We use the bell on the bike sparingly, yes. Or else traffic would be a deafening cacophony. Note that, in the Netherlands, hooting the klaxon in your car can actually be fined when police deem that you had no valid reason to use it - the judgment at their discretion.
Same goes with the bell actually! I mean the police won't fine your for it, but in the law it states that ringing your bell without reason is illegal. It can cause confusing and thus danger in traffic because we use it only in "emergency" cases. It was the scare tactic that they used when you had to do your 'verkeersexamen', so you won't be that annoying kid ringing your bell all the time.
@@bobosims1848 I mean sure if you brake randomly in the middle of the road that's a dick move cus it's dangerous, but obviously taking off your brakes entirely is also a dick move because that's dangerous in case you do need them :') The same goes for the bell, if there is an emergency it's dangerous not to have it so you have to have it even though you preferably don't get to use it.
Actually I have two bells on my bicycle. One is the ordinary 'ring-ring' for alarm, which I never use. The other one gives just one 'ping'. I use it (sparingly, I prefer to whistle a happy tune) to warn pedestrins on the narrow bikelanes in the woods around Zeist.
Even in Amsterdam I never had an issue ordering just something to eat in a cafe. I think it was just the way you said it that was rude, haha. Usually when I do it they say “you want nothing to drink?” and when I reply “No thank you” it’s perfectly fine.
There is a bar in Utrecht (in Neude) where a sign says they don't have a kitchen, and you are invited to go and bring back food. As long as you buy a drink from them.
I notice in Amsterdam, probably everywhere in NL, when you are a pedestrian and come to a zebrapad, you should have right of passage before everything else. But, all pedestrians give right of way to bikes. It's like we all know, it's as pedestrian much easier to stop for a moment, than for a bike. Thus we all wait to help cyclists. But cars, they just have to stop. We're out in the weather. ;)
More like most pedestrians expect bikers either not to know the proper traffic rules or to just not give a flying fig about them. Same reason why pedestrians are often also stop at a zebrapad for cars even though they have right of way, cars are just a lot harder and more durable then their own skins. And you never know if the car isn't driven by an asshole who think he's above the rules. (I've had cars honk and gesture at me for crossing in front of them on a zebrapad in the past and once or twice nearly hitting me if I hadn't jumped of in time.)
@@PhoenixNL72-DEGA- The trick with cars in the Netherlands is to not look at cars when you cross. I know I must be careful, but I walk and cars stop but the I and other pedestrians walk with arrogance, the more careful cars, in general, will have to be. The trick also lies in timing. Cars need space to break, not idiots jumping in front of them. ;)
@@KootFloris Yeah, until you encounter an asshole that thinks he's king of the road. Like I said I had to jump of a zebrapad a couple of times, and usually at the other end of it cause the car just refused to slow down at all. (Especially people who drive status car brands like Mercs and BMWs seem to suffer from this, like they are too good to break for others) And then there are those drivers that honk their horn and make rude gestures if you start passing WELL before they are close to the zebra and are just angry that you had the audacity to not let them pass before you. It might be different in small towns or villages, but in major cities drivers can be aholles. (And I'm dutch as were my parents, grandparents and greatgrandparents)
@@PhoenixNL72-DEGA- But do you live in NL? Because here honking for nothing is forbidden. Can even get you fined. I never had to jump out of the way. But I time carefully and then walk like I own the place. In Amsterdam. But perhaps different cities, different customs. Like in rich neighborhoods with few pedestrians, I'm way more careful.
Ofcourse we Dutch prefer to speak Dutch most of the time. When someone stays long-term in the Netherlands, I find it appalling when that person doesn''t make a serious effort to learn Dutch. Which means reading Dutch, writing Dutch, listening to Dutch, and speaking Dutch.
So true. Keep in mind that you do not have to be fluent as we understand that learning a new language is hard but we want to see you make a effort. If you do we can be patient and help you with words you do not know yet. Let's face it, most dutch speak Dutch, English and German. But a lot will also speak French or Spanish. If we take the effort to learn your language for the 2 weeks we spend in your country, the least you can do is the same. I never understood people that come here (French, German, eastern europe, etc) without even speaking english and just demand that we talk to them in their language. O and don't badmouth a Dutchman in your own language, we may not speak it but we may know how to swear in it. I can swear in Dutch, English, German, French, Spanish, (Brazilian)Portugese, Russian, Hebrew, Japanese, Italian, Arabic and probably a few more that I forgot but that will pop up again if I hear them.
Well according to my experience having loads of Expats as colleagues is the Dutch in reality don't have the patience for foreigners the practise Dutch by letting them talk Dutch. Every single try lasts half a sentence at most and the Dutch switch to English. This applies to professional AND social life. Foreigners don't stand a chance.
@@endthisnonsense7202 That's true. When talking 1 on 1, it's almost impossible to stop the Dutch person from speak english. We are good in English and we embrace the opportunity to show it off ;) However, in a group of Dutch people with one person not talking Dutch (like work), this person is usually going to mis out on 90% of what's being said.
@@DutchObserver [However, in a group of Dutch people with one person not talking Dutch (like work), this person is usually going to mis out on 90% of what's being said.] True, but THAT is not typical for Dutch native speakers, it's typical for humans. In any setting where there is a majority of native speakers of any language, that language dominates the conversation regardless of the capability of the minority to speak/understand it. You'll see exactly the same in a group of 2 Frisians and 1 Dutch person in the Netherlands, or for instance 2+ Indonesian native speakers and 1 Dutch person. Two Russians and a Japanese and so on and so on.
@@woutbakker7319 you’d simply ask “ is it my turn or were you first ?” But usually we kinda know who came in after us, so if no one is left that we didn’t see come in after us it’s our turn.
So the last one is a little bit weird. Actually it comes down to you being surprised that people in the Netherlands like to speak their own language while being in the Netherlands.
The surprising thing for me was that most Dutch people automatically switch to English when needed, especially younger people. Even the people who don't speak English very well at least try to, unlike in countries like France and Germany.
@@NeiloNeil some do, most Dutch people don't but are to polite to refuse. If I found out people are not tourists and live here a couple of years I refuse to speak english. You Never Will become part of society if you don't speak their native language
An average Dutch grown up has a vocabulary of about 42000 words. A person with a collage education or more knows 60000 words or more. In a foreign language actively knowing 4500 words is considered good, and after living somewhere for a few years you may get over the 10000 words. Speaking a foreign language you constantly realise you are missing details and emotions. That is the reason you prefer your mother tongue!
Indeed, and this is the Netherlands, so that's the home language. Unless there's a lot of foreigners around. Then I've learned to speak English so they may join the conversation.
This is why you should try speaking the other persons language in a conversation. So the American speaking Dutch to a Dutchman speaking English. This way there is very little chance of using a word that the other person doesn't know.
And if you are hearing your mother tongue all day you're thinking in that language, but having to speak in an other all of the sudden. It gets easier and less tiering if you are only speaking the other language for a longer period of time. I always have to get used to the way you move your mouth while speaking an other language 😅
@@ST-vt4nu It takes a while to switch from Dutch to English and back. I often find myself mixing english with dutch or dutch with english words at first like an engine struggeling to get started , but once I get going I'm fine.
@@Scarletcroft I was raised bilingual. Dutch-Frisian. I learned english very young. now I'm 50 and if someone switches from one language to another I don't even notice... something that happens a lot; I can't remember a word in the right language. so I'm mixing three languages and it's terrible.
First let me say: thank God we're all different, otherwise we'd be all the same. 1- Cafe's were originally/culturally intended for drinking. Being able to get something to eat is just an added bonus. Having said that, I wouldn't consider it rude if all you did was order a bite to eat. Maybe you should say: just the apple pie, please? Of course, Amsterdam, being the tourist trap that it is, may have some more unwritten rules. Like trying to sell as much as they can to unwitting tourists. 2- Dutch never stand neatly in line as our British and apparently US neighbors do. Just keep a mental note of who was there first and who arrives after you. And don't forget to ask of the people in front of you if they are already being serviced. However we do have places where you can draw a number, usually at the butcher's or in government buildings, as you said. 3- Nothing wrong with ringing your bell. It's just that the infrastructure here usually keeps all participants out of each others way. Roads for cars, bike paths for bikes, sidewalks for pedestrians. 4- Obviously, going WITH the traffic avoids more accidents than going AGAINST the traffic...Duh. Furthermore, in cities, the first traffic law that comes to mind is usually the law of the jungle: show no fear and you will get right of way. But we do have actual traffic laws, such as yield to traffic from the right etc. Also important to realize is that pedestrians and cyclists are considered more vulnerable because... they are. This is visible in our laws and fines. Hit a pedestrian or a cyclist with your car and you are automatically found at fault and guilty. This may be a difference with the US where cars are 'holy'. 5- Would you rather speak your native tongue in the US, or Dutch? Obviously, the Dutch prefer to speak Dutch. It's our language. Just because we like to show off our skills, doesn't mean we want to do it indefinitely.
Nothing rude about denying the things you don't want, you are the customer. Niets onbeleefd aan wanneer je als klant dan reageert met: " Alleen de appeltaart graag".
I kinda suspect that your girlfriend meant was that "and that's OK" will probably come off as patronizing. Like others said "Just apple pie please", would have been more appropriate.
We do use the bell on the bike though, usually when people are blocking the bicycle lane or to give them a heads up that we are going to overtake them. Yes some people take it as rude, but it should be used as a signal that you want to overtake someone if you can't get past them.
For overtaking, I only see people using their bell if space is limited. I've never seen people do that is there is a lot of space (excluding little kids).
I've been a bartender (and patron) in Amsterdam for more years then I'd like to admit and there's nothing wrong with only ordering apple pie. In that situation, it wouldn't even have been a problem if your girlfriend ordered something but you politely declined. And if the waiter made it out to be, that's one of those situations in which you apply a light touch of Dutch directness. ;-)
I'm also verry confused how that was rude, no need to buy and pay for something you don't want. Usually people do also order drinks i don't generaly see people that don't also order drinks but i'm pretty sure that's not needed to not be rude. Even if it might be considdered rude it's fine, saving money is verry Dutch :P.
So true! Nothing rude about you ordering only apple pie. I sometimes use a saying: “welk woord begrijp je niet van ‘nee’?” . Yes, that’s rude. Sometimes people ‘need’ that kind of rudeness. 😅 When they realy don’t listen to you…😊
Oh, something else about the queue thing: you can make good use of the lack of a queue when at a bus stop. If you accurately gauge where the door of the bus will be when it stops, and you position yourself there, you will be, by definition, at the front of the queue.
The bicycle bell thing is entirely true; there's only one commonly agreed upon moment to ring your bell, and that's the moment about 2/10ths of a second before impact, presumably so the other person has an instant to brace themselves.
About waiting your turn, just ask: wie is er als laatste? Then you only have to pay attention to 1 person and the next person should do the same. Very common in my hometown at least
Yeah and if you tend to forget U usually wil have the person behind you say "no no he/she was here before me. Go ahead" That is unless the person behind you is a woman that wants cheese :D
I always track who is already in the room and who comes after me so I have a roughly idea of when it's my turn. And In general it's not a big deal if I get one place in front or someone that got later gets in front of me.
Yeah, that ‘line’ thing, while there’s no line. I always look for the one that came into the shop after me. So I don’t mind who takes their turn before me, as long as it is not that one person that I’m keeping an eye on. If every one acts to that rule, there’s an invisible line.
Hi Eva, loved the video! Regarding Dutch traffic, what I usually explain to exchange students is that it’s better to be predictable than to be correct, especially while cycling or walking. We tend to move around each other, but that can only work if all parties roughly know how the rest will move. So, like you said, don’t waver when you want to cross the road, either clearly do it or clearly wait :) This is where the bell comes in. I would only use the bell when I think someone might do something unpredictable or when they’re in the way. I would ring my bell when people are swerving on the road, when parents cycle with their children (children tend to swerve more often), when groups of people are blocking the road, or when a pedestrian suddenly crosses the street without looking (very annoying :P). Although it might seem to be the case that we speak fluent English, I feel that it is rarely the case that someone is completely fluent. Speaking a foreign language usually still comes with some difficulties. For example, it is a lot easier to make jokes in your native tongue, especially jokes that rely on language, such as puns. These make conversations more lighthearted and can really help you bond with someone. Also, it is difficult to create subtle nuances in language that help steer the tone of the conversation. Unfortunately, that means that, in my experience, English is mainly used to share information in some way. Which at some point can become quite exhausting without the language-play we tend to include while speaking Dutch ;)
Hear hear on being better to be predictable! The person in front of me being predictable allows me to be predictable to the person behind me, keeping everyone safer :D The absolute worst is people who cannot seem to make a decision, waffling and making aborted moves, like, I don't /want/ to hit you, but you're making it really hard for me to actually know where you are and dodge you :/
One of many things I love about visiting The Netherlands is that people there never assume you don't speak Dutch. I'm not white, and strangers always start speaking to me in Dutch, and I say I only speak English (I speak other languages, but that is not the point), and they immediately switch to English. It's really nice. Also, the Dutch always treat me like I'm a fellow human being just like them, whereas in Germany, Austria, and France, some people treated me like I was sub-human or something.
