The Ploopy Trackball(s)
Вставка
- Опубліковано 29 тра 2024
- Check out Ploopy here: ploopy.co/
Big thanks to PCBWay for the transparent resin 3D prints pcbway.com/g/cdHBtO
Chapters
0:00 (Introduction)
2:05 (Ploopy Mini)
4:15 (Ploopy Thumb)
6:33 (Mini or Thumb?)
8:17 (Customization)
10:00 (Transparent Ploopy?)
11:46 (Conclusions)
Pointing device modes PR
github.com/qmk/qmk_firmware/p...
Modified BigButtons.STL
www.printables.com/model/6884...
Ploopy github:
github.com/ploopyco/thumb-tra...
The Charybdis wireless video feat. VOID
• The Charybdis Wireless...
Instagram
/ eiga.tech
Intro theme by Hila
/ hila - Наука та технологія
Holy cow that transparent resin Ploopy looks incredible! I would love to have something like that for myself.
Every trackball mouse i've ever used:
Thumb finger over trackball design: Easy to feel fatigue, awkward, hard for game, hard to get precise (I feel like, this is why trackball isn't mainstream/normal mouse today)
Index & middle finger over trackball design: Never feel fatigued; Fun to flick; Ease of precision; Easy for gaming (FPS, RTS; In fact, i like gaming on it more than regular mice)
Trackball mouse perks in general: Can work on any surface. No mouse mat shenanigans.
wow, that transparent version is gorgeous
Been using an Elecom Ex-G Pro for about 5 months and it's amazing. I work as a recording engineer and trackballs are 100% a necessity for the amount of mouse movements you need to do with a DAW, and I've really, really enjoyed gaming with mine as well.
Interesting shape and design, wasn't aware of it. Any issues with long sessions? Have you also tried classic trackballs with the trackball positioned near the index finger?
I used elecom deft pro for 5 years for mechanical design.
You always see trackballs or trackpads in studios aswell! (Also because of deskspace I think)
I've been using an Elecom Huge for about the same time as well, for all general use.
It's great, I love the added precision from the large ball, though that can make it unwieldy with quick movements.
Wow thanks for this bro. I've been using the logitech mx master 3 for its sidescroll.
Eversince migrating to pc-based audio production a few years back, i haven't really found a good replacement for the apple magic mouse.. until now. Gna have to grab one of these elecoms.
I can confirm my quite old experience from times when mouses had a ball and world still experimented with diffrent devices - this was just after trackball hype and just before touchpads (in simple laptop kind).
On my presonal machine i have proper trackball (not trackball in mouse) but at work as IT guy i used many kinds of mouses.
After some time switch was natural, my brain by assesing what my fingers touch easly changed from one to another without concius thoughts about it.
6:38 Full agree on preferring finger operated trackballs.
After having tried an M507 trackball to see if I'd like the input, I got an Elecom Huge for my desktop.
Which is a great mouse that works for all general use and the games I do play.
It's huge ball does have significant momentum, which can make it unwieldy for quick buttons, but I like the precision this size allows for.
For remapping the keys, I use sezanzeb's input-remapper project, which works for pretty much any device on Linux machines.
Ploopy trackballs are on my radar for if the Elecom Huge becomes unavailable.
I love the way that transparent one looks, perhaps I'll treat myself to one of those in the future.
man your videos are clean, keep it up!
Switched to a trackball a few months ago and I way prefer it, but the first day or two was a little challenging. Definitely think I'll pick up a Ploopy at some point
that flexible non flexible pcb is genious!
I have been using a trackball for over 20 years now, both of the trackballs I currently have are on the 'top/finger' ball usage versions, and I defo can not see myself going back to a mouse anytime soon
Drag-scroll -- in Windows you can just middle clock (scroll click?) to enable that. No need to dive into the drivers.
It's no wonder the Thumb feels fatiguing - you say the trackball is exactly where you expect it to be, but the simple fact of the matter is that having your hand splayed out flat like that shape enforces, while still manipulating your thumb with both force and dexterity is an incredibly unnatural position. Your thumb gets no support from the rest of the hand, leading to instability that you have to compensate for with brute force - which leads to fatigue (and in time, likely RSI). Think about it: there are essentially no other situations in life where you would have your hand in a position like that and still need to repeatedly move your thumb in that kind of way. Almost no matter what you are using your hands for, manipulation of the thumb typically entails a closed or semi-closed grip, both of which support the thumb by stiffening the hand and wrist through tensioning the other fingers. The sweat issue might also be somewhat related to this, given that you'll likely be (unconsciously) trying to keep your palm "glued" to the mouse in order to support your thumb, as your other fingers can't do this. In short: this seems like a poor design based on a poor understanding of ergonomics and the physiology of human hands.
interesting take, because trackball mice are often recommended to people who do suffer from fatigue. also add to the fact that the thumb clusters for mechanical keyboards are a popular option instead of just one long spacebar.
