*MORE FLAP FAILURES* - American A320 is UNABLE TO RETRACT THE FLAPS ua-cam.com/video/Lv2gEXzDCV0/v-deo.html - American B738 forced to land WITHOUT FLAPS AT JFK! ua-cam.com/video/ATVYGjkgq2A/v-deo.html - KLM Boeing B739 has FLAPS ISSUE at Amsterdam ua-cam.com/video/E7LW7WEK3sA/v-deo.html - Delta B739 has STUCK FLAPS AFTER TAKEOFF ua-cam.com/video/WPSj5GQVm68/v-deo.html
May I suggest you increase your fibre intake? LOL!!! "Fly direct TOILT, report established on seat. Dumping approved". HeHee!! Thanks for the laugh. :-)
Always a pleasure to listen to the Swiss: great accent but also extremely professional aviators. Love flying with Swiss and looking forward to be onboard of one of their aircraft soon again.
I love the Sound of Swiss - the intonation/melody can be heard even in English. I had a delay two years ago in Zurich and I have not experienced a friendlier and more supportive staff in Europe. Always happy to fly with them. Such huge difference to Germans/Lufthansa.
Side information on this - as I was directly impacted by this issue: - The flight back from Johannesburg to Zurich was delayed by 7h due to this and could only take off at ~02:30 in the morning - A passenger unfortunately passed away on the return flight (reasons unknown but it caused certainly some hectic on the plane!) - Despite those 7h delay, the waiting time and all the troubles, Swiss refused to pay a single cent of compensation to any of the passengers with the argument "for flights from third countries to CH, Swiss is not required to accept any restrictions and passenger laws [that would otherwise apply e.g. for a flight with a EU destination]"
Swiss are 100% in the right here. The delay was not covered by EU261. Additionally the ‘troubles’ caused by someone passing away does not require any money to be given to passengers, it’s a little weird that you’re trying to capitalise on someone’s death.
@@BenBen-vk7vq The delay was because of the flap issue, not the death if I’m correct. This seems not related to the death? I think you got the flights mixed up Ben Ben.
@@BenBen-vk7vq The delay was not caused by the death (if anything, it might have been the other way around but this would be pure speculation). It was just an additional thing worth mentioning on the flight. The cause for the delay was this flaps-incident shown in the video which lead to a cascading delay in the return leg (it was the same aircraft).
Just by chance, I was tuned in to ZRH ATC live when this happened (I listen to ATC maybe once or twice a month). While dumping fuel they flew basically straight over my house. Very cool to see this here now. 😀
Most of the fuel that is dumped turns into vapor within a few minutes. If jettisoned above 5000 feet in above freezing temperature calculations show that 98% will evaporate before reaching the ground. The fuel vapors rapidly dissipate and diffuse. This could contribute to photochemical oxidant pollution, smog.
There was a Cessna with a no-nose gear landing combined with radio/electrical issues at KEAU (Eau Claire, WI) with the first call coming in around 00z Saturday (Friday evening 7pm US central time). Interestingly, the tower asked the pilot several times if he could land either well before or well after the intersecting main runway to try and keep that open.
If they were forced to fly into Los Angeles airspace they would most likely run out of fuel before having any to dump, and indeed it is incredibly unsafe to fly such long distances with defective flight surfaces. Clearly a fuel dump site much closer to the airport of origin was the logical decision here.
At 10:30 with another hour or so to land and exit, there's not going to be an alternative flight for quite some time. Even getting to a hotel before midnight might be unlikely.
ZÜRICH ATC (sorry for you international guys it is ZURICH of course) has a much better audio quality than any other ATC featured here. SO, is the microphone better or does the controller speak out more clearly?
It's probably a mix of different reasons. The controller was only handling one aircraft so they could speak a lot slower. It also depends on where the person is recording from (ie. their distance to the airport and aircraft) and the quality of their equipment.
