On a funny related note: most native speakers can't pass the C2 level exam in their own language (lots of technical grammar stuff most people either never knew or forgot even if they did at some point learn it in school).
Most of the people are dumb and they could not pass even C1 exam with their limited vocabulary. Half of the white population is in the range of 85-100 points of IQ. The 2nd half is not much better... www.researchgate.net/figure/Sample-Itens-at-5-Levels-of-NALS-Literacy-and-Percentage-of-White-Adults-Performing-at_tbl3_237537863
I think this is an indication that the exams don't do a good job of testing language proficiency. When I took a practice C1 exam in Greek last year, I noticed that many of the questions were SAT-style questions that were really testing your ability to make inferences more than anything. I don't think it makes sense to include questions like this on a language exam because language proficiency and intelligence are two completely different things; you should be able to get a perfect score if you are a native speaker, even if you're as dumb as a brick.
@Fryrish i know what it means. My point is that people in general are stupid. 80-115 points has nothing common with 'intelligence'. But the worst thing these idiots rule in the idiocracy. Tyranny of the majority.
Maybe the real question to ask yourself is “At what level of social interaction would I want to be taken seriously by native speakers in my target language?” Two examples from my own experience: My father grew up in Italy and immigrated to the USA after completing the classical liceo in Rome. He went on to get a PhD in the USA, married, had a family, and lived here for over 60 years. His speech and writing were much more sophisticated (and grammatically correct) than 99% (or better) of native American speakers. But he still had an accent - it wasn't the stereotyped Italian accent, in fact wasn't even recognizable as Italian. You could tell he was “foreign born". Despite that, he was always respected at all levels of interaction. I grew up speaking Italian and our dialect, and I could communicate entirely well - with the proper accent, body language, gestures, etc. But my level was determined mostly by my grandparents, relatives and other “paesani” in our circle (in NY, mid 20th Century). So, even though I have advanced degrees and am a professional, when I spoke Italian, I sounded like a peasant (a time-shifted peasant at that!). I was fluent at that level, but when I would interact with Italian customers and coworkers, I could tell that I was being judged harshly because my language was more appropriate for a peasant than a professional. I'd rather be in my father's position than mine, which is why I'm working really hard now to get to the "well-educated foreigner” level in Italian. Not native - I'll never be that in Standard Italian. But I can at least have a large vocabulary and get the grammar right. And every once in a while, I can throw in some dialect for some "color". :). Overall, I think that's a much better goal than " speaking like a native”.
But why are we putting a "peasant" native on one scale and an educated foreigner on another? Being proficient in a language and sounding like a native are not mutually exclusive.
I experienced something similar practicing my Romanian with my grandmother. Certain words and the way certain vowels are slurred in her dialect made me sound awkward to the native youth when I started learning Romanian but because I starting studying as an adult it was a quick fix
In my American college, I had a woman from Japan as an English professor. She had a PhD in English, and taught Americans. But she also spoke with a heavy Japanese accent. I was the native speaker and she was the non-native. Even though she knew every bit of English grammar to perfection, nobody would ever mistake her for a native speaker.
I saw this comment before watching the video and thought it was stupid, americans do say peasant. Then I saw how Luca used it. The american peasant? That was weird.
@@andresanchez728 Yeah. We do use the word peasant, mostly when talking about actual peasants, but we generally do not use it when referring to our citizens (even our lower class), that is, unless we are specifically trying to insult someone.
@@FinancialHealth-ku1ry Sure he could have but it wouldn't have conveyed the same meaning. So why would he want to? I'd venture a guess that there was only one dislike back then and that's what Enes referred to. His only mistake, really, is the commas, which we don't use with defining clauses.
Im from philippines and working in taiwan and currently learning mandarin and english as well. Im watching ur videos every single day and im learning alot from it. Thanks much LUCA😊
i'm from the philippines too.. i've learned to speak spanish through the internet.. right now i'm working on my russian.. in my experience the best way to learn a language is through comprehensible input, that is, constant exposure to comprehensible input..
@@мирвовсеммире-ы1и wow nice! Im planning to learn spanish also im doing part time job in the hotel here in taiwan and sometimes we have spanish guest and there are already spanish words that we are using in the phils😆 so it really exciting to learn
I've experienced switching to a language to which I'm a native speaker at, making me a native speaker of two different languages in different times. As a kid, I've always expressed myself in Filipino (Standardized Tagalog="Tagalog" in layman's term)--talked,cried, argued, and everything else that involves colloquial expression; all of those in Filipino). However, when I got to 4th grade, I was transferred to a public school and everything was almost expressed in Cebuano. I was already an L2 speaker of Cebuano during that time but I was not a "native speaker" (I don't express myself nor even talk to myself in Cebuano). During those times of heavy immersion to the language, I gradually transitioned into a Cebuano native speaker. At this point in time, I think I'm a native speaker of Cebuano even though Filipino and English were my first languages :D
The relevant challenge in a second language is fluency and "connection". Establishing the bridge for interacting with ideas, enhancing the collective value from a mere transactional communication. At this point, the richness of each experience matters, and team cognitive process emerges through a common identity or purpose. As you mentioned, body language, intonation counts as much as the message (7_38_55 rule from Albert Mehrabian) for achieving this goal, in other words, a true storyteller. Metaphors, stories, idiomatic expressions are so powerful in effective communication, and a good sample of it is your comparison: Abroad professor living a long time in the country, vs. a native peasant. The teacher has more tools for verbal and written communication, but from the cultural approach never at the same level of natives. Thanks for sharing.
This is so accurate I could say it's a very important lesson to be taught when you are learning a language. It's awful knowing that a number of people confuse being at a C2 level and being a native speaker and for that reason they quit learning a language! I think don't even we can reach a c2 level in our own language if it's not through proper courses or studies, so for me it doesn't matter the level of your target language you are but the eager you are to learn it, and knowing more about other cultures, places or customs helps a lot. Cheers! Gracias Luca, te mereces más seguidores macho! ^_^
Great video. One more point I would like to say is the need to become a “native speaker”. Culturally speaking, the perspective that a foreigner see a country is always different than a native, no matter how much you try to absorb the local culture. But there’s nothing wrong with that. I treasure the mixture of my international knowledge. On the other hand, those “natives” are always interested in how they are seen by the foreigners too!
Luca, this was great! Loved the language "impersonations". I really appreciate all of the "tips" videos that you put together, but if I had one wish, it would be to hear more of you actually speaking the languages you've learned. Your accents in the various languages always sound so spot-on, and I have to admit that I feel far more inspired when I see you switching languages rapid-fire in conversation with Matthew Youlden, or going into various topics in quite some depth with Richard Simcott across ten or so languages (about half of which I can understand, but that's what subtitles are for). This is what initially moved me so much about the online polyglot community - not as some cheap party trick, but as the ultimate expression of the decades of work that you've put in. It comes across like you're having so much fun with it, and for me, when I see it, that's what drives me to hit the books and study - not more generic videos like "the benefits of learning a language". Please don't misinterpret this - it's not a complaint. I appreciate everything you're doing! Just wanted to express my excitement for your speaking videos. Groetjes uit Nederland!
Nice video! It took me a while to accept the fact that I'll never become a native German speaker, but it's actually a refreshing, calming feeling once you just accept it. And it's true...those moments where you somehow pass for a native even for just a few seconds/minutes are quite fun :)
Francesco Camuglia It’s very comforting indeed, as Luca mentions, when I realized how precisely one speaks, it’s possible to have the best of all worlds. As with any skill, the better it becomes, the more valuable it is, without taking away our identities.
Its not true, i moved to germany when i was a kid and learned the language and pronounciation in around 6 years. As an adult you can still learn it. Observe other people very closely, work on your pronounciation, try expressing your feeling with common idioms and it will become natural to you
well-done!!! I observed that Luca has a systematic approach based on a psychological point of view when he explores different aspects of learning foreign languages. i would say that Luca is a linguistic psychotherapist who corrects unrealistic expectations.
