There is no doubt that Orgen thrinlay Dorjee is the Karmapa declared and recognised by HH the Dalai Lama, the spiritual head of Tibet and also by all eminent lamas.
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big position has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different ❤❤❤❤❤
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
For me the two are karmapa.. Because their teaching is about wisdom... Because it's important that what kind of teaching they r giving us who is it's doesn't matter... The way of buddha teaching is important ❤..
Bro I would suggest you to do more research or study of these topic cause this is not a small thing for us Tibetan.. many of your information are not up on the point..
Beside my personal appreciation of his Holiness the 14. Dalai Lama from a distance it seemes obvious, that since the 1960s the tibetan government had the plan to unify the 4 main sects of tibetan Buddhism under Gelug leadership, which culminated in the death of Gungthang