There are people actually claiming that your reputation has been ruined because of the debate. I'm of the opinion that it will be a longtime before you have to buy your own beer at an archaeology conference.
@@ullrich it's how they work. Same with trump, he said 2025 wasn't the plan, while appointing the very people behind it and now post election, they're admitting it.
"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." - Asimov That quote becomes more and more relevant on a daily basis as of late.
There is a great video by the author Kurt Andersen that explains how The Untied States became the irrational, fake-news, alternative-truth, failed nation that we now see in it's full, gruesome glory. ua-cam.com/video/Id4WZCG0e7c/v-deo.html
@@RYPA190 Your point? Are you saying what Asimov said 50 or 60 years ago now applies globally and that willfully ignorant morons are inside every border?
Especially the past 4 yrs. I mean look at our MSM “News”. It’s a Propaganda machine for the Democratic Party, AKA the most willfully ignorant hypocrites on Earth. “Donald Trump is a Russian spy” “Joes sharp as a tack,never been better” “Donald Trump is a threat to democracy, listen to us and vote for the woman who recieved the nomination via coup on the sitting president, you know, to save democracy.”🙄 We must send all our money to Ukraine to save the world” Who cares if billions and billions of the hundreds of billions we have sent them have gone missing? WHO cares if they really do have battalions of Neo Nazis? WHO cares they’ve been the most corrupt country in Europe for yrs,their people need this money more than our own people. We’ll take care of our own after we take care of the Ukrainians, and start WW3 in the process, oh wait we also have to take care of millions of illegal aliens too, then nnnn we’ll worry about Americans. Femas outta $$??? So what? Send millions to Lebanon, then we’ll worry about FEMA! Luckily, all the BS is ending. Nobody with half a brain listens to these sociopaths anymore, like Joy Behar….”Joe Rogan believes in dragons, I triple fact checked it”….These old hags are insane. How about Joy Reid? “Donald Trump Is never leaving the White House now” This is allll white womens fault! Oh, that was the other Kook,Sonny Hostin. If you get your news from these people….Stop. They don’t even understand how to be real people!! They can’t for the life of them figure out why Trump ran the table. They think they have to create their own Joe Rogan to fight back. They had their own Rogan..His name was Joe Rogan. But they went sooooo far left with absolutely asinine policy that they lost him. He was a Bernie Bro. As was i in ‘15-16. Then the DNC fixed the primaries for Hillary. Sickening sickening people.
You didn’t just admit that you didn’t know the exact numbers, but you gave an approximation AND provided a source that would expound on the topic in ways you could not. That’s, quite literally, the opposite of lying.
Graham did this same thing with the miss speaking on Gunung Padang. He said that is was radio carbon dated to 20,000 years trying to pass that off as a culture layer when it was not a cultural layer but just a layer of dirt from a certain depth (that obviously can be carbon dated) At least Flint didn’t miss speak on a multi-million dollar Netflix series. that went over every Graham supporter’s head, I guess. Have you read Grahams books? If you want to compare Miss-speaking’s you should read one of those mind benders. He literally speaks about Atlantis like it’s already been discovered and insists there were ancient civilizations on Mars.
Yeah on one hand we have that statement by Dibble where he cites who has studied this and how to get the information, on the other Graham has pictures of rocks that faintly look like a recognizable thing, of course lacking any other archeological data like food remnants the products of this widespread metallurgy etc.
@@AZ-kr6ffeven after the pushback I don't think that dibble's followup meets the full definition of lie. Which is the point here. I'm sure that dibble would be happy to do a solo follow up like Hancock did and go thru all of the alleged problematic stuff point by point with Rogan.
@@AZ-kr6ff Was it wrong tho? At the very least, giving a rough estimate to the best of ones knowledge before referring to someone more informed on the matter is a way of "lying" we can only dream of seeing from mr Graham. And sorry, but this is too funny. Joe: How long does the Taylor Swift concert last? Flint: O, hours, definitively hours. Joe: No, really. How many hours exactly? Flint: Well, im not a swifty so i don't know exactly, I have a friend that is though, her name is Google, we could ask her... Joe: Nooo,! Begone! You lied!!
Hancock wasnt prepared ... after a lifetime of presenting on his own stuff? Someone has been spending too much time straw manning archaeologists and not enough time reading them. Funny how the standard is that an archaeologist can never misspeak, but Hancock can string them back to back, for hours on end, and it's never questioned.
@@chucklearnslithics3751 yup he’s got hundreds of provable lies. And yet flint makes one error about the ship wrecks, which he then corrected himself, and they jump on him calling a liar. And they all shut down discussion.
@@chucklearnslithics3751 exactly.. I also think Hancock is so accustomed to the sub-high school level of discussion he is able to get away with, due to poor publicity and lack of public awareness for archaeology. Handcock has only two modes; 1. Befuddled babbling about square rocks and pyramid alignment 2. Whining about how silenced and cancelled he is with only his own Netflix show, multiple appearances on THE biggest podcast ever, & a bunch of actual published physical books. He has nothing to contribute but bullshit and whining, he's an embarrassment and a blight on public information. He's the Andrew Wakefield of archaeology
imagine you leave a pile of money and a gun on a table and tell a hitman you dont like this peron and then just leave the room empty handed. you dont get to act shocked when the hitman fails and then the target calls you out and brings all the evidence against you. the instructions were very clear.
every single alt history community is filled with grownup man acting like an edgy child. cmon, you want to challenge the status quo with no evidence, then when real expert who know what real archeology all about, started corrected and critisize in good faith they come arround and start crying about cancell culture. All bark and no bite, No substance whatsoever. people like jimmy corsettri and dan need to grow up and be a real men. Not a slimy, manipulative, paranoid, and insuferable manchild. I think they all loss their pacifier, thats why they cry all the time.
"played fast and loose with the truth" Bro... He brought a power point with over 200 slides of peer reviewed science. That is neither fast nor loose. Also, to quote a very famous fictional archaeologist: you want truth, philosophy is down the hall. Archaeology deals in facts.
I bring 200 hundred slides pointing to different pieces of evidences from different studies and then organize it in a particular order to be most effective for my ends. My ability to construct a powerful narrative of facts does not actually bring any judgement on the correctness of my presentation, just that I have a large arsenal of weapons to throw at my opponent. These are not things they will be able to respond to at large. They may be ready for some points of evidence, but I will continue to move on until I find a weak point with my prepared fact deck. It's more of a game than a demonstration of knowledge. The sleight of hand is happening with the organization of facts to say something about anything (thus they smuggle in truth and other unfounded conclusions).
Well Hancock has many more thousands of slides but atleast Dibble has actual physical archaeological evidence to corroborate many of his slides. Hancock has the ole “well I’m just telling you what someone else said” circumstantial evidence to backup everything
@@soccerplayer922 that's called using evidence for an argument... if you think his evidence is wrong and his argument invalidated, then fact check him. you're criticizing an expert for having knowledge against laymen arguing over his own field of expertise. if you're unprepared to grapple with the evidence he brings up, you shouldn't be having that argument.
It's funny how Joe denounces cancel culture yet will straight up lie about the arguments you made in your debate. You, sir, have earned a new subscriber.
What’s ridiculous is Graham said “I was not prepared for the first flint debate”. Literally the last 30 years of his life has been dedicated to arguing for a lost civilisation, so how can he not have been prepared?! 😂😂 he’s written 3 books, done 100s of hours of podcasts and probably 500 talks on it. And he was still unprepared??
I mean thats what happen to charlatan when they debate expert which is the people that research and know the shit they talked about. Grham for the last 30 years have been peddle his crap to the public not expert. the old man is clearly didint have real proof and pulling stuff straight from thin air and call it fact. LOL
And don't forget, they had to reschedule their debate due to Flint's chemo! I haven't seen the JRE episode, but were the questions/subjects up for debate known by both parties ahead of time? Did Flint and Graham have a list of specifics they were to discuss on the podcast?
My mother has a PhD in microbiology she spent over 20 years research a single microorganism and was fascinated by it. The idea that any scientist would ever want to not discover something new is absolutely absurd and shows the growing disconnect between normal people and intellectuals.
You’re absolutely right! The scientific community love finding new things. And when we do, we share, celebrate and challenge it. These same people who come up with silly conspiracies would never actually put in the work to verify any of it, or join the field to find out for themselves. They just sling mud from their armchairs.
If you spent 20 years studying one thing along with publishing papers and books, and a new discovery was shown to completely uproot that, would you welcome it with open arms ? Scientists can be culty and defensive to old paradigms.
"the intellectuals" 😂 That is the problem with academia, people think because they have a degree, it makes them "intellectuals". A degree does not mean anything nowadays, you have absolutely incompetent and dumb people with masters degrees nowadays, anybody gets a degree nowadays but they then look at the world from a pedestal. This is why nobody respects you people anymore, and by you people I am not talking about all of academia but by the ones who think they are "intellectuals", nobody who refers to themself as an intellectual is an intellectual. Like these "experts on the environment" who can't identify any tree or insect around them.