The point made at 4:30 ish was just amazing. I had never actually noticed those things! Could you make a video about the different body language and mannerisms you noticed in each of the languages you studied (or maybe your 5 best languages idk), that would be super helpful! The french one just cracked me up 😂
Please a Video of you imitating the gestures of other Language speakers. Your German example was accurate (and that coming from a German), as well as the Spanish example. But your French one almost killed me mdr😂
Thanks Luca. Important video and wellt thought arguments. It is a nice feeling to be mistaken for a native speaker, but you are right that sooner or later your real identity will be revealed, so it’s always a question why strive to be taken for a native speak if you are not one. Look forward to your next videos.
I think too many people concentrate on native proficiency when native speakers of major languages from different countries speak the language differently for example English in US, UK, Canada, Australia; Spanish in Mexico, Spain, Argentina, Cuba; French in France, Quebec, Belgium, Francophone West Africa, Mahgreb; Portuguese varieties in Brasil, Portugal, and Angola. The best is to learn the standard version of the language to a B2/C1 proficiency level and adapt to the local idioms of the native speakers from that particular country, region, or city where you will live or with the natives you will daily communicate.
Enhorabuena por el video ! hahaha que buena la imitación de diferentes nacionalidades. Es curioso que la expresión corporal que acompaña a las palabras sea también un rasgo común de las personas de un país o zona geográfica. Estaría muy bien un video de tu experiencia en eso Lucca !
Nice video in many ways. The only thing I would really quibble about is your claim that a native speaker needs to be born in a country. My feeling is that a person that immigrates into a country at a relatively young age will learn the local language (without trying, like any child) at a level that is "native", i.e. indistinguishable from that spoken by someone born there. I am an example. I was born in Romania, but came to Canada (in the 70s) at the age of 7. My older brothers were 9 and 11. None of of speak with any accent whatsoever in English vs our Canadian-born peers, and in fact our English is better than our Romanian, since we have spoken much more English in our lives than Romanian. When we speak to other people, they don't know we were born outside of Canada unless we tell them. My Romanian is good, but it's probably only C2 or so. In Toronto, where half the people were actually born outside of Canada, you will find many people like us. Plus the whole gamut, including people who came at a slightly older age, perhaps 13-15, and speak English really really well, including using all native idioms, but perhaps still have a little bit of an accent. Past a certain age, it's hard to lose it.
Colin Sampaleanu I have a similar migration story, as I was born in England to Indian and Pakistani parents, then spent several childhood years in Pakistan, and moved to America by age 10, in the early 1970’s. My cousins who were born in England and then immigrated to America by age 10, never lost their British accents. In mine, one can trace influences from all three cultures.
Excellent explanation of the difference between a native speaker and C2 level. One clarification. In the USA (and probably Canada as well) we do not use the term "peasant" to refer to a rural dweller or someone who works on a farm or ranch. We would refer to the "peasant" as a farm hand or ranch hand. Cheers,
Hi Luca, I have been impressed by your videos, techniques for a long time, and I have a lot of respect to you. However, I feel a bit sad that you did not give Arabic a chance. It is a rich language and you will have a lot of joy learning and speaking it. if you decide to learn it one day, I am happy to help practice with you the language free :)
GOOD POINT! I was born and raised and lived my entire life in the usa. So many of the people I have encountered with the same existence as mine are incredibly ignorant of the vocabulary and nuances of "American" english. I constantly feel a need to hand out thesauruses.
As a native in the USA allow me to take a machete to the thicket: Dr Henry Kissinger, whether or not you like his politics, is amazing. While he has a German accent, he does not make MISTAKES in English. My voice teacher, the late Cantor Moshe Taubé had an accent: He was from Poland, saved by Oskar Schindler, and spoke six languages. His German needless to say was perfect, and he taught me exclusively in that language! Once after a Synagogue service (before I was his student) I had made him angry. He said: "I believe I am entitled to an apology!" I am good at English, of course. *In a million years I would not have been able to formulate that phrase, "I believe I am entitled to an apology" off the cuff as he did.* Natives, for all their restlessness(!) don't know everything either! ALSO: proficiency is the goal. Remember: NOBODY to my knowledge ever asks a great concert pianist what he/she did BEFORE they learned their music!😊 As a pianist, I can honestly say nobody ever asked me that either, they seem to either enjoy my music or tell me their opinion of THE PERFORMANCE.
The question I have is: what about those who want to write novels in English? You want to be able to flex the language to your will but at the same time you don't need to speak like native speaker....just write and considering the fact that most natives don't pass C2 test BECAUSE of grammar...well..you have to reach C2
that genture part was hysterical 😂 I liked that since I do that too while learning this english language. It helps me to remember vocabs and make me think in English.
I personally believe, for myself and many others, there´s a deep psychological need to abandon our own identity and take on another, like a foreign agent, to be seen as NOT foreign. I´m talking about acceptance. When you combine this psychological need to belong, perhaps like me, whose had a disastrous socialization from age 5 to 25, you desire a redo, a change to do it all over and be accepted by a target society. I don´t want ¨just¨ to be C1 level Spanish. I want to become Spanish! I want the impossible--All the admiration and interest of me being different and yet, not to be seen as different. It´s a frustration we cannot hope to accomplish because, the accomplishment would make us realize that we aren´t happy inside ourselves. We let other´s opinions paint who we become. The coolest fckr in the world is the foreigner who doesn´t want to be seen as the culture of their study. If I can realize this now, I´ll be so much happier in Spain! Again, like the LGBT community, we thought we wanted equality but, what we really needed was attention, to be accepted and for the older ones like me, to find an apology from a world who treated me like shit. Then again, unfortunately, I´m not special. Everyone has been mistreated but we are still scared and maybe language! Maybe moving to a foreign country! It´s not about the language. I know that much.
in my opinion, and i'm surprised you didn't mention this ;), native speaker and C2 are not points along the same continuum. you don't pass C2 and keep going until you get to native speaker. there's a real question of register for the C2 exams. it's primarily an academic use of the language, showing skills of reasoning and transitions between ideas, summarizing and arguing, etc. a native speaker may or may not ever have the need (or ability) to do any of that. it might help to think of C2 as "academic fluency". these exams were created as a way to filter applicants to universities and certain jobs which is why they dwell so heavily on a specific set of skills.
Yes, and by doing this (adopting like native behavior or expressions) we can see think in a different way or at least feel hehe. Yes, It is like being a second language learner, a native, and a foreign language learner. the process of acquiring a language is different for each case. In fact, some just acquire it and others learn it.
No one needs to be a native speaker. The point is to be able to communicate. I talk to non-native speakers of English every day and for the most part, I don't even notice it. And the speaker in this video doesn't sound like a native speaker of English but is able to communicate perfectly.
Yes, the important part is to master pronunciation, grammar and vocabulary to the point where a native speaker (or another language student for that matter) does not need to wonder or guess what you're trying to communicate. Because then they miss parts of what you're saying/writing and we don't say or write in order to not be understood. I think the pronunciation part especially applies to languages that have various accents/dialects etc. Like in English, for example, most dictionaries will mention both "American" and "British" pronunciation. You can strive to acquiring one of these but honestly, only a small percentage of native speakers actually speak one of the two variations and most of the time they will still get along. So an accent which is say Spanish or German of French or any other one, as long as it's understandable, should not be a problem.
I don't need to be an english native speaker. 😥 I just want to be able to express and speak in english whatever thoughts I have in my mind without any or very little difficulties. 😥
i could tell you were italian in the first few seconds you started speaking haha i got some italian friends and your accent are pretty distinctive i love the video btw
1. Native speaker is different from foreigner who tries to sound like a native speaker 2. foreigners can speak more eloquently than a native speaker does 3. but the native speaker still can have some advantages(knowledges about facial expressions, custom and cultural references etc) 4. foreigners cannot know all the cultural references, and can't have the same experience which native speaker had(going to school etc) 5. When you learn a new language not only focus on how they speak but take a good look at on face, hand gesture, expressions with eyes and body etc 6. Given naitive speaks have their own expericen in specifi time and specific space, we cannot be in that time and space so you cannot replicate. 7. 100%
WHY YOU SO RACIST ??? You discourage many people who start their journey with the language. Don’t ever tell anybody that because it’s bullshit and you should be ashamed of yourself.
