The CMI8738 was (and apparently, still is) a great budget PCI sound chip! I used one for a long time because it had bit-perfect SPDIF output unlike the Sound Blaster Live I used before it.
@@alextirrellRI For sure. The noise floor on the analog outputs of a Live are much cleaner than this thing. Although I'm sure there are some CMI8738 boards that are built much better than this one.
Nice one! I got ESS Solo1 for such purpose and it really rocks. If I could say something to criticize it would be the IRQ/Address selection which has the classic Plug and Pray which forces you to tweak bios settings.
I demand a video of the Doom soundtrack but played through the $12 Ali Express card. Glorious stuff. Speaking of sound, your sound is improving! Keep up the good work!
Yeah after some experimentation I finally have an audio setup that seems to work consistently! Although the wavetable is pretty messed up for DOOM it sounds pretty decent in SB FM mode.
It appears the card is only good for FM, since you were unable to get digitized sound effects (especially those with continuous auto-dma buffers, like Doom or Descent) working. Still, I guess $12 to get Adlib sound is good, although for $50+ you can get an old card on ebay that works better. Thanks for taking the time to make the video, you've saved me a lot of time. Keep up the good work!
Digital sound effects actually work fine for some games. Jill of the Jungle, Vinyl Goddess from Mars, One Must Fall, Monster Bash, and even Doom works fine in straight up Sound Blaster mode in my testing. It just seems to be hit or miss.
I remember these "cut corner" cards being somewhat popular. I definitely remember some were C-Media, but I'm pretty sure other companies were using similar, if not the same, designs as well. Pretty cool!
"There is hardly anything in the world that someone cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price alone are that person's lawful prey." George P. Landow, Professor of English and the History of Art, Brown University.
Overkill was one of the first games I (my parents) purchased (it was a shareware floppy in a store). I've never heard many other people talk about it so I'm happy to see it featured here! 🙂
that DLS thing is kinda interesting though! some games like Final Fantasy 8 for PC support loading custom samples (DLS banks) for the MIDI soundtrack via something called DirectMusic. if you patch the game with samuel slight's ff8 dls soundfont it actually sounds pretty similar to the PS1 version. i'd say these cmedia thingies are pretty nifty for win9x and xp era games.
the Yamaha DS-XG, ESS Solo-1, and Avance Logic ALS4000 were some other DOS compatible PCI cards the SB Live and some Audigy models and the ESS Maestro or Allegro and the Aureal Vortex had some sort of DOS compatibility too but the FM synth was more inferior
Yeah PCI cards are usually shunned by most for DOS gaming. At the very least they are interesting though, and I will probably test more of them. I have a Yamaha XG sitting around somewhere.
Solo was the last useful card by ESS for DOS. Maestro and later are Windows cards, with some really crappy support for legacy. They have no FM part at all.
@@DOSStorm I was reading about this and it sounds like some of the 'XG' branded chips are Yamaha YMF724, YMF744B. Shouldn't be too surprising that a lot of Yamaha's products are pretty good when you consider that electronic organs, pianos, and synthesizers are something they kinda specialize in.
fair warning, they make this exact card with two different chips, the C-media one and what appears to be some sort of esoniq? they may have the same pinouts, but they do not have the same feature levels. the esoniq will do fine in windows, but the dos support is a .. well, better to stick with the cmedia one if you can, or as mentioned elsewhere, the ess solo-1, which trumps everything but an actual old sound card, a card with the PC/PCI or SB_LINK, or a compatible one with sbemu. and listings currently have the cmedia variant running around $9, shipped. though you have to hunt a bit for them.
Awesome to bring attention to an affordable modern alternative card. Not perfect, but for some, this may be a good starting point, or may just be enough.
I get all my small electronics for my kids powerwheels on Aliexpress. They're occasionally crappy quality and you gotta wait forever, but the price is always right. Soundcard though?
Aliexpress is an interesting place. At least pricing seems to be good unlike Wish most of the time. As for buying Soundcards on there...This definitely isn't the worst card I've ever tested.
This C-Media card is really great for the price, and I'm interested in learning more. Can you provide a link for that Solo-1? I wasn't able to find that in a search.
I had a different CMI8738 card back in 2002 and even then it was really cheap. However I'm not sure what I did back then, but I am pretty sure I did get sound to work with the games you said don't work. Have you tried the card in DOS and not within Windows 98? I never really played DOS games in Windows back then.
It looks like this chip was used on lots of boards around that time. They must have made a boatload of them to still be pouring into new cheap add-in cards over 20 years later.
Actually it was originally going to be the sequel to Jill of the Jungle. However, Epic wasn't satisfied with the quality of it, so it was renamed(story and sprites were changed as well I assume) and was released with a different publisher.
