What makes Neve preamps so great? Neve clone teardown
Вставка
- Опубліковано 15 лип 2020
- Neve's vintage mic preamp design is the most celebrated and imitated of all time. But what's inside and that makes it so damn special? In this video I tear down a GAP Pre-73 Neve preamp clone and walk through the parts and the circuit.
- Наука та технологія
This channel deserves to grow. Amiable delivery with just enough teccy stuff to satisfy the curious.
Top job.
I feel the learnz.
Thank you for the diligence on the video quality!
Thankyou! Between this and the API teardown, now I understand what it is about each that makes them special.
Totally interesting video. Amazing how the Neve pre-amps were/are designed...Thanks for sharing it.
Phil
NYC Area
This was awesome! Love this type of content!!
Your comments on balanced internals was so useful, just what I needed to hear.
Fantastic video! I learned a lot, especially about voltage vs current amplification. Thank you Peterson.
Glad it was helpful!
yep that detail was really enlightening for me too
this channel is such a beautiful gem! thank you
Excellent video man!! Keep them coming!
Awesome channel, loved the 1176 teardown and this one, Neve 1073 EQ, API 550/560 and Pultec EQ would be very interesting as well!
Thanks! This is really useful to hear about how this works and the differences that are part of high end vs low end gear. I'm on the new side of audio - and looking to upgrade the audio in my home video studio. This helps me understand whats going on. If you continue to show this for preamps, compressors, EQ, etc - it will be quite popular with many of us who will never be full on audio engineers - but rather home grown audio techs. Thanks for a great job!
Loved the teardown. Thanks!
I would love you to go through All of the Classic Preamp, Compressor, and EQ circuits. That DIYRE is about circuits, seeing these circuits broken down, inspires one to build up one of the DIYRE kits.
“... if you’ve made it this far into the video, I hate to break it to you, but you are a nerd” 😂
I popped popcorn before this lol 🤓
FINe BY ME😂😂😂😂
Great breakdown!
Thanks for your time. I wish I had all these knowledge available when I was young. That’s incredible What you can found on UA-cam.
Really enjoyed this teardown, learned a lot, please keep them coming. The question is what classic audio gear don't I want torn down and analyzed by you?
Thank you for the video! I have been starting to get an urge to get into building/modifying audio gear and this is the exact type of content I (as someone with no prior experience) was looking for. This has helped me tremendously. I intend to watch your other breakdown videos right away. And will be checking out the website as well. It would be cool to maybe see a comparison or even a side by side comparison of this unit and the golden age pre 73 dlx. I'm guessing its just higher quality transistors, tubes, etc. but would be awesome to hear someone with your level of experience talk about it. Anyway cheers! keep grinding my man.
Clicking on this again to give you the view. Would love to hear your take on the Trident A Range Preamp design.
Great suggestion!
I definitely second this. Especially because Trident Audio just released their 500 series A range EQ not too long ago and they will also be releasing a standalone A range and 80b 500 series preamp next year.
I think the combo mic jack is actually pretty useful. It allows you to easily feed a line signal into the mic pre which can create a pretty awesome sounding distortion.
Or sometimes mic level signal is fed via TRS
Definite nerd here! I'd love to see a teardown/explanation of how the different compressor detector circuits work, opto/vca/fet etc...
Great suggestion!
You’re not nerd. It’s having a brain on alert and paying attention.
Woohoo, I made it to the end. I'm a nerd. Great walkthrough Peterson.
I love watching this kind of stuff. Thank you for taking the time to do this, and keep them coming!!! How about a teardown & walk-through of an EL Distressor?
I'd also love to see you do a comparison teardown between a budget preamp like the Golden Age 73 alongside a higher end 1073 preamp like Warm Audio / Heritage to see the difference and what makes the others more expensive.
warm audio not that high end a lot of their product are alctron chinese rebrand with some modifications
@@ThaexakaMavro WARM does not have any product with any board that has any relation or similarity to an Alctron. Your comment is actually libelous / defamatory and 3 people were dumb enough to believe you already.
Like (Their?) W-47 mic. Total Alctron product.@@ThaexakaMavro
would love a side by side comparison of a vintage neve and a vintage API preamp.
Interesting, always good to see 2N3055 in TO-3 packages. Would like to know more about choice of cap and resistor composition though (or maybe that'd be too nerdy!)
Awesome video dude! I've been wanting a video like this for ages on YT. I like most DIY'ers like to learn how things work but when it comes to electronics they are rather a bitch to learn. I love these types of videos, what would be cool if you could do a little tutorial on how to build a cheap opamp pre. Thanks for the video!
nice, i discovered your site .. best vibes
I own the WA12 MK2 black mic preamp from Warm, and it's GREAT!!! Especially with my LL2A compressor limiter from Little Labs chained behind it.
I love these videos! So interesting to see someone talk about all the individual components because i'm not an electrical engineer
I’d like to see a comparison teardown of the GAP 73 Premier DLX, the Warm Audio version, and a Chamelean Labs version, all of them doing their Carnhill xformer / tantalum/ polystyrene caps thing..
Would love to see a tear down or value measurements comparisons of Marinair vs CarnHill transformers of those from a high end Neve preamp.