To experience the culture I like to listen to online radio stations. I found this incredible country station it's called 96.3 real country. If you like this type of music it's a great way to soak into language
Luca is a perfect example of what he describes in this video.. his command of American English and accent is so nuanced I did a double take the first time I heard him like “ 😱he’s not American??” But then I heard him use phrases or words that a native speaker wouldn’t use .. not that they’re wrong ...but just sounded learned from education; formal as opposed to acquired natively. For instance the use of the word “peasants” in his analogy... the word use is correct grammatically and lexically.. but it sounded so unnatural to my American English ear. I would’ve used “blue collar”. There are other instances in his other videos as well. I suspect it comes from reading a lot of English literature. But don’t get me wrong... he definitely has mastery over English and I will strive to get my French and Spanish on par with his English level!!
I don't fully agree on one point, namely on the fact that people who have lived 30 years in a foreign. country speak almost like native speakers. There are many examples showing it is not always the case, it really depends on many other factors as well and especially on one's imitating skills. Some people pick up habits and ways quite fast, others never do. I totally agree on the rest
lol peasant. Thanks for the laugh, never heard anyone refer to poor (assumed uneducated?) as such. I'm an American, I don't think I can pass myself off as a native Japanese speaker, for example. I don't really see the need either. I study a lot of languages, but I only strive to be excellent at a few of them. Maybe for fun, or as an experiment I can see how close to native I can get, including body language, patterns of speech, cultural references, etc, but I wouldn't do that for each language I study. I don't have any desire to try and fool people, even if I could pull it off. I think your example of the Danish professor has already reached the pinnacle of foreign language proficiency. He didn't grow up with American culture, and so that is not a part of his identity. It seems disingenuous to try and pretend. I've heard non-native English speakers attempt to do so before and it just sounds weird, especially if they have a stronger accent. I don't hold it against them for trying, but it doesn't sound right. Its kind of like the stereotypical middle-age man trying to dress like a teenager, or a balding man with a comb-over. By all means, learn the references, learn the accent, keep improving, but know that no matter how good you get, there will always be something that gives away your non-nativeness, and that's OK.
Thanks for the comment! I found this: peasant /ˈpɛz(ə)nt/ noun plural noun: peasants a poor smallholder or agricultural labourer of low social status (chiefly in historical use or with reference to subsistence farming in poorer countries). "peasant farmers" INFORMAL an ignorant, rude, or unsophisticated person. "‘That is a civilized drink, you peasant’" I find it interesting how most Americans are reacting to the use I made of this word in this video. Although I meant to use peasant in the informal sense, my actual use of the word is perceived as odd and/or awkward. This goes to show how complex languages are - each word has a history on its own - and this is of the many reasons why machines - even the most sophisticated ones - will have a hard time replicating the way humans use language to communicate (not to mention translating one language into the other.) I quote from someone who wrote about our fabulous linguist Umberto Eco's book: "In his essay “Experience in translation“, whose subtitle in the Italian version is “say almost the same thing”, Umberto Eco argues that the translation is not about comparing two languages, but about the interpretation of a text in two different languages, thus involving a shift between cultures"
@@LucaLampariello Americans don't use the word peasant for an average farmer. while making your comparison with the Danish prof and the American native speaker, you should have just said "American farmer". Much smoother.
Luca Lampariello - I knew exactly what you meant, but as an Australian I actually laughed, too 😊 For some reason we never think of anyone in Australia as a “peasant”. It just conjures up images of peasants in feudal Japan for me. For what it’s worth, you pass for me as a non-Australian native English speaker outside Australia brought up with immigrant parents.
@@LucaLampariello "Peasant" has funny connotations in English - not really "contadino"- or maybe it is!. Check out Eugene Weber's classic social history: "From Peasants to Frenchmen". It's become a bit of a stereotype. It brings to mind someone wearing a cap and riding a donkey - usually in the Middle Ages, in France, Spain, Italy. I remember an article in the Herald Tribune talking about the "peasants' in Tuscany - many who are highly educated and have more money than, say, "farmers" in Iowa
Luca Lampariello Funny! It’s like this thing came up on exactly right video to be relevant. Luca is a hell of an English speaker, but no one in the US would ever call someone else a peasant unless they’re trying to be extremely rude. No matter how good he is, he’s still not a native speaker (as I’ll never be a native German speaker, and in the long run, worrying about it is foolish).
U can put into account that even u not born in that country ,as long as u raised up there like for example ,u came to that country at the very young age' you can consider urself as a native speaker .
bro yo intente hacer un examen de c2 de español de 24 preguntas y obtuve 16 buenas osea lo gane pero al limite jaajajja por eso yo siempre pienso que alcanzar un c2 no es tan factible en un segundo idioma
@@juancas0736 Ni siquiera es necesario para el día a día. Con un B2 o máximo C1 (contando en C1 sobre todo algunos dichos o jergas populares) basta. Yo por eso en todos los idiomas que aprendo, siempre trato de llegar al B2 y cuando puedo seguir aprendiendo jergas y dichos en ese idioma. Ahora si necesitas vocabulario avanzado, será sobre todo para tu trabajo por ejemplo.
Seriously, I don't care as for speaking like a native, because I find it so cool when I see someone who speaks Portuguese with a foreign accent that I don't even think it's a matter of speaking well or not, it's just who you are.
Next time you want to give an example of Greek body language remember "extend your hand exposing your palm, like showing the other person the number 5 with your fingers and say: par'ta re malaka!" It even has a name: moutza
I don't care if I'll ever speak like a native speaker, I've been living in Italy for 12 years now and guess what? I speak Italian with a slight accent but I don't care as long as my Italian is excellent and people understand me well. BTW American people usually say that they don't understand English people, which is strange since they speak the same language ;-) But I understand both ;-))))))
Yeah, I gave up on perfecting my English accent for 2 reasons. 50% of my input are non-natives, 25% is American and 20% is British and 5% is Canada and Australia. It is way too diverse mix of various accents for me to emulate one. And English has way too many vowels for me to match perfectly. The second reason is, that most people are okay with my accent and to my surprise, some actually like it. I think as long as people can understand you well, having a bit of exotic accent is not a bad thing.
Most people's goal in language learning is NOT passing off as a native speaker IMHO. What would you have to say to those that do not travel to countries where the languages they learn are spoken? How about those who don't have much opportunity to talk to native speakers? Not everyone is so much into speaking. We have also reading and understanding spoken (recorded) language - sth we can do without a native speaker or even on our own.
I was thinking this too. Luca seems to really appreciate coming off as a native speaker to others, which is cool he finds meaning in that. I for one find meaning in listening and reading. Of course I enjoy speaking too, but I feel like if I have to go out of my way to accomplish this. Plus I suck at making friends in general so theres that lol
@@texmex321 I like talking to people, but I have discovered I don't learn so much from it - in everyday situations people (native speakers) talk about simple issues and use rather limited vocabulary. In my opinion through massive input (reading, listening) one can achieve much more. Besides, I can hardly imagine myself harassing strangers with "can we talk since I'd like to practise my language skills?"
I was born in Brazil and my family always spoke English and Portuguese with me. I have learned English since I was born and I think in English. I also speak Portuguese, as fluent as English. Am I a native speaker?
I think the professor will speak so well than the simple native speaker do because in our native language we don't speak an academic language that why.
Although I accept the general argument of a foreign-proffesor vs. local peasant, I think the US is a bad example. US "paesants" (whatever that is supposed to mean...) could have a variety of ethnic backrounds other than English speaking.... Although English may be a native language, there still be a high degree of influence from the language(s) of their immigrant forefathers, depending on where they originated.(Scandinavian, German, etc.)
My take of the situation is that if you live in a country for long enough (10/20 years) and you speak and behave just as a native speaker and people can’t tell, you are a native speaker. The point is I think you can became a native speaker. It’s difficult but it’s possible. Just my opinion.
