Mate, there were times I would've happily exchanged my baby, after being awake with her crying for hours, for 20 Marlboro and a nice quiet night's sleep. That was 21 years ago, love her to bits really though.
A few years ago I saw posters telling people to drink water and not to get dehydrated. This video shows why people dehydrate when travelling around London.
on the day of a journey into london from the suburbs, i do not drink anything at least two hours before the start of journey. toilets in pubs or coffee places are self defeating as i feel i ought to buy something.
My wife is disabled and often needs a loo at short notice. I asked TFL why there are no toilets on their overground trains. They responded that "toilets use up valuable space and passengers should use toilets on the stations". I pointed out that they had closed most station toilets. "Yes, sorry about that" was the reply.
That one of the reasons why I like my local Thameslink line - there are always toilets on a train. And I hope the TfL never gets their toilet-less hands on it and doesn’t Overgroudise it.
@@dmytrorubanov3340 Thameslink is regional, not local, apart from perhaps the line to Sutton. Bus and rail that leaves town (i.e. Easybus, Hams Travel, Southern) needs toilets. Bus and rail that is just used for getting around within town (i.e. TFL Buses, London Overground) doesn't.
Across all of Europe public toilets are being closed down because no one wants to pay for the maintenance, or repair them after they've been vandalized. In Denmark, nearly all train stations used to have toilets, but they were frequently destroyed by morons. Even after they replaced the toilet and sinks with all steel versions, someone still managed to wreck them, so now only the bigger stations that are constantly staffed have toilets. As far as building toilets below ground, there are special toilets for situations where you need to install one below the sewer level. The actual throne bit looks like a normal toilet, but they hook into a form of crusher+pump combo that turn the goods into a paste, which is then pumped up and into the sewer. These toilets require very little water and only need a small pipe for the sewer connection, and because the delivery is done under pressure, they can be relatively far from the sewer, unlike a normal toilet which relies on gravity for the delivery.
I notice this when on the continent. Most public toilets are pay to use, that's kind of rare in the UK. They exist, but few and far between. I guess that's partly why a lot of them have since gone. I had to pay 30 Krone in Sweden to use a toilet at a train station. Thankfully contactless payment is super prevalent there or I'd have been holding it for another couple of hours until I got to my friends place haha.
When I was growing up in Britain in the forties and fifties, there were reasonably good access, to “public conveniences”, as they were called then. The men had it OK got peeing, and sometimes for more serious business, but it was a different situation for the ladies, who had no choice but to use a cubicle. These we’re locked, to be unlocked by inserting a penny int a suitable slot - giving rise to the expression “spend a penny” as a euphemism for going to the toilet. By the way, Jago, thanks for the photograph of Sudbury Town Station. From 1948 till 1962 that was just a few minutes walk from where I lived.
I used the system daily for at lest 30 years and never ever thought about this problem. Today I don't even go to the end of the garden without planning the trip. Just ban old people.
I'm guessing ALL stations have SOME sort of toilet facilities (probably around the back of, and only accessible from, the ticket offices), otherwise where would the Staff go? They can't be expected to 'hold it in' all day!
Was thinking this too. And as manned ticket booths are becoming less frequent etc, I wonder is there space in many stations to redevelop a bit of the space previously used by staff into public loos, provided that there is an existing loo for the staff to use
The loo on tube on the TfL website is not accurate. Most stations that show as having a toilet within gate or out of gate don’t have toilet or its closed.
It says at the station, or close by. I can't think where the one at the elephant and castle is, unless they were thinking of the ones in the demolished shopping centre.
Just came back from Tokyo and it was AMAZING how public toilets were everywhere. Every single train station, without exception, had public loos. They were all clean and well maintained.
If your customers are mostly Japanese, people making a mess is not a problem. Stereotypically, they are civilized human beings to a degree that makes pretty much everyone else look like monkeys in a zoo.
@@fumiotsuki5027 Yes, but Japan is mostly populated by Japanese people. They are a few thousand years ahead of anybody else in toilet tech. And a million years ahead when it comes to not making a filthy mess everywhere you go. 😅
As a plumber the solution to providing toilets when not near a localised sewer pipe would involve installing pumps and or maceraters that would pump the effluent to the appropriate outlets. The challenge would be finding a suitable route and then running the waste pipework so it can join the sewer, particularly in buildings underground with such an old infrastructure. However, I’d be happy to bet that the staff areas of all stations have welfare facilities so one could attempt to run the waste pipework to the pre existing drainage providing the public toilets were within a reasonable distance to them.
Must say I was very surprised to realise on my occasional journeys via the Elizabeth line that the trains did not have toilets given the distance they travel and the types of carriages they use. Definitely missing a trick there.
If you watch the TFL series on the abandoned and disused parts of the tube stations. You will see there is plenty of space to run a pipe up in many stations. They took over the old elevator shafts for many other uses when they went to escalators.
My problem while in London is allways the unfortunate combination of pubs and underground travelling. Thanks for this important video. Though very sad.
Thank you for talking about this. This is a triggering subject for me as a ten-year Londoner with IBS - luckily I'm back home in Kansas City with a car and freedom from this particular problem. It absolutely was limiting. Some stations it took forever to get from platform level to street level, so you had to plan carefully every time. What I would love to see is one or two small loos at platform level that are accessible with radar keys, and then you can apply for the key if you have issues. I am hoping someday to see an innovation making it easy to install a box toilet facility without needing fancy plumbing work.
Yes! I feel like I got genuine trauma from IBS & the London Underground for a few years. The panic when the need struck, the outdated TfL toilet map PDF, the absolutely heinous abominations that some stations called toilet facilities (looking at you, Baker Street 🤮), etc.
As one of those who cannot 'keep it in' this is a huge problem for me. I didn't know about that toilet map when I was in London, because I would have definitely benefitted from being able to use it. I of course grew to love the toilet stops, like Cannon Street, but even there they are a problem because you have to leave the rail line to use it, then pay another fare to get back on the train. At least it is accessible from the street when not using the tube. I am often critical of the lack of rail lines in Sydney, but I do appreciate that every station has a toilet, and that it is always within the station itself, either platform or concourse. You don't realize how important these conveniences are until you don't have them.
This is a question that has been on my -intestines- mind for quite some time. So happy to see it being discussed in a comprehensive manner. VIVA LA ABLUCION!
@@paulsengupta971 My conflict shy trick is to use pubs where I have had a few beers on a couple of occasions when I am in a familiar town. That makes me a customer in my book, so I can get on with my plans while still sober. And I can walk straight to the facilities while looking confident and purposeful, since I know exactly where they are. As a tourist, I have more time. I can have a snack or a meal and then use the facilities again as I am leaving, getting ahead in the beer-in-beer-out-loop. I don't think this counts as overthinking it... 😆
In the 60s and 70s the loos at Piccadilly Circus were the first stop for clients of the station's all-night chemist at a time when addicts could get heroin on prescription.
It used to be transport in general, but most motorway service stations have grudgingly sorted themselves out, but even mainline stations are dreadful. St Pancras has massive thoroughfares, a mall, a ticket office (somewhere), yet is the only place I've ever seen a queue for the GENTS! St. Pancras, one station, dozens of trains, thousands of people, one toilet. One cleaner... And don't get me started about the doors and locks on the cubicles, everywhere you go, even DIY stores.
