@TraceVelo Really surprised by the performance especially when you compare costs. Luke, can I ask you what is the brand name or even sent a link over to where you purchased your wheels from? They are stunning and I'm after some spinergy wheel set look a likes. Thanks in advance.
I bought these for my Trek Domane last year and have had zero issues since. They have been consistent and reliable. I've put over 1000 miles on them. Couldn't pass these up for $40 for the pair when looking to upgrade from the standard Tektro calipers 👍🏾
8:26 A smaller piston does not mean higher pressure. This is factually wrong no matter what you intended to say. A larger slave piston area means higher _force_ on the brake pads, given identical master cylinders. And the oil _pressure_ remains identical regardless of the size of the slave cylinder.
Yeah sorry Luke, bigger surface area equals more pressure. This assumes you have enough lever travel to make the most out of it. As long as the lever isn't bottoming out the caliper with the larger piston will press harder. Hand strength isn't an issue, there's always more lever pressure available.
I have not worked in the cycle industry for nearly twenty years now, but I believe CST is the Chen Shin Tyre company (Owners of Maxxis, or at least they were when I was last in the trade). My other half is a motorcycle Instructor trainer and once tried some CST tyres on a training motorbike, with hilarious results. They were great in the dry, but lethal in the wet! I have not used their cycle tyres since the mid 90s, after discovering Continental. I run Contis on all of my bikes these days, including the motorbike and the last set I bought were for the MTB, which cost me just shy of £40 for the pair. I look forwards to your reviews on the CST tyres, I hope that they have improved a lot in thirty or more years!
Can confirm that Maxxis is still a sub-brand of CST. CST has certainly improved over time but their QC isn't the best in my experience. Still decent budget options
It's a shame about the Trifox, if you did want to give it one last go, I fixed a friend's 2016 Cannondale EVO (also prone to this issue) I got a piece of cut off Alu' seat post about 50mm long and sliced a piece out length ways (about a quarter of the tube) to make a curved plate that I epoxied inside the seat tube behind the holes (Blu-Tac on a stick was the trick), once the glue set I drilled and tapped through the original holes into the bit of post (M4) and fixed the hangar with short low dome bolts, but I suppose you could just drill and rivet without fear of pulling through the carbon. That was about 2020, and he's still riding it as his winter bike. Or you could give 1x on Road a go. Looking forward to the tyre reviews, always avoided them as they never seemed that much cheaper compared to the mainstream to be worth the risk. 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖
You’re legend for going into internals of these Ali Ex parts, and testing, love your channel. I’d be interested to see some Xcadey power meter reviews, some amazing price offerings over their 4iiii and Stages PM counterparts.
CST is a major brand, and they make some great budget tires. I remember when they first reached my country a decade or so ago, they were the tires to get for classic 27 inch wheels, because they used a modern, reliable design, while most name brand tires were ancient and flat-prone. 🥖
I found CST to be kinda hit or miss. Some work exceptionally well, others warp after just a few rides and are essentially useless. I ruled out the climate (I live in the PNW) by running two CST on the same bike (Bianchi road bike with 700c x 25mm) front and rear. The front tyre is in excellent shape after nearly a year on the wheel. Straight and smooth. The rear tyre warped after one hard ride over rolling hills. I replaced that one with a Panaracer and I've since had no troubles with either for several weeks. Whether that's just an issue with their QC not being consistent? The manufacture? the quality of the compound changing with each pressing? 🥖🥖
OK cool, noted! I've not come across CST before, but I have to say, those tanwall tyres I showed at the end have been great so far. For the money, I'm well impressed!
Props to you, Luke, for finding your audience and sticking to it. Lots of content creators tend to stray and lose their audience. Great content, as always.
Some of Walmart's bikes come with CST tires on them, generally the 'nicer' ones (the Kent Trouvaille has CST Patrols on it for example, as opposed to some of the cheaper ones that'll have like... house-brand or nameless tires stock). No experience with anything but those Patrols myself, but they didn't feel half bad, even after upgrading to some proper XC tires I didn't feel like the Patrols had been noticeably worse, just overall more bulky and such.
Great video. If you do revisit brake compounds, give the blue multi metallic pads from Ali Express a look - They're semi-metallic but with a much higher percentage of metal particles, essentially placing them between ordinary semi-metallic pads and full sintered. I've had them on my MTB for about 100 miles and I'm sold. Just like sintered pads but with a bit more initial bite and a bit less rotor wear (still higher than most pads though).
Cheng Shin Rubber owns both Maxxis and CST. However, CST is the sister company to Maxxis and is the cheaper of the two. CST normally supplies the Chinese e-bikes that are imported to the US and fat bike tires. You can only try them and see! The casings won't be anything like the EXO+ from Maxxis, maybe more like the basic two-layer casing. Still, if you're not bothered about branded boots, who cares as long as they roll!
