It's Time We Stopped Building These Horrible Places
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- Опубліковано 27 вер 2024
- Don't miss Cities:Skylines FREE TO PLAY between the 18th and 22nd of May! play.citiessky...
You might be smart, but you'll never be "we put all the commerce outside the city and then wonder why the center is dying" smart.
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I guess I can recommend Cities:Skylines, as I've played it a bit, only around 1300 hours so far (yes, this is sarcasm). Do check out the free-to-play between the 18th and 22nd of May as Cities:Skylines 2 is coming soon! LINK: play.citiesskylines.com/AdamSomething
EDIT: I accidentally wrote March instead of May. Don't worry, the free to play will not happen in the past.
March? March of next year?
@@slxvyy In the video he said 18th-22nd of May at 3:28. So its just a mistake.
@@l_Doc Oh my bad
you said, you'd reccomend mods during the announcement of free to play CS. I can't find the Link in the description. Although i am quite happy with the mods I have, there are a few I see in you Video that I'd like.
You should go to this year's "Green" Capital of Europe Tallinn and roast the infra there.
Fun fact: In the early build phases of Sim City they wanted to factor in parking. They found it was impossible to do so without requiring excessive sprawl, so they axed it.
Love that :')
Why does everyone forget about the possibility to stack cars on top of each other in a parking house, rather than wide, sprawling parking lots...
In times where there is apparently not even enough space in most european cities to stack people in appartments above each other, there might be also no space to stack cars
@@MadnerKami because expensive. rather than making a giant concrete plate with paint on it you are making a giant concrete cube with elevators and supports that can hold the weight of all those cars.
@@corneloni_with_chese not true, because cities like Hong Kong can stack people 10 times more efficiently than most European cities
I find it extremely ironic that shopping malls are just walkable neighbourhoods with extra steps
Walkable neighbourhoods you have to drive to and can't stay at... For maximum convenience
@@lordsrednuas That's not shopping malls. That's satellite malls. There's a difference.
You guys are high. You can't put the same amount of stores holding the same amount of wares in a neighborhood.
Or these new malls with no roofs that are somehow more "premium". They save money by building out in the middle of nowhere and by not having a roof and "pass the savings on to you" (actually they keep the savings to themselves, and make you eat the time and cost of having to travel all the way there, and make every employee of the mall eat the time and cost and time of having to commute to the outskirts of the burbs for work).
@@Adkit2 where do you think all these shops were before?
My favorite thing about outlet malls is the architecture.
They are literally trying to reimagine the main street feel, which they destroyed
Strangely enough malls across North America are dying and closing up, their version of commerce being replaced by on-line retail - the modern version of mail-order which used to be the only choice beyond the nearest general store. What goes around comes around.
It's not just because of online retail though. Lots of the malls closing are in the parts of the country that people are moving out of, you'll notice the cities gaining population close malls very rarely but the cities losing population are closing quickly.
Because they are so far away from people's homes that people just simple buy stuff from home, specially teens which can't drive. If the business were close to their homes, people would go and buy there, because it would be more faster and easy than online purchase. Its truly a "caught in their own web" moment.
What’s funnier is that the companies that use to pioneer the mail order system failed to keep up with the times and died
@@LuckyAceCard As somebody living in Halifax, Nova Scotia, I have to disagree a bit there - Halifax is one of the fastest growing cities in Canada, and just on the other side of my apartment block is the first mall which is now a medical center, and just a few blocks away is the second mall which was converted to office space a few years ago, too. So it's for sure not the "cities are losing population" part as such. What was the killer of the in-town malls here was the new commercial areas on the border of the city (yep, two of them, and both are kind of hard to reach by public transit, and the main stroads there only have sidewalks ON ONE SIDE (if at all), which makes it really hard to get from one place to the other unless you are in a car. Since they are on the outside of town, they can sell their stuff cheaper, so the malls in town were not able to compete anymore, especially after their main people magnets left (read: the big supermarkets, or in the other case, Sears, who basically went bankrupt).
But also, why would you drive all the way out to the mall when you can just go to your local Walmart? Chances are, it's significantly closer and significantly cheaper. And anything you can't get at Walmart, you can get online.
Online retail is definitely part of the problem, but the other part is big box retail, which have historically always been a bad thing for any community they are put in.
A former colleague was taking a training course in the US. Since the training center wasn't very far, he and a couple of other attendees decided to walk every morning there from their hotel. After a couple of days they were stopped by the police because someone had seen them walking on the sidewalk a few times. The caller thought is was so strange that a police should be called to investigate.
I always thought Japan was weird for having traffic laws that protected the pedestrians instead of drivers, but now I realized that we did things right all along.
10:45 Microtransactions is a FANTASTIC way to describe the constant money drain of car ownership.
I thought the same - the car industry used this scummy sceme before it even got a name by the gaming industry.
I feel stupid for having not thought of it myself. God damn!
r/fuckcars
its not even a metaphor. BMW actually started using microtransactions for stuff like heated seats
@@jakobfriedrich5117 no they haven’t. It was a stupid idea to have a subscription for something that’s built in into the product that you’ve already purchased, yes, so they’ve backed out of it due to the backlash.
Being in the UK, that part about shopping centres and big businesses killing town centres really got to me. Where I live, the first shopping centre in our region was built when my mum was still a teenager, since then the high streets that used to be lively with people looking at the independent businesses and preserved victorian buildings at the heart of the town is completly closed up and boarded, the railings and catwalks from the Covid restrictions built to keep people in orderly single file lines are still there the council cares so little for it.
All the while, the asphalt cauldron that is Merry Hill has sucked the local region dry, with only massive international businesses affording to set up shop there, as independent businesses always close down in less than year due to how exorbitant the overhead cost is of being in a giant poorly ventilated box shop with no windows. I wish I could have the high street back!
good old Dudley
Can't stand merry hill, my mom calls it merry hell
Then stop voting Conservative and Labour. Vote Green. Shop at independent shops.
Meanwhile, talk radio hosts will lament the death of the British high street, blaming it (in proportions varying depending on their political affiliations) on Brexit, austerity, Covid-19, pesky youngsters, online shopping etc. etc. missing the open goal of the legacy of the post-war car-centric urban design. And even when we have got retail in our city centres, it has to be confined to an indoor mall with an obligatory multistorey car park. Worse still, many new city-centre residential developments have no retail at the street level, further deepening our dependence on the Holy Mall.
@@nukkuminen Then stop voting Tory.
Started playing a city building game, ended up becoming an advocate for good urban planning.
City skylines will do that to you, you learn a lot with that game.
One of my friends is a civil engineer by trade, and Cities: Skylines is his favorite game.
also you often specialize in traffic managment
The trouble with urban planning is that urban planners don't actually live in the parts of the city they are trying to improve.
Downtown Chicago has the best policy, yield to vehicles
There is definitely a solution. In Lisbon, about 25 yrs ago they built a massive shopping mall in the city. Not outside it, _in_ the city. There are multiple ways to get there, including a subway station right under the building. Since it's so large you have the massive furniture, large appliances and hardware stores inside it.
It's packed, all the time. It has been since it opened.
Not only because you have a lot of choice and can basically find anything and everything in it, but it's also extremely accessible, whether it's by car, bus, subway, on foot, and yes, even by bike, be it your own or the city's shared bikes service. While it's it not the prettiest or most optimized structure, its saving grace is that you can go there and not have to drive or leave the city.
It's also located close to a large residential neighborhood that still has a lot of local businesses open, so it doesn't seem to have impacted them on a negative way. I personally don't really like to go there (hate crowds) but in my eyes it's a great alternative to satellite shopping malls. Even if it's not in the older part of town it's still close enough that anyone can get there from pretty much anywhere in the city in under half an hour.
In Paris, we also have Châtelet, which is both a major hub for metro and regional trains, a central neighbourhood and a large mall with even a whole cinema complex. It's insanely practical, and aside for the stores in there, there's also all the surrounding streets will lots of stores and restaurants/bars!
Is it the Colombo?
Same in Prague, actually, few shoping malls have subway station connected right in to/or next to them. Quite cozy, though i still walk to mine by foot, i live on the edge of city, next to the "Černý Most nákupní centrum" a quite new chonker with everything in it.