The last rule is so true! Me and my girlfriend speak English on a near-native level. We have a lot of friends who moved here to study and don't speak Dutch (very well). So whenever they come over we speak English to them, but we take absolutely every chance to switch back to Dutch (without being rude of course). This doesn't really make a lot of sense because we're both very comfortable speaking English. I think the main reason is that it takes just a little more effort to speak your second language.
Exactly! I am fluent in English, but Dutch is my mother tongue and I don't need to think about it for a second. I am comfortable in, and have no problem with speaking English, but it is still a tad bit less easy than my mother tongue. I think this goes for most people who were raised in one language and are fluent in a second.
To me it's also just making the sounds. I can speak Dutch with no effort, but in English I stumble over my words, even though my vocabulary is pretty big. There's just some sounds that are tongue twisters to me, even though they don't have to be. Try saying "Short Circuit" for example.
Hi Ava, number 5 on your list blows my mind, since most expats complain about not getting the opportunity to learn to speak Dutch, since almost all Dutch people like to practice their English on expats and foreign visitors, even if the expat is speaking at least rudimentary Dutch. You can find this complaint from expats all over the internet in videos, podcasts and written material. Dutch people are known for switching into English in a heartbeat without even thinking about it, since it is their second language, which they learned in school from grade eight onwards. Also Dutch television does not synchronize foreign programs, but do subtitles instead, which is great for easy adoption of foreign languages like English and German and occasionally even French or Spanish. I have had similar experiences in Germany and in dealing with German business relations. I speak German quite well, but as soon as a German finds out you’re foreign, they automatically switch to English. I think this is a courtesy thing by thus leveling the playing field for both parties. Anyways, keep up the good work and keep posting your interesting videos.
The 5th rule also applies for other countries. I'm working in an international environment. In meetings and work we spreak English, but in informal coffee chats Portugese/Brazilian, just speak Portugese. Chinese just spreak chinese when there aren't non Chinese persons around. Similar when Dutch have a coffee chat. I also see it for myself, that i go back to Dutch (outside by work environment) even then there is a non native spreaking person is around.
In my opinion, a country has a language for a reason. So of course when you are in a certain country people prefer speaking that language. You can't expect a country to forget it's own language because it has internationals in it (not saying she expected that), because why would it have their own language to begin with. No matter how fluent you are in a certain language. Speaking in your native language will always be easier.
I lived with someone from the US for 10 years My experience that even when your english is good and you have a large vocabulary it is easier to express yourself in your own language when the conversation goes deeper. Special early in the morning during a meeting and you are just awake. Or when your angry or have a disagreement But that is just me. My grandson is 11 and can speak and read English very well. His school starts teaching english to kids when they are 4 years old.
Hey Ava :-) Nope .. you can definately order something to eat without ordering something to drink! Just maybe a bit more uncommon but for sure not rude! You are customer so you decide! :-) About the waiting: You usually just ask: Wie was de laatste? :-) About speaking Dutch or English when you are bilingual: There is always a language in which you feel more comfortable and you are more capable to express your feelings and opinions. For most Dutchies that is of course ..Dutch! So in a situation at work or among friends the urge to express exactly what you feel or think is dominant over being on common ground with language. And: If I compare my ability to communicate in English or Dutch, I don't mind WRITING English but I prefer talking Dutch if I really want to be well understood. Does that make sense to you? In writing you can "compose" the message just until it reflects your feelings while in speach it is out in the open without any chance to take back what you said ;-) Have a wonderful Sunday Ava!
In the Netherlands there is a saying. "Ze eten je arm, maar drinken je rijk." Which means (loosely translated) "By eating they make you poor, by drinking they make you rich." Which stemms from the old habit that most of the time cafes and restaurants do not earn much on the food. But they do have a big margin on drinks. Cheers! 🍻
I don't think it's rude to not order a drink. But they make the most profit on drinks. * Knowing where you are in line is the result of not being as isolated or as much living in a bubble as White Americans -- gasp -- no offense. * An unwritten unofficial rule in Amsterdam (only) is that pedestrians have a right of way on bikers and bikers on drivers. It's the sympathy for the underdog. And traffic lights: red means go ahead, green means watch the scene. * Speaking Dutch is just more gezellig! We feel fake when we need to speak this English that feels plastic, unnatural. Not using our small words as 'wel,' 'toch,' 'een beetje' make it hard for us to express the nuances that we have in Dutch.* In the Netherlands, people don't need so much space around them like USers. So, they don't say "excuse me" whenever they pass someone within 3 feet. It's annoying to have to pay attention to someone saying "excuse me" who doesn't need anything from you. :-) You didn't notice? * Great video! Keep up the good work!
I have a friend who’s from England, and been living in the Netherlands for many years now. Although he speaks and understands Dutch perfectly, he prefers to speak English. So while we all speak Dutch to each other, he speaks English. Works like a charm, we all perfectly understand each other (although often times I find myself automatically switching to English during conversations with him).
Before I use my bell I usually try to make different noises with my bike, if their is enough time for that. Clicking with my handbrakes or thumping my pedals. Usually that's enough to make people notice. If they don't Ill ring away and even feel justified doing it.
The bell has a purpose, when a 'dangerous' situation is about to happen the bell is there to alert the other person. Just like the horn of a car. You use them only when necessary.
Niet alle nederlanders letten op bij het wachten. Ik sta meestal wat te dromen. Daarom vraag ik als het drukker is vaak: "Wie was de laatste". Dan hoef ik alleen die persoon in de gaten te houden. Not all Dutch are paying attention while in line. Most of the time I'm daydreaming. That's why when it's busy I ask "who was last" when coming in. That way I only have to pay attention to one person. Of course I do watch who is coming in after me. So I know they are not skipping the line. Any attempt to do so will be met with a firm and slightly hostile "It's not your turn". ;-) As for preferring to speak dutch. The reason for that is quite simple. Most people don't speak English daily so despite the fact that they perfectly capable of speaking english it still takes a little bit more effort and it tires you. Something you must have noticed yourself. If you speak Dutch for multiple hours your brain gets tired and it becomes more difficult. But maybe that's just me?
I love these little sneakpeaks into our ways as the Dutch, and am bingewatching your videos atm. I often find myself nodding along, sometimes I'm surprised and I am curious all the time what you will bring up next. For instance, I didn't really know about the drink rule. I guess it just never comes up? The standing in line thing really made me laugh, knowing where you are in line probably is second nature to us. Every ones in a while somebody tries to sneak in line and everybody knows it. But I think odds are less then 50/50 anyone speaks up, we just look at eachother in recognition that the sneaky git is in fact a loony.
I am Dutch and I like to watch your videos to learn more about my own country. How expacts see it. I know a other unwritten role: Wait for people to go out of the train/tram/bus before go in yourself. I don't reminder how if it goes in the USA, but I saw in Italy people didn't do that.
In my corner of the US we are very multicultural, and whether you wait for people to get off first or just push your way on seems to depend primarily on what your native culture happens to be. In my neighborhood, waiting politely will most often mean people pushing around you impatiently to grab up all the seats first.
Tip with the standing in line, If someone looks badly at you you can ask "Was u voor mij?" = "where you in front of me?", if they say yes, then always excuse yourself. But just knowing the person in front of you helps most of the times. It also may happen that it is your turn without you knowing and then there will be an akward silence which is a small signal that its probably your turn, just ask to be sure when that happens : )
I think most bike things are easily explained by thinking of bike lanes as roads in New York City (Or at least the way it's portrayed in films): If you stand in the bike lane you can expect similar reactions to standing in the middle of the road. And people ringing their bell comes off similarly to people honking their horns. Since you're a New Yorker, I'm curious if the analogy helps you (or if you can think of some obvious way in which it would break down.)
In cafes most Dutch people order a drink and don't order something something to eat. (Cake, cookies, bread rolls). Next time just say politiely that you are not thirsty (ik heb momenteel geen dorst maar wil graag wel appeltaart met slagroom bestellen)
Who the hell uses "momenteel"(at the moment) in that situation? That's the kind of thing you might find in a textbook, not on the street. Just use the word "nu"(now) or simply say "Nee bedankt, alleen een appeltaart alstublieft"(No thanks, just a apple pie please.)
Actually, I noticed this difference as well, one time when I was in Florida. I noticed that USA people have the tendicy to automatically go stand in line. I found this very uncomfy as a Dutch person being used to stand in a group. Mostly when we enter such a waiting area, we mostly simply ask: "who was last?". That way you only have to keep track of that person. Very simple!
3:50 the rude part was saying it in a arrogant way (with a smile), as if the waitress made a mistake and it was obvious you didn't want a drink. But actually it's not obvious, because normally people don't do that. She thougt you forgot about your drink and wanted to help. You can definitely buy a pie without a drink, just thank her kindly. One more thing to notice: Restaurants and cafe's make their money with drinks, not food. So just eating makes you a non profitable guest, who just occupies space. But you will always be welcome anyway. Btw that's also why we don't do free refills.
Regarding the remembering your place in line, I (as a Dutchman) find that it becomes even more difficult at a place like a fishmonger. The sales(wo)man will ask "Who's next?" and then you can look at those that are before you, not realizing that they are not waiting in line, but that they have already ordered and are waiting for their order to be prepared, so you're next in line before you think you are.
When I walk into a shop with people standing around, I always ask the person closest to me if they are the last in line. Either you get a Yes and then know you're after them or they will say "No, he/she is" and you know when your turn is
The going with the flow in traffic rule is so important. The main thing to keep in mind is: don't be apprehensive. Either do it or don't. I cannot tell you how many times I've heard my parents cuss someone out for not communicating clearly where they are going haha
You missed one most Americans get wrong: if you call someone, especially if you call a phone that has multiple possible people who can answer it: identify yourself first before asking for who you want to speak to!
I also wanted to be able to make a little ring on my bike instead of the usual ring-ring, so I bought a race biker ringer. This gives one single "ding" sound and is way more friendly. The regular ring-ring sounds like "move aside!!". A single ding sounds like "just in case you didn't see me comming".
@@generaldreagonlps6889 for me, not always. More often I just want somebody to be aware of me being there, to prevent an accident, in case they don't pay enough attention to their surroundings.
On speaking Dutch... I think Dutch sometime too easy switch to English ;-) In comparison with Germans or French, the Dutch directly switch to English when someone has an foreign accent. The only thing I notice at work is that we like to switch to Dutch if everyone is capable of speaking it... because it is our native language. And I have some colleagues that live now several years in the Netherlands and are capable of at least understanding Dutch. So then the time has comes that we actual should switch, although we still don't... and still speak English in all meetings all day:-D
About rather speaking Dutch. I guess it's also to do with a sense of identity, I guess most people are kind of proud of their country and the language is a big part of the identity of a country, so I guess it goes for everyone, not just Dutch people. You can see it very clearly with people who immigrate to an other country but still it's important to them to teach their kids the language of their home country.
About speaking Dutch over English, in my group of Dutch friends (which might not be "standard") we've caught ourselves speaking English when it's just us. And US friends who immigrated and really wanted to learn and practice their Dutch had to remind us to speak Dutch to them, as we switched to English so very easily. But, YMMV as they say :D
What happens to me as an American living in NL. I want to practice my Dutch, but my Dutch friends always want to speak English with me to practice their English!
Meh, I'm so used to speaking, reading and writing English, having worked at Universities where there are many international meetings, study material English and so on. Also preferring to have my computer's operating system and applications in English as the Dutch translations are often rather clumsy. I even catch myself thinking in English. As my partner is from the US, I even speak English to our cats :) Never miss speaking Dutch, even while I appreciate it. I just don't have a preference.
