I think the reason Buffy's so comfortable with Spike is because there aren't any expectations he's putting on her. He accepts her, the good and the bad, and just takes what he can get. Whereas around everyone else there's an expectation that she be 'Buffy' when she increasingly doesn't feel like her old self anymore. That kind of performace is exhausting, and I think it's very much an allegory for depression. I think it was very telling when in an earlier episode she said that she can still 'be alone with him there'.
The writers could have worked with this better, with more emphasis on what they have in common and why she feels comfortable around him and so they communicate a lot now. They hinted at it a little at the very beginning and that's all. Then it was just for a three-letter word, it's very superficial. They've toned down the reasons why it started. And see how people are not sure why it happened. You need to repeat things to people several times, otherwise they just won't remember it and their imagination will do the job.
@@JuneJaneb4 I disagree, I think even before she died she relied on and trusted him in a way that the others didn't, so it made the progression this season of him being the one she goes to make sense. Plus it was very clearly laid out for the viewers that they'd both died, had to claw their way out of the coffins etc, that he now understood her in a way that the others didn't.
@ There is no talk about what others think of him. The point is that give reasons what they have in common and why, more clearly. And I have to repeat it. They hinted at it a little at the beginning. And you give an example of such. But "they both died and there were coffins" is not all and you wrote in your first comment what's also there. And THAT'S what I'm talking about. After what you mentioned she was just around him for 7 minutes scenes where they didn't really touch the topic of similarities and why she's comfortable around him. And later it all came down to three-letters. Toning down the reasons why it started. And we see that when people watch it they might struggle to give real reasons. When you watch it 10 times with reactors, you might see things better.
@@JuneJaneb4No, you're wrong. That's just a bad take. It's very, very well written and was set up slowly and meticulously all throughout the previous season.
Buffy doesn't care what Spike thinks about her the way she cares about what her friends think... so she doesn't feel guilty feeling like crap around him, like she does with them. Plus relating to each other through resurrection.
To answer your spike question. He’s the only one she doesn’t have to pretend around. She has to pretend like she is fine and not struggling around her friends because they “ saved” her from hell so she has to pretend to be happy. spike knows so no pretending or worrying about hurting feelings
I think Buffy sees Spike different now, because they have something in common - they died. He is the only one that can really understand how it is to come back after death.
That and the Council have showed that they really don't care very much for the Slayers and view them as expendable. They're not as much of a force for good as they like to think of themselves as.
That, and if the Watcher's council cared, technically Faith is the 'active slayer. Far more likely they'd use their influence to spring her, and hold that over her head; than deal with Buffy, who from their point of view is notorious ly uncooperative.
I always assumed that's why they give the Slayer the test at 18 when they lose their powers and get locked in the house with the vampire. They'd prefer she dies imo.
Could also be about control. If you have no money and the council provides somewhere for you to live, your food, and your daily needs then you have to rely on them. From Kendra's case it seems that her watcher pretty much took care of her from when she was a child.
1:56 Slayers rarely even make it past 18, as we learned in Helpless. And the real answer as to why the Council doesn’t pay the slayer is pretty simple, albeit the answer is one I know most don’t/won’t like: within the meta of the show, being the slayer is a metaphor for being an adult, and you don’t just magically get paid for being an adult- you have to get a job- ergo the slayer doesn’t receive a salary for slaying.
I have known the meta of the show for a long while and I never made that connection- I just assumed it was because the Council saw the slayers as disposable and expected them to die young- Buffy was just an anomaly in that scenario. But I like your explanation much better; it makes perfect sense.
I wonder if Buffy's choice to oppose the Council (or graduate, as she called it in season three) would have been different, had the Council been paying her.
The Council was also never seen as an organization that helped the Slayer. All they did was control. After all, after Checkpoint, literally the only or almost the only information Buffy gets after the Council visit is that Glory is a goddess. The real useful information comes from Spike and Xander.
@ThePowerDrome I noticed that you said 'almost' the only information th Council gave Buffy. Because I remember other information that Giles revealed in the following episode (which is why I assume you said 'almost').
Spike: 1) Doesn't judge her. At all. She feels that. He may have is own agenda, but he doesn't judge. He's understanding and listening (most of the time) and just… there. 2) He also knows her secret, so she doesn't have to pretend not to have depression around him. Oops, I meant "pretend not to have been thrown out of heaven". She can just be miserable around him, relax, let her guard down a bit and know he won't judge her, won't look at her disappointedly, won't feel bad. She knows the rest of the scoobies would make it all about them if they knew. Spike doesn't, he's just there.
Nailed it! There are a bunch of reasons why Buffy might feel more comfortable around Spike than anyone else at this point, but this is the main one. The show loves to take everyday situations and mix in some supernatural twists to explore the situation from a different angle... and while they haven't beaten the audience over the head with it, it seems pretty easy to draw comparisons between Buffy's current status (withdrawn, without direction or purpose, overwhelmed, a parent's death still fresh in mind, and not big with the whole spectrum of human emotions) and depression.
A lot of people get lost in the money stuff, & the short story is it's not the story they wanted to tell. I just look at it as Willow & Tara putting in their students loan money for housing, & Buffy needing a job since she doesn't go back to school.
At this point spike is an outsider to the gang and doesn't really get along with them so I think Buffy can stand him is because she can share her true depressed feelings with any risk of it getting to the others and making them worrys kinda like how it's sometimes easier talking to a stranger about your problems then your friends and family
She also doesn't really care what Spike thinks about her. She has to be "Buffy" with the gang, but not with him. And that takes some pressure off of her so she can act the way she feels, say what she thinks.
And what does Spike do when Buffy is in his crypt and she's drunk? Takes her to play kitten poker, of course, what else do you think it is 😄 So Buffy needs a job. In parallel universe Spike won all those fluffies and opened a cafe when you can buy coffee and pet these kitties. And she will be in charge and play with them when no one is there.
@beccarosewriter She was given money, but it didn't seem like she was homeless. Edit: I think "in their care" is too strong a word. Probably, "In their possession/control" would ve more accurate.
“How do you expect them to live?” They don’t. Slayers aren’t people to the Council, they’re not even weapons; they’re ammunition. They prefer their slayers to be compliant for a short amount of time and then die before they can develop too much personal power.
I also believe this is why they do the Cruciamentum. It's not about teaching them to use their brains as well as their brawn, it's about trying to get a new slayer.
There's zero evidence in the show that Willow and Tara were paying nothing towards the upkeep of the house, so I've never understood people getting angry at them over something they probably didn't do. All we _do_ know is that whatever they were paying, it wasn't enough. Personally, I assume that whatever they were paying towards their college accommodation in Season 5, they're now paying for 1630 Revello Drive, and for Dawn's upkeep (which, remember, they're under no legal or even moral obligation to contribute. They're doing it out of pure goodwill).
As for the Spike question: I think he's the only person Buffy doesn't have to lie to. He knows she was in heaven, not hell, so she doesn't have to put on a facade of being grateful and happy. Buffy is suffering from depression right now, and the energy needed just to smile and be happy (or show any kind of strong emotion, really, as Willow noticed) is a constant drain on her. Spike is comforting, because she doesn't have to do that with him. She sees him as undemanding. She doesn't have to use up any of her spoons on him. I also think that deep down, she doesn't _really_ think of Spike as a person. Not fully. He isn't human, he doesn't have a soul, and so he doesn't really count in her eyes the way her friends do. Remember her remark from a couple of episodes back: "I can be alone with you here".
The way I see it, three adults live in a house. One of them is expected to get a job, even though she already has one. The other two can just keep on studying. I see absolutely no fairness in that.
@@TheRealGSmith Would you prefer Willow and Tara to stop contributing to the rent and move back into their dorm room, so Buffy has to arrange childcare for Dawn as well as working? Because like I said, they have no legal or moral obligation to help Buffy out _at all_ -- they do it out of the goodness of their hearts, nothing more. Criticising the Watchers' Council for not helping Buffy is entirely fair. You can also criticise Giles, if we assume that his salary from the Council is meant to cover his Slayer's living expenses as well. (Though I suspect they don't pay their Watchers enough to support an adult Slayer with a mortgage, since Slayers are expected to be dead by the age of 18.)