Not arguing, there still aren't many, but there are 2 sets of toilets there. 1 Opposite Eurostar arrivals and 1 right at the end where the semi-circle area is. Still inadequate though
@@TestGearJunkie. it's literally next door. You don't even have to cross traffic. If you're walking to St Pancras' toilets, you can easily walk to King's Cross.
@@davidjames579 I know, but if you're like me and get to a toilet and find it's closed, getting to another one, even if it's just a few yards away, is fraught with danger, and losing it mid-way between the two is not a pleasant experience, I can tell you.
Many of the Leslie Green stations did have toilets such as Hampstead but these were removed during modernisation. It’s worth noting that councils across London closed or removed public toilets. Just another of the many modern inconveniences!
The main issue is that as a society we are aging. Unfortunately, with age some things don't work as well as they used to. Gone are the days where a toilet was the last thing on my mind. I recently flew from Sydney to London. The Captain announces we are starting our decent into Heathrow please put your seat upright & put you seat belt on. I take 1 last dash to the loo & get ready to land. 20 minutes later the Captain says we have been put into a holding pattern shouldn't be to long. The person next to me notices I'm sweating & asks "are you a nervous flyer" I explain the issue & all of a sudden they become a nervous flyer.
The Elizabeth Line needs toilets in all the stations in the "core". That way if there's a delay in theory a lot of passengers can get off to relieve themselves.
Even better toilets on the trains they are after all mainline stock travelling long distances. The stupid TfL argument that the stations are close so toilets on trains are not needed assumes that people are only travelling 3 or 4 stations.
@@barrieshepherd7694 TfL probably has (or as you might say, "have") detailed statistics on journey lengths. Whether or not those stats actually support this-or-that stupid argument is another issue entirely, of course.
@@AlanHMartin Maybe - stats or not TfL just managed to dodge the Disability Act by, what I consider, stealth of hand. ALL other new mainline train stock is required to have toilets - the Elizabeth line stock should be no different.
@@barrieshepherd7694 TFL are of course wrong if there's a breakdown and passengers don't have an option to get to the toilet. Not long ago a train was held up for 3 hours.
Lots of toilets available on the Israel train system. Toilets at every station. On the bigger main stations like Tel Aviv stations, sometimes toilets on the platform and ticket hall level, and even such as at the main Tel Aviv station Hahaganah, toilets before and AFTER the ticket barriers. And thank goodness there is!
Why modern vacuum toilets were not included on Elizabeth Line stock baffles me as many passengers could be on a train for more than just a few minutes. Alighting at a station that has platform facilities and boarding the next service is often not a solution.
When I taught an evening class ending at 21.00 trains were less frequent, sometimes resulting in a long wait before the journey home. The lack of facilities at such times occasionally meant leaving the station to find relief before returning for another long wait.
I was genuinely surprised when I discovered the ones at Stratford station because the sign and door are obscured by the staircase and lift leading up to the tube and DLR platforms. Came in very handy to say the least lol
I found them unexpectedly one day as well, they are well hidden! Unfortunately on that day they were closed for ‘maintenance’ so my hopes were dashed!!
Abs nightmare for us prostate sufferers who have little warning and a definite panic to "mind the gap" so to speak before its all over :( I remember commuting through Victoria the fearsome reputation the bogs had there and the toilets at Viccy were absolute last chance for many of us blokes who would find themselves accosted by ahem denizens of a certain negotiable favour or old bill pulling you up to ask whats going on here sonny jim. I used the Casey Jones loos instead which were less fraught with disaster as don't forget this was the era of EPB's without lav's and the rush hour 4CEP's would be crammed super bad and chances of a loo were remote. Charing Cross was little better but London Bridge with the mens lavs opposite the BTP office it was positive luxury with no chance of oo-er's and mishaps, quite refreshing and the 1-6 platform loo's were pretty good cleaned up many times a day.
Belated apologies to the station staff at Baker Street about thirty years ago. I started feeling sick on my way to Paddington and somehow managed to get off the packed rush hour train just before I emptied my stomach at the end of the platform.
I did the same once in the early 2000s at London Bridge...puked like something from the Exorcist...yet not a single person said anything or offered help 😮 they just got on with their lives
@@KidarWolf I had commuted for a number of years so I cannot blame them as I may have been some dangerous drunk or something...and I probably would have done the same. Anyway thanks
Lucky you didn't cause a short circuit! On a DC system, chlorine gas might be produced by electrolysis, which would be decidedly unpleasant underground. Was there a station announcement: "trains delayed because of bits of carrot on the line".
The lack of anything at Morden (local authority sold off toilets) is perhaps the worse one as the end of the line stations probably need things more than most, sometimes one has to arrange ones journey via thameslink for the on board provision
This topic of “public conveniences” is really interesting. To respond to your question of what happens if the lavatory facilities are below the level of the sewer, a sump would need to be dug (lined pit or nowadays a tank) and a sump pump with level float is installed to raise the effluent up to the level of the receiving sewer line. This is also done on a large scale where land has lots of rises and falls and to dig sewers at a level for gravity to work would be prohibitive.
Some use a sump pump but most used a sewage ejector system. A tank get's filled with waste, the level float triggers and compressed air forces the contents up to the sewer. This was very common when points etc used compressed air. I suspect that as points now use electric motors.... They no longer use compressed air and thus now favour maceraters and sump pumps as you correctly pointed out. I had a mate who's job was changing the nozzles and fixing the non return valves.... What a great job!!!!!
Most underground stations have now closed their ticket offices and staff facilities associated with them, so they could easily be turned into extra toilet facilities.
The platform 7 toilets that stay open until 2am at Finsbury Park on the national rail section have saved me and my bladder many, many times after an evening out in central London lasted a little longer than expected. Even when not changing to a national rail train I often make the journey up and down just to use them. They may be disgusting, but at least they exist.
Interesting to note at the end the shot of a public telephone box next to the public toilet. My memory of public telephone boxes on the tube is that most of them doubled up as a public toilet at some time or other. Makes sense to put them next to each other. 😊
Funny Gary Delany one liner from a few years ago "I was at the train station the other day and saw a piano on one of the platforms. So I had a little tinkle and saved myself twenty pence."
Having bladder cancer means that I just can't and don't travel on public transport for more than a 20 minute journey. Even my trips to hospital for chemo have to be made by taxi.
Certainly a problem in most major cities. New York famously has few toilets in its subway system (other than most elevators/lifts ugh) and woe to you should you find one and it's actually open.🤮 One rare exception there is Times Square, where they have a bunch of individual bathrooms with an attendant who buzzes you in and out, and are kept fairly clean because of it. Our main line/commuter rail terminals are generally easy for bathrooms though, but quality can vary. NY in general is famous for the difficulty in finding a public bathroom and the subway especially, for all the same reasons. Great video as always!
Ah, that's an old international problem. Here in Moscow some stations had toilets in a project, still those were staff-only available. On late 10's we had 20 to 30 toilet modules being installed here and there, still it isn't enough.
Back in the 90s I lived in Hillingdon which is a goodly tube ride from central London at the best of times but even more so if you've been out for a few shandies with all that entails. The toilets on the platform at Wembley Park though rather rudimentary were often a source of considerable relief. Sadly when they redeveloped the station the toilets disappeared.
Many of the District line stations in the east have toilets but they had to cap them off, cos people kept getting mugged and vandalising the area, and caught with drugs, syringes and stuff like that - it was that bad.
