You have the patience of a saint Peter. I'm not sure I could manage the vagaries of some of your customers... I trust you were paid well for the work you did, and yes, there is much learning in your presentation. It is true that we learn more when things go wrong. You are operating at a much higher level than most of us out here in You Tube Land Peter. I, for example, am struggling with my 4' x 1' 009 Scale end to end layout plans with three sets of points... 🙄. Only kidding. Hope you are coping as well as possible right now. Please keep posting. Your work is really appreciated.
Such a shame to see you meet all the challenges, produce one of your most interesting designs, and then be frustrated. It's good to see and hear you again, Peter, and know you are still enjoying your endeavours. Let's hope you can take this ahead.
Peter hope things are getting a little better, I went through the same issue 18 months ago. I lost my wife, younger brother & sister in one year. I just kept busy and tried to work through the whole family matter. Always keep the family close. Tom
I’m assuming that this extremely complicated plan was done in the past with your total focus and not within the past couple of days. Very impressive that you can keep track of all the different elevations and numerous changes and editions and then change them all at the customer’s request. The mother in law moving in has caused another change and I can see her needing a nice bathroom and some kind of lounge area and this ending up as a small switching layout, if he’s lucky. Lol. Thank you. Even in your time of sorrow, you leave us with humor in the end of the video. We are here for you and you, your wife, and your family are in our prayers.
Well worth showing us this one; indeed, plenty to learn there. Makes a nice change to see a layout that includes a major passenger station and associated railroad 'stuff'.
It is commendably thoughtful of you @David Firth to be considerate of Peter's client and at least try to understand his feelings. It is wonderful he shared this design and the comments here from others about how patient, adaptive and artistic he was in fitting the usual space are well deserved. He is truly a genius. He not only met all the design brief desires but also added numerous flourishes that probably only Peter is capable of. You are correct it is disappointing to have lost the opportunity to continue this layout. The sacrifice in support of my family was however the only ethical decision.
This is one great design, very ambitious to say the least, but I like it. You came up with a great design it's to bad too see it may not happen for now, thanks so very much for sharing Jack 👍👍👍
Talk about chicken and egg, or is it counting roosters? Either way a fascinating enterprise and goes to show the benefits(?) of an awkwardly shaped space, scenic wise. I guess as long as you got paid, and I hope you got paid(?), it all makes for a fascinating exercise. I always feel, in a way, that as long as I can see it in my mind's eye, there really isn't any need to build it. The layout is already there. That is the great thing about being able to read a plan, and having seen how you build your layouts, it is 'easy' enough to visualise this one as built - even though it may never be? Keep strong Peter, my best wishes and prayers still go out to you after last week's revelations.
I did enjoy this. I learned a few things too. I know I have been in touch. And I am putting together a list of what I want so I can find out how much it would cost me to get a good design for my 12 by 16 building. Looking a multi levels and a peninsula. I know it's going to be awhile. Take your time. It's never an easy thing to go through what you are going through. You have my prayers. And can't wait to work with you.
Don't have enough space for the design, just ask(demand) for more from the client, the brief is to fit it to the space not take up the guy's entire living space. Before he moved the wall why didn't you recommend the helix could have gone in the center? Good video on redesigning a railway system, I myself have tried to choose between a table or whole room layout, this has helped alot, whatever I do will need the ability to expand. The other issue for me is I like villages, cities and castle, none seem to be in this layout, how would you do these? Shame this was never built.
Without moving the side wall out to add that extra alcove, there was not enough space to get a curve of acceptable radius in that corner, so it could not have been used at all - regardless of where the helix went. The client was determined it should go in the corner until I showed him the benefits of moving it out. Also see reply to your other comment.
Just curious with the software you use to design the track layouts, is there a way to automatically generate sections thru the layout? The plan views are great but also having a section to see exactly what your proposing for each level would be awesome? Not sure the software can do that, I'm just curious... and please except my deepest sympathy on the loss of your wife...
The software can be used to draw a section through a layout, but it is certainly not "automatic". Creating the plan in 3D is a complicated and lengthy task that no client is ever likely to want to pay for, and even then I don't think there is a function to create a section through it. I have on occasion drawn my own sectional views in order to illustrate a plan.
I'm guessing the odd angles of the building means this is a small home or semi in a built up city area, because there are stairs, this looks like a loft or second floor addition, the workshop is really a bedroom as you found out later, crew lounge a bath room or kitchen? Or 3 bedrooms above the living areas. Which is why he wanted it in the one room, you probably put him off as you encroached on the other two rooms. Also since he was wanting scenic landscapes and a harbor, all the industrial elements while correctly placed for realism, was not the goal of the brief? A simple design with a town, village and a central platform is probably all he was looking for to start with. Also for a beginner, I see 1 and half levels as more than sufficient.