@@thearousedeunuch can't be, that place is not within walking distance to the majority of its customer base
@@apc4884 I stand corrected, then. I assumed it was the Colombo because it's a famous mall. I haven't been to any malls in Lisbon for ages.
Adam, we need to see your vision of a perfect city build in Cities Skylines.
YES
I support this
My guess would be parking spaces outside the city at tram stations, narrow streets with enough greenery, everything everywhere in walking distance, Public transport everywhere, one way roads in cities and for bus+delivery only, open public spaces like at the town hall or train station and parks. Lots of parks.
Meh, CS mechanics do not allow to properly build cities without car dependence.
You get debuffs for stores being near residential areas and people will prefer to go shopping to random places every day even if it's a long trip.
You can literally build free perfet-quality tram system that saturates the entirety of the city but people still will get into a car to drive to a random convenience store through the most congested road ever.
After a while it just turns to stupid-ass puzzle to solve congestion without opting for public transportation.
@@mroiddzhem7311 This is where mods come and save the day
As an auto enthusiast, I also hate these shopping centres. They purposefully design the entry streets and parking lot easy get in, but make it difficult to leave. They will direct natural traffic flow inside it in a loop to make you notice stores that you might have missed and out routes are blocked by chicanes that don’t need to be there.
These aren't alters of auto-enthusiasm, they are alters of consumerism facilitated by car ownership. I've thought about how you can be a car enthusiast but also hate the mandatory car-centric design of cities. Just that you like cars and driving doesn't mean you enjoy every drive. I love driving on the open road, especially in the mountains. But in-town stop-and-go traffic is miserable no matter what you're driving. I like driving but also wish for an alternative so I don't always have to drive. But where I live the only viable alternative to a car is a motorcycle, which avoids some issues with cars (less fuel/environmental impact, cheaper in all regards, doesn't need as much space to park if suitable motorcycle parking is available, some places can be parked much easier) but still is individual motorized transport.
@@quillmaurer6563Take a look at Indonesia. Motorcycle ownership is so high because of how reliable they are (+easy credit). But with uneducated, selfish, dumb poeple now motorcycle traffic is a pain (especially in cities). The flexibility of it made selfish motorists to drive in any gap to avoid traffic. Here they saw a 1m gap between side of the road and a car, they go through it. They even drive off-road (in case sidewalk doesn't exist) to overtake. Even with sidewalk they still drive on it. It's just pain in the head to fix it with the reliability & flexibility of motorcycles, selfish & uneducated peoples, and lacking law enforcement. In short just like cars, one poeple using it for daily is fine but the whole city
But doesn't mean I hate motorcycles, I just hate the poeples and the forcing design of city. Just like cars.
@@zidriz07ID I agree that it's not a perfect solution either, especially in a free-for-all like that. But I still figure it's better than all those people driving cars. Could probably say Public Transit > Motorcycles > Cars. But coming from the US, even "cars" would be an improvement over all these huge SUVs and pickup trucks people are driving for no real reason.
@@quillmaurer6563 Yeah, for daily commute i'd stick to motorcycles. Light weight, easier, less of a space waste, and cheaper.
The funny thing is these places offer the experience of living/shopping/walking in big and wide car-free enviroments, as long as you drive to get there.
They’re like walkable city theme parks. You get a taste of this other reality but it’s all artificial and wholly self contained.
The problem is. The shops in the city are small, overpriced and shitty. They are just there because they jave aways been there...
@@blablup1214 what city are you referring to?
@@noahsuarez3696 For example Itzehoe.
@@noahsuarez3696 what city are they not overpriced in?
Fun fact about the IKEA in Vienna. The first few floors are fully used by them, with even a restaurant, but the top floors are a hostel. I stayed there in July and it was incredible to just be able to go have breakfast, lunch or dinner by going one floor down to the IKEA restaurant. They even share multiple lifts, which serve as access to multiple sections of the IKEA and its restaurant, and the hostel. Conveniently located next to a major train station and multiple tram stops.
I love this idea.
its a great idea but just cause a mall cant be built in the city doesnt mean it shouldnt be built at all. The majority of his arguments just hinge on him milking the "cars are bad" take in everyway possible. the idea that we shouldn't build malls away from the city because they cause traffic is so unfeasible and just plain ridiculous, its him being a karen.
@@afrosymphony8207 A mall *can* be built in a city. Multiple examples of malls in cities can be found, and to a certain extent, the aforementioned IKEA is actual proof that even furniture stores can work in city centres.
@@afrosymphony8207"B-b-but if we ban lead, the children won't have any toys to play with!"
@@CityWhisperer my point is that it shouldn't be the only option. So no one can build an affordable mall or furniture store outside the city if the ones in the city happen to be overpriced because traffic?? yes from a business standpoint OBVIOUSLY it makes sense to build it in the city but this idea that it should be banned if its in the city is completely unfeasible its ridiculous.
Once they built the mall here in the mid 1980s the downtown area immediately started suffering from "urban decay".
Same here in my city...
We had vibrant downtown until the mega mall was built in the late 70s...
It started the slow death, and now downtown is nothing but homeless encampments and services for the homeless...
The mall is also now 80% empty, and is basically just a giant food court
I half expected Adam to explain the Russo-Ukrainian war in HOI IV after seeing the Paradox sponsorship
Oh god. I sincerely hope such an abomination never assaults humanity’s eyeballs
As a Hoi 4 player, I also expected HoI 4 sponsorship, but had no idea how would it work in the video.
Then I realized there are other games than just HoI 4. I know…
I will just unsubscribe if that happens
Considering the recent deployment of soviet-era tanks AND the fact that new DLC for CK3 was just released, I was expecting Crusader Kings...
I honestly thought it would be a ad for Stellaris since they just released a new DLC
This sounds really similar to my home town. Every time they opened a new mall, it would immediately lead to another mall dying and a shift in where the major traffic accidents are concentrated.
Imma take a wild guess and say Cincinnati?
@@lordofallspoons4190 that happened in some of towns in Poland where i live. The demand for those shopping malls isn't big enough
Salt Lake City?
I am reminded of the Discworld novel 'Reaper Man', which describes the process by which a city, as a living entity, can be killed by a parisitic lifeform that turns out to be an edge of town shopping mall.
GNU Sir Terry ❤
The most ironic thing about these places (we call them smart centre's in Ontario) is that their road networks are often poorly designed. It's a car centric space that can't even do that right and navigating through them can be a harrowing experience.
It's an interesting phenomenon to be sure.
Because they are so quick and convenient, even car centric design doesn't really concern itself much with efficiency.
It's a symptom of the same thinking that gives rise to the 'one more lane will fix traffic' idea.
The car itself is perceived as so ideal, that very little thought has to be given to the rest of the infrastructure.
And yes, I know that traffic engineers do exist, but how much priority is actually given to finding solutions when *gestures wildly* this has been allowed to happen.
It is baffling that they design these places to be car-centric, and then put in the absolute bare minimum amount of effort into making them actually traversable by car.
@@LN997-i8x It's because they want to use as much of the space they have for car parking bays rather than to aid the flow and movement of the actual traffic it brings. It's rather absurd.
@@LN997-i8x yeah. A lot of indoor shopping malls in the Phoenix valley are surrounded by roads that have 2 lanes in each direction but don’t have turning lanes, and the massive parking lots can be a pain to navigate through, especially during holiday shopping seasons. Even the freeways aren’t free from massive design flaws (e.g. the SR-101/I-10 interchange by Tolleson, where there’s a lane merge as soon as traffic from the 101 is going onto I-10 east, and traffic going on from 91st Avenue must merge into that, and the next interchange, which is 83rd Avenue, doesn’t even have a dedicated exit lane, and that’s made worse by I-10 getting an additional lane at the interchange with SR-202).
There are places such as the mall that I specifically don't go to just because of the inconvenience of parking.
The bigger the place is, the worse the parking. Walmart is another big offender. I hate walmart parking lots. They are chaotic.
It would be smarter of them, in my opinion, to put their stores in the middle of the parking lot. Instead, they usually put it all the way at the back, with no parking behind the store.
This obviously limits access and stuff. They could probably actually increase their profits and such if they took a more rational approach. Instead, we have legacy admissions to harvard making the decisions.
I was born and raised in Chemnitz.