Here in Vienna, which has a modern, expanding metro system (a new line is currently under construction) the availability of toilet facilities is not ubiquitous, either. The older stations rarely have them, some of the new ones, especially ‘out in the sticks’, have none. Those in the city centre are sometimes closed. Some are ‘manned’ the vast majority are not. Metro (or U-Bahn) khazis used to be free, but they now charge 50c, even to spend a penny. They are, however, clean and for the greater part in working order.
Jago, I recall that back in the early 1960s almost all Underground stations DID have public toilets, often these were located in or near the booking hall. Quite a few open-air stations had men's toilets on the platforms, intended for use by the train crews (who were all male in those days).
I just wrote a really clever comment - and then the video got to 4:55 - 5:30. You think of everything, don't you Mr Hazzard. Great video! How do you keep coming up with these ideas?!
To put the toilets underground they’d need a device called a macerator, basically it chops up all the effluent and pumps it away at high pressure. Can’t imagine several hundred of them all round London would all be working however. And not like that’s gonna stop someone going in the mess 😬
@@hairyairey aye but they’ll be for surface water, if it’s got poop in it itll likely need go to a different drain. If it needs to be pumped at pressure you’d usually do that in a smaller pipe
The traditional way to handle toilets under a sewer level is to have a holding tank, and then push it up under pressure. The pump used is normally termed an ejector. This is how things like the underground telephone exchanges and cold war bunkers ran. They don't use a macerator.
@@TheChloeRed ah. You know more about this than me lol, my experience is mostly domestic see. Yeah I wondered if something like that would be the usual method but with the expense of retrofitting etc… who knows. Don’t think they’ll be installing any platform level toilets anytime soon anyway haha
@@cakeskin3333 The reason it's done that way is so you don't end up with (basically) a pressurised column of sewage if something fails. That can be.. messy! You don't tend to retro fit it because it's a lot of work, you have to sink a tank somewhere, add the ejectors, maintenance for it.. And maintenance of it is icky.
Finding a public toilet above ground level can be hard enough in Central London. I've seen it so bad that certain fast food joints employ someone to stand outside the toilets and only allow customers in. Department stores usually have them, but department stores are going out of fashion.
I was always under the impression that Free House pubs had to let people use the toilets without buying anything, but that turns out to be false. It just happens that a lot of free houses just tend not to bother stopping people. With that in mind, 'Spoons are always great if you're caught short.
Coming from Hong Kong where almost any station has toilets, and they’ve retrofitted old stations that were originally without, the state of affairs in London is terrible. It is a city that also has a lot of public toilets all around. The same comparison can be drawn with most Asian cities, not just HK. It’s shocking to see the degree to which the UK has both failed to catch up and even has regressed.
The Paddington station facilities is correct and they are nice to have, but to get to them from the Bakerloo line consists of 3 lifts, 2 massive corridors to go down as well as continuing into the main station itself. You have to leave the gate line to get to it. It is a huge detour! If the lifts are busy and you gotta go, you're in trouble.
All Underground stations have toilets, even those deep underground...... there are many staff facilities around. Baker Street Jubilee Depot for instance, a set of rooms deep below ground (entrances by platform 10 and a back way in/out on platform 7) has staff toilets, as does the Elephant & Castle Bakerloo Northbound platform... Pumps are used to remove the waste up to a normal level for disposal......
At one time there was the circle line game. It was a pub crawl with a drink at each station. A visit to the loo sent you back one station and I never managed to complete the course. Then there was the variant where we would have rucksacks full of miniatures and toast the train from the platform. (That was before alcohol was banned.) Suddenly the lack of facilities became a serious problem. Happy days!
Thanks for this. Sometime this summer I'd like to do the longest non-stop journey (I think!) which I can do on a Freedom Pass, Abbey Wood to Reading on the Elizabeth Line for no other reason than that I can. There are no loos on the trains though! Drat!
This subject was covered in a couple of episodes of Hidden London Hangouts in regards to the needs of those sheltering from the Blitz. Needless to say that having to use the jerryrigged loos were a rather unpleasant experience
I do find it nice that despite the damage, SEPTA (philly's Transit network) does keep functionap toilets open to the public at all times with hourly inspections for maintenance. This is at all but Kensington square which is welded shut due to overdoses. But i visit the city only once in a while so rarely a issue.
As a man of a certain age and sometime visitor to London I found this very informative! Would you ever consider doing some videos on the departmental side of LT, specifically their steam and diesel shunters as well as rolling stock? Many thanks.
I once had to use the Baker street toilet due to unfortunate illness. That was a learning experience as let's just say many patrons had "adapted" the space for "networking" between cubicles and sharing lots of "details" on "noticeboards". I have no prejudice for such activities however I did feel like I was misusing the space since it had apparently been "repurposed".
Those Bakerloo Line 1972 Stock tube trains do look pretty old and needs replacing at some point in few years. But yes it’s quite hard to find a toilet at any tube station in and around London. With other tube stations that do have toilets and some toilets at some stations you have to pay. And there are underground toilets dotted around London that have remained opened to the public.
As an ancient male with a hugely enlarged prostate I carry a plastic bottle with me which I get out and pee in when necessary, it does attract some scowls and gasps of disbelief on the tube but when they see the relief on my face most understand. Untrue of course but I I'm trying to make powers that be understand how desperate you can get when there is nowhere to go when the need is great.
Putting a toilet below the sewage level. It's fairly common practise for buildings with basements. You just have a pump (normally with a grinder) and sometimes a tank of sorts. So you just pumped the refuge up to sewer level.
Disembarking, usually just walking into the nearest Prête or Nero's (with an attitude of brisk confidence, as if you're just about to buy a coffee) & using their loo is perfectly feasible - Nero's & Prête are everywhere
When I lived in London the Tube was my main form of transport and I never gave it a thought about toilets. It makes sense your explanation about short journeys. Basically when you think about it the Tube is just a bus service on tracks and bus stops don’t have toilets.
At least if you get stuck in traffic on a bus you can get off at the next stop and find a toilet. If the tube gets stuck in the tunnel for a long time due to a signal failure or whatever, then you have a problem!
there's another ancient metro system in a european city where I live and they've recently installed public accessable toilets in major line intersections, they just put those at some not so busy corners of passageways, you pay for the visit with your regular metro card and those toilets seem to be rather clean, so I believe this is technically achievable
I was on a District Line train once, when there was an announcement "this train will terminate at the next station", to which everyone sighed or moaned. The driver went on to explain "this is due to a medical emergency... meaning that the driver has to go to the toilet", and everyone laughed and accepted that. Thus the train terminated at High Street Kensington, so there is at least a staff toilet there, though not open to the public.
What I don't get is how come it's comparatively easy to add a lift to get those passengers who cannot use the lifts / stairs, but finding space for a toilet is too hard?
I've seen lots of closed rooms, offices, shops, ticket windows, etc in your videos of old stations (including that outro with a public telephone room next to toilets). There is space for individual toilets in passenger-accessible areas. Not major high-volume stables-stye toilets, but space for a few.
A comparison that could also be made between the underground is you don’t get toilets on buses or trams and neither at their relevant stops. Also, as you mention, to have toilets cost money and would inflate the fares. I also particularly note Merseyrail trains, neither old or new, have never had toilets and very few of their stations have toilets.
There is something to be said for the process that I have seen in Germany and elsewhere in which someone needing a toilet can go into any shop and ask to use the toilet, generally paying 50 cents if not a customer of the shop. I'm not sure that this would adapt to British society though.