I have the real Juin brakes and they have been excellent so far. One thing I’d note is they probably work best with compression-less brake housing and good brake cables. I use regular decent mountains brake levers on a flat bar. Setup is easy and they can be realigned perfectly with the rotors just by loosening them, then clamping down hard on the levers while you tighten back up.
I just installed TRP HY/RD but swapped the pads for MTX Gold Label ceramic pads with 180 in front and 160 in rotors in the rear. Wow… just plane wow at the stopping power. Those might need to also be some pads for you to look at!
In China, the Decathlon AF105 model is using a pair of CST C3045 tires as default. I have used C3045 and currently using C1922. Don't have any issue so far.
Sorry to hear of your problems with Trifox. I built up a trifox rame a couple of years ago. No issues with the frame yet, but I have done some long rides on it the bike performed very well.
Sintered brake pads come as standard with Shimano Ice Tech rotors and come as standard on most EMTB bikes with 4-piston XT calipers and 203mm Ice Tech discs. Mine came with them; they hardly leave a mark on the discs! I think it will be more the ZTTO softer metals that are causing the deep gauges with them. Maybe another thing you can test in the future, but Ice Tech discs are very strong and hard-wearing; they are really something else on e-bikes and mountain bikes, with me as a heavy rider as well. My discs still look brand new hardly a mark on them! Actually thinking of taking abit af wet and dry to them aswell to get some bedding into them Ice technare solid something you won't have to worry about with Sintered pads
Nice Review. My riding buddies have got these on their bikes and I have seen these mounted on a lot of cheap chinese bikes being sold here in my country, so it's nice to know that they're okay as a temporary brake while you save up for an upgrade.
All these brands like iii pro, ztto, zrace are all just brands with different oem manufacturers making stuff for them. As for the iii pro, I've had their E4 brakes for over a year. With the stock pads they brake really good. They also look good. As for the trifox, you could swap that riveted hanger for a clamp-on adapter. No need to ditch the frame just because the hanger is rubbish 👍
In a hydraulic system, the larger piston would be exerting more total force on the brake pad, assuming that the system pressure is the same between two brake calipers. Basically, if you have 100PSI of pressure in the hydraulic system, a piston with 1 square inch of piston area will exert 100lbs of force on the back of the brake pad. A piston with 2 square inches of piston area will exert 200lbs of force on the back of the brake pad. Pressure is measured by the amount of force exerted over a given area, so the more area you have the more force you will have exerted. It’s just that with the same bore of master cylinder, the larger pistons will require that the master cylinder moves further to achieve the same movement/pressure.
Hi mate. I don't have any problem with the knock-offs, I've been running them for more then 5000k and they work fine. I live in the Swiss Alps by the way😅
I have had the copies on my bike about a year now. The build quality isn't nearly as bad as your examples and the cylinder seal looks to be higher quality. One issue I have found, and this seems to apply to ALL Chinese kit, is the bolts/screws are the cheapest possible. I often replace before even using something
Hey Luke (@TraceVelo). About your Trifox front derailleur issues, try to remove those original brazed on and put some clamp adapter. Depends with how many room you have to use this kind of clamp to brazed on adapter. Should do the job by $5 :P
I have been experimenting with different brands of pads. I found out that different brands on the same compound have drastic variations, and between batches of pads of the same company and same material the results may vary a lot, shimano ones are consistent, you get the same performance every time
OK interesting, I can definitely see how this could be the case. I'll have to get a few batches of cheap brake pads and see if there are any differences....
The real ones-still a great value. I had a bike with Juin tech GT-F., and a new bike build. I put the FI dual chamber on the rear wheel of each bike. and the 4 chamber on the front of each bike. They seem to match well. TRP levers/Reaction cable. mellow jff riding.
I've actually used that Pro III caliper and they work pretty fine. The finish is better and quality looks better as well compared to the one you got for 16 quid. I actually loved it and would have loved to use them still on my Trifox X16. Won't fit due to the lever hitting the seat stays.
Bonjour monsieur! I love that the Chinese are now knocking off their own stuff. There's a Chinese brand called Lewis that's popped up in the MTB world recently and they're getting a pasting for being a knock off of very expensive Trickstuff brakes. However, hilariously there are even cheaper knock offs of the Lewis brakes. So knock offs of knock offs, if you will. I'm confusing myself now. I'll stop. 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖
But why do you consider those knock offs of the Lewis brakes? I'd say they are knock offs of the Trickstuff brakes, just cheaper than the Lewis knock offs. What am I missing here?
@@whateverbikes I'm just generalising. Look at it whichever way you want. Only making the point that there used to be stuff like Hope and then there'd be an incredibly similar Chinese knock off. Now we've arrived at a point where they're knocking off their own cheap Chinese knock offs. I have no beef either way with the Lewis brakes. Personally I try and support British manufacturing wherever possible.
@@SteveKimbo I think you missed my point. You state that the cheapest version is a knock off of the 'original' knock off. My question is what makes you think that is the case (instead of it simply being a cheaper knock off of the Trickstuff's)?
@@whateverbikes what makes you think the Trickstuff brakes aren't just a way more expensive backwards knock off of the cheaper knock offs of the Lewis brakes?
