SOS Bros React - RWBY Volume 6 Chapter 3 - Salem and Ozpin's Backstory!!
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- Опубліковано 10 вер 2024
- LORE. BACKSTORY. OMG. This marks the longest reaction video Jacob and I have EVER done!! Understandably so, this episode of RWBY means so much more than just the lore. It tells us how the show will end, what our hero's fight has led up to and meant all this time.
Please be nice to Oscar, don't hate the messenger.
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God of Dark: "Still Demanding things from your creators?"
Me: "Miles and Kerry are trying to send us a message."
Nameless Crow o my god you’re right
Omg yes best comment
This comment deserves more upvotes.
Nameless Crow If Miles and Kerry are comparing themselves to these gods who are clearly horrible beings who couldn’t care less about their creations because why care if you can restart than I fully support that comparison
@@Wildcard-Jack-47 accurate
I find it really cool how Salem has Linear immortality like an Olympic god while Ozpin has Cyclical immortality like an Chthonic god.
Cyclical immortality is actually an Egyptian God theme. *See Ra*
The day when all RWBY theorists about Salem's origins, Ozpin's role in the story and the MOON turned nothing but dust.
Was that a pun?
@@C-F98 Nope. More like a summary of what's gonna happen in the RWBY fandom.
Yep. Listening to their theories last week was hilarious. I feel like most "reveals" before this have been subversions. Like Martin Lawrence said in Bad Boys, "This bleep just got real"
Maybe it was Bad Boys II
Oh snap, they got… snapped😎 YEAH!!!
Says you. Ozpin x Salem shippers just got their theories vindicated!
*You do not understand. There is. NO ONE. Left.*
That line gave me chills, like it finally hits you what has just happened
Oz got quite the sisyphean task there. "Call us when you have achieved world peace."
I mean, it's a much smaller world lol. With a common enemy to unite against.
God of light is also God of Trolling
@@teamcybr8375 sure, but at the same time, there's more possible divisions and the grimm create a constant air of panic and tension, and with salem actively working to divide people, the task might be even harder than it is in reality, since at least on earth, nobody is actively AGAINST world peace, we're all just too petty and proud to let it happen.
Yal Rathol plus there's the problems we have in our world with greed, corruption, violence and hatred the whole idea of world peace is I think incredibly asinine given the viscous cycle hatred and violence we have in both our world and the world of remnant now I'm sure it'll probably work out for the world of remnant but ours that remains to be seen
@@nappyk96 violence spawns from hatred, hatred spawns from pride and petty revenge. pride and pettiness are the reason world peace doesn't happen on earth, if people were more willing to bend their knee and give each other an inch, there would be less conflict, less hatred, less violence. it's a simpler problem, but so much more insidious.
whereas, remnant doesn't have that issue. it's actual, real divides that people are targeting, the faunus are a different species, different semblances are actively better, atlas, regardless of what you think of them, has a higher success rate for fending off the grimm than any other country, etc. that's a more scattered problem, but one that can actually be directly dealt with. pride is brittle and usually doesn't like being directely targeted, but racism washes away when directly targeted, as does fascism.
I nearly spit out my sprite when he said humanity would just be a remnant of what it was
Angry Boi Bakugou SPRITE!
Nick H hey, it was ice cold and delicious
Angry Boi Bakugou SPRITE is soo damn good!
*roll credits*
At first I thought Adam was "justice", then I thought he was "passion". But over time, I realized I was wrong. He wasn't any of those things. He was "sprite".
he did learn his lesson. he told her the truth about the gods and it didn't go well. now he lies
BTYF So teue
Facts
True
not a lie. more just not telling people stuff.
Also, Tyrian referring to Salem as a goddess.
To deformed humans, she actually is.
@@Johnpinckney98 I believe you mean "overformed."
Theories:
#1. Dust is the metors from the moon
#2. Humans respawned FROM dust, ties back to other world or remnant stories. The DARK god intentionally Cracked the moon so humanity would be rebord, it was him alone who did it, the god light was not a part of that.
#3. Faunus evolved from the Animals that survived the dark gods annihilation of humanity, when dust hit the earth from the metors over time. some animals ate dust, and since man came from dust some Animals slowly evolved into humans.
#4. Dust can be used to create "magic" but humans came from dust which is what Semblances come from. If you paid attention it was the DARK god specifically who broke the moon, and then metors fell down. He purposely broke the moon, he wanted to undo the cleansing of humanity, and regift them magic but to a lesser degree one that warrants maturity to cultivate. Rather then everyone wielding great power easily. this also explains why faunas have Semblance, cause they evolved from animals that ate dust. this also strings the theory that faunas existed before man, because man was once whipped and the animals that survived that consumed metors "dust" started to slowly evolve before humans.
"Salem, however, found freedom not in the outside world she longed for, but in the eyes of the man who saved her. (Ozma/Ozpin)"
*skip ahead to the aftermath of their battle, before Salem kills Ozma/Ozpin*
"We _finally_ had our freedom."