Neither, all of the ATC here is recorded by amateurs, it all depends on their location and equipment, atmospheric conditions, etc.. The quality you can listen to here is never the same as the actual transmissions ATC and pilots receive, their equipment is much better.
Perhaps a bit less so these days, but I feel like with the reduction in flights due to COVID-19, there are/were a lot of bored people at airports, so I get the sense that there's a lot of, "Might as well bring out all the equipment and people for this minor issue. They need the practice and are tired of running drills," attitudes at some airports.
EDDG (which normally only has like max 5 flights a day and where it's basically impossible to take a wrong turn) uses a follow me for everything - I'm talking about small GA planes too.... Ground must be really bored there
This actually happened to me, this difference being flap failure on approach. Luckily I only had a C206 with five passengers on board. I am a PPL pilot, and had training with practice before obtaining licence. The passengers didn’t notice,, except one who aske why we seemed to.be landing at a higher speed, Obviously I did and a shallower angle of descent. The landing was fast but I surprised myself with a very smooth touchdown. I deliberately tried a few flawless landing in C 172 on my own - same result,
Ahhh, don't do that. It's called Schoggi. Everytime you spell it incorrectly, a cow shepherd somewhere on a Swiss alp raises his shaking fist in anger and blasphemes against heaven.
lol the flaps are taking a vacation for a bit. Flaps/slats have a lot of complex mechanisms and sensors. If a problem is detected they're designed to remain extended as a failsafe for landing.
@@krozareq except when they don't. They do more than even my dad could explain. He's retired Navy aviation. He spent his life keeping Intruders, People Eaters and Tomcats airborne. I still love listening to his stories. Must remember to record them and get them written down. Time has a bad habit of getting away from one. He's the reason I'm fearless about flying.
Must have been a lonely night shift, so much superfluous verbiage, guess he did not want to fall asleep at the console. Ground taxiing instructions issued while the flight is still airborne. Never heard or seen anyone controller do this, must be a Swiss thing.
Zurich is a very noise sensitive area. People complain about the noise a lot. To help with the situation, controllers give the information to aircraft on how much distance the inbound airplane has to the touchdown. With that information, the pilot is able to plan a descent with idle power on the engines, basically gliding down. Much quieter. So for 12miles, the aircraft should be roughly 4000ft above the threshold altitude.
@@hbpilot70 while that is true, that is more the case for the "35 miles to touchdown" call at 5:33 - that call is indeed to give the pilots an idea of how steep they have to keep their descent if they want it to be the optimal idle descent. The call they recieved about how many miles on final is more for them to know how much time and distance they have to stabilise themselfs on the final approach segment. When you have only 6 or 8 miles for that you need to be quick to be stabilised and configured for landing, in the event of any malfunctions you'd wish for some more distance, thats why the controller offered them 12-12miles.
I don't see your problem, if the airplane is maintained and works well why would you replace it? Replacing a functioning airplane before its end of service is just a waste.
Just listen to how much more professional the pilots and ATC are in their 2nd language compared.to the shit show for US vids. Am waiting for far more incidents in the US due to diversity box checking hiring in the coming years. In aviation, Get Woke, People Die.
Does the dumped fuel have an impact on the environment? Edit: Found the perfect answer for my Question (If anyone is interested and understands German): www.flughafen-zuerich.ch/~/media/flughafenzh/dokumente/das_unternehmen/laerm_politik_und_umwelt/luft/2012_treibstoffschnellablass_de.pdf
*MORE FLAP FAILURES*
- American A320 is UNABLE TO RETRACT THE FLAPS ua-cam.com/video/Lv2gEXzDCV0/v-deo.html
- American B738 forced to land WITHOUT FLAPS AT JFK! ua-cam.com/video/ATVYGjkgq2A/v-deo.html
- KLM Boeing B739 has FLAPS ISSUE at Amsterdam ua-cam.com/video/E7LW7WEK3sA/v-deo.html
- Delta B739 has STUCK FLAPS AFTER TAKEOFF ua-cam.com/video/WPSj5GQVm68/v-deo.html
i also sometimes need 30-40 minutes for the dumping
May I suggest you increase your fibre intake? LOL!!!
