This isn't really a fair comparison. The Twin Otter may have been used as a "commuter airplane" but that wasn't what it was designed for. It was designed to operate in the rough conditions of northern Canada or other similarly under-developed places. I flew them on floats, in off-strip operations in Northern Canada, where we landed on flat spots in the tundra, and on sea ice. You'll also find them flying to the North-Pole, or with the British Antarctic Survey, and in many other sparse-infrastructure environments. The Sky Courier appears to be idealized for carrying LD3 containers from paved, developed airports. It's probably a great airplane, but I doubt it would excel in the Twin Otter's playground.
Agree It beats it in one facet of the wheeled role, prepped strip. But off strip, ski's,wheel-ski,floats and amphibious floats..... Doesn't even come close
Exactly Johnny MAC, these are different planes designed for different purposes. One is supposed to be the Toyota 4 runner of planes, the other the Toyota Camry of planes.
You are right, the only plane design to match the capabilities of twin otter is the IAe's N219, because Indonesia is the worshiper of the mighty Twin Otter.....they felt that twin otter is the best aircraft for the mountaniuos jungles of papua
i flew the 208 for 17 years for fed-ex, this plane was designed with fed-ex and market in mind . with money from fed-ex also..yes i agree you are right the twin otter is better in the back country the 408 will be going into bigger airports i did LAX for years i predict it will be a great success, we waited for this a long time and darn i retired too early-lol But respect for the twin otter and her pilots great airplane but just to say for fun i put a caravan down on grand canyon west airport made the first taxi way only about 200 feet or so and the twin otter pilots spend days trying to do the same but they never could lol ( this was decades ago the airport rebuilt since then not the same now .)!
The Twin Otter has more range than 100nm ... check on that first. The upper wing fittings on the Cessna will become an issue soon in my opinion. The Cessna will need to fly several decades to match what the Twin Otter has accomplished. I loved working/flying on the -6 and -8 DeHavillands. Cessna makes a great aircraft but the over-engineered Twin Otter will always be the choice for rough field ops.
Exactly. A more comparable aircraft is the Dornier 228 and maybe the Islander. Although the Islander isn't ideal for rugged terrain, rather island hopping hence the name.
Not really a fair comparison. Cessna Skycourier and Twin Otter are built for different intentions. I flew the Otters and man it sure can take a beating on rough terrain runways thanks to the two rubber compression blocks on each side. The shortest take off I have done is 400m runway in Papua New Guinea unpaved runway with full load 5670kg and she flew like a fart in a bath, I doubt the skycourier can match that. In terms of comfy dont expect any from the Otters coz they are built for robust, shorthaul and nothing fancy just get the job done.
I always hated flying on Twin Otters because it usually meant I was flying into a frozen hell. But there is no other plane I would rather be on. It has gotten me on and out of some scary weather / places.
Twin Otters can get in and out of anywhere in the world. You can land them on water, ice, gravel, dirt roads, etc. I doubt any company will produce a decent competitor anytime soon. It's a niche market and DHC has nailed it. The SkyCourier is like a Ford Transit with wings. There is no way the SkyCourier has the STOL capabilities or ability to operate in harsh environments.
98% of the World does not have to worry about landing on snow, ice, water, gravel bars, etc. etc. Enjoy your financial collapse (read: Every single Canadian aviation company).
@@andreinarangel6227 funny . Viking air is doing well. and does not need Trump to bail itself out.. BTW how is being doing? the government still protecting it?
@@lloydertel1 @Lloyd Ertel How's Bombardier doing? How many billions of taxpayer cash did they take only to sell the regional jet line to Mitsubishi Heavy Industries for only half a billion? Then there's the billions given to them for the C-Series only to be given to Airbus for next to nothing. The funniest part is many of them will be built in the US.
@@tomsylvia1874 If you did any research. That money went to securing the PAYROLL. IF the us government would have kept it nose out of Canada's business. the money would have been paid back. thanks to the contract with Delta. BUT Trump and Boeing are butt buddies. got their wish. Bombardier was sold to airbus. and the crj is being made, Here hoping that the world sees Boeing as the 2-bit company. I will never fly anything they make. and would hope they do go under but with the friends in the white house.. we all know they can make planes that crash and it will not matter
One other consideration. The Twin Otter was produced in 1965 to 1988 and the SkyCourier was type certified on March 11, 2022. That is like comparing a 1965 Chevy pickup truck to a 2022 Ford pickup truck. No comparison. Besides I will take the Twin Otter over the SkyCourier any time despite its shortcomings compared to the SkyCourier. The Otter has proven its durability and usefulness many times over. It has been doing that for 57 years. Lets hear it for Canadian Aircraft design.
Isn’t that the complete opposite of what the Cessna 408 was made for its more of a light cargo plane than a stol aircraft that’s why there’s a giant cargo door it would be more like a cheaper atr
I came to know a real hero, a legendary pilot who flew and owned a Twin Otter. They could go anywhere. I will forever be, am aways grateful for for what he did for me. And I will never forget the advice he gave me.
I sure would prefer having my trusted DHC-6 300 in a downpour, sleet, wet snow etc, with it's highly effective windshield wipers. More so during a dark and stormy approach or taxiing in heavy precipitations. This is a glaring omission on the SkyCourier. CYUL
The Twotter also shines in ultra cold conditions. Kenn Borek Air has done a couple Antarctic medical evacuations when nobody else could because the DHC-6 can operate down to something like -60C, and do it on skis. I don’t think FedEx cares about skis. Horses for courses.
When the Cessna reaches the 10% of the Twin Otter fligth hours in harsh conditions i.e north an south pole during the winter we can start to talk about which is best
Hi! Take the Airplane to Nepal and operate to Lukla,Simikot,Talcha and manang thereafter you can compare whether Cessna can live upto Twin otter(Queen of STOL).
The real battle ground is Bugalaga airstrip in Papua Indonesia, i flew twin otter there with mldw and nothing can beat this twotter by far. But now i Caravan cuz they offered me more.
Shame age wasn't taken into consideration. The beloved twotter is around 50 years old. 2 generations older than the Cessna. I think cost per unit might have been a detail to focus on too.