Yep. It has DOS drivers as well! I used these: archive.org/details/C-Media-PCI-Audio-Drivers-2.73 That archive has DOS, Windows 9X, and 2000 drivers. It even as a DOS based mixing utility for changing digital/FM levels.
@@DOSStorm I've had to re-evaluate my ct1600 snobbery after having a good listen to a few other chips with decent OPL3 like the ESS and the Aztech. Your video on the Crystal CX4235 got me curious. Btw, really enjoy your humour. Peace
Ah nice! I’ve just received a PCIe CMI8738. Just to experiment in getting it to work under Windows 98 and DOS. Windows 98 has been a succes thus far. DOS however, that’s a whole other story. Thanks for this awesome content!
I've also never seen such a "gameport"🤣 PCB looks like 💩, too. But the CMI does its job, so I think the card is worth its money if you're on limited budget. Anyway, a 2nd hand card with the ESS Solo-1 can be found for small money, too - and will win any comparison I guess.
The CMI8738 was (and apparently, still is) a great budget PCI sound chip! I used one for a long time because it had bit-perfect SPDIF output unlike the Sound Blaster Live I used before it.
I imagine that avoiding the card's DAC probably made it sound better as well.
@@alextirrellRI For sure. The noise floor on the analog outputs of a Live are much cleaner than this thing. Although I'm sure there are some CMI8738 boards that are built much better than this one.
C-Media Master race >:V/
OPL3 compatible FM-synth is not software emulated, it is integrated.
Yes, you're correct. Good point.
Nice one! I got ESS Solo1 for such purpose and it really rocks. If I could say something to criticize it would be the IRQ/Address selection which has the classic Plug and Pray which forces you to tweak bios settings.
I'll have to look into those as well thank you!
I demand a video of the Doom soundtrack but played through the $12 Ali Express card. Glorious stuff. Speaking of sound, your sound is improving! Keep up the good work!
Yeah after some experimentation I finally have an audio setup that seems to work consistently! Although the wavetable is pretty messed up for DOOM it sounds pretty decent in SB FM mode.
It appears the card is only good for FM, since you were unable to get digitized sound effects (especially those with continuous auto-dma buffers, like Doom or Descent) working. Still, I guess $12 to get Adlib sound is good, although for $50+ you can get an old card on ebay that works better. Thanks for taking the time to make the video, you've saved me a lot of time. Keep up the good work!
Digital sound effects actually work fine for some games. Jill of the Jungle, Vinyl Goddess from Mars, One Must Fall, Monster Bash, and even Doom works fine in straight up Sound Blaster mode in my testing. It just seems to be hit or miss.
I remember these "cut corner" cards being somewhat popular. I definitely remember some were C-Media, but I'm pretty sure other companies were using similar, if not the same, designs as well. Pretty cool!
I think some of the later Aural Vortex cards had a similar look, albeit with components that were much more high quality!
"There is hardly anything in the world that someone cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price alone are that person's lawful prey."
George P. Landow, Professor of English and the History of Art, Brown University.
Overkill was one of the first games I (my parents) purchased (it was a shareware floppy in a store). I've never heard many other people talk about it so I'm happy to see it featured here! 🙂
I'm actually working on another video that features Overkill as well! Great game that often gets overshadowed by Raptor and Tyrian.
that DLS thing is kinda interesting though! some games like Final Fantasy 8 for PC support loading custom samples (DLS banks) for the MIDI soundtrack via something called DirectMusic. if you patch the game with samuel slight's ff8 dls soundfont it actually sounds pretty similar to the PS1 version. i'd say these cmedia thingies are pretty nifty for win9x and xp era games.
the Yamaha DS-XG, ESS Solo-1, and Avance Logic ALS4000 were some other DOS compatible PCI cards
the SB Live and some Audigy models and the ESS Maestro or Allegro and the Aureal Vortex had some sort of DOS compatibility too but the FM synth was more inferior
Yeah PCI cards are usually shunned by most for DOS gaming. At the very least they are interesting though, and I will probably test more of them. I have a Yamaha XG sitting around somewhere.
Solo was the last useful card by ESS for DOS. Maestro and later are Windows cards, with some really crappy support for legacy. They have no FM part at all.
@@DOSStorm I was reading about this and it sounds like some of the 'XG' branded chips are Yamaha YMF724, YMF744B.
Shouldn't be too surprising that a lot of Yamaha's products are pretty good when you consider that electronic organs, pianos, and synthesizers are something they kinda specialize in.
fair warning, they make this exact card with two different chips, the C-media one and what appears to be some sort of esoniq? they may have the same pinouts, but they do not have the same feature levels. the esoniq will do fine in windows, but the dos support is a .. well, better to stick with the cmedia one if you can, or as mentioned elsewhere, the ess solo-1, which trumps everything but an actual old sound card, a card with the PC/PCI or SB_LINK, or a compatible one with sbemu.
and listings currently have the cmedia variant running around $9, shipped. though you have to hunt a bit for them.