As soon as the video began I thought "Hm, isn't the Chemnitz Center a satellite mall too?"
AND THEN IT IS LITERALLY THE MAIN EXAMPLE FOR THE VIDEO. I JUST CAN'T
That said, it is really fascinating to see these places which were basically an integral part of your childhood being recontextualized in such a video.
Thanks Adam!
Same
speaking as a beginner driver, our "car-centric" stroads and expressways freak me the fuck out
like, I don't *like* having to go 55 mph to get anywhere, I would rather drive down a perfectly reasonable city street at 25mph and stop for pedestrians than increase my blood pressure having to make sure I'm staying between the lines and stopping soon enough on a 3-lane road produced by urban sprawl
@@technoturnovers7072 If you are afraid to go 55 mph on a grade separated dual carriageway you shouldn't be driving maybe.
@@CsImre you did get the part where I said /beginner/ driver, right? I'm sure I'll eventually get used to it, and that's not the point of my comment
@@technoturnovers7072you need to think outside the geschwindigkeitsbeschrankung
"If a car is your only option,this is not freedom.
Its mandetory microtransactions." Adam Something.
This is a Very Good quote!
Freedom isnt unrestricted access.
Its also not getting one thing thats "good enough" for everything.
Freedom is having multiple valid options to choose from!
We have a satellite mall outside of my city in Sweden. This has resulted in every single shop leaving the city center and now if i want to buy anything that i can't find at the local food store like clothes, tools, electronics,, kitchen supplies, etc, i have to go to the satellite mall. This sucks because it has killed the city center and i have to go to this stupid place filled of stuff and people whenever i need anything out of the ordinary.
Sweden wish it was USA again....
I bet there is still people blaming biking, and a lack of parking and other car amenities in the center.
Which town? Väla is being tough for Helsingborg center as well.
So you want your city center to have a store for clothes, tools, electronics, kitchen supplies, etc, with enough wares and throughput to handle an entire city? That is so dumb. There's a REASON why these places are in the outskirts of cities.
Why not? A lot of countries still do that. I mean Tokyo wouldn't be the iconic city today if it did not have entire districts dedicated to specific consumer goods, i.e. Akihabara and it's tech and gaming hubs.
I almost stopped driving cars because of this channel. I've noticed that our city has made a massive step forward with bike lane infrastructure, so I bought myself a bike and now if I need to go to work, I go by bike or bus. At least one less car on the road during rush hours.
And everywhere else, if it's a viable options, I do not choose car anymore, it stays parked for a whole work week.
So thank you for opening my eyes.
And thank you for being so understanding and accepting of change! Save the car for what it’s supposed to be for! Going far and carrying more stuff than you can on bike racks, which is very rare. Props to you mate 💪🏻 enjoy the bike :)
Biking makes you healthier, slimmer and sexier, makes you feel better and gives you a more open and free view of your area you don't get from cars.
Why still have the car?
What about Car Sharing?
I sold my car when I moved to a walkable neighborhood.
Why pay insurance and taxes for something you don't use?
You can always RENT a car.
@@CordeliaWagner Because I still use it. That's why in my original comment I written "stays parked for a whole work week". In the weekends we (I and my girlfriend) drive to her or my families, go somewhere far enough that without a car it would be a major inconvenience.
P.s. I don't live in US, so I don't have that issue. Insurance is 200$ a year, and no taxes for having a car. It's much cheaper to have a car than to rent it every weekend. Especially when it's a Prius.
As someone in the UK it's so annoying, usually there will be buses there but it's so sad seeing high streets which have been alive Hundreds sometimes thousands of years being dead because they made a fancy inaccessible shopping centre right at the edge of town where hardly anyone lives, it's also kinda weird since most pubs and restaurants haven't adapted so there's no retail in town just a place to drink
oh. ive been wondering why my old hometown was basically dead. this video explains so much. i thought satellite malls were a symptom of something wrong with the city planning and not the fault.
Satelite malls are a failure of city planning.
Here we are seeing a bigger focus around deliveries in retail stores dispatched from warehouses. I suspect it is to compete with online retail but it could have a positive effect on locations of these stores.
If deliveries are become more mainstream these store no longer need huge storage attached or to be somewhere with loads of parking because people need to lug mega tv's back home etc.
So they can simply setup somewhere in the center and just dispatch big items from somewhere else.
Reminds me of mine too, but our big satellite mall died too, got replaced with another, even bigger satellite mall, and now that one is also dying.
It's all sort of interlinked. Satellite Malls, suburbanization, and car dependency. Each of them on their own are undoubtedly bad, but they require each other in order to justify their existences.
@@thelittleredhairedgirlfrom6527 yeah lol. Same is happening in my home town. Mall died cause they built a bigger one across the street and the big one is also now dying cause there is nobody buying things because nobody wants to live in the city, because there is nothing to do and so on and on
@@BlitzkriegOmega And then there's also efficiency and competativeness, which is often overlooked. A centralized structure like a mall can offer a lot of services at one place, which cuts costs both for the customer and the companies. They're very attractive in that regard.
Have been a follower of your channel for sometime but never understood the gravity of the poor planning in US until recently. Recently been to Phoenix and never felt stuck in the middle of a Downtown before. Amidst the dry heat, no free community areas or Shadow area to get a break from heat. The heat is reflected from both walkway and the side walls. All major shopping center are dispersed across the city making us heavily depended on uber for traveling from one point to another. I expected this from some remote part of the country, not in city center.
As a phd scholar, i become an expert on living on below minimum wage . But in Phoenix, i felt like a destitute with these unnecessary expenses. I felt so dependent on my friends to take me from one place to another. I did have metro valley tickets, but in many cases, 3 miles of travel took 1 hr with connection services in the middle of dry heat.
Do they give any shit about pedestrians?
"Do they give any shit about pedestrians?"
Yes, they hate you for walking on the road!
(even if there is no sidewalk)
phoenix is the example of all examples, a city that defies god and should never have been constructed. it has less than 50 years before it just dies because it's so completely unsustainable
@@janthran And it's one of the fastest growing cities, along with other sun belt cities that will also be inhospitable in a few generations. Lots of children and grandchildren of Midwestern/Great Lakes transplants will be coming back.
I think there is a huge potential to develop a city with huge spaces around such as parking spots. In Toronto is the same and I strongly believe that we can get rid of huge parking spaces and construct a building or whatever
@@janthran Same with Las Vegas, it never should've existed. Now Lake Mead rapidly drying up while they water golf courses
In the US I read that a lifetime cost of a car is from $250k-650k. I think every one of my friends who've reached retirement age, broke and poor as mice had nice cars for decades. I on the other hand was trained by an enlightened father not to get emotional about them, how to find good ones for little money and how to fix basic things to keep it running. For years my limit was $400 cost for a car. I was always the last owner. Now, I've retired with money in the bank and am looking at a move to another country for the village life Americans abandoned because we've been told we LOVE our cars. No wonder our society has gone mad.
Here in the UK, up north, most town centers are dead. In fact I've watched them die as I've grown
Just full of pawn shops, bet shops, 'pound shops' and takeaways etc. But we also have lots of retail parks. It's not the only reason they're dead I'm sure but after watching this video no doubt it's a major factor.
Much of it started with maggie thatch and continues under tory half wits
Stop voting Tory.
Sounds like "Life In A Northern Town" needs an update.
@@jasonhaven7170 Never have but I agree
Also hairdressers and nail bars? Can't move for them here, but at least it brings foot traffic.
I keep thinking about Douglas Adams and the Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy. One of his main characters was an alien taking human form to live on earth and try to observe humans by fitting in and living among us. The name he chose for himself, indicating his confusion about the dominant life form of our world, was "Ford Prefect."
Didn't he also struggle to get in contact with the earthlings, by trying to talking with the cars... or something like that
It has been so long since I read that book
@@tjampman I just checked (I have the book) it tells us that "he made one careless blunder ..." which was his choice of name. There's no reference to him talking to cars, (not that I could find, anyway).
@@sadunlapI think in the movie he runs into traffic while trying to greet the cars and has to be saved by Arthur.
But him thinking that cars were the dominant species (and him attempting to communicate with them) is just subtext in the books, never explicitly statet. As far as I remeber.