"Fly direct TOILT, report established on seat. Dumping approved". HeHee!!
Thanks for the laugh. :-)
Sounds about right, the only difference is that now takeoff comes after the dumping.
@@patrickmitchell6968 :-)))
I would suggest "Enter holding pattern at TOILT, dumping approved once established."
@@reynirheidbergstefansson2343 Nice. Lol!
They have such lovely accents!
Sänk you! We Swiss are very conscious about our accent, haha
but pliis nout that se äkzenz diffr from länguätsch riigion to länguätsch riigion ... les romon parlent pas lö mäm ongläis kö les swiss allmon
Agree !
I wonder what is the native language of ATC and pilot ?
@@charlottethien3749 From the accent I can say it's Swiss-Germam
So great to hear polite conversation between professionals. The general public could use this video as a training venue!
Always a pleasure to listen to the Swiss: great accent but also extremely professional aviators. Love flying with Swiss and looking forward to be onboard of one of their aircraft soon again.
I love the Sound of Swiss - the intonation/melody can be heard even in English. I had a delay two years ago in Zurich and I have not experienced a friendlier and more supportive staff in Europe. Always happy to fly with them. Such huge difference to Germans/Lufthansa.
German Lufthansa owns Swiss of course, but you probably knew that already. Just saying it for the benefit of others. :)
Thanks, happy to hear that :) Cheers from Switzerland
Side information on this - as I was directly impacted by this issue:
- The flight back from Johannesburg to Zurich was delayed by 7h due to this and could only take off at ~02:30 in the morning
- A passenger unfortunately passed away on the return flight (reasons unknown but it caused certainly some hectic on the plane!)
- Despite those 7h delay, the waiting time and all the troubles, Swiss refused to pay a single cent of compensation to any of the passengers with the argument "for flights from third countries to CH, Swiss is not required to accept any restrictions and passenger laws [that would otherwise apply e.g. for a flight with a EU destination]"
Swiss are 100% in the right here. The delay was not covered by EU261. Additionally the ‘troubles’ caused by someone passing away does not require any money to be given to passengers, it’s a little weird that you’re trying to capitalise on someone’s death.
@@BenBen-vk7vq The delay was because of the flap issue, not the death if I’m correct. This seems not related to the death? I think you got the flights mixed up Ben Ben.
@@BenBen-vk7vq The delay was not caused by the death (if anything, it might have been the other way around but this would be pure speculation). It was just an additional thing worth mentioning on the flight.
The cause for the delay was this flaps-incident shown in the video which lead to a cascading delay in the return leg (it was the same aircraft).
Isn’t this anyway force majeure (besides the passenger rights from third countries)? Anyway, 7 hour delay still is really annoying..!
Just by chance, I was tuned in to ZRH ATC live when this happened (I listen to ATC maybe once or twice a month).
While dumping fuel they flew basically straight over my house.
Very cool to see this here now. 😀
But because they were high enough the fuel vaporizes and does not affect ground environment, is that how it works?
@@robertmog4336 yes it basically evaporates before it hits the ground.
@@ryanrussell8262 Thank you for your knowledge!
Most of the fuel that is dumped turns into vapor within a few minutes. If jettisoned above 5000 feet in above freezing temperature calculations show that 98% will evaporate before reaching the ground. The fuel vapors rapidly dissipate and diffuse. This could contribute to photochemical oxidant pollution, smog.
Exactly, the fuel evaporates. I was actually curious, so I had the window open for quite a while but couldn't even smell anything at all.
I live in Switzerland and heard about this. Didn’t think you’d make a video about it but gladly I was wrong.
Zurich control is about 10x more understandable than US control. It’s crystal clear!
Vass covers everthing Avi
Same i saw it in my local newspaper though
That holding pattern is impressive.
GRUEZI FELLOW VASAVIATION FANS :)
1:40 look how accurately the holding pattern is kept every loop!