Well I mean.. the Viking Air DHC-6 Series 400 with new Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6A-34 engines, new fully integrated Honeywell Primus Apex digital avionics suite and almost 800 modifications is hardly the same plane as its grandparent. And that is the plane being referenced.
Quick note: the Twin Otter nowadays can be equipped with Garmin G1000 avionics also. And I think that the Twin Otter will surely retain its wide use cases and more extreme usage, while the Cessna will be good as a short haul cargo and passenger commuter aircraft, and I see people like FedEx replacing their Caravans with those.
Interesting performance comparison. Was hoping for some initial and operating cost comparisons, too. But it appears that the Cessna is intended to earn it's livelihood largely off of pavement while the Twin Otter remains a versatile multi-environment workhorse.
These two aircraft are made for two very distinct roles, making this comparison biased. The Cessna C408 SkyCourier is designed for cargo transport between cities from long paved runways, while the Twin Otter is a STOL off-pavement bush plane. The Cessna C408 SkyCourier needs a 3,000-foot paved strip versus the STOL Twin Otter, which can be airborne with a full load in 1000 feet off dirt, gravel, sand, whatever.
It would interesting to see how peple reacts to it in terms of operations. I work on DHC-6 and for sure that plane something else. In terms of looks I go for the twin otta.
Both beautiful aircraft. I haven't seen anything on the Skycourier's field maintainability, an area where the TWOtter has a long held reputation. I'd be interested to see it on floats.
Looks like it's the Otter hands down. We have an island off the coast that has a short runway, cliff to cliff. We used to pilot out there for adventure seekers in all kinds of weather onto a dirt runway. That Otter never let us down, nailed T&L every time. Miss the old gal.
I have flown the Twin Otter into short strips in North Africa on very hot days. I'm not knocking the Cessna. It is probably a great aircraft for short haul package delivery in North America. But a Twin Otter it is not.
Cessna may have taken some of the DHC-6 looks but you will be in big trouble if you try flying where the Otters live. Maybe it is more of a baby Short SC.7 Skyvan.
"Tell me you don't know jack about the aviation industry without saying you don't know jack about the aviation industry." My man, claiming the 408 outpaces the DHC-6 and therefore must be the better aircraft is like calling a server computer terrible because "its graphics on GTA5 suck". This is an irrelevant comparison between two VERY dissimilar aircraft with VERY different mission profiles. The DHC-6 is optimized for STOL (as you may recall DHC's background of specializing in bush aircraft) whereas the 408 is optimized for carrying capacity and range. By sheer numbers on paper, the 408 may outpace the DHC-6 in just about every aspect, but good luck putting a 408 into the mountain jungle strips of New Guinea or sending it for a medevac mission to Antarctica. As much as the DHC-6 is purpose-built for operations in rough environments, the 408 is as purpose-built for efficient day-to-day cargo ops in modernized environments.
As other viewers complained you are comparing apples to pears here! Those airplanes are designed for total different jobs, just because both are twin engines, high wing and similar size does not mean they are in any way even close to comparable. Cessna has it‘s plane designed after specifications from FedEx and I‘m sure Cessna has done a great job in doing so. DeHavilland has designed the twin Otter as a rugged bush plane serving in highly demanding environments and has done this with such great success that up to this day it is without any competitor! Please leave the comparing of aircrafts to professionals. You have a very long way to go until you comprehend the complexity of comparing aircrafts. I have been flying for over 40 years and over 60 different aircrafts and I would hesitate to tackle a comparison of aircrafts I have not extensively used or at least flown myself.
Twin otter with STOL capabality and Skycourier without STOL capability. Not a fair comparison. I fly twin otter and it can fly with 19 passengers in and 16 passengers out of 400 meters/1300 feet unpaved runway. Skycourier? I don't think it can.
Skycouriers appear to be an up powered high wing twin:Nice. Nothing really uniquely new. The trusty old DHC-6 Twin Otter is a tried and true pick-up STOL; a work horse, for the field operations.The Courier is not a STOL, it's a Cessna, nice and pretty Commuter for nice runways. Aeronautical: Apples to oranges. Both no doubt good planes. Great to see the markets developing.
Can you put the Cessna on floats, or skis, or tundra tires? Can the Cessna land cross-ways on an uphill gravel beach? Can the Cessna take off from a frozen lake with 2 feet of slush on the ice? If not, then there is no comparison & the Twin Otter, which has been in the air since 1965, will outlast this competitor, as it has many others.
@@marlintheaviator Even if these configurations become available for the Cessna, it will still have a lot to prove to be considered alongside the Twin Otter. My experiences as a passenger in northern Canada (& those are just 2 of many) & those described by others in these comments constitute a very high bar in terms of versatility & reliability for the Cessna to match.
Ahora que estamos en pleno mundial de fútbol hablemos sobre este tema de aviación en términos futbolísticos de este Twin Otter vs Sky Courier. resultado final gana por 4 a 1 el legendario Twin Otter.
Been a admirer eversince my childhood,hanging and running around the local airport almost next from my elementary school Got familiar and experienced with all types of Cessna's particularly 206/skywagon with Missionairiy Aviation Fellowship.up to development of 208 grand caravan. Totally surprised when found the new 408.congrats with this new born.
There’d be something wrong if the Sky Courier couldn’t beat the Twin Otter in at least one department since the Twin Otter was designed in the sixties and the Sky Courier is not even in service yet 60 years later.
The whole purpose of the SkyCourier is that it can transport three industry standard LD3 transport containers. I don't imagine there are a lot of seaports (docks on a river, lake or inlet) that could load/unload LD3 containers from a float plane variant of the SkyCourier... Still good on Cessna for listening to the marketplace and building a plane for the new "air commuter hub courrier" niche.
You can not compare these two aircraft with each other they are both built for different purposes for example the twinotter can not fly as far as the Cessna SC with 19 passengers on board but the Cessna SC can not land at Sint Barth or Saba or most remote places in the third world countries that being said they are both exceptional good aircrafts !!!!