Nice vids bro
This stuff is the best small signal audio information on UA-cam.
Excellent 🙏 proud to be a nerd
great video! I'd like to see a tear down of the ddx3216 preamps... as I am curious how I can rebuild them if they ever fail as I have heard of upgrades on the preamps, curious how to go about it and what parts should be switched out to clean the signal.
Thank you!
“It likes fava beans, and a nice Chianti”
Very good! Very good! 😊
i would be interested to see a teardown of the SSL six. SSL seems to be trying to pivot into lower cost parts of the market so im curious where they had to make compromises from an engineering/financial perspective to pack all those features in at that price poin
this is before i watched it all but stopped at :21 and i already love how explicitly said we will go over topology and their makeup....big ups because for anyone trying to grasp their head around "special" circuits its nice to have a voice with knowledge... just my 2 cents. thank you
As in music, this reminds me the difference between "complicated" and "complex", achieved through simplicity I'd dare say : )
We want more.
Great vid!! API next?
Maybe also a video about what were listening to in all the different preamp styles (esp since they're represented in the Color range)...? Neve... low mid bias? API, mids? SSL...?
Hey Peterson, love this series! Just out of curiosity, since you mentioned a chunk of the price is in that big switch, would it make a neve style pre any more affordable if you re-worked that design to be a series of basic on/off switches for each preamp section and standard pots for within each section?
Sure! I think you could do some clever stuff that way and get interesting sounds by driving different sections to extremes
Would be GREAT to explain partes behavor with osciloscope/thks the list of transistores & Transformer specs
“the Hannibal Lecter of transistors” hahaha
Nerds unite!
Thank you for the awesome synopsis👍
I want all that as an onboard pre in my bass guitar
Hi, thanks for making this. What does the Line transformer do if there is nothing to unbalance?
I believe the line input is balanced
Thx for showing .to your knowledge or anyone who read , is it worth to buy to one with carnhill transformer.
Is it a big difference in sound quality thx .
Wonder how this one compares to there newer black neve clone, as the build quality looks significantly higher on the new one (haven't seen if it's price matches yet lol)
Any suggestions as far a fixing the stepped elm switch? Seems to have lost contact on multiple gain settings :/
Could you do Neve preamp teardown with EQ version?Real 1073 has EQ and more complex.
If I bought one of these it would be primarily to use as a high quality di. But you have not discussed the circuit that follows the quarter inch input. Can you tell me how the high impedance transformation is achieved? Does it use an FET ? does it use of a op-amp voltage follower ? Where is the signal injected is it at the secondary area of the microphone transformer how is it buffered from this transformer?
I wonder how this compares to the neve monsteratt console? I would love to see inside one of those things.
Ironically, the 80-series consoles that practically every Neve clone is based on were not designed for or used in music studios. I don't know what's inside the Monserrat but given the year of 1977 and my limited knowledge of the Neve timeline I believe the console would have used rather different circuitry from the 80-series. By the time of the 8058 in 1976 the circuitry had gone discrete, class-AB, and by the late 70s it was all ICs.
could this be used as a line level preamp to feed a power amp or set of powered monitors? if you had two of them I mean .
lol'ed hard at the reference to Hanibal Lecter is like a transistor and then reliases it's nothing like him ahahah.
Long live the nerds!
Tube-tech CL1B teardown next!!!!!
in theory, can you install a vintage output transformers on a clone? does this work or no?
Hey i have one and i recently had to move my studio after a few years and now the pre is giving me really thin vocals. please help.
so to power the unit 120v to 24 volt done through rectifier? Then you transform 24v to 48v?
I'm sure that nobody here is a newbie, but i'd like to imagine trying to explain what these things even do that is so essential. They basically add rather minor, mostly imperceivable harmonics to the signal. They can (though not sure if this one does) also overdrive or rather softclip in a way that is sometimes a pleasant kind of distortion, though this is rarely actually used. I wanna say I hate it here, but it's no ones fault and there's no way around it (confused emoji).
Haha! I Only like transistors that like Fava beans and a nice Chianti!!
I would LOVE to see a critical analysis of the actual schematic, (1073).....although we could conceivably get into trouble in the patent--copyright area ??? I'm not sure how that works on youtube, but if there's a way to pull it off I'd be happy to help.
"it likes fava beans and a nice chianti" lmao
Would be really cool if you did another segement with say a BAE & a GAP side by side explaining to us why one is 3 times the price. Same with SSL comps SSL vs Serpent etc WARM audio WA2A va LA2A? Inform the masses into making fully informed decisions. It’s a bit scary when there are a few things you’re not sure of when explaining though we need full confidence in you and a extremely detailed tear down for these vids to be successful. Bout time someone did it his though
whats the difference in the GAP mk1/mk2 and mk3 ?
Is it exactly same as Neve 73?
Good basic breakdown of the device but like most people you are implying that the use of the output knob (trim) is to lower the output after one cranks the input.
This is not what the trim was designed for at all. It is called a trim because that is it's intended use.
The gain knob offers 5db increments so if you need 43db of gain then you would set the input gain to 45db and trim off 2db with the output trim knob.