There are traffic rules in the Netherlands for pedestrians crossing the street even when there is no pedestrian crossing. The rule of thumb is: if the pedestrian wants to cross the street orthogonal of where the traffic is on the pedestrian has to wait, and on the other hand traffic that would turn left/right and the pedestrian wants to cross that sidestreet then the traffic has to wait.
Your story on the apple pie made me grin. It’s absolutely true: it’s quite unheard of to be in a cafe in the Netherlands and then not order something to drink. The reason for this might be that, originally, there was quite a principal distinction between a restaurant - where you came to eat out - and a bar/café - where you came to drink. Ofc, the coming of ‘eetcafé’s’ and things like that since the 1980s has somewhat blurred this distinction, but a cafe remains primarily a place to drink - and not necessarily to eat stuff. There might also be a more literary reason. Willem Kloos, one of the best Dutch poets from the late 1800s, once famously said “natuur is een mooi ding - maar je moet er wel iets te drinken bij hebben” (“nature is wonderful and all - but you need something to drink with it”). Now, if one of the most brilliant of Dutch poets gives such a recommendation, who are we to disagree to it....?
About ordening drinks in a café. I think the waitress was asking because most people go to a café in the first place to get a drink and food second. It is like going to a restaurant and only order a drink and then be surprised the waiter asking what you would like to eat.
Rule 5 doesn't always apply. It's my experience that English speaking people sometimes complain about the Dutch switching to English too easily. Like they're not 'proud of their own language' or something like that (not true btw). But maybe that's just people who are trying to learn to speak Dutch. I can see how that would be a bit annoying.
People on their phone are not really there. Therefore they are not in the mental Line and they end up waiting for hours. If you are waiting on tour turn IT is considered rude to be on your phone..
About the "no line"thing: I remember reading somewhere that in Spain (I think), when people enter into a shop or such where people are waiting, you ask out loud "who's last", so you then know that when they have been served, it's your turn. Seems like a practical way of doing that: no line (so you can for exmple already look into the counter what you want) and also no ticket/number system the vendor needs to buy.
I have been alive in The Netherlands for 35 years and working in the food-service industry for 16, and I have never heard of the rule that you have to order a drink with your food. If someone just orders cake, sure, we'll try to upsell you a drink, but it's definitely not weird or rude. The only instance I can think of that would be weird is going to a fancy restaurant and only ordering a drink. Regarding the bikes: ringing your bell isn't rude, a lot of cyclists are rude. I've seen so many cyclists looking at their phones or not putting their arm out when they turn that it's no surprise to me that they don't ring their bell when they pass someone. To me it's only normal that you go 'ringring, I'm here, be careful please!', but then again I often feel out of place with a lot of typical Dutch behaviour. :')
Hearing your bike story and how much you enjoy biking here, I'm sure you've heard of the Not Only Bikes youtube channel. It's a Canadian guy who is an urban planner and he's explained these obvious and subtle differences in how Dutch and American and Canadian cities work.
I live in the border of Germany and Netherlands and i would say Dutch are the friendliest..they would always speak to me or try to speak in english and i can see the willingness of them to help..a big difference from germans who can speak english..in my first two years here, i have to bring my husband with me everytime i have appointment in Germany (til now sometimes), but i can go out and face people alone and do my errands in the Netherlands without hesitation..All smiles and good vibes in the Netherlands 😎 - From a Filipina with a german husband
The thing about bikes is that if you're walking on a cycling path (because you might not have a choice) you'd walk on the right so that bikers can pass you by. If this is not the case (for instance, if you're walking smack-dab in the middle of the road) a biker could ring the bell. However, constant ringing is like sitting in a car and slamming your horn as often or as long as possible. It's unnecessary because *we got it the first time*. So you're allowed to ring your bell, just don't overdo it.
#5: I believe it depends on the region you are in or specific people who prefer to speak Dutch over English. Most people really don't have a problem at all speaking English, no matter the circumstances. Maybe you've met some people who don't feel comfortable enough speaking English all the time. On the other hand: if you do meet people who prefer to speak Dutch, it might help you in your Dutch proficiency faster.
I love the subtle awareness the Dutch have here about the invisible line. However, when people push forward we become quite direct about it and we let you know you have to go back in the line and wait your turn. We can be very frustrated or angry by that behavior. Ringing when cycling is still used when people are cycling outside of the city. We do that so we let people know we're about to pass them by. But nowadays people have headphones or earplugs and are listening to music, so there's a chance they don't hear it. Nice to hear your perspective on things!
The invisible line is an example of how natural it is to be organized, the same thing in Sweden. This is an important reason why the Netherlands is one of the best functioning countries in the world (top ten in almost all welfare areas).
I must say, I'm surprised by most of these. 1: It's regularly not that big a deal to just order food in a cafe. Like someone below me said, maybe state you 'only' want the food. Sweet stuff is usually ordered with a drink, but I can't imagine it being a big deal if you just order the pie. Non sweet stuff, like a grilled cheese sandwich, definitely shouldn't be a problem to order without a drink. 2: Queuing is a bit all over the place I suppose. Generally, in any kind of waiting room we don't. Sometimes you have a numbered ticket, sometimes you get called by name (general practitioner/huisarts for example) and sometimes you have to pay attention yourself. In a theme park for a ride or at the register in the supermarket we generally will queue. When it comes to public transportation, at least in the North, we just sorta group in front of the door of the bus or train. Tends to be messy, definitely not a queue. 3 The bike bell. You definitely don't want to ring it more than twice (probably only once). If you are just overtaking someone and you can do so without problems you don't need to ring. If people bike next to each other and it's more difficult you are expected to ring. 4: When it comes to traffic, we follow the actual traffic laws and expect everyone to do the same. So if you are crossing a pedestrian/zebra crossing you assume the approaching car will be slowing down/stopping and you keep walking. If a driver sees a cyclist approaching at a roundabout where the driver has 'voorrang' he assumes the cyclist will wait so you keep driving. It is therefore important to make eye contact to make sure the other person has seen you and will follow traffic rules. If you can't make eye contact you have to be extra alert. 5: Again, surprising. I usually hear it's hard to learn Dutch partly because Dutch people always talk in English with English speaking people. Makes it hard to practice/learn by listening. I suppose we generally do have a tendency to go back to Dutch when speaking to each other though.
In the Netherlands learning how to bike and what your place is in traffic is tought through school very early. The rule of thumb is wherever you bike you keep to the right side as much as possible so people can pass on your left side. If there is enough room you really, REALLY shouldn't use the bell. People won't just sway left for no appearant reason.
Having worked in several restaurants over the years I think the margins on drinks are the main reason why it is weird or rude not to order a drink. In the US, you compensate for that by tipping a lot, which is not common here. In the Netherlands restaurants have to pay the waiters a fair wage and it would not be very profitable if nobody ordered drinks.
When I have to wait, I just ask "who was last before me?" when I come in. Someone will answer, and then I know to whom I must pay attention. I am dutch and have always lived in Brabant. I have always learned that you have to ring your bell when you want to pass someone when biking. Everyone does. I haven't heard anything else here. Want to pass someone else while biking? Ring your bell! In all other cases, don't! Strange to hear that anyone can think differently
Come to Utrecht, really do not keep ringing your bell 10 times per minute ;). As it's crowded and people keep overtaking others, just go, don't ring a bell. Just overtake (somewhat) safely :)
@@vincinoyb9734 That's exactly what I meant to say. When you want to pass someone who's blocking you or just being difficult to overtake, you ring you bell. In the video I got the inpression that you NEVER should ring your bell in such cases. And that seems weird to me
I am from Brabant too, but I think the difference is do you ring your bell when you can't pass and want to pass or always when your passing, even when it's easy. Because I have never seen anyone ringing their bell just to let them know I pass. When someone does I would think it's rude like "what do you want for? You can pass easily, are you expecting me to make even more room for you, because I can't". I live in a village and the unspoken rule is you ring your bell to let people know to make room when they didn't yet. Only use it in 'emergencies'. Basically what Vinci Noyb is saying
I live in a Dutch village and ringing your bicycle bell is perfectly acceptable here. In fact, it is common courtesy to ring your bell when you're about to take over another bicycle, or when closely passing pedestrians. This way nobody is surprised (jumpscared) and nobody gets in your way at the very last moment. It's for safety! We don't have many zebra crossings, but where they are bicycles usually stop for pedestrians. However, there is also an unwritten rule that certain cyclists get the right of way: Old people, the mailman with his heavy load, and mothers with two kids and three grocery bags all on one bike.
I think the ringing the bell thing is because we only use the bell when there is danger or we can't pass. So if you ring the bell at someone as you are passing, it is perceived as you saying: hey I can't pass, even if there might be room
07:38 it is just normal to know who where before you and who whas after you, it is just being polite and not going before someone else that was before you it is not normal to come in and start right away looking on the phone.... i know, i am old fashion(50 years) but i like to pay attention to people in general. about ringing the bell when passing....it is not ring ring ring ring....... just only ring short once if you think somebody did not see you or maybey older people that not hear you coming. and when passing say friendly hello and everything is okay
For the Dutch traffic point, I can confirm that demonstrating to the other person that you know you have priority works very well. Plenty of people who do not focus on traffic a lot, tend to depend on this rather than their brain. This also helps when you give way/priority early so the other person can be gone by the time you want to pass a crossing. It also helps to nearly hit people who do not care for priority and give them a good wake up fright. Some people deserve to be treated like a dick because they behave like a dick.
If i enter a waiting room, i sometimes ask `who was the last one?` But when it is busy at the market, i mostly leave, because there are always people who go first and i don`t like that. At the bus or train stop, everybody wants to go first, so don`t be upset.
As a Dutch but also Italian I always get in trouble/strange looks/comment about how I just cross the road so confidently (if you understand what I'm saying). My dad (Italian) taught me to do so because in Italy traffic doesn't actually stop unless you more or less just throw yourself in front of it. It just baffles me that you feel people do that here a lot more, while I always get comments that I shouldn't just cross the road without checking to see if the car is slowing down. Had a few close calls to be honest...
We don t uses signals if we go slower. Nobody drives slowy if you give a signal you want to drive slowy or to stop. But if you go to the right or left , it s polite and a rule to use your arm before you make the move.
With speaking English for the Dutch. While we're pretty good at it, it always takes more of an effort because we still think and formulate in Dutch and then we have to translate it. Because I'm a musician and regularly converse in English I started to force myself to think in English; that makes conversation so much easier especially with Brits who tend to revert a lot to dialect when they notice your English is pretty good.
12:00 Yes, you either give them the look to assert dominance, or you give people a nod or a hand gesture that they can go before you lol. As for the last one you mentioned, most Dutch people are pretty good at conversational English, but most of them have to consiously think about it. It doesn't come naturally, therefore, when it's early or when they're tired people prefer speaking English. Also, when you, a Dutch person, are in the Netherlands, you'd generally be thinking in Dutch, and there are so many things you'd say in Dutch that can't properly be translated into English, so that might also be a reason why people might prefer to speak Dutch, even if they're good at English.
It's funny to see how a foreigner looks at Dutch culture. But please keep something in mind: Amsterdam =/= The Netherlands It's only 1 city and is actualy a terrible representation of our country. Most Dutch people do not even like Amsterdam and many people in Amsterdam look down on the rest of the country. Hell for the last few years the city council of Amsterdam has actually said they don't like tourists and want less of them to go there.. Take a trip to other cities but also the countryside and you will see a completely different country. When you go to the smaller cities and towns you may find the people to be a lot nicer and helpfull. Be sure to visit Carnaval in the south once the quarantine has been lifted, it is the best party of the year BUT you want to ignore the cities and go to a town. Make sure to have a local of the specific town with you to explain the customs during this week as they differ from normal and are different for every town. Someone from "boven de rivieren" (above the rivers) will not understand. Watching the parade, dressing up as silly as you can, singing until your throath hurts, loads of roaming brass bands playing local songs on the streets, drinking loads and loads of beer and dancing with everyone from 9yo to 99yo everyone joins in. Did I mention the beer? Think if Mardi Gras, Oktoberfest and Halloween had a baby but it had a screw loose and was a lot nicer and family friendly. Most music will be hard to understand as a lot wll be sung in a heavy dialect but you could at least sing along with Sweet Caroline ;)
i understand that it feels weird but here in the Netherlands we don't go to a cafe for a piece of pie but we're going to the cafe to drink something and sometimes we get something else like some pie so I think that's why.