I feel like those two lines show more than anything just how much the Grimm Pool corrupted Salem. She went from being a beautiful, caring woman whose greatest sense of freedom came from being with the man she loved, to being someone whose greatest sense of freedom came not from that same man who she now has a family with, but from behaving in a way not entirely different from the very two beings she hated, and accused of being mosters. Someone pure that lived for love, and she became someone who lived to destroy the lives of all who go against her without care for circumstances, similar to how the gods ultimately destroyed Salem's life simply because they did not understand her circumstances(as a girl who was likely raised without much love, if any at all. Not to mention her living with little to no true freedom until Ozma saved her.), and did not truly care to understand.
"Born an angel/ Heaven sent
Falls from grace are never elegant." -RWBY V2, Sacrifice
Holy Shit.
That quote is on point! niceeee
its funny how we as fans start quoting vol and chap numbers like its verses from the bible or something xD
@Wolf 71288 In a way, they are: for Remnant at least.
To be fair, she was shown to be very selfish, arrogant, and spiteful from the very beginning which was why the Gods cursed her. Honestly, the pool of darkness felt very unnecessary as she literally raised an army to take down Gods just because she hated them. I can definitely see someone like her going into a murderous rage when she finds her husband betraying her and taking her kids away, lol. It's like they threw in the pool just to be like "oh look how evil she is now!", but it didn't even change her very much besides her appearance. What's more, she seems to want to conquer humanity rather than destroy it like the Grimm do, as shown when she happily ruled them with Ozpin.
This lore drop was good, but personally I thought everything surrounding her falling into a pool of darkness was very flimsy writing overall.
@@chrismarkwardt4685 well i think the pool did change her at least a little, if you look closely when she is watching(via orb) the humans fighting, she is smiling until ozma speaks.
this was one of the best episode of RWBY ever and certainly the most intense one as well, Team CRWBY ,Miles,Kerry and the whole cast did such an amazing job on it!!!!
Contrary to what many believe, I think Oz was actually able to "kill" Salem or at least her physical body temporarily. At 26:31 you see Salem regenerating from light (because she was made immortal by the Light God's power). It's just that her immortality brought her back but, if not for that, he would have succeeded in killing her.
@MinecraftPro15 I did consider that, but the Light God only gave her immortality though? I don't think the immortality curse gave her any other abilities/powers
@MinecraftPro15 could be!
Except that Jinn already told oz the truth he cant destroy her maybe for two reasons one he still loves salem or two cause salem is immortal and unless that immortality is out of the picture and oz has the balls to actually destroy her then jinn might have said he can but thats it salem cannot be destroyed by ozpin now theres one question left and that question is what im interested how will they use that last question cause they cant ask the same question ozpin asked
@@scarletrose8766 So pretty sure nobody can destroy or kill Salem. The curse was placed on her by a God so doubtful anything in the world can undo that. But remember just because they can't destroy her doesn't mean she can't be stopped. They need to do what the God's told her she needed to do in the first place, learn the importance of Life and Death, then she will finally be able to rest (die). Definitely gonna be a challenge to do that but it shouldn't be impossible. And its never been stated they can't ask the same questions Ozma did. I mean it would be pointless but they probably could ask again.
@@digitaladventurer2142 Well immortality was placed on her by the pool in the God of light's garden rather than by him, just like how her desire for destruction was placed on her by the pool in the God of darkness's garden. Since the Gods made the pools then they could've made other things to negate the effects of those pools, after all there's a relic of destruction and it's most likely the sword, lol.
I'd also say that it's pretty likely that the genie told him he can't destroy her because he's in love with her and simply won't do it. If he couldn't because of the immortality then she would've said "you have to remove her immortality" or "you have to make her realize the importance of life and death" or "you have to convince the Gods to destroy her". The fact that she said he simply can't means that either he won't do it in any situation for any reason, or that there is NO way to destroy her whatsoever even if she learned her lesson and the Gods themselves tried to smite her (which wouldn't make much sense). He was a righteous hero and literally tried to forfeit saving the entire world to a God just so he could be with her in death, so I think it's safe to say he simply will not kill her.
It's funny to think that if Salem had just gone straight to the God of Darkness, everything would have probably worked out for her.
And that's why we always make deals with the devil first, kids
except it definitely wouldn't have, since the god of light would still have appeared to maintain balance and the gods would have probably fought and destroyed the planet in the process.
@@Yal_Rathol
Potentially... there would have been a different outcome, for sure, but both gods seemed somewhat reasonable in regards to each other. I could see the two working something out so as not to destroy their balance over the life of a single human. It seems that Light showed up specifically because he already said no and had his pride hurt when his little baby girl went to ask daddy to let her play when mommy wouldn't.
@@lo4tr except that wasn't why. the god of light appeared to stop the deal he and his brother made about balance from being upset, so he still would have come. and the god of dark would have still been too prideful and petty, which would have resulted in the two coming to blows, as they were about to before the god of light explained that his brother was being taken advantage of. without that impetus, the brother of light would just have to hope that the idea of destroying the balance between the two would be too high a price for his brother.
Or they could have practiced medicine instead of magic. Ozma doesn't die prematurely, and the story ends just fine.
@@Yal_Rathol The only reason Darkness backed down is when he said that Salem went to Light first. If she didn't he would've ended up fighting his brother for trying to control his decisions. It would've gone very differently and been a God fight.