@@marlintheaviator it is not really designed as a STOL. it is about making money being able to put a can on here is BIG in the business world of fed-ex now if they wanted to redesign the twin otter to take cans then they might have been able to compete but i am glad fed-ex went with American company . we need to buy American as much as possible . i have not seen one place where fed-ex or Cessna said they were building a completion with the twin otter. hey the twatter is aa great airplane i give her much respect. do they even make the otter any more??? no way fed-ex is going to start out with 40 year old aircraft
@@dennisseeker36 They do make the Twin Otter still actually! It was stopped but Viking Air here in Canada vastly improved and modernized the Twin Otter, so now Twotters are still being ordered. It's still under the De Havilland Canada name (defunct company). Also, why would Fed-Ex need to buy American planes as much as possible? In reality though, these two planes are vastly different. The Dornier 228 is a better comparison to the Twin Otter. If FedEx ever wanted to do service in remote areas their current aircraft doesn't do well in, there's always the Twin Otter or Dornier. Dornier is also a defunct company and no one produces it, so I guess it's order new Twin Otters or buy second hand Dorniers. Lots of great aerospace manufacturers have gone out of business.
Yea that’s the only useful information since you be using the best plane for rugged short strips up in Can and Alaska for fishing trips. Armchair comparison, completely useless information. Cruise and range comparison also completely useless.
I have to Agee with all of these pilots who flew the Twotter into rough strips as in Canada, Papua New Guinea where I flew them, they were designed specifically for the Canadian Army as I understand, and has succeeded worldwide into very formidable terrain. The sky courier looks like a cross between a Beech 1900D and Twin Otter. The landing gear doesn't look robust enough for operating into really rough and sloped landing strips. We flew them into 17% strips in Papua New Guinea that were 300 to 350 meters long. Also the Twotter is a Proven aircraft with over 50 years.. and outstanding in the role it was designed for. Yes, in the same role as a caravan flying FedEx the Sky Courier will be great, in a Bush environment..no.. Two totally different aircraft and a lousy unfair comparison.
I have flown DHC-6 300 , Do-228 (dornier) and LET-410 in Nepal in hot and high STOL airfields. Lukla included. All these have advantages and disadvantages. All three are performing well in our severe condition. Wonder how this will perform in STOL fields. Will it be approved for STOL operations by FAA?
The cockpit is actually more comfortable than most, it's one of the only cockpits I actually fit in. Hand is only on the power levers when you take off and land so it doesn't make your arm sore
Having high throttles doesn't make your arms sore because you already have Popeye arms from the 45 gallon drums, drill mud, drill pipe, pop, frozen food, luggage and propane bottles you have been humping in and out of the plane all day. Not to mention the throttle friction knob.
a false controversy here: the otter has been evolving and perfected over many years. The cessna is a good attempt so far, and get back to us in a few decades to evaluate it fairly.
Not in your lifetime, people who skydive would not pay for a 5.5 million dollar airplane. And every single Sky Dive Operation I ever worked for as a pilot, flew pretty much junk!
I hope Regional Airlines will take interest in buying the Cessna SkyCourier soon right after the Twin Otter 300 & 400 Series are gone from passenger routes.
The main, and probably only target for the Cessna SkyCourier is cargo. It's not designed to be a passenger plane, and it's not comparable to the Twin Otter at all. Not sure about the Cessna landing gear though. Or is that still under development?
The gear for the courier (at least the prototypes) seem like they would make for a rough landing. Actually being one of its first passengers it was surprisingly smooth.
@@LadyInTheHangar That means you probably live in a very beautiful area. Happy for you. After watching the video again I realized the Twin Otter has an extremely short range. Didn't know it was so bad. And if the Cessna landing was so smooth I suppose there's nothing stopping the Cessna from becoming more popular than the Otter.
I'm hoping so. Plus the maintenance is pretty simple. It's in Kansas so it's pretty flat here but it's not too bad. Yes i did notice the range is farther however i did hear of possible plans of adding more fuel storage in the wings which could improve the range even more. I appreciate the comment!
As a Skydiver, I jumped out of the Twin otter scores of times down in Florida & Spain... Great jump aircraft... Does anyone know how the new Cessna Courier aircraft would fair as a jump plane?! Ciarán/Ireland.
Fly the Cessna from the Artic to the Antartic for a rescue in mid Antartic winter and then see how they match. DHC6 has done it 2 times on 2 different winters.
Good Video, Young Man. I Must however expand on your "4,000lb/ 100nm" range for the DHC-6. Viking Specs:-" Payload for 100nm Range is 4348 lb/1972 kg" and "Payload for 250nm Range is 3828 lb/1736 kg." Extrapolation of those 2 should put the DHC-6 "4,000 lb Payload Max Range" closer to 200 nm.
I just did my first SkyCourier revenue run last night. It flies like a dream. Built like a brick shithouse. It says Cessna on there but it’s mostly built by the Beechcraft folks at Textron. Lots of system commonality with the Beech 1900D and King Air 350. Cruised at 7000ft. Trued out at 208 burning 1000lbs per hour. On a 200nm flight with 1.5 reserve fuel I could take 4500 of cargo. 100nm flight I could take 5500lbs. It does what it’s built to do for FedEx. I have about 1000 hours in Twin Otters and they don’t compare at all. I needed about 3800ft of runway for balanced field length. The Twotter needs about 1500ft less. The SkyCourier is going off roading with Bering Air in Alaska on gravel strips. Bigger wheels and tires plus a gravel kit. Still not a Twotter so curious how it’s going to hold up. Where I can see it competing is Island hopping in the Caribbean. With 19 seats it’s roomier than the Twotter and a bit quieter. It’s an honest flying aircraft. Very light on the ailerons and a bit heavier on the elevators but much lighter than I expected. Single engine work is a breeze with the auto feather and rudder bias systems.
Considering that the Twin Otter was developed and first flown in 1965 , and joined the team of Beaver,Otter and twin Otter . Made for the very rugged Northern conditions of Canada as well as other places on earth . The SkyCourier is a combination of the Twin Otter and the Short Brothers SkyVane and 360 developed in 1963 and 1980 respectively . Cessna has just showed a lack of imagination on the design engineering side of things .