When the shop attendant doesn't know who is next we like to look between the customers and if anyone is unsure who is next, the other one would gesture "you go ahead" or someone will take their turn if they know they are next. It is very unintentional yes, I could see why foreigners would be confused
The point of a "café" is to get a drink. The apple pie is something you have "with the drink". It's not so much rude not to order a drink, as it is confusing. "What are you here for, if it's not for a drink?". In many cafés the apple pie IS something to come for, though. Usually a good choice.
Never really thought about it, but now that you mention the bike bells it seems so obvious. The most common/just about only situation wherein we ring our bike bell is when someone is blocking the bicycle path (most often when 2 people are biking side by side) and we're trying to pass them. That, or they're standing in a group, blocking the bicycle path and don't notice the cyclist because it's 2 a.m., and they're drunk and talking to each other. Ringing the bell is mostly a notice of "Hey, look out, I'm coming!"
About the drink: it's expected to order one, mainly because for the restaurants and cafés that's where the profits are. European restaurants sell food at a very low price whereas the drinks are normally sold with quite some profit margin. Because of this restaurants will always try to get you to drink at least one but preferably two drinks each time you visit. Still, it's not rude (just unexpected) if you don't want one :)
I am Dutch. I never thought about these things but I think you have a sharp eye about them. By the way, I think you are doing great learning Dutch. It is probably harder for English speaking people than for others since the Dutch will switch to English if they struggle (meaning you don't learn). For other languages the Dutch probably cannot switch, not even for Germans. So I found that native English speaking people usually don't speak Dutch that well. It seems you do and take real effort. I start to ramble. What I really wanted to say is that your videos are insightful. For me it is useful to keep unintended rudeness in check. Keep up the good work.
the second point kinda depends on the situation, i'd say your experience with that is fairly uncommon here in NL as well. non-queueing waiting rooms *are* pretty common in professional settings, like if you go to the dentist or pharmacy or some government-related stuff you'll find these, but in anything that's marginally fast, and not appointment-based like a supermarket. These still just use queues. though there's possibly a more deliberate effort to "queue in parallel" where possible, so that no single queue is excessively long (it's not uncommon for movie theaters that get pretty busy to have, like, 10 automated ticketing machines, just so there's usually no more than 1-2 people waiting to buy a ticket, and supermarkets will often open a new register when 3-4 people are waiting in line) usually in these "non-queueing" cases, however, you'll either be called by number, or based on an appointment (so they do actually know and tell you, at least in some form, whose turn it is) As for the 3rd, ringing your bell isn't rude per se, but it's mostly intended to be used in a similar way to a car horn, so using it in the way you suggest is like honking your car horn every time you go to overtake someone, it's not necessary and might startle them. on the other hand, it is "more subtle" than a car horn so you would use it when you notice people clearly aren't aware you're there, for instance if two people are cycling side-by-side, blocking most of the bike lane, they're slower than you are, and not moving over to let you pass, or someone's about to cross the road in front of you and looking away from you. but yeah, it's not generally used "pre-emptively" much The last one's true, but mainly because not being "pro-active" in traffic tends to lead to a lot of stalemates, where both people are trying to be polite to prevent a dangerous scenario from developing, yet that usually turns the situation more dangerous because you now get into this "jousting" game of who actually ends up going first, which risks you both choosing to go at the same time, this is especially true if you stop for people that are expecting you to continue. Dutch traffic laws are defined fairly strictly, meaning there's almost always a "correct" order for people to go and stop (one exception is when, on an unmarked intersection, cars arrive on all 4 streets simultaneously and they all want to go straight, because then for all 4 of them the car coming from their right has right of way, but this kind of exception is pretty rare), in many circumstances, without any signs or traffic signals, emergency vehicles have first priority, then public transit, then cars, then motorcycles, then cyclists, then pedestrians*, BUT the opposite is true for whose fault it is if mistakes are made (if any vehicle hits a pedestrian, it's the vehicle driver's fault almost by definition, for instance), Within the same "priority", people on your right have right of way, and people going straight have right of way over people making turns, also if you're doing something "unexpected" like parking your car, driving in reverse, or making a U-turn, that makes you drop to the lowest "priority" and everyone else gets right of way over you. * This is actually not a very consistent priority, a cyclist coming from the right of a car gets right of way, but a tram gets right of way over a car even if the tram is coming from the left and making a turn, a bus pulling out of a bus stop has right of way over cars, but only within cities, and of course an emergency vehicle is even allowed to ignore traffic lights if they deem it safe to do so. as for the last point, and this might just be a programmer thing, but we actually speak english quite a bit at my workplace, even though we're all dutch natives, though i guess that might be a matter of how constantly switching between dutch and english is more annoying than just sticking to english ;)
Ok couple of things there. Going with the flow as you put it, is made possible by a lot of non-verbal communication. Bikers and pedestrians alike will establish eye contact and use body language to indicate they've seen each other and will yield or expect the other person to yield. This is also the reason why tourist sometimes get hit, as they didn't understand/follow the rules, or strayed into a bikelane by mistake. The bell is used when you encounter someone ahead that is obstructing your path. So if 2 people cycle next to each other and there is not a lot of room to overtake them, you ring your bell in advance giving them time to react and clear the way for you. If there's enough space to continue unimpeded, there's no reason to ring it. We're taught that your place on the (bike) road is as far to the right as possible, and overtaking is done on the left. So in general people won't veer to the left. Having a drink is part of the social construct 'gezellig' which is why a waiter would expect you to order a drink too. If you'd have said something like I'll just have a piece of apple pie please, he/she probably wouldn't have thought twice or perhaps asked you if you would like a drink with that. (This also increases revenue per guest) As to why Dutch people like speaking Dutch? Well it is their native language, and you'll probably find that Germans, French, Spanish people etc. Will do the same. In fact the French are notoriously proud of their own language and culture. In general though most Dutch people will tend to think it is rude to speak a language that others in their company don't understand and only converse in Dutch to ask a quick question to a fellow Dutchie and then revert back to English. Since you speak Dutch, they won't feel any objection to speaking their own language. They'll likely expect you to indicate when you've failed to understand something and if you don't then simply assume you've understood. I've lived in California myself and can relate to many of the examples you give from the American point of view. You sharing your experiences of Dutch culture and customs is quite refreshing.
I was taught that not ordering a drink is a faux pas because café’s have cheap food and usually have a bigger margin on their drinks to compensate for it.
Yeah in the Netherlands with our own bike lanes you low key expect a bike to just pass you when they want to pass you so the meaning of the bell is interpreted as more of a "make way" or "hurry up" rather than a "watch out I'm coming through". A good time to use the bell would be when someone's about to cross the road without looking and you feel like you can't stop in time. Then you'd be making them aware that they're about to get hit and hopefully they step out of the way and they don't get hit :') But even then most of us would just dodge around them because everyone's who's been cycling through the inner city at a late-night on the weekends knows how to weave a bike through a busy street of drunk people :')
in most dutch cities kids learn at school the trafic rules for riding a bike . about the bell thingy...only use it when you go way faster than others and in front of you are 2 biking beside eachother . 9 out of 10 will they check and form a line so you may pass , the one rule everyone breaks , its not allowed riding your bikes beside eachother and have an conversation.
Hi Eva, nice channel!! I think that if the waitress/waiter suggest that you should order a drink, it is their way of trying to boost your expenditures. They are supposed to be in a commercial role. But you can order whatever you want, as long as you order something.
I never do that but rather just make sure anyone whos after me doesnt go before me, anyone that was there before me goes before me so when theyre all done im good to go either way, so just making sure noone that entered after you goes first should also work
There is no rule to order a drink with food. Never heard of that of seen it, personally or with friends. My guess is that the fact that u ordered in English + ur girlfriend had already ordered tea with the pie (which made the waitress expect a similar thing maybe) + the default order is usually both food and drinks (so so she might have thought ud forgotten + (especially in conjunction w the last thing) the fact that u didn't say "Just the Apple pie please" instead of "An apple pie", I think that brought the confusion. I can almost guarantuee if u said 'just the apple pie please' there wouldve been no issue. And next to all that: Dutch people also sometimes say something similar to the English 'will that complete ur order?' with 'anders nog iets?'. Which roughly translates to 'anything else?'. But that'd just a semi-standard question if they asked u that And if u say 'i think that's okay', trying to justify ur order As to imply the waitress thought it was morally bad, then yeah that's rude
At places where there is no line (bakery, butcher, some hear dressers, etc.) it is commonplace to ask when entering the shop "wie was er laatst? (who is last?) You only have to remember that person, when he is helped, you are next.
About speaking English: it is natural that you prefer your own language. I worked at a holiday park, cleaning bungalows. One day I had a colleague with me who could only speak English. Well, no problem. We were send to a bungalow with guests with a complaint. The guests could only speak German. Well, no problem. They explained what the problem was and I translated to my colleague. He however was afraid to enter the bungalow because the guests had a dog. So I translated again. This translating thing went on for about half an hour, while we were fixing the stuff they complained about. After this I was exhausted! Switching between 3 languages is not easy even if you know all 3 pretty well.
In the Netherlands: in a café you order drinks with possibly food, in a restaurant you order food with possibly drinks. A restaurant definitely will not only serve drinks without food, but I think generally a cafe might be a bit amazed if you only order food, but I don’t think it is considered rude at all. And most cafes will serve you the food without the drink.
The biking thing is also one of the reasons why, as a pedestrian, you should walk on the opposite side of the road, so left in the netherlands; so you also face the cyclers coming your way, and not be surprised by them. Oh and ringing your bell at a pedestrian while riding your bike is considered “hey you! You’re in my way; move it!” And not “hey just wanted to let you know I’m coming” like it may be in the US
We use the bell on the bike sparingly, yes. Or else traffic would be a deafening cacophony. Note that, in the Netherlands, hooting the klaxon in your car can actually be fined when police deem that you had no valid reason to use it - the judgment at their discretion.
Same goes with the bell actually! I mean the police won't fine your for it, but in the law it states that ringing your bell without reason is illegal. It can cause confusing and thus danger in traffic because we use it only in "emergency" cases. It was the scare tactic that they used when you had to do your 'verkeersexamen', so you won't be that annoying kid ringing your bell all the time.
@@kemismits6158 At the same time, though, if there is no bell installed on your bike, you're likely to be fined for that as well!
I think I've ever only used mine to indicate that I'm going to pass someone
@@bobosims1848 I mean sure if you brake randomly in the middle of the road that's a dick move cus it's dangerous, but obviously taking off your brakes entirely is also a dick move because that's dangerous in case you do need them :') The same goes for the bell, if there is an emergency it's dangerous not to have it so you have to have it even though you preferably don't get to use it.
Actually I have two bells on my bicycle. One is the ordinary 'ring-ring' for alarm, which I never use.
The other one gives just one 'ping'. I use it (sparingly, I prefer to whistle a happy tune) to warn pedestrins on the narrow bikelanes in the woods around Zeist.
Even in Amsterdam I never had an issue ordering just something to eat in a cafe. I think it was just the way you said it that was rude, haha. Usually when I do it they say “you want nothing to drink?” and when I reply “No thank you” it’s perfectly fine.
Me too. Not rude at all.
You can even ask for free tap water and there won't be an issue :)
There is a bar in Utrecht (in Neude) where a sign says they don't have a kitchen, and you are invited to go and bring back food. As long as you buy a drink from them.
100% this that first point is just wrong.
Yea, i guess it's pretty much the same all over Europe, except for Italy.
They however have a reason ... the food costs like 10 Euro and the drink 8.
I notice in Amsterdam, probably everywhere in NL, when you are a pedestrian and come to a zebrapad, you should have right of passage before everything else. But, all pedestrians give right of way to bikes. It's like we all know, it's as pedestrian much easier to stop for a moment, than for a bike. Thus we all wait to help cyclists. But cars, they just have to stop. We're out in the weather. ;)
Nah just Amsterdam. The rest of the country simply crosses.