You forget, as long as Remnant continues to use Dust to power everything, no one is getting to space
Fun fact: If you go back to The Great War world of remnant, the king of vale who ended the war had two relics- the crown and the sword- on him (highlighted in gold as opossed to the king being colored green)
Destruction and choice. I wonder if that implies he stole the world's ability to make any other choice than his own and held the power to back up his choice through the sword.
@@lo4tr I would assume the king would be one of Ozpin's past lives. That would be rather important to mention in the "What is Ozpin hiding from us?" question. Not sure why the king wasn't mentioned at all by Jinn considering he had 2 relics at the time. Unless her story ended before that point happened
@@ShadowKnfing
Well, the story was specifically about what Ozpin was hiding from them... Maybe he never hid that information, could have even used it in a breakdown of the other relics. Or, it could be that the information isn't exactly relevant to the direct conversation. We don't know exactly how Djinn works, what limitations she might have in terms of how she answers questions or even if she decides how much 'excess' truth to give. She may just take the question to mean she only has to give out one secret and then she has successfully upheld her end of the contract.
ShadowKnfing I’m pretty sure it said he had 3. The crown, sword, and scepter
@@Hello-yt7jp He definitely did have a scepter but it wasnt gold like the sword and the crown so i believe that's ozpin's normal scepter
Fun Fact: the voice for the God of Light is Schmitt from Sword Art Online Abridged (the meat-toboggan guy).
I really think that the main reason Salem wants the relics is to make the judgment day happen in the hopes that the whole world getting erased will finally end her existence.
Heard a theory that dust are the remains of humanity after the Dark Brother God Thanosed the planet
I'd say that the dust was the remnant of the magic, not the people themselves. When Dark Thanos'd the world, the people disintegrated into dust; the magic that they held became captial-D Dust while the remnants of the people themselves probably came back as twisted amalgamations of what they once were. Light pretty much stated that he wanted them to get another chance, so it's likely he set it up for them to return that way. The faunus probably came into existence as a sort of mutation in the process, similar to a cancer forming from the regeneration of cells.
@@thehoodlen
Over millions of years the dust settles
By the dew drops and the flower petals
The magic that flowed the through humans' veins
Now infused in their remains
Still, the most powerful line of this episode has to be "How do I destroy Salem." "You can't."
Ozma: "How do I destroy Salem?"
Jinn: "Protip: You can't."
Ginger Dwarf And if you think about it, that’s the only part of the story that he should feel like withholding from RWBY. Nothing actually paints him as a bad guy, it’s just that his goal apparently is impossibly for him to do. Now this may trace back to Raven’s issue with him essentially sacrificing other people for his own unknown goals, all because he understands that someone else must be the one to destroy Salem. Or maybe because Jinn does not know of future things, Ozpin can still destroy Salem, just not yet.
Ginger Dwarf wow I see you on the nyancave all the time. Nice seeing you here!
Just want to point out Jinn said "*You* can't" Implying that Ozma/Ozpin can't destroy Salem.
Maybe someone else can
Maybe the silver eyes are the key to killing Salem?
the gods did also say there's was only one way to take her immortality away
Course, wording is key when talking to these type of beings. He chose the word destroy, not the word defeat. He probably would have gotten a different answer if he used defeat instead. And immortality is just not being able to die, it doesn't mean she doesn't feel pain or feels exhaustion~
His question should have been how do I save Salem?
Ozpin can't kill Salem but maybe silver eyes can Remember how Ruby effected Cinder and she was part Grimm.
_God of light appears_
"Oh. My. God."
God of Light: Well, yeah... that's kinda in my name, you know.
That was pretty funny
Longest SOS discussion ever? Not counting podcasts and streams
Salem FELL hard for love
there is no way the humanity can fight back againt the gods, the dark one literally destroyed the moon cause it was in his way
I don't even think he was trying to destroy it, it was more like he was a tank running over a bug.
This gods can fight Thanos king with no problem because nothing can kill them lol
Well except now salem is a sort of goddess of destruction thanks you gave a entity of pure destruction immortality ..... thanks gods now ozpin had to deal with salem after all those years Salem might have the ability to kill them now (probably) this could end two ways humanity is eradicated getting salem finally her long waited death or........ salem kills the old gods and replace them (unless someone manage to stop her)
Scarlet Rose well Salem only really got magic and immortality and the God's can take away her immortality and they cannot be kill by any means and Salem even with the grims power following in her is not enough to even match the God's
Katsuro Kei well that defeats the purpose of giving salem immortality then if they are gonna take it away and kill her ...... remember her punishment is eternal life which at one perspective they screw that up so what powers do they have to take the immortality away when its link to she needs to learn balance of life and death and giving her death isint the answer also the gods returning is judgement day they could eradicate humanity and eventually end salem cause humanity the other link to her immortality is gone but eradication of humanity will result into humanity vs gods which salem might be up to that idea and this time humanity might win (i mean the old gods were a dick so im not surprised if salem joims humanity is killing them)
I didn't really understand why Ozpin ended up having to clean up after the mess Salem caused. :X She first did it for lover, but became twisted along the way. And he never asked for her to go through all that for him either. :S I'm confused. The gods were so very heartless about it. Salem having to witness the grief of losing Oz 3 times. Though they were right in a way to teach her lesson to not overstep boundaries, god damn. That was a real shitty way to go about it. And then dumping responsibility on someone else. The God of Light blames humanity's extinction on the God of Darkness. And then leaves Oz to fix it.