It also looks way bigger than other models such as a Logitech MX Ergo. When I put my small hand on my Ergo, it covers the whole shell of the device and my fingertips end where the buttons end. That feels comfortable. In the video it looks like the guy has bigger hands than mine and yet he can't reach the tip of the buttons. Not sure why Ploopy felt they needed to make the shell so big.
Very interesting insight, and it all sounds reasonable. I was thinking gamepad thumbsticks are one example of similar precision being demanded from thumbs, but there you do have a semi-closed grip. Still, this design is not new, you have devices like the Logitech MX Ergo using a thumb trackball, so it is likely a problem not unique to the Ploopy Thumb.
@@kouhaiii3182 Both of those are true, but neither of those other options generally enforce repetitive forceful and dextrous thumb use with a flat hand. When typing on a keyboard your fingers will be quite bent, and most trackball mice I've seen are small enough and/or rounded enough to have a more natural grip than this. There's also of course a massive difference between intermittently pressing a few keys with your thumb and having it near-constantly be in motion, with the added support from bent fingers making that even less fatiguing.
@@MadMaxBLD yeah, it looks way too big and way too flat to be ergonomically sensible.
A trackball is way easier on the wrist. I use Logitech ERGO M575 and M570. They're wireless, doesn't seem to effect performance for me. They just work well. I don't have any others to compare to. The M575 has a better feel to it. The trackball and keyboard can share a dongle, which works great for battery powered devices. A trackball can also be installed on something and won't require removal for use, to move it around. Say if you're building a cyberdeck. My oldest one is at least 6 years old at this point. An occassional cleaning and they're like brand new. The ones I have the trackball has to be pushed out from the bottom for cleaning. The ball won't just fall out on it's own if flipped over. What I'd really like is one that is super small. The trackball itself being about the size of a marble with the reliability of the Logitech. My first trackball was built into a Compaq laptop in 94, it wasn't laser, but it was still amazing. It was about the size I described, had the buttons on the side of the laptop.
High quality videos. U deserve more subs.
Thanks! Appreciate the thought.
My family have a similar trackball mouse when the original Warcraft came out. I loved that thing. I want to get this for nostalgia, but I spent over a grand on mice last year.
You sir need a cat.
@@EIGAtech That's an underrated joke LOL
You can print a ploopy classic with a BTU and it's the ultimate mouse imo
Have you had issues with gunk getting on the BTUs and slowing down the feel?
i had a trackball once,it was one you control with your index finger and it had thumb buttons. with a little practice it can be superior to a normal mouse
Trackball are awesome if you're prone to RSI or had RSI. Since I switched to an Ergo MX I don't ever feel wrist pain. And to be honest while I don't do competitive shooters I play any game just as comfortably (more I'd even say as I don't need to constantly move around the mouse)
Nice video, as always! After some time, do you see yourself using more the TOTEM or the Charybdis? (Specially paired with a proper trackball)
Thanks! I've been using the TOTEM more, I really like the minimalism of it, and I really got used to home row mods. Still, even with the Kailh Sunsets, I am looking forward to going back to MX style switches, just not sure which keyboard yet.
Thanks! I have the classic ploopy without any modifications and I quite like it! Let me know if you (or void) would like to borrow and try it out! I messeged him on discord to ask some questions about the wireless cnano already! I'm based in Europe so I imagine the shipping wouldn't be an issue!
@@franciscoberrocal1124 Haha, that's awesome! Will definitely keep it in mind.
what a name
Can we get your modified files so we can get a clear printed resin as well? Looks amazing
Added printables link to description 👍.
@@EIGAtech The link doesn't seem to work. Takes me to PCBWay homepage. Tried clicking the link, copying the link (to get around UA-cam's redirect) and manually typing in the url but it goes straight to the homepage every time.
That is sick!
Thanks for this, was looking to replace my (censured) Logitechs Ergos (2x) and other Logitech thumb trackballs... (buttons fail, cheap hardware on Logitech)
It's likely that reason the sensor doesn't come pre soldered is that it's the only through-hole component on the board. All of the other components are placed and soldered to the board by a machine, but through-hole components must be done by hand. Kits are cheaper because you pass on the manual labour to the buyer (many of whom enjoy this sort of thing).
That makes sense and I do agree overall, but soldering just one component doesn't feel that justified to me. Usually kits like these, for example an ergo split keyboard kit will involve a lot more soldering, for pretty much every component.
What is the default way to change the dpi. Without changing the firmware?
When you click it and spinning that ball I felt like pushing your hand over to a mouse already.
dunno if it's just how it's filmed, but that silver and gold one looks like someone wiped their ploopy all over that mouse.
Have you tried the xkeys l-trac?
Nice vid mate
Dis dude could be a hand model.
Micro USB is a sin in 2023
sorry, around the 7:30 mark you mention having to lift your finger off the ball while clicking? why? i've been using an elecom finger ball for about 5 years and have never needed to do this?
I had a similar issue when I first switched to a trackball. Not anymore though. I think it stems from the muscle memory of the index finger twitching when wanting to left click, moving the ball.
Balls
now make a vid about playing minecraft using trackball,this looks cool.
What keyboard are you using in this video??