Millionaires and billionaires, with the biggest shows on the planet, broadcast on the largest platforms, earning tens and hundreds of millions, talking about "the elites" and how they are being silenced and oppressed... Guess vampires don't see themselves in the mirror.
“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” ― Isaac Asimov
@@promark5317I don’t think there’s a single positive review of Joe’s most recent special!! He also “recycled” some jokes from other comedians (something he went after Mencia for)
@@AcappellaTidbits eh, I haven’t liked his material since my freshman year of high school…even the clip Dibble included as an olive branch was cringeworthy…but Rogan makes good money when he goes on tour telling jokes, which makes him (by definition) a successful comedian.
I don’t make a bunch of money teaching Earth Science (public state university in California) but I’m so glad I get the chance to teach science to students, and show them how to think critically about what they’re being told. I make sure they know how to detect pseudoscience when they are presented with it. It’s a contribution I’m honored to provide. I’ve been teaching since 2003 and have had close to 10,000 students over the years so far.
Thank you for everything you do! I'm majoring in environmental science and it disappoints me when people fall for pseudoscience, as if the world isn't fascinating on its own. I don't understand why people cling to these evident-less theories when scientific fields are constantly evolving and learning more about our world and its history. It's so much fun to read actual research papers and see how we discover new things all the time.
I think it is a good thing to make this video-open letter to Joe Rogan. But keep in mind that Joe won't change his ways. You're criticizing his business model. He knows who and what his audience likes. Uneducated people who like conspiracies and mysteries. This is the reality of today's society. I hope that you find other ways to communicate with people and try to educate them.
Hi flint, History teacher here. I'm amazed by the amount of effort that requires refutation, but the effortless of nonsense. I hope the energy you put in this absolute madness of cultural battle brings you and your colleagues the credits and justice deserved.
@@SoEinTyp Rogan was on a radio show talking about the Bondo Ape. An expert called in to explain to him the Bondo Ape is not real. Rogan immediately began shouting over her, questioning when she graduated, telling her to check more recent research and calling her stupid. Rogan typically keeps a calm demeanor but he really went off when discussing the Bondo Ape, which it turns out the expert was right about. They're just chimpanzees.
@@AsusSusu-o3x I can't remember the exact details if it was bigfoot or some alleged discovery of a different species of ape. He was way off base. Someone who studies primates called in to help him our with some info and he essentially went apeshit. A good sign that if he really wants to believe something then facts and logic and expertise will only anger and confuse him.
these guys forgot the golden rule of never allowing an actual expert on, prepared with actual academic materials, to present their case against the conspiracy crap and now they're very butthurt about the end result
16:23-18:22 Is this not like the definition of stochastic terrorism? "I'm not going to do this and I'm not saying someone should but I think someone should." The coward's way of inciting harassment and/or violence while trying to wash their hands of the potential consequences?
It amazes me that Graham has the audacity to accuse archeologists of not changing their minds when confronted with new evidence while he's the worst example of just that I've ever seen.
@@ksumrz Indeed when scientists change their mind it's because new evidence was discovered that was able to withstand scientific scrutiny. Grifters like Hancock on the other hand don't want their claims subject to scrutiny.
The problem is that Flint has the burden of truth, whereas Graham’s claims require no evidence. Flint’s position requires amazing amounts of knowledge that only an expert in the field could synthesize. Joe’s audience is more satisfied with the “what if” scenarios that Graham describes. It does not surprise me that they find one minor inaccuracy and use it as leverage to ignore everything else that was said and clearly cited. Such is the conspiracy theory movement.
I think it's fine for Hancock to present his ideas as long as he's honest about what they are: fantasies. The kind of thing you'd normally say after starting out with "Wouldn't it be cool if.....". But instead he's been using his fantastical stories to discredit normal, hardworking scientists while pretending there's actual evidence for his claims, and that is something I'm not okay with.
@@fleac-4712 Flint doesn’t have any burden of proof. Both have provided proof, Flint’s evidence is far superior and immense. It’s like pitting Muhammad Ali against a 6 year old.
@ I mean technically speaking neither had proof, they provided evidence. Flints thesis is something like this “Mainstream Archaeology can accurately explain most of our human history, and as new evidence presents itself, It usually fits nicely with our current understanding” This position requires lots of evidence Graham goes something like this “Its possible that we have missed something in our current understanding of human history because I have seen things that look like they don’t make sense” This is an opinion, its his truth, he doesnt have to provide evidence other than what stuff “looks like”. And when he does provide actual evidence, it’s easily debunked.
I’m surprised it’s not considered harassment to share contact information in a context like Dan Richards did, regardless of it being available on a public website
Someone should ask Graham why he didn't spend his Netflix money to go and look for a civilization in the sahara instead of just traveling around the world and talk about stuff he probably already talked about a million times in his books and podcast appearences. Like, if you want archeologists to take you seriously, then do archeology. You certainly have more money than most of them to do so, and you could even probably convince some rich weirdo to fund the whole operation (I think Rogan makes more than enough to give a helping hand). It is sooooo easy to just sit back a criticize everyone because they don't do exactly what you think they should be doing.
Flint, Joe is a believer in "what ifs" instead of "what is." He went deep in "Let's imagine" as his train of thought awhile back. He's lost in many ways. Keep up your good work!
I'm absolutely shocked and dismayed at what I've seen in this video. I watched Joe Rogan 6-8 years ago. I thought he had interesting guests, and he usually just let's his guests talk. But please don't misunderstand something, Flint. This was a popularity contest from the minute you stepped into that broadcast room with The Great Joe and Graham Hancock. And believe it or not, the first two times I saw Graham Hancock speak (again, years and years ago), I thought he had some interesting ideas. No data, just ideas. From what I've read on the internet, and in comment sections, I think the people who looked at this debate in good faith, with an open mind, and zero subjectivity where unanimous in the thrashing that Hancock took, and for that, we have you and solely you, and your archaeologist collleagues and peers to thank for that. ANYONE who saw that debate, I repeat, ANYONE who went into that JRE episode with an open-mind and no dog in the race had to come to the conclusion that you told nothing but facts and data, backed, cited, and sourced, and Graham came prepared with his conjecture and fantastical ideas. I know it must be hard to be treated so harshly but so many people who adore Joe Rogan, but just know that you won over anyone who was thinking critically that day. I wish that number was higher, and what this says about the state of the world right now is extremely, extremely discouraging. What a joke Joe Rogan has become. If you'd like to hear something about Joe Rogan and his artform, his comedy has become the laughing stock of the comedy world. He's a huge name because of his podcast, who would be a nobody in the world if he hadn't hit it big with his podcast. One of the worst stand-up comedians that have achieved any modicum of success; Joe Rogan.
So I love Graham Hancock's works. I've bought all of his books, watched almost every JRE with him on it. I greatly looked forward to the debate between Flint and Graham, and I immensely enjoyed it. I hadn't heard of Flint Dibble prior, but I've been a fan since, and I've been a fan of Milo Rossi since I initially found his videos on UA-cam. I find the circumstances and aftermath of the debate wildly disappointing. Graham seems like he's arguing from a point of hurt feelings and faith as opposed to concrete evidence and solid, cited, points of fact.
What makes me sad for Rogan is, how he dedicated his life to exposing martial artist frauds, but won't do it with science. He's had many frauds on his show, and repeats so many lies. He's still that guy who wants to believe in fraud
Love me some pseudo science "what ifs" but I love some actual "I went and dug this out of the ground and studied in a lab and then 50 people checked my home work for errors" more.
That's the funniest part to me. If all these pseudoscience peddlers dropped the bollocks and just did some fantasy world this could easily be some tolkien level worldbuilding. Especially bleeping Spirit Science with their toroidal earth, their universe is genuinely really interesting, with worldbuilding as deep as tolkien and ideas as out there as diskworld... But they keep insisting on trying to tell people its somehow true and I'm sorry jordan but THE EARTH IS NOT A DONUT DAMNIT!
All of the pseudo-scientists commit the same crime; they (willingly) ignore the Peer Review step of the scientific method. I've never been on your channel before, but I wish you all the best in your fight with these charlatans. This 'post-truth era' we live in is so sickening.
3 decades working in resource conservation, it still shocks me how pervasive and destructive science-denial has been. I don’t know how humanity can recover from the disinformation.
Ultimately the truth will and always does prevail for the vast majority. They just unfortunately need it to literally slap them right in the face. Something like climate change, they will deny until it is undeniable and their house is on fire every summer from forest fires etc... The liars have the advantage that it is much easier to spread lies and takes less time than it does to dispel them. But they are at the disadvantage that what they are saying isnt true. It is scary though, we need to find a better way to deprogram these people and get them out of this hyper defensive state where they attribute someone challenging their beliefs to someone challenging them personally.