More like most pedestrians expect bikers either not to know the proper traffic rules or to just not give a flying fig about them. Same reason why pedestrians are often also stop at a zebrapad for cars even though they have right of way, cars are just a lot harder and more durable then their own skins. And you never know if the car isn't driven by an asshole who think he's above the rules. (I've had cars honk and gesture at me for crossing in front of them on a zebrapad in the past and once or twice nearly hitting me if I hadn't jumped of in time.)
@@PhoenixNL72-DEGA- The trick with cars in the Netherlands is to not look at cars when you cross. I know I must be careful, but I walk and cars stop but the I and other pedestrians walk with arrogance, the more careful cars, in general, will have to be. The trick also lies in timing. Cars need space to break, not idiots jumping in front of them. ;)
@@KootFloris Yeah, until you encounter an asshole that thinks he's king of the road. Like I said I had to jump of a zebrapad a couple of times, and usually at the other end of it cause the car just refused to slow down at all. (Especially people who drive status car brands like Mercs and BMWs seem to suffer from this, like they are too good to break for others)
And then there are those drivers that honk their horn and make rude gestures if you start passing WELL before they are close to the zebra and are just angry that you had the audacity to not let them pass before you. It might be different in small towns or villages, but in major cities drivers can be aholles. (And I'm dutch as were my parents, grandparents and greatgrandparents)
@@PhoenixNL72-DEGA- But do you live in NL? Because here honking for nothing is forbidden. Can even get you fined. I never had to jump out of the way. But I time carefully and then walk like I own the place. In Amsterdam. But perhaps different cities, different customs. Like in rich neighborhoods with few pedestrians, I'm way more careful.
Ofcourse we Dutch prefer to speak Dutch most of the time.
When someone stays long-term in the Netherlands, I find it appalling when that person doesn''t make a serious effort to learn Dutch. Which means reading Dutch, writing Dutch, listening to Dutch, and speaking Dutch.
So true. Keep in mind that you do not have to be fluent as we understand that learning a new language is hard but we want to see you make a effort. If you do we can be patient and help you with words you do not know yet.
Let's face it, most dutch speak Dutch, English and German. But a lot will also speak French or Spanish. If we take the effort to learn your language for the 2 weeks we spend in your country, the least you can do is the same.
I never understood people that come here (French, German, eastern europe, etc) without even speaking english and just demand that we talk to them in their language.
O and don't badmouth a Dutchman in your own language, we may not speak it but we may know how to swear in it.
I can swear in Dutch, English, German, French, Spanish, (Brazilian)Portugese, Russian, Hebrew, Japanese, Italian, Arabic and probably a few more that I forgot but that will pop up again if I hear them.
So...you expect them to go Dutch? 🤣
Well according to my experience having loads of Expats as colleagues is the Dutch in reality don't have the patience for foreigners the practise Dutch by letting them talk Dutch. Every single try lasts half a sentence at most and the Dutch switch to English. This applies to professional AND social life. Foreigners don't stand a chance.
@@endthisnonsense7202 That's true. When talking 1 on 1, it's almost impossible to stop the Dutch person from speak english. We are good in English and we embrace the opportunity to show it off ;) However, in a group of Dutch people with one person not talking Dutch (like work), this person is usually going to mis out on 90% of what's being said.
@@DutchObserver [However, in a group of Dutch people with one person not talking Dutch (like work), this person is usually going to mis out on 90% of what's being said.]
True, but THAT is not typical for Dutch native speakers, it's typical for humans. In any setting where there is a majority of native speakers of any language, that language dominates the conversation regardless of the capability of the minority to speak/understand it. You'll see exactly the same in a group of 2 Frisians and 1 Dutch person in the Netherlands, or for instance 2+ Indonesian native speakers and 1 Dutch person. Two Russians and a Japanese and so on and so on.
Yeah. We don’t stand in “line” but we do go on turn. She came in first. She is before me, done.
Exactly!!
If there is no definite queue, it is sort of 'überpolite' to ask 'Who was the last?'
@@woutbakker7319 you’d simply ask “ is it my turn or were you first ?” But usually we kinda know who came in after us, so if no one is left that we didn’t see come in after us it’s our turn.
You can often see the last person go in before you, so you know you're after them. :D
Most of the the time but there are definitely plenty of “asos” as well.
So the last one is a little bit weird.
Actually it comes down to you being surprised that people in the Netherlands like to speak their own language while being in the Netherlands.
Just wait until she visits France or Germany... "Was machen sie?! Sprich einfach Deutsch! Bist du verrückt oder was?" :D
@@david6054 In France they pretend they do not understand you at all, until you made at least an effort to speak some French words.
The surprising thing for me was that most Dutch people automatically switch to English when needed, especially younger people. Even the people who don't speak English very well at least try to, unlike in countries like France and Germany.
@@NeiloNeil some do, most Dutch people don't but are to polite to refuse. If I found out people are not tourists and live here a couple of years I refuse to speak english. You Never Will become part of society if you don't speak their native language
@@boldvankaalen3896 yea allot of them cant speak it
An average Dutch grown up has a vocabulary of about 42000 words. A person with a collage education or more knows 60000 words or more. In a foreign language actively knowing 4500 words is considered good, and after living somewhere for a few years you may get over the 10000 words. Speaking a foreign language you constantly realise you are missing details and emotions. That is the reason you prefer your mother tongue!
Indeed, and this is the Netherlands, so that's the home language. Unless there's a lot of foreigners around. Then I've learned to speak English so they may join the conversation.
This is why you should try speaking the other persons language in a conversation. So the American speaking Dutch to a Dutchman speaking English. This way there is very little chance of using a word that the other person doesn't know.
And if you are hearing your mother tongue all day you're thinking in that language, but having to speak in an other all of the sudden. It gets easier and less tiering if you are only speaking the other language for a longer period of time. I always have to get used to the way you move your mouth while speaking an other language 😅
@@ST-vt4nu It takes a while to switch from Dutch to English and back. I often find myself mixing english with dutch or dutch with english words at first like an engine struggeling to get started , but once I get going I'm fine.
@@Scarletcroft I was raised bilingual. Dutch-Frisian. I learned english very young. now I'm 50 and if someone switches from one language to another I don't even notice...
something that happens a lot; I can't remember a word in the right language. so I'm mixing three languages and it's terrible.
First let me say: thank God we're all different, otherwise we'd be all the same.
1- Cafe's were originally/culturally intended for drinking. Being able to get something to eat is just an added bonus. Having said that, I wouldn't consider it rude if all you did was order a bite to eat. Maybe you should say: just the apple pie, please?
Of course, Amsterdam, being the tourist trap that it is, may have some more unwritten rules. Like trying to sell as much as they can to unwitting tourists.
2- Dutch never stand neatly in line as our British and apparently US neighbors do. Just keep a mental note of who was there first and who arrives after you. And don't forget to ask of the people in front of you if they are already being serviced.
However we do have places where you can draw a number, usually at the butcher's or in government buildings, as you said.
3- Nothing wrong with ringing your bell. It's just that the infrastructure here usually keeps all participants out of each others way. Roads for cars, bike paths for bikes, sidewalks for pedestrians.
4- Obviously, going WITH the traffic avoids more accidents than going AGAINST the traffic...Duh.
Furthermore, in cities, the first traffic law that comes to mind is usually the law of the jungle: show no fear and you will get right of way.
But we do have actual traffic laws, such as yield to traffic from the right etc. Also important to realize is that pedestrians and cyclists are considered more vulnerable because... they are. This is visible in our laws and fines. Hit a pedestrian or a cyclist with your car and you are automatically found at fault and guilty. This may be a difference with the US where cars are 'holy'.
5- Would you rather speak your native tongue in the US, or Dutch? Obviously, the Dutch prefer to speak Dutch. It's our language. Just because we like to show off our skills, doesn't mean we want to do it indefinitely.
What the hell, I have lived in the Netherlands for my entire life and I have NEVER had a bad experience when not ordering anything to drink.
I think she felt bad rather than was treated badly. The waitress was likely confused that her friend ordered a drink and she didn't.
Nothing rude about denying the things you don't want, you are the customer. Niets onbeleefd aan wanneer je als klant dan reageert met: " Alleen de appeltaart graag".
Totally agree. Not rude at all. I am Dutch and I also sometimes also just order the food. It’s okay really. 😊
However. I grew up around Americans. 😆
Maybe not rude, but definitely weird. Just like me getting weird looks at McDonalds when I only ordered some fries.
I kinda suspect that your girlfriend meant was that "and that's OK" will probably come off as patronizing. Like others said "Just apple pie please", would have been more appropriate.
True. The waitress was rude, not you.
We do use the bell on the bike though, usually when people are blocking the bicycle lane or to give them a heads up that we are going to overtake them. Yes some people take it as rude, but it should be used as a signal that you want to overtake someone if you can't get past them.
For overtaking, I only see people using their bell if space is limited. I've never seen people do that is there is a lot of space (excluding little kids).
I've been a bartender (and patron) in Amsterdam for more years then I'd like to admit and there's nothing wrong with only ordering apple pie. In that situation, it wouldn't even have been a problem if your girlfriend ordered something but you politely declined. And if the waiter made it out to be, that's one of those situations in which you apply a light touch of Dutch directness. ;-)
I'm also verry confused how that was rude, no need to buy and pay for something you don't want. Usually people do also order drinks i don't generaly see people that don't also order drinks but i'm pretty sure that's not needed to not be rude. Even if it might be considdered rude it's fine, saving money is verry Dutch :P.
So true! Nothing rude about you ordering only apple pie. I sometimes use a saying: “welk woord begrijp je niet van ‘nee’?” . Yes, that’s rude. Sometimes people ‘need’ that kind of rudeness. 😅 When they realy don’t listen to you…😊
Oh, something else about the queue thing: you can make good use of the lack of a queue when at a bus stop. If you accurately gauge where the door of the bus will be when it stops, and you position yourself there, you will be, by definition, at the front of the queue.
LOL, so I'm not the only one doing that :-) ?
Yeah, fun sport for teenager boys.
A highlight in the daily commute when you get it exactly right ;)
@@lotteyanson4033 well of course I ALWAYS got it right, PERIOD!
The bicycle bell thing is entirely true; there's only one commonly agreed upon moment to ring your bell, and that's the moment about 2/10ths of a second before impact, presumably so the other person has an instant to brace themselves.
So true!!
Why ring at all, the bell will ring automatically if you hit them hard enough :')
About waiting your turn, just ask: wie is er als laatste? Then you only have to pay attention to 1 person and the next person should do the same. Very common in my hometown at least
Same here, in all the smaller shops like butcher or bakery or at the local outdoor market. Or in the ‘patatkraam’
Yeah and if you tend to forget U usually wil have the person behind you say "no no he/she was here before me. Go ahead"
That is unless the person behind you is a woman that wants cheese :D
@@david6054 she is also a customer🤣
@@MrDanfra I was wondering if anyone would get the reference in English :D
I always track who is already in the room and who comes after me so I have a roughly idea of when it's my turn. And In general it's not a big deal if I get one place in front or someone that got later gets in front of me.
Yeah, that ‘line’ thing, while there’s no line.
I always look for the one that came into the shop after me. So I don’t mind who takes their turn before me, as long as it is not that one person that I’m keeping an eye on. If every one acts to that rule, there’s an invisible line.
Hi Eva, loved the video!
Regarding Dutch traffic, what I usually explain to exchange students is that it’s better to be predictable than to be correct, especially while cycling or walking. We tend to move around each other, but that can only work if all parties roughly know how the rest will move. So, like you said, don’t waver when you want to cross the road, either clearly do it or clearly wait :)
This is where the bell comes in. I would only use the bell when I think someone might do something unpredictable or when they’re in the way. I would ring my bell when people are swerving on the road, when parents cycle with their children (children tend to swerve more often), when groups of people are blocking the road, or when a pedestrian suddenly crosses the street without looking (very annoying :P).