@@TheRealGSmith She's 15, and is still a minor. Dawn needs clothes, she needs to eat. She needs a caregiver. I assume W & T contribute to the rent because (a) they no longer need to pay for a dorm room so they have _some_ money to spare, (b) they're decent people, and (c) nobody - not Buffy herself, not Dawn, not Giles, and not even Anya (who would definitely speak out, if there was a money-related issue that needed mentioning) ever says or implies in any way that they're not contributing to the best of their ability. So why would you assume they're not contributing?
Spike is easy for her to be around because he doesn't rely on her to save him like the others do. She has to be 'the hero' with everyone else but he doesn't see her in that light. He's super strong too so she can be kind of a mess and know he's still able to protect himself and maybe her too if something attacks.
After rewatching this show so many times, I never thought that Buffy should get paid for saving lives. She definitely deserves a pay check just like police, doctors, and firefighters do. Tara and Willow should be helping with the money since they are still living there and it is so sad that Buffy’s biological father does not seem to care bout his daughter’s well being at all.
Scully is Dana Scully, Fox Mulder's partner on the X-Files, assigned to track his activity. She is basically assigned as the scientific foil to his paranormal perspective on cases. And she is also an attractive red head which is why Andrew said that about her. If you ever watch the X-Files, it's another of my favorites. But I wouldn't recommend going past season 7. It gets really bad after that. And you would have to keep in mind that it's even older than Buffy.
My favourite line ever: Yes, and then I'm going to marry Bob Dole and raise penguins in Guam 🐧 re. Spike, at this point he's the only one who is not asking or expecting anything of her.
I remember college circa 1978-82. Fortunately, one of the first things I noted in the only "auditorium" class I ever took at a very small liberal arts college was a professor telling the 200-ish folks in "Intro to Sociology" was him saying "I can tell who will make the best grades in this and every course by who sits at the front and who interacts the most." I took it to heart, and damned if it didn't work! So I wound up with one degree with two seemingly contradictory majors. Economics and Sociology. And still graduated in 4 years! (But my wife, who I married in my final semester, outdid me. Summa Cum Laude in 3 1/2 years AFTER transferring to Trinity with a year at University of Colorado, Bolder! She remains my wife, and also remains WAY smarter than me! Well, she puts up with me, so perhaps she's not that smart! 🙂) Anyway, the whole student interaction involving Willow and the "audit" with the professor, students spouting sophomoric pablum, reminds me of those halcyon days.
re: when it comes to the gang and Dawn ,Buffy feels like she has to uphold a certain image and take on a lot of responsibilities.But when she's around Spike, she doesn't have to be the best version of herself, she can act however she feels like. It's liberating and + he's the only one who knows what she's been through
I've always viewed her willingness to be around Spike to be for a few reasons. First, she doesn't care how he perceives her. If her actions or words upset him and he told her to leave she wouldn't be loosing a friend, Spike has tried to kill her, not judge her. Second, they do have a connection of experiences that she doesn't share with anyone else. Third, Buffy may not like to admit it but she does seem drawn to the dark as people have told her in the past. Rylie was truly a distraction for her, in my opinion, I didn't see their time together as her being in love which makes their departure and her running after him feel off. (Again, my observation) Buffy is complex, a breakdown in dualities. A soldier for the light that is drawn to the dark. As for why she doesn't get paid for being a slayer if you look back at her trials where the Watchers put her with a vampire in a weakened state she shouldn't have lived this long. Spike even said so, the only reason she has lasted this long is her connections to the world. Spike may be some negative things but he is observant and perceptive, more than most characters in this show. Now she finds herself detaching from those connections.
...but Buffy quit the Council back in Season 3. That doesn't explain why Tara and Willow are apparently freeloading and left her financially underwater upon her resurrection, though. The real answer is that the writers wanted Buffy to have to deal with money trouble and hoped the audience wouldn't think too much about obvious solutions or questions surrounding that.
@jspettifer True, but in this case, the show.doesn't seem to really understand that they're being that way (at least not about finances/living arrangements)
@@dostatochno, it looks like you completely missed the episode in Season Five while Buffy was facing off against Glory, and the Watcher's Council came to Sunnydale.
@@dostatochno, remember Kendra talking about being taken in and raised by her Watcher in Season Two? Other than Buffy, who is living with her mother, we are given no indication of other Slayers who are not under the care of their Watchers.
I found your channel a few months ago and watched all your Buffy reactions and album reactions! I loveeeee your content so much, can’t wait to watch your season 6 reactions! ❤
Buffy's depression clashes with the trio messing with her and it makes Buffy feel even worse, to the point of drinking while spending time with Spike. The two "magic bone" jokes never fail to get me going.
Fun and solid reaction to an episode that can and does cause diverse interpretations. You asked about Spike and Buffy. When we watched we felt that there were a couple of reasons for Buffy feeling comfortable with Spike. Buffy has suffered severe trauma by being taken from bliss, peace, and love. The reason for her emotional suffering were her friends Willow and Xander. ( she is friendly with Tara and Anya but not the deep relationship with Willow and Xander) She can not be honest with her two closest friends without telling the full story. She can’t open up with Giles or Dawn without causing them pain because that would have them question their love of Buffy returning. The other reason we felt there was something between Spike and Buffy was the nature of Buffy and what Spike telling Buffy she is a creature of the night. 3 powerful and legendary vampires , Angelus, Dracula, and Spike, have all become obsessed with Buffy. Buffy has shown she has a dark power within and is willing to explore herself. We felt that coming back from death has made Buffy totally oblivious to the normal life, classic depression, and only her unfulfilled inner power/ dark feeling is giving her any feelings. The only joy or emotions is when she is fighting. The adrenaline from the action is at least something and Spike can at least relate to the dark power. Buffy can at least feel some bond and with Spike comes some form of danger. Lastly, remember that Giles came into a windfall because of Buffy’s actions with the vile Watchers Council in Season 5, Checkpoint. Giles not only was rehired he was also given 2 years of full back salary..
Re: spike I do think it’s basically what you said. He’s the only one that she is allowed be around and not be okay. He doesn’t need her to fake being okay for his sake so she can just relax and be herself.
An episode about Buffy trying to find her place in the world. As often in 'Buffy', the supernatural elements are metaphors. Buffy feels slow at college, like she can't keep up, so this becomes literal. The construction site section is about the difficulties with sexism women can have in the workplace. The time loop scenario in the magic shop is a metaphor for how repetitive retail jobs can feel etc.
Same. I think at this point in the show, the reason Buffy could stand to be around Spike was because he knows her secret, that she was in heaven, and he wasn't a part of trying to bring her back to life (even though he's thrilled she's back). He doesn't put any expectations on her from her POV. She needs to take care of Dawn. She needs to show gratitude to Willow, Tara, and Xander for bringing her back. She needs to show Giles she can handle being the slayer again. But she doesn't have to pretend anything for Spike. She can just be. Loved your reaction, and I agree! :)
To answer your question about the Watchers council and how do they expect her to live without an income: they don’t. It’s that simple. “The Council fights evil. The Slayer is the instrument with which we fight. The Council remains. The Slayers... change. It's been that way from the beginning.” -Checkpoint
I think at least in the back of her mind, Buffy feels Spike is somewhat morally inferior to her. So she doesn't feel that pressure to be "good" around Spike because she can still feel "better" or "above" him morally. I believe he's a safe outlet for her right now as she starts grappling with some nasty darker feelings that she feels her friends/family aren't prepared to handle without judgement. Plus I think it's been made clear to Buffy (through being brought back by her friends) that they really *need* her. She feels needed by everyone around her in a way. And Spike may want Buffy, but he doesn't need her in those same ways.
The Watchers council usually doesn't pay the Slayer because they pay the watcher who takes care of the Slayer, rather than the Slayer staying with her family like Buffy does. In hindsight it's kinda interesting that they never discussed, never even seemed to consider Buffy leaving her mother to be the Slayer like all the other Slayers. It's something that seems odd to try to do with modern Slayers, in areas unlike wherever Kendra was from that took it as an honor. But it was done with other Slayers odd as it may seem. But anyway, it makes sense to pay the Slayer instead of the Watcher or also, when she does need to take care of herself. It really shouldn't be seen as such a favor or sacrifice for Giles to give Buffy money as he's paid for HER being the Slayer and she isn't, And she even got him retroactive pay for when he wasn't actively working with the council. But storywise, they couldn't go for the "Real life is hard/hell" storyline if they did that.