I guess the obsession with native speakers comes from a place where native speakers are the "rightful owners" of the language. And if you are a learner, you are wrong as soon as you open your mouth. We live in a connected world, there are so many combinations of languages and abilities. For example, that thing of not knowing famous TV personalities, I get it in my native culture A LOT, because I lived abroad for 8 years before I came back home. I don't need to be a native speaker if I don't have that idea that I could be humiliated for that. I speak my languages like myself. I have weird associations from other languages in all of them including my first language.
I definitely got what you meant, but although is still disappointing to face the reality :'v not Matter If I do travel to New York and all of those good stuff , ouch that hurt. Archer quote "I didn't need that heart anyway" :'v
Luca, could you once make a video about italian pronounciation of r in Italian? So... I am slovene so rotic r is normal for me. The thing I am looking for are rules for standard Italian which i can't find. So.. like Spanish for example, when r is the first letter in a word, it is a strong r. Is that the same in italian? Or after l, n, s 'r' is also strong (e.g. sonrisa). And off course when it is written 'rr' is a strong r. Are rules similar in Italian?
I think comparing monolingual native speakers with bi-multilingual non-native speakers, who by definition, speak two or more languages at a high level, is kinda pointless. Of course, you’ll find differences. The bi- multilinguals’ will have a foreign accent (even if it’s a slight one), their culture is different etc. If someone speaks more languages then those languages will affect each other. Even simultaneous bilinguals who were born in an English-speaking country might have a “foreign” accent in English (everybody has an accent btw) and might not be 100% aware of the different customs of that country. The definition of native English accent itself is problematic since there are a lot of English dialects. Culture is not homogenous either even in one country there are different habits. Nevertheless, if someone’s aim is to sound and/or behave like one of them (NES) then it’s up to them. Personally, it makes me frustrated. Ps I hope this comment didn’t come across as mean it wasn’t my purpose:). Luca’s language skills are incredible and he’s ability to analyse languages and the pragmatics of languages is also phenomenal. He truly is an inspiration
I'm 5 years in England and I don't know how to speak a good English and you have an amazing pronunciation in French,Spanish and Italian Roman accent...it's really frustrating for me....😅
Frankly, I don't care about passing for a native. Of course, a migrant who doesn't want to be discriminated against will probably put a lot of effort into his accent. The same goes for someone who wants to be an actor or to work with his voice. My usual goal is that of sounding "foreign-born" without natives being able to understand where I come from. That is usually an excellent conversation starter and it's useful when dealing with officials and bureaucracy. I'm currently studying Spanish, but I am still at a very basic level. Despite that, I am quite proud of the fact that most people don't understand where I come from. To me, this means that I'm doing my listening/speaking practice well.
Nicht nur das sondern ich habe gemerkt das elsässische Leute haben andere Gestik als Franzosen. Die sind beide aus Frankreich aber die sind unterschiedlich. Tolles Video und wahr. Hauptsache kann man kommunizieren .Ich bin froh wenn ich komuniziren kann egal das ich Akzent habe.
Interesting. I was born in Chile. I don't use or understand chilean slang (it must be explained to me) and My fellow chileans have doubts about My nacionality when the hear me speak. I do have a chilean accent, I just don't like speak incorrectly. ( Yes I have been bullied by this and have some job interviewers ask If I hace some type of autism [I don't think I do]) I learned My second language at the age of ten by living two years in England. So it's funny to not be a native speaker of My own language. Note: chilean slang is ridiculously complicated. Ask any spanish speaker. Seriously. I don't get it much because I preffered to read than go outside so I missed My chance to mingle with My kind.
Interesting use of the word peasant. I think that’s your Italian showing up, I was confused when j first heard the word in french, like wow - they still use that here huh? Too archaic in English now, I suppose it can be droll when used properly.
you are idolizing native speakers too much. That is because you have accents in English, French and every single language you learned. But actually it is possible to reduce the accents to the minimum. I guess you tried a lot, but it wasnt enough or you werent cut out to speak like a native.
As a Southerner of the USA, it was very strange to switch from living around Appalachia, in a Celtic area, to moving to the North, to a flat, German area. It was like I was a foreigner. Our English is different, our culture is different; how we talk is different--physical expressions, gestures. They did not understand what we meant when we said, "He's hollering at me." One responded to me, "I'm not hollering at you!"
Cultural understanding is the root of Japanese humour. Like you can walk into an American comedy club and get like half the jokes wherever you are from? Japanese jokes are bits that are reused. LIke. a guy will be "When am I gonna do it? Now, of course." Or, "Relax, I've got on underwear." And that is just like a fact for people who haven't lived in Japan, but I am out here rolling on the floor cackling.
Despite I agree very much on the culture and accent topic I see nothing wrong to say "He (or she) sounds like a native speaker." even they were not born in my country. Once I was in Madrid and behind me two people talked in German perfectly. So, I was convinced they were Germans, (and maybe that was the case) but as I turned around I noticed they looked differently. So, I would say they sounded like native speakers. And it doesn't matter to me if there were Germans, or born in Germany or not. Whereas the culture knowledge are indeed very important. Because, even if you use the right word in the right context, it could be wrong, because It could be used otherwise than in your own culture.
A native German might think differently. Language is a tool to communicate. Sounding, looking, behaving like a native are ok. Just not necessary. Wanting the prestige of being a native speaker is just an ego issue. Nothing more.
@@plerpplerp5599 Well, I guess, I have some clue how perfect German sounds, because I am German. But I guess, you missed my point anyway. I said nothing about, that I want to achieve that level. My level in English as well as in Spanish is under C. So, for me is still not right the time in dreaming about speaking as a native speaker. I only wanted to point out, that the estimation "like a native speaker" under certain circumstances valid and acceptable is.
using the word peasant pegs you as not a native english speaker, especially not north american. but i know what you mean. i think a lot of people wont be able to get past it though.
The Study System that Will Unlock Your Potential to Master Any Language: www.lucalampariello.com/free-3-video-training/
On a funny related note: most native speakers can't pass the C2 level exam in their own language (lots of technical grammar stuff most people either never knew or forgot even if they did at some point learn it in school).
Most of the people are dumb and they could not pass even C1 exam with their limited vocabulary. Half of the white population is in the range of 85-100 points of IQ. The 2nd half is not much better...
www.researchgate.net/figure/Sample-Itens-at-5-Levels-of-NALS-Literacy-and-Percentage-of-White-Adults-Performing-at_tbl3_237537863
Most of them even B2.
@@quandmeme9970 By definition, an IQ of 100 is average. So half should be above, and half below.
I think this is an indication that the exams don't do a good job of testing language proficiency. When I took a practice C1 exam in Greek last year, I noticed that many of the questions were SAT-style questions that were really testing your ability to make inferences more than anything. I don't think it makes sense to include questions like this on a language exam because language proficiency and intelligence are two completely different things; you should be able to get a perfect score if you are a native speaker, even if you're as dumb as a brick.
@Fryrish i know what it means. My point is that people in general are stupid. 80-115 points has nothing common with 'intelligence'. But the worst thing these idiots rule in the idiocracy. Tyranny of the majority.
Maybe the real question to ask yourself is “At what level of social interaction would I want to be taken seriously by native speakers in my target language?” Two examples from my own experience: My father grew up in Italy and immigrated to the USA after completing the classical liceo in Rome. He went on to get a PhD in the USA, married, had a family, and lived here for over 60 years. His speech and writing were much more sophisticated (and grammatically correct) than 99% (or better) of native American speakers. But he still had an accent - it wasn't the stereotyped Italian accent, in fact wasn't even recognizable as Italian. You could tell he was “foreign born". Despite that, he was always respected at all levels of interaction. I grew up speaking Italian and our dialect, and I could communicate entirely well - with the proper accent, body language, gestures, etc. But my level was determined mostly by my grandparents, relatives and other “paesani” in our circle (in NY, mid 20th Century). So, even though I have advanced degrees and am a professional, when I spoke Italian, I sounded like a peasant (a time-shifted peasant at that!). I was fluent at that level, but when I would interact with Italian customers and coworkers, I could tell that I was being judged harshly because my language was more appropriate for a peasant than a professional. I'd rather be in my father's position than mine, which is why I'm working really hard now to get to the "well-educated foreigner” level in Italian. Not native - I'll never be that in Standard Italian. But I can at least have a large vocabulary and get the grammar right. And every once in a while, I can throw in some dialect for some "color". :). Overall, I think that's a much better goal than " speaking like a native”.