Although it might seem to be the case that we speak fluent English, I feel that it is rarely the case that someone is completely fluent. Speaking a foreign language usually still comes with some difficulties. For example, it is a lot easier to make jokes in your native tongue, especially jokes that rely on language, such as puns. These make conversations more lighthearted and can really help you bond with someone. Also, it is difficult to create subtle nuances in language that help steer the tone of the conversation. Unfortunately, that means that, in my experience, English is mainly used to share information in some way. Which at some point can become quite exhausting without the language-play we tend to include while speaking Dutch ;)
Hear hear on being better to be predictable! The person in front of me being predictable allows me to be predictable to the person behind me, keeping everyone safer :D
The absolute worst is people who cannot seem to make a decision, waffling and making aborted moves, like, I don't /want/ to hit you, but you're making it really hard for me to actually know where you are and dodge you :/
One of many things I love about visiting The Netherlands is that people there never assume you don't speak Dutch. I'm not white, and strangers always start speaking to me in Dutch, and I say I only speak English (I speak other languages, but that is not the point), and they immediately switch to English. It's really nice. Also, the Dutch always treat me like I'm a fellow human being just like them, whereas in Germany, Austria, and France, some people treated me like I was sub-human or something.
The last rule is so true! Me and my girlfriend speak English on a near-native level. We have a lot of friends who moved here to study and don't speak Dutch (very well). So whenever they come over we speak English to them, but we take absolutely every chance to switch back to Dutch (without being rude of course). This doesn't really make a lot of sense because we're both very comfortable speaking English. I think the main reason is that it takes just a little more effort to speak your second language.
Exactly! I am fluent in English, but Dutch is my mother tongue and I don't need to think about it for a second. I am comfortable in, and have no problem with speaking English, but it is still a tad bit less easy than my mother tongue. I think this goes for most people who were raised in one language and are fluent in a second.
To me it's also just making the sounds. I can speak Dutch with no effort, but in English I stumble over my words, even though my vocabulary is pretty big. There's just some sounds that are tongue twisters to me, even though they don't have to be. Try saying "Short Circuit" for example.
Hi Ava, number 5 on your list blows my mind, since most expats complain about not getting the opportunity to learn to speak Dutch, since almost all Dutch people like to practice their English on expats and foreign visitors, even if the expat is speaking at least rudimentary Dutch. You can find this complaint from expats all over the internet in videos, podcasts and written material. Dutch people are known for switching into English in a heartbeat without even thinking about it, since it is their second language, which they learned in school from grade eight onwards. Also Dutch television does not synchronize foreign programs, but do subtitles instead, which is great for easy adoption of foreign languages like English and German and occasionally even French or Spanish. I have had similar experiences in Germany and in dealing with German business relations. I speak German quite well, but as soon as a German finds out you’re foreign, they automatically switch to English. I think this is a courtesy thing by thus leveling the playing field for both parties. Anyways, keep up the good work and keep posting your interesting videos.
The 5th rule also applies for other countries. I'm working in an international environment. In meetings and work we spreak English, but in informal coffee chats Portugese/Brazilian, just speak Portugese. Chinese just spreak chinese when there aren't non Chinese persons around. Similar when Dutch have a coffee chat. I also see it for myself, that i go back to Dutch (outside by work environment) even then there is a non native spreaking person is around.
In my opinion, a country has a language for a reason. So of course when you are in a certain country people prefer speaking that language. You can't expect a country to forget it's own language because it has internationals in it (not saying she expected that), because why would it have their own language to begin with. No matter how fluent you are in a certain language. Speaking in your native language will always be easier.
I lived with someone from the US for 10 years My experience that even when your english is good and you have a large vocabulary it is easier to express yourself in your own language when the conversation goes deeper. Special early in the morning during a meeting and you are just awake. Or when your angry or have a disagreement But that is just me. My grandson is 11 and can speak and read English very well. His school starts teaching english to kids when they are 4 years old.
Restaurant owner saying: “They eat me poor and drink me rich” 😄
thats vd valk
@@groenekever No, that's everywhere in the restaurant business. Margins on drinks are 3/4 times the margins on food.
Hey Ava :-) Nope .. you can definately order something to eat without ordering something to drink! Just maybe a bit more uncommon but for sure not rude! You are customer so you decide! :-)
About the waiting: You usually just ask: Wie was de laatste? :-)
About speaking Dutch or English when you are bilingual: There is always a language in which you feel more comfortable and you are more capable to express your feelings and opinions. For most Dutchies that is of course ..Dutch! So in a situation at work or among friends the urge to express exactly what you feel or think is dominant over being on common ground with language. And: If I compare my ability to communicate in English or Dutch, I don't mind WRITING English but I prefer talking Dutch if I really want to be well understood. Does that make sense to you? In writing you can "compose" the message just until it reflects your feelings while in speach it is out in the open without any chance to take back what you said ;-) Have a wonderful Sunday Ava!
totally agree!
What we (used to) do when entering a busy waiting room, is ask who's the last one in.
So everyone knows who's in front and behind them in line.
In the Netherlands there is a saying. "Ze eten je arm, maar drinken je rijk." Which means (loosely translated) "By eating they make you poor, by drinking they make you rich." Which stemms from the old habit that most of the time cafes and restaurants do not earn much on the food. But they do have a big margin on drinks.
Cheers! 🍻
I don't think it's rude to not order a drink. But they make the most profit on drinks. * Knowing where you are in line is the result of not being as isolated or as much living in a bubble as White Americans -- gasp -- no offense. * An unwritten unofficial rule in Amsterdam (only) is that pedestrians have a right of way on bikers and bikers on drivers. It's the sympathy for the underdog. And traffic lights: red means go ahead, green means watch the scene. * Speaking Dutch is just more gezellig! We feel fake when we need to speak this English that feels plastic, unnatural. Not using our small words as 'wel,' 'toch,' 'een beetje' make it hard for us to express the nuances that we have in Dutch.* In the Netherlands, people don't need so much space around them like USers. So, they don't say "excuse me" whenever they pass someone within 3 feet. It's annoying to have to pay attention to someone saying "excuse me" who doesn't need anything from you. :-) You didn't notice? * Great video! Keep up the good work!
I have a friend who’s from England, and been living in the Netherlands for many years now. Although he speaks and understands Dutch perfectly, he prefers to speak English. So while we all speak Dutch to each other, he speaks English. Works like a charm, we all perfectly understand each other (although often times I find myself automatically switching to English during conversations with him).
Before I use my bell I usually try to make different noises with my bike, if their is enough time for that. Clicking with my handbrakes or thumping my pedals. Usually that's enough to make people notice. If they don't Ill ring away and even feel justified doing it.
The bell has a purpose, when a 'dangerous' situation is about to happen the bell is there to alert the other person. Just like the horn of a car. You use them only when necessary.
Niet alle nederlanders letten op bij het wachten. Ik sta meestal wat te dromen. Daarom vraag ik als het drukker is vaak: "Wie was de laatste". Dan hoef ik alleen die persoon in de gaten te houden.
Not all Dutch are paying attention while in line. Most of the time I'm daydreaming. That's why when it's busy I ask "who was last" when coming in. That way I only have to pay attention to one person. Of course I do watch who is coming in after me. So I know they are not skipping the line. Any attempt to do so will be met with a firm and slightly hostile "It's not your turn". ;-)
As for preferring to speak dutch. The reason for that is quite simple. Most people don't speak English daily so despite the fact that they perfectly capable of speaking english it still takes a little bit more effort and it tires you. Something you must have noticed yourself. If you speak Dutch for multiple hours your brain gets tired and it becomes more difficult.
But maybe that's just me?
I love these little sneakpeaks into our ways as the Dutch, and am bingewatching your videos atm. I often find myself nodding along, sometimes I'm surprised and I am curious all the time what you will bring up next. For instance, I didn't really know about the drink rule. I guess it just never comes up? The standing in line thing really made me laugh, knowing where you are in line probably is second nature to us. Every ones in a while somebody tries to sneak in line and everybody knows it. But I think odds are less then 50/50 anyone speaks up, we just look at eachother in recognition that the sneaky git is in fact a loony.
I am Dutch and I like to watch your videos to learn more about my own country. How expacts see it.
I know a other unwritten role: Wait for people to go out of the train/tram/bus before go in yourself. I don't reminder how if it goes in the USA, but I saw in Italy people didn't do that.
In my corner of the US we are very multicultural, and whether you wait for people to get off first or just push your way on seems to depend primarily on what your native culture happens to be. In my neighborhood, waiting politely will most often mean people pushing around you impatiently to grab up all the seats first.
You're doing a great job, Ava. I admire your courage and openness.
Hi, if i want just apple pie and nothing to drink i do it and it is not considered rude or cheap.
Hello my name is Remco from the Netherlands 😅
Tip with the standing in line, If someone looks badly at you you can ask "Was u voor mij?" = "where you in front of me?", if they say yes, then always excuse yourself. But just knowing the person in front of you helps most of the times. It also may happen that it is your turn without you knowing and then there will be an akward silence which is a small signal that its probably your turn, just ask to be sure when that happens : )
I think most bike things are easily explained by thinking of bike lanes as roads in New York City (Or at least the way it's portrayed in films):
If you stand in the bike lane you can expect similar reactions to standing in the middle of the road. And people ringing their bell comes off similarly to people honking their horns. Since you're a New Yorker, I'm curious if the analogy helps you (or if you can think of some obvious way in which it would break down.)
In cafes most Dutch people order a drink and don't order something something to eat. (Cake, cookies, bread rolls). Next time just say politiely that you are not thirsty (ik heb momenteel geen dorst maar wil graag wel appeltaart met slagroom bestellen)
Agreed. You don't have to order something to drink. They just ask you if you want a drink first.
A friendly 'Nee dank je' is enough.
Who the hell uses "momenteel"(at the moment) in that situation? That's the kind of thing you might find in a textbook, not on the street. Just use the word "nu"(now) or simply say "Nee bedankt, alleen een appeltaart alstublieft"(No thanks, just a apple pie please.)
Never ever have I heard of the fact that you have to order a drink in a café with your apple pie, just leave if they tell you otherwise 🤣
Actually, I noticed this difference as well, one time when I was in Florida. I noticed that USA people have the tendicy to automatically go stand in line. I found this very uncomfy as a Dutch person being used to stand in a group. Mostly when we enter such a waiting area, we mostly simply ask: "who was last?". That way you only have to keep track of that person. Very simple!
3:50 the rude part was saying it in a arrogant way (with a smile), as if the waitress made a mistake and it was obvious you didn't want a drink. But actually it's not obvious, because normally people don't do that. She thougt you forgot about your drink and wanted to help. You can definitely buy a pie without a drink, just thank her kindly.
One more thing to notice: Restaurants and cafe's make their money with drinks, not food. So just eating makes you a non profitable guest, who just occupies space. But you will always be welcome anyway. Btw that's also why we don't do free refills.
Regarding the remembering your place in line, I (as a Dutchman) find that it becomes even more difficult at a place like a fishmonger. The sales(wo)man will ask "Who's next?" and then you can look at those that are before you, not realizing that they are not waiting in line, but that they have already ordered and are waiting for their order to be prepared, so you're next in line before you think you are.
When I walk into a shop with people standing around, I always ask the person closest to me if they are the last in line. Either you get a Yes and then know you're after them or they will say "No, he/she is" and you know when your turn is
The going with the flow in traffic rule is so important. The main thing to keep in mind is: don't be apprehensive. Either do it or don't. I cannot tell you how many times I've heard my parents cuss someone out for not communicating clearly where they are going haha
You missed one most Americans get wrong: if you call someone, especially if you call a phone that has multiple possible people who can answer it: identify yourself first before asking for who you want to speak to!
True indeed!
Hoi. Ik ben Nederlandse en ik vind jouw videos geweldig. Er zijn zoveel typische dingen waar ik nooit over nadenk. Ga zo door.
I also wanted to be able to make a little ring on my bike instead of the usual ring-ring, so I bought a race biker ringer. This gives one single "ding" sound and is way more friendly. The regular ring-ring sounds like "move aside!!". A single ding sounds like "just in case you didn't see me comming".
It is pretty much supposed to mean "move aside".
@@generaldreagonlps6889 for me, not always. More often I just want somebody to be aware of me being there, to prevent an accident, in case they don't pay enough attention to their surroundings.
On speaking Dutch... I think Dutch sometime too easy switch to English ;-) In comparison with Germans or French, the Dutch directly switch to English when someone has an foreign accent. The only thing I notice at work is that we like to switch to Dutch if everyone is capable of speaking it... because it is our native language. And I have some colleagues that live now several years in the Netherlands and are capable of at least understanding Dutch. So then the time has comes that we actual should switch, although we still don't... and still speak English in all meetings all day:-D
Finally, you have learned the time-honored Dutch folk-sport of complaining! Congratulations! And no, I am not being a sarcastic jerk, I mean it.