It's the TOTEM, I have a video on it: ua-cam.com/video/YwsutNf1WRA/v-deo.html
What revision this PCB is? Where can I get gerber files for PCB manufacturing?
this was rad
Thanks!
the problem for me with trackballs is that they're EXPENSIVE for a good one. you can get a good normal mouse for $30 but trackballs are at least double
there is the gameballs, and the gameball thumb is likely to ship very soon for about $70
❤❤❤
ploopy from doawk
i cant with the name!
do they sell just the electronics so you can 3d print your own shell?
Unfortunately not. Afaik the reasoning is that the 3D printed parts account to a fraction of the price.
@@EIGAtech not sure i understand - 3d printed parts dont equate to much of the overall cost/profit, so they would make almost just as much as selling the parts?
Is there way to make trackball clickable?
It would probably lose too much precision. On mine even lifting up a finger causing a little bit of movement
is this a reference to Gloopy productions?
What’s the keyboard at 5:08?
It's the TOTEM keyboard from this video: ua-cam.com/video/YwsutNf1WRA/v-deo.html
usb C tho? I know I could just solder one on but I'm lazy...
I am a fan of Trackball (that are good!*). I started using trackballs over 25 years ago.
On the poopy mini, Try setting it your 'ring finger left click & pinky right click' & other 2 finger move the ball.
Thumb trackballs are ok- but are not great if used for a long time in a day or a work-day. just over works the thumb.
*some are BAD for they are ----
the software that don't work right!
Some the parts are just junk! AKA Don't work right / at-all.
some have what looks-like a lot buttons - BUT ONLY are 2 buttons - left & right click only!
A lot Don't have changeable "DPI" WTF??? why!! & 'BAD DPI' !
The Logitech Trackman Marble was the best! The non-thumb trackballs had amazing precision on fps games
I use an elecom huge. A big ball can be very accurate. I even play fps.
5:06 It's fatiguing because you're wrist is hovering roughly 2.5cm over the desk with nothing supporting it. Trackballs are already the Devil, this incarnation seems like a love letter to 90s raver footwear.
Edit: That transparent print is lovely.
From the thumbnail, it looks like a snake!
I thought it was the head of a snake
ploopy balls lmao
Looks like a snake 🐍
who is void?
youtube.com/@voidkb the "unseen"
hehehehe
plooper
We are now in an era where a brand name can be anything.
ooh accidentally theres an l in its name. :D
Y'know what would be cool? A trackball mouse... That also works as a normal mouse so you don't have to choose between a trackball mouse or a non-trackball mouse if you want to do short bursts of FPS gaming. Personally I'd design it to be ambidextrous and smaller than most trackball mice so that you can throw it around with your fingertips. Love the transparent, uh, Ploopy. Hilarious name. :P
I've used a logitech thumb trackball for FPS gaming now for the last 25 years. You very quickly get used to it.
@@lmaoroflcopter Unfortunately I had an accident that fractured my aiming/dominant hand's thumb, so prolonged sessions of gamepad FPS gaming becomes quite uncomfortable. My injury aside, it'd be neat if a trackball mouse was also a normal mouse as gestural movement via a trackball is great for reducing RSI, but not as accurate as being able to use your whole arm to precisely aim or select things in a graphics application.
@MajatekYT I'd disagree. It would become irritating as your ability to accurately pinpoint and swiftly move to a coordinate would be dramatically affected, given the conflicting input from a thumbball and the base unit if it acted like a mouse.
As I said, I've used one exclusively for 25+ years and am just as accurate as any of my friends at playing FPS who use mice.
Playing with a trackball is nothing like playing with a game pad, I'm crap at playing fps with a controller.
Give it a go, and I bet you'll have no issue. I have RSI from being a data entry clerk many years ago. Adopting a thumb trackball and natural keyboard completely eliminated the pain.
@@lmaoroflcopter As I already said, I fractured my thumb. Any thumb-based inputs just aggrevates my thumb. I can't use trackball mice competitively that require thumb movement. This is why I would like to see, even as an experiment, an optical mouse with an additional trackball so that I can game at a decent competitive level and then eliminate RSI while checking my socials without needing two discreet pointing devices.
@@MajatekYTIf you fractured your thumb, just don't get thumb trackball then? Having trackball that also acts as mouse is very bad idea since it would need to be light to be able to move around but moving around the mouse would destabilize the trackball experience. Trackballs need to be grounded, while mice need to move. This is clear conflict which you can't easily solve.
heh, poopy
Did they really have to call the company that? Seriously? Out of all the possible names they could have chosen, they chose the one that sounds most like a 5-year-old's euphemism for going to the bathroom.
I want to buy one, but I don't know if I could stomach the slitted-eye self-judgement I'd render on myself every time I saw the logo.
I find it pretty funny and playful, or look at it this way, it’s definitely a name that stays with you.
You are totally overthinking it. Then again I'm not native english speaker so it doesn't sound even remotely weird to me.
kinda meh tbh
Do they not realize the word ploopy is associated with shit
overpriced hobby project
really bad name