Wrong on all counts, I'm afraid. This is not a home in a built-up area; it's an outbuilding on a farm. I followed the brief as it was given, but the client kelp wanting to add more. When the want-list for a layout design exceeds the space available, the only choices are to reduce the want-list or enlarge the space - this client chose to enlarge the space.
Afternoon sir Victor from New Jersey how are you and your dogs today. There's not a lot of new content out there so I'm going through a lot of old content yours and other UA-camrs currently building an HO scale modular type layout so when I have to move it's like 4 ft sections I'm going to fairly small room 12x14 making it up as I kind of go starting out with a roundhouse scratch built start to finish turntable in the first four feet which takes me into the corner going to do some type of a homemade bridge river scene and go from there having said that recommended curves on an HO scale I plan on running long old steam locomotive articulated once I buy a couple right now I'm picking stuff with the chickens building what I can with what lumber I have and track and whatnot but before I come into the corner build I was curious as to what do you recommend I want to have two main lines coming out of that I mean do I go for like a 40 inch should I keep it at a 24 I mean what's good what's going to suit my needs for articulated locomotives if you can help me with that question I'd greatly appreciate it so you have a wonderful day and bye for now
For big articulated steamers, go with the widest curved you can fit into the space. Even though some such models are built to go around 24" curves, they look like crap doing so. Curves in the 36-40" range look pretty good though.
@@mpeterll thank you sir I was thinking about a 40 inch in that first curve and you just made up my mind I will send you pictures of my work as the progress moves forward right now not worthy of a picture but I'll get there I'm out of work due to hernia so I have time to work on this thing I just got to get a little more wood and I can keep producing thank you for getting back to me sir you're an absolute gentleman bye for now
Once again sir how are you? Is there a definitive number from the front of the roundhouse to the start of the turntable for the length of those tracks if you can help me with that a thousand thank yous if not 999 thank yous once again I speak with you because what I've watched on TV your knowledge is what I want and I'm a 40-year carpenter as well thank you for letting me pick your brain and learn something new bye for now
Love the channel. As a newbie to model railways, I'd really like to see how a multilevel layout looks once built. Do you have a video showing a 2 or 3 level railway and what the observer sees?
There are many such layouts published in Model Railroader magazine, often with overall views showing how the levels look to a viewer. A subscription is well worth the money.
@@mpeterll Thanks very much for the tip. Will buy a copy for the next few months and see if I like them. Maybe for my birthday (in April), a subscription could be a nice birthday present from my family..... Hope you’re keeping well and positive during your sad times.
3rd-plan-it will do 3D drawings, but it takes at least 10x as long to create it as it does for a simple 2D plan. Since it is unlikely that anyone will ever want to pay me for all that extra time, I probably won't ever be presenting a plan in 3D on this channel - sorry.
This is a classic case of an over enthusiastic customer diving right into the project details before assessing the fundamental parameters. It's really a shame to see so much design efforts "wasted" only because no careful survey was done in the beginning. Giving the odd shape of this building, it seems to confirm the customer is passionate but disorganized.
Yes thats a good idea to put the mother in-law in the workshop, I normally favour the shed 😂😂 fantastic design Peter
You have the patience of a saint Peter. I'm not sure I could manage the vagaries of some of your customers... I trust you were paid well for the work you did, and yes, there is much learning in your presentation. It is true that we learn more when things go wrong. You are operating at a much higher level than most of us out here in You Tube Land Peter. I, for example, am struggling with my 4' x 1' 009 Scale end to end layout plans with three sets of points... 🙄. Only kidding. Hope you are coping as well as possible right now. Please keep posting. Your work is really appreciated.
Such a shame to see you meet all the challenges, produce one of your most interesting designs, and then be frustrated. It's good to see and hear you again, Peter, and know you are still enjoying your endeavours. Let's hope you can take this ahead.
Good to see your back Peter.
Hope that you are doing well at this time Peter.. still thinking of you and your family during this difficult time in your life..
Peter hope things are getting a little better, I went through the same issue 18 months ago. I lost my wife, younger brother & sister in one year. I just kept busy and tried to work through the whole family matter. Always keep the family close. Tom
I’m assuming that this extremely complicated plan was done in the past with your total focus and not within the past couple of days. Very impressive that you can keep track of all the different elevations and numerous changes and editions and then change them all at the customer’s request. The mother in law moving in has caused another change and I can see her needing a nice bathroom and some kind of lounge area and this ending up as a small switching layout, if he’s lucky. Lol. Thank you. Even in your time of sorrow, you leave us with humor in the end of the video. We are here for you and you, your wife, and your family are in our prayers.