A lot of fans are turned off over freeloading Willow and Tara but I try to cut it some slack, it seems to me that the writers landed on “Buffy struggles with money; depression increases” and reverse engineered it from there. Buffy should have been set with Joyce’s life insurance regardless of the medical costs
I remember her saying, in episode 3 I think it was, that she could "be alone" with him there. I don't know exactly what she meant by that, but I get the feeling it is a key to understanding her side of their relationship.
As we’ve seen, the look on her face in Ep 3. Buffy felt absolutely betrayed to learn that her best friend was responsible for her being pulled out of heaven. She also is being seen as the one who is still responsible for everything in her life (the bills, dawn, being the slayer) and the only one who lets her relax and not be “fine” or responsible is Spike. Hence, the fact that she feels like she can only be around him.
This episode is so depressing but alsp so funny. The magic box moment is just comedy gold. And as someone who went through several different awful jobs I can relate so much
She has a Slayer body, which makes her more resistant to the poisons produced by alcohol in her liver. Of course, she has to drink more than a normal person to get drunk. And she overdid it a bit. But even under these conditions, she can stand on her feet quite well.
I read a theory somewhere that after Checkpoint, the Board of Supervisors gave Buffy some money. It may not have been a lot, but it was there, which allowed Buffy to have no particular money problems. However, that doesn't mean they could afford expensive purchases, like renting a serious motorhome. It's also possible that they specifically took one, because it was, after all, just a consumable.
There's nothing in the canon to support that theory, however. They agreed to pay Giles, not Buffy. But I wouldn't get too caught up in wondering about it. The show never made much attempt to explain how Faith could afford that hotel, or how Anya could afford her apartment prior to working at The Magic Box, or how Buffy was paying for anything after her mom died until now, when they needed it for drama. 😂😂
You're right. Using your super strength to work on a building site is a waste of talent. It's like Gordon Ramsey, flipping burgers in a fast food outlet.
I would say your opinions on Buffy and Spike are on track.. There's no expectations with Spike and no need to inpress him, so she feels free to be however she is, with him. Where's that not the case with her friends.
Had it not been for some of the creeps at the construction site, and the needs with their demons, Buffy would have been a real asset to the crew. They were behind schedule, and Buffy was helping them catch up. The foreman was pleased, but one of the workers wanted her to slow down.
Buffy seasons 6 & 7 were on a different network than Angel, which made crossovers difficult and less frequent. They also couldn't coordinate air dates, so continuity between the series was problematic.
The thing with Willow and Tara living in the house and not paying the bills isn't really ever mentioned on the show, but it's clearly implied by the lack of any indication that either of them has a job. I mean; they were basically acting as adult guardians to Dawn in exchange for room and board, which ain't nothing, but it's not like they'd be homeless because Willow clearly would be getting some level of support from her parents. I don't know about Tara - how does she support herself? Doesn't seem like her family is involved since the last time we saw them. Also as for the Council... why do they pay the Watchers but not the Slayers?
As a Spike fan, I hate to say that I think Buffy feels comfortable with Spike because she doesn't actually care about his feelings. Her family and friends love her, but she does worry about their feelings. Additionally, Buffy is Spike's #1. At the moment, he's shown that she's all he cares about, for better or worse. Her friends are in relationships, Dawn is too young to burden with stuff, and Giles just got back but she doesn't want to disappoint him. With Spike, Buffy can actually be herself without think he's judging her or that she's hurting him in some way.
She rejected Giles herself. She didn't tell him the truth, she stood up when he reached for her. She deliberately didn't open up to him and rejected him. Her words at the end of the episode are empty, she closed herself off from him.
I think the council just sees the slayers as commodities instead of real people. Also, as mentioned here during season 3, the older the slayer, the harder it is for the council to control them, so they expect them to die young (with a little help of 18th birthday psycho test). At the end of the day, paying them is a waste of time and money.
With the high rate of turnover, each Slayer supposedly lasting no more than a few years, perhaps the Council thought it too much trouble to constantly change where the money would go.
Regarding Tara when Buffy is not moving cause of the time thing it does seem weird that she just leaves her there but maybe she thinks is one of the after-coming-back-to-life-weirdnesses 🤷♀️ I always wondered
The council most likely doesn't pay the slayer for a few reasons: 1. Most slayers dies, very young age. 2. control, its was most likely set up in a way that if the slayer actually gets past their initiation rights that in the long history of humans that the slayers watcher's money was set up to finance the slayer. Giles was fired by the watchers council and with Buffy's refusal to work with them any more they probably only kept an eye on her to make sure she didn't turn evil. Honestly im surprised they didn't assassinate her and faith once this happened so that a new chosen one (or 2) could happen. Willow and Tera were most likely paying for food for dawn, but its honestly one of the parts of the show that make the least sense. If Willow had failed in reviving Buffy would they have had to sell the house? At some point the logic does break down a little, but its most likely that this seasons set up was more built for the metaphor and less on the logistics of real life.
I always interpreted the trio as a representation of everyday pervasive misogyny, just the general sexism women have to deal with on a regular basis. With the hopelessness and depression and shame she's already feeling these boys who have less power than her at the end lf the day can manage to bring her down and make her feel like she isn't enough.
Angel and Buffy are now running on different networks. CW & UPN. So crossovers of any kind are hard to do. They still find their ways but just a heads up.
Firstly, we don't know that Willow and Tara weren't contributing at all. I like to think they kept the lights and water on and food in the fridge but they simply couldn't keep up with the mortgage and everything. Secondly I think traditionally the Slayers lived with their Watchers like Kendra lived with hers so they pay the Watchers well enough to keep them comfy. We don't know what happened that had it so Buffy stayed with her parents instead of going to live with a Watcher.
The reason why the Council and Giles make money and Buffy doesn’t is easy: The patriarchy in full effect. Buffy can be around Spike because he knows the truth about her and she can be herself around him and he doesn’t expect anything other than companionship with her.
Without doubt The Trio are so irritating at this point, especially Andrew. I get exactly what people saying about them at this point, as they are not lending to the seriousness of the storylines. As if Buffy didn't have enough to cope with, now we have these goons messing with her life. Spike bringing Buffy to the poker game for kittens brings some light relief, and of course the X-Files referenced again with the Craddock Marine Bank ( yes the same fictitious bank in Breaking/Bad Better Call Saul) that kept blowing up. I thought it was a pretty average episode overall, and yes Cass you will love the X-Files if you do it.
At my university, you could attend classes (without paying for the course), but you weren't tested and you received no final grade. You just showed up to soak in some knowledge but received no credit for taking the course. It wouldn't show up on your transcript. I always thought Buffy should have started earning some money until the next enrollment period came around.
Fans like to throw out the accusation that Willow and Tara are living at Buffy's rent-free, but that's never actually discussed in the show. I always assumed they were chipping in, we just never heard about it.
Spike is easy. He just wants to be around her no matter what she is, she can be mean, vulnerable, good, bad, it doesn't matter to Spike as long as she is honest about it. Everyone else has expectations, or she feels that they are responsible for removing her from heaven, and she feels like she can't be how she feels around them at this point. As she said when she told Spike, they can never know.