@@sadunlap the movie shows Ford trying to shake hands with a car in the middle of the street, which arthur dent saves his life by tackling him out of the way. which is why theyre friends
@@gemstonegynoid7475 @Hans Helga Thanks. I did not know that. I do not remember the movie.
You know it's funny, we call them "Outlet Malls" and the one that was built recently has been _STRUGGLING_ to stay open. I'm surprised it still is after the pandemic but still there's barely anyone or anything there. It's a place retail chains go to die.
Outlet malls are a bit different. Outlet stores (with outlet malls being a collection of outlet stores) are where manufacturers sell their product directly to the customer. Like having a Levi's store that only sells Levi's jeans and other Levi's products. As opposed to something like Walmart where they sell Levi's, Dickie's, Wrangler, etc.
Along with what Allen said, outlet malls are also different in design. Google each example given below and look at the satellite map image.
Outlet Mall: The parking lot is surrounded by sections of the shopping center. "Queenstown Premium Outlets, Queenstown MD"
Shopping Mall: The shopping center is surrounded by an enormous parking lot. "Marley Station Mall, Glen Burnie MD"
Strip Mall: The shopping center, built in a straight line (a "strip" of stores) is adjacent to the parking lot. "Value City Furniture, Glen Burnie, MD"
@AllenSchreiber they are also where they send product that fails quality control. I grew up poor and my grandmother would always take me shopping there. It was amazing that you could buy a 2 dollar pair of jeans there because they had a tiny unnoticeable flaw in the stitching somewhere at a time the rich suburban kids were paying a hundred bucks for ripped up because they were fashionable.
I swear Adam is sponsored by taxpayers' money. He keeps promoting trains, cycles and decent livable cities.
Those damn taxpayers, trying to force their will upon regular citizens!! /s
hes a shill for Big Shoe. he wants people to stop using cars so they use more shoes.
But just like the religious types that push their way despite what everyone else thinks, not everyone wants to live in the core of an ultra dense city, packed like sardines into tiny apartments and paying hefty rent for the privilege of doing so. That sounds like a complete hellscape to me - being packed into a box surrounded by karens and HOAs / condo boards telling me what to do with every second of my life - no f'in thanks
@@probusexcogitatoris736 how dare he. He should be paying politicians for that sort of influence. /s
just that our taxes in germany (hes german) dont go to anything that would help its people, instead its all pumped into the car industry and given away to other countries
What’s weird is that in the US malls and such were originally idealized as a walkable living spaces with houses in them, facilities and some shops to have funding but of course it just became shops.
Imagine you can open a shop in a suburbia! And a Café and a Restaurant. Sadly nobody seems to want it.
@@CordeliaWagner it's not that people don't want it it's that they're illegal to build in the middle of a neighborhood
@@bird-war In the US and Canada that may be true, but in Europe it definitely is not.
In fact almost all modern housing builds have some kind of retail element onsite.
They finished building three big tower blocks last year near to where I live, and the ground floor of each has several different amenities, including a restaurant, grocers, butchers, hair salon, gym, and even a doctors surgery.
Meaning residents can walk out their front, go downstairs and get whatever they need, without ever needing to get in a car.
@@bird-war I think you made that up buddy.
I personally would hate it if McDonald's were allowed in residential areas. If small businesses are allowed to, you bet your ass megacorps will too
As an economist, often traveling in some of the cities that you mention in your videos, you might not even know how much I appreciate your content and the description of the silly society that we live in.
As an Alchemist, I agree.
@@epis8613As a natural philosopher, I concur.
one problem I saw with your sattelite mall model in Cities:Skylines. there was clearly way too much space wasted on greenery.
After all, who need trees ?
He also used a track from Baldur's Gate called "Exploring the Plains" to talk about cities :D
@@DeusInMachina23 could’ve built another lane on that space
trees are for p*ssies
@@sirsurnamethefirstofhisnam7986 Mars colony need it ! How will mars billonaires colonizers have access to essential products as Iphones and Tesla ?
In Europe, the arrival of the car led to compactization (is too a word): people who used to live in farms moved to the village.
In the US and later Canada the opposite took place.
7:16 Traffic Lesson no. 2: Only play in designated playgrounds!
(Also invented by the car industry to avoid all those pesky mothers complaining their kids being killed!)
to be perfectly fair a going to the playgrounds as a kid always beat just playing on the street.
@@sosig6445 but mabye that just because those streets were made so hostile that they werent ever seen as an option. Originally streets WERE the playgrounds.
That's kinda crazy to me. I spent a lot of time as a kid playing on and cycling on streets in my local area.
I imagine stroads probably make that horrible though.
@@sosig6445 that's just because the streets you had available sucked. Going to a playground never beat riding a bobby-car, scooter, bike, skateboard, rollerblade, etc. or driving an RC-car around a track painted with chalk onto the street right in front of my parent's (or friend's parent's) house, without having to worry about traffic when I was a kid.
I remember once on our way home from the football club, a few friends and I stopped smack in the middle of a four-way crossroad where our ways parted and kept chatting for almost an hour without a car approaching ONCE. It was really cool when we first realized how long we've already been stood in that crossroad for and we promptly decided to keep delaying and testing how much longer until a car would approach. We ran out of stuff to talk about and got bored 20 - 30 minutes later and still haven't seen a single car, not even moving somewhere in the distance.
@@LRM12o8
I lived in extremely low density suburbs and the streets didn't suck they were just boring, what was great was the nearby forests and fields where we often took our mountain bikes for stunts.
growing up poor in california (20k~y/r) the cost of a car was always soul crushing even as a kid, and since I never traveled I never read about the world outside of me, so thank you though for making this video as it makes me really happy seeing an environment that can thrive without the excessive needs of cars
also the diner bit was spot on thank you for that xD
Another Californian here, this is SO much our reality. I hate that cities seem to think this is a good move.
We have an older shopping district and two malls near the community college and small university. Due to bad city policy and myopic planning (if any) and bad property owners, these areas have struggled to keep business despite being "walkable" to to a significant population. Notably, there are Walmarts in the edge of town shopping centers.
But our town has bigger problems right now, such as a major school district being investigated by the DOJ for among other things disappearing $30-40 million. Personally, I'd say look into all the superintendents we've had, around 1/yr, with golden parachutes, then senior administration and the school board. None of those folks care about the students or teachers. It's serious drama, and the kids are paying for it. 🤬
@@erinmac4750 walkable stores tend to be expensive and have crime. It is not profitable to run them. How often do you shop there versus cheaper places?
@@ShaggyRodgers420 When I can. Also, you can't make a blanket statement about the crime. That depends on a lot of factors.
@@ShaggyRodgers420this might be the most American thing I've ever had the "pleasure" to read.
Walkable stores exists all over the world without being neither unprofitable or dangerous
@@AtomicDig American cities are crime-ridden crapholes, which is why suburbia exists because everyone that could afford to abandoned them as fast as they possibly could.
Now why they are so crime-ridden and other systemic issues that keep them that way is another answer, but the story isn't as simple as Adam has pointed out.
There's a confluence of factors that made it so North American didn't develop in the same way that Europe did. Chief among them is the simple fact that most of their growth and expansion happened in the last 80 years, well after the advent of the automobile. If Europe had been built from the ground up in the same time frame as North America, it would look similar too. But it wasn't so it doesn't.
That's not a reason not to try and change things, but it's exceedingly difficult. Maybe impossible to do so.
Danke, dass du diesem Thema mehr Aufmerksamkeit verschaffst. Nur so kommen wir hoffentlich irgendwann zur Besinnung und schaffen lebenswerte und lebensfördernde Städte - für Menschen.
Grüße aus Hamburg :)
Ah Ja! Hallo Yannik! Those malls can be so dummkopf! Sorry, my German is bad at the moment! I want to reconnect with my German ancestry.
I never even thought about how human-centric past cities used to be. Damn.
Streets in particular. It's shocking once you look into just how communal and important to the social fabric they used to be.
@@LN997-i8x Paris is the only real outlier here, as they built huge, grand boulevards long before cars were a thing when they redesigned most of it after the revolution. This was to make it harder to riot though, and the many roundabouts they added with clear views down the big long streets were perfect for shooting the gathering crowds.
Adding to KW, it's terrifyingly ironic how far right nuts pride the US in being a "family" or sorts, but suburbs do the exact opposite, and cars contribute to the isolation so many modern urban people feel.