Yes, this was done before my wife passed.
Well worth showing us this one; indeed, plenty to learn there. Makes a nice change to see a layout that includes a major passenger station and associated railroad 'stuff'.
I've done a few layouts with passenger terminals - and recently published at least two others that I can think of.
What a beautiful design Peter. It detracts from the very odd non conventional shape of the room and really works.
Great idea for such an odd room, welcome back
Shocking that your client didn't give you correct dimensions for the space. I love your videos and enjoy how you come up with some great layout ideas.
Wow what a process you go through to design and redesign, mind bending and fascinating. Thank you for sharing.
Thanks for sharing this layout. I think it would have been a great layout. I really like what you came up with. God bless.
Great to see you Peter, what an interesting shape you had to work with
Adding one mother-in-law, subtracts one future train layout, is usually how that math formula resolves, unfortunately.
oh dear ,
It is commendably thoughtful of you @David Firth to be considerate of Peter's client and at least try to understand his feelings. It is wonderful he shared this design and the comments here from others about how patient, adaptive and artistic he was in fitting the usual space are well deserved. He is truly a genius. He not only met all the design brief desires but also added numerous flourishes that probably only Peter is capable of.
You are correct it is disappointing to have lost the opportunity to continue this layout. The sacrifice in support of my family was however the only ethical decision.
Wonder video i love the steel mill mirror idea......that might just migrate into my own track plans
A beautifully designed layout for somewhat of a wishy-washy customer very well done
Very good video. I hope you are ok at the moment.thank you for sharing your work with us
This is one great design, very ambitious to say the least, but I like it. You came up with a great design it's to bad too see it may not happen for now, thanks so very much for sharing Jack 👍👍👍
Peter, this is very impressive design in such a weird space to work with! - Jason
Great work trying to give a client his wishes to bad if it doesn't get past planning.
Talk about chicken and egg, or is it counting roosters?
Either way a fascinating enterprise and goes to show the benefits(?) of an awkwardly shaped space, scenic wise.
I guess as long as you got paid, and I hope you got paid(?), it all makes for a fascinating exercise.
I always feel, in a way, that as long as I can see it in my mind's eye, there really isn't any need to build it. The layout is already there. That is the great thing about being able to read a plan, and having seen how you build your layouts, it is 'easy' enough to visualise this one as built - even though it may never be?
Keep strong Peter, my best wishes and prayers still go out to you after last week's revelations.
Real head scratcher, welcome back hope all is well
Still a very interesting design... would be nice to see it come to life.
I did enjoy this. I learned a few things too. I know I have been in touch. And I am putting together a list of what I want so I can find out how much it would cost me to get a good design for my 12 by 16 building. Looking a multi levels and a peninsula. I know it's going to be awhile. Take your time. It's never an easy thing to go through what you are going through. You have my prayers. And can't wait to work with you.
I'm still going through my web-site correspondence, so if you haven't yet done so, just sent me a message from there.
It's genious. Thank you.
You must have some patience to do all this hope you are a bit better thanks for sharing 😀👍
Thank you for the new video.
Don't have enough space for the design, just ask(demand) for more from the client, the brief is to fit it to the space not take up the guy's entire living space. Before he moved the wall why didn't you recommend the helix could have gone in the center?
Good video on redesigning a railway system, I myself have tried to choose between a table or whole room layout, this has helped alot, whatever I do will need the ability to expand. The other issue for me is I like villages, cities and castle, none seem to be in this layout, how would you do these? Shame this was never built.
Without moving the side wall out to add that extra alcove, there was not enough space to get a curve of acceptable radius in that corner, so it could not have been used at all - regardless of where the helix went. The client was determined it should go in the corner until I showed him the benefits of moving it out.
Also see reply to your other comment.
Just curious with the software you use to design the track layouts, is there a way to automatically generate sections thru the layout? The plan views are great but also having a section to see exactly what your proposing for each level would be awesome? Not sure the software can do that, I'm just curious... and please except my deepest sympathy on the loss of your wife...
The software can be used to draw a section through a layout, but it is certainly not "automatic". Creating the plan in 3D is a complicated and lengthy task that no client is ever likely to want to pay for, and even then I don't think there is a function to create a section through it. I have on occasion drawn my own sectional views in order to illustrate a plan.
I don’t know how you do it Peter. I got 3rd plan it and I can’t make it do what you can! Great job!