There used to be more-as in most public places-but those running them close them (eg there used to be one on the london bound BR at Walthamstow Central)...some Outer London branches have loos at a lot of stations as you state🎩
At Eastcote Station (met line) they closed the toilets and put up a sign saying something like “due to drug addicts ruining it for everyone, these toilets are now closed permanently”. This was a few years ago now. South Ruislip has a toilet but you may catch some something trying to use it…
My local station on the District Line has toilets, problem being about 15-20 years ago they started locking them due to drug users using them. Although you can ask for the key there's rarely anyone in the ticket office to ask... Saying that in the local area there used to be 4 public lavatories run by the local council within a 20-25 minute walk of this station, all barring one have been closed and either sold or demolished.
A few seconds into this, I was thinking, "blame the Victorians." Yyyyyep! I have a crazy notion though... if you can't build out to put in the John, as it would cost money, and putting the lavs below the sewer line is an idea so bad as to be categorically denied... Why not build the thrones *above* the station? Extend the lifts, add in stairs, go up to flush your troubles down!
When my daughter was little, I took her and her friend to ride the cable car (cheap day out), stupidly on an engineering works day. We had to get a bus back into town from Greenwich and I and the kids were bursting. The bus was slow and as soon as I realised that we were at Elephant and Castle, we got off to continue our journey by Tube. It turns out that that for all the reasons stated, there are no toilets there and with two little ones in tow, it's a long way to the Elephant and Castle shopping Centre (no longer in existence) which which we weren't sure had loos either. However, I persuaded the staff to let the girls use their toilet and of course helped myself while we were there. They might have rules to follow but they are mostly human.
There was a wonderful little Gents toilet on one of the platforms at High Barnet , complete with green stalagmites in the urinals (this predating the new ring main) I wonder if it is still there.
I think (though it may be an urban myth) that one of the key design considerations of the early tube was to ensure there was enough height to facilitate the wearing of top hats for regular folk going to the City, or the opera?
If this comment is TMI, I apologize in advance. The Atlanta US MARTA system has closed almost all of its toilets due to vandalism. So, some people have taken to relieving themselves in station elevators/lifts; there's at least one at every station. To combat this, new urine-detection technology has been added to many elevators/lifts, which sounds an alarm if someone does relieve themselves there. MARTA transit police are quick on the scene to take the person into custody and fine them. This has helped ... a little.
I used to use the tube a lot back in the 1960's and, at platform level, I only knew of 2 stations with toilets (outer London above ground excepted). If my memory serves thet were Gloucester Road and South Kensington .............. next door to each other !!! Probably closed long ago now.
"Held it in" is precisely what I once did between Sloane Square and Ealing Broadway. To make matters worse, I had got on the train to Richmond by mistake, so I got off on Earl's Court to change trains to one for Ealing Broadway. Couldn't find a loo at Earl's Court, so I carried on some 30 excruciating minutes.
Top tip, if you're from north west London and having drinks in East, there's a gents at Liverpool Street, Baker Street on the Met line platform going west, Wembley Park on the same platform going west. All 3 have been a pants saver
In the good old days BSC (before S-class) one could utilise the connecting door at the end of the carriage. Now one has had to swap improvised toilet facilities for air conditioning and CCTV
And if the world wasn't filled with yobbos going round vandalising and graffiti-ing everything, there'd be no need to close toilets and remove refuse bins.
Certain groups used to use bins as somewhere to plant explosives. This is why you'll still see them in slightly less convenient places away from where people tend to congregate (think bus stops). Especially in bigger towns and cities. This is also partly why a lot of bins are just frames with a dangling clear bag, as are famous in Mr. Marshall's videos.
I don't think there should be baby changing facilities - you should stick with the baby you've got
😹
😂😂😂
Some aren't happy with their babies
Men should withdraw before the vinegar stroke 🥒💦
Mate, there were times I would've happily exchanged my baby, after being awake with her crying for hours, for 20 Marlboro and a nice quiet night's sleep. That was 21 years ago, love her to bits really though.
A few years ago I saw posters telling people to drink water and not to get dehydrated. This video shows why people dehydrate when travelling around London.
That drives me bonkers, too.
ok so drink enough water that arent dehydrated and not too much so you need the toilet then
@@Farleigh1050 For many people, drinking any water at all causes the need! The older you get the more acute the problem becomes.
In fairness if it's hot and you're sweating a lot, you're less likely to need the toilet as your body will stop filling up the bladder.
on the day of a journey into london from the suburbs, i do not drink anything at least two hours before the start of journey. toilets in pubs or coffee places are self defeating as i feel i ought to buy something.
My wife is disabled and often needs a loo at short notice. I asked TFL why there are no toilets on their overground trains. They responded that "toilets use up valuable space and passengers should use toilets on the stations". I pointed out that they had closed most station toilets. "Yes, sorry about that" was the reply.
It's usually long distance bus and rail that have toilets. I've never been to any place where the local bus and rail had on-board toilets.
That one of the reasons why I like my local Thameslink line - there are always toilets on a train. And I hope the TfL never gets their toilet-less hands on it and doesn’t Overgroudise it.
@@dmytrorubanov3340 Thameslink is regional, not local, apart from perhaps the line to Sutton. Bus and rail that leaves town (i.e. Easybus, Hams Travel, Southern) needs toilets. Bus and rail that is just used for getting around within town (i.e. TFL Buses, London Overground) doesn't.
@dmytrorubanov3340 no reason they should. Thameslink isn't exclusively London which is why I guess it's not part of TFL.
@@lazrseagull54Local trains in Glasgow all have toilets. It's probably because they use the same trains as the regional ones mind you.
Should've just had a bunch of footage of the Bakerloo line.
That's just for bakers
Bakers gunna bake
Get those loaves out
Nice buns
What about the Waterloo and City
We need a Portaloo Line
Very good sir!
Well we do have Michael Portaloo on line.
Underrated comment!
Portaloo & sh*ty
😂😂😂😂😂
Across all of Europe public toilets are being closed down because no one wants to pay for the maintenance, or repair them after they've been vandalized. In Denmark, nearly all train stations used to have toilets, but they were frequently destroyed by morons. Even after they replaced the toilet and sinks with all steel versions, someone still managed to wreck them, so now only the bigger stations that are constantly staffed have toilets.
As far as building toilets below ground, there are special toilets for situations where you need to install one below the sewer level. The actual throne bit looks like a normal toilet, but they hook into a form of crusher+pump combo that turn the goods into a paste, which is then pumped up and into the sewer. These toilets require very little water and only need a small pipe for the sewer connection, and because the delivery is done under pressure, they can be relatively far from the sewer, unlike a normal toilet which relies on gravity for the delivery.
I notice this when on the continent. Most public toilets are pay to use, that's kind of rare in the UK. They exist, but few and far between. I guess that's partly why a lot of them have since gone. I had to pay 30 Krone in Sweden to use a toilet at a train station. Thankfully contactless payment is super prevalent there or I'd have been holding it for another couple of hours until I got to my friends place haha.
When I was growing up in Britain in the forties and fifties, there were reasonably good access, to “public conveniences”, as they were called then. The men had it OK got peeing, and sometimes for more serious business, but it was a different situation for the ladies, who had no choice but to use a cubicle. These we’re locked, to be unlocked by inserting a penny int a suitable slot - giving rise to the expression “spend a penny” as a euphemism for going to the toilet.
By the way, Jago, thanks for the photograph of Sudbury Town Station. From 1948 till 1962 that was just a few minutes walk from where I lived.
That's what happens when you don't raise your children properly.