JR is that guy at a college party going "dude... what if my red is different from your red...", except he's a wealthy middle-aged man with a huge amount of influence. He's stuck in that stoner mindset that relies solely on conspiracies and stories
Former big Rogan fan here... I feel pretty foolish for having been such a credulous tourist in your area of expertise. Thank you for exposing Mr Hancock.
I’m not an archaeologist myself, in fact that’s far from my area of expertise, but as somebody who aspires to have a career in academia someday all I can say is: Congratulations on searching for the facts and having the humility to admit your beliefs were wrong. Be weary of people like Hancock who tell you they have uncovered some hidden truths that are being censored by “mainstream science” while heaping in hefty amounts of profits from it. I tend to find that people who are drawn to guys like Joe Rogan are curious about being exposed to different ideas from a wide variety of topics, but bear in mind that guys like him are often more committed to profit than to factual accuracy.
@@WhenYouveGoneGuru exactly. not to mention the lack of materials found anywhere near the site. graham's thinking is so strange. what's more likely: it's a natural formation, or the only remnant of a highly advanced civ is a road leading to nowhere from nowhere that coincidentally looks like naturally formed rock.
I think he uses smart angle to shoot it to make it look like its a lone road, cuz the area which "bimini road" located is covered with tons beachstone. I think cherrypicking data is an understatement in graham method.
Excellent response. I’m sorry you’re going through this harassment. But I’m really impressed with your tenacity and courage to press forward with the truth and counter this BS. This type of actually truthful, factual, and scientific counter narrative needs to exist on UA-cam so the grifters and pseudoscientists don’t dominate. Looking forward to the debunk video!
I think what this whole thing proves is that the alternative history people pretend to want to have a conversation but its obvious they don’t the reason? Money. Almost all these guys uncharted x, bryan forerster, bright insight etc they all have tourism gigs. They make a ton of money off their fans who are convinced to never ever look at the other side of the coin
Exactly, their followers assume that they (the mystery grifters) have done all the research so they don't have to. And they just parrot what they've been told by them uncritically.
and wow the guy calling others to get students to fight you, using communist cultural revolution as a positive example, that is absolutely crazy. That is scary that Rogan invites a guest like that.
The idealization of the communist approach it was what really did it for me. "I'm not saying that's what I want to see happen. I'm saying its a time honored tradition." WTF time-line am I living in that a guy spewing this can get any traction at all.
I'm a neuroscience student. I don't know anything about archeology but I find it really fascinating and I really appreciate the light that you shed on grifters like Hancock. You and Miniminuteman are my go-to for quality science backed archaeological content. Thanks for all the work you do and just wanted to let you know you have my support!! Go Flint! Go science! Edit: great point about Joe just being a comedian. I think people forget that.
@@shmooveyea yes I do know that. I'm not making a comparison. Considering they've collaborated with each other, I think it's safe to say they're both on the same side.
@@randywoodard6198 I wish it would actually make a difference, seems like people don't want to understand, don't want to learn, don't want to know how things work
Any time Joe gets an intelligent guest on board, I watch. Its fun to see how experts succeed (or fail) to dial down their knowledge to the level of the interviewer and guests. Brian Cox is a great example of this. Graeme is a great storyteller, and his voice charms. Your debate with him was disappointing. The debate stopped him in his tracks and you even won Joe over on the day! You did a fantastic job showing your passion and intellect for archaeology and I genuinely think a large portion of the viewers will have dialled back their belief in Graemes stories, and your answer here was hilarious. I'll look forward to debate pt 2. I'm sure you will have pushed all the right buttons here 😂
I was exhausted just watching you repeatedly school Hancock, I can't imagine how exhausting it must have been in person. Thank you for your tenacity to veracity! ⚔️
The saddest part, I think, is that your appearance on Joe's show was a rare example of a debate done well on his show. You came very well prepared, everyone involved was very gentle for such a divisive topic, and your entire presentation contained so much information that Rogan was pretty hands-off during the entire affair. If anything, it was an excellent showcase that, with the rights guests, I guess his show can be exciting to listen to. So it's a shame that they decided to continue the debate without your involvement. Personally I do not considering this to be a form of "cancelling", but rather it shows that they're not willing to present the actual scientific facts and are more interested in talking about fantasies. There's nothing wrong with that, but they should clarify that they're just fantasies, and they should stop belittling the archeologists who do the actual science.
Good video man ♥ Shame people like more fantasy history than hard evidence history , because it is more "COOL" and reality of life is too "boring" Keep up the good fight 🤘
Thank you so much for posting this. I’ve always been incredulous at Hancock’s beliefs and claims but used to like Rogan, as I found him quite entertaining. I hadn’t seen this particular podcast, but had others with Hancock and was pretty disappointed with what was put forward. I’m now downright disgusted with Rogan and will be unsubscribing from his channel. This stuff is misleading, Misinformative, and harmful. I hope more people call out this bs. Thank you again!
See i wasn't convinced of your take, until you brought up the seed dispersion evidence. To which it bloody clicked, that "advanced societies" should of left evidence of monoculture a lot earlier around the globe. I thank you for this, and officially think Graham is a bulls**er.
Why do you think monoculture is the on out way to be advanced? Just because that’s what we have now? We can do a lot better than monocrop. Amazon is living proof you can propagate the right species but let them become a forest and then eat off of your food forest. Just because it doesn’t look like modern agriculture doesn’t mean it’s worse. In fact it’s more resilient.
@@dack4dust856 it doesn't need to be one source. The dibinator pointed out that at every core sample that was taken at different locations, the monoculture varient of the pollen from like wheat was found at the earliest same period and not earlier. So unless this "advanced civilisation" was strictly a fishing or hunter gathering society, they would of farmed too, and the pollen traces from their farmed variant of wheat should of been found across the globe.
@@DrumToTheBassWoop what really for me was how they have found sites, costal and submerged and that they have excavated. I also found it convincing that the archeologist only have so many resources and so they have to pick sites that have the most evidence. Doesn't mean there isn't something buried that hasn't been found but I don't think archeology is covering anything up. Still not sure about the pyramids though
@@drfeelgordo no, I'm sorry that's wrong. Because we got core samples going back nearly a million years from Antarctica. There should of been evidence of monoculture pollen in the atmosphere and then trapped. So unless this civilization was some sort of enlightened hunter gatherers, I doubt it existed. BUT... If the argument is about early formation of a social society existing, we got hundreds of thousands of years of evidence, from cave paintings, tool use and now recently a wooden pier found, meaning we were very good at building shit quite early on. But not to the scale of building massive megastructures, that's just bs. Our megastructures phase started in the bronze age, as proven by the pyramids, so the last 4-5 thousand years, not that long ago compared to 50,000 years ago.
Thank you for what you do Flint, I used to listen to people like Graham Hancock and was enraptured by the ideas he presented. Now, thanks to the inspiration of scientists like yourself, I’m an anthropology student and look forward to starting my career in the field working on real science with real evidence. Cheers Flint.
Please sue these people for defamation. LegalEagle? That said, if it’s any consolation Joe Rogan is actually so weak-minded that he is audience captured, that he can’t change his mind because if he does he’ll also lose his audience as well. It’s kind of pathetic.
Been watching JRE for years, always thought Graham is full of **** and Rogan wants this to be true despite knowing its mostly nonsense. Most people don't watch him for him, they watch for the way he interview the guests. Something that people like you cannot grasp is that Rogan doesn't want to be an idol, he is just a curious person that occasionally fails hard. Keep spouting nonsense of things you know nothing about, just like Rogan is doing with this.
@PurpleHighWatchtower Explain exactly how Joe is displaying this curious personality that you can see while he's surrounding himself with people who are only going to feed him anti-intellectual narratives. Not only does Joe clearly state at the beginning of this video that his mind is made regarding Flint, he's filled his head with nothing but Hancock, Dan, and Corsetti. Since when did curious show itself by only inviting guests that represent the anti-intellectual narratives?
@@PurpleHighWatchtower we all get that. The issue is Joe platforms them and offers no meaningful pushback to all the liars, hacks, and grifters he has on. He knows what he's doing and he sold out years ago.
Good on you, Flint. Now, finish up that book so you can go back on Joe Rogan and defend your honour and that of archaeology! No debate this time, just straight facts.
Joe Rogan could not accept that Hancock was wrong. He had him on the podcast for more than a decade. If he had to, then he should also accept that fact that he wasted time on Hancock and he in turn fooled him. Something something sunk cost fallacy.
Joe pretends to have an open mind but when anything challenges what he wants to be true he just dismisses it or finds someone to go on the pod that reinforces his viewpoint. e.g. the climate change denialist author recently, or the recent Dedunking et al pod
As a fan of JRE myself, Im routing for you Flint. Graham is a very fun person to listen to but is clearly not well educated or sensible with what he believes. There is certainly a middle ground betweem both of your conclusions that might be worth looking into. I really enjoyed the episode with your debate and hope Joe invites you back.