They startet the building oft the DHC 6 in 1965 and the SkyCourier is in developement since 2017 or so. There is a timespan of 52 years in between with many changes in aviation.
I hope aviation people realize the Sky Courier is designed for FedEx, but updates will be coming from the market demands. Floats and other landing gear could come later depending on the market.
Love and bias aside, when the otter was designed, it has been the king of its operations for a long time. I think the Cessna looked at this area of aviation and had the plans to improve on it everywhere it could to be a bit better and when they found someone who would commit to having the updated design be supported, it set the wheels in motion to just do things a bit better. I think both planes are brilliant, if I was going to start a charter business, I would start with the otter and eventually buy the Cessna when the business proves it has potential. Anyone with the capital would be thinking the same, this is presuming freight had any significant share in operations. Both do a good job, but if you can load the specific air cargo like the big boys, buying ready made tooling from proven, tested and reliable sources makes sense. We’re talking about pallets, the trolleys, tugs, you name it, the list to run a business in as many aspects as possible fits in better with a purpose built cargo plane that can do passengers too, I want one of each plane but like I said, start small in capital and upgrade if it works.
Different aircraft designed for different purposes. Cessna is going to make many dollars selling the SkyCourier just like they have the Caravan. Why?? Because they are going to be sold to a company that is desperately needing/wanting the machine. There will be many more of the twin Cessnas produced than any other twin turboprop. Commercial success is what makes a plane great. BUT, the Twin Otter thrives in it's designed for enviroment.
While the new Cessna looks a bit like the Twin Otter you’d be better comparing it with other older aircraft like the Australian GAF Nomad or the UK Shorts Skyvan and its derivatives. Both more contemporary with the Otter but also more like the Cessna in concept.
Well without knowing the minimum take off and landing length runway needed. The Otter is a proven Bush plane. It takes a betting in the mountains of Malaysia.... If the Cessna can't compete with that. It's just a FedEx plane...
Single point fuel port. Every rampies dream. Very excited to start seeing this come around. To be fair, I think the cessna would better go up against a beech1900. Would be funny to see one of these in the jazz colors.
I am surprised there is no mention of the Dornier 228. From what I can see the Twin Otter is far more versatile than the Cessna which is designed for the FedEx work using established hard runways.
I have flown many times over in the Dehavilland Twin Otter, which at times appears to be underpowered, but the Cessna aircraft is beautiful aircraft with more powerful and better looking engines and better propellers✅😊👍
This isn't really a fair comparison. The Twin Otter may have been used as a "commuter airplane" but that wasn't what it was designed for. It was designed to operate in the rough conditions of northern Canada or other similarly under-developed places. I flew them on floats, in off-strip operations in Northern Canada, where we landed on flat spots in the tundra, and on sea ice. You'll also find them flying to the North-Pole, or with the British Antarctic Survey, and in many other sparse-infrastructure environments. The Sky Courier appears to be idealized for carrying LD3 containers from paved, developed airports. It's probably a great airplane, but I doubt it would excel in the Twin Otter's playground.
Nailed it, cap. My thoughts exactly.
Agree
It beats it in one facet of the wheeled role, prepped strip.
But off strip, ski's,wheel-ski,floats and amphibious floats.....
Doesn't even come close
Exactly Johnny MAC, these are different planes designed for different purposes. One is supposed to be the Toyota 4 runner of planes, the other the Toyota Camry of planes.
You are right, the only plane design to match the capabilities of twin otter is the IAe's N219, because Indonesia is the worshiper of the mighty Twin Otter.....they felt that twin otter is the best aircraft for the mountaniuos jungles of papua
i flew the 208 for 17 years for fed-ex, this plane was designed with fed-ex and market in mind . with money from fed-ex also..yes i agree you are right the twin otter is better in the back country
the 408 will be going into bigger airports i did LAX for years
i predict it will be a great success, we waited for this a long time and darn i retired too early-lol
But respect for the twin otter and her pilots great airplane
but just to say for fun i put a caravan down on grand canyon west airport made the first taxi way only about 200 feet or so and the twin otter pilots spend days trying to do the same but they never could lol ( this was decades ago the airport rebuilt since then not the same now .)!
The Twin Otter has more range than 100nm ... check on that first. The upper wing fittings on the Cessna will become an issue soon in my opinion. The Cessna will need to fly several decades to match what the Twin Otter has accomplished. I loved working/flying on the -6 and -8 DeHavillands. Cessna makes a great aircraft but the over-engineered Twin Otter will always be the choice for rough field ops.
Not any comparison required, two totally different types and uses of aircraft.
How different are they?
@@luarbiasawaras8700 it's like minivan vs 4x4
Exactly. A more comparable aircraft is the Dornier 228 and maybe the Islander. Although the Islander isn't ideal for rugged terrain, rather island hopping hence the name.
@@luarbiasawaras8700 The Twin Otter is an STOL aircraft whereas the SkyCourier is not.
@@johannmckraken9399 okay, thanks
Not really a fair comparison. Cessna Skycourier and Twin Otter are built for different intentions. I flew the Otters and man it sure can take a beating on rough terrain runways thanks to the two rubber compression blocks on each side. The shortest take off I have done is 400m runway in Papua New Guinea unpaved runway with full load 5670kg and she flew like a fart in a bath, I doubt the skycourier can match that. In terms of comfy dont expect any from the Otters coz they are built for robust, shorthaul and nothing fancy just get the job done.
Thou art wise...
One of the best comments ever !😂
I always hated flying on Twin Otters because it usually meant I was flying into a frozen hell. But there is no other plane I would rather be on. It has gotten me on and out of some scary weather / places.
somthing called maldives and the maldives are hot and humid!?!?!?!?!?
Just with a quick glance, Im gonna say that the landing gear on the Twin Otter is considerably more robust in design than the Cessna
@ Monster's Inc,... Oh, those Urethane Blocks, Genius Shock Absorption!!
Can't beat a DeHavilland aircraft. Made to work hard with reliability!
Twin Otters can get in and out of anywhere in the world. You can land them on water, ice, gravel, dirt roads, etc. I doubt any company will produce a decent competitor anytime soon. It's a niche market and DHC has nailed it. The SkyCourier is like a Ford Transit with wings. There is no way the SkyCourier has the STOL capabilities or ability to operate in harsh environments.