@@TalesOfWar They're all pay to use in London now, 50p to a quid in some places. Fortunately we have a Radar key.
@@TalesOfWar agreed, although there is a pay to use toilet at Westminster tube station oddly.
What about: dedicated "toilet trains" which criss-cross the network on a schedule?
Like bakerloo and waterloo and city may be
@@johnlandall5275 The Bakerloo line is especially apt, given the name and line colour! And general state of some of the stations and rolling stock.
@@johnlandall5275 And down The Drain!
Problem is they would probably carry more passengers than the regular services.
@@TalesOfWar They could call the special trains the "Bakerpoo service".
Obviously we should blame Charles Tyson Yerkes.
Given the lack of public toilets in America, that's not an entirely unreasonable take.
If you are going to blame CTY, do not stand anywhere near The Gap on the network, just saying
I knew he'd be behind it.
I used the system daily for at lest 30 years and never ever thought about this problem. Today I don't even go to the end of the garden without planning the trip. Just ban old people.
Or wear a nappy.
@@rodgermoss8975 The "Great Man" across the pond wears one :P Everybody says so ;)
Sounds like you've already banned yourself!
Years ago I approached the gents toilet up in Woodside Park and it was locked. A handwritten sign said "Shut Happens" !!
Probably a Kiwi!
You should have crapped outside it on the ground and put a notice there saying "Open Happens Too."
This is but one reason why I can't use public transport and rarely venture into town centres let alone big cities. Disability sucks.
I'm guessing ALL stations have SOME sort of toilet facilities (probably around the back of, and only accessible from, the ticket offices), otherwise where would the Staff go?
They can't be expected to 'hold it in' all day!
Good point. I wonder how that works for the deep lines, i.e., stations below the level of the sewers.
Was thinking this too. And as manned ticket booths are becoming less frequent etc, I wonder is there space in many stations to redevelop a bit of the space previously used by staff into public loos, provided that there is an existing loo for the staff to use
@@rogerkearns8094 The ticket hall isnt below sewer level
@@monkey7431_
Yes, fair enough.
@@rogerkearns8094 Pumped sewage removal is a thing! 🤣
I wonder why side streets are often smelly? Lack of drainage and toilets was a big problem in the past, we don't learn much from history do we!
**Do wee.
;-)
As someone with bowel disease and a Londoner, I’m critically aware of how bad this problem is unfortunately, thank you for bringing it up!
The loo on tube on the TfL website is not accurate. Most stations that show as having a toilet within gate or out of gate don’t have toilet or its closed.
Or in the case of Stratford, when open, it is akin to an outer circle of hell.
Quite it was Raynors lane station. Waiting for picc line
It says at the station, or close by. I can't think where the one at the elephant and castle is, unless they were thinking of the ones in the demolished shopping centre.
The Antonym of Within is Without 🙈
A classic.
I bet Jago is flushed about getting this one out of his cistern.....
Sent him round the bend I'd wager...
I'm sick of all these toilet jokes. They just go down the pan for me.
Oh, put a lid on it, will you?
I'm not going to get engaged with these toilet puns
@@keithparker1346 One just gets bogged down you Know!
Just came back from Tokyo and it was AMAZING how public toilets were everywhere. Every single train station, without exception, had public loos. They were all clean and well maintained.
If your customers are mostly Japanese, people making a mess is not a problem. Stereotypically, they are civilized human beings to a degree that makes pretty much everyone else look like monkeys in a zoo.
Same for other cities in Japan, that have underground system.
@@fumiotsuki5027 Yes, but Japan is mostly populated by Japanese people. They are a few thousand years ahead of anybody else in toilet tech. And a million years ahead when it comes to not making a filthy mess everywhere you go. 😅
Japan is a First World, developed nation.
As a plumber the solution to providing toilets when not near a localised sewer pipe would involve installing pumps and or maceraters that would pump the effluent to the appropriate outlets. The challenge would be finding a suitable route and then running the waste pipework so it can join the sewer, particularly in buildings underground with such an old infrastructure. However, I’d be happy to bet that the staff areas of all stations have welfare facilities so one could attempt to run the waste pipework to the pre existing drainage providing the public toilets were within a reasonable distance to them.
Must say I was very surprised to realise on my occasional journeys via the Elizabeth line that the trains did not have toilets given the distance they travel and the types of carriages they use. Definitely missing a trick there.
If you watch the TFL series on the abandoned and disused parts of the tube stations. You will see there is plenty of space to run a pipe up in many stations. They took over the old elevator shafts for many other uses when they went to escalators.
My problem while in London is allways the unfortunate combination of pubs and underground travelling. Thanks for this important video. Though very sad.
Nice to see someone with the big picture.
A responsible person who has been drinking uses public transportation to get home. This works only for those with 3-pint bladders.
Thank you for talking about this. This is a triggering subject for me as a ten-year Londoner with IBS - luckily I'm back home in Kansas City with a car and freedom from this particular problem. It absolutely was limiting. Some stations it took forever to get from platform level to street level, so you had to plan carefully every time. What I would love to see is one or two small loos at platform level that are accessible with radar keys, and then you can apply for the key if you have issues. I am hoping someday to see an innovation making it easy to install a box toilet facility without needing fancy plumbing work.
Yes! I feel like I got genuine trauma from IBS & the London Underground for a few years. The panic when the need struck, the outdated TfL toilet map PDF, the absolutely heinous abominations that some stations called toilet facilities (looking at you, Baker Street 🤮), etc.
As one of those who cannot 'keep it in' this is a huge problem for me. I didn't know about that toilet map when I was in London, because I would have definitely benefitted from being able to use it. I of course grew to love the toilet stops, like Cannon Street, but even there they are a problem because you have to leave the rail line to use it, then pay another fare to get back on the train. At least it is accessible from the street when not using the tube.
I am often critical of the lack of rail lines in Sydney, but I do appreciate that every station has a toilet, and that it is always within the station itself, either platform or concourse. You don't realize how important these conveniences are until you don't have them.
This is a question that has been on my -intestines- mind for quite some time. So happy to see it being discussed in a comprehensive manner. VIVA LA ABLUCION!
It's darn hard to find a toilet in any town
I just find a pub, and then buy a beer to show my gratitude. Thus just delaying the problem.
@@geirmyrvagnes8718 Yep. It's a self perpetuating problem. Pub & toilet crawl.
@@paulsengupta971 My conflict shy trick is to use pubs where I have had a few beers on a couple of occasions when I am in a familiar town. That makes me a customer in my book, so I can get on with my plans while still sober. And I can walk straight to the facilities while looking confident and purposeful, since I know exactly where they are. As a tourist, I have more time. I can have a snack or a meal and then use the facilities again as I am leaving, getting ahead in the beer-in-beer-out-loop. I don't think this counts as overthinking it... 😆
In the 60s and 70s the loos at Piccadilly Circus were the first stop for clients of the station's all-night chemist at a time when addicts could get heroin on prescription.
Known for other 'clients' picking up as well..........
Piccadilly an incredibly seedy place back then. Pick up some heroin and several rent boys in one place.
It used to be transport in general, but most motorway service stations have grudgingly sorted themselves out, but even mainline stations are dreadful.
St Pancras has massive thoroughfares, a mall, a ticket office (somewhere), yet is the only place I've ever seen a queue for the GENTS!
St. Pancras, one station, dozens of trains, thousands of people, one toilet. One cleaner...
And don't get me started about the doors and locks on the cubicles, everywhere you go, even DIY stores.