Well said
Thanks for sharing!
But why are we putting a "peasant" native on one scale and an educated foreigner on another? Being proficient in a language and sounding like a native are not mutually exclusive.
@@asiam.5671 Nobody like poor people
I experienced something similar practicing my Romanian with my grandmother. Certain words and the way certain vowels are slurred in her dialect made me sound awkward to the native youth when I started learning Romanian but because I starting studying as an adult it was a quick fix
In my American college, I had a woman from Japan as an English professor. She had a PhD in English, and taught Americans. But she also spoke with a heavy Japanese accent. I was the native speaker and she was the non-native. Even though she knew every bit of English grammar to perfection, nobody would ever mistake her for a native speaker.
Perfect example of C2 vs. native: Americans don’t say “peasant” because we never had feudal history.
move along now peasant.
I saw this comment before watching the video and thought it was stupid, americans do say peasant. Then I saw how Luca used it. The american peasant? That was weird.
@@andresanchez728 Yeah. We do use the word peasant, mostly when talking about actual peasants, but we generally do not use it when referring to our citizens (even our lower class), that is, unless we are specifically trying to insult someone.
@@Real_LiamOBryan I know. That is what I meant.
It made me laugh because it reminded me of the film Emperor's New Groove 😂
The one, who didn"t like the video, is probably the Danish Professor.
Probably the American peasant
Rød grød med fløde
Always aim to use as few words as possible; this creates clarity. You could have written:
The Danish Professor disliked the video
that's funny, you made me laugh!
@@FinancialHealth-ku1ry Sure he could have but it wouldn't have conveyed the same meaning. So why would he want to? I'd venture a guess that there was only one dislike back then and that's what Enes referred to. His only mistake, really, is the commas, which we don't use with defining clauses.
This recent series of videos from Luca has been amazing. A real gold mine of valuable insights and advise.
Thanks Anthony! Always way too kind ;-)
Im from philippines and working in taiwan and currently learning mandarin and english as well. Im watching ur videos every single day and im learning alot from it.
Thanks much LUCA😊
judylen omak hiiiii I’m taiwanese, i like to watch his vids as well. How’s the life there? Wish you good luck on your language journey. :)
i'm from the philippines too.. i've learned to speak spanish through the internet.. right now i'm working on my russian.. in my experience the best way to learn a language is through comprehensible input, that is, constant exposure to comprehensible input..
@@мирвовсеммире-ы1и wow nice! Im planning to learn spanish also im doing part time job in the hotel here in taiwan and sometimes we have spanish guest and there are already spanish words that we are using in the phils😆 so it really exciting to learn
@@joannechucheerup thanks for that. I enjoyed my work here in taiwan but im still struggling learning mandarin .its quite interesting to learn😆😆
Luca, I love that you addressed the issue of "native-speaker"! Nativeness is not the synonym of "fluency"!
I've experienced switching to a language to which I'm a native speaker at, making me a native speaker of two different languages in different times. As a kid, I've always expressed myself in Filipino (Standardized Tagalog="Tagalog" in layman's term)--talked,cried, argued, and everything else that involves colloquial expression; all of those in Filipino). However, when I got to 4th grade, I was transferred to a public school and everything was almost expressed in Cebuano. I was already an L2 speaker of Cebuano during that time but I was not a "native speaker" (I don't express myself nor even talk to myself in Cebuano). During those times of heavy immersion to the language, I gradually transitioned into a Cebuano native speaker. At this point in time, I think I'm a native speaker of Cebuano even though Filipino and English were my first languages :D
The relevant challenge in a second language is fluency and "connection". Establishing the bridge for interacting with ideas, enhancing the collective value from a mere transactional communication. At this point, the richness of each experience matters, and team cognitive process emerges through a common identity or purpose. As you mentioned, body language, intonation counts as much as the message (7_38_55 rule from Albert Mehrabian) for achieving this goal, in other words, a true storyteller. Metaphors, stories, idiomatic expressions are so powerful in effective communication, and a good sample of it is your comparison: Abroad professor living a long time in the country, vs. a native peasant. The teacher has more tools for verbal and written communication, but from the cultural approach never at the same level of natives. Thanks for sharing.
This is so accurate I could say it's a very important lesson to be taught when you are learning a language. It's awful knowing that a number of people confuse being at a C2 level and being a native speaker and for that reason they quit learning a language! I think don't even we can reach a c2 level in our own language if it's not through proper courses or studies, so for me it doesn't matter the level of your target language you are but the eager you are to learn it, and knowing more about other cultures, places or customs helps a lot. Cheers! Gracias Luca, te mereces más seguidores macho! ^_^
Great video.
One more point I would like to say is the need to become a “native speaker”. Culturally speaking, the perspective that a foreigner see a country is always different than a native, no matter how much you try to absorb the local culture.
But there’s nothing wrong with that. I treasure the mixture of my international knowledge. On the other hand, those “natives” are always interested in how they are seen by the foreigners too!
Luca, this was great! Loved the language "impersonations". I really appreciate all of the "tips" videos that you put together, but if I had one wish, it would be to hear more of you actually speaking the languages you've learned. Your accents in the various languages always sound so spot-on, and I have to admit that I feel far more inspired when I see you switching languages rapid-fire in conversation with Matthew Youlden, or going into various topics in quite some depth with Richard Simcott across ten or so languages (about half of which I can understand, but that's what subtitles are for). This is what initially moved me so much about the online polyglot community - not as some cheap party trick, but as the ultimate expression of the decades of work that you've put in. It comes across like you're having so much fun with it, and for me, when I see it, that's what drives me to hit the books and study - not more generic videos like "the benefits of learning a language".
Please don't misinterpret this - it's not a complaint. I appreciate everything you're doing! Just wanted to express my excitement for your speaking videos. Groetjes uit Nederland!
Nice video! It took me a while to accept the fact that I'll never become a native German speaker, but it's actually a refreshing, calming feeling once you just accept it. And it's true...those moments where you somehow pass for a native even for just a few seconds/minutes are quite fun :)
Those precious moment...
Francesco Camuglia It’s very comforting indeed, as Luca mentions, when I realized how precisely one speaks, it’s possible to have the best of all worlds. As with any skill, the better it becomes, the more valuable it is, without taking away our identities.
Its not true, i moved to germany when i was a kid and learned the language and pronounciation in around 6 years. As an adult you can still learn it. Observe other people very closely, work on your pronounciation, try expressing your feeling with common idioms and it will become natural to you
well-done!!! I observed that Luca has a systematic approach based on a psychological point of view when he explores different aspects of learning foreign languages. i would say that Luca is a linguistic psychotherapist who corrects unrealistic expectations.
The point made at 4:30 ish was just amazing. I had never actually noticed those things!
Could you make a video about the different body language and mannerisms you noticed in each of the languages you studied (or maybe your 5 best languages idk), that would be super helpful! The french one just cracked me up 😂
That would be such an interesting thing!
Please a Video of you imitating the gestures of other Language speakers. Your German example was accurate (and that coming from a German), as well as the Spanish example. But your French one almost killed me mdr😂
The french exemple was a bit caricatual but not incorrect haha and I'm a native speaker from paris
I'm not good at showing appreciation. But thank you for being a genuine Polyglot, you inspire me and I will keep learning just like you do.
Thanks Luca. Important video and wellt thought arguments. It is a nice feeling to be mistaken for a native speaker, but you are right that sooner or later your real identity will be revealed, so it’s always a question why strive to be taken for a native speak if you are not one. Look forward to your next videos.
''The peasants, though...''