As a fellow scientist, I just want to say, I hope that someday I can be this kind of badass. The fight against misinformation is absolutely fatiguing, and I'll admit, I had given up. You give me hope that maybe I can rejoin the fight. Thank you bruv, keep digging.
I have been a fan of Hancock for awhile and I saw your interview/debate with Hancock on the Rogan show. I honestly found your arguments solid and you provided data for your arguments, which is important. It gave me something to think about regarding Hancock and his ideas. I am really disappointed at Rogan for not inviting you back after in order to defend what was said about you by Hancock and others on his show. I'm also tired of those people outside of academia always claiming some conspiracy about the system against their ideas, when their ideas are challenged. Yes academia, governments and organizations being complex human systems certainly have their issues, but you cannot fix these issues by going to crazy extremes on the other end.
Huge fan of yours and actual field archaeologist into lithics. I cannot begin to thank you for going on JRE to tell the truth. I don’t think JRE and his fanboys are ever going to get it. At this point, it probably doesn’t matter if they ever do. That will never change my career trajectory or my outlook- I WILL STILL BE AN ARCHAEOLOGIST. God bless from Guam🇬🇺
This hate for actual intellectuals comes from decades of letting people believe that their ignorance is just as good as your knowledge… The whole “I’m allowed to have an opinion” should be thrown straight to the trash when it comes from someone that is almost entirely uninformed about the subject they choose to have an opinion on… Just because an opinion exists doesn’t mean it is worthy of respect or even consideration, and it’s high time people were reminded of that…
@@danielfallu5302he also used to say that he disagreed with up to 70 percent of what Hancock was pushing. Even dismissing some of it as BS and woo. But then when hancock shows him a little love he acts like a 16 year old high school newspaper reporter who won a contest and gets to interview Taylor swift.
@@jlspracher because if you go low, the other side wins. If you have Rogan in a corner, with straight fact, it’s very difficult to argue with that. When you go low, you get clipped up and all that work goes to waste. Your channel turns into an echo chamber
Great work Flint. Summed up your own points well. Hopefully Joe watches this and between his “who does this guy think he is” rage looks inwardly and sees what a prick he’s been to you.
Flint, thank you for debating Graham and finally showing some true archeology on JRE. You and Milo opened my eyes after I began to go into this pseudoarcheology rabbit hole. I hope you will deal with the internet trolls that are attacking you. You attacked their idols, so they are prepared to be really vicious.
At least Special Jimmy acknowledges that cancer exists and is not part of a Big Pharma conspiracy. I would like to say that I am joking, but with him you never know.
@@Docrock-z9k _"At least Special Jimmy acknowledges that cancer exists and is not part of a Big Pharma conspiracy"_ Just give him time, I'm sure he's going to.
Thanks all for the support and for sharing real archaeology far and wide. I appreciate it big time.
You're doing important work man 👍
Thank you for sharing this video with us!!!!
Oh the irony that the “new media,” Rogan, is considered more reliable than the MSM. He’s even worse!!
Continue speaking truth to the new power Flint!
There are people actually claiming that your reputation has been ruined because of the debate. I'm of the opinion that it will be a longtime before you have to buy your own beer at an archaeology conference.
Real archeology is whatever you make up with your buddies...
"This is not a call to action." Jesus Christ, that's below the belt.
Hayyyy, will you two ever get the chance to meet up or collab on a video?
Lol
Holy shit, that's nuts. Just because you say "this is not a call to action," doesn't mean it isn't a call to action. These people are fucking insane.
And for that call to action to be to contact my students is way below the belt
@@ullrich it's how they work. Same with trump, he said 2025 wasn't the plan, while appointing the very people behind it and now post election, they're admitting it.
"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." - Asimov
That quote becomes more and more relevant on a daily basis as of late.
@@Clem.H.Fandango United States isn't the whole world. People from all over the world watch Joe Rogan.
It's actually really sad your nation prides itself on its own ignorance and tries to push that as the mentality of the "common man."
There is a great video by the author Kurt Andersen that explains how The Untied States became the irrational, fake-news, alternative-truth, failed nation that we now see in it's full, gruesome glory.
ua-cam.com/video/Id4WZCG0e7c/v-deo.html
@@RYPA190 Your point? Are you saying what Asimov said 50 or 60 years ago now applies globally and that willfully ignorant morons are inside every border?
Especially the past 4 yrs. I mean look at our MSM “News”. It’s a Propaganda machine for the Democratic Party, AKA the most willfully ignorant hypocrites on Earth.
“Donald Trump is a Russian spy”
“Joes sharp as a tack,never been better”
“Donald Trump is a threat to democracy, listen to us and vote for the woman who recieved the nomination via coup on the sitting president, you know, to save democracy.”🙄
We must send all our money to Ukraine to save the world” Who cares if billions and billions of the hundreds of billions we have sent them have gone missing? WHO cares if they really do have battalions of Neo Nazis? WHO cares they’ve been the most corrupt country in Europe for yrs,their people need this money more than our own people. We’ll take care of our own after we take care of the Ukrainians, and start WW3 in the process, oh wait we also have to take care of millions of illegal aliens too, then nnnn we’ll worry about Americans. Femas outta $$??? So what? Send millions to Lebanon, then we’ll worry about FEMA!
Luckily, all the BS is ending. Nobody with half a brain listens to these sociopaths anymore, like Joy Behar….”Joe Rogan believes in dragons, I triple fact checked it”….These old hags are insane. How about Joy Reid? “Donald Trump Is never leaving the White House now” This is allll white womens fault! Oh, that was the other Kook,Sonny Hostin. If you get your news from these people….Stop. They don’t even understand how to be real people!! They can’t for the life of them figure out why Trump ran the table. They think they have to create their own Joe Rogan to fight back. They had their own Rogan..His name was Joe Rogan. But they went sooooo far left with absolutely asinine policy that they lost him. He was a Bernie Bro. As was i in ‘15-16. Then the DNC fixed the primaries for Hillary. Sickening sickening people.
You didn’t just admit that you didn’t know the exact numbers, but you gave an approximation AND provided a source that would expound on the topic in ways you could not. That’s, quite literally, the opposite of lying.
Graham did this same thing with the miss speaking on Gunung Padang. He said that is was radio carbon dated to 20,000 years trying to pass that off as a culture layer when it was not a cultural layer but just a layer of dirt from a certain depth (that obviously can be carbon dated)
At least Flint didn’t miss speak on a multi-million dollar Netflix series.
that went over every Graham supporter’s head, I guess.
Have you read Grahams books? If you want to compare Miss-speaking’s you should read one of those mind benders.
He literally speaks about Atlantis like it’s already been discovered and insists there were ancient civilizations on Mars.
Yeah on one hand we have that statement by Dibble where he cites who has studied this and how to get the information, on the other Graham has pictures of rocks that faintly look like a recognizable thing, of course lacking any other archeological data like food remnants the products of this widespread metallurgy etc.
Only after Joe pushed back on his original "confidently wrong" answer, though.
I'm just keepin' it real here.
@@AZ-kr6ffeven after the pushback I don't think that dibble's followup meets the full definition of lie. Which is the point here.
I'm sure that dibble would be happy to do a solo follow up like Hancock did and go thru all of the alleged problematic stuff point by point with Rogan.
@@AZ-kr6ff Was it wrong tho? At the very least, giving a rough estimate to the best of ones knowledge before referring to someone more informed on the matter is a way of "lying" we can only dream of seeing from mr Graham.
And sorry, but this is too funny.
Joe: How long does the Taylor Swift concert last?
Flint: O, hours, definitively hours.
Joe: No, really. How many hours exactly?
Flint: Well, im not a swifty so i don't know exactly, I have a friend that is though, her name is Google, we could ask her...
Joe: Nooo,! Begone! You lied!!
Hancock wasnt prepared ... after a lifetime of presenting on his own stuff? Someone has been spending too much time straw manning archaeologists and not enough time reading them.
Funny how the standard is that an archaeologist can never misspeak, but Hancock can string them back to back, for hours on end, and it's never questioned.
@@chucklearnslithics3751 yup he’s got hundreds of provable lies. And yet flint makes one error about the ship wrecks, which he then corrected himself, and they jump on him calling a liar. And they all shut down discussion.
@@chucklearnslithics3751 exactly.. I also think Hancock is so accustomed to the sub-high school level of discussion he is able to get away with, due to poor publicity and lack of public awareness for archaeology. Handcock has only two modes;
1. Befuddled babbling about square rocks and pyramid alignment
2. Whining about how silenced and cancelled he is with only his own Netflix show, multiple appearances on THE biggest podcast ever, & a bunch of actual published physical books.