Not arguing, there still aren't many, but there are 2 sets of toilets there. 1 Opposite Eurostar arrivals and 1 right at the end where the semi-circle area is. Still inadequate though
Just nip next door to King's Cross
@@davidjames579 If you can get there in time.
@@TestGearJunkie. it's literally next door. You don't even have to cross traffic. If you're walking to St Pancras' toilets, you can easily walk to King's Cross.
@@davidjames579 I know, but if you're like me and get to a toilet and find it's closed, getting to another one, even if it's just a few yards away, is fraught with danger, and losing it mid-way between the two is not a pleasant experience, I can tell you.
Many of the Leslie Green stations did have toilets such as Hampstead but these were removed during modernisation. It’s worth noting that councils across London closed or removed public toilets. Just another of the many modern inconveniences!
The main issue is that as a society we are aging. Unfortunately, with age some things don't work as well as they used to. Gone are the days where a toilet was the last thing on my mind. I recently flew from Sydney to London. The Captain announces we are starting our decent into Heathrow please put your seat upright & put you seat belt on. I take 1 last dash to the loo & get ready to land. 20 minutes later the Captain says we have been put into a holding pattern shouldn't be to long. The person next to me notices I'm sweating & asks "are you a nervous flyer" I explain the issue & all of a sudden they become a nervous flyer.
The Elizabeth Line needs toilets in all the stations in the "core". That way if there's a delay in theory a lot of passengers can get off to relieve themselves.
Even better toilets on the trains they are after all mainline stock travelling long distances. The stupid TfL argument that the stations are close so toilets on trains are not needed assumes that people are only travelling 3 or 4 stations.
@@barrieshepherd7694 TfL probably has (or as you might say, "have") detailed statistics on journey lengths.
Whether or not those stats actually support this-or-that stupid argument is another issue entirely, of course.
@@AlanHMartin Maybe - stats or not TfL just managed to dodge the Disability Act by, what I consider, stealth of hand. ALL other new mainline train stock is required to have toilets - the Elizabeth line stock should be no different.
And some passengers probably use the toilet to get off! 😂😂😂
@@barrieshepherd7694 TFL are of course wrong if there's a breakdown and passengers don't have an option to get to the toilet. Not long ago a train was held up for 3 hours.
Lots of toilets available on the Israel train system. Toilets at every station. On the bigger main stations like Tel Aviv stations, sometimes toilets on the platform and ticket hall level, and even such as at the main Tel Aviv station Hahaganah, toilets before and AFTER the ticket barriers. And thank goodness there is!
Why modern vacuum toilets were not included on Elizabeth Line stock baffles me as many passengers could be on a train for more than just a few minutes. Alighting at a station that has platform facilities and boarding the next service is often not a solution.
The Elizabeth Line is just a spruced up underground line
Funnily enough the expression to spend a penny comes from Bank underground station
I thought it was the great exhibition1851 actually I'm pretty certain it was
On Friday and Saturday nights, every staircase is a urinal...
The following also makes me chuckle:
"Here I lie, broken hearted. Paid a penny and only farted".
@@user-vo4ft8rj4g I thought that too but have also read that the first one was outside The Royal Exchange. No idea which is correct though!
@@SlartiMarvinbartfast Sit not lie surely.
When I taught an evening class ending at 21.00 trains were less frequent, sometimes resulting in a long wait before the journey home. The lack of facilities at such times occasionally meant leaving the station to find relief before returning for another long wait.
I was genuinely surprised when I discovered the ones at Stratford station because the sign and door are obscured by the staircase and lift leading up to the tube and DLR platforms. Came in very handy to say the least lol
Did it have a sign on it that said "Beware of the Leopard"?
@@thehaprust6312 I sadly didn't have a torch...
@@demitrilevantis3427 At least the stairs hadn't gone...
I found them unexpectedly one day as well, they are well hidden! Unfortunately on that day they were closed for ‘maintenance’ so my hopes were dashed!!
@@thehaprust6312 No, that's on the filing cabinet in the basement.
Abs nightmare for us prostate sufferers who have little warning and a definite panic to "mind the gap" so to speak before its all over :( I remember commuting through Victoria the fearsome reputation the bogs had there and the toilets at Viccy were absolute last chance for many of us blokes who would find themselves accosted by ahem denizens of a certain negotiable favour or old bill pulling you up to ask whats going on here sonny jim. I used the Casey Jones loos instead which were less fraught with disaster as don't forget this was the era of EPB's without lav's and the rush hour 4CEP's would be crammed super bad and chances of a loo were remote. Charing Cross was little better but London Bridge with the mens lavs opposite the BTP office it was positive luxury with no chance of oo-er's and mishaps, quite refreshing and the 1-6 platform loo's were pretty good cleaned up many times a day.
Belated apologies to the station staff at Baker Street about thirty years ago. I started feeling sick on my way to Paddington and somehow managed to get off the packed rush hour train just before I emptied my stomach at the end of the platform.
As a long-time traveler on trains I appreciate your effort to get off the train first. Much appreciated!
I did the same once in the early 2000s at London Bridge...puked like something from the Exorcist...yet not a single person said anything or offered help 😮 they just got on with their lives
@@keithparker1346 I'd have stopped to ask if you were okay. I'm sorry nobody else did.
@@KidarWolf I had commuted for a number of years so I cannot blame them as I may have been some dangerous drunk or something...and I probably would have done the same. Anyway thanks
Lucky you didn't cause a short circuit! On a DC system, chlorine gas might be produced by electrolysis, which would be decidedly unpleasant underground. Was there a station announcement: "trains delayed because of bits of carrot on the line".
The lack of anything at Morden (local authority sold off toilets) is perhaps the worse one as the end of the line stations probably need things more than most, sometimes one has to arrange ones journey via thameslink for the on board provision
Jago, your introduction warning is some of your best snarky humor but also completely on-point and smart. thanks for the gideo
This topic of “public conveniences” is really interesting. To respond to your question of what happens if the lavatory facilities are below the level of the sewer, a sump would need to be dug (lined pit or nowadays a tank) and a sump pump with level float is installed to raise the effluent up to the level of the receiving sewer line. This is also done on a large scale where land has lots of rises and falls and to dig sewers at a level for gravity to work would be prohibitive.
Some use a sump pump but most used a sewage ejector system. A tank get's filled with waste, the level float triggers and compressed air forces the contents up to the sewer. This was very common when points etc used compressed air. I suspect that as points now use electric motors.... They no longer use compressed air and thus now favour maceraters and sump pumps as you correctly pointed out. I had a mate who's job was changing the nozzles and fixing the non return valves.... What a great job!!!!!
@@user-dh1cu2rf7h It's a shitty job, but someone has to do. Also I hope they're well paid for such work!
Most underground stations have now closed their ticket offices and staff facilities associated with them, so they could easily be turned into extra toilet facilities.
The platform 7 toilets that stay open until 2am at Finsbury Park on the national rail section have saved me and my bladder many, many times after an evening out in central London lasted a little longer than expected. Even when not changing to a national rail train I often make the journey up and down just to use them. They may be disgusting, but at least they exist.
Not to worry, Jago. We’re just going through the motions and subsequently taking time off in loo! Lol 😝
You should feel flushed with success for that one.
@@LadyGavGav Nah! It's a load of ballcocks in my opinion!
That just wiped the smile off my face.