True with all of it but the ''he never asked her of this' and ''ask gods to bring him back'''is something any lover (or bring back a friend) would try, in my point of view and some anime went about
Nobody is gonna comment about the fact that the 2 brothers were fauna-like in their appearance?
Salem and Ozpin’s curse reminds me of Meliodas and Elizabeth’s curse
Thought the same thing
*She was starved for love...*
*She resented love...*
*She desired love...*
*And... she was DESTROYED by love...*
Oh Salem...
1:07:03 To Quote Doctor Ooblek
"History is important... If you can't learn from it... you're destined to repeat it." Volume 1 of RWBY
To summarize this episode: The gods are giant doughbags. I mean Salem deserved to be punished but not to that extent.
Eh, the determined extend of punishment changes from person to person. Someone would say a slap on the hand is punishment enough, another would be killing her would be her punishment.
All she had to do was learn the balance of life and death for her curse to be lifted. Thats a fair punishment
@@aleexozaki I'd agree If I were the gods, I'd do the same exact thing. Like, those gods were just as human as normal humans, with their own ideals and obviously their own moral compass. The god of light might not have liked his brother killing all of the humans, but he let it happen.
@@aleexozaki if it was specified how much they were together before ozma fell ill. and it was a few years i am ok about the life and death balance speech. However if they have been together for only like a few months like screw the gods. it wouldnt break the balance to just take half of salem's remaining lifespan and revive ozma with that ammount of life remaining . Hell , take it all of salems lifespan , revive ozma and tell em you have 10/20 years . make em count. the balance would only be broken if they made them immortal -.-. like how in the end they did. I understand not wanting to give every being in Pre-remnant immortality as the resources are finite.
Also the gods are such hypocrites.
No riviving allowed unless its for their own, the gods' , gain/benefit.
I'm sorry but what? I call major bs on "bAlAncE" The God of Darkness would've left Oz alive but the fact that he's butthurt that he wasn't first choice is what determined his fate seems so childish and petty. How is making someone immortal, teaching them the importance of balance. They make one person immortal, and reincarnate the other.
Oh, My God.
Rooster Teeth really up their story telling, this is top notch lore. Super interesting
So I have a theory. What if the reason for the Great War was someone in Atlas discovering this truth somehow? Either through the Lamp or otherwise and deciding the way to achieve this was via quelling the emotions of the masses. That living in harmony required controlling their emotions to those insane degrees.
The God of Light is voiced by a UA-camr, ChaseFace...
He has a phenomenal natural voice like radio-announcer-quality good
Really? Sounded awfully like Ironwood and Watts.
sadly the next episode is only 13 minuts. Still really good so I got no complaints. The season is just getting better and better
I believe that the kid's power was passed on. They are the product of a physical immortal and a spiritual immortal, and they already had magic. I don't really see any reason why the power swap aspect of the maidens couldn't be the case from the beginning.
i think the story we knew before was correct, and the girls weren't the maidens because we know ozpins power has diminished (I know he lies, but why would he lie about being LESS powerful). During one of his lives he probably saw the 4 girls, they reminded him of his daughters, and he transferred some of his power to them.
@@missTgalman It's possible, though it's also possible that he used up his magic making the schools that have portals to other pockets of space. It's also possible that his power is diminished whenever he reincarnates. The people his spirit bonds to don't have magic on their own. It has to come from him, working through a body that has no magic to offer, and no biological way of replenishing magical power. We don't really know how his magic even works, yet. We just know, "It's magic!" I just think there are too many options left open to buy the obvious. Maybe I'm wrong, but I guess we'll just have to wait and see. That's half the fun, anyway. :-)
Now I REALLY want to read a novel with Salem as the protagonist. She's so deliciously, desperately, humanly flawed. The Immortal Maiden Trilogy or something like that.
Haven't watched all of your discussion (catching a flight now!) but there's something so poignant about the beginning. The lonely maiden trapped in a tower! The righteous young hero rescues her! They fall in love! But the moment they left the tower, they became human. Human illnesses, human flaws, human pettiness. Salem being human (instead of fairytale) caused all these.
Also, nice touch by Rooster Teeth to have to God of Light as an Asian dragon (can't tell if Chinese or Japanese). Not only a nice visual contrast to his brother, but also that in Asian mythology Dragons are demi-god figures, typically of wisdom and luck. All the good attributes, unlike the Western style dragon.
So could one theoretically still find the pool of light/fountain of youth, right?
The question is, if you just jumped in would it make you immortal? Or did it only do that because the God of Light instructed it to?
I think that was the implication. Salem did become a creature of destruction when she entered the pool of darkness without the gods involvement
My theory is that it is the vault at Haven, there is the same kind of tree with light leaves and environment in the middle of mountain.
So if it is still functional, Cinder is immortal now.
@@windwatcher460 except that only happened because she's immortal, the pool couldn't destroy her, but it twisted her in the attempt.
it's probable that the pool of light wouldn't make you immortal, but it would have an effect, might make you very creative, or supercharge your aura permanently. assuming it still exists.
@@TheMyuken ... Oh... Huh... Yeah, I think you're on to something. That would also explain why (ep 4 spoiler) Salem knows Cinder is alive
Ozma: Salem i dont feel so good
I bet the daughters didn't make it out of that hallway alive. Maybe Oz gave the original Maidens their powers because he saw his daughters in them.