He has nothing to contribute but bullshit and whining, he's an embarrassment and a blight on public information. He's the Andrew Wakefield of archaeology
“How much of the Sahara has been excavated” the whole desert? Gram is a fool
What a coward, "I am not advocating anything, but btw if you want you can make his live a living hell" what a pathetic coward
He's a piece of shit and doesn't deserve to feel safe himself.
imagine you leave a pile of money and a gun on a table and tell a hitman you dont like this peron and then just leave the room empty handed. you dont get to act shocked when the hitman fails and then the target calls you out and brings all the evidence against you. the instructions were very clear.
every single alt history community is filled with grownup man acting like an edgy child. cmon, you want to challenge the status quo with no evidence, then when real expert who know what real archeology all about, started corrected and critisize in good faith they come arround and start crying about cancell culture. All bark and no bite, No substance whatsoever.
people like jimmy corsettri and dan need to grow up and be a real men. Not a slimy, manipulative, paranoid, and insuferable manchild. I think they all loss their pacifier, thats why they cry all the time.
@@Behrking To paraphrase: "Will no one rid me of this turbulent archaeologist?"
they all bark and no bite, with zero substrance whatsoever. A coward indeed
Brought here by MiniMinuteMan. Glad I finally got to see your side as a layman. I subscribed
@@thomaslee6894 i really like that guy
I came from the king of Google debunkers as well
@@SadBoysCollectiveCirca96 lol I can see your previous troll comments my guy haha.
Same!
Do yourself a favor and watch the Bridges episode with both Flint and MiniMin
"played fast and loose with the truth"
Bro... He brought a power point with over 200 slides of peer reviewed science. That is neither fast nor loose.
Also, to quote a very famous fictional archaeologist: you want truth, philosophy is down the hall. Archaeology deals in facts.
I bring 200 hundred slides pointing to different pieces of evidences from different studies and then organize it in a particular order to be most effective for my ends. My ability to construct a powerful narrative of facts does not actually bring any judgement on the correctness of my presentation, just that I have a large arsenal of weapons to throw at my opponent. These are not things they will be able to respond to at large. They may be ready for some points of evidence, but I will continue to move on until I find a weak point with my prepared fact deck.
It's more of a game than a demonstration of knowledge. The sleight of hand is happening with the organization of facts to say something about anything (thus they smuggle in truth and other unfounded conclusions).
Well Hancock has many more thousands of slides but atleast Dibble has actual physical archaeological evidence to corroborate many of his slides.
Hancock has the ole “well I’m just telling you what someone else said” circumstantial evidence to backup everything
@@soccerplayer922 Do you have any idea how to debate? Jfc my 12 year old knows this is dumb .
@@soccerplayer922 that's called using evidence for an argument... if you think his evidence is wrong and his argument invalidated, then fact check him. you're criticizing an expert for having knowledge against laymen arguing over his own field of expertise. if you're unprepared to grapple with the evidence he brings up, you shouldn't be having that argument.
Rogan knows Hancock draws an audience. He wants to keep it going rather than changing stance.
It's funny how Joe denounces cancel culture yet will straight up lie about the arguments you made in your debate. You, sir, have earned a new subscriber.
What’s ridiculous is Graham said “I was not prepared for the first flint debate”. Literally the last 30 years of his life has been dedicated to arguing for a lost civilisation, so how can he not have been prepared?! 😂😂 he’s written 3 books, done 100s of hours of podcasts and probably 500 talks on it. And he was still unprepared??
I mean thats what happen to charlatan when they debate expert which is the people that research and know the shit they talked about. Grham for the last 30 years have been peddle his crap to the public not expert. the old man is clearly didint have real proof and pulling stuff straight from thin air and call it fact. LOL
And don't forget, they had to reschedule their debate due to Flint's chemo!
I haven't seen the JRE episode, but were the questions/subjects up for debate known by both parties ahead of time? Did Flint and Graham have a list of specifics they were to discuss on the podcast?
@@rufioswitch2132 he was not prepared to debate a guy who knows what he is talking about. That was his problem
"I was unprepared to discuss my area of expertise"
@rufioswitch2132 maybe he meant that he hadn't done any scientific research to prepare 😅
My mother has a PhD in microbiology she spent over 20 years research a single microorganism and was fascinated by it. The idea that any scientist would ever want to not discover something new is absolutely absurd and shows the growing disconnect between normal people and intellectuals.
@@robertturni2845 I'm very curious which organism managed to hold her attention so long
20 years just for one??? what a waste!
You’re absolutely right! The scientific community love finding new things. And when we do, we share, celebrate and challenge it. These same people who come up with silly conspiracies would never actually put in the work to verify any of it, or join the field to find out for themselves. They just sling mud from their armchairs.
If you spent 20 years studying one thing along with publishing papers and books, and a new discovery was shown to completely uproot that, would you welcome it with open arms ? Scientists can be culty and defensive to old paradigms.
"the intellectuals" 😂 That is the problem with academia, people think because they have a degree, it makes them "intellectuals". A degree does not mean anything nowadays, you have absolutely incompetent and dumb people with masters degrees nowadays, anybody gets a degree nowadays but they then look at the world from a pedestal. This is why nobody respects you people anymore, and by you people I am not talking about all of academia but by the ones who think they are "intellectuals", nobody who refers to themself as an intellectual is an intellectual. Like these "experts on the environment" who can't identify any tree or insect around them.
Millionaires and billionaires, with the biggest shows on the planet, broadcast on the largest platforms, earning tens and hundreds of millions, talking about "the elites" and how they are being silenced and oppressed...
Guess vampires don't see themselves in the mirror.
Exactly very mienkonf.
The more they can shove animosity at a hypothetical Other, the more accepting they can dodge
@@andreisopon4615 Go figure! And more depressing is the fact that plenty of people fail to see through it!!
@@pranaysyour struggle?
Very well said !
“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”
― Isaac Asimov
Exactly. But I feel like the internet made this 10x worse today than it was in Asimov’s day. And unfortunately it’s not just the US.
"..let's be honest Joe: youre a comedian..."
Proof that Flint is out here peddling misinformation. /jk
😂 true… Joe’s “comedy” special is so cringy 😬
Watch BeigeFrequency's review of Toe Jogan's latest special. It's absolutely brutal lol.
@@promark5317I don’t think there’s a single positive review of Joe’s most recent special!! He also “recycled” some jokes from other comedians (something he went after Mencia for)
That's not true, Joe is funny as heck. It's just unintentional comedy. You don't laugh at his jokes, you laugh at him.
@@AcappellaTidbits eh, I haven’t liked his material since my freshman year of high school…even the clip Dibble included as an olive branch was cringeworthy…but Rogan makes good money when he goes on tour telling jokes, which makes him (by definition) a successful comedian.
I don’t make a bunch of money teaching Earth Science (public state university in California) but I’m so glad I get the chance to teach science to students, and show them how to think critically about what they’re being told. I make sure they know how to detect pseudoscience when they are presented with it. It’s a contribution I’m honored to provide. I’ve been teaching since 2003 and have had close to 10,000 students over the years so far.
Thank you for your service.
Great! Debunking pseudoscience should be part of every science course.
And science and critical thinking should be part of every school curriculum.
Thank you for everything you do! I'm majoring in environmental science and it disappoints me when people fall for pseudoscience, as if the world isn't fascinating on its own. I don't understand why people cling to these evident-less theories when scientific fields are constantly evolving and learning more about our world and its history. It's so much fun to read actual research papers and see how we discover new things all the time.
@@genuineappeal3458 go away troll
💪💪💪
I think it is a good thing to make this video-open letter to Joe Rogan. But keep in mind that Joe won't change his ways. You're criticizing his business model. He knows who and what his audience likes. Uneducated people who like conspiracies and mysteries. This is the reality of today's society. I hope that you find other ways to communicate with people and try to educate them.
JR will probably copyright strike the video. He's notorious for doing that over even a few seconds while also complaining when someone does it to him
@@anniealexander9911 he can try, but it’s clearly fair use, so i doubt it will stick. But that isn’t surprising he would stoop so low lol
It’s all about the money with Joe
This. Its the Fox playbook.
@@georgeflowers3730 Bingo! It's not science, it's ENTERTAINMENT
Hi flint, History teacher here. I'm amazed by the amount of effort that requires refutation, but the effortless of nonsense. I hope the energy you put in this absolute madness of cultural battle brings you and your colleagues the credits and justice deserved.
Brandolinis law in full view.
If anyone has heard of the "bondo ape" incident involving Rogan it gives some insight into why he wont do the courtesy of equal time with dibble.
@@Docrock-z9k i havent heard of that. was does it explain?
@@SoEinTyp Rogan was on a radio show talking about the Bondo Ape. An expert called in to explain to him the Bondo Ape is not real. Rogan immediately began shouting over her, questioning when she graduated, telling her to check more recent research and calling her stupid. Rogan typically keeps a calm demeanor but he really went off when discussing the Bondo Ape, which it turns out the expert was right about. They're just chimpanzees.