Lol :D
Native Spanish speaker from Barcelona here. His '¿Pero qué te pasa, macho?' was spot on 😂
I think too many people concentrate on native proficiency when native speakers of major languages from different countries speak the language differently for example English in US, UK, Canada, Australia; Spanish in Mexico, Spain, Argentina, Cuba; French in France, Quebec, Belgium, Francophone West Africa, Mahgreb; Portuguese varieties in Brasil, Portugal, and Angola. The best is to learn the standard version of the language to a B2/C1 proficiency level and adapt to the local idioms of the native speakers from that particular country, region, or city where you will live or with the natives you will daily communicate.
Enhorabuena por el video ! hahaha que buena la imitación de diferentes nacionalidades. Es curioso que la expresión corporal que acompaña a las palabras sea también un rasgo común de las personas de un país o zona geográfica. Estaría muy bien un video de tu experiencia en eso Lucca !
I love what you covered here and I feel like it’s rarely discussed in such detail
Nice video in many ways. The only thing I would really quibble about is your claim that a native speaker needs to be born in a country. My feeling is that a person that immigrates into a country at a relatively young age will learn the local language (without trying, like any child) at a level that is "native", i.e. indistinguishable from that spoken by someone born there. I am an example. I was born in Romania, but came to Canada (in the 70s) at the age of 7. My older brothers were 9 and 11. None of of speak with any accent whatsoever in English vs our Canadian-born peers, and in fact our English is better than our Romanian, since we have spoken much more English in our lives than Romanian. When we speak to other people, they don't know we were born outside of Canada unless we tell them. My Romanian is good, but it's probably only C2 or so. In Toronto, where half the people were actually born outside of Canada, you will find many people like us. Plus the whole gamut, including people who came at a slightly older age, perhaps 13-15, and speak English really really well, including using all native idioms, but perhaps still have a little bit of an accent. Past a certain age, it's hard to lose it.
Colin Sampaleanu I have a similar migration story, as I was born in England to Indian and Pakistani parents, then spent several childhood years in Pakistan, and moved to America by age 10, in the early 1970’s. My cousins who were born in England and then immigrated to America by age 10, never lost their British accents. In mine, one can trace influences from all three cultures.
Excellent explanation of the difference between a native speaker and C2 level. One clarification. In the USA (and probably Canada as well) we do not use the term "peasant" to refer to a rural dweller or someone who works on a farm or ranch. We would refer to the "peasant" as a farm hand or ranch hand. Cheers,
Paysan?
Hi Luca, I have been impressed by your videos, techniques for a long time, and I have a lot of respect to you. However, I feel a bit sad that you did not give Arabic a chance. It is a rich language and you will have a lot of joy learning and speaking it. if you decide to learn it one day, I am happy to help practice with you the language free :)
GOOD POINT!
I was born and raised and lived my entire life in the usa. So many of the people I have encountered with the same existence as mine are incredibly ignorant of the vocabulary and nuances of "American" english. I constantly feel a need to hand out thesauruses.
Overall, very informative video. Keep up the good work✊✊
Thanks! =)
lmfao your French impersonation was so on point, I'm dying.
That's so true! Very good job Luca!
As a native in the USA allow me to take a machete to the thicket: Dr Henry Kissinger, whether or not you like his politics, is amazing. While he has a German accent, he does not make MISTAKES in English. My voice teacher, the late Cantor Moshe Taubé had an accent: He was from Poland, saved by Oskar Schindler, and spoke six languages. His German needless to say was perfect, and he taught me exclusively in that language!
Once after a Synagogue service (before I was his student) I had made him angry. He said: "I believe I am entitled to an apology!"
I am good at English, of course. *In a million years I would not have been able to formulate that phrase, "I believe I am entitled to an apology" off the cuff as he did.*
Natives, for all their restlessness(!) don't know everything either!
ALSO: proficiency is the goal. Remember: NOBODY to my knowledge ever asks a great concert pianist what he/she did BEFORE they learned their music!😊 As a pianist, I can honestly say nobody ever asked me that either, they seem to either enjoy my music or tell me their opinion of THE PERFORMANCE.
The question I have is: what about those who want to write novels in English? You want to be able to flex the language to your will but at the same time you don't need to speak like native speaker....just write and considering the fact that most natives don't pass C2 test BECAUSE of grammar...well..you have to reach C2
that genture part was hysterical 😂
I liked that since I do that too while learning this english language. It helps me to remember vocabs and make me think in English.
I personally believe, for myself and many others, there´s a deep psychological need to abandon our own identity and take on another, like a foreign agent, to be seen as NOT foreign. I´m talking about acceptance. When you combine this psychological need to belong, perhaps like me, whose had a disastrous socialization from age 5 to 25, you desire a redo, a change to do it all over and be accepted by a target society. I don´t want ¨just¨ to be C1 level Spanish. I want to become Spanish! I want the impossible--All the admiration and interest of me being different and yet, not to be seen as different. It´s a frustration we cannot hope to accomplish because, the accomplishment would make us realize that we aren´t happy inside ourselves. We let other´s opinions paint who we become. The coolest fckr in the world is the foreigner who doesn´t want to be seen as the culture of their study. If I can realize this now, I´ll be so much happier in Spain! Again, like the LGBT community, we thought we wanted equality but, what we really needed was attention, to be accepted and for the older ones like me, to find an apology from a world who treated me like shit. Then again, unfortunately, I´m not special. Everyone has been mistreated but we are still scared and maybe language! Maybe moving to a foreign country! It´s not about the language. I know that much.
Wow, amicci. Finally somebody agrees with me. To be a native speaker, you have to be a native speaker. It's not something you acquire later in life.
Your French made me laugh ! It is so truthful ! 😂
Sounds a bit purist to me, identities are constructed over time, it's no something fixed that you can't change.
Me gustó el:. "¿Pero que te pasa macho!!!???" 😄
ma che cazzo stai facendo?
in my opinion, and i'm surprised you didn't mention this ;), native speaker and C2 are not points along the same continuum. you don't pass C2 and keep going until you get to native speaker. there's a real question of register for the C2 exams. it's primarily an academic use of the language, showing skills of reasoning and transitions between ideas, summarizing and arguing, etc. a native speaker may or may not ever have the need (or ability) to do any of that. it might help to think of C2 as "academic fluency". these exams were created as a way to filter applicants to universities and certain jobs which is why they dwell so heavily on a specific set of skills.
Yes, and by doing this (adopting like native behavior or expressions) we can see think in a different way or at least feel hehe.
Yes, It is like being a second language learner, a native, and a foreign language learner. the process of acquiring a language is different for each case. In fact, some just acquire it and others learn it.
No one needs to be a native speaker. The point is to be able to communicate. I talk to non-native speakers of English every day and for the most part, I don't even notice it. And the speaker in this video doesn't sound like a native speaker of English but is able to communicate perfectly.
Yes, the important part is to master pronunciation, grammar and vocabulary to the point where a native speaker (or another language student for that matter) does not need to wonder or guess what you're trying to communicate. Because then they miss parts of what you're saying/writing and we don't say or write in order to not be understood.
I think the pronunciation part especially applies to languages that have various accents/dialects etc. Like in English, for example, most dictionaries will mention both "American" and "British" pronunciation. You can strive to acquiring one of these but honestly, only a small percentage of native speakers actually speak one of the two variations and most of the time they will still get along. So an accent which is say Spanish or German of French or any other one, as long as it's understandable, should not be a problem.
I fully agree Suzannah! The most important goal of language learning is and wil always remain communication
I don't need to be an english native speaker. 😥 I just want to be able to express and speak in english whatever thoughts I have in my mind without any or very little difficulties. 😥
The only way is to practice and read a lot of books... that’s the only way
i could tell you were italian in the first few seconds you started speaking haha i got some italian friends and your accent are pretty distinctive i love the video btw
1. Native speaker is different from foreigner who tries to sound like a native speaker
2. foreigners can speak more eloquently than a native speaker does
3. but the native speaker still can have some advantages(knowledges about facial expressions, custom and cultural references etc)
4. foreigners cannot know all the cultural references, and can't have the same experience which native speaker had(going to school etc)
5. When you learn a new language not only focus on how they speak but take a good look at on face, hand gesture, expressions with eyes and body etc
6. Given naitive speaks have their own expericen in specifi time and specific space, we cannot be in that time and space so you cannot replicate.
