Games Workshop prices are not the standard for Miniature Wargaming. I've been wargaming for 35 years and never spent 300-400 $ in a game or in an army. 28mm plastic historicals cost 50 pence each miniature. You can go on a low budget to play games like SAGA or Dragon Rampant for example. And of course there are the 6, 10 and 15 mm. armies that haven't even been mentioned in the video.
1/72 (20mm) is even more economical than 28mm. For example, a box of around 50 plastic infantry usually costs less than $10 Australian, and there is also a wide range of plastic kit armoured vehicles available in this scale, as well as a few metal figure ranges. I mainly use the 'chain of command' WWII rules by 'too fat lardies', which has ground scale of 12 inches = 40 yards, so the 20mm miniatures are only slightly oversized compared to the ground scale. As another bonus, HO scale model railway scenery and buildings fit in reasonably well with this scale. Ps I agree that GW figures are WAY overpriced compared to the market standard.
Well said, that man. I have over thirty forces at present, and there have been many others in the past, but I've never been a rich man. And I prefer it the way I do it - 10mm, so I can have a thousand or so figures in action at a time. 28mm is for skirmish games. They have their raisons d'etre, but I do get rather tired of the assumption that it sets the benchmark! (Never mind what trying to do Trafalgar in 28mm would imply).
@@corvusboreus2072 absolutely. There's an assumption that you have to invest piles of money and huge amounts of time to paint your figures to the GW standard and play their 3 inch thick rulebooks, but you can paint a box or two of 1/72 figures with three colours and play with a cheap set of rules that you could learn in half an hour, and have a full wargame experience. That assumption deters so many people from the hobby I love.
Not only can you scratchbuild terrain, you can do it for your army, specially if you play vehicle heavy army. In 40k this works best with certain armies like orkz or chaos, former because in fluff they just build random ramshackle vehicles and later because chaos can mutate even vehicles, so you can make like tanks from cardboard and cover them stuff etc.
There's a whole hobby out of Games Workshop. Go get a massive 15mm roman army for €60, paint it in a week or less and play basic impetus, impetus, hail caesar, DBA, Kings of War Historical and so on. Go buy an €80 german army for Bolt Action and paint it by drybrushing in two days, then learn the rules in a couple of games. Same with Flames of War. And even if you want to play fantasy games, there are alternatives to GW. Go get a €30 warband for Kings of War Vanguard, or get an €80 army for Kings of War. You can play Warlords of Erehwon with the same miniatures (Warlord Games' version of Age of Sigmar, more tactical, few weird abilities). Science-fiction? sure! There are a couple of alternatives as well. Just stay away from GW's main games, Age of Sigmar and 40k, 'cause GW is often the newcomers' crusher: too many noobs get interested in the hobby, expend €200 in GW's stuff, never finish painting the miniatures because they realize how difficult and time consuming it can be and those miniatures are too expensive and beautiful to paint them by drybrushing, so they get discouraged and they don't play a single game... or play once, get their ass kicked and that's it. Too many special abilities and fantasy stuff to learn. Intellectual stuff that you can't see moving on the table. And GW pretends you to buy all the army books, or your rivals will keep surprising you with their new abilities and combos... I don't know if I'm making any sense but, I was a GW's hooligan once and nowdays I'm like, geeeez! It's sad to me to see how many people think of GW as "the" hobby.
Beware the insular cult of GW. As well as the ridiculously overpriced models, they also keep draining the purse through designed obsolescence in the form of 'codex creep'. I now mainly play WWII in 1/72 scale (20mm) using 'chain of command' rules by too fat lardies (I personally prefer the mechanics to those of 'bolt action') and have acquired rules, expansions, and 2 opposing forces (infantry platoons with support choices) for a fraction of the cost of collecting a small 40k army.
Agreed. and if you want that 28mm sci fi flavor you can get that with cheaper model lines, like Wargames Atlantic, and cheaper or even free rule sets like Starfinder or Grimdark Future. Hell, in Historical games Osprey has so many blue books that cover just about everything.
@@nerdfatha I second Grimdark Future. I see players in my community complaining their armies are not working in the new meta. I told them forget meta, download Grimdark Future and enjoy the game.
it is still cheaper to have both armies and another game system that is not warhammer 40k. Go historical or look for sci-fi games that are in say 15mm scale.