@@SoEinTyp look up Joe Rogan Bondo Ape Primatologist - he basically went full asshole over bigfoot to a PhD lady over phone on some podcast, lmao
@@SoEinTyp watch?v=__CvmS6uw7E
@@AsusSusu-o3x I can't remember the exact details if it was bigfoot or some alleged discovery of a different species of ape. He was way off base. Someone who studies primates called in to help him our with some info and he essentially went apeshit. A good sign that if he really wants to believe something then facts and logic and expertise will only anger and confuse him.
Hats off to Flint for this excellent response🎉
these guys forgot the golden rule of never allowing an actual expert on, prepared with actual academic materials, to present their case against the conspiracy crap
and now they're very butthurt about the end result
2:12 I'm a man who uses reading glasses, I see no reason to mock someone over their use of glasses.
Flint also wears glasses... it was a nervous tic and stalling tactic of Graham's he even removed and put on the same pair on occasion.
Bad jokes don't make accusations of slander or calls to unalive people go away.
stop being so sensitive on the internet. grow up.
@@danielfallu5302 jesus I just watched it and you're right
@surfingbilly9654 it's indicative of the low brow discussion of what once was a serious anthropological discussion.
16:23-18:22 Is this not like the definition of stochastic terrorism? "I'm not going to do this and I'm not saying someone should but I think someone should."
The coward's way of inciting harassment and/or violence while trying to wash their hands of the potential consequences?
Pretty sure you're correct.
Stochastic terrorism😂😂😂😂😂
@@AlexBerezovskyJr Yes that is a term that exists. What of it?
I'm going to go watch Joe, this is lame
@@sanguinusedisappointing, but fair enough mate
I really want to make an archaeology joke, but I’m afraid I’d have to dig deeper into the subject.
ba-dum-tsss 🥁
It amazes me that Graham has the audacity to accuse archeologists of not changing their minds when confronted with new evidence while he's the worst example of just that I've ever seen.
@@ksumrz Indeed when scientists change their mind it's because new evidence was discovered that was able to withstand scientific scrutiny. Grifters like Hancock on the other hand don't want their claims subject to scrutiny.
The problem is that Flint has the burden of truth, whereas Graham’s claims require no evidence. Flint’s position requires amazing amounts of knowledge that only an expert in the field could synthesize. Joe’s audience is more satisfied with the “what if” scenarios that Graham describes.
It does not surprise me that they find one minor inaccuracy and use it as leverage to ignore everything else that was said and clearly cited. Such is the conspiracy theory movement.
I think it's fine for Hancock to present his ideas as long as he's honest about what they are: fantasies. The kind of thing you'd normally say after starting out with "Wouldn't it be cool if.....". But instead he's been using his fantastical stories to discredit normal, hardworking scientists while pretending there's actual evidence for his claims, and that is something I'm not okay with.
It's easier to tear something down just to build something up. Thus the con man's game is easier than the scientists or the person with facts.
@@fleac-4712 Flint doesn’t have any burden of proof. Both have provided proof, Flint’s evidence is far superior and immense. It’s like pitting Muhammad Ali against a 6 year old.
@ I mean technically speaking neither had proof, they provided evidence. Flints thesis is something like this “Mainstream Archaeology can accurately explain most of our human history, and as new evidence presents itself, It usually fits nicely with our current understanding”
This position requires lots of evidence
Graham goes something like this
“Its possible that we have missed something in our current understanding of human history because I have seen things that look like they don’t make sense”
This is an opinion, its his truth, he doesnt have to provide evidence other than what stuff “looks like”. And when he does provide actual evidence, it’s easily debunked.
Graham wants these ancient sites to be explored further, allowing more evidence to be explored
I’m surprised it’s not considered harassment to share contact information in a context like Dan Richards did, regardless of it being available on a public website
Insighting harassment at the least.
Someone should ask Graham why he didn't spend his Netflix money to go and look for a civilization in the sahara instead of just traveling around the world and talk about stuff he probably already talked about a million times in his books and podcast appearences.
Like, if you want archeologists to take you seriously, then do archeology. You certainly have more money than most of them to do so, and you could even probably convince some rich weirdo to fund the whole operation (I think Rogan makes more than enough to give a helping hand).
It is sooooo easy to just sit back a criticize everyone because they don't do exactly what you think they should be doing.
I agree. He could sponsor a dig or a fellowship or 😱😱could have gone back to uni and got an archaeology degree thirty years ago.
thats a good comment
"yeah but have they excavated the entire Sahara????"
Agreed 💯
Musk would probably fund it, as long as it got his name on it
Just wanted to share that im here because of miniminuteman sharing ur video on a community post 👍
@@cheeseshit999 same bro
Me too. Subscribing.
That's what brought me here as well. Making a longer than strictly necessary reply for the algorithm boost.
Milo sent me
Same!
Flint, Joe is a believer in "what ifs" instead of "what is."
He went deep in "Let's imagine" as his train of thought awhile back. He's lost in many ways.
Keep up your good work!
And which creates more innovation?
He could have said he didn’t agree with you and that would have been fine. To say you intentionally lied is slander and despicable.
Ego is the reason we will never have answers to anything.
This was amazing, thank you.
It was really disappointing how Joe Rogan dismissed him PUBLICLY after such a good debate.
I'm absolutely shocked and dismayed at what I've seen in this video. I watched Joe Rogan 6-8 years ago. I thought he had interesting guests, and he usually just let's his guests talk. But please don't misunderstand something, Flint. This was a popularity contest from the minute you stepped into that broadcast room with The Great Joe and Graham Hancock. And believe it or not, the first two times I saw Graham Hancock speak (again, years and years ago), I thought he had some interesting ideas. No data, just ideas.
From what I've read on the internet, and in comment sections, I think the people who looked at this debate in good faith, with an open mind, and zero subjectivity where unanimous in the thrashing that Hancock took, and for that, we have you and solely you, and your archaeologist collleagues and peers to thank for that. ANYONE who saw that debate, I repeat, ANYONE who went into that JRE episode with an open-mind and no dog in the race had to come to the conclusion that you told nothing but facts and data, backed, cited, and sourced, and Graham came prepared with his conjecture and fantastical ideas.
I know it must be hard to be treated so harshly but so many people who adore Joe Rogan, but just know that you won over anyone who was thinking critically that day. I wish that number was higher, and what this says about the state of the world right now is extremely, extremely discouraging. What a joke Joe Rogan has become. If you'd like to hear something about Joe Rogan and his artform, his comedy has become the laughing stock of the comedy world. He's a huge name because of his podcast, who would be a nobody in the world if he hadn't hit it big with his podcast. One of the worst stand-up comedians that have achieved any modicum of success; Joe Rogan.
So I love Graham Hancock's works. I've bought all of his books, watched almost every JRE with him on it.
I greatly looked forward to the debate between Flint and Graham, and I immensely enjoyed it.
I hadn't heard of Flint Dibble prior, but I've been a fan since, and I've been a fan of Milo Rossi since I initially found his videos on UA-cam.
I find the circumstances and aftermath of the debate wildly disappointing. Graham seems like he's arguing from a point of hurt feelings and faith as opposed to concrete evidence and solid, cited, points of fact.
@@j.james.s.2412 Hancock is a pathological narcissist
@@calebmahoney2448 As far as I'm aware, Flint said the sources typically used are racist in origin and ideas, not that Graham is in fact racist
Im sorry but GH is a con artist. I have watched and read many of his works too but he is full of bs. He gets his money by lieing on this topic.
@@Lip836completely agree! In every aspect. He’s peddling BS, and is full of it. He’s a dangerous individual.
Joe absolutely has the “appearance of an open mind”. That’s basically his whole personality.
yes open to whoever has the more sensational/edgy theory
ua-cam.com/video/DdfvYcLhgbI/v-deo.html
One of those "so open your brains fall out" types that Sagan warned us of.
Open and empty.
Yes, if you mean his grift.
What makes me sad for Rogan is, how he dedicated his life to exposing martial artist frauds, but won't do it with science.
He's had many frauds on his show, and repeats so many lies. He's still that guy who wants to believe in fraud
He’s just a bit simple, too many blows to the head.
It was never going to work, Flint. You brought facts to JRE.
Love me some pseudo science "what ifs" but I love some actual "I went and dug this out of the ground and studied in a lab and then 50 people checked my home work for errors" more.
That's the funniest part to me. If all these pseudoscience peddlers dropped the bollocks and just did some fantasy world this could easily be some tolkien level worldbuilding. Especially bleeping Spirit Science with their toroidal earth, their universe is genuinely really interesting, with worldbuilding as deep as tolkien and ideas as out there as diskworld... But they keep insisting on trying to tell people its somehow true and I'm sorry jordan but THE EARTH IS NOT A DONUT DAMNIT!
All of the pseudo-scientists commit the same crime; they (willingly) ignore the Peer Review step of the scientific method.