From DH/FR background, Hope it helps someone 🥖 Rule of thumb for brake pads: 1 to 1 change rotor and pads for sintered metal, or 1 to 4 for for semi metallic (one rotor per four sets of pads). Yes, I need new rotors and new fluid. Anyone, spare change?
🥖🥖🥖🥖 I have had a trifox x8 frame for over a year now... had constant issues. Seatpost always slipping, frame cracked, rear hanger alignement, cable routing issues. So just bought a OG Evkin frame. Quality difference is massive! 🥖🥖🥖🥖
I have retrospec mechanical hydraulic brakes. But it's awful, I already bleed it and it's not working well. I prefer and recommend using fully mechanical dual piston brakes, like Tektro C550. It's easy to set up, easy for maintenance, easy for calibration.
The sintered Metal ones look exactly like Shimano M06 sintered metal brake pads. They are great for Gravel/Cross and have much better stopping power than the stock JuinTech F1s organic pads. However, during long alpine descends in warm weather they produce so much heat when breaking, that it can cause the calipers to clamp up by themselves. The particular time it happened to me, it I thought it might help to bleed the F1s thinking maybe it's mostly the expanding air that caused the clamping, but have not tried it yet. I found the black Galfer pads to be a very good in between solution.
I use the Juin Tech with the gold sintered metal brake pads. They are great but I noticed that you need to pre-brake to get them to modulate brake force 🥖🥖🥖
Shimano has some decent mechanical brakes for both flat and post mounts. They have a short pull, so road levers can work with them. Maybe you can give them a try if you can find some. It’s the BR-RS305 (flat mount) and BR-317 and 517 (post mount).
Enjoying your content. Keep it going. If you want to get rid of your frame, give me a shout on cost. Been looking at making a 1x group set on a budget.
I have been using some 28C CST tires. I don't know how long they will last or how puncture resistant they are or the watts needed, or how much they weigh but, they are incredibly comfortable and super grippy.
I have those 2 piece rotors (with a different brand name on them) and found that even with resin pads they wear down much quicker than any other rotors I've used. I imagine with sintered pads they'll be done in a matter of weeks.
You should check out the avid bb7s. About $70 per caliper and they're the best fully mechanical disc brakes you can get without spending stupid money on Paul Klampers. Only downside is that they're exclusively post-mount
Excellent comparison video. Have you compared a Specialized 3D printed saddle with a Ali Express 3D printed knock off saddle? I would like to see a video on that if possible. Appreciate the content you provide, Thanks!
I am looking forward to your thoughts as Asian tires have never broken into the road market, so they are a bit of a mystery. (Note: Innova Tire, CST, & Maxxis are from Taiwan.)
I have this exact brake calipers installed on my gravel bike before, and the performance was good at first but after a year of use, the oil started to leak everywhere and it does not perform well anymore. I ended up using TRP Spyre and there were no issues since then. Stay away from this type of hybrid hydraulic brakes, the quality just suffers after some period of use.
🥖🥖🥖🥖 Ayyyyy I ran these for a while and now I run TRP HY/RD. Tbh the knock offs are fine but I wouldn't do it again, just save up for a better set of calipers. Luke's totally right about it having a higher chance of having a lazy piston.
Also I hope you try out 180mm rotors in the front. Not all forks support it though. 180mm rotors and semi metallic pads really improved my braking power.
Great Video as always! Probably just by chance but it's intresting to see you're having issues with a trifox frame aswell. Buddy of mine had the Trifox X16 which is now totalled due to the included dropout hanger snapping on an 8% incline at less than 500W power. Shame really, he was very happy with the frame otherwise.
Would be nice if You could compare those Aliexpress brake pads with golden pads from EBC company (or some other brake pads produced in EU/GB/USA like Galfer etc.)- I have tested many brands of brake pads with many mechanical calipers, like Hayes, Avid BB5, BB7, Zrace Br-05 and so far, the stoping power and longevity of these golden EBC is absolutely the best, for me (110kg) they last for about 5000km.
You should sax that sintered need the disc brake for sinter and not for resin. The sintered pads are eating through resin discs. I run now ceramic and i think they are a good idea
Luke, LTwoo has an updated GR9, it’s now full hydro, but with the campy style tiny tumor for downshifts, And would it be possible since you have a mix of Chinese groupo’s that you could possibly do a mish mash of stuff? Which works and which ones wont? All I know is that Shimano Goes good with LTwoo and Sensah Goes good with Sram stuff, or the other way around would be possible, I’m not sure about microshift, and the brakes for the full hydro if they would be cross compatible. 😁
I wish I could make this but not 20 mins ago while on call with my partner I was looking at brakes for a BXT frame build I’m planning and I saw and actually contemplated these aliexpress breaks, some call it a coincidence, I call it a sign.