Keep practicing and you will get better at it.
I sure hope so!
I'm guessing the odd angles of the building means this is a small home or semi in a built up city area, because there are stairs, this looks like a loft or second floor addition, the workshop is really a bedroom as you found out later, crew lounge a bath room or kitchen? Or 3 bedrooms above the living areas. Which is why he wanted it in the one room, you probably put him off as you encroached on the other two rooms. Also since he was wanting scenic landscapes and a harbor, all the industrial elements while correctly placed for realism, was not the goal of the brief?
A simple design with a town, village and a central platform is probably all he was looking for to start with. Also for a beginner, I see 1 and half levels as more than sufficient.
I don´t know if Imy brain stopped working watching the video or just trying to follow Your Interpretation....its Just railroading-level-MADNESS!
Wrong on all counts, I'm afraid.
This is not a home in a built-up area; it's an outbuilding on a farm.
I followed the brief as it was given, but the client kelp wanting to add more.
When the want-list for a layout design exceeds the space available, the only choices are to reduce the want-list or enlarge the space - this client chose to enlarge the space.
Afternoon sir Victor from New Jersey how are you and your dogs today. There's not a lot of new content out there so I'm going through a lot of old content yours and other UA-camrs currently building an HO scale modular type layout so when I have to move it's like 4 ft sections I'm going to fairly small room 12x14 making it up as I kind of go starting out with a roundhouse scratch built start to finish turntable in the first four feet which takes me into the corner going to do some type of a homemade bridge river scene and go from there having said that recommended curves on an HO scale I plan on running long old steam locomotive articulated once I buy a couple right now I'm picking stuff with the chickens building what I can with what lumber I have and track and whatnot but before I come into the corner build I was curious as to what do you recommend I want to have two main lines coming out of that I mean do I go for like a 40 inch should I keep it at a 24 I mean what's good what's going to suit my needs for articulated locomotives if you can help me with that question I'd greatly appreciate it so you have a wonderful day and bye for now
For big articulated steamers, go with the widest curved you can fit into the space. Even though some such models are built to go around 24" curves, they look like crap doing so. Curves in the 36-40" range look pretty good though.
@@mpeterll thank you sir I was thinking about a 40 inch in that first curve and you just made up my mind I will send you pictures of my work as the progress moves forward right now not worthy of a picture but I'll get there I'm out of work due to hernia so I have time to work on this thing I just got to get a little more wood and I can keep producing thank you for getting back to me sir you're an absolute gentleman bye for now
Once again sir how are you? Is there a definitive number from the front of the roundhouse to the start of the turntable for the length of those tracks if you can help me with that a thousand thank yous if not 999 thank yous once again I speak with you because what I've watched on TV your knowledge is what I want and I'm a 40-year carpenter as well thank you for letting me pick your brain and learn something new bye for now
thank you for detail video as think lot operation in this plan if was build
Love the channel. As a newbie to model railways, I'd really like to see how a multilevel layout looks once built. Do you have a video showing a 2 or 3 level railway and what the observer sees?
There are many such layouts published in Model Railroader magazine, often with overall views showing how the levels look to a viewer. A subscription is well worth the money.
@@mpeterll Thanks very much for the tip. Will buy a copy for the next few months and see if I like them. Maybe for my birthday (in April), a subscription could be a nice birthday present from my family.....
Hope you’re keeping well and positive during your sad times.
even starting out with a room like that. I think I would of run away from it. there is/was a lot to squeeze into it. too me almost too much
The orginal space 4 metres by 4 metres?
Peter, does your software have a way to show this design in 3D? I'm a bit lost with all the levels hanging over eachother
I agree, it is a bit hard to visualise for me too.
3rd-plan-it will do 3D drawings, but it takes at least 10x as long to create it as it does for a simple 2D plan. Since it is unlikely that anyone will ever want to pay me for all that extra time, I probably won't ever be presenting a plan in 3D on this channel - sorry.
@@mpeterll Thanks for the explanation, that's a huge difference indeed.
My condolences about your wife's passing :(
My brain hurts!.......How can You cope with this???
It's what I do.
That sucks, after all that work you did and he walks away. Hope you still got paid. Chris
I'm sure he knows not to work for free for ages and rely on being paid only at the end.
This is a classic case of an over enthusiastic customer diving right into the project details before assessing the fundamental parameters. It's really a shame to see so much design efforts "wasted" only because no careful survey was done in the beginning. Giving the odd shape of this building, it seems to confirm the customer is passionate but disorganized.
Great to see you Peter, what an interesting shape you had to work with