Why does Buffy feel like Spike is the only person she can bear being around? I'm sure there are many aspects to it. The darkness connecting them. The fact that he doesn't judge her as much as others do. The fact that he's not really part of the friend group and sometimes it's so much easier to talk to someone on the outside. She doesn't care as much about his opinion. She can tell herself that he's not a real person. I'm sure there are other aspects as well. Personally, I think that Buffy is severely depressed and it's hard to think clearly in that state. You have to do whatever gives you a tiny bit of joy or relief to survive. Spike isn't involved in her human life with all the bills and companies. Lying to him about how she feels would be pointless because he'd just know it's a lie. He's way too perceptive for that. So it's easy to let down her guard. And he IS treating her with whatever compassion a soulless being can muster, without ever belittling her. She knows he sees her as strong and worthy of love, no matter what. That must feel good, when everything else is falling apart. Long answer, but you asked ;)
Anya, Xander and to a lesser extent Giles (before the end) kinda annoy me in this ep. So maybe Xander couldn't possibly have talked the crew into keeping Buffy around since he isn't like, the entire site manager and the other guy seems to be, feels like he could have given it a bit more of a go. Or like, get her a job at some other site. Then Anya seemingly doesn't train Buffy or give her all the info on her first day at the shop and then when she makes a small mistake that isn't her fault, she's like "oh well we'll just take it out of your wages" when she knows Buffy super needs the money and a job. Giles just kinda lets it all happen as well, it's supposed to be a comedy episode and obviously the point is Buffy isn't going to be happy doing any of these things but it felt uncharacteristically harsh and out of character when usually the show manages to do comedy while still keeping the characters true to their selves. She's even the one who suggested Buffy charge for saving peoples lives so if Buffy were in as shitty a mood as she has a right to be, she could have said "Ok Anya, you take that money out of my pay and then you can pay me for the ohhhh five or six times I've saved the planet you're living on, does that seem fair?"
I doubt Buffy would take the money even if the Council offered to pay her. She is fiercely independent, and particularly doesn't want to be under the Council's thumb, or be beholden to them for anything. Only Giles could get away with handing her money, because he's Dad.
It annoys me that some fans say they did nothing. Buffybot helped with cooking & cleaning but there was so much more to taking care of a teenager that a robot couldn't do, plus in my head canon at least one of them had a minimum wage job at a coffee shop or Sunnydale bookstore or something. They never seemed like slackers. Willow even volunteered at the magic shop the previous year even though Anya rejected her help.
Buffy and Spike share the same issues. Both died both dug out their graves both are creatures of the night they relate. It's crazy how Buffy's best friends are the most selfish ppl on the show not Tara and Anya
Oh not this again. People just assume Tara and Willow were living there without chipping in, but this is never explicitly stated in the show. For all we know they did contribute the best they could, given they didn't have jobs either as college students. Also, they were taking care of Dawn for free
02:32 - 02:43 NO,IT'S NOT OKAY,ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?I WANNA KNOW!!!😫💢I'm here stuck with Spike 24/7 and *the one time* I could get a tiny scrap of Bangel interaction not only I don't get to see it but you're not even _narrate it_ to me?!?!😡💢WHY should I be okay with this?!😤💢💢💢 10:40 - 10:43 No joke,YESTERDAY a fire started in a basement of my building and now every time I see a very smokey scene I get a bit triggered. :-S The smoke's smell hasn't even gone away completely yet!
It's because she's really miserable and he knows why. She told him the truth, and she has to pretend around all the other people that matter to her. That's why, it has to do with that, for now.
As depressing as this start of the season was, starting next episode is when the season turns into another gear and we start to see the direction of this season. And after next episode is the reaction we all been waiting for.
You don't know who Scully is? Okay, you really **do** need to watch X-Files next, because Scully is just the best. And so is Mulder. Mulder and Scully are the best. As for Spike and Buffy, he really does understand her on a level that the others don't. Remember when he was teaching her about the other slayers he's encountered? He knows slayers even better than Giles does. That and knowing about her having been in Heaven instead of Hell means that he is the only one she **can** open up to right now. She can tell the others some things, like telling Giles how she misses her mother, but Spike has access to information that the others don't. And that's both a good **and** a bad thing, considering that he is still a vampire, a creature of darkness, willing to tempt her to give in to her own darkness. He doesn't have a soul, like Angel does, so even though he loves Buffy, it's a pretty selfish kind of love. We saw that when he had the Buffybot built. He's grown since then, helping the others and especially Dawn while Buffy was dead, but he's still who he is.
Who says Willow and Tara weren't paying rent? The show never says they aren't. But two college students renting a room can't afford to pay the full costs of keeping up a house. As for the Council, I'm sure they'd be delighted to pay Buffy. Her being their employee would come with a heaping dose of control, and it doesn't surprise me that Buffy doesn't even contemplate asking them.
Exactly who knows if Tara and Willow paid rent? Second I view the slayers not getting paid as a way to explain why they always pick a girl to be the slayer. They are basically slaves. Obviously Buffy didn't act that way but she was supposed to. As much as the concept sucks to me it makes it much more logical to always pick a girl storyline wise
@ But the Watchers Council does not choose the Slayer; if they did, then Buffy (who they failed to identify as a possible Slayer, and train for it from a young age) would never have been the one chosen. Joss Whedon's original script for the movie, on which the series is based rather than the theatrical version, mentions the Slayer is a girl because the essence of the feminine is to create/give life, the direct opposite of vampires who only take it.
Whoever said that Willow and Tara were not paying have no basis for those assertions. At no time in the show were the financial arrangements mentioned, period. I choose to believe that friends would not stiff a friend for the rent. I choose to believe that they were paying at least what they were paying for their previous accommodations. I think that people assume that because we never see them working that they had no income. Many scholarships and student loans pay for housing and other necessities. Also we don't know that they were not getting financial assistance from their parents. Pobably not Tara because of what we saw of her father, but probably Willows Mother would have helped her out financially. So please can we stop this nonsense of Willow and Tara not contributing to the family budget?
possibly they payed for groceries and power... But economics is big plot hole from now on. I'll come back to the topic and my observations on further episodes.
Oh man that Warren guy always leaves me seeing red. He comes across as particularly creepy and gross. I have never been that bothered by the Willow and Tara thing; Buffy being dead and then being brought back to life has always raised more questions for me. I wonder about Buffy's death and whether or not she was officially dead to the state. How officially dead was she? Did she have a death certificate? Did they bury her in a random spot but give her a super formal headstone?
I think the reason Buffy's so comfortable with Spike is because there aren't any expectations he's putting on her. He accepts her, the good and the bad, and just takes what he can get. Whereas around everyone else there's an expectation that she be 'Buffy' when she increasingly doesn't feel like her old self anymore. That kind of performace is exhausting, and I think it's very much an allegory for depression. I think it was very telling when in an earlier episode she said that she can still 'be alone with him there'.
The writers could have worked with this better, with more emphasis on what they have in common and why she feels comfortable around him and so they communicate a lot now. They hinted at it a little at the very beginning and that's all. Then it was just for a three-letter word, it's very superficial. They've toned down the reasons why it started. And see how people are not sure why it happened. You need to repeat things to people several times, otherwise they just won't remember it and their imagination will do the job.
@@JuneJaneb4 I disagree, I think even before she died she relied on and trusted him in a way that the others didn't, so it made the progression this season of him being the one she goes to make sense. Plus it was very clearly laid out for the viewers that they'd both died, had to claw their way out of the coffins etc, that he now understood her in a way that the others didn't.
@ There is no talk about what others think of him. The point is that give reasons what they have in common and why, more clearly. And I have to repeat it. They hinted at it a little at the beginning. And you give an example of such. But "they both died and there were coffins" is not all and you wrote in your first comment what's also there. And THAT'S what I'm talking about.
After what you mentioned she was just around him for 7 minutes scenes where they didn't really touch the topic of similarities and why she's comfortable around him. And later it all came down to three-letters. Toning down the reasons why it started. And we see that when people watch it they might struggle to give real reasons. When you watch it 10 times with reactors, you might see things better.
@@JuneJaneb4No, you're wrong. That's just a bad take. It's very, very well written and was set up slowly and meticulously all throughout the previous season.
Buffy doesn't care what Spike thinks about her the way she cares about what her friends think... so she doesn't feel guilty feeling like crap around him, like she does with them. Plus relating to each other through resurrection.
To answer your spike question. He’s the only one she doesn’t have to pretend around. She has to pretend like she is fine and not struggling around her friends because they “ saved” her from hell so she has to pretend to be happy. spike knows so no pretending or worrying about hurting feelings
I think Buffy sees Spike different now, because they have something in common - they died. He is the only one that can really understand how it is to come back after death.
Technically, she has died before. But yes. This time sure is different.
0:36 Reactors “I can’t wait to see that conversation!” Me: 😅
The short answer to the council and paying buffy goes... Slayers don't normally live long enough to reach working age.
That and the Council have showed that they really don't care very much for the Slayers and view them as expendable. They're not as much of a force for good as they like to think of themselves as.