When you've grown up in car centric planning and the past few generations have too, it's not hard to believe that we're brainwashed.
The pinnacle of an urbanist youtuber's carier: when you get sponsored by Cities Skylines.
True that! 🙂
I live in a city in the Midwest of the United states, and this video really hit me where it hurts. Every even moderately well populated area in the Midwest has a satellite mall on the edge of town, and every single one of them has roughly the same shops as the last one. Hell, in my hometown the entirety of the northwestern most edge of town is completely dominated by a massive shopping complex that includes a normal mall structure as well as three or four strip malls located around it. And what's funny about all of that is the simple fact that the only store I have ever shopped at there was the scheels contained within, just cause they sell ammo and other hunting goods. I have legit never made a purchase there that would inherently require a car to transport back home, and yet there isn't a single public transport line that runs directly out there.
For better or for worse Amazon has all but killed Malls they are more like zombies at this point in my little corner or the world or at least they are nothing compared to what they were 20 years ago.
When I first saw the ikea in Vienna, I was surprised that it wasn‘t a long, space wasting box. But the more I passed by, the more my curiosity grew. And thanks to this vid, I can understand the purpose of the ikea.
Skylines advertising with Adam is a stroke of genius
I'm glad that in new Zealand geography makes satellite malls practically impossible. Also most people live in just 3 citys surrounded by mountains meaning most malls are just a short tower of parking and shopping. Also in Wellington we have a giant national park that's pest free.
What about The Base in Hamilton? Botany Town Centre in Auckland? Ferrymead in Christchurch? They are all car-centric hellscapes.
@@deathscythehellfunk many but compered to America it is a paradise. The geography of nz forces every thing closer together makeing not putting in public transportation hard to ignore.
@@boaz7927 Compared to the US maybe, but compared to Europe it's bad. I come from The Netherlands and lived in NZ for a few years.
People in NZ behave much the same as in the US. They don't care for anyone who isn't in a car. There is barely any proper infrastructure for pedestrians and cyclists. Bus services are spotty, train services are absolutely atrocious. NZ roads are too wide and of poor quality. Being better than the US is a VERY low bar. The only reason NZ isn't as bad as the US is because far fewer people live in NZ. The attitude to planning and traffic design is very similar to the US.
And I'm sorry, but the geography of NZ forcing things closer together is total nonsense. Even cities like Wellington that are squashed between mountains are far more sprawling than they would be in Europe. Population density of NZ cities and towns is significantly lower than for Dutch cities, even though the Netherlands has no mountains. The available space is very poorly used.
@@deathscythehellfunk I live in NZ and what you've said is true. I'm visiting the UK at the moment and the public transport is so much better here. Especially the trains. Population density is much higher, VKT per capita is lower. I can actually walk on the footpaths not having to watch for cars coming out of driveways every 5 meters.
And yeah, geography has nothing to do with it at all. There's clearly plenty of land, seeing as they keep building suburban sprawl and big box retail stores in the main population centers.
I've lived in New Zealand and I'm pretty sure it has the highest cars per capita rate in the world
My husband and I went to the mini IKEA in Hammersmith the other day. Main differences were the canteen bit is tiny, and it's weirdly way easier to get lost in there. But it was perfect for getting smaller stuff like bedding, frames etc. It's a great idea.
The Robina railway station on the Gold Coast Australia was supposed to be built under the dubiously named Robina Town Centre shopping centre but the developers objected because it would attract “undesirable elements”. So the station was instead built a kilometre away next to a swamp.
There's a book called Edge City that describes this mass urbanization. First, homes move out to the suburbs, then shopping & retail move, and finally, jobs move, making the suburb an independent "city" separate from the historical. It's mildly terrifying.
I remember when I visited my grandparents, we drove to these malls very often. They lived a ca 30-60 minutes car drive away in a smaller town, which actually always had all of the stores you had in these malls, but for some reason my grandparents preferred to drive a long ass route to these malls. I never quite understood why
I'm from Vienna and gotta say the new Ikea is absolutely amazing. it being so close to the city centre and easily reachable by train, metro, trams and buses also encourages to go there for small purchases instead of ordering online.
even my mom who lives around 45mins per car from another ikea in a mall south of Vienna now takes the 1h train to Vienna to go to the new one
We still have plenty of local small hardware stores in Czech Republic and even in Prague and they mostly have better stuff and for even better prices than those oversized hobby markets, but when I need something in Bauhaus or Obi or something like that, there are some of them near metro station, for shopping some smaller furniture I could go to Jysk or check some bigger hypermarkets like Tesco, they also have some home stuff which I can just take and transport by metro or bus.
I visited IKEA only few times in my life, it's mostly somewhere where I really don't go often when I don't have a car and IKEA furniture is mostly piece of shit, it will fall apart next year, there is like milion other options even in center, local furniture stores or I can just order something online, no need for IKEA. But I actually work in furniture factory, so I can buy some things in work or make something by myself.
IKEA is just another unsustainable big business producing cheap furniture made to be thrown after a few months. those along with car-centric cities among many things most be gone
I'm autistic and live next to the bypass road that cuts through my seaside town.
My windows are permanently covered in soot, and vehicle noise reverberates between the buildings lining the road.
I want to scream sometimes with how *fucking* noisy it gets every day, especially during the summer when it's too hot to leave the windows closed and tourists slow the traffic to a crawl.
Delivery is really underrated for car free living. In London we can get anything delivered including groceries from anyone next day with an hour slot. I never shop in a store anymore unless I’m abroad
Leipzig had a huge satellite center that looked exactly like Chemnitz Center, but then they rebuild everything, making it three times bigger and "modern looking". It is now called Nova (Eventis?) and there is a single bus route from Leipzig Hauptbahnhof with a tiny bus once per hour. It is a hell and I hate it deeply.
As an American who lives in Germany, I appreciate you showing that these aren’t just North American problems, lol. We get a lot of shit online about the way our cities are built, but I think all of us have a long way to go in terms of making city designs more sustainable
But all of this (at least in the areas like Leipzig) is past-unification, American-inspired builds.
It came together with "dying" inner cities (so much we made it into a word: Innenstadtsterben).
Back in the GDR we had 3 bakers and 2 butchers and a "supermarket" (Kaufhalle) in 500m range. Now they are all closed and there is a big parking sea with several shops a bit farther away, that turned the neighborhhood street which was my road to school into one of the busiest in town.
That is capitalistic efficiency! Instead of having 10 trucks per day that deliver to the shops and people walking, you now have 10 trucks and 1000 cars using 10 times the space!
@@steemlenn8797 Capitalist “efficiency” at its finest.
Also, I love how Germans have a word for (seemingly) everything.
@@Merrybandoruffians Well, if we don't have, we can always make one up. Like "Wortschöpfungsfreiheit"
‘The Germans have a word for everything’ idea isn’t really true - they just don’t use spaces between components in noun phrases like we do. Same in basically all other Germanic languages, and actually the English way of using spaces is arguably better since it’s easier on learners and kids. What’s easier to parse: ‘piratafskrækkelsesmissionen’ or ‘the pirate deterrence mission’?
It's not just NA problems but arguably, we're the progenitor of them since we export our culture so much or at least popularize it. We deserve the heavy criticism 😂
I also live in Leipzig, and recently tried to cycle to the local IKEA. An absolute nightmare, ended up on a road with 70km/hour traffic and gravel paths the moment I got close.
What is the point of cycling to IKEA? How do you plan on carrying a 20 kilo bookshelf on cycle?
@@bessmertni i Was only going to pick up a couple of smallish things.
10kg max. Then I strapped them to the bike.
Why would you cycle there, they have their own bus route!
@@reniesulaweyo4383 yeah, but it's 10 EUR there and back.
And Google said they would both take an hour (Google lied)
@@bessmertni You know, there are things like *Cargo Bikes* or *Bicycle Trailers* out there in a non-car-centric World - beyond the Horizon of car-conditioned minds!
PARADOX SPONSORSHIP POG!!!! I am so happy for you Adam, you are literally my favourite youtube right now and I am so frikking glad to see your content associated with, and branching into the gaming world. I really hope you are able to give them some pointers for the second game so I can actually make my Dutch cities instead of being forced to build like Americans.