Correct. The Twin-Otter is a STOL. The other plane is a high-wing version of a Beech twin:no where near a STOL at all.
Nothing really beats the twin otter. It’s very very versatile
The Cessna is purpose built for FedEx. Try landing it on snow, ice, water, gravel bars, etc etc.
98% of the World does not have to worry about landing on snow, ice, water, gravel bars, etc. etc. Enjoy your financial collapse (read: Every single Canadian aviation company).
@@andreinarangel6227 funny . Viking air is doing well. and does not need Trump to bail itself out.. BTW how is being doing? the government still protecting it?
You are right ua-cam.com/video/chDDl-SYDwc/v-deo.html
@@lloydertel1 @Lloyd Ertel How's Bombardier doing? How many billions of taxpayer cash did they take only to sell the regional jet line to Mitsubishi Heavy Industries for only half a billion? Then there's the billions given to them for the C-Series only to be given to Airbus for next to nothing. The funniest part is many of them will be built in the US.
@@tomsylvia1874 If you did any research. That money went to securing the PAYROLL. IF the us government would have kept it nose out of Canada's business. the money would have been paid back. thanks to the contract with Delta. BUT Trump and Boeing are butt buddies. got their wish. Bombardier was sold to airbus. and the crj is being made, Here hoping that the world sees Boeing as the 2-bit company. I will never fly anything they make. and would hope they do go under but with the friends in the white house.. we all know they can make planes that crash and it will not matter
Cessna have created a great airplane but the Otter is still the legend in my book!
One other consideration. The Twin Otter was produced in 1965 to 1988 and the SkyCourier was type certified on March 11, 2022. That is like comparing a 1965 Chevy pickup truck to a 2022 Ford pickup truck. No comparison. Besides I will take the Twin Otter over the SkyCourier any time despite its shortcomings compared to the SkyCourier. The Otter has proven its durability and usefulness many times over. It has been doing that for 57 years. Lets hear it for Canadian Aircraft design.
The twin otter is now back in production as the DHC6 400. It has a new flight deck and many composite parts to save weight.
With over 2000+ skydives and the majority of them out of Otters, I'm kinda partial to the aircraft. It's a brute of a workhorse.
Otters or Twin Otters? 2 different airplanes. Dhc3 vs Dhc6
Twin Otter all the way! Nothing can beat it. It simply has a much sturdier design. It can land on every surface, land and water.
Isn’t that the complete opposite of what the Cessna 408 was made for its more of a light cargo plane than a stol aircraft that’s why there’s a giant cargo door it would be more like a cheaper atr
I came to know a real hero, a legendary pilot who flew and owned a Twin Otter. They could go anywhere. I will forever be, am aways grateful for for what he did for me. And I will never forget the advice he gave me.
I'm working on twin OTTER SINCE 1997, and I think It's amazing and unique Aircraft.
Until the SkyCourier starts to show up on drop zones, the Twin Otter has nothing to fear.
I sure would prefer having my trusted DHC-6 300 in a downpour, sleet, wet snow etc, with it's highly effective windshield wipers.
More so during a dark and stormy approach or taxiing in heavy precipitations.
This is a glaring omission on the SkyCourier.
CYUL
The Twotter also shines in ultra cold conditions. Kenn Borek Air has done a couple Antarctic medical evacuations when nobody else could because the DHC-6 can operate down to something like -60C, and do it on skis. I don’t think FedEx cares about skis. Horses for courses.
Lol they definitely don’t care about skis
@@marlintheaviator Well..AMAZOOM does sell skies..
I was thinking about that very happening ... they were based here at YYC ( Calgary ) at the time . Was actually quite proud of them for that .
When the Cessna reaches the 10% of the Twin Otter fligth hours in harsh conditions i.e north an south pole during the winter we can start to talk about which is best
Hi! Take the Airplane to Nepal and operate to Lukla,Simikot,Talcha and manang thereafter you can compare whether Cessna can live upto Twin otter(Queen of STOL).
That’ll be the real battle ground
The real battle ground is Bugalaga airstrip in Papua Indonesia, i flew twin otter there with mldw and nothing can beat this twotter by far. But now i Caravan cuz they offered me more.
Skycourier is not a STOL aircraft. Period. It is not suitable for Nepal operation.
@@jetstreamalex really??
Very well said. Bring this new craft to the Nepalese skies n the remote airports of Nepal n see if Cessna is air-worthy
You should’ve compared the takeoff and landing distance.
Shame age wasn't taken into consideration. The beloved twotter is around 50 years old. 2 generations older than the Cessna. I think cost per unit might have been a detail to focus on too.
Well I mean.. the Viking Air DHC-6 Series 400 with new Pratt & Whitney Canada PT6A-34 engines, new fully integrated Honeywell Primus Apex digital avionics suite and almost 800 modifications is hardly the same plane as its grandparent. And that is the plane being referenced.
Quick note: the Twin Otter nowadays can be equipped with Garmin G1000 avionics also. And I think that the Twin Otter will surely retain its wide use cases and more extreme usage, while the Cessna will be good as a short haul cargo and passenger commuter aircraft, and I see people like FedEx replacing their Caravans with those.
Interesting performance comparison. Was hoping for some initial and operating cost comparisons, too. But it appears that the Cessna is intended to earn it's livelihood largely off of pavement while the Twin Otter remains a versatile multi-environment workhorse.
Very likely
These two aircraft are made for two very distinct roles, making this comparison biased.
The Cessna C408 SkyCourier is designed for cargo transport between cities from long paved runways, while the Twin Otter is a STOL off-pavement bush plane. The Cessna C408 SkyCourier needs a 3,000-foot paved strip versus the STOL Twin Otter, which can be airborne with a full load in 1000 feet off dirt, gravel, sand, whatever.
Been a Cessna pilot for 23 years. Cessna is prettier, Otter is tough and proven..take your pick.
Really? When it comes to looks I think the Canadian girl wins!
@@terryzanger7152 .. whatever floats your boat.. beauty lies in the eye of the beholder.