Interesting to note at the end the shot of a public telephone box next to the public toilet. My memory of public telephone boxes on the tube is that most of them doubled up as a public toilet at some time or other. Makes sense to put them next to each other. 😊
Funny Gary Delany one liner from a few years ago "I was at the train station the other day and saw a piano on one of the platforms. So I had a little tinkle and saved myself twenty pence."
Don't tell Dr.K 😆
Having bladder cancer means that I just can't and don't travel on public transport for more than a 20 minute journey. Even my trips to hospital for chemo have to be made by taxi.
Joe Wilkinson has some interesting thoughts about train station toilets.
An absolutely amazing poem, side splittingly funny!!!!
Didn’t think I’d see you here, Captain Birdseye.
@@Jack-cq9pv Nor you Mrs Fernsby, my old geography teacher…
Better than Wetherspoons or McD's for WC use is a lot of the Betting Shops,
I never thought of that. But I suppose if you don’t want people to leave, it makes sense.
I've never really been in one. Do they really have toilets? And do they really still exist in this day and age?
And yet, if you go to Japan or South Korea they have clean and free public toilets in many of their metro stations. So good! 🙌
Certainly a problem in most major cities. New York famously has few toilets in its subway system (other than most elevators/lifts ugh) and woe to you should you find one and it's actually open.🤮
One rare exception there is Times Square, where they have a bunch of individual bathrooms with an attendant who buzzes you in and out, and are kept fairly clean because of it. Our main line/commuter rail terminals are generally easy for bathrooms though, but quality can vary.
NY in general is famous for the difficulty in finding a public bathroom and the subway especially, for all the same reasons.
Great video as always!
Ah, that's an old international problem. Here in Moscow some stations had toilets in a project, still those were staff-only available. On late 10's we had 20 to 30 toilet modules being installed here and there, still it isn't enough.
Back in the 90s I lived in Hillingdon which is a goodly tube ride from central London at the best of times but even more so if you've been out for a few shandies with all that entails. The toilets on the platform at Wembley Park though rather rudimentary were often a source of considerable relief. Sadly when they redeveloped the station the toilets disappeared.
Many of the District line stations in the east have toilets but they had to cap them off, cos people kept getting mugged and vandalising the area, and caught with drugs, syringes and stuff like that - it was that bad.
Here in Vienna, which has a modern, expanding metro system (a new line is currently under construction) the availability of toilet facilities is not ubiquitous, either. The older stations rarely have them, some of the new ones, especially ‘out in the sticks’, have none. Those in the city centre are sometimes closed. Some are ‘manned’ the vast majority are not. Metro (or U-Bahn) khazis used to be free, but they now charge 50c, even to spend a penny. They are, however, clean and for the greater part in working order.
Should be easy enough to have loos on The Drain.
Jago, I recall that back in the early 1960s almost all Underground stations DID have public toilets, often these were located in or near the booking hall. Quite a few open-air stations had men's toilets on the platforms, intended for use by the train crews (who were all male in those days).
These pesky women.....
I just wrote a really clever comment - and then the video got to 4:55 - 5:30. You think of everything, don't you Mr Hazzard. Great video! How do you keep coming up with these ideas?!
5:45 - Replace public telephones with public toilets!
Now we all carry mobile phones!
To put the toilets underground they’d need a device called a macerator, basically it chops up all the effluent and pumps it away at high pressure. Can’t imagine several hundred of them all round London would all be working however. And not like that’s gonna stop someone going in the mess 😬
You only need a macerator if you have narrow section pipes. Remember that there are water pumps keeping the underground dry all the time.
@@hairyairey aye but they’ll be for surface water, if it’s got poop in it itll likely need go to a different drain. If it needs to be pumped at pressure you’d usually do that in a smaller pipe
The traditional way to handle toilets under a sewer level is to have a holding tank, and then push it up under pressure. The pump used is normally termed an ejector. This is how things like the underground telephone exchanges and cold war bunkers ran. They don't use a macerator.
@@TheChloeRed ah. You know more about this than me lol, my experience is mostly domestic see. Yeah I wondered if something like that would be the usual method but with the expense of retrofitting etc… who knows. Don’t think they’ll be installing any platform level toilets anytime soon anyway haha
@@cakeskin3333 The reason it's done that way is so you don't end up with (basically) a pressurised column of sewage if something fails. That can be.. messy! You don't tend to retro fit it because it's a lot of work, you have to sink a tank somewhere, add the ejectors, maintenance for it.. And maintenance of it is icky.
According to TFL barking has a toilet (it doesn't), also all the toilets east of barking have now been closed due to anti-social behaviour
Finding a public toilet above ground level can be hard enough in Central London.
I've seen it so bad that certain fast food joints employ someone to stand outside the toilets and only allow customers in.
Department stores usually have them, but department stores are going out of fashion.
I was always under the impression that Free House pubs had to let people use the toilets without buying anything, but that turns out to be false. It just happens that a lot of free houses just tend not to bother stopping people. With that in mind, 'Spoons are always great if you're caught short.
Coming from Hong Kong where almost any station has toilets, and they’ve retrofitted old stations that were originally without, the state of affairs in London is terrible. It is a city that also has a lot of public toilets all around. The same comparison can be drawn with most Asian cities, not just HK. It’s shocking to see the degree to which the UK has both failed to catch up and even has regressed.
The Paddington station facilities is correct and they are nice to have, but to get to them from the Bakerloo line consists of 3 lifts, 2 massive corridors to go down as well as continuing into the main station itself. You have to leave the gate line to get to it. It is a huge detour! If the lifts are busy and you gotta go, you're in trouble.
All Underground stations have toilets, even those deep underground...... there are many staff facilities around. Baker Street Jubilee Depot for instance, a set of rooms deep below ground (entrances by platform 10 and a back way in/out on platform 7) has staff toilets, as does the Elephant & Castle Bakerloo Northbound platform... Pumps are used to remove the waste up to a normal level for disposal......
At one time there was the circle line game. It was a pub crawl with a drink at each station. A visit to the loo sent you back one station and I never managed to complete the course. Then there was the variant where we would have rucksacks full of miniatures and toast the train from the platform. (That was before alcohol was banned.) Suddenly the lack of facilities became a serious problem. Happy days!
Thanks for this. Sometime this summer I'd like to do the longest non-stop journey (I think!) which I can do on a Freedom Pass, Abbey Wood to Reading on the Elizabeth Line for no other reason than that I can. There are no loos on the trains though! Drat!
This subject was covered in a couple of episodes of Hidden London Hangouts in regards to the needs of those sheltering from the Blitz. Needless to say that having to use the jerryrigged loos were a rather unpleasant experience
There are a good few Overground Stations bereft of the required systems too
I do find it nice that despite the damage, SEPTA (philly's Transit network) does keep functionap toilets open to the public at all times with hourly inspections for maintenance. This is at all but Kensington square which is welded shut due to overdoses. But i visit the city only once in a while so rarely a issue.
As a man of a certain age and sometime visitor to London I found this very informative! Would you ever consider doing some videos on the departmental side of LT, specifically their steam and diesel shunters as well as rolling stock? Many thanks.
'As a man of a certain age and sometime visitor to London ...' head for a department store for public loos.
I once had to use the Baker street toilet due to unfortunate illness. That was a learning experience as let's just say many patrons had "adapted" the space for "networking" between cubicles and sharing lots of "details" on "noticeboards". I have no prejudice for such activities however I did feel like I was misusing the space since it had apparently been "repurposed".
Those Bakerloo Line 1972 Stock tube trains do look pretty old and needs replacing at some point in few years. But yes it’s quite hard to find a toilet at any tube station in and around London.