I've never been on your channel before, but I wish you all the best in your fight with these charlatans. This 'post-truth era' we live in is so sickening.
They ignore almost every step in the scientific method.
Love your work Flint 👍
“I was not prepared for the first flint debate” Your entire life and career has been preparing for this, Graham.
3 decades working in resource conservation, it still shocks me how pervasive and destructive science-denial has been. I don’t know how humanity can recover from the disinformation.
Ultimately the truth will and always does prevail for the vast majority. They just unfortunately need it to literally slap them right in the face. Something like climate change, they will deny until it is undeniable and their house is on fire every summer from forest fires etc... The liars have the advantage that it is much easier to spread lies and takes less time than it does to dispel them. But they are at the disadvantage that what they are saying isnt true. It is scary though, we need to find a better way to deprogram these people and get them out of this hyper defensive state where they attribute someone challenging their beliefs to someone challenging them personally.
Joe is all about Bro-Science, that's the extent of his abilities...
JR is that guy at a college party going "dude... what if my red is different from your red...", except he's a wealthy middle-aged man with a huge amount of influence. He's stuck in that stoner mindset that relies solely on conspiracies and stories
I can't know the guy's mind, but I suspect he's capable of more than that, but still managed to echo chamber himself. Not sure which is worse 🤷🏻♂️
Former big Rogan fan here...
I feel pretty foolish for having been such a credulous tourist in your area of expertise.
Thank you for exposing Mr Hancock.
well said 👏
I’m not an archaeologist myself, in fact that’s far from my area of expertise, but as somebody who aspires to have a career in academia someday all I can say is: Congratulations on searching for the facts and having the humility to admit your beliefs were wrong. Be weary of people like Hancock who tell you they have uncovered some hidden truths that are being censored by “mainstream science” while heaping in hefty amounts of profits from it. I tend to find that people who are drawn to guys like Joe Rogan are curious about being exposed to different ideas from a wide variety of topics, but bear in mind that guys like him are often more committed to profit than to factual accuracy.
Same, I liked Rogan initially, but I’m completely disappointed and even disgusted with him now.
Commenting to raise awareness. Hopefully this blows up and everyone sees it!
Same, I hope many people see this and realise what complete BS Hancock and Rogan are peddling.
the contrast between your evidence and graham displaying those blurry photos had me dying
Were those photos taken at the "Bimini Road"? Because Geologists unanimously agree it's a natural formation.
@@WhenYouveGoneGuru exactly. not to mention the lack of materials found anywhere near the site. graham's thinking is so strange. what's more likely: it's a natural formation, or the only remnant of a highly advanced civ is a road leading to nowhere from nowhere that coincidentally looks like naturally formed rock.
I think he uses smart angle to shoot it to make it look like its a lone road, cuz the area which "bimini road" located is covered with tons beachstone. I think cherrypicking data is an understatement in graham method.
Hot DAMN!
My man, please don’t ever stop.
You’ve got fire and integrity.
I’m glad to know you’re out there. You are a light.
Thank you for being you.
Excellent response. I’m sorry you’re going through this harassment. But I’m really impressed with your tenacity and courage to press forward with the truth and counter this BS. This type of actually truthful, factual, and scientific counter narrative needs to exist on UA-cam so the grifters and pseudoscientists don’t dominate. Looking forward to the debunk video!
Some people are so open minded they're brains fall out.
...so open-minded they let all the BS in.
Believing any crackpot conspiracy with no evidence at all just because it's cool is not open mindedness.
I think what this whole thing proves is that the alternative history people pretend to want to have a conversation but its obvious they don’t the reason? Money. Almost all these guys uncharted x, bryan forerster, bright insight etc they all have tourism gigs. They make a ton of money off their fans who are convinced to never ever look at the other side of the coin
Exactly, their followers assume that they (the mystery grifters) have done all the research so they don't have to. And they just parrot what they've been told by them uncritically.
Milo sent me. Thank you for doing what you do!
Same
Your father raised a superb archeologist! Thank you.
and wow the guy calling others to get students to fight you, using communist cultural revolution as a positive example, that is absolutely crazy. That is scary that Rogan invites a guest like that.
Yup, and Hancock endorses a guy like that.
wait , that dude was at rogan's too??
why did he green screen this?
It looks like one of those AI backgrounds in zoom
For privacy of his home?? Not that hard to think of a reason
I assumed his place was a total dump Lol
The idealization of the communist approach it was what really did it for me. "I'm not saying that's what I want to see happen. I'm saying its a time honored tradition." WTF time-line am I living in that a guy spewing this can get any traction at all.
Don't forget that he's not only endorsed by Hancock but also Rogan.
Honestly the debate really dropped the facade on Rogans "experts" for me nothing graham says or does is scientific
He’s a complete nut job and only got his series on Netflix because his son is an executive or producer there. He’s full of complete BS.
I'm a neuroscience student. I don't know anything about archeology but I find it really fascinating and I really appreciate the light that you shed on grifters like Hancock. You and Miniminuteman are my go-to for quality science backed archaeological content. Thanks for all the work you do and just wanted to let you know you have my support!! Go Flint! Go science!
Edit: great point about Joe just being a comedian. I think people forget that.
He's barely a comedian. He's the Fear Factor guy who started a podcast right as the podcast boom kicked off.
You know this guy is a Phd and prof right? miniminute is an undergrad... Tough to compare
@@shmooveyea yes I do know that. I'm not making a comparison. Considering they've collaborated with each other, I think it's safe to say they're both on the same side.
Thanks for fighting against pseudo science. Real scientific researchers don't have time or the will to fight the amount of pure bs on the Internet.
27 missed call from Flint Dibble
Great work, speaking truth to stupidity.
@@randywoodard6198 I wish it would actually make a difference, seems like people don't want to understand, don't want to learn, don't want to know how things work
Any time Joe gets an intelligent guest on board, I watch. Its fun to see how experts succeed (or fail) to dial down their knowledge to the level of the interviewer and guests. Brian Cox is a great example of this.
Graeme is a great storyteller, and his voice charms. Your debate with him was disappointing. The debate stopped him in his tracks and you even won Joe over on the day! You did a fantastic job showing your passion and intellect for archaeology and I genuinely think a large portion of the viewers will have dialled back their belief in Graemes stories, and your answer here was hilarious.
I'll look forward to debate pt 2. I'm sure you will have pushed all the right buttons here 😂
I was exhausted just watching you repeatedly school Hancock, I can't imagine how exhausting it must have been in person. Thank you for your tenacity to veracity! ⚔️
Great job Flint. I’m a Patreon subscriber. Hope at least a few more people sub from this. You’ve earned the cash, not Graham and Corsetti et al.
The saddest part, I think, is that your appearance on Joe's show was a rare example of a debate done well on his show. You came very well prepared, everyone involved was very gentle for such a divisive topic, and your entire presentation contained so much information that Rogan was pretty hands-off during the entire affair. If anything, it was an excellent showcase that, with the rights guests, I guess his show can be exciting to listen to. So it's a shame that they decided to continue the debate without your involvement. Personally I do not considering this to be a form of "cancelling", but rather it shows that they're not willing to present the actual scientific facts and are more interested in talking about fantasies. There's nothing wrong with that, but they should clarify that they're just fantasies, and they should stop belittling the archeologists who do the actual science.
Good video man ♥
Shame people like more fantasy history than hard evidence history , because it is more "COOL" and reality of life is too "boring"
Keep up the good fight 🤘
Thank you Flint! Your appearance on Rogan pulled me away from the "alternate history" content.
Thank you so much for posting this.
I’ve always been incredulous at Hancock’s beliefs and claims but used to like Rogan, as I found him quite entertaining. I hadn’t seen this particular podcast, but had others with Hancock and was pretty disappointed with what was put forward.
I’m now downright disgusted with Rogan and will be unsubscribing from his channel.
This stuff is misleading, Misinformative, and harmful.
I hope more people call out this bs.
Thank you again!
Go Flint! Tell those money hungry fools!
See i wasn't convinced of your take, until you brought up the seed dispersion evidence. To which it bloody clicked, that "advanced societies" should of left evidence of monoculture a lot earlier around the globe. I thank you for this, and officially think Graham is a bulls**er.
Why do you think monoculture is the on out way to be advanced? Just because that’s what we have now?
We can do a lot better than monocrop. Amazon is living proof you can propagate the right species but let them become a forest and then eat off of your food forest. Just because it doesn’t look like modern agriculture doesn’t mean it’s worse. In fact it’s more resilient.
@@dack4dust856 it doesn't need to be one source. The dibinator pointed out that at every core sample that was taken at different locations, the monoculture varient of the pollen from like wheat was found at the earliest same period and not earlier.
So unless this "advanced civilisation" was strictly a fishing or hunter gathering society, they would of farmed too, and the pollen traces from their farmed variant of wheat should of been found across the globe.