On my gravel bike Sram 1x mechanical, I have run variously TRP HyRds , Sprye and eventually settled on the best : JuinTech F1s. Although I have a backup set of Sram 1x hydraulics sitting on a shelf for the last 3 years, the JuinTech F1 are perfectly fine for my riding (was it mentioned they are really sleek and comes in pretty colours ? ) On another bikes, I do have full hydraulics (eg SRAM AXS Force etc) so I have enough for comparisions. As for brakepad compounds, it all depends on the performance AND THE squealing which is an unbearable source of grief
In my experience sintered metal pads bite best but also contaminate incredibly easily. Even just splashing through a puddle of dirty water is enough to make them howl forever, and you can't even fix them by sanding them because they're porous and the oil seeps through the whole pad. The other thing is that you pay for that great bite with very rapid rotor wear. When I switched to sintered my rotor life from resin pads dropped from 2-3 years to a few months.
🥖🥖🥖 I've been on only discs on my bikes since the early naughties and would only ever go with sintered pads in the UK. Resin pads are saved for alpine road days and purely for heat management.
Same location for pouring dissatisfaction in the casting etc they either used Juin tech discarded molds to reproduce it or they're just QC failed parts 😉
Really surprised by the performance especially when you compare costs. Luke, can I ask you what is the brand name or even sent a link over to where you purchased your wheels from? They are stunning and I'm after some spinergy wheel set look a likes. Thanks in advance.
Give that Trifox frame to Jourdain Coleman or other guy to cut an evaluate the quality. If the rivets are working their way out time and time again it seems to be a problem with the carbon.
Always good to be able to save money on parts… however brakes and tires aren’t on the list of things to skimp . Your baguette 🥖 affiliation inspired me to rename all my created Strava segments to end with 🥖 in their names 😎
CST and Innova pro are considered lower tier tires compared to other. they cheap though. regarding sintered metal pads, I always use them with SLX hydro brake when riding MTB, because of the braking assurance. kinda not feel safe with the resin pad.
i've never tried any of those hybrid ones, but given how cheap real hydraulic is getting i see the point of those fancy juintech ones less and less everyday... unless the iiipro is somehow worse than straight up mechanical disc i think it makes a lot more sense
🥖 trace! I found replicas of a certain high end Spanish brand and also a German one if you’ve seen them. Premium Ali prices but a quarter to a third of what the real ones cost.
"This episode didn't go to plan". Made me immediately think, I'm happy you are still alive and healthy 😅
Ha thanks, yeah nothing from AliExpress has taken me down... yet
@TraceVelo Really surprised by the performance especially when you compare costs.
Luke, can I ask you what is the brand name or even sent a link over to where you purchased your wheels from? They are stunning and I'm after some spinergy wheel set look a likes. Thanks in advance.
So much brake setups recently. Man can probably fix rotor rub by just looking at the calliper.
I bought these for my Trek Domane last year and have had zero issues since. They have been consistent and reliable. I've put over 1000 miles on them. Couldn't pass these up for $40 for the pair when looking to upgrade from the standard Tektro calipers 👍🏾
The moustache is deeply missed. I will light a candle tonight.
🫡
8:26 A smaller piston does not mean higher pressure. This is factually wrong no matter what you intended to say. A larger slave piston area means higher _force_ on the brake pads, given identical master cylinders. And the oil _pressure_ remains identical regardless of the size of the slave cylinder.
The larger slave piston should require more lever travel to achieve the same amount of pad movement, which has the potential to cause problems.
@@markdavison7893 I don't see how that's relevant to my comment.
Yeah sorry Luke, bigger surface area equals more pressure.
This assumes you have enough lever travel to make the most out of it. As long as the lever isn't bottoming out the caliper with the larger piston will press harder.
Hand strength isn't an issue, there's always more lever pressure available.
also die geometry of the connecting holes through the caliper body should not have an impact just because they are more nicely cut for the juin tech
Excuse me as I go to check that these aren’t the calipers I have mounted on my gravel bike 🤣
I have not worked in the cycle industry for nearly twenty years now, but I believe CST is the Chen Shin Tyre company (Owners of Maxxis, or at least they were when I was last in the trade). My other half is a motorcycle Instructor trainer and once tried some CST tyres on a training motorbike, with hilarious results. They were great in the dry, but lethal in the wet! I have not used their cycle tyres since the mid 90s, after discovering Continental. I run Contis on all of my bikes these days, including the motorbike and the last set I bought were for the MTB, which cost me just shy of £40 for the pair. I look forwards to your reviews on the CST tyres, I hope that they have improved a lot in thirty or more years!