But he made a video dissing them...
@@EugeneOneguine Yeah, and the cities skylines youtube channel commented on that saying they'd love pointers. You can like something whilst still critising it.
I think another positive example is the "Cittimarkt" in Kiel. It has all the typical features of a typical satellite mall: giant parking lots (partially underground) and a direct highway connection... but it is quite accessible by bike (directly at a "bike highway") and has a train and bus station.
I'd like to create a city where you can drive but don't want to
Thats most Dutch cities. Car ownership rates are still pretty high in the Netherlands, but for short urban trips take the bike, walk or catch a tram. Then when you do want to use the car for longer journeys the roads are clear, even if you might have to take a slightly longer route, but still reducing journey times compared to congested US cities.
I'm just imagining an infuriating game mode where new laws are constantly added to your city that you have to obey. Things that immediately and negatively affect your city. Zoning laws, minimum parking, big box stores placing themselves at the outskirts of your city and being forced to connect to it, being forced to plow through your residential center with a highway.
All sorts of stuff like that
The problem is that driving creates a tragedy of the commons scenario. It's in every individual's short term interest to drive themselves to the place they want to go as directly as possible. Nobody driving makes that offer even more compelling, since the trip by car would be even more appealing (you get even faster). And, while capitalism's individuality and competition makes the problem worse, it doesn't go away when removing that factor because people would still like convenience. The only way would be applying massive deterrents like very few places where cars are allowed and social stigma around using a car instead of public transport. At which point, "can drive" becomes less and less of a thing.
That's most cities, what you need is a city where you can drive but don't have to.
@@BlitzkriegOmega CS: Red-State Legislative Preemption edition.
Man, your bike driving montages really do remind me of most of Poland. If a city has dedicated bike infrastructure, it's either fine or really good. When it's not there though (and trust me, even the bike-lenient cities are spotty on this), you end up in places like in Chemnitz.
Same here in the UK. I go to my local city to ride my bike because it's safer and more relaxing than riding around the semi-rural area I live in. In the past, it would have been the opposite way around. We live in crazy times.
I was in Chemnitz in 2003 on tour with a band. Man It was a sight to see for us western kids, a derelict Soviet mining city. Back then there were no complaints about traffic in that there. There was hardly anyone living in it. I talked to a guy who told me that roughly 80% of the population had left Chemnitz after the wall fell. It was such a depressing place. Everything was dirty and worn. The city core had big, hulking, soviet era brutalist style office buildings, I remember orange and brown curtains flapping in the breeze through several broken windows. Man, the communists did a number on that place. They even renamed it Karl Marx Stadt until the people dared voting to name it back to Cheminitz again in the 90's. Glad to see it's cleaned up and populated again.
i rather sit safe in my car than surrounded by baggers and scammers and evtl getting pick pocketed ...
Belgium has been building these car-centric shopping malls everywhere for the last 30 years. Each one has been a death sentence for the city centre.
The thought I always have when I go to a strip mall in the middle of a suburb close to me is always "Wow, with all this open space only being used for car parking I could build a crap ton of small shops/homes/etc. The Walmart could easily have 2 podium style towers on top of it and still be a Walmart on the ground floor. We could pedestrianize the whole place, and since we'd be ripping up the ground anyways, we could move much of the parking underground if we really still needed it and have space left over for at least a BRT line. All of this would make money in the medium to long term for individuals, businesses, and governments after it's built". Admittedly it's not a satellite mall it's built central in the suburb but that just makes it a more compelling case as a "mini-downtown" or "Town Centre" or "Suburban core" or whatever you want to call this.
The walkway right next to the road with no separation and *sloped towards the road* around 7:00 is really terrifying to me. It ensures that if one slips and falls, it would be right under the wheels of the murder-box.
8:38 well… Amazon taught us that delivery exists. Why would you wanna go with your own car there when there’s a specialised service that delivers to multiple clients in one travel? You’re still paying for gas, just don’t.
Edit: OF COURSE 9:51, OF COURSE YOU THOUGHT ABOUT THAT TOO. I fucking love this channel. When things are obvious they are just so predictable.
You probably addressed this better in another video, but these big developments are hostile to ped/bike users just as much if you live near them! Some of those houses are 60m from the shopping center, but you'd have to walk 10x that far to get there. Or in my town they put up this "big new awesome corporate headquarters job center" and it's interconnected with itself and the parking garages in such a way that you just can't walk through that 6 block area at all.
Reminds me of our edge-of-town retail park when I was a kid - we used to risk our necks crossing some railway tracks to get to it because otherwise there was no other way to walk there.
I completely agree. I live in one of the gulf states where there really is no choice but a car. I live across from a mall but in order to walk there I need to cross two highways even though it is just a 10 or so minute walk. since the country has built its economy on oil I don't see them changing their car centric planning policies anytime soon
I live right on the edge of the "old" part of the city of Baltimore. A bit suburban, but I can at least walk to a bus stop or grocery store. It's crazy how you can feel the shift from the old suburbs, which were built for people, to the new suburbs, which were built for cars, just driving from one road to the next.
A number of my friends moved to new, modern suburbs, and whenever I visit them it's shocking just how dead those places feel. Meanwhile my neighbourhood was built in the 1920's and is just a joy to be in by comparison. Tons of greenery, all sorts of human spaces, and easily traversable on foot. And yet so many people seem to have bought into the scam that the newer neighbourhoods are somehow better simply because they are new.
You with Avon or Marlowe?
Most people with a functioning brain don't like the autocentric hellscape that our world has become but people who jaywalk without giving a single fuck about what happens afterward are psychopaths. Not the worst kind of psychopath, but definitely a danger to themselves and possibly others. Here's hoping that our world slowly works toward cars being an option, not the default.
This reminds me of the times I would use my bicycle to get to the library that was 2 miles away from my home...in Florida ! Never though it would be this bad in Germany. I am glad you didn't die my dude!
Nice sideswipe to economics explained 😂
Btw, another example would be SCS (Shopping Center Süd) in Vienna. Even if they have bus/tram access. Its inconvenient to go by foot to another part of the same mall. I know it, I did it.
Sadly, it has upsides, that inner city malls don't have. Storage space inside the car. Big bulky stuff. Ikea. Sport equipment. Just stuff it in the car, and continue. So for anything bulky, I drive to SCS by car. For anything else, bike or bus inside the city.
My dad LITERALLY made the "you need cars for furniture" thing and I was like... "you can get it delivered, rent a car, or own a car for longer trips but use other stuff close by." He's a mechanic so I don't think we'll ever see eye to eye, but I biked EVERYWHERE as a kid in a car-centric area of Canada.
Being in a car centric city, walking around is insane. I’ve jaywalked and ran through parking lots to go to a park. And yes some of the people you described have certainly given me dirty looks and stuff.
Have to run across a busy road as soon as there's a break in the traffic just to get to a convenience store, not so convenient if you ask me.
I'm from Chemnitz and when you described the car-centric satellite mall, I thought of the Chemnitz-Center right off the bat. I was a bit surprised to really see it in the video! Chemnitz is not mentioned a lot normally. I was sitting in the bus daily when going to school, going by this thing and I think I can count the times where I really spent time there on one hand. It feels pointless. Most stuff you can get there, you can also get in the city or just order on the internet depending on what it is. And I agree to what you said about the Brühl - I really like the concept of that area, and it even looks kind of nice. It just doesn't work because people here, me included because I didn't really have a choice, cling to their cars and will go where there's free parking. So nobody goes there, which makes the area empty and depressing, which makes even less people go there. Yay.
This city is really badly designed in general if you ask me. Nothing is within walking distance, and busses and trams are all routed through the center, making it that you have to change lines at least once if you want to go somewhere else than the center. This means that it's almost always faster and more convenient to take the car. The university is split in parts between which I had to switch a lot, either by riding a crammed bus or by taking the car and having free parking spaces, guess what I chose. They made it better now and built a tram though, so props for that. Also built a dope new library. But even walking between buildings in one university part took way longer than it should because of all the parking spaces. And you can't change that because people here are used to their cars.
This year, I'll move from here to Mittweida for my masters. I've seen the college where I'll be and it's much better. You can walk fast and easily to every location you need to go to, it is quieter because of less cars and the center looks nicer. That city is smaller too, but even with that in mind the differences are huge. I'm more of a fan of smaller cities and towns anyway.