7.
100%
WHY YOU SO RACIST ??? You discourage many people who start their journey with the language. Don’t ever tell anybody that because it’s bullshit and you should be ashamed of yourself.
To experience the culture I like to listen to online radio stations. I found this incredible country station it's called 96.3 real country. If you like this type of music it's a great way to soak into language
Luca is a perfect example of what he describes in this video.. his command of American English and accent is so nuanced I did a double take the first time I heard him like “ 😱he’s not American??” But then I heard him use phrases or words that a native speaker wouldn’t use .. not that they’re wrong ...but just sounded learned from education; formal as opposed to acquired natively. For instance the use of the word “peasants” in his analogy... the word use is correct grammatically and lexically.. but it sounded so unnatural to my American English ear. I would’ve used “blue collar”. There are other instances in his other videos as well. I suspect it comes from reading a lot of English literature. But don’t get me wrong... he definitely has mastery over English and I will strive to get my French and Spanish on par with his English level!!
I don't fully agree on one point, namely on the fact that people who have lived 30 years in a foreign. country speak almost like native speakers. There are many examples showing it is not always the case, it really depends on many other factors as well and especially on one's imitating skills. Some people pick up habits and ways quite fast, others never do. I totally agree on the rest
lol peasant. Thanks for the laugh, never heard anyone refer to poor (assumed uneducated?) as such.
I'm an American, I don't think I can pass myself off as a native Japanese speaker, for example.
I don't really see the need either. I study a lot of languages, but I only strive to be excellent at a few of them. Maybe for fun, or as an experiment I can see how close to native I can get, including body language, patterns of speech, cultural references, etc, but I wouldn't do that for each language I study. I don't have any desire to try and fool people, even if I could pull it off. I think your example of the Danish professor has already reached the pinnacle of foreign language proficiency. He didn't grow up with American culture, and so that is not a part of his identity. It seems disingenuous to try and pretend. I've heard non-native English speakers attempt to do so before and it just sounds weird, especially if they have a stronger accent. I don't hold it against them for trying, but it doesn't sound right. Its kind of like the stereotypical middle-age man trying to dress like a teenager, or a balding man with a comb-over. By all means, learn the references, learn the accent, keep improving, but know that no matter how good you get, there will always be something that gives away your non-nativeness, and that's OK.
Thanks for the comment! I found this:
peasant
/ˈpɛz(ə)nt/
noun
plural noun: peasants
a poor smallholder or agricultural labourer of low social status (chiefly in historical use or with reference to subsistence farming in poorer countries).
"peasant farmers"
INFORMAL
an ignorant, rude, or unsophisticated person.
"‘That is a civilized drink, you peasant’"
I find it interesting how most Americans are reacting to the use I made of this word in this video. Although I meant to use peasant in the informal sense, my actual use of the word is perceived as odd and/or awkward. This goes to show how complex languages are - each word has a history on its own - and this is of the many reasons why machines - even the most sophisticated ones - will have a hard time replicating the way humans use language to communicate (not to mention translating one language into the other.) I quote from someone who wrote about our fabulous linguist Umberto Eco's book:
"In his essay “Experience in translation“, whose subtitle in the Italian version is “say almost the same thing”, Umberto Eco argues that the translation is not about comparing two languages, but about the interpretation of a text in two different languages, thus involving a shift between cultures"
@@LucaLampariello Americans don't use the word peasant for an average farmer. while making your comparison with the Danish prof and the American native speaker, you should have just said "American farmer". Much smoother.
Luca Lampariello - I knew exactly what you meant, but as an Australian I actually laughed, too 😊 For some reason we never think of anyone in Australia as a “peasant”. It just conjures up images of peasants in feudal Japan for me. For what it’s worth, you pass for me as a non-Australian native English speaker outside Australia brought up with immigrant parents.
@@LucaLampariello "Peasant" has funny connotations in English - not really "contadino"- or maybe it is!. Check out Eugene Weber's classic social history: "From Peasants to Frenchmen". It's become a bit of a stereotype. It brings to mind someone wearing a cap and riding a donkey - usually in the Middle Ages, in France, Spain, Italy. I remember an article in the Herald Tribune talking about the "peasants' in Tuscany - many who are highly educated and have more money than, say, "farmers" in Iowa
Luca Lampariello Funny! It’s like this thing came up on exactly right video to be relevant. Luca is a hell of an English speaker, but no one in the US would ever call someone else a peasant unless they’re trying to be extremely rude. No matter how good he is, he’s still not a native speaker (as I’ll never be a native German speaker, and in the long run, worrying about it is foolish).
Ma stai a Villa Pamphili? Complimenti, a parte questo!
Great the imitations...so funny.😂Great video!
I adore your way of tackling such topics... Wooooow mouth watering topic to widen my gaze 😄
U can put into account that even u not born in that country ,as long as u raised up there like for example ,u came to that country at the very young age' you can consider urself as a native speaker .
Dude I tried to pass a C2 level test in Spanish(my native language), But they even used expressions I've never hear of
bro yo intente hacer un examen de c2 de español de 24 preguntas y obtuve 16 buenas osea lo gane pero al limite jaajajja por eso yo siempre pienso que alcanzar un c2 no es tan factible en un segundo idioma
@@juancas0736 Ni siquiera es necesario para el día a día. Con un B2 o máximo C1 (contando en C1 sobre todo algunos dichos o jergas populares) basta. Yo por eso en todos los idiomas que aprendo, siempre trato de llegar al B2 y cuando puedo seguir aprendiendo jergas y dichos en ese idioma. Ahora si necesitas vocabulario avanzado, será sobre todo para tu trabajo por ejemplo.
En serio? que tan dificil es un examen c2 de español? obvio tambien soy nativo pero me dio curiosidad...
Seriously, I don't care as for speaking like a native, because I find it so cool when I see someone who speaks Portuguese with a foreign accent that I don't even think it's a matter of speaking well or not, it's just who you are.
Next time you want to give an example of Greek body language remember "extend your hand exposing your palm, like showing the other person the number 5 with your fingers and say: par'ta re malaka!"
It even has a name: moutza
Μα τι χυδαιολογίες είναι αυτές, αγαπητέ;
Perhaps the video I liked the most
Excelente video Luca👍
One of your best video Luca actually 1️⃣
Hahahaha shit your French “I don’t know” was so good 😊
Everyone: Native speaker
Luca: P E A S A N T 😎
I don't care if I'll ever speak like a native speaker, I've been living in Italy for 12 years now and guess what? I speak Italian with a slight accent but I don't care as long as my Italian is excellent and people understand me well.
BTW American people usually say that they don't understand English people, which is strange since they speak the same language ;-) But I understand both ;-))))))
Yeah, I gave up on perfecting my English accent for 2 reasons. 50% of my input are non-natives, 25% is American and 20% is British and 5% is Canada and Australia. It is way too diverse mix of various accents for me to emulate one. And English has way too many vowels for me to match perfectly.
The second reason is, that most people are okay with my accent and to my surprise, some actually like it. I think as long as people can understand you well, having a bit of exotic accent is not a bad thing.
You’re just being honest, this is a great video. Thank you
Most people's goal in language learning is NOT passing off as a native speaker IMHO. What would you have to say to those that do not travel to countries where the languages they learn are spoken? How about those who don't have much opportunity to talk to native speakers? Not everyone is so much into speaking. We have also reading and understanding spoken (recorded) language - sth we can do without a native speaker or even on our own.
I was thinking this too. Luca seems to really appreciate coming off as a native speaker to others, which is cool he finds meaning in that. I for one find meaning in listening and reading. Of course I enjoy speaking too, but I feel like if I have to go out of my way to accomplish this. Plus I suck at making friends in general so theres that lol
@@texmex321 I like talking to people, but I have discovered I don't learn so much from it - in everyday situations people (native speakers) talk about simple issues and use rather limited vocabulary. In my opinion through massive input (reading, listening) one can achieve much more. Besides, I can hardly imagine myself harassing strangers with "can we talk since I'd like to practise my language skills?"