That, and if the Watcher's council cared, technically Faith is the 'active slayer. Far more likely they'd use their influence to spring her, and hold that over her head; than deal with Buffy, who from their point of view is notorious ly uncooperative.
I always assumed that's why they give the Slayer the test at 18 when they lose their powers and get locked in the house with the vampire. They'd prefer she dies imo.
Could also be about control. If you have no money and the council provides somewhere for you to live, your food, and your daily needs then you have to rely on them. From Kendra's case it seems that her watcher pretty much took care of her from when she was a child.
When you're allowed to audit a college class, generally you attend classes without paying, but you also don't receive credits.
some classes do require an audit fee, usually its only if you want the professor to grade/look over your work.
1:56 Slayers rarely even make it past 18, as we learned in Helpless.
And the real answer as to why the Council doesn’t pay the slayer is pretty simple, albeit the answer is one I know most don’t/won’t like: within the meta of the show, being the slayer is a metaphor for being an adult, and you don’t just magically get paid for being an adult- you have to get a job- ergo the slayer doesn’t receive a salary for slaying.
I have known the meta of the show for a long while and I never made that connection- I just assumed it was because the Council saw the slayers as disposable and expected them to die young- Buffy was just an anomaly in that scenario. But I like your explanation much better; it makes perfect sense.
I wonder if Buffy's choice to oppose the Council (or graduate, as she called it in season three) would have been different, had the Council been paying her.
The Council was also never seen as an organization that helped the Slayer. All they did was control. After all, after Checkpoint, literally the only or almost the only information Buffy gets after the Council visit is that Glory is a goddess. The real useful information comes from Spike and Xander.
I always felt another reason the slayers aren’t paid is because most never make it to adulthood and don’t need to support themselves.
@ThePowerDrome I noticed that you said 'almost' the only information th Council gave Buffy. Because I remember other information that Giles revealed in the following episode (which is why I assume you said 'almost').
Spike:
1) Doesn't judge her. At all. She feels that. He may have is own agenda, but he doesn't judge. He's understanding and listening (most of the time) and just… there.
2) He also knows her secret, so she doesn't have to pretend not to have depression around him. Oops, I meant "pretend not to have been thrown out of heaven". She can just be miserable around him, relax, let her guard down a bit and know he won't judge her, won't look at her disappointedly, won't feel bad. She knows the rest of the scoobies would make it all about them if they knew. Spike doesn't, he's just there.
Nailed it! There are a bunch of reasons why Buffy might feel more comfortable around Spike than anyone else at this point, but this is the main one.
The show loves to take everyday situations and mix in some supernatural twists to explore the situation from a different angle... and while they haven't beaten the audience over the head with it, it seems pretty easy to draw comparisons between Buffy's current status (withdrawn, without direction or purpose, overwhelmed, a parent's death still fresh in mind, and not big with the whole spectrum of human emotions) and depression.
im so excited for this episode! season 6 is one of my fav seasons and ur my fav buffy reactor! looking forward to all ur season six reactions!!!!!!!!
And this is where we meet Clem. Who doesn't love Clem?
@@hendrikscheepers4144 EXACTLY
the council don’t expect slayers to live to 18 and when they do they put them through that awful test that can get them killed
the look of disappointment when brushing pass the angel convo
A lot of people get lost in the money stuff, & the short story is it's not the story they wanted to tell. I just look at it as Willow & Tara putting in their students loan money for housing, & Buffy needing a job since she doesn't go back to school.
At this point spike is an outsider to the gang and doesn't really get along with them so I think Buffy can stand him is because she can share her true depressed feelings with any risk of it getting to the others and making them worrys kinda like how it's sometimes easier talking to a stranger about your problems then your friends and family
She also doesn't really care what Spike thinks about her. She has to be "Buffy" with the gang, but not with him. And that takes some pressure off of her so she can act the way she feels, say what she thinks.
He was always an outsider. No one really got along with him, except maybe Anya, because she was a demon and understood him better than anyone else.
And what does Spike do when Buffy is in his crypt and she's drunk? Takes her to play kitten poker, of course, what else do you think it is 😄
So Buffy needs a job. In parallel universe Spike won all those fluffies and opened a cafe when you can buy coffee and pet these kitties. And she will be in charge and play with them when no one is there.
Based on Kendra, it's possible that they are normally in the council's care.
except Kendra wasn't given money. She had one shirt and had to sneak onto a plane.
@beccarosewriter She was given money, but it didn't seem like she was homeless.
Edit: I think "in their care" is too strong a word. Probably, "In their possession/control" would ve more accurate.
“How do you expect them to live?”
They don’t. Slayers aren’t people to the Council, they’re not even weapons; they’re ammunition. They prefer their slayers to be compliant for a short amount of time and then die before they can develop too much personal power.
I also believe this is why they do the Cruciamentum. It's not about teaching them to use their brains as well as their brawn, it's about trying to get a new slayer.
There's zero evidence in the show that Willow and Tara were paying nothing towards the upkeep of the house, so I've never understood people getting angry at them over something they probably didn't do. All we _do_ know is that whatever they were paying, it wasn't enough.
Personally, I assume that whatever they were paying towards their college accommodation in Season 5, they're now paying for 1630 Revello Drive, and for Dawn's upkeep (which, remember, they're under no legal or even moral obligation to contribute. They're doing it out of pure goodwill).
As for the Spike question: I think he's the only person Buffy doesn't have to lie to. He knows she was in heaven, not hell, so she doesn't have to put on a facade of being grateful and happy. Buffy is suffering from depression right now, and the energy needed just to smile and be happy (or show any kind of strong emotion, really, as Willow noticed) is a constant drain on her. Spike is comforting, because she doesn't have to do that with him. She sees him as undemanding. She doesn't have to use up any of her spoons on him.
I also think that deep down, she doesn't _really_ think of Spike as a person. Not fully. He isn't human, he doesn't have a soul, and so he doesn't really count in her eyes the way her friends do. Remember her remark from a couple of episodes back: "I can be alone with you here".
The way I see it, three adults live in a house. One of them is expected to get a job, even though she already has one. The other two can just keep on studying. I see absolutely no fairness in that.
@@TheRealGSmith Would you prefer Willow and Tara to stop contributing to the rent and move back into their dorm room, so Buffy has to arrange childcare for Dawn as well as working? Because like I said, they have no legal or moral obligation to help Buffy out _at all_ -- they do it out of the goodness of their hearts, nothing more.
Criticising the Watchers' Council for not helping Buffy is entirely fair. You can also criticise Giles, if we assume that his salary from the Council is meant to cover his Slayer's living expenses as well. (Though I suspect they don't pay their Watchers enough to support an adult Slayer with a mortgage, since Slayers are expected to be dead by the age of 18.)
@@stormwreath What? Dawn is like 16. She doesn't need child care. And why would you assume Willow and Tara are contributing to the rent??
@@TheRealGSmith She's 15, and is still a minor. Dawn needs clothes, she needs to eat. She needs a caregiver.
I assume W & T contribute to the rent because (a) they no longer need to pay for a dorm room so they have _some_ money to spare, (b) they're decent people, and (c) nobody - not Buffy herself, not Dawn, not Giles, and not even Anya (who would definitely speak out, if there was a money-related issue that needed mentioning) ever says or implies in any way that they're not contributing to the best of their ability.
So why would you assume they're not contributing?
The assumption that Tara and Willow are freeloading is a fandom theory. The show never addresses it.
It is confirmed though
@@randycrawford1132 When?
At least up to this point in the show, I have never seen Tara or Willow look for a job. And they live in Buffy's house.
@@TheRealGSmith They're full-time students. Buffy didn't work a job when she was a full-time student, either, and yet her rent was paid somehow.
and an annoying one at that
Spike is easy for her to be around because he doesn't rely on her to save him like the others do. She has to be 'the hero' with everyone else but he doesn't see her in that light. He's super strong too so she can be kind of a mess and know he's still able to protect himself and maybe her too if something attacks.
She's gotta be strong, and she's gotta be fast
And she's gotta be fresh from the fight
After rewatching this show so many times, I never thought that Buffy should get paid for saving lives. She definitely deserves a pay check just like police, doctors, and firefighters do. Tara and Willow should be helping with the money since they are still living there and it is so sad that Buffy’s biological father does not seem to care bout his daughter’s well being at all.