I know it seems counter intuitive, but Battletech is considered a board game because of the hex board. Also, sadly, Battletech is a niche within a niche, so it never gets the representation it deserves among table top wargames.
I respect Battletech for being around since the 80s and I even own some mechs. But we have to acknowledge not all games like Battletech are played constantly at all FLGS.
Good grief the hobby can be so much cheaper than what they are suggesting. Buy an old Risk set second hand. You know have hundreds of miniatures pieces that are 10mm scale. Use elmers glue to stick them to cardboard or what have you for basing them. Download or make up rules. Put down some green felt for your battle field and start playing.
Avoid Games Workshop like the plague. Their pieces may look nice, but the scale is huge and as for the prices - well, best you see your bank manager before going down that rabbit hole. Personally I much prefer historical wargaming in that much derided 1/72 scale; but they are well moulded, within the average persons budget, and don't require huge storage space (says he with many thousand Napoleonic figs) or a huge able to produce a decent looking battle. Also a good scale for us older gamers with deteriorating eyesight - small scales have me reaching for a magnifying glass, & larger scales look like skirmishes, not battles (unless you have access to a huge table).
There is so much wrong with this video...god...I could write a book about it. Wargaming goes back to Mesopotamia. Julius Caesar carried a sand table on campaign to work out battles in advance. The Chinese are also in there with the chess forerunner. The military started using tabletop wargaming again after the computer programs got Iraq completely wrong (they found out programmers were tweaking the software to give the military the answer they wanted...not the real outcome of a given situation...and paper / miniature wargaming is way cheaper than the software they were using). Terrain from trash they got right. I built my toybox from plastic and metal minis and can play out skirmish or proxy and go bigger if I want for way less than the overpriced noise they are suggesting. Kit bashing is the key to building a good collection. I can play out Ancients to Contemporary (500-1500 AD and Cold War / Post Cold War are my go to periods). etc etc etc
Games Workshop prices are not the standard for Miniature Wargaming. I've been wargaming for 35 years and never spent 300-400 $ in a game or in an army. 28mm plastic historicals cost 50 pence each miniature. You can go on a low budget to play games like SAGA or Dragon Rampant for example. And of course there are the 6, 10 and 15 mm. armies that haven't even been mentioned in the video.
1/72 (20mm) is even more economical than 28mm.
For example, a box of around 50 plastic infantry usually costs less than $10 Australian, and there is also a wide range of plastic kit armoured vehicles available in this scale, as well as a few metal figure ranges.
I mainly use the 'chain of command' WWII rules by 'too fat lardies', which has ground scale of 12 inches = 40 yards, so the 20mm miniatures are only slightly oversized compared to the ground scale.
As another bonus, HO scale model railway scenery and buildings fit in reasonably well with this scale.
Ps I agree that GW figures are WAY overpriced compared to the market standard.
Well said, that man. I have over thirty forces at present, and there have been many others in the past, but I've never been a rich man. And I prefer it the way I do it - 10mm, so I can have a thousand or so figures in action at a time. 28mm is for skirmish games. They have their raisons d'etre, but I do get rather tired of the assumption that it sets the benchmark! (Never mind what trying to do Trafalgar in 28mm would imply).
You are right. Not all games are expensive
@@corvusboreus2072 absolutely. There's an assumption that you have to invest piles of money and huge amounts of time to paint your figures to the GW standard and play their 3 inch thick rulebooks, but you can paint a box or two of 1/72 figures with three colours and play with a cheap set of rules that you could learn in half an hour, and have a full wargame experience. That assumption deters so many people from the hobby I love.
Not only can you scratchbuild terrain, you can do it for your army, specially if you play vehicle heavy army. In 40k this works best with certain armies like orkz or chaos, former because in fluff they just build random ramshackle vehicles and later because chaos can mutate even vehicles, so you can make like tanks from cardboard and cover them stuff etc.
Used this to make my own game.
Pics or didn't happen.