@@dack4dust856there’s other credible sources that touch on the same subject Flint got the wrong one. Rogan does that on the regular
@@DrumToTheBassWoop what really for me was how they have found sites, costal and submerged and that they have excavated. I also found it convincing that the archeologist only have so many resources and so they have to pick sites that have the most evidence. Doesn't mean there isn't something buried that hasn't been found but I don't think archeology is covering anything up. Still not sure about the pyramids though
@@drfeelgordo no, I'm sorry that's wrong. Because we got core samples going back nearly a million years from Antarctica. There should of been evidence of monoculture pollen in the atmosphere and then trapped. So unless this civilization was some sort of enlightened hunter gatherers, I doubt it existed. BUT...
If the argument is about early formation of a social society existing, we got hundreds of thousands of years of evidence, from cave paintings, tool use and now recently a wooden pier found, meaning we were very good at building shit quite early on. But not to the scale of building massive megastructures, that's just bs.
Our megastructures phase started in the bronze age, as proven by the pyramids, so the last 4-5 thousand years, not that long ago compared to 50,000 years ago.
Thank you for what you do Flint, I used to listen to people like Graham Hancock and was enraptured by the ideas he presented. Now, thanks to the inspiration of scientists like yourself, I’m an anthropology student and look forward to starting my career in the field working on real science with real evidence. Cheers Flint.
Hey Flint, loved your pod with Gnostic Informant
Please sue these people for defamation. LegalEagle?
That said, if it’s any consolation Joe Rogan is actually so weak-minded that he is audience captured, that he can’t change his mind because if he does he’ll also lose his audience as well. It’s kind of pathetic.
Been watching JRE for years, always thought Graham is full of **** and Rogan wants this to be true despite knowing its mostly nonsense. Most people don't watch him for him, they watch for the way he interview the guests. Something that people like you cannot grasp is that Rogan doesn't want to be an idol, he is just a curious person that occasionally fails hard.
Keep spouting nonsense of things you know nothing about, just like Rogan is doing with this.
@PurpleHighWatchtower Explain exactly how Joe is displaying this curious personality that you can see while he's surrounding himself with people who are only going to feed him anti-intellectual narratives. Not only does Joe clearly state at the beginning of this video that his mind is made regarding Flint, he's filled his head with nothing but Hancock, Dan, and Corsetti.
Since when did curious show itself by only inviting guests that represent the anti-intellectual narratives?
@@PurpleHighWatchtower we all get that. The issue is Joe platforms them and offers no meaningful pushback to all the liars, hacks, and grifters he has on. He knows what he's doing and he sold out years ago.
Good on you, Flint. Now, finish up that book so you can go back on Joe Rogan and defend your honour and that of archaeology! No debate this time, just straight facts.
@@RealisticMgmt no one should go back on at this point. Go on other podcasts to present this sort of thing, but stop feeding that beast to do it
@@Gavintech I disagree, if Graham got his own private rebuttal Flint should too, but that should be the end of it.
Joe Rogan could not accept that Hancock was wrong. He had him on the podcast for more than a decade. If he had to, then he should also accept that fact that he wasted time on Hancock and he in turn fooled him. Something something sunk cost fallacy.
Joe pretends to have an open mind but when anything challenges what he wants to be true he just dismisses it or finds someone to go on the pod that reinforces his viewpoint. e.g. the climate change denialist author recently, or the recent Dedunking et al pod
As a fan of JRE myself, Im routing for you Flint. Graham is a very fun person to listen to but is clearly not well educated or sensible with what he believes. There is certainly a middle ground betweem both of your conclusions that might be worth looking into. I really enjoyed the episode with your debate and hope Joe invites you back.
I have to ask, why are you a fan, especially in the last 4 years when Rogan has become a literal useful idiot for any conspiracy out there?
As a fellow scientist, I just want to say, I hope that someday I can be this kind of badass. The fight against misinformation is absolutely fatiguing, and I'll admit, I had given up. You give me hope that maybe I can rejoin the fight. Thank you bruv, keep digging.
I have been a fan of Hancock for awhile and I saw your interview/debate with Hancock on the Rogan show. I honestly found your arguments solid and you provided data for your arguments, which is important. It gave me something to think about regarding Hancock and his ideas. I am really disappointed at Rogan for not inviting you back after in order to defend what was said about you by Hancock and others on his show. I'm also tired of those people outside of academia always claiming some conspiracy about the system against their ideas, when their ideas are challenged. Yes academia, governments and organizations being complex human systems certainly have their issues, but you cannot fix these issues by going to crazy extremes on the other end.
Most comments under those videos just attack your appearance/look. You just did so well, that they don’t find any other point to attack.
Yeah, I noticed the same thing, believing in pseudoscience seems to go hand in hand with shallowness.
i only trust my scientists if they are 6 foot 9 shredded gigachads
The storm has passed, the idiot swarm has already moved on and most comments are now support messages
Great work Flint. Keep doing great work.
Huge fan of yours and actual field archaeologist into lithics.
I cannot begin to thank you for going on JRE to tell the truth.
I don’t think JRE and his fanboys are ever going to get it. At this point, it probably doesn’t matter if they ever do. That will never change my career trajectory or my outlook- I WILL STILL BE AN ARCHAEOLOGIST.
God bless from Guam🇬🇺
This hate for actual intellectuals comes from decades of letting people believe that their ignorance is just as good as your knowledge…
The whole “I’m allowed to have an opinion” should be thrown straight to the trash when it comes from someone that is almost entirely uninformed about the subject they choose to have an opinion on…
Just because an opinion exists doesn’t mean it is worthy of respect or even consideration, and it’s high time people were reminded of that…
Worse yet. Our economy is built around selling you bs. Things are working perfectly. If churches made no money. There would be no churches.
@@GravitasZero Indeed science is based on evidence not opinions. As John Oliver said "You don't need peoples opinions on a fact".
Thank you, Flint. In this era of anti-intellectualism, it's good to know and see that people are fighting the good fight.
Sorry to hear about your bout with cancer. I hope you are doing well and feeling back to your old self.
Mahn I am very sad to hear about your health. Hope you get better in no time
It's funny to hear Hancock talking about the pyramids knowing he's banned from visiting there because of his book selling b.s. .
That's really funny tbh. Probably for the best too.
We're with you Flint ❤
Yes we are
Here from DGG sending love!
Corsetti: *Says a bunch of horrifically nasty sh*t about Flint*
Corsetti in the very next breath: "I've been nothing but nice to Flint"
And Dan used to call Jimmy out, until Dan realized Jimmy was his meal ticket. Total sell out.
@@danielfallu5302he also used to say that he disagreed with up to 70 percent of what Hancock was pushing. Even dismissing some of it as BS and woo. But then when hancock shows him a little love he acts like a 16 year old high school newspaper reporter who won a contest and gets to interview Taylor swift.
@@danielfallu5302 Dan basically on his knees on Rogan trying to get any sort of relevance bump by being an agreeable yes-man
Good stuff. Keep the high ground. Don’t go low.
Nah man, they want the smoke, they can have it.
@ it makes you look like a joke and lets them win the argument
@@alexatedw why bring a cutting tool to a ballistics confrontation?
@@jlspracher because if you go low, the other side wins. If you have Rogan in a corner, with straight fact, it’s very difficult to argue with that. When you go low, you get clipped up and all that work goes to waste. Your channel turns into an echo chamber
@@alexatedw what do you mean by "go low?"
Great work Flint. Summed up your own points well. Hopefully Joe watches this and between his “who does this guy think he is” rage looks inwardly and sees what a prick he’s been to you.
Thank you, for all the work you do. Seriously. One of the lights in the dark.
Keep it up Flint, this is essential work
Thank you for fighting against the looming idiocracy. May your efforts live long and prosper.
Love your work. You deserve way more views than you receive.
Flint, thank you for debating Graham and finally showing some true archeology on JRE. You and Milo opened my eyes after I began to go into this pseudoarcheology rabbit hole. I hope you will deal with the internet trolls that are attacking you. You attacked their idols, so they are prepared to be really vicious.
They just got Double Dibbled
I find it insane that Graham thinks that the best evidence for his position is that there is no evidence.
@@ludwigfeuerbach it’s literally a fallacy. The argument from ignorance.
The preposterous idea that you faked cancer is so so funny. It's the kind of thing I can see a pseudoscientist doing to avoid a debate.
At least Special Jimmy acknowledges that cancer exists and is not part of a Big Pharma conspiracy. I would like to say that I am joking, but with him you never know.
@@Docrock-z9k _"At least Special Jimmy acknowledges that cancer exists and is not part of a Big Pharma conspiracy"_ Just give him time, I'm sure he's going to.
@@NinjaMonkeyPrime I wont be suprises if he come arround and say that cyanide is a better than ibuprofen, considering all the shit he believe in.
When you brought out the 420 example then Joe was immediately like "Makes sense!" LMAO