Scully is Dana Scully, Fox Mulder's partner on the X-Files, assigned to track his activity. She is basically assigned as the scientific foil to his paranormal perspective on cases. And she is also an attractive red head which is why Andrew said that about her. If you ever watch the X-Files, it's another of my favorites. But I wouldn't recommend going past season 7. It gets really bad after that. And you would have to keep in mind that it's even older than Buffy.
My favourite line ever: Yes, and then I'm going to marry Bob Dole and raise penguins in Guam 🐧 re. Spike, at this point he's the only one who is not asking or expecting anything of her.
You should totally watch X-Files, it's amazing. It's my 2nd favorite show of all time behind Buffy.
Same!
I remember college circa 1978-82. Fortunately, one of the first things I noted in the only "auditorium" class I ever took at a very small liberal arts college was a professor telling the 200-ish folks in "Intro to Sociology" was him saying "I can tell who will make the best grades in this and every course by who sits at the front and who interacts the most." I took it to heart, and damned if it didn't work! So I wound up with one degree with two seemingly contradictory majors. Economics and Sociology. And still graduated in 4 years! (But my wife, who I married in my final semester, outdid me. Summa Cum Laude in 3 1/2 years AFTER transferring to Trinity with a year at University of Colorado, Bolder! She remains my wife, and also remains WAY smarter than me! Well, she puts up with me, so perhaps she's not that smart! 🙂)
Anyway, the whole student interaction involving Willow and the "audit" with the professor, students spouting sophomoric pablum, reminds me of those halcyon days.
re: when it comes to the gang and Dawn ,Buffy feels like she has to uphold a certain image and take on a lot of responsibilities.But when she's around Spike, she doesn't have to be the best version of herself, she can act however she feels like. It's liberating and + he's the only one who knows what she's been through
I've always viewed her willingness to be around Spike to be for a few reasons.
First, she doesn't care how he perceives her. If her actions or words upset him and he told her to leave she wouldn't be loosing a friend, Spike has tried to kill her, not judge her.
Second, they do have a connection of experiences that she doesn't share with anyone else.
Third, Buffy may not like to admit it but she does seem drawn to the dark as people have told her in the past. Rylie was truly a distraction for her, in my opinion, I didn't see their time together as her being in love which makes their departure and her running after him feel off. (Again, my observation)
Buffy is complex, a breakdown in dualities. A soldier for the light that is drawn to the dark.
As for why she doesn't get paid for being a slayer if you look back at her trials where the Watchers put her with a vampire in a weakened state she shouldn't have lived this long. Spike even said so, the only reason she has lasted this long is her connections to the world. Spike may be some negative things but he is observant and perceptive, more than most characters in this show. Now she finds herself detaching from those connections.
I think it boils down to the fact that Buffy doesn't really care what Spike thinks of her.
One could expect that whatever support a Slayer needed would be provided by their Watcher, which is why Watchers receive salaries from the Council.
...but Buffy quit the Council back in Season 3.
That doesn't explain why Tara and Willow are apparently freeloading and left her financially underwater upon her resurrection, though.
The real answer is that the writers wanted Buffy to have to deal with money trouble and hoped the audience wouldn't think too much about obvious solutions or questions surrounding that.
@@dostatochnoor just confirming that Buffy’s friends are sometimes selfish jerks.
@jspettifer True, but in this case, the show.doesn't seem to really understand that they're being that way (at least not about finances/living arrangements)
@@dostatochno, it looks like you completely missed the episode in Season Five while Buffy was facing off against Glory, and the Watcher's Council came to Sunnydale.
@@dostatochno, remember Kendra talking about being taken in and raised by her Watcher in Season Two? Other than Buffy, who is living with her mother, we are given no indication of other Slayers who are not under the care of their Watchers.
I think you hit the nail on the head with Buffy and Spike at this pint. She doesn't feel any kind of pressure with him.
Willow and Tara provided a rather valuable sevice, at least while Buffy was dead, constantly babysitting Dawn.
They were sitting. Dawn just happened to be there.
@@alanmackie6180 Pretty sure, they were also standing, walking and - not least of all - lying.
I found your channel a few months ago and watched all your Buffy reactions and album reactions! I loveeeee your content so much, can’t wait to watch your season 6 reactions! ❤
Buffy's depression clashes with the trio messing with her and it makes Buffy feel even worse, to the point of drinking while spending time with Spike.
The two "magic bone" jokes never fail to get me going.
Excluding serious clinical depression, the best thing for feeling a bit down is getting totally plastered.
@@alanmackie6180 Which, for Buffy is why the drinking doesn't work. I have no doubt that's what she has since being resurrected.
Fun and solid reaction to an episode that can and does cause diverse interpretations. You asked about Spike and Buffy. When we watched we felt that there were a couple of reasons for Buffy feeling comfortable with Spike.
Buffy has suffered severe trauma by being taken from bliss, peace, and love. The reason for her emotional suffering were her friends Willow and Xander. ( she is friendly with Tara and Anya but not the deep relationship with Willow and Xander) She can not be honest with her two closest friends without telling the full story. She can’t open up with Giles or Dawn without causing them pain because that would have them question their love of Buffy returning.
The other reason we felt there was something between Spike and Buffy was the nature of Buffy and what Spike telling Buffy she is a creature of the night. 3 powerful and legendary vampires , Angelus, Dracula, and Spike, have all become obsessed with Buffy. Buffy has shown she has a dark power within and is willing to explore herself. We felt that coming back from death has made Buffy totally oblivious to the normal life, classic depression, and only her unfulfilled inner power/ dark feeling is giving her any feelings. The only joy or emotions is when she is fighting. The adrenaline from the action is at least something and Spike can at least relate to the dark power. Buffy can at least feel some bond and with Spike comes some form of danger.
Lastly, remember that Giles came into a windfall because of Buffy’s actions with the vile Watchers Council in Season 5, Checkpoint. Giles not only was rehired he was also given 2 years of full back salary..
Re: spike I do think it’s basically what you said. He’s the only one that she is allowed be around and not be okay. He doesn’t need her to fake being okay for his sake so she can just relax and be herself.
An episode about Buffy trying to find her place in the world. As often in 'Buffy', the supernatural elements are metaphors. Buffy feels slow at college, like she can't keep up, so this becomes literal. The construction site section is about the difficulties with sexism women can have in the workplace. The time loop scenario in the magic shop is a metaphor for how repetitive retail jobs can feel etc.
Same. I think at this point in the show, the reason Buffy could stand to be around Spike was because he knows her secret, that she was in heaven, and he wasn't a part of trying to bring her back to life (even though he's thrilled she's back). He doesn't put any expectations on her from her POV. She needs to take care of Dawn. She needs to show gratitude to Willow, Tara, and Xander for bringing her back. She needs to show Giles she can handle being the slayer again. But she doesn't have to pretend anything for Spike. She can just be.
Loved your reaction, and I agree! :)
Stop touching my magic bone! Lol
Gotta love Anya: I can illustrate with an amusing story about a crystal.
Sad we never got to hear it.
To answer your question about the Watchers council and how do they expect her to live without an income: they don’t.
It’s that simple.
“The Council fights evil. The Slayer is the instrument with which we fight. The Council remains. The Slayers... change. It's been that way from the beginning.” -Checkpoint
I think at least in the back of her mind, Buffy feels Spike is somewhat morally inferior to her. So she doesn't feel that pressure to be "good" around Spike because she can still feel "better" or "above" him morally. I believe he's a safe outlet for her right now as she starts grappling with some nasty darker feelings that she feels her friends/family aren't prepared to handle without judgement. Plus I think it's been made clear to Buffy (through being brought back by her friends) that they really *need* her. She feels needed by everyone around her in a way. And Spike may want Buffy, but he doesn't need her in those same ways.