Do you have a hypothesis for why so many of these satellite malls popped up in Chemnitz? Given what you said about the public transport being extremely monocentric, why would an investor doing a new-build retail project want to set up something like the Chemnitz-Center at the edge of town away from the public transport instead of a city-center or inner-ring suburban mall right next to a train station like in many other German cities (ie. Alexa, Gesundbrunnen-Center or Spandau Arcaden to give some Berlin examples)? Is it that much more difficult to build a mall in the center of Chemnitz than in Berlin-Mitte or Brunnenviertel?
To be fair there is a mall right in the city center next to the central bus and tram stop (Galerie roter Turm). Also the Sachsen Allee is in walking distance of the central train station (10-15 minutes).
@@samlerman-hahn2674 my bet is because the city is coughing up money for them to be built.
It warms my heart that what you described as optimal solution happened in my home city olomouc in czechia. It is basically a student city where 20% of inhabitants are students of 1 university so public transport is important. There is a sattelite mall that died down called olympia after they built malls in the inner city like Moritz or Šantovka. All the customers shifted there because its on their way to bus to go home every single day so its easy to get to. But as every city the traffic gets bad at rush hours, so I hope they will introduce car entry limit soon, with which they are currently experimenting in Prague! If that happens it will be an ideal city to live in!
So, the government intervened to build the facilities and redirect consumer traffic and thus subsidize businesses in a wealthy part of town, collapsing the long-established businesses in other parts of town, and this is a good thing?
as to 10:20
Here in Tokyo we already have a handful of these IKEAs. They are absolutely amazing.
Not only does it make shopping for furniture much easier and integratable into a day in the city (the IKEA in shibuya is in the heart of the district for examble), it also removes the confusion that navigating an IKEA always brought with it.
I don't own a car, not a single colleague of mine owns a car, these IKEAs have changed our ways of shopping for european style furniture.
I was just in Tokyo and those IKEAs in busy pedestrian areas completely blew my mind! Honestly this felt like true innovation, even better than your hot beverage vending machines 😄
Ikea furniture is dreadful.
@@MilwaukeeF40C and im happy to have the option to buy it no matter what your taste is
I recomend you reading José Saramago's "The Cave".
Though not directly linked with transportation and car, it gives you an idea of what would a world run by a huge city mall would be like
Humans: Love to live in wide spaces, and hate being stacked on top of each other
This channel:
He’s a communist what do you expect?
I really like the idea of stores in the center that will deliver the bigger goods to your home.
Hmm, something like... Amazon?
It'll certainly help this glorified "small businesses"😅
@@paulster185 Amazon doesn’t have a monopoly on home delivery. Plus we’re talking things you can’t bring on the train or bus.
@@paulster185 Not sure if Amazon sells lumber (like to build a deck). The other bits and pieces sure, but I'd be shocked if they sold sheets of plywood or 12 foot lengths of wood. I admit I have not checked though (maybe they do).
@@stevedixon921 I didn't know and checked. They do.
It's just funny when someone proposes "new brilliant idea" that was already implemented for years.
Beside "to home delivery" is a norm for bigger goods (don't tell me that seller want deliver you a fridge, for example).
@P: As someone who was around before Amazon (: I agree that, yep, Amazon IS home delivery. Before Amazon, not only did you not have CoVid, but shoppers, namely Boomers, were physically more mobile, and quantitative easing didn‘t hurt, either. EV’s and climate change wasn‘t around, much less urban planning. Some Americans conserved gas since Carter‘s stagflation, but the younger folks gladly drove SUV’s and trucks, and would have bought a Humvee. I dunno why Amazon doesn‘t play up its role in urban planning. I guess nobody thinks about it.
Leipzig also has one of these shopping centres; it is called Nova Eventis and you can only get there by car or bus 131.
(There is also a large Ikea across the street).
So you really didn't need to go to Chemnitz.
Technisch gesehen ist das Nova Eventis aber nicht in Leipzig, es ist ja nicht mal in Sachsen.😉
@@deltbuddy5067 Ich nehm an das is wie die SCS? Ist auch nicht mehr in Wien, aber nah genug, dass es Shopper aus Südwien absaugt und die beste Alternative zum hinkommen ist das Auto. Mit der Bim oder nem Shuttle kommt man auch hin, aber wer tut sich die Stunde mit umsteigen an, wenn man einfach 20 min mit dem Auto fahren kann
When I lived in Sydney, Australia (back in the early 2000s) I chose to live in the very inner suburbs, because the lifestyle there was so much better than the outer suburbs, which required car commutes everywhere. I worked out that - in the inner city - owning a car cost about $3,500 a year - factoring in that parking cost about $30 a week, registration about $850 a year, insurance about $200 a year (I had an old car that was only worth getting third party insurance for - as a younger driver it would have been over $2,000 a year if I had owned a car worth comprehensively insuring), and allowing between $500 - $1000 a year for servicing and maintenance. I didn't use my car to get to or from work (I either worked in the inner city where I could walk, or chose jobs outside of the city that were close to train stations or ferry stops), so I was also paying $30 - $50 a week for unlimited public transport within various distances from the city.
I figured $3,500 a year was a lot of money to pay for occasional weekend convenience, so got rid of the car, and rented the car space I wasn't using to a neighbour for $30 a week and had a very healthy budget to take taxis if I was coming home drunk at 2 in the morning and it was pouring rain and I didn't feel like a 15 - 20 minute walk back home from wherever I'd stumbled out of.
That budget also left plenty to occasionally hire a car for the week if I had hardware or furniture shopping to do. I suspect many cities have an equivalent of "Bayswater Car Rental" who, back then, had a fleet consisting only of white 5 door Toyota Corolla Hatchbacks, which could be had for under $300 for the week, complete with excess reduction down to a $300 excess. So, for the 1-3 weekends each year where I really needed a car, I could have one, along with the convenience of occasional door to door car travel (in a taxi, without the hassle of having to find anywhere to park), I was still paying less than owning a car (and that was without factoring in fuel or tolls or any of that).
There are plenty of ways to have the best of both worlds, and in a city of any reasonable size, it's still likely to work out cheaper and less stressful being car free
I say this as a bit of a "car guy" too, who loves nothing better than fanging a fast car around a winding country road. You can keep your city commuter driving though - I'll take the train any day of the week rather than sit in crawling city traffic. The leftover from the car budget has occasionally hired me something fun on holidays too: e.g. Mazda RX8, and Holden SSV Redline Commodore ("last of the V8 interceptors") ;)
I love your story. I completely agree. Maintaining a car could easily be $1000 a year, then there is petrol, registration, insurance and the price of the car itself which would easily be a subscription service of $4000 a year.
$4000 is a lot of money. I can live car free, rent a car for the occasional weekend outing, have a yearly overseas holiday, AND have change left over for retirement funds.
I especially like the fact that if you live around 15 minutes drive from your workplace, a used scooter/moped/Ebike will do everything a car does for $100 a year, and can be parked in a bicycle spot.
Cars definitely have their place, and I love an efficient hybrid, but I really find it hard to justify one for daily use.
You have a Mazda RX8? AWESOME! That's one of my favorite cars!
How were you paying more for rego then than I do now. Oh yeah. Lies.
I live in the Netherlands, the nation with the best cycling infrastructure around, where public transport is (according to all the UA-camrs) pretty amazing. I live in one of the big cities…
And even then, it’s insanely convenient having a car. Yeah, I said it. You can make your infrastructure as easily accessible by bike or walking/public transport as possible… But it’s still convenient having a car
This is the thing right, carrot AND stick. You guys seem to have cracked the code on carrot but the stick is probably lacking. I have seen other Dutch commentators on the internet writing this so dw, I believe you (even if it is a little inconvenient to the online urbanist narrative lol). Similar problem here in the UK too (although we have much less carrot esp when it comes to cycling) - like where I live, I have a lot of amenities in a 5-15 minute walking distance, and there is also a bus service which though infrequent is still very useful - and all of this is in the far-out suburbs of a large city. However, people still use their cars a lot, because it's just really convenient to do so. I think one great way to reduce convenience is to reduce car parking - free/cheap parking is a big factor in why people will still travel by car even when alternatives exist.