This... 1000 times THIS! I've been saying this since I seen the episode. Those kids died that day.
"Ozma" is a reference to Princess Ozma, the rightful ruler of the Land of Oz, hidden away by the Wizard of Oz, while he ruled in her stead. Just as Ozpin hid his past as Ozma from everyone.
"if you think this story has a happy ending, you haven't been paying enough attention."
This is apparently a long, thought-out rant...
Thinking over this chapter, it seems that both Salem and Oz has the same problem; trying to destroy Salem by force. As Jinn answered, it's not possible, not as long as Salem is cursed with immortality.
And there-in lies the solution. Her curse can be broken, just like every curse in fairytales. Whether its a poison apple, eternal sleep, or being a beast, there's always a cure (usually by true love's kiss or other similiar cliche).
For Salem, the cure to her curse was already explained by the god of creation, that is, for her to understand the needed balance between life and death. Her mistake/problem was that every time she tried to do the opposite, she only made her situation worse, and not just for herself either.
When she was first cursed, rather then learning her lesson and look past her own selfishness, she became spiteful and led mankind against the gods, their creators, who in turn, outright Thanosed them. Then she continued in her arrogance and tried to bypass their curse by using the dark pit which only made her more malovolent and making it harder to learn the initial lesson.
As far Oz is concerned, his only real issue (sort of) is he became more focused on Salem and how to destroy her instead of the task that he was assigned to help united mankind. But in retropsect, due to Salem's presense, his mission is being thrown off and his mission/attention is divided. Even worse, if his mission fails, the world will be annihilated. And there is a good chance that Salem will still be alive, probably left alone in the void.
In the end, it seems, only Salem can stop, or rather, save Salem...
One thing that I finally noticed is that the God of Lights Lake looks exactly Like the Spring Maidens temple in Volume 5... Blew my mind
NOT SPOILER! The next chapter tells you that Salem liked truth. She doesn't like lying
I can just picture someone from RWBY pulling this quote from Bayonetta: Bloody Fate when being judged by the Gods:
"You're such an egotist. What good is a world where you get your way all the time? It sounds like a bore. I think I'll stick with chaos, if you don't mind."
I feel like this all could've been avoided if the Gods understood how strong human emotions were, instead of teaching her, giving her support in mourning him they practically said "Deal with it" and kicked her out and then they cursed her for having such strong emotions and doing anything for her love.... I feel like the Gods are just powerful jerks.... it's sad :( "Felt pity" - wow that really helps her GodOLight, thanks so much! I'll just live normal again.... and when they kept killing and bringing him back, like wth???? You're ripping her apart and then punishing her for being emotional 😂😂
I feel so bad for Ozbin, and they gave him so much crap.
So this episode sets two things up
A. Raven was right more or less, so there may be a team split
B. When Jaune finds out Pyrra died and what she did it for is literally
impossible, hes going to snap.
C. Jaune might turn onto Salems side, He wants Pyrra back and Salem is the type to take advantage of that.
Except, why would he turn to salem? Cinder was working under salem and they all know that.
None of what you said makes any sense whatsoever.
@@zackrose6261 Simple, Salems deal was losing a loved one. Her pull is that she wanted to make a world where noone has to die. And as far as Cinder she could very easily say she was doing her own thing. Which wouldnt even be a lie since Cinder is known for doing that.
If Salem can convince Jaune that she can bring Pyrra back he could potentially turn.
@@teamcybr8375 Read it again, but think this time. It's not that complex it's simple story tropes and potential setup
@@Doritochi Raven was absolutely not right.
It's not that Salem cannot be defeated. It's that Ozpin cannot defeat her. Also, Pyrrha was not becoming the Fall Maiden to stop Salem. She was doing it to protect people. Which is totally possible.
Jaune isn't a fucking idiot. He's not going to betray all his loved ones like that. Maybe Vol. 1 Jaune would have. But he's actually grown as a character even if you didn't notice it.
Something I noticed was that Ozpin's second reincarnation (the old man) is the one that gave the powers to the first maidens, and they had parallels to his daughters which is pretty sad in how they may have reminded ozpin of his dead children
5:01 Holy shit how did I not notice that the first watch through? That cape looks exactly like Glynda's cape!
I have track n field and it was torture, but this feels like reward so thanks so much
Honestly this episode left me so pissed at the god of light, he comes off as a petty hypocrite, meanwhile the god of darkness seams pretty chill
you two are the only reactors that actually listen to whats being said instead of screaming incoherently and missing half the dialogue. its refreshing and actually fun to watch
The fact that magic was the gift of the god of darkness gives some interesting connotations to the purpose of magic in the world.
except it doesn't really. the god of dark said that while the god of light revels in creation powers, he doesn't own them. magic can be used to create or destroy, especially since humans were granted the ability to choose between the two. the only way it really affects the magic is that we've never seen magic that can only be constructive, like a spell to build a house, since the god of dark can't really let humans do that, it's not in his jurisdiction.
@@Yal_Rathol I'd be really curious to see some constructive magic then
Chase Sutter it seems like the gods were capable of the same things, but chose to use their powers differently, and essentially assigned each other a role to balance each other mutually.