Who'da thunk you could get something that didn't sound like screahing bats with a cheap sound card? Thanks for the review.
Its almost disappointing that it's not disgustingly terrible. Its cool that its a good ultra budget option though.
Awesome to bring attention to an affordable modern alternative card. Not perfect, but for some, this may be a good starting point, or may just be enough.
My thoughts exactly!
I get all my small electronics for my kids powerwheels on Aliexpress. They're occasionally crappy quality and you gotta wait forever, but the price is always right.
Soundcard though?
Aliexpress is an interesting place. At least pricing seems to be good unlike Wish most of the time. As for buying Soundcards on there...This definitely isn't the worst card I've ever tested.
Another option is the ESS Solo-1 also on AliExpress. Better DOS support.
Others have mentioned this as well....I'll look into it. I have some ESS cards I'm not sure if I have a Solo-1 though.
This C-Media card is really great for the price, and I'm interested in learning more. Can you provide a link for that Solo-1? I wasn't able to find that in a search.
@@brendanstone3073 I couldn't find it either. I do see a few people mention it though so maybe it was a limited stock thing that sold out?
we need the armpit audio for comparison
Yeah I really should have done my due diligence there.
Do you know if the gameport connects with external MIDI like MT32?
Well done !
I had a different CMI8738 card back in 2002 and even then it was really cheap. However I'm not sure what I did back then, but I am pretty sure I did get sound to work with the games you said don't work. Have you tried the card in DOS and not within Windows 98? I never really played DOS games in Windows back then.
Pretty decent option it looks like, especially for the price. Might have to try one of these out.
For the price its hard to go wrong even if it isn't perfect.
I had this soundchip onboard on my chaintech 7aja2/100 back in 2001
It looks like this chip was used on lots of boards around that time. They must have made a boatload of them to still be pouring into new cheap add-in cards over 20 years later.
I just bought a board with this built in. Should I use it or should I use an MWave modem? :P
Is it me, or does Vinyl Goddesses feel like a spiritual successor to GODS by the Bitmap Bros?
Actually it was originally going to be the sequel to Jill of the Jungle. However, Epic wasn't satisfied with the quality of it, so it was renamed(story and sprites were changed as well I assume) and was released with a different publisher.
@@DOSStorm Interesting! I thought of GODS, due to the fact Vinyl has a weapon like in that game.
@@NightSprinter It could very well be inspired by that game as well, I've never played Gods so I can't say for sure.
Wow that DOOM wavetable 😩
It will definitely haunt my dreams for the coming weeks.
It is real dosmode or just dos inside windows?
Yep. It has DOS drivers as well! I used these: archive.org/details/C-Media-PCI-Audio-Drivers-2.73
That archive has DOS, Windows 9X, and 2000 drivers. It even as a DOS based mixing utility for changing digital/FM levels.
Pretty impressive considering there are only a few components on the board.
I agree, all things considered it should be way more of a disaster.
@@DOSStorm I've had to re-evaluate my ct1600 snobbery after having a good listen to a few other chips with decent OPL3 like the ESS and the Aztech. Your video on the Crystal CX4235 got me curious. Btw, really enjoy your humour. Peace
@@esc2dos That is nice of you to say, thank you!
Ah nice! I’ve just received a PCIe CMI8738. Just to experiment in getting it to work under Windows 98 and DOS. Windows 98 has been a succes thus far. DOS however, that’s a whole other story.
Thanks for this awesome content!
Thanks for watching! That is quite interesting you were able to get PCI-E working in Windows 98. How difficult was that to get working?
Theres something wrong with the IRQ setup in wavetable mode.
You think I configured it wrong or that its just broken? I just thought it was implemented in an incomplete manner.
@@DOSStorm I had a somewhat lengthy reply for you but its gone. Is this comment still here?
@@memadmax69 Yeah I'm not sure. Did it have a link in it? UA-cam sometimes auto removes comments with links.
You know if the game port works?
It was detected by windows as working...I don't remember if I actually used it though.
I've also never seen such a "gameport"🤣 PCB looks like 💩, too. But the CMI does its job, so I think the card is worth its money if you're on limited budget. Anyway, a 2nd hand card with the ESS Solo-1 can be found for small money, too - and will win any comparison I guess.
The gameport is hilarious. This is definitely not super high quality product, but its fairly effective for what it is.
Does the gameport actually work?
Yeah it works, its plastic as hell but it works!
Turned out to be much better than I expected.
I know right? It's surprisingly usable.