The Watchers council usually doesn't pay the Slayer because they pay the watcher who takes care of the Slayer, rather than the Slayer staying with her family like Buffy does. In hindsight it's kinda interesting that they never discussed, never even seemed to consider Buffy leaving her mother to be the Slayer like all the other Slayers. It's something that seems odd to try to do with modern Slayers, in areas unlike wherever Kendra was from that took it as an honor. But it was done with other Slayers odd as it may seem. But anyway, it makes sense to pay the Slayer instead of the Watcher or also, when she does need to take care of herself. It really shouldn't be seen as such a favor or sacrifice for Giles to give Buffy money as he's paid for HER being the Slayer and she isn't, And she even got him retroactive pay for when he wasn't actively working with the council. But storywise, they couldn't go for the "Real life is hard/hell" storyline if they did that.
A lot of fans are turned off over freeloading Willow and Tara but I try to cut it some slack, it seems to me that the writers landed on “Buffy struggles with money; depression increases” and reverse engineered it from there. Buffy should have been set with Joyce’s life insurance regardless of the medical costs
I remember her saying, in episode 3 I think it was, that she could "be alone" with him there. I don't know exactly what she meant by that, but I get the feeling it is a key to understanding her side of their relationship.
Electra heart is typing......
The Star Wars theme on the van horn always makes me laugh. So much for being inconspicuous.
15:27 ..."We don't kill the kittens, right? We just... we love then and we take care of them".... Yeeeaaah....suuuuuureeee....
As we’ve seen, the look on her face in Ep 3. Buffy felt absolutely betrayed to learn that her best friend was responsible for her being pulled out of heaven. She also is being seen as the one who is still responsible for everything in her life (the bills, dawn, being the slayer) and the only one who lets her relax and not be “fine” or responsible is Spike. Hence, the fact that she feels like she can only be around him.
I have coveted that cameo shirt Buffy is wearing during the Magic Box sequence for like 20 years now.
This episode is so depressing but alsp so funny. The magic box moment is just comedy gold. And as someone who went through several different awful jobs I can relate so much
“We’re gonna stick with them, love that”
Eh, we’ll see about that
"And also, I think you're drunk" she said unsteadily, slurring her words. 😆
She has a Slayer body, which makes her more resistant to the poisons produced by alcohol in her liver. Of course, she has to drink more than a normal person to get drunk. And she overdid it a bit. But even under these conditions, she can stand on her feet quite well.
I read a theory somewhere that after Checkpoint, the Board of Supervisors gave Buffy some money. It may not have been a lot, but it was there, which allowed Buffy to have no particular money problems. However, that doesn't mean they could afford expensive purchases, like renting a serious motorhome. It's also possible that they specifically took one, because it was, after all, just a consumable.
SPOILER:
I fully expected this comment to go:
"I read a theory.....
...............................it could be _bunnies!"_
There's nothing in the canon to support that theory, however. They agreed to pay Giles, not Buffy. But I wouldn't get too caught up in wondering about it. The show never made much attempt to explain how Faith could afford that hotel, or how Anya could afford her apartment prior to working at The Magic Box, or how Buffy was paying for anything after her mom died until now, when they needed it for drama. 😂😂
AHHH SHES ALMOST AT THE BEST EPISODD
You're right. Using your super strength to work on a building site is a waste of talent. It's like Gordon Ramsey, flipping burgers in a fast food outlet.
I would say your opinions on Buffy and Spike are on track.. There's no expectations with Spike and no need to inpress him, so she feels free to be however she is, with him. Where's that not the case with her friends.
Did you notice at the end of last episode how she just ran off and left dawn, and Giles facial expression
Had it not been for some of the creeps at the construction site, and the needs with their demons, Buffy would have been a real asset to the crew. They were behind schedule, and Buffy was helping them catch up. The foreman was pleased, but one of the workers wanted her to slow down.
Buffy seasons 6 & 7 were on a different network than Angel, which made crossovers difficult and less frequent. They also couldn't coordinate air dates, so continuity between the series was problematic.
The thing with Willow and Tara living in the house and not paying the bills isn't really ever mentioned on the show, but it's clearly implied by the lack of any indication that either of them has a job. I mean; they were basically acting as adult guardians to Dawn in exchange for room and board, which ain't nothing, but it's not like they'd be homeless because Willow clearly would be getting some level of support from her parents. I don't know about Tara - how does she support herself? Doesn't seem like her family is involved since the last time we saw them.
Also as for the Council... why do they pay the Watchers but not the Slayers?
The Council was also never seen as an organization that helped the Slayer. All they did was control.
My guess, if Buffy kicked them out, they'd just go back to the dorm.
As a Spike fan, I hate to say that I think Buffy feels comfortable with Spike because she doesn't actually care about his feelings. Her family and friends love her, but she does worry about their feelings. Additionally, Buffy is Spike's #1. At the moment, he's shown that she's all he cares about, for better or worse. Her friends are in relationships, Dawn is too young to burden with stuff, and Giles just got back but she doesn't want to disappoint him. With Spike, Buffy can actually be herself without think he's judging her or that she's hurting him in some way.
If you speak into a dead man’s ear it doesn’t make it real. Also she’s where he is. Outside. She doesn’t feel like she belongs.
She rejected Giles herself. She didn't tell him the truth, she stood up when he reached for her. She deliberately didn't open up to him and rejected him. Her words at the end of the episode are empty, she closed herself off from him.
I think the council just sees the slayers as commodities instead of real people. Also, as mentioned here during season 3, the older the slayer, the harder it is for the council to control them, so they expect them to die young (with a little help of 18th birthday psycho test). At the end of the day, paying them is a waste of time and money.
With the high rate of turnover, each Slayer supposedly lasting no more than a few years, perhaps the Council thought it too much trouble to constantly change where the money would go.
Regarding Tara when Buffy is not moving cause of the time thing it does seem weird that she just leaves her there but maybe she thinks is one of the after-coming-back-to-life-weirdnesses 🤷♀️ I always wondered
I think that with moving super fast, it would seem to Tara that Buffy just left.
A very good episode! The time going slower, the endless repetition... It looks like depression .
It's a shame that my favorite line of the episode got edited out.
Spike- "Someone's gotta stake me."
Buffy- "I'll do it."
The council most likely doesn't pay the slayer for a few reasons:
1. Most slayers dies, very young age.
2. control, its was most likely set up in a way that if the slayer actually gets past their initiation rights that in the long history of humans that the slayers watcher's money was set up to finance the slayer. Giles was fired by the watchers council and with Buffy's refusal to work with them any more they probably only kept an eye on her to make sure she didn't turn evil. Honestly im surprised they didn't assassinate her and faith once this happened so that a new chosen one (or 2) could happen.
Willow and Tera were most likely paying for food for dawn, but its honestly one of the parts of the show that make the least sense. If Willow had failed in reviving Buffy would they have had to sell the house? At some point the logic does break down a little, but its most likely that this seasons set up was more built for the metaphor and less on the logistics of real life.
Cass, I love watching these reactions with you. It's like watching Buffy with fresh eyes.
Most slayers don't make it to adulthood. Their parents and watchers take care of them.
Spike is the only one that Buffy can be honest with. She needs to lie to everyone else.
I always interpreted the trio as a representation of everyday pervasive misogyny, just the general sexism women have to deal with on a regular basis. With the hopelessness and depression and shame she's already feeling these boys who have less power than her at the end lf the day can manage to bring her down and make her feel like she isn't enough.
Angel and Buffy are now running on different networks. CW & UPN. So crossovers of any kind are hard to do. They still find their ways but just a heads up.
However, from her conversation in Dead Things, it can be assumed that
SPOILER
This meeting gave her nothing, because she felt nothing.
my poor Buffy 🥺
Firstly, we don't know that Willow and Tara weren't contributing at all. I like to think they kept the lights and water on and food in the fridge but they simply couldn't keep up with the mortgage and everything. Secondly I think traditionally the Slayers lived with their Watchers like Kendra lived with hers so they pay the Watchers well enough to keep them comfy. We don't know what happened that had it so Buffy stayed with her parents instead of going to live with a Watcher.
The reason why the Council and Giles make money and Buffy doesn’t is easy: The patriarchy in full effect. Buffy can be around Spike because he knows the truth about her and she can be herself around him and he doesn’t expect anything other than companionship with her.