Well done by crew and ATC!
There was a Cessna with a no-nose gear landing combined with radio/electrical issues at KEAU (Eau Claire, WI) with the first call coming in around 00z Saturday (Friday evening 7pm US central time). Interestingly, the tower asked the pilot several times if he could land either well before or well after the intersecting main runway to try and keep that open.
288 “we need an area to dump fuel please.”
LSZH “ok fine, let me get you vectors for Los Angeles.”
What? Too soon??
If they were forced to fly into Los Angeles airspace they would most likely run out of fuel before having any to dump, and indeed it is incredibly unsafe to fly such long distances with defective flight surfaces. Clearly a fuel dump site much closer to the airport of origin was the logical decision here.
MarlonBitoy whoosh
@@jesselloyd207 I’m sorry do you see the lives of over 300 individuals as a joke? The hell is wrong with you?
I believe that is Oaken from the Frozen movies running ZRH ATC.
This Swiss accent and the talk about dumping fuel always reminds me of Swissair 111
At 10:30 with another hour or so to land and exit, there's not going to be an alternative flight for quite some time. Even getting to a hotel before midnight might be unlikely.
The tower looked friendly!
@Kevin When you're upstairs and your aircraft isn't working correctly, nothing looks more friendly than a tower! :-)
glad to see someone is still flying the 4 engines.
And it's the 300 with the hair dryers as engines
Retiring in 2021 according to Wikipedia and Swiss
Lufthansa also has some A343 still operating on the regular
ZÜRICH ATC (sorry for you international guys it is ZURICH of course) has a much better audio quality than any other ATC featured here. SO, is the microphone better or does the controller speak out more clearly?
It's probably a mix of different reasons. The controller was only handling one aircraft so they could speak a lot slower. It also depends on where the person is recording from (ie. their distance to the airport and aircraft) and the quality of their equipment.
Neither, all of the ATC here is recorded by amateurs, it all depends on their location and equipment, atmospheric conditions, etc.. The quality you can listen to here is never the same as the actual transmissions ATC and pilots receive, their equipment is much better.
Tower is probably thinking after hearing the issue. "Well that aint good lets get them home."
Ooh, he got a follow me car, what a luxury
Perhaps a bit less so these days, but I feel like with the reduction in flights due to COVID-19, there are/were a lot of bored people at airports, so I get the sense that there's a lot of, "Might as well bring out all the equipment and people for this minor issue. They need the practice and are tired of running drills," attitudes at some airports.
EDDG (which normally only has like max 5 flights a day and where it's basically impossible to take a wrong turn) uses a follow me for everything - I'm talking about small GA planes too....
Ground must be really bored there
Hola desde Malaga, con lluvias!
This actually happened to me, this difference being flap failure on approach. Luckily I only had a C206 with five passengers on board. I am a PPL pilot, and had training with practice before obtaining licence. The passengers didn’t notice,, except one who aske why we seemed to.be landing at a higher speed, Obviously I did and a shallower angle of descent. The landing was fast but I surprised myself with a very smooth touchdown. I deliberately tried a few flawless landing in C 172 on my own - same result,
Great videos as always VASA and thank you. Just absolutely yuck for weather by ORD today, eww.
Did they eat some schoki?
😂
Allways when there is an issue ! It is the company policy 😂
May be Toblerone is part of the emergency box below the ATC desk?
I don´t know...:-) - but you´re right - I remember that video with the schoki very well! :-)
Ahhh, don't do that. It's called Schoggi. Everytime you spell it incorrectly, a cow shepherd somewhere on a Swiss alp raises his shaking fist in anger and blasphemes against heaven.
I sent you details on a event that just happened at OKC
GRÜEZI Fellow Vas fans!
This sounds like the conversation between my brain and my bowels every morning.
😂😂😂😂
Excellent clear concise instructions makes for a wonderful uneventful landing.
BRAVO!