@@KevSB07 Agreed, but the BoD said magic was specifically _his_ gift to humanity, and seemingly not the BoC's. Congruently, I don't think humans have been seen to wield magic constructively.
@@windwatcher460 Well, we haven't seen very many humans with magic before this chapter. Our knowledge of magic up until this point has been maidens, Ozpin, Raven/Qrow, and potentially Salem (we'll have to rewind and check if something she's done could be magic) Also, consider not using the word "constructive". Remember, the word we were told is opposite of "destruction" is "creation", not "construction". Now, have we seen magic be used, "creatively"? Not really, but it might be worth looking at various uses of semblances and dust, as they are the closest humanity has to magic PMS (post-moon-shattering).
that last violin note playing as the episode ending just gets me thats intense
salem couldn't be reasoned with by the time ozma reincarnated. she's been poisoned by the dark brother's power, the only thing she wants is destruction, of herself, of the world, of everything that causes her pain. she wasn't built to contain that power like the gods were, it corrupted and twisted her into a pained and cornered animal. ozma trying to reason with her may have delayed the inevitable, but in the end, maybe many lifetimes in the future, salem would have seen ozma as the source of her pain and turned on him, she would have lashed out against people for the smallest infraction, used her overwhelming magic to crush armies and kill by the hundreds, because she only wants to destroy.
salem cannot be reasoned with, she cannot be contained by anyone, and she cannot die. just listen to divide again, her entire being is summed up in that song, all she wants is to cut everything apart and rip the world into tatters.
Ozmas two daughters in one of his following lives had silver eyes. Now, this episode told us that magic is also something the dark god gave humanity, who also created the creatures of grimm.
Silver eyes are essentially anti magic/destruction and Salem doesn't want them around to prevent massive grimm depopulation which would directly lower her influence on keeping humanity down.
Another thing, humans are using fossilized remains of old humanity as their main power source.
Also, dust stops working before exiting the planets atmosphere, Salem is of old humanity (undusted) and this mysterious effect would effectively keep her imprisoned to the planet itself if the brothers intended to not let her leave the planet. Or is that just a wild thought? The whole "while you walk the face of this planet you will be immortal" could make this quite literal and tie into this as well.
Also, the Judgement includes "wiping out the planet" if they judge humanity irredeemable, so Salem might be wanting to summon the gods so she could finally rest because of the wording of her immortality curse while at the same time spiting them with making the humanity as disharmonious as possible.
As for the Maidens, the story says how the Wizard gave most of his magic to the four girls, which translated to what we now know would be that Ozma somehow grafted like 96% of his magic onto four separate girls and that due to his intent and reincarnation aspect those fragments are also "reincarnating" while following the "will" of their owner by going from one woman to another young woman empowering them with magic while latching onto their last users mind process for the next target due to the whole mental aspect of magic needing direction before it goes random. This could also somewhat explain why Cinder felt her power being hungry for its' other "half" because the quarters were willed by Ozpin to act as 4 wholes empowering 4 girls and not differently.
There is no logic behind Gurren Laggan ending fight versus the gods considering that the Brothers Grimm can literally wipe out the planet in a second, so that kind of ending falls apart.
On the other hand, Ruby is the Drill, Ozcar is Simon with inner Kamina, Salem is anti-spiral Nia at the head of anti-spirals. Ruby is the Drill that will allow Ozcar to pierce the Heavens and rescue Nia leading to a bittersweet ending of lovers reuniting and perishing?
Then again, silver eyes/shoes clacking/activating full blast ends the witch/Salem parallel... Ruby Giga Silver Eyes Breaking Salem?
On the subject of Adam, I do wonder. Because as Blake said, he is the personification of Spite, I wonder if part of Salem's hypothetical redemption is when she finds herself spitting the same line at Adam. Because he is a perfect mirror of what she once was. Bringing everything together to try and accomplish something, and then just being stripped of everything. I feel there is a lot of parallels there that could be capitalized on.
You guys have literally the best analysis of shows I've ever seen anywhere...
11:43 ok thanos
The Relic of CHOICE is a crown, Ozpin puts a lot of focus on choices, said he made finding the Beacon Relic more challenging, and Goodwitch's symbol is a crown......
God of Light: "Look Ozma, we are going to give you a chance to redeem humanity by tasking you with making a utopia where everyone lives in harmony, even though we made humans so that they are capable of both good an evil and it is completely unrealistic to expect this."
Ozma: "Okay... so...."
God of Light: "Also we are going to leave Salem there. Immortal and indestructible with a desire to destroy and turn humanity against itself. Have fun LOL"
Ozma: "WAIT! But why?"
God of Light: "She dared ask us for help, and then turned other people against us when we refused. So yeah... we wiped out all of humanity and now still think it best we punish this one human for all eternity, even though it is going to make this impossible task I'm giving you even harder. Totally worth it."
Ozma: "Somehow, I agree with you and don't see anything wrong with your logic. I will instead turn on Salem and side with the most childish, petty and irrational gods of all time!"
These gods are worse than any other villain in RWBY, honestly.
Just something i thought of. I think the castle that Salem and ozpin lived in, where their children died, is the same one Salem lives in now. And their kingdom is now Salem's realm.