@@mouf725 Exactly, the small grocery store is like 10 minutes away by walking and also 10 minutes away with the bike because you need to grab it from storage. If you want to go to a bigger one? Well, that's 20 minutes one way by bike, no worries but yeah, it's something...
Flipside, do you want to go to work like 8 km (5 miles) away? Well, there's a bus route there but one bus only goes every 30 minutes, and well... Taking the bike is like 45 minutes.
Car? 15 minutes flat. I use my bike when it's above 20*C outside, but below that? Nah, sorry, I'll take the car.
Going to Amsterdam by public transport where I live? It's 20 minutes by bike to the nearest train station (don't bother with that 30 min waiting for the bus) and then 20 or 25 by train. It was a pain when I was studying there
The car? 30 in general, but it's better to drive 20, park for free... And take a 10-minute bus ride.
You CAN get everywhere by public transport and bike, but a car is faster and more convenient. I haven't had a car for like 5-6 years, everything felt doable but after I got a car again? Holy sh*t... Everything is so much easier. I feel that things should be designed for BOTH. And why did I buy a car? Because public transport sucks imo here. I live in Velserbroek, the Netherlands, in a small corner of the town where taking a bus is just... Garbage... because it just doesn't quite connect to the network. If I lived a kilometer closer to the centre of the little town? Everything would've been great but now the 15 minutes I take walking to where all the busses are? Yeah, I can just rather buy a car for 500 euros, costs me 30 euros a month in taxes and insurance.
Liffey Valley in Ireland is the quintissential satellite mall, when I was young, we would go there all the time in our car, but now that I live in the city centre with no car, how the hell will I get there, and because it’s so huge, there aren’t really any alternatives inside the city itself, kinda emblematic of Dublin itself tbh
Let's bring back horses.
Can't believe you talked about Chemnitz, the city I grew up in. That said, I have NEVER visited ANY of these satellite malls, as they are just hard to reach. Like, just go to the Sachsen-Allee or Roter Turm.
Ja man Sachsen-Allee in den 90gern bin ich immer gleich nach der Schule hin um im Spielzeugladen Playsi 1 zu spielen :D
I'm an American but spent the last 10 years in Korea and Japan where public transportation is fantastic, and I can get most of what I need in my local area by walking distance.
Now whenever I visit the US, I feel like I'm in car hell. Literally to do anything, I have to get into a car. And it takes longer to do things by car that I could do by public transportation in Asia; not just the driving but the traffic, finding parking, walking to and from the parking lot, and also getting gas.
And in Asia, I'm used to being on my feet and moving all the time. In America, I actually felt physically tired and uncomfortable spending so much time sitting in a car.
Yeah, and then people wonder why there's an obesity epidemic in the US. Sadly, the UK is going the same way. Over here it's a laziness epidemic though because a lot of places are accessible by walking or cycling, but more and more people are choosing to use their cars instead. I've noticed it with my own father. He used to walk places and go for rides on his bike. Now he uses his car to get everywhere. I've told him he could easily use his bike and a backpack to do small grocery runs, but I doubt he'll listen to my advice and his bike will continue to collect dust in the shed. Heck, I might even end up using it myself since he obviously has no intention of using it and it's a more lightweight bike than the heavy steel frame ones I own.
Sadly Leipzig does have some of those parking hell holes, there's one around ikea that is nearly unwalkable 😮💨
Yeah, for second I thought it was going to be Saalepark or whatever it is called these days.
i just clicked the link and it says that Cities Skylines is 70% off and not free to play, is it still going to be free to play?
I used to like biking around the city while living in a small town...ever since I moved to Brno, near every such exploration attempt ends with me being funneled into a car only highway (the road leading there not being properly marked as such) and me climbing the nearest slope away from the road for dear life...
Me too
prague and brno are unpleasant places ngl. Only passed thru prague a couple times and I hated every second of it. Lived in brno for a while and it was also terrible. Then I also lived in liberec for a bit and it was decent but google told me to walk on the highway way too many times. By far my favorite city was Znojmo. At least where I lived, on the outskirts, the centre was still accessible by both foot and bike.
I remember City Skylines getting feedback on players wanting to be able to build a less car centric city in the game, but it's not easy to do. At least in the first version, you need to overcome a certain threshold before you can afford adding subway stations all over your city. I hope it could come in SC2 but I think it will not.
Well, it's just like in real life. You will not build subway is small cities. It's too expensive.
You got buses and bike lanes in that game. Do small towns really need more?
@@Nala15-Artist Yeah that is true, but if my memory serves me right, even with a lot of busses people will still to a large extent take cars. I saw someone that made extensive bike lanes (maybe it was with mods I guess) but not sure how well it worked.
I’m so glad malls are dying and being abandoned. Maybe that land will be used for something to enhance humanity rather than destroy it.
My experience here in Sweden is that in towns it is still generally that cars are expected to yield to pedestrians, and are responsible doing so. That said, we do also have some horrid out of town malls (mostly DIY and big box stores). But the town centers aren’t dead. Also, there are busses that go to the malls …
Honestly you're really lucky to have bike/walking paths on the side of the street, there aren't any where I live.
I moved to Canada from Ukraine about 10 years ago and I 100% agree with Adam. One more shocking fact that I discovered when I moved here is that if you like nature you need to drive 100+ kilometers and pay 10$ every time you want to enjoy a river a lake or a mountain. That is why when the war is over I am planning to move back, actually I already preparing for my departure since 2017.
Omg yes, being from the Parisian region - more specifically the highly connected nearby suburbs (the "small crown" as we call it) - and being used to doing anything by using public transportations or going around by foot, my stay in Canada was uh. Not great in that regard. And I was in Ottawa-Gatineau! A place where the Quebecois/Ontario public transports are conveniently connected! But I was very much annoyed by the unnecessary sprawl and the stark contrast with the much older city centers of Gatineau and Ottawa (where I used to work).
Now I'm in Southern France, Marseille area, and man for the second metropolitan area of the country, it's horribly lacking in public transports. And since I can't drive for health reasons, well. I guess you can count me among the people who will request improved public transports with more trains especially.
Driving far away and paying for visiting nature - is a good thing. People's "enjoyment" is destruction from the nature point of view.
@@VFPn96kQT Agree. That is why in second biggest country in the world with low density of population people should not see nature. As well traveling distance must be increased to at least 200km because driving cars, building more malls and highways as well as making giant cities with plain boring residential districts is the only way not to hurt nature.
@@anatoliidudko7029 correct. Just FYI, the city with the population density of the city of Paris with the radius 200km (to get to your nature) will have 2 billion people in it. How many cities approach even 1% of such population? So you should never travel 200km to see nature in densely populated cities.
I used to be HYPER into freeways as any other car-loving American, interchanges and urban car skyways just wiped my world. But then... something happened.... something, called a 2 month trip to Japan. After experiencing both the Osaka and Tokyo metros and the Shinkansen connecting them, it opened my eyes to what a city, even ones not as massive, should be like
ANYWAYS back on topic, yes satellite malls suck, but many places even my own local city is turning them into superblocks with mixed use developments and green areas, and parking... for BIKES not cars. This is honestly a REALLY good idea, and actually following the narrative malls were supposed to be
Just use pocket cars like a normal person. You do not need parking spaces. You just put the car in your pocket, or take it out when needed. Like in Cities:Skyline.
Have you considered becoming an Urban Planner cause thats the best idea ive ever heard
Not in Leipzig itself, but about 15 km west of it is the NOVA, which would have been another prime example for a satellite mall, accessible by car or bus only. Oh, and did anyone notice that IKEA seems to have a hard-on for such locations as well?
A bit weird you didnt choose Nova Eventis in the west of Leipzig. Thats pretty much a satelite Mall. BTW i live in Leipzig too and plan roads, id really like to talk sometime :D
Halle Center Peißen would have been a good example as well. That place just feels more like a shitty American mall to me.
Chemnitz or how OGs call it: Karl-Marx-Stadt
Yeah great Soviet city planning there. Basically made the city a hellhole
another advantage of delivery is that it's WAY more environmental than car traffic, even when the truck is a big diesel truck.
a single delivery truck will always outperform 20 cars, even when those cars are Teslas.