It would interesting to see how peple reacts to it in terms of operations. I work on DHC-6 and for sure that plane something else. In terms of looks I go for the twin otta.
You should compare the Cessna SkyCourier with Indonesia's N219. Both are in final testing phase.
They’re incredible similar!
The N219 will be more of a Twin Otter competitor than the SkyCourier
Both beautiful aircraft. I haven't seen anything on the Skycourier's field maintainability, an area where the TWOtter has a long held reputation. I'd be interested to see it on floats.
According to my "research", the Twin Otter still has much better STOL capability... much shorter take-off distance...
Looks like it's the Otter hands down. We have an island off the coast that has a short runway, cliff to cliff. We used to pilot out there for adventure seekers in all kinds of weather onto a dirt runway. That Otter never let us down, nailed T&L every time. Miss the old gal.
I have flown the Twin Otter into short strips in North Africa on very hot days. I'm not knocking the Cessna. It is probably a great aircraft for short haul package delivery in North America. But a Twin Otter it is not.
Great side by side comparison Marlin. I’m eager to see take-off and landing performance (actual) once flight testing is completed by Textron Aviation.
Thanks for your information...I need to know that.
I'm starting my new Airline by buying three units...1 Cargo & 2 Passenger.
Cessna may have taken some of the DHC-6 looks but you will be in big trouble if you try flying where the Otters live.
Maybe it is more of a baby Short SC.7 Skyvan.
"Tell me you don't know jack about the aviation industry without saying you don't know jack about the aviation industry." My man, claiming the 408 outpaces the DHC-6 and therefore must be the better aircraft is like calling a server computer terrible because "its graphics on GTA5 suck".
This is an irrelevant comparison between two VERY dissimilar aircraft with VERY different mission profiles. The DHC-6 is optimized for STOL (as you may recall DHC's background of specializing in bush aircraft) whereas the 408 is optimized for carrying capacity and range. By sheer numbers on paper, the 408 may outpace the DHC-6 in just about every aspect, but good luck putting a 408 into the mountain jungle strips of New Guinea or sending it for a medevac mission to Antarctica. As much as the DHC-6 is purpose-built for operations in rough environments, the 408 is as purpose-built for efficient day-to-day cargo ops in modernized environments.
As other viewers complained you are comparing apples to pears here!
Those airplanes are designed for total different jobs, just because both are twin engines, high wing and similar size does not mean they are in any way even close to comparable.
Cessna has it‘s plane designed after specifications from FedEx and I‘m sure Cessna has done a great job in doing so.
DeHavilland has designed the twin Otter as a rugged bush plane serving in highly demanding environments and has done this with such great success that up to this day it is without any competitor!
Please leave the comparing of aircrafts to professionals. You have a very long way to go until you comprehend the complexity of comparing aircrafts. I have been flying for over 40 years and over 60 different aircrafts and I would hesitate to tackle a comparison of aircrafts I have not extensively used or at least flown myself.
Excellent presentation!
Can the Cessna operate from 600 metre paved runways in ISA +10 conditions? Such as at TRPG airport?
Twin otter with STOL capabality and Skycourier without STOL capability. Not a fair comparison.
I fly twin otter and it can fly with 19 passengers in and 16 passengers out of 400 meters/1300 feet unpaved runway. Skycourier? I don't think it can.
It's like the DC-3 and the C-130 had a baby. Nice plane.
I Love The Twin Otter 300 Series I hope too fly on them soon!!!!!
Skycouriers appear to be an up powered high wing twin:Nice. Nothing really uniquely new. The trusty old DHC-6 Twin Otter is a tried and true pick-up STOL; a work horse, for the field operations.The Courier is not a STOL, it's a Cessna, nice and pretty Commuter for nice runways. Aeronautical: Apples to oranges. Both no doubt good planes. Great to see the markets developing.
Can you put the Cessna on floats, or skis, or tundra tires? Can the Cessna land cross-ways on an uphill gravel beach? Can the Cessna take off from a frozen lake with 2 feet of slush on the ice? If not, then there is no comparison & the Twin Otter, which has been in the air since 1965, will outlast this competitor, as it has many others.
I cannot currently independently confirm these configurations but do not rule them as an impossibility.
@@marlintheaviator Even if these configurations become available for the Cessna, it will still have a lot to prove to be considered alongside the Twin Otter. My experiences as a passenger in northern Canada (& those are just 2 of many) & those described by others in these comments constitute a very high bar in terms of versatility & reliability for the Cessna to match.
I agree, the Cessna SkyCourier will have a ton to prove.
I would hope the Cessna is better, it’s 56 years newer.
You could probably have a fleet of 6-10 otters for the price of a new Cessna.
Ahora que estamos en pleno mundial de fútbol hablemos sobre este tema de aviación en términos futbolísticos de este Twin Otter vs Sky Courier. resultado final gana por 4 a 1 el legendario Twin Otter.
Been a admirer eversince my childhood,hanging and running around the local airport almost next from my elementary school
Got familiar and experienced with all types of Cessna's particularly 206/skywagon with Missionairiy Aviation Fellowship.up to development of 208 grand caravan.
Totally surprised when found the new 408.congrats with this new born.
There’d be something wrong if the Sky Courier couldn’t beat the Twin Otter in at least one department since the Twin Otter was designed in the sixties and the Sky Courier is not even in service yet 60 years later.
I want to see a SkyCourier with pods for water takeoff / landings
The whole purpose of the SkyCourier is that it can transport three industry standard LD3 transport containers. I don't imagine there are a lot of seaports (docks on a river, lake or inlet) that could load/unload LD3 containers from a float plane variant of the SkyCourier... Still good on Cessna for listening to the marketplace and building a plane for the new "air commuter hub courrier" niche.
You can not compare these two aircraft with each other they are both built for different purposes for example the twinotter can not fly as far as the Cessna SC with 19 passengers on board but the Cessna SC can not land at Sint Barth or Saba or most remote places in the third world countries that being said they are both exceptional good aircrafts !!!!
Price wise the Cessna costs about the same as the BT-67, but the BT can carry an additional 2 LD3's
hey - neat vid but i expected to hear STOL characteristics.