Planes be having an awful lot of flap problems lately. Are their arms just getting too tired?(a bit of dopey humour, there)
lol the flaps are taking a vacation for a bit. Flaps/slats have a lot of complex mechanisms and sensors. If a problem is detected they're designed to remain extended as a failsafe for landing.
@@krozareq except when they don't. They do more than even my dad could explain. He's retired Navy aviation. He spent his life keeping Intruders, People Eaters and Tomcats airborne. I still love listening to his stories. Must remember to record them and get them written down. Time has a bad habit of getting away from one. He's the reason I'm fearless about flying.
ty
Must have been a lonely night shift, so much superfluous verbiage, guess he did not want to fall asleep at the console. Ground taxiing instructions issued while the flight is still airborne. Never heard or seen anyone controller do this, must be a Swiss thing.
it happens by night quite frequently . I had it several times in Nice Airport for 2 AM arrivals
english and miles...this delights me
Nautical miles, nota bene.
@@reynirheidbergstefansson2343 immer noch fröhlich...still not raining on this parade :) . we'll get you on bald eagle wingspans per kilometric next
I don't know why ATC wasn't interested in flaps problem details.
3:21 i love that accent haha
Imagine if cars just randomly dumped fuel while driving around.
Btw, use a watermark to prevent piracy
They sound like Dr Strangelove
5:14
Can someone please explain, what does this mean 👇?
ATC: "I plan you for about 12 to 13 miles final".
Pilot: "10 miles is ok for us".
Zurich is a very noise sensitive area. People complain about the noise a lot. To help with the situation, controllers give the information to aircraft on how much distance the inbound airplane has to the touchdown. With that information, the pilot is able to plan a descent with idle power on the engines, basically gliding down. Much quieter.
So for 12miles, the aircraft should be roughly 4000ft above the threshold altitude.
@@hbpilot70 while that is true, that is more the case for the "35 miles to touchdown" call at 5:33 - that call is indeed to give the pilots an idea of how steep they have to keep their descent if they want it to be the optimal idle descent. The call they recieved about how many miles on final is more for them to know how much time and distance they have to stabilise themselfs on the final approach segment. When you have only 6 or 8 miles for that you need to be quick to be stabilised and configured for landing, in the event of any malfunctions you'd wish for some more distance, thats why the controller offered them 12-12miles.
0:12 swiss 288
Scarebus.
This was the biggest air disaster the controller has seen since Johann Mueller's cows blocked the road to the airport back in '09.
Thankfully I don't take 40 minutes to do my dumping🚽🧻
Who still flies a 340?
I don't see your problem, if the airplane is maintained and works well why would you replace it? Replacing a functioning airplane before its end of service is just a waste.
17 airlines as of February according to Wikipedia. Lufthansa, Mahan and Swiss are the main ones.
I love the plane :) so much memories from my childhood. It's my favorite plane beside the A380.
'i just remember bashkirian-2937 by this one'
Swiss needs to retire the A340 already
Hi
Just listen to how much more professional the pilots and ATC are in their 2nd language compared.to the shit show for US vids. Am waiting for far more incidents in the US due to diversity box checking hiring in the coming years. In aviation, Get Woke, People Die.
what a waste of petrol
A necessary waste, but a waste none the less.
Jet fuel is more like diesel. Even if many pilots complain that the A343 has the power of 4 hair driers, it's still no piston engine :-)
Does the dumped fuel have an impact on the environment?
Edit: Found the perfect answer for my Question (If anyone is interested and understands German): www.flughafen-zuerich.ch/~/media/flughafenzh/dokumente/das_unternehmen/laerm_politik_und_umwelt/luft/2012_treibstoffschnellablass_de.pdf
Yes..so it is safe to dump over the fuel until it doesn't affect the Marine lives.
@@Barani_SpotsPlanez It probably doesn't affect marine life seeing as switzerland is landlocked and has no ocean access anywhere 😂
Super Quelle! Interessant zum läse.
It's okay, they tow it out of the environment.
Then the front fell off.
@@EvanBear yeah