While some people do use the output trim in the way you suggest this isn't really the best way to push a 1073 type circuit. At three o'clock the output trim knob is cutting around 10db and at noon about 20db. Using this knob lowers your signal to noise considerably and pushing the preamp in this way doesn't take full advantage of the circuit really.
If you want to push a 1073 (or other micpreamps with input and output knobs) it's much like a guitar amp with master volume works. Cranking the input and then turning down the master (the output trim on a preamp) results in a fuzzy buzzy small sounding distortion while cranking the master or output trim and pushing the input gain appropriately results in a bigger meaner clearer overload sound.
By starving the signal at the trim knob you are sending a weak signal to the output transformer.
A far better way of pushing the 1073 is to keep the trim near full up and go a click or a few higher than what is needed for a good clean sound and then attenuate after the output of the 1073. This way you are working the output transformer (which is one of the things you are paying for in a preamp like this so you might as well use it ... right?)
This is exactly why the Golden Age Pre73dlx model has an output pad. If you have one of the standard Pre73 units you can buy or make an inline pad to do the same thing. Shure makes this device as do Whirlwind, Proco, and others. Some even offer three different levels of attenuation.
If you like the sounds you get by lowering your output knob then enjoy but you really should check out what one of these preamps can sound like when you light up the whole circuit properly and find that "on the edge" sound that involves the output transformer working a bit.
i wish i knew what any of this meant but cool!
man, after going on a 5 month rabbit-hole of wasting money on gear instead of singing and instrument lessons, this video makes A LOT more sense.
Is it a good mic preamp or is it junk?
Why are IC's not good in the audio path?
That’s Better!
This is the Hannibal Lechter of preamps.
@@Ascoundrel LECHTER
I could send you a Golden Age LA2A, LA3A, Warm API 312 etc.
1176, 33609, SSL G-Bus, DBX160.
Block diagrams or signal flow graphics, even drawn on napkins, would be helpful for visual folks like me.
Amazing and thanks for the ideas! could you shoot me an email via diy.re/contact?
Could you explaine in other video the importance of the input impedance for a good mic preamp?.
Thanks.
Noted!
yep im def a nerd. thank you
💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯
you dont need no power to make analog distortion for the transformer and it dose not take lot of power to make transformer distortion so i think the amp is there to Balance the signal for the mic and to make it louder
Lmao I am not a nerd sirrah!
RE-RE-Upload 😄
shhhhh
The only thing I actually want to see is an experienced engineer comparing the PCBs, components and build quality of different clones. I.e. comparison of 1176 clones, 2A clones, 1073 clones, Pultec clones. I can't find any videos like that existing on UA-cam, nobody has ever made something like that. But maybe it's asking too much to expect someone to get hold of multiple clones.
Rupert : 1073
China: ok guy´s we are out here
@6:28 lololol
A 'loud shirt' salesman in a mall gets held at gun point and is told to describe a Neve Preamp.
all of the distortion is coming from transformer and it dose not take lot to drive You can straight up just plug it into minijack for synth to audio Interface just like that and it works no joke this is for real i just done it
I'm a nerd ❤
would I be very wrong to guess that the three transistors in a group are part of a discrete opamp, probably not very different than the one seen here: ua-cam.com/video/jAwwsrnNdzg/v-deo.html
It's a good guess but in this case the transistors are not configured as an op amp
about two seconds of transformer information. "these are the transformers". the transformers are the tone containers, in lieu of tubes that's where all the juicy distortion comes from 🤤 BUT WHAT DO THEY DO
Not sure why you need to show your picture onscreen while you're explaining the nomenclature, but it's interfering with the main picture!
I am a nerd.
Yes
Let’s try to figure out why a Orange tastes like a orange by looking at a apple…
ah, the output stage, a 3055, common in a shit load of 100w amp designs. 3 transistor op amps, now that brings back memories. I probably played with this circuit back then too. It would take somebody about a day to trace the cct and then its readily available . Statements like " this is were it gets weird" are just so amateurish. Nothing weird about it at all, if you know anything about op amps. Look at the time we thought this was pretty ground breaking stuff, but looking back now, nothing really extra ordinary at all. Just that some people were smart enough to put it all together and the rest of us just followed. I was only 18 at the time, lol. The highlights to me are the input transformers, the wide p-p linear output voltage of the op amps and the output transformer drive. The magic sauce, the transformers.
I changed from a dislike to a like- because I know you have so much going on its hard to keep a video under 13 minutes. But you really only said what makes the neve preamp special is Its minimal components and the type of components, but the real specialty is in the type of components. What type of components and why are they special here in this particular model?
This is a Neve clone, therefore you aren't evaluating a Neve preamp. You have to title this video, "Evaluating a Neve clone"
If nerds are interested and can make complicated electronics eg: smartphones then nerds rule the world... OK!
Wow. there is nothing to it. Mainly just caps, resistors and connectors. I hope this is a low budget device.
calling a heat sink a "cage" just trashed any electronics credibility you might have had..
ok
Why talk so much if you keep saying this may be that may be may be? Please prepare yourself first to tell what is what. Regards.