Great video! You Rock man!
Thanks Aldo!
Thanks for your videos!! I love it!!
Thanks dear Wendy =)
¡Sos el mejor mentor de idiomas!
I was born in Brazil and my family always spoke English and Portuguese with me. I have learned English since I was born and I think in English. I also speak Portuguese, as fluent as English. Am I a native speaker?
I think the professor will speak so well than the simple native speaker do because in our native language we don't speak an academic language that why.
Although I accept the general argument of a foreign-proffesor vs. local peasant, I think the US is a bad example. US "paesants" (whatever that is supposed to mean...) could have a variety of ethnic backrounds other than English speaking.... Although English may be a native language, there still be a high degree of influence from the language(s) of their immigrant forefathers, depending on where they originated.(Scandinavian, German, etc.)
My take of the situation is that if you live in a country for long enough (10/20 years) and you speak and behave just as a native speaker and people can’t tell, you are a native speaker. The point is I think you can became a native speaker. It’s difficult but it’s possible. Just my opinion.
Schöne Bäume im Hintergrund 😮
I guess the obsession with native speakers comes from a place where native speakers are the "rightful owners" of the language. And if you are a learner, you are wrong as soon as you open your mouth. We live in a connected world, there are so many combinations of languages and abilities. For example, that thing of not knowing famous TV personalities, I get it in my native culture A LOT, because I lived abroad for 8 years before I came back home. I don't need to be a native speaker if I don't have that idea that I could be humiliated for that. I speak my languages like myself. I have weird associations from other languages in all of them including my first language.
I loved this video, in Argentina we have an interesting mixture of Spanish and Italian
Lunfardo! 🙂
I definitely got what you meant, but although is still disappointing to face the reality :'v not Matter If I do travel to New York and all of those good stuff , ouch that hurt.
Archer quote "I didn't need that heart anyway" :'v
Luca, could you once make a video about italian pronounciation of r in Italian?
So... I am slovene so rotic r is normal for me.
The thing I am looking for are rules for standard Italian which i can't find. So.. like Spanish for example, when r is the first letter in a word, it is a strong r. Is that the same in italian? Or after l, n, s 'r' is also strong (e.g. sonrisa). And off course when it is written 'rr' is a strong r. Are rules similar in Italian?
Interesting idea. I'll try to make a video about the Italian (and Spanish) r in 2020 =)
@@LucaLampariello thank you. I cannot find it anywhere so it will be used by many people :)
Well, since I highly doubt I'll ever get past B1, I'm not worried about whether "C2 is good enough."
So motivating! Thank you!
I think comparing monolingual native speakers with bi-multilingual non-native speakers, who by definition, speak two or more languages at a high level, is kinda pointless. Of course, you’ll find differences. The bi- multilinguals’ will have a foreign accent (even if it’s a slight one), their culture is different etc. If someone speaks more languages then those languages will affect each other. Even simultaneous bilinguals who were born in an English-speaking country might have a “foreign” accent in English (everybody has an accent btw) and might not be 100% aware of the different customs of that country. The definition of native English accent itself is problematic since there are a lot of English dialects. Culture is not homogenous either even in one country there are different habits. Nevertheless, if someone’s aim is to sound and/or behave like one of them (NES) then it’s up to them. Personally, it makes me frustrated.
Ps I hope this comment didn’t come across as mean it wasn’t my purpose:). Luca’s language skills are incredible and he’s ability to analyse languages and the pragmatics of languages is also phenomenal. He truly is an inspiration
Great advice Luca!
All I have heard from others people that the native speakers are totally gained their languages with genetics and others things like listening.
I'm 5 years in England and I don't know how to speak a good English and you have an amazing pronunciation in French,Spanish and Italian Roman accent...it's really frustrating for me....😅
Frankly, I don't care about passing for a native.
Of course, a migrant who doesn't want to be discriminated against will probably put a lot of effort into his accent. The same goes for someone who wants to be an actor or to work with his voice.
My usual goal is that of sounding "foreign-born" without natives being able to understand where I come from. That is usually an excellent conversation starter and it's useful when dealing with officials and bureaucracy.
I'm currently studying Spanish, but I am still at a very basic level. Despite that, I am quite proud of the fact that most people don't understand where I come from. To me, this means that I'm doing my listening/speaking practice well.
Nicht nur das sondern ich habe gemerkt das elsässische Leute haben andere Gestik als Franzosen. Die sind beide aus Frankreich aber die sind unterschiedlich. Tolles Video und wahr. Hauptsache kann man kommunizieren .Ich bin froh wenn ich komuniziren kann egal das ich Akzent habe.
Interesting. I was born in Chile. I don't use or understand chilean slang (it must be explained to me) and My fellow chileans have doubts about My nacionality when the hear me speak.
I do have a chilean accent, I just don't like speak incorrectly. ( Yes I have been bullied by this and have some job interviewers ask If I hace some type of autism [I don't think I do]) I learned My second language at the age of ten by living two years in England.
So it's funny to not be a native speaker of My own language.
Note: chilean slang is ridiculously complicated. Ask any spanish speaker. Seriously. I don't get it much because I preffered to read than go outside so I missed My chance to mingle with My kind.
Amazing video !
Interesting use of the word peasant. I think that’s your Italian showing up, I was confused when j first heard the word in french, like wow - they still use that here huh? Too archaic in English now, I suppose it can be droll when used properly.
you are idolizing native speakers too much. That is because you have accents in English, French and every single language you learned. But actually it is possible to reduce the accents to the minimum. I guess you tried a lot, but it wasnt enough or you werent cut out to speak like a native.
we all look forward to your follow-up video where you explain your methods
I picked up a Québec accent of sorts in 3 days.
As a Southerner of the USA, it was very strange to switch from living around Appalachia, in a Celtic area, to moving to the North, to a flat, German area. It was like I was a foreigner. Our English is different, our culture is different; how we talk is different--physical expressions, gestures. They did not understand what we meant when we said, "He's hollering at me." One responded to me, "I'm not hollering at you!"
Cultural understanding is the root of Japanese humour. Like you can walk into an American comedy club and get like half the jokes wherever you are from? Japanese jokes are bits that are reused. LIke. a guy will be "When am I gonna do it? Now, of course." Or, "Relax, I've got on underwear." And that is just like a fact for people who haven't lived in Japan, but I am out here rolling on the floor cackling.
Mamma mia Luca sei un mostro con le lingue, vorrei imparare il tedesco che mi consigli?
Thanks luca
Molta verita' in questo video
I'm uh peasant and I apruve this massage.
good point
Despite I agree very much on the culture and accent topic I see nothing wrong to say "He (or she) sounds like a native speaker." even they were not born in my country. Once I was in Madrid and behind me two people talked in German perfectly. So, I was convinced they were Germans, (and maybe that was the case) but as I turned around I noticed they looked differently. So, I would say they sounded like native speakers. And it doesn't matter to me if there were Germans, or born in Germany or not.
Whereas the culture knowledge are indeed very important. Because, even if you use the right word in the right context, it could be wrong, because It could be used otherwise than in your own culture.
A native German might think differently. Language is a tool to communicate. Sounding, looking, behaving like a native are ok. Just not necessary. Wanting the prestige of being a native speaker is just an ego issue. Nothing more.
@@plerpplerp5599 Well, I guess, I have some clue how perfect German sounds, because I am German. But I guess, you missed my point anyway. I said nothing about, that I want to achieve that level. My level in English as well as in Spanish is under C. So, for me is still not right the time in dreaming about speaking as a native speaker. I only wanted to point out, that the estimation "like a native speaker" under certain circumstances valid and acceptable is.
How many languages do you speak? Whats your native language? English?
using the word peasant pegs you as not a native english speaker, especially not north american. but i know what you mean. i think a lot of people wont be able to get past it though.
I think "peasant" comes from an Italian word he was trying to say in English but translated it different.