We do love to complain lol. Even if everything is so perfect there is nothing to complain about, we will complain about that.
About rather speaking Dutch. I guess it's also to do with a sense of identity, I guess most people are kind of proud of their country and the language is a big part of the identity of a country, so I guess it goes for everyone, not just Dutch people. You can see it very clearly with people who immigrate to an other country but still it's important to them to teach their kids the language of their home country.
About speaking Dutch over English, in my group of Dutch friends (which might not be "standard") we've caught ourselves speaking English when it's just us. And US friends who immigrated and really wanted to learn and practice their Dutch had to remind us to speak Dutch to them, as we switched to English so very easily. But, YMMV as they say :D
What happens to me as an American living in NL. I want to practice my Dutch, but my Dutch friends always want to speak English with me to practice their English!
Meh, I'm so used to speaking, reading and writing English, having worked at Universities where there are many international meetings, study material English and so on. Also preferring to have my computer's operating system and applications in English as the Dutch translations are often rather clumsy. I even catch myself thinking in English. As my partner is from the US, I even speak English to our cats :)
Never miss speaking Dutch, even while I appreciate it. I just don't have a preference.
There are traffic rules in the Netherlands for pedestrians crossing the street even when there is no pedestrian crossing.
The rule of thumb is: if the pedestrian wants to cross the street orthogonal of where the traffic is on the pedestrian has to wait, and on the other hand traffic that would turn left/right and the pedestrian wants to cross that sidestreet then the traffic has to wait.
Your story on the apple pie made me grin. It’s absolutely true: it’s quite unheard of to be in a cafe in the Netherlands and then not order something to drink. The reason for this might be that, originally, there was quite a principal distinction between a restaurant - where you came to eat out - and a bar/café - where you came to drink. Ofc, the coming of ‘eetcafé’s’ and things like that since the 1980s has somewhat blurred this distinction, but a cafe remains primarily a place to drink - and not necessarily to eat stuff. There might also be a more literary reason. Willem Kloos, one of the best Dutch poets from the late 1800s, once famously said “natuur is een mooi ding - maar je moet er wel iets te drinken bij hebben” (“nature is wonderful and all - but you need something to drink with it”). Now, if one of the most brilliant of Dutch poets gives such a recommendation, who are we to disagree to it....?
About ordening drinks in a café. I think the waitress was asking because most people go to a café in the first place to get a drink and food second. It is like going to a restaurant and only order a drink and then be surprised the waiter asking what you would like to eat.
Rule 5 doesn't always apply. It's my experience that English speaking people sometimes complain about the Dutch switching to English too easily. Like they're not 'proud of their own language' or something like that (not true btw). But maybe that's just people who are trying to learn to speak Dutch. I can see how that would be a bit annoying.
People on their phone are not really there. Therefore they are not in the mental Line and they end up waiting for hours.
If you are waiting on tour turn IT is considered rude to be on your phone..
About the "no line"thing: I remember reading somewhere that in Spain (I think), when people enter into a shop or such where people are waiting, you ask out loud "who's last", so you then know that when they have been served, it's your turn. Seems like a practical way of doing that: no line (so you can for exmple already look into the counter what you want) and also no ticket/number system the vendor needs to buy.
In Spain and Greece it was common to place a shoe in the line 😉 and then you can sit down 🤣 waiting for the next shoe to go back to the owner
I have been alive in The Netherlands for 35 years and working in the food-service industry for 16, and I have never heard of the rule that you have to order a drink with your food. If someone just orders cake, sure, we'll try to upsell you a drink, but it's definitely not weird or rude.
The only instance I can think of that would be weird is going to a fancy restaurant and only ordering a drink.
Regarding the bikes: ringing your bell isn't rude, a lot of cyclists are rude. I've seen so many cyclists looking at their phones or not putting their arm out when they turn that it's no surprise to me that they don't ring their bell when they pass someone. To me it's only normal that you go 'ringring, I'm here, be careful please!', but then again I often feel out of place with a lot of typical Dutch behaviour. :')
Hearing your bike story and how much you enjoy biking here, I'm sure you've heard of the Not Only Bikes youtube channel. It's a Canadian guy who is an urban planner and he's explained these obvious and subtle differences in how Dutch and American and Canadian cities work.
I live in the border of Germany and Netherlands and i would say Dutch are the friendliest..they would always speak to me or try to speak in english and i can see the willingness of them to help..a big difference from germans who can speak english..in my first two years here, i have to bring my husband with me everytime i have appointment in Germany (til now sometimes), but i can go out and face people alone and do my errands in the Netherlands without hesitation..All smiles and good vibes in the Netherlands 😎
- From a Filipina with a german husband
The thing about bikes is that if you're walking on a cycling path (because you might not have a choice) you'd walk on the right so that bikers can pass you by. If this is not the case (for instance, if you're walking smack-dab in the middle of the road) a biker could ring the bell. However, constant ringing is like sitting in a car and slamming your horn as often or as long as possible. It's unnecessary because *we got it the first time*. So you're allowed to ring your bell, just don't overdo it.
#5: I believe it depends on the region you are in or specific people who prefer to speak Dutch over English. Most people really don't have a problem at all speaking English, no matter the circumstances. Maybe you've met some people who don't feel comfortable enough speaking English all the time. On the other hand: if you do meet people who prefer to speak Dutch, it might help you in your Dutch proficiency faster.
I love the subtle awareness the Dutch have here about the invisible line. However, when people push forward we become quite direct about it and we let you know you have to go back in the line and wait your turn. We can be very frustrated or angry by that behavior.
Ringing when cycling is still used when people are cycling outside of the city. We do that so we let people know we're about to pass them by. But nowadays people have headphones or earplugs and are listening to music, so there's a chance they don't hear it.
Nice to hear your perspective on things!
Relatable
The invisible line is an example of how natural it is to be organized, the same thing in Sweden. This is an important reason why the Netherlands is one of the best functioning countries in the world (top ten in almost all welfare areas).
I must say, I'm surprised by most of these.
1: It's regularly not that big a deal to just order food in a cafe. Like someone below me said, maybe state you 'only' want the food. Sweet stuff is usually ordered with a drink, but I can't imagine it being a big deal if you just order the pie. Non sweet stuff, like a grilled cheese sandwich, definitely shouldn't be a problem to order without a drink.
2: Queuing is a bit all over the place I suppose. Generally, in any kind of waiting room we don't. Sometimes you have a numbered ticket, sometimes you get called by name (general practitioner/huisarts for example) and sometimes you have to pay attention yourself. In a theme park for a ride or at the register in the supermarket we generally will queue. When it comes to public transportation, at least in the North, we just sorta group in front of the door of the bus or train. Tends to be messy, definitely not a queue.
3 The bike bell. You definitely don't want to ring it more than twice (probably only once). If you are just overtaking someone and you can do so without problems you don't need to ring. If people bike next to each other and it's more difficult you are expected to ring.
4: When it comes to traffic, we follow the actual traffic laws and expect everyone to do the same. So if you are crossing a pedestrian/zebra crossing you assume the approaching car will be slowing down/stopping and you keep walking. If a driver sees a cyclist approaching at a roundabout where the driver has 'voorrang' he assumes the cyclist will wait so you keep driving. It is therefore important to make eye contact to make sure the other person has seen you and will follow traffic rules. If you can't make eye contact you have to be extra alert.
5: Again, surprising. I usually hear it's hard to learn Dutch partly because Dutch people always talk in English with English speaking people. Makes it hard to practice/learn by listening. I suppose we generally do have a tendency to go back to Dutch when speaking to each other though.
In the Netherlands learning how to bike and what your place is in traffic is tought through school very early.
The rule of thumb is wherever you bike you keep to the right side as much as possible so people can pass on your left side.
If there is enough room you really, REALLY shouldn't use the bell. People won't just sway left for no appearant reason.
Having worked in several restaurants over the years I think the margins on drinks are the main reason why it is weird or rude not to order a drink. In the US, you compensate for that by tipping a lot, which is not common here. In the Netherlands restaurants have to pay the waiters a fair wage and it would not be very profitable if nobody ordered drinks.
Over here in Winterswijk it's very common to ask who was last when you enter a full bakery for example so you only have to watch one person
When I have to wait, I just ask "who was last before me?" when I come in. Someone will answer, and then I know to whom I must pay attention.
I am dutch and have always lived in Brabant. I have always learned that you have to ring your bell when you want to pass someone when biking. Everyone does. I haven't heard anything else here. Want to pass someone else while biking? Ring your bell! In all other cases, don't!
Strange to hear that anyone can think differently
Come to Utrecht, really do not keep ringing your bell 10 times per minute ;). As it's crowded and people keep overtaking others, just go, don't ring a bell. Just overtake (somewhat) safely :)
@@CobisTaba well it's obviously different here!
I also never learned that, sorry. IMHO, you just do that when others are blocking you from overtaking savely.
@@vincinoyb9734 That's exactly what I meant to say. When you want to pass someone who's blocking you or just being difficult to overtake, you ring you bell. In the video I got the inpression that you NEVER should ring your bell in such cases. And that seems weird to me
I am from Brabant too, but I think the difference is do you ring your bell when you can't pass and want to pass or always when your passing, even when it's easy. Because I have never seen anyone ringing their bell just to let them know I pass. When someone does I would think it's rude like "what do you want for? You can pass easily, are you expecting me to make even more room for you, because I can't". I live in a village and the unspoken rule is you ring your bell to let people know to make room when they didn't yet. Only use it in 'emergencies'. Basically what Vinci Noyb is saying
I live in a Dutch village and ringing your bicycle bell is perfectly acceptable here. In fact, it is common courtesy to ring your bell when you're about to take over another bicycle, or when closely passing pedestrians. This way nobody is surprised (jumpscared) and nobody gets in your way at the very last moment. It's for safety!
We don't have many zebra crossings, but where they are bicycles usually stop for pedestrians. However, there is also an unwritten rule that certain cyclists get the right of way: Old people, the mailman with his heavy load, and mothers with two kids and three grocery bags all on one bike.
I think the ringing the bell thing is because we only use the bell when there is danger or we can't pass. So if you ring the bell at someone as you are passing, it is perceived as you saying: hey I can't pass, even if there might be room
07:38 it is just normal to know who where before you and who whas after you, it is just being polite and not going before someone else that was before you
it is not normal to come in and start right away looking on the phone....
i know, i am old fashion(50 years) but i like to pay attention to people in general.
about ringing the bell when passing....it is not ring ring ring ring....... just only ring short once if you think somebody did not see you or maybey older people that not hear you coming.
and when passing say friendly hello and everything is okay
For the Dutch traffic point, I can confirm that demonstrating to the other person that you know you have priority works very well. Plenty of people who do not focus on traffic a lot, tend to depend on this rather than their brain. This also helps when you give way/priority early so the other person can be gone by the time you want to pass a crossing. It also helps to nearly hit people who do not care for priority and give them a good wake up fright. Some people deserve to be treated like a dick because they behave like a dick.
Just moved to The Netherlands from Brazil, your content is really nice 🙃
If i enter a waiting room, i sometimes ask `who was the last one?` But when it is busy at the market, i mostly leave, because there are always people who go first and i don`t like that. At the bus or train stop, everybody wants to go first, so don`t be upset.
As a Dutch but also Italian I always get in trouble/strange looks/comment about how I just cross the road so confidently (if you understand what I'm saying). My dad (Italian) taught me to do so because in Italy traffic doesn't actually stop unless you more or less just throw yourself in front of it. It just baffles me that you feel people do that here a lot more, while I always get comments that I shouldn't just cross the road without checking to see if the car is slowing down. Had a few close calls to be honest...
Interesting!
A Very Good Video 👌🏻👍🏻
I know several UK/US people who stopped trying to speak dutch because everybody replied in English...
We don t uses signals if we go slower.
Nobody drives slowy if you give a signal you want to drive slowy or to stop.
But if you go to the right or left , it s polite and a rule to use your arm before you make the move.
With speaking English for the Dutch. While we're pretty good at it, it always takes more of an effort because we still think and formulate in Dutch and then we have to translate it. Because I'm a musician and regularly converse in English I started to force myself to think in English; that makes conversation so much easier especially with Brits who tend to revert a lot to dialect when they notice your English is pretty good.
12:00 Yes, you either give them the look to assert dominance, or you give people a nod or a hand gesture that they can go before you lol.