Hi! As I said in another post, I think that Salem's plan in the current day is to bring the relics together, bring back the gods, and let them judge humanity unworthy. Then, they will destroy the world and probably end Salem's life. So, yes, I think that you are absolutely right.
Remember the gods told her on 12:30 that if she’s learns the meaning of life and death only then shall she Rest In Peace. Maybe Gin was right you can’t destroy Salem because she’s immortal, but maybe only Salem can stop herself by “learning her mistake”. But I still wonder if Ruby’s silver eyes are the key to help Salem or something else?...
Salem want to rule the world, she basically told Ospin to forget about the judgement thing. She doesn't want it to happen, she doesn't want to die anymore, and she can actually die (The god of light told her, when she understands the value of life and death, then she will rest). The thing is: Salem looks for the relics, probably to prevent Ospin from EVER reuniting them since that might stop her by wiping out everything and so she can actually take over the world unquestioned.
something to think about is ozpin asked how do ‘I’ defeat salem the jinn gave him the answer ‘he’ cant. Its is known jinns do like screwing with people like twisting a wish into something horrible .so oz cant but someone else can. my theory is that rubys silver eyes are a type of anti magic that can negate salems immortal body so only then she can be killed
Am I the only one that thinks the gods are totally in the right?
No, it seems mostly those who are the "look at all the POVs" and/or "needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" type understand them.
I agree. When your dog bites you, you put it down.
everyone that thinks the gods are wrong are operating on an anthrocentric mindset. they think it's bad because humans died, period.
Hard to say. Relations between the brothers are obviously... Strained. Calling a whole world an experiment is a big red flag. Don't accept any candy offered by Dark Brother.
But we don't know all the info. The legend suggests the brothers couldn't defeat each other. We know 'order' can be taken too far.
Short version, both are incredibly dangerous, and would need *really* good reasons for their apparent viciousness. Is it impossible for those reasons to exist? Dunno.
I think the whole immortality thing was just punishment because of their hurt pride and murdering every man woman and child on the planet because of one small army's attack on them was a bit of an over reaction on the gods part imo.
Literally been waiting for this all week.
I don't know if you know this but each academy logo is one of the relics. Beacon was the crown, atlas is the scepter, vacuo is the sword, and haven is the lamp
I got some powerful flashes to NnT with this episode. 2 lovers, 2 pissed off and stubborn gods, 1 lover cursed with immortality, 1 lover cursed with reincarnation, and ultimately the collection of godly relics is needed to end the curses.
I don't know why but I honestly feel that the direction that rwby is going follows the storyline of Magi the labyrinth of magic b/c of the involvement of djinns and reincarnation of Solomon (in this case would be ozpin) and with the destruction of one entire world of beings that leads to another one coming about
I’ve been watching this show for the first time and I cannot BELIEVE those cosmic jerks were surprised Salem was still seeking revenge. They gave her an eternity of loneliness to scheme in! Honestly it’s hard to blame her too much for becoming the Joker about it.
In MLP there is the logic that magic can't go away into thin air, it needs to go to someone. Maybe that's the logic here as well?
0:10 exactly!
0:14 if this was scripted I'd think it was a joke.
The phrasing of ozpin questions is what matter because Spoilers for this episode Salam cant be destroyed but that dosent mean she cant be stoped
Imagine living your life and one day someone else jumps into your body and starts turning you into an alcoholic because he's still grieving over some shit that had nothing to do with you, and you can't go and tell your friends or family and they never get to know why you had to disappear.
Oz's quick decision to go back because he wanted to see Salem no matter what shows that he can't be counted on in the clutch should his emotions get compromised. I get the feeling this is the CRWBY putting this shit into turbo and going full force forward. It's gonna get messy, but it's gonna be a wild ride either way.
Me when I wake up: 8:56
Me at 3 am lookin for *_BEANS_* : 9:06
What's interesting is that if she went to the God of Darkness first, things would have been drastically different. LOL Also, I noticed a lot of people seemed to have forgotten that Salem may have been selfish in her love, but her falling into the pit of Grim was what caused her to completely change her personality because the pool destroyed what was left of her humanity and replaced it with the need to destroy like it did with the creatures of Grim. So, yeah...the gods were to be blamed for everything. Pretty sad, Salem was selfish, but they were the cause of Salem to become what she was in the later future and left to have Ozma to take responsibility for their actions.
God of Light "Hey Ozma if I had just brought you back or let my brother bring you beck my brother would not have committed Genocide, but I am going to send you back now that's all over to fix everything but if you fail we are going to do it again, have fun." Great god.
right when you thought you were getting zuko alone it's time for the avatar and the firelord
silver eyes seem more like one of the God's abilities. If the light god knew the children would be born from Ozpin, prehaps he gave his own children the silver eyes? It would make sense considering the effect of the silver eyes is the effect the god used to 'strike' the grim down.
Actually now that I think about it Salem never told Oz about what happened with her and the gods. Ruby asked Gin to tell her what Oz is keeping a secret. So this has to imply he found out some how about the moon and all that happened with Salem while he wasn't there, or it's a plot hole.
Another thing I noticed the God of Light said about the world is that it is also a REMNANT BEFORE their intervention or creation. The current iteration of the RWBY world is a REMNANT of a REMNANT.
Jin said that Salem couldn't be destroyed, but she didn't say she couldn't be saved. Either that or have Atlas build a very large prison that zaps magic.