There's a whole hobby out of Games Workshop. Go get a massive 15mm roman army for €60, paint it in a week or less and play basic impetus, impetus, hail caesar, DBA, Kings of War Historical and so on. Go buy an €80 german army for Bolt Action and paint it by drybrushing in two days, then learn the rules in a couple of games. Same with Flames of War. And even if you want to play fantasy games, there are alternatives to GW. Go get a €30 warband for Kings of War Vanguard, or get an €80 army for Kings of War. You can play Warlords of Erehwon with the same miniatures (Warlord Games' version of Age of Sigmar, more tactical, few weird abilities). Science-fiction? sure! There are a couple of alternatives as well. Just stay away from GW's main games, Age of Sigmar and 40k, 'cause GW is often the newcomers' crusher: too many noobs get interested in the hobby, expend €200 in GW's stuff, never finish painting the miniatures because they realize how difficult and time consuming it can be and those miniatures are too expensive and beautiful to paint them by drybrushing, so they get discouraged and they don't play a single game... or play once, get their ass kicked and that's it. Too many special abilities and fantasy stuff to learn. Intellectual stuff that you can't see moving on the table. And GW pretends you to buy all the army books, or your rivals will keep surprising you with their new abilities and combos... I don't know if I'm making any sense but, I was a GW's hooligan once and nowdays I'm like, geeeez! It's sad to me to see how many people think of GW as "the" hobby.
Beware the insular cult of GW.
As well as the ridiculously overpriced models, they also keep draining the purse through designed obsolescence in the form of 'codex creep'.
I now mainly play WWII in 1/72 scale (20mm) using 'chain of command' rules by too fat lardies (I personally prefer the mechanics to those of 'bolt action') and have acquired rules, expansions, and 2 opposing forces (infantry platoons with support choices) for a fraction of the cost of collecting a small 40k army.
Agreed. and if you want that 28mm sci fi flavor you can get that with cheaper model lines, like Wargames Atlantic, and cheaper or even free rule sets like Starfinder or Grimdark Future. Hell, in Historical games Osprey has so many blue books that cover just about everything.
@@nerdfatha I second Grimdark Future. I see players in my community complaining their armies are not working in the new meta. I told them forget meta, download Grimdark Future and enjoy the game.
it is still cheaper to have both armies and another game system that is not warhammer 40k. Go historical or look for sci-fi games that are in say 15mm scale.
Great video, but how did Battletech not make it on here?
I know it seems counter intuitive, but Battletech is considered a board game because of the hex board. Also, sadly, Battletech is a niche within a niche, so it never gets the representation it deserves among table top wargames.
I respect Battletech for being around since the 80s and I even own some mechs. But we have to acknowledge not all games like Battletech are played constantly at all FLGS.
I always wondered if anyone did malta
what is the footage at 1:05 from?
I'm going to GUESS it's from Pike and Shotte ( though it's hard to tell at a glance at those angles )
@@sebytheman I think you are correct.
Wow! at 5:02 Dropzone Commander
Great video, new subscriber 👍
Fantastic!
What about go? You forgot that one before chess or any if that later stuff.
30-50 bucks a year. Ahahahahaha
Bolt action is my fav.
It's impressive ... but nah... I'll happily stick to playing hex-n-counter monster games.
Good grief the hobby can be so much cheaper than what they are suggesting. Buy an old Risk set second hand. You know have hundreds of miniatures pieces that are 10mm scale. Use elmers glue to stick them to cardboard or what have you for basing them. Download or make up rules. Put down some green felt for your battle field and start playing.
these guys put a ton of work into it....cue unpainted figure...
Avoid Games Workshop like the plague. Their pieces may look nice, but the scale is huge and as for the prices - well, best you see your bank manager before going down that rabbit hole. Personally I much prefer historical wargaming in that much derided 1/72 scale; but they are well moulded, within the average persons budget, and don't require huge storage space (says he with many thousand Napoleonic figs) or a huge able to produce a decent looking battle. Also a good scale for us older gamers with deteriorating eyesight - small scales have me reaching for a magnifying glass, & larger scales look like skirmishes, not battles (unless you have access to a huge table).
There is so much wrong with this video...god...I could write a book about it.
Wargaming goes back to Mesopotamia. Julius Caesar carried a sand table on campaign to work out battles in advance. The Chinese are also in there with the chess forerunner.
The military started using tabletop wargaming again after the computer programs got Iraq completely wrong (they found out programmers were tweaking the software to give the military the answer they wanted...not the real outcome of a given situation...and paper / miniature wargaming is way cheaper than the software they were using).
Terrain from trash they got right.
I built my toybox from plastic and metal minis and can play out skirmish or proxy and go bigger if I want for way less than the overpriced noise they are suggesting. Kit bashing is the key to building a good collection. I can play out Ancients to Contemporary (500-1500 AD and Cold War / Post Cold War are my go to periods).
etc etc etc