Without doubt The Trio are so irritating at this point, especially Andrew. I get exactly what people saying about them at this point, as they are not lending to the seriousness of the storylines. As if Buffy didn't have enough to cope with, now we have these goons messing with her life. Spike bringing Buffy to the poker game for kittens brings some light relief, and of course the X-Files referenced again with the Craddock Marine Bank ( yes the same fictitious bank in Breaking/Bad Better Call Saul) that kept blowing up. I thought it was a pretty average episode overall, and yes Cass you will love the X-Files if you do it.
At my university, you could attend classes (without paying for the course), but you weren't tested and you received no final grade. You just showed up to soak in some knowledge but received no credit for taking the course. It wouldn't show up on your transcript. I always thought Buffy should have started earning some money until the next enrollment period came around.
Fans like to throw out the accusation that Willow and Tara are living at Buffy's rent-free, but that's never actually discussed in the show. I always assumed they were chipping in, we just never heard about it.
I love this episode.
so excited for this one
wow, you are in for some surprises in this season. things are far from what you are thinking.
Spike is easy. He just wants to be around her no matter what she is, she can be mean, vulnerable, good, bad, it doesn't matter to Spike as long as she is honest about it. Everyone else has expectations, or she feels that they are responsible for removing her from heaven, and she feels like she can't be how she feels around them at this point. As she said when she told Spike, they can never know.
Waiting for your reaction to electra heart album
Why does Buffy feel like Spike is the only person she can bear being around?
I'm sure there are many aspects to it. The darkness connecting them. The fact that he doesn't judge her as much as others do. The fact that he's not really part of the friend group and sometimes it's so much easier to talk to someone on the outside. She doesn't care as much about his opinion. She can tell herself that he's not a real person. I'm sure there are other aspects as well.
Personally, I think that Buffy is severely depressed and it's hard to think clearly in that state. You have to do whatever gives you a tiny bit of joy or relief to survive. Spike isn't involved in her human life with all the bills and companies. Lying to him about how she feels would be pointless because he'd just know it's a lie. He's way too perceptive for that. So it's easy to let down her guard. And he IS treating her with whatever compassion a soulless being can muster, without ever belittling her. She knows he sees her as strong and worthy of love, no matter what. That must feel good, when everything else is falling apart.
Long answer, but you asked ;)
Anya, Xander and to a lesser extent Giles (before the end) kinda annoy me in this ep. So maybe Xander couldn't possibly have talked the crew into keeping Buffy around since he isn't like, the entire site manager and the other guy seems to be, feels like he could have given it a bit more of a go. Or like, get her a job at some other site.
Then Anya seemingly doesn't train Buffy or give her all the info on her first day at the shop and then when she makes a small mistake that isn't her fault, she's like "oh well we'll just take it out of your wages" when she knows Buffy super needs the money and a job. Giles just kinda lets it all happen as well, it's supposed to be a comedy episode and obviously the point is Buffy isn't going to be happy doing any of these things but it felt uncharacteristically harsh and out of character when usually the show manages to do comedy while still keeping the characters true to their selves.
She's even the one who suggested Buffy charge for saving peoples lives so if Buffy were in as shitty a mood as she has a right to be, she could have said "Ok Anya, you take that money out of my pay and then you can pay me for the ohhhh five or six times I've saved the planet you're living on, does that seem fair?"
She doesn't feel guilty for how she feels around Spike. That's all. Everyone else expects things from her. Spike will take her as she is.
I doubt Buffy would take the money even if the Council offered to pay her. She is fiercely independent, and particularly doesn't want to be under the Council's thumb, or be beholden to them for anything. Only Giles could get away with handing her money, because he's Dad.
It annoys me that some fans say they did nothing. Buffybot helped with cooking & cleaning but there was so much more to taking care of a teenager that a robot couldn't do, plus in my head canon at least one of them had a minimum wage job at a coffee shop or Sunnydale bookstore or something. They never seemed like slackers. Willow even volunteered at the magic shop the previous year even though Anya rejected her help.
Well, if you need head canon to fill in the gaps, maybe people do have a point.
Buffy and Spike share the same issues. Both died both dug out their graves both are creatures of the night they relate. It's crazy how Buffy's best friends are the most selfish ppl on the show not Tara and Anya
This is my life is in a rut season. My life currently is in a rut jobwise so I can relate. I'm on S6 episode 1 as I post this lol
Oh not this again. People just assume Tara and Willow were living there without chipping in, but this is never explicitly stated in the show. For all we know they did contribute the best they could, given they didn't have jobs either as college students. Also, they were taking care of Dawn for free
That's the point. They didn't have jobs and are not expected to get jobs when money is tight while Buffy is. That's the whole argument right there.
02:32 - 02:43 NO,IT'S NOT OKAY,ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?I WANNA KNOW!!!😫💢I'm here stuck with Spike 24/7 and *the one time* I could get a tiny scrap of Bangel interaction not only I don't get to see it but you're not even _narrate it_ to me?!?!😡💢WHY should I be okay with this?!😤💢💢💢 10:40 - 10:43 No joke,YESTERDAY a fire started in a basement of my building and now every time I see a very smokey scene I get a bit triggered. :-S The smoke's smell hasn't even gone away completely yet!
It's because she's really miserable and he knows why. She told him the truth, and she has to pretend around all the other people that matter to her. That's why, it has to do with that, for now.
❤🧡💛💚💙💜🤎🖤🤍
As depressing as this start of the season was, starting next episode is when the season turns into another gear and we start to see the direction of this season. And after next episode is the reaction we all been waiting for.
You don't know who Scully is? Okay, you really **do** need to watch X-Files next, because Scully is just the best. And so is Mulder. Mulder and Scully are the best.
As for Spike and Buffy, he really does understand her on a level that the others don't. Remember when he was teaching her about the other slayers he's encountered? He knows slayers even better than Giles does. That and knowing about her having been in Heaven instead of Hell means that he is the only one she **can** open up to right now. She can tell the others some things, like telling Giles how she misses her mother, but Spike has access to information that the others don't. And that's both a good **and** a bad thing, considering that he is still a vampire, a creature of darkness, willing to tempt her to give in to her own darkness. He doesn't have a soul, like Angel does, so even though he loves Buffy, it's a pretty selfish kind of love. We saw that when he had the Buffybot built. He's grown since then, helping the others and especially Dawn while Buffy was dead, but he's still who he is.
I definitely recommend X-Files after Buffy!!
Who says Willow and Tara weren't paying rent? The show never says they aren't. But two college students renting a room can't afford to pay the full costs of keeping up a house.
As for the Council, I'm sure they'd be delighted to pay Buffy. Her being their employee would come with a heaping dose of control, and it doesn't surprise me that Buffy doesn't even contemplate asking them.
Exactly who knows if Tara and Willow paid rent? Second I view the slayers not getting paid as a way to explain why they always pick a girl to be the slayer. They are basically slaves. Obviously Buffy didn't act that way but she was supposed to. As much as the concept sucks to me it makes it much more logical to always pick a girl storyline wise
@ But the Watchers Council does not choose the Slayer; if they did, then Buffy (who they failed to identify as a possible Slayer, and train for it from a young age) would never have been the one chosen. Joss Whedon's original script for the movie, on which the series is based rather than the theatrical version, mentions the Slayer is a girl because the essence of the feminine is to create/give life, the direct opposite of vampires who only take it.
Whoever said that Willow and Tara were not paying have no basis for those assertions. At no time in the show were the financial arrangements mentioned, period. I choose to believe that friends would not stiff a friend for the rent. I choose to believe that they were paying at least what they were paying for their previous accommodations. I think that people assume that because we never see them working that they had no income. Many scholarships and student loans pay for housing and other necessities. Also we don't know that they were not getting financial assistance from their parents. Pobably not Tara because of what we saw of her father, but probably Willows Mother would have helped her out financially. So please can we stop this nonsense of Willow and Tara not contributing to the family budget?
possibly they payed for groceries and power... But economics is big plot hole from now on. I'll come back to the topic and my observations on further episodes.
Oh man that Warren guy always leaves me seeing red. He comes across as particularly creepy and gross. I have never been that bothered by the Willow and Tara thing; Buffy being dead and then being brought back to life has always raised more questions for me. I wonder about Buffy's death and whether or not she was officially dead to the state. How officially dead was she? Did she have a death certificate? Did they bury her in a random spot but give her a super formal headstone?