With other tube stations that do have toilets and some toilets at some stations you have to pay. And there are underground toilets dotted around London that have remained opened to the public.
As an ancient male with a hugely enlarged prostate I carry a plastic bottle with me which I get out and pee in when necessary, it does attract some scowls and gasps of disbelief on the tube but when they see the relief on my face most understand.
Untrue of course but I I'm trying to make powers that be understand how desperate you can get when there is nowhere to go when the need is great.
Putting a toilet below the sewage level. It's fairly common practise for buildings with basements. You just have a pump (normally with a grinder) and sometimes a tank of sorts.
So you just pumped the refuge up to sewer level.
Disembarking, usually just walking into the nearest Prête or Nero's (with an attitude of brisk confidence, as if you're just about to buy a coffee) & using their loo is perfectly feasible - Nero's & Prête are everywhere
And in the American context? Starbuck's! At least it was until "the unpleasantness"...
?@@stickynorth
When I lived in London the Tube was my main form of transport and I never gave it a thought about toilets. It makes sense your explanation about short journeys. Basically when you think about it the Tube is just a bus service on tracks and bus stops don’t have toilets.
At least if you get stuck in traffic on a bus you can get off at the next stop and find a toilet. If the tube gets stuck in the tunnel for a long time due to a signal failure or whatever, then you have a problem!
Great video, wasn't looking for this but a great intro and random watch.
there's another ancient metro system in a european city where I live and they've recently installed public accessable toilets in major line intersections, they just put those at some not so busy corners of passageways, you pay for the visit with your regular metro card and those toilets seem to be rather clean, so I believe this is technically achievable
I was on a District Line train once, when there was an announcement "this train will terminate at the next station", to which everyone sighed or moaned. The driver went on to explain "this is due to a medical emergency... meaning that the driver has to go to the toilet", and everyone laughed and accepted that. Thus the train terminated at High Street Kensington, so there is at least a staff toilet there, though not open to the public.
What I don't get is how come it's comparatively easy to add a lift to get those passengers who cannot use the lifts / stairs, but finding space for a toilet is too hard?
Lifts have no plumbing, and of course people rarely do spectacularly disgusting things in lifts.
I've seen lots of closed rooms, offices, shops, ticket windows, etc in your videos of old stations (including that outro with a public telephone room next to toilets). There is space for individual toilets in passenger-accessible areas. Not major high-volume stables-stye toilets, but space for a few.
It's not just the toilet, it's the plumbing as well. Easier for one block rather than numerous individual facilities
A comparison that could also be made between the underground is you don’t get toilets on buses or trams and neither at their relevant stops. Also, as you mention, to have toilets cost money and would inflate the fares. I also particularly note Merseyrail trains, neither old or new, have never had toilets and very few of their stations have toilets.
There are brick pillars on the westbound platform at Upton Park outlining spaces where the loos used to be.
There is something to be said for the process that I have seen in Germany and elsewhere in which someone needing a toilet can go into any shop and ask to use the toilet, generally paying 50 cents if not a customer of the shop. I'm not sure that this would adapt to British society though.
There used to be more-as in most public places-but those running them close them (eg there used to be one on the london bound BR at Walthamstow Central)...some Outer London branches have loos at a lot of stations as you state🎩
Genius Jago. Sheer genius. I've often wondered why and now, thanks to you, I know! Thank you. J
5:50 I’m sure the telephone kiosk could be repurposed - if it hasn’t already been so ‘informally’!
At Eastcote Station (met line) they closed the toilets and put up a sign saying something like “due to drug addicts ruining it for everyone, these toilets are now closed permanently”. This was a few years ago now.
South Ruislip has a toilet but you may catch some something trying to use it…
My local station on the District Line has toilets, problem being about 15-20 years ago they started locking them due to drug users using them. Although you can ask for the key there's rarely anyone in the ticket office to ask... Saying that in the local area there used to be 4 public lavatories run by the local council within a 20-25 minute walk of this station, all barring one have been closed and either sold or demolished.
A few seconds into this, I was thinking, "blame the Victorians." Yyyyyep!
I have a crazy notion though... if you can't build out to put in the John, as it would cost money, and putting the lavs below the sewer line is an idea so bad as to be categorically denied... Why not build the thrones *above* the station? Extend the lifts, add in stairs, go up to flush your troubles down!
Toronto’s TTC is the same way. Out of a total of 70 subway stations, only 8 have washrooms.
When my daughter was little, I took her and her friend to ride the cable car (cheap day out), stupidly on an engineering works day. We had to get a bus back into town from Greenwich and I and the kids were bursting. The bus was slow and as soon as I realised that we were at Elephant and Castle, we got off to continue our journey by Tube. It turns out that that for all the reasons stated, there are no toilets there and with two little ones in tow, it's a long way to the Elephant and Castle shopping Centre (no longer in existence) which which we weren't sure had loos either. However, I persuaded the staff to let the girls use their toilet and of course helped myself while we were there. They might have rules to follow but they are mostly human.
There was a wonderful little Gents toilet on one of the platforms at High Barnet , complete with green stalagmites in the urinals (this predating the new ring main) I wonder if it is still there.
I think (though it may be an urban myth) that one of the key design considerations of the early tube was to ensure there was enough height to facilitate the wearing of top hats for regular folk going to the City, or the opera?
If this comment is TMI, I apologize in advance.
The Atlanta US MARTA system has closed almost all of its toilets due to vandalism. So, some people have taken to relieving themselves in station elevators/lifts; there's at least one at every station. To combat this, new urine-detection technology has been added to many elevators/lifts, which sounds an alarm if someone does relieve themselves there. MARTA transit police are quick on the scene to take the person into custody and fine them. This has helped ... a little.
They would definitely be pissed off...........................................I'll see myself out.
Some years ago all of the toilets at National Rail's London terminals were made free. This was a great convenience.
I used to use the tube a lot back in the 1960's and, at platform level, I only knew of 2 stations with toilets (outer London above ground excepted). If my memory serves thet were Gloucester Road and South Kensington .............. next door to each other !!! Probably closed long ago now.
"Held it in" is precisely what I once did between Sloane Square and Ealing Broadway. To make matters worse, I had got on the train to Richmond by mistake, so I got off on Earl's Court to change trains to one for Ealing Broadway. Couldn't find a loo at Earl's Court, so I carried on some 30 excruciating minutes.
Top tip, if you're from north west London and having drinks in East, there's a gents at Liverpool Street, Baker Street on the Met line platform going west, Wembley Park on the same platform going west. All 3 have been a pants saver
Personally I have small bladder syndrome so it is a hassle to travel with confidence as a rail enthusiast 😢
In the good old days BSC (before S-class) one could utilise the connecting door at the end of the carriage.
Now one has had to swap improvised toilet facilities for air conditioning and CCTV
It's a certain age that thinks the same reason why refuse bins were removed from public places.
And if the world wasn't filled with yobbos going round vandalising and graffiti-ing everything, there'd be no need to close toilets and remove refuse bins.
Because the followers of a gentleman on trial at Woolwich Crown Court use closed areas for things which create a lot of nitrogen.
Certain groups used to use bins as somewhere to plant explosives. This is why you'll still see them in slightly less convenient places away from where people tend to congregate (think bus stops). Especially in bigger towns and cities. This is also partly why a lot of bins are just frames with a dangling clear bag, as are famous in Mr. Marshall's videos.
@@TalesOfWarwar on terror nonsense