Can confirm that Maxxis is still a sub-brand of CST. CST has certainly improved over time but their QC isn't the best in my experience. Still decent budget options
The Trufox frame of yours makes an excellent candidate for a 1x groupset! 😊
It's a shame about the Trifox, if you did want to give it one last go, I fixed a friend's 2016 Cannondale EVO (also prone to this issue) I got a piece of cut off Alu' seat post about 50mm long and sliced a piece out length ways (about a quarter of the tube) to make a curved plate that I epoxied inside the seat tube behind the holes (Blu-Tac on a stick was the trick), once the glue set I drilled and tapped through the original holes into the bit of post (M4) and fixed the hangar with short low dome bolts, but I suppose you could just drill and rivet without fear of pulling through the carbon. That was about 2020, and he's still riding it as his winter bike. Or you could give 1x on Road a go. Looking forward to the tyre reviews, always avoided them as they never seemed that much cheaper compared to the mainstream to be worth the risk. 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖
You’re legend for going into internals of these Ali Ex parts, and testing, love your channel. I’d be interested to see some Xcadey power meter reviews, some amazing price offerings over their 4iiii and Stages PM counterparts.
Your insight to manufacturing processes are super interesting!
Thanks yeah I love delving into it too. It really sheds some light onto these cheaper options, and how they cut down on costs!
@@TraceVelo what's your back ground... you seem very knowledgeable in manufacturing...
CST is a major brand, and they make some great budget tires. I remember when they first reached my country a decade or so ago, they were the tires to get for classic 27 inch wheels, because they used a modern, reliable design, while most name brand tires were ancient and flat-prone. 🥖
I found CST to be kinda hit or miss. Some work exceptionally well, others warp after just a few rides and are essentially useless. I ruled out the climate (I live in the PNW) by running two CST on the same bike (Bianchi road bike with 700c x 25mm) front and rear.
The front tyre is in excellent shape after nearly a year on the wheel. Straight and smooth. The rear tyre warped after one hard ride over rolling hills.
I replaced that one with a Panaracer and I've since had no troubles with either for several weeks.
Whether that's just an issue with their QC not being consistent? The manufacture? the quality of the compound changing with each pressing? 🥖🥖
Got some cst Pika gravel tyres, they are really good for the money :)
It is also Taiwanese, not Chinese.
OK cool, noted! I've not come across CST before, but I have to say, those tanwall tyres I showed at the end have been great so far. For the money, I'm well impressed!
CST is the parent company of Maxxis. No one makes more bike tires
Props to you, Luke, for finding your audience and sticking to it. Lots of content creators tend to stray and lose their audience.
Great content, as always.
CST = Cheng Shin Tire. It's a Taiwanese company that also owns Maxxis.
Some of Walmart's bikes come with CST tires on them, generally the 'nicer' ones (the Kent Trouvaille has CST Patrols on it for example, as opposed to some of the cheaper ones that'll have like... house-brand or nameless tires stock). No experience with anything but those Patrols myself, but they didn't feel half bad, even after upgrading to some proper XC tires I didn't feel like the Patrols had been noticeably worse, just overall more bulky and such.
I had some CST tyres that lasted nearly 10 years on my hybrid bike, until I ran over a stick that even punched through tyre liners.
Great video. If you do revisit brake compounds, give the blue multi metallic pads from Ali Express a look - They're semi-metallic but with a much higher percentage of metal particles, essentially placing them between ordinary semi-metallic pads and full sintered.
I've had them on my MTB for about 100 miles and I'm sold. Just like sintered pads but with a bit more initial bite and a bit less rotor wear (still higher than most pads though).
OK noted, I'll check them out!
Cheng Shin Rubber owns both Maxxis and CST. However, CST is the sister company to Maxxis and is the cheaper of the two. CST normally supplies the Chinese e-bikes that are imported to the US and fat bike tires. You can only try them and see! The casings won't be anything like the EXO+ from Maxxis, maybe more like the basic two-layer casing. Still, if you're not bothered about branded boots, who cares as long as they roll!
I have the real Juin brakes and they have been excellent so far. One thing I’d note is they probably work best with compression-less brake housing and good brake cables. I use regular decent mountains brake levers on a flat bar. Setup is easy and they can be realigned perfectly with the rotors just by loosening them, then clamping down hard on the levers while you tighten back up.
I just installed TRP HY/RD but swapped the pads for MTX Gold Label ceramic pads with 180 in front and 160 in rotors in the rear. Wow… just plane wow at the stopping power. Those might need to also be some pads for you to look at!
I once commented that we need a mountain bike version of this channel. However I now have an older Trek Madone 5.1. Great bike.
In China, the Decathlon AF105 model is using a pair of CST C3045 tires as default. I have used C3045 and currently using C1922. Don't have any issue so far.
Sorry to hear of your problems with Trifox. I built up a trifox rame a couple of years ago. No issues with the frame yet, but I have done some long rides on it the bike performed very well.
Sintered brake pads come as standard with Shimano Ice Tech rotors and come as standard on most EMTB bikes with 4-piston XT calipers and 203mm Ice Tech discs. Mine came with them; they hardly leave a mark on the discs! I think it will be more the ZTTO softer metals that are causing the deep gauges with them. Maybe another thing you can test in the future, but Ice Tech discs are very strong and hard-wearing; they are really something else on e-bikes and mountain bikes, with me as a heavy rider as well. My discs still look brand new hardly a mark on them! Actually thinking of taking abit af wet and dry to them aswell to get some bedding into them Ice technare solid something you won't have to worry about with Sintered pads
got fully hydraulic versions of these (came with my sensah grt 12 groupset ) and they are brilliant, no complaints so far!