I think the stipulation was “So long as the world turns, you shall walk it’s face.” So should the world end, Salem’s immortality might end with it. Just a thought.
'ozpin' is the spirit within. put into various VERY HUMAN bodies. so him getting deaded by a Maiden is no mystery.
what kind of ride takes an hour and 41 minutes? I'M IN BOIS
The difference between a genie and God’s is that the gods are immortal. And the genie looks like a blue spirit who can grant only three wishes.
I’ve seen genies like this in an anime show which is Magi the kingdom of magic and labyrinth of magic. However, they are called dijinns.
Late to the party here, but I think probably the single most important line in this episode was a throwaway line by the God of Light; "You must learn the importance of life and death. Only then may you rest". I'm thinking probably the key to beating Salem permanently?
If the humans don’t like that they’ll be judged negatively, then they’ll unite and proved the gods that they’re worthy. It just takes a really good motive to unite and that’s the gods wanting to kill them all.
This is true, Salem was getting jerked back and forth. However she is the cause of the problems still. She lied to the younger brother, tricked him and turned the two against each other albeit momentarily. That being said, the punishment they bestowed upon her was very harsh.
No. Not quite. It's still Remnant. But there is a part that becomes Salem's domain.
And that is how dust came to be. The god of darkness destroyed the moon which apparently held dust in it.
No those are not the first maidens. It's not a coincidence either though. Ozpin as the wizard bestowed magic upon the four kind hearted young women because they reminded him so much of his former children. But as you can see at the end of Salem and Ozpin's fight, the children died in the chaos.
Also sympathizing with Salem lots, not against them fighting gods, tho they could also go the other many routes, the mistakes of gods and deities (Oz & Salem) trying to destroy each other didn't work, so maybe RWBY can make it right and save each other rather?.
There's a lot of really nice hints across the chapter, notice how the old man was the next incarnation after Salem killed Oz? he would have prolly been depressed and maybe go live in isolation in a place that brought him good memories of a past now gone, a cabin perhaps? Maybe 4 maidens that helped him regain his hope and light to keep moving forward...
Walking from the dark into the light over time with each life.
It's almost like it's saying, just like his daugthers, there's loss and things move on, life goes on and if you don't you could end up like Salem stuck in a past of hatred and resentment whether towards yourself or everything else.
Part of me wasn't too sold on Salem's grudge first watch, but it makes sense, i think its just that there's so much packed in 1 chapter that it feels like a lot of time between events was skipped, buuut i'm also not sure if 2 episodes of backstory skimming woulda been a good idea... specially when there's probably more to come yet, all in all it was pretty good and very well done (specially considering this was exposition, and it never got slow, let that sink in lol). Good job CRWBY.
The thing is, if Ozma had not died of whatever sickness he succumbed to, Salem and Ozma may not have lived happily ever after. Salem was already selfish and had a sense of entitlement before she went to the gods. Wheras Ozma was a just and honorable person. I can see these opposites being a good match.
Just a thought, the Faunus could be the remnants of the gods' essence.
I wonder if they dunked Salem in the pool of light if she went back to pre destructive pool Salem.
First of all, I love you guys. Your reactions and discussions are awesome.
But how the fuck?! Did you manage to make an almost two hour video for one episode? That's a theatre movie with credits! Awesome, but still!
Anyway, nice video. Keep up guys. I like your theories.
And another thing, the first relic was open by the Spring maiden, but how are they going to get to find the other maidens to open their vault to get the other relics? Or should I ask WHO are the NEXT maidens? And I don’t know if it’s just me or that old lady knows something about Ruby’s silver eyes, I got that suspicion from watching the opening and I don’t know why.🤔🤔🤔
So basically, Salem and Ozpin are recreating the 2 brothers' story : gods of their own world, weilding the power to destroy as well as the power to create, they each fight for what they believe in : Ozpin fight in order to bring balance back to the world and bring the gods back as well, while Salem wants to tke the gods' place. Perhaps that is why she seeks the relics, to call upon the gods and try to destroy them or at least steal their power (we know she has a way to do it, since she gave Cinder something that could steal the Maidens' power). What could aslo be possible is that all of this is a secret test byt the gods, to see if Salem and Ozpin are worthy of becoming the new gods of this world. Just imagine, the 2 of them finally reunited, protecting humanity.
We also know now that somewhere far from the kingdoms lies a place that holds both the Land of light, the Land of destruction (where Salme was standing at the end of Volume 3), and the old, nameless kingdom ruled by the 2 of them (Where Salem and her allies are living, we can recognize the room where they meet as the one where she fought Ozpin when he tried to leave). And something tells me that their journey will bring our heroes to the Land of light, because it must still hold some vast magical powers.
At the very least, we also know that this is most likely leading to a final confrontation between the 2 : Salem has made her moves, chasing after the Maidens and the relics actively, and the only choice Ozpin has to protect them is to take them with him, meaning they would be able to call the gods back. At any rate, know that the series finale has to be epic (and also that we still have material for many volumes).
the creatures of GRIMM, the creatures created be one of the Brothers Grimm. But that was already established as a theory way back in pre season 5.... why are you two surprised? ^^
Great discussion, i also had the idea of ruby destroying the grimm part of salem.