As for the last one you mentioned, most Dutch people are pretty good at conversational English, but most of them have to consiously think about it. It doesn't come naturally, therefore, when it's early or when they're tired people prefer speaking English. Also, when you, a Dutch person, are in the Netherlands, you'd generally be thinking in Dutch, and there are so many things you'd say in Dutch that can't properly be translated into English, so that might also be a reason why people might prefer to speak Dutch, even if they're good at English.
It's funny to see how a foreigner looks at Dutch culture.
But please keep something in mind: Amsterdam =/= The Netherlands
It's only 1 city and is actualy a terrible representation of our country.
Most Dutch people do not even like Amsterdam and many people in Amsterdam look down on the rest of the country.
Hell for the last few years the city council of Amsterdam has actually said they don't like tourists and want less of them to go there..
Take a trip to other cities but also the countryside and you will see a completely different country.
When you go to the smaller cities and towns you may find the people to be a lot nicer and helpfull.
Be sure to visit Carnaval in the south once the quarantine has been lifted, it is the best party of the year BUT you want to ignore the cities and go to a town. Make sure to have a local of the specific town with you to explain the customs during this week as they differ from normal and are different for every town. Someone from "boven de rivieren" (above the rivers) will not understand. Watching the parade, dressing up as silly as you can, singing until your throath hurts, loads of roaming brass bands playing local songs on the streets, drinking loads and loads of beer and dancing with everyone from 9yo to 99yo everyone joins in. Did I mention the beer?
Think if Mardi Gras, Oktoberfest and Halloween had a baby but it had a screw loose and was a lot nicer and family friendly.
Most music will be hard to understand as a lot wll be sung in a heavy dialect but you could at least sing along with Sweet Caroline ;)
i understand that it feels weird but here in the Netherlands we don't go to a cafe for a piece of pie but we're going to the cafe to drink something and sometimes we get something else like some pie so I think that's why.
When the shop attendant doesn't know who is next we like to look between the customers and if anyone is unsure who is next, the other one would gesture "you go ahead" or someone will take their turn if they know they are next. It is very unintentional yes, I could see why foreigners would be confused
Eva, your tips are very helpful in may case, just arriving to The Netherlands
The point of a "café" is to get a drink. The apple pie is something you have "with the drink". It's not so much rude not to order a drink, as it is confusing. "What are you here for, if it's not for a drink?".
In many cafés the apple pie IS something to come for, though. Usually a good choice.
Never really thought about it, but now that you mention the bike bells it seems so obvious.
The most common/just about only situation wherein we ring our bike bell is when someone is blocking the bicycle path (most often when 2 people are biking side by side) and we're trying to pass them.
That, or they're standing in a group, blocking the bicycle path and don't notice the cyclist because it's 2 a.m., and they're drunk and talking to each other.
Ringing the bell is mostly a notice of "Hey, look out, I'm coming!"
About the drink: it's expected to order one, mainly because for the restaurants and cafés that's where the profits are. European restaurants sell food at a very low price whereas the drinks are normally sold with quite some profit margin. Because of this restaurants will always try to get you to drink at least one but preferably two drinks each time you visit. Still, it's not rude (just unexpected) if you don't want one :)
I am Dutch. I never thought about these things but I think you have a sharp eye about them. By the way, I think you are doing great learning Dutch. It is probably harder for English speaking people than for others since the Dutch will switch to English if they struggle (meaning you don't learn). For other languages the Dutch probably cannot switch, not even for Germans. So I found that native English speaking people usually don't speak Dutch that well. It seems you do and take real effort.
I start to ramble. What I really wanted to say is that your videos are insightful. For me it is useful to keep unintended rudeness in check. Keep up the good work.
the second point kinda depends on the situation, i'd say your experience with that is fairly uncommon here in NL as well.
non-queueing waiting rooms *are* pretty common in professional settings, like if you go to the dentist or pharmacy or some government-related stuff you'll find these, but in anything that's marginally fast, and not appointment-based like a supermarket. These still just use queues. though there's possibly a more deliberate effort to "queue in parallel" where possible, so that no single queue is excessively long (it's not uncommon for movie theaters that get pretty busy to have, like, 10 automated ticketing machines, just so there's usually no more than 1-2 people waiting to buy a ticket, and supermarkets will often open a new register when 3-4 people are waiting in line)
usually in these "non-queueing" cases, however, you'll either be called by number, or based on an appointment (so they do actually know and tell you, at least in some form, whose turn it is)
As for the 3rd, ringing your bell isn't rude per se, but it's mostly intended to be used in a similar way to a car horn, so using it in the way you suggest is like honking your car horn every time you go to overtake someone, it's not necessary and might startle them.
on the other hand, it is "more subtle" than a car horn so you would use it when you notice people clearly aren't aware you're there, for instance if two people are cycling side-by-side, blocking most of the bike lane, they're slower than you are, and not moving over to let you pass, or someone's about to cross the road in front of you and looking away from you.
but yeah, it's not generally used "pre-emptively" much
The last one's true, but mainly because not being "pro-active" in traffic tends to lead to a lot of stalemates, where both people are trying to be polite to prevent a dangerous scenario from developing, yet that usually turns the situation more dangerous because you now get into this "jousting" game of who actually ends up going first, which risks you both choosing to go at the same time, this is especially true if you stop for people that are expecting you to continue.
Dutch traffic laws are defined fairly strictly, meaning there's almost always a "correct" order for people to go and stop (one exception is when, on an unmarked intersection, cars arrive on all 4 streets simultaneously and they all want to go straight, because then for all 4 of them the car coming from their right has right of way, but this kind of exception is pretty rare),
in many circumstances, without any signs or traffic signals, emergency vehicles have first priority, then public transit, then cars, then motorcycles, then cyclists, then pedestrians*, BUT the opposite is true for whose fault it is if mistakes are made (if any vehicle hits a pedestrian, it's the vehicle driver's fault almost by definition, for instance),
Within the same "priority", people on your right have right of way, and people going straight have right of way over people making turns, also if you're doing something "unexpected" like parking your car, driving in reverse, or making a U-turn, that makes you drop to the lowest "priority" and everyone else gets right of way over you.
* This is actually not a very consistent priority, a cyclist coming from the right of a car gets right of way, but a tram gets right of way over a car even if the tram is coming from the left and making a turn, a bus pulling out of a bus stop has right of way over cars, but only within cities, and of course an emergency vehicle is even allowed to ignore traffic lights if they deem it safe to do so.
as for the last point, and this might just be a programmer thing, but we actually speak english quite a bit at my workplace, even though we're all dutch natives, though i guess that might be a matter of how constantly switching between dutch and english is more annoying than just sticking to english ;)
I worked in an international environment, one of them started to learn dutch, so I asked him, would you prefer me to talk dutch to you?
and?...
Dude wtf is this cliffhanger? :D
Ok couple of things there. Going with the flow as you put it, is made possible by a lot of non-verbal communication. Bikers and pedestrians alike will establish eye contact and use body language to indicate they've seen each other and will yield or expect the other person to yield.
This is also the reason why tourist sometimes get hit, as they didn't understand/follow the rules, or strayed into a bikelane by mistake.
The bell is used when you encounter someone ahead that is obstructing your path. So if 2 people cycle next to each other and there is not a lot of room to overtake them, you ring your bell in advance giving them time to react and clear the way for you. If there's enough space to continue unimpeded, there's no reason to ring it. We're taught that your place on the (bike) road is as far to the right as possible, and overtaking is done on the left. So in general people won't veer to the left.
Having a drink is part of the social construct 'gezellig' which is why a waiter would expect you to order a drink too. If you'd have said something like I'll just have a piece of apple pie please, he/she probably wouldn't have thought twice or perhaps asked you if you would like a drink with that. (This also increases revenue per guest)
As to why Dutch people like speaking Dutch? Well it is their native language, and you'll probably find that Germans, French, Spanish people etc. Will do the same. In fact the French are notoriously proud of their own language and culture. In general though most Dutch people will tend to think it is rude to speak a language that others in their company don't understand and only converse in Dutch to ask a quick question to a fellow Dutchie and then revert back to English. Since you speak Dutch, they won't feel any objection to speaking their own language. They'll likely expect you to indicate when you've failed to understand something and if you don't then simply assume you've understood.
I've lived in California myself and can relate to many of the examples you give from the American point of view. You sharing your experiences of Dutch culture and customs is quite refreshing.
I was taught that not ordering a drink is a faux pas because café’s have cheap food and usually have a bigger margin on their drinks to compensate for it.
Yeah in the Netherlands with our own bike lanes you low key expect a bike to just pass you when they want to pass you so the meaning of the bell is interpreted as more of a "make way" or "hurry up" rather than a "watch out I'm coming through". A good time to use the bell would be when someone's about to cross the road without looking and you feel like you can't stop in time. Then you'd be making them aware that they're about to get hit and hopefully they step out of the way and they don't get hit :') But even then most of us would just dodge around them because everyone's who's been cycling through the inner city at a late-night on the weekends knows how to weave a bike through a busy street of drunk people :')
in most dutch cities kids learn at school the trafic rules for riding a bike . about the bell thingy...only use it when you go way faster than others and in front of you are 2 biking beside eachother . 9 out of 10 will they check and form a line so you may pass , the one rule everyone breaks , its not allowed riding your bikes beside eachother and have an conversation.
Hi Eva,
nice channel!!
I think that if the waitress/waiter suggest that you should order a drink, it is their way of trying to boost your expenditures. They are supposed to be in a commercial role. But you can order whatever you want, as long as you order something.
'standing in line?'.... when you're in a situation like that, it's 'normal' to ask "who was last?" :-)
I never do that but rather just make sure anyone whos after me doesnt go before me, anyone that was there before me goes before me so when theyre all done im good to go either way, so just making sure noone that entered after you goes first should also work
That might just be more of a personal preference tho, as someone who doesnt like attracting attention to themself by asking ^^; but it works!
There is no rule to order a drink with food. Never heard of that of seen it, personally or with friends.
My guess is that the fact that u ordered in English + ur girlfriend had already ordered tea with the pie (which made the waitress expect a similar thing maybe) + the default order is usually both food and drinks (so so she might have thought ud forgotten + (especially in conjunction w the last thing) the fact that u didn't say "Just the Apple pie please" instead of "An apple pie", I think that brought the confusion. I can almost guarantuee if u said 'just the apple pie please' there wouldve been no issue.
And next to all that: Dutch people also sometimes say something similar to the English 'will that complete ur order?' with 'anders nog iets?'. Which roughly translates to 'anything else?'. But that'd just a semi-standard question if they asked u that
And if u say 'i think that's okay', trying to justify ur order As to imply the waitress thought it was morally bad, then yeah that's rude
At places where there is no line (bakery, butcher, some hear dressers, etc.) it is commonplace to ask when entering the shop "wie was er laatst? (who is last?) You only have to remember that person, when he is helped, you are next.
I wasn't even aware about the queue situation.. :D
Nooit bij de patatkraam gestaan? Dat is de ideale 'niet in de rij staan' situatie.
@@eefneleman9564 Op de markt net zo.
Of bij de bakker. Je vraagt bij binnenkomst: wie was er laatst? En dan hoef je maar 1 gezicht te onthouden
About speaking English: it is natural that you prefer your own language. I worked at a holiday park, cleaning bungalows. One day I had a colleague with me who could only speak English. Well, no problem. We were send to a bungalow with guests with a complaint. The guests could only speak German. Well, no problem. They explained what the problem was and I translated to my colleague. He however was afraid to enter the bungalow because the guests had a dog. So I translated again. This translating thing went on for about half an hour, while we were fixing the stuff they complained about. After this I was exhausted! Switching between 3 languages is not easy even if you know all 3 pretty well.
In the Netherlands: in a café you order drinks with possibly food, in a restaurant you order food with possibly drinks. A restaurant definitely will not only serve drinks without food, but I think generally a cafe might be a bit amazed if you only order food, but I don’t think it is considered rude at all. And most cafes will serve you the food without the drink.
The biking thing is also one of the reasons why, as a pedestrian, you should walk on the opposite side of the road, so left in the netherlands; so you also face the cyclers coming your way, and not be surprised by them. Oh and ringing your bell at a pedestrian while riding your bike is considered “hey you! You’re in my way; move it!” And not “hey just wanted to let you know I’m coming” like it may be in the US