Thanks & Sorry 😕
@@marlintheaviator it is not really designed as a STOL. it is about making money being able to put a can on here is BIG in the business world of fed-ex now if they wanted to redesign the twin otter to take cans then they might have been able to compete but i am glad fed-ex went with American company . we need to buy American as much as possible
. i have not seen one place where fed-ex or Cessna said they were building a completion with the twin otter. hey the twatter is aa great airplane i give her much respect. do they even make the otter any more??? no way fed-ex is going to start out with 40 year old aircraft
@@dennisseeker36 They do make the Twin Otter still actually! It was stopped but Viking Air here in Canada vastly improved and modernized the Twin Otter, so now Twotters are still being ordered. It's still under the De Havilland Canada name (defunct company).
Also, why would Fed-Ex need to buy American planes as much as possible? In reality though, these two planes are vastly different. The Dornier 228 is a better comparison to the Twin Otter. If FedEx ever wanted to do service in remote areas their current aircraft doesn't do well in, there's always the Twin Otter or Dornier. Dornier is also a defunct company and no one produces it, so I guess it's order new Twin Otters or buy second hand Dorniers. Lots of great aerospace manufacturers have gone out of business.
Yea that’s the only useful information since you be using the best plane for rugged short strips up in Can and Alaska for fishing trips. Armchair comparison, completely useless information. Cruise and range comparison also completely useless.
@@thecaynuck4694 - Don't forget the Kodiak for remote areas!
I have to Agee with all of these pilots who flew the Twotter into rough strips as in Canada, Papua New Guinea where I flew them, they were designed specifically for the Canadian Army as I understand, and has succeeded worldwide into very formidable terrain. The sky courier looks like a cross between a Beech 1900D and Twin Otter. The landing gear doesn't look robust enough for operating into really rough and sloped landing strips. We flew them into 17% strips in Papua New Guinea that were 300 to 350 meters long. Also the Twotter is a Proven aircraft with over 50 years.. and outstanding in the role it was designed for. Yes, in the same role as a caravan flying FedEx the Sky Courier will be great, in a Bush environment..no.. Two totally different aircraft and a lousy unfair comparison.
Depends what do u wanna do...
That’s also a good point
I'm really interested in seeing Cessna bring it into service at U.S $5.5 million, as projected. That would make it a Steal!!
Definitely!
I have flown DHC-6 300 , Do-228 (dornier) and LET-410 in Nepal in hot and high STOL airfields. Lukla included. All these have advantages and disadvantages. All three are performing well in our severe condition. Wonder how this will perform in STOL fields. Will it be approved for STOL operations by FAA?
I've never flown a DHC6, but I always felt like it would make my arm tired, keeping a hand on the throttles.
Lol yeah it must be very uncomfortable
@@marlintheaviator apparently not...
The cockpit is actually more comfortable than most, it's one of the only cockpits I actually fit in. Hand is only on the power levers when you take off and land so it doesn't make your arm sore
@@douglassperlich6329 Thanks Douglas, I was about to mention the fact that there's something called "Throttle Friction"!😀✌🇬🇾
Having high throttles doesn't make your arms sore because you already have Popeye arms from the 45 gallon drums, drill mud, drill pipe, pop, frozen food, luggage and propane bottles you have been humping in and out of the plane all day. Not to mention the throttle friction knob.
a false controversy here: the otter has been evolving and perfected over many years. The cessna is a good attempt so far, and get back to us in a few decades to evaluate it fairly.
do we know any facts on the cessna? I assume the Cessna can do this and that? but has it been proved? the twin otter has been proven
Would like to see the SkyCourier in a Skydiving operation.
That’s very probable.
Not in your lifetime, people who skydive would not pay for a 5.5 million dollar airplane. And every single Sky Dive Operation I ever worked for as a pilot, flew pretty much junk!
The Otter has true bonafides, The Cessna has great promise with much better performance. We may see soon, mods to the Otter. Just an opinion.
Info on fuel burn and TBO? Performance differences for short haul aren't much different considering 1500 vs 2200 hp.
I hope Regional Airlines will take interest in buying the Cessna SkyCourier soon right after the Twin Otter 300 & 400 Series are gone from passenger routes.
I'm not sure if the the regional airlines will pick up these aircraft to their fleets.
The main, and probably only target for the Cessna SkyCourier is cargo. It's not designed to be a passenger plane, and it's not comparable to the Twin Otter at all.
Not sure about the Cessna landing gear though. Or is that still under development?
This would be how the final product looks
The gear for the courier (at least the prototypes) seem like they would make for a rough landing. Actually being one of its first passengers it was surprisingly smooth.
@@LadyInTheHangar That means you probably live in a very beautiful area. Happy for you.
After watching the video again I realized the Twin Otter has an extremely short range. Didn't know it was so bad. And if the Cessna landing was so smooth I suppose there's nothing stopping the Cessna from becoming more popular than the Otter.
I'm hoping so. Plus the maintenance is pretty simple. It's in Kansas so it's pretty flat here but it's not too bad. Yes i did notice the range is farther however i did hear of possible plans of adding more fuel storage in the wings which could improve the range even more. I appreciate the comment!
Also, i have the take off from my flight on my channel if anyone would like to check it out.
As a Skydiver, I jumped out of the Twin otter scores of times down in Florida & Spain... Great jump aircraft... Does anyone know how the new Cessna Courier aircraft would fair as a jump plane?! Ciarán/Ireland.
You could also compare those aircraft with the Dornier D228
Good idea
And we also used a Canadian DHC6 and a Turbine Single Otter to carry people from Patriot Hills camp to the South Pole Station, Antarctica….
Twin Otters have been in use for over 55 years, let's see if the SkyCourier can match that.
Fly the Cessna from the Artic to the Antartic for a rescue in mid Antartic winter and then see how they match. DHC6 has done it 2 times on 2 different winters.
no skis or floats for the cessna....dhc6 has wingtips tanks, not mentioned...
Good Video, Young Man. I Must however expand on your "4,000lb/ 100nm" range for the DHC-6. Viking Specs:-" Payload for 100nm Range is 4348 lb/1972 kg" and "Payload for 250nm Range is 3828 lb/1736 kg."