Another video! Luke is on fireee 🥖🥖🥖
Always!
@@TraceVeloI'm sorry but I need to recommend to not be on fire. I need more videos and your wonderful personality in them 😢🥖🥖🔥
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣👌🏽
Hello Luke! You're doing great as always! Maybe it's worth transferring the bed frame to one star in front and then you can still use it. Good luck!
Nice Review. My riding buddies have got these on their bikes and I have seen these mounted on a lot of cheap chinese bikes being sold here in my country, so it's nice to know that they're okay as a temporary brake while you save up for an upgrade.
Yeah they are honestly OK. The JuinTech's are better overall, but the cheap calipers did brake pretty nicely
All these brands like iii pro, ztto, zrace are all just brands with different oem manufacturers making stuff for them. As for the iii pro, I've had their E4 brakes for over a year. With the stock pads they brake really good. They also look good.
As for the trifox, you could swap that riveted hanger for a clamp-on adapter. No need to ditch the frame just because the hanger is rubbish 👍
Thanks for all your research and humor, Luke. Great video.
Definitely interested in hearing about what the best pads are for semi hydraulic brakes.
Wow, I’m once again impressed by the quality of the Juin-Techs; what a legit product!
Running those knock-offs on the rear for the last 6 months . No any issue. Work solid.
In a hydraulic system, the larger piston would be exerting more total force on the brake pad, assuming that the system pressure is the same between two brake calipers.
Basically, if you have 100PSI of pressure in the hydraulic system, a piston with 1 square inch of piston area will exert 100lbs of force on the back of the brake pad. A piston with 2 square inches of piston area will exert 200lbs of force on the back of the brake pad.
Pressure is measured by the amount of force exerted over a given area, so the more area you have the more force you will have exerted. It’s just that with the same bore of master cylinder, the larger pistons will require that the master cylinder moves further to achieve the same movement/pressure.
Hi mate. I don't have any problem with the knock-offs, I've been running them for more then 5000k and they work fine. I live in the Swiss Alps by the way😅
I have had the copies on my bike about a year now. The build quality isn't nearly as bad as your examples and the cylinder seal looks to be higher quality. One issue I have found, and this seems to apply to ALL Chinese kit, is the bolts/screws are the cheapest possible. I often replace before even using something
WE ALWAYS GET SO MUCH VALUE FROM YOUR VIDEOS thank you TRACE VELO AND THOSE GOLD BRAKE PADS ARE THE TOPS .
Hey Luke (@TraceVelo). About your Trifox front derailleur issues, try to remove those original brazed on and put some clamp adapter. Depends with how many room you have to use this kind of clamp to brazed on adapter. Should do the job by $5 :P
I have been experimenting with different brands of pads. I found out that different brands on the same compound have drastic variations, and between batches of pads of the same company and same material the results may vary a lot, shimano ones are consistent, you get the same performance every time
Japanese engineering.
OK interesting, I can definitely see how this could be the case. I'll have to get a few batches of cheap brake pads and see if there are any differences....
The real ones-still a great value. I had a bike with Juin tech GT-F., and a new bike build. I put the FI dual chamber on the rear wheel of each bike. and the 4 chamber on the front of each bike. They seem to match well. TRP levers/Reaction cable. mellow jff riding.
I've actually used that Pro III caliper and they work pretty fine. The finish is better and quality looks better as well compared to the one you got for 16 quid. I actually loved it and would have loved to use them still on my Trifox X16. Won't fit due to the lever hitting the seat stays.
Bonjour monsieur! I love that the Chinese are now knocking off their own stuff. There's a Chinese brand called Lewis that's popped up in the MTB world recently and they're getting a pasting for being a knock off of very expensive Trickstuff brakes. However, hilariously there are even cheaper knock offs of the Lewis brakes. So knock offs of knock offs, if you will. I'm confusing myself now. I'll stop. 🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖
Juintech is Taiwanese
But why do you consider those knock offs of the Lewis brakes? I'd say they are knock offs of the Trickstuff brakes, just cheaper than the Lewis knock offs. What am I missing here?
@@whateverbikes I'm just generalising. Look at it whichever way you want. Only making the point that there used to be stuff like Hope and then there'd be an incredibly similar Chinese knock off. Now we've arrived at a point where they're knocking off their own cheap Chinese knock offs. I have no beef either way with the Lewis brakes. Personally I try and support British manufacturing wherever possible.
@@SteveKimbo I think you missed my point. You state that the cheapest version is a knock off of the 'original' knock off. My question is what makes you think that is the case (instead of it simply being a cheaper knock off of the Trickstuff's)?
@@whateverbikes what makes you think the Trickstuff brakes aren't just a way more expensive backwards knock off of the cheaper knock offs of the Lewis brakes?
From DH/FR background, Hope it helps someone 🥖
Rule of thumb for brake pads: 1 to 1 change rotor and pads for sintered metal, or 1 to 4 for for semi metallic (one rotor per four sets of pads).
Yes, I need new rotors and new fluid. Anyone, spare change?
CST is actually a legit tire brand, you can buy those in Serbia for city bikes and such, never saw a kevlar road version tho...
🥖🥖🥖🥖 I have had a trifox x8 frame for over a year now... had constant issues. Seatpost always slipping, frame cracked, rear hanger alignement, cable routing issues. So just bought a OG Evkin frame. Quality difference is massive! 🥖🥖🥖🥖
Bravo, Luke. I could hardly be less interested in hybrid brakes and pads, but your videos are nonetheless compelling. 😂. Thanks.
I have retrospec mechanical hydraulic brakes. But it's awful, I already bleed it and it's not working well. I prefer and recommend using fully mechanical dual piston brakes, like Tektro C550. It's easy to set up, easy for maintenance, easy for calibration.
The sintered Metal ones look exactly like Shimano M06 sintered metal brake pads. They are great for Gravel/Cross and have much better stopping power than the stock JuinTech F1s organic pads. However, during long alpine descends in warm weather they produce so much heat when breaking, that it can cause the calipers to clamp up by themselves. The particular time it happened to me, it I thought it might help to bleed the F1s thinking maybe it's mostly the expanding air that caused the clamping, but have not tried it yet. I found the black Galfer pads to be a very good in between solution.
I use the Juin Tech with the gold sintered metal brake pads. They are great but I noticed that you need to pre-brake to get them to modulate brake force 🥖🥖🥖
Shimano has some decent mechanical brakes for both flat and post mounts. They have a short pull, so road levers can work with them. Maybe you can give them a try if you can find some. It’s the BR-RS305 (flat mount) and BR-317 and 517 (post mount).
Enjoying your content. Keep it going.
If you want to get rid of your frame, give me a shout on cost. Been looking at making a 1x group set on a budget.
I guess I'll have to wait for the QUADFOX frame availabilty
Cheap 1x setup for the trifox? Excited to see the cst tire review, kinda interested in them since most lower cost tires are all made there anyways.
I have been using some 28C CST tires. I don't know how long they will last or how puncture resistant they are or the watts needed, or how much they weigh but, they are incredibly comfortable and super grippy.
I have those 2 piece rotors (with a different brand name on them) and found that even with resin pads they wear down much quicker than any other rotors I've used. I imagine with sintered pads they'll be done in a matter of weeks.
I now come here just to hear the bonus clip jingle with every new video🥖😚😚🥖
I am excited to see your testing of the tires make realy good expierences with some cheap tires from AliExpress greetings from Germany
You should check out the avid bb7s. About $70 per caliper and they're the best fully mechanical disc brakes you can get without spending stupid money on Paul Klampers. Only downside is that they're exclusively post-mount
Excellent comparison video. Have you compared a Specialized 3D printed saddle with a Ali Express 3D printed knock off saddle? I would like to see a video on that if possible. Appreciate the content you provide, Thanks!
I am looking forward to your thoughts as Asian tires have never broken into the road market, so they are a bit of a mystery. (Note: Innova Tire, CST, & Maxxis are from Taiwan.)
Yeah so far, I'm mega impressed with the CST tyres I've got on the bike. They were only about £10 each, and roll really nicely. Plus they look great!
I have this exact brake calipers installed on my gravel bike before, and the performance was good at first but after a year of use, the oil started to leak everywhere and it does not perform well anymore. I ended up using TRP Spyre and there were no issues since then. Stay away from this type of hybrid hydraulic brakes, the quality just suffers after some period of use.
Hi Luke, love your videos, really entertaining. For the Trifox, why not try a 1by setup 😉
🥖🥖🥖
Wow... finally ur gonna be doing tire review for these alternatives Chinese brand. Looking forward to it
Can't wait the Wheeltop final review !
🥖🥖🥖🥖 Ayyyyy I ran these for a while and now I run TRP HY/RD. Tbh the knock offs are fine but I wouldn't do it again, just save up for a better set of calipers. Luke's totally right about it having a higher chance of having a lazy piston.
Also I hope you try out 180mm rotors in the front. Not all forks support it though. 180mm rotors and semi metallic pads really improved my braking power.
Great Video as always! Probably just by chance but it's intresting to see you're having issues with a trifox frame aswell. Buddy of mine had the Trifox X16 which is now totalled due to the included dropout hanger snapping on an 8% incline at less than 500W power. Shame really, he was very happy with the frame otherwise.
You aren't the first to pan Trigox frames. At least you gave it all you could and no one could fault you for that.
Would be nice if You could compare those Aliexpress brake pads with golden pads from EBC company (or some other brake pads produced in EU/GB/USA like Galfer etc.)- I have tested many brands of brake pads with many mechanical calipers, like Hayes, Avid BB5, BB7, Zrace Br-05 and so far, the stoping power and longevity of these golden EBC is absolutely the best, for me (110kg) they last for about 5000km.
Convert the Trifox to one by and use alternate handlebar.. Or touring or commuting set up.. Not ritired but re-assign
🥖 good point on sintered pads.
You should sax that sintered need the disc brake for sinter and not for resin.
The sintered pads are eating through resin discs.
I run now ceramic and i think they are a good idea
Looking forward to the tire video!
One thing about Temu as well, is that sometimes the product isnt half bad. Temu just makes so much money off of selling your data haha.
Luke, LTwoo has an updated GR9, it’s now full hydro, but with the campy style tiny tumor for downshifts, And would it be possible since you have a mix of Chinese groupo’s that you could possibly do a mish mash of stuff? Which works and which ones wont? All I know is that Shimano Goes good with LTwoo and Sensah Goes good with Sram stuff, or the other way around would be possible, I’m not sure about microshift, and the brakes for the full hydro if they would be cross compatible. 😁
I wish I could make this but not 20 mins ago while on call with my partner I was looking at brakes for a BXT frame build I’m planning and I saw and actually contemplated these aliexpress breaks, some call it a coincidence, I call it a sign.
try an og evkin frame andddd you should try to build an xc bike!!!
On my gravel bike Sram 1x mechanical, I have run variously TRP HyRds , Sprye and eventually settled on the best : JuinTech F1s. Although I have a backup set of Sram 1x hydraulics sitting on a shelf for the last 3 years, the JuinTech F1 are perfectly fine for my riding (was it mentioned they are really sleek and comes in pretty colours ? )
On another bikes, I do have full hydraulics (eg SRAM AXS Force etc) so I have enough for comparisions.
As for brakepad compounds, it all depends on the performance AND THE squealing which is an unbearable source of grief
We all nerd-out about our passions. I'm hear for it.
overall, there are a few shortcuts but nothing too worrying, you could do ok with these as a cost cutting measure
holy crap the limits have been found haha
I have the same caliper included in my Kespor Titanium Bike haha. Kespor Ultipro model had this PRO8000 model. Changed the pads and it's ok haha.
In my experience sintered metal pads bite best but also contaminate incredibly easily. Even just splashing through a puddle of dirty water is enough to make them howl forever, and you can't even fix them by sanding them because they're porous and the oil seeps through the whole pad. The other thing is that you pay for that great bite with very rapid rotor wear. When I switched to sintered my rotor life from resin pads dropped from 2-3 years to a few months.
A few months! Wow. How many miles in those few months? I was going to switch but if I'm changing rotors every 3 months maybe not.
🥖🥖🥖 I've been on only discs on my bikes since the early naughties and would only ever go with sintered pads in the UK. Resin pads are saved for alpine road days and purely for heat management.
Same location for pouring dissatisfaction in the casting etc they either used Juin tech discarded molds to reproduce it or they're just QC failed parts 😉
Larger piston on caliper gives larger force for a given pressure. Force = Pressure x area.
The funny thing is, I bought one of those. Worked well for about 6 months and then died. I actually made it halfway through a second set of pads.
Interesting. How did they die, if I may ask? (Love the construction / manufacturing side of things)🙂
Really surprised by the performance especially when you compare costs.
Luke, can I ask you what is the brand name or even sent a link over to where you purchased your wheels from? They are stunning and I'm after some spinergy wheel set look a likes. Thanks in advance.
Give that Trifox frame to Jourdain Coleman or other guy to cut an evaluate the quality. If the rivets are working their way out time and time again it seems to be a problem with the carbon.
Always good to be able to save money on parts… however brakes and tires aren’t on the list of things to skimp .
Your baguette 🥖 affiliation inspired me to rename all my created Strava segments to end with 🥖 in their names 😎
How did the knock off juin tech ones compare to the cheap zrace ones
Try a stainless steel riv nut and bolt to fix front derailleur hanger
Great Video.... try the Cycle1 semi-metallic pads.... saved me in a panic stop the other day....
Luke great video, I'm off to get new brake pads. Do you think the LTWOO FD is too heavy or the torque is putting pressure on the rivets? 🥖
Those brakes came with my gravel bike, it only lasted for a year
CST makes excellent tires
Thanks, as always.
Try a 1x setup on the trifox.
CST and Innova pro are considered lower tier tires compared to other. they cheap though. regarding sintered metal pads, I always use them with SLX hydro brake when riding MTB, because of the braking assurance. kinda not feel safe with the resin pad.
i've never tried any of those hybrid ones, but given how cheap real hydraulic is getting i see the point of those fancy juintech ones less and less everyday... unless the iiipro is somehow worse than straight up mechanical disc i think it makes a lot more sense
A baguette for the algorithm 🥖🥖🥖
I had a similar issue with the front derailleur rivets on a Hong-Fu frame back in the FM-066 era.
🥖 trace! I found replicas of a certain high end Spanish brand and also a German one if you’ve seen them.
Premium Ali prices but a quarter to a third of what the real ones cost.