Extrapolation of those 2 should put the DHC-6 "4,000 lb Payload Max Range" closer to 200 nm.
I just did my first SkyCourier revenue run last night. It flies like a dream. Built like a brick shithouse. It says Cessna on there but it’s mostly built by the Beechcraft folks at Textron. Lots of system commonality with the Beech 1900D and King Air 350. Cruised at 7000ft. Trued out at 208 burning 1000lbs per hour. On a 200nm flight with 1.5 reserve fuel I could take 4500 of cargo. 100nm flight I could take 5500lbs. It does what it’s built to do for FedEx. I have about 1000 hours in Twin Otters and they don’t compare at all. I needed about 3800ft of runway for balanced field length. The Twotter needs about 1500ft less. The SkyCourier is going off roading with Bering Air in Alaska on gravel strips. Bigger wheels and tires plus a gravel kit. Still not a Twotter so curious how it’s going to hold up. Where I can see it competing is Island hopping in the Caribbean. With 19 seats it’s roomier than the Twotter and a bit quieter. It’s an honest flying aircraft. Very light on the ailerons and a bit heavier on the elevators but much lighter than I expected. Single engine work is a breeze with the auto feather and rudder bias systems.
I'll let you know what I think of the Skycourier after I jump out of it.
Lol
Considering that the Twin Otter was developed and first flown in 1965 , and joined the team of Beaver,Otter and twin Otter . Made for the very rugged Northern conditions of Canada as well as other places on earth . The SkyCourier is a combination of the Twin Otter and the Short Brothers SkyVane and 360 developed in 1963 and 1980 respectively . Cessna has just showed a lack of imagination on the design engineering side of things .
They startet the building oft the DHC 6 in 1965 and the SkyCourier is in developement since 2017 or so. There is a timespan of 52 years in between with many changes in aviation.
And yet the Laws of Physics an Aerodynamics have not...
The Twin Otter has been, for many years, our Jeep Willys in Colombia, incomparable!!!
How about a comparison between three aircraft. The Shorts Skyvan, Cessna SkyCourier and the Twin Otter-?
The Cessna’s longer range will come in handy when it has to turn round and return home because it can’t land where the Twin Otter does.
I hope aviation people realize the Sky Courier is designed for FedEx, but updates will be coming from the market demands. Floats and other landing gear could come later depending on the market.
Love and bias aside, when the otter was designed, it has been the king of its operations for a long time. I think the Cessna looked at this area of aviation and had the plans to improve on it everywhere it could to be a bit better and when they found someone who would commit to having the updated design be supported, it set the wheels in motion to just do things a bit better. I think both planes are brilliant, if I was going to start a charter business, I would start with the otter and eventually buy the Cessna when the business proves it has potential. Anyone with the capital would be thinking the same, this is presuming freight had any significant share in operations. Both do a good job, but if you can load the specific air cargo like the big boys, buying ready made tooling from proven, tested and reliable sources makes sense. We’re talking about pallets, the trolleys, tugs, you name it, the list to run a business in as many aspects as possible fits in better with a purpose built cargo plane that can do passengers too, I want one of each plane but like I said, start small in capital and upgrade if it works.
Different aircraft designed for different purposes. Cessna is going to make many dollars selling the SkyCourier just like they have the Caravan. Why?? Because they are going to be sold to a company that is desperately needing/wanting the machine. There will be many more of the twin Cessnas produced than any other twin turboprop. Commercial success is what makes a plane great. BUT, the Twin Otter thrives in it's designed for enviroment.
Twin otter truly tried and proven. A very adaptable aircraft. The Cessna Skycourier wont match it's Stol capabilities
They don't need to.
The STOL capability hurt the range and payload.
The Cessna will do fine. Faster even though it may need more runway. Will probably ride better, too.
While the new Cessna looks a bit like the Twin Otter you’d be better comparing it with other older aircraft like the Australian GAF Nomad or the UK Shorts Skyvan and its derivatives. Both more contemporary with the Otter but also more like the Cessna in concept.
Or the shorts 330/360 or the casa 212 or lots of other non pressurised twins with squarish cabins.
Hi, great comparison, Do you have the information about the flap angles for both aircraft?
What about comparing the purchase and operating costs of the two aircraft? Which is more cost effective?
Would be interesting to see if somebody put the Cessna on floats.
It would be
Twin Otter stol performance will put it to shame but not in the Load Carrying Capacity.
Agreed
Well without knowing the minimum take off and landing length runway needed. The Otter is a proven Bush plane. It takes a betting in the mountains of Malaysia.... If the Cessna can't compete with that. It's just a FedEx plane...
Single point fuel port. Every rampies dream.
Very excited to start seeing this come around.
To be fair, I think the cessna would better go up against a beech1900. Would be funny to see one of these in the jazz colors.
I guess it would come down to which airplane provides a smoother flight? Whether cargo or people, no one likes things rattled or broken.
The new type of exhaust i ever seen
Is the landing gear retractable in the Cessna?
It is not
Spec’s would be great on runway length soft field takeoff and landing…. Good comparison though…
I am surprised there is no mention of the Dornier 228. From what I can see the Twin Otter is far more versatile than the Cessna which is designed for the FedEx work using established hard runways.
STOL wing? high lift more drag? Do you understand aircraft at all?
DHC6 has been around for 55 years, wonder why?
Would be interested in a cost comparison.
The twin otter is much more pleasing to the eye. The gear legs,lift strut attachment on the Cessna are goofy.
The square-ish shape of the Cessna SkyCourier throws it off a bit for me.
I have flown many times over in the Dehavilland Twin Otter, which at times appears to be underpowered, but the Cessna aircraft is beautiful aircraft with more powerful and better looking engines and better propellers✅😊👍
LOOKS LIKE IT WILL BE AGREAT A/C FOR FED EX & OTHER CARRIERS THAT PURCHASE IT. IS IT CONSIDERED A STOL LIKE THE DHC 6 ?
Can the Cessna operate at temperatures of minus 60 degrees Celsius? Can it be fitted with floats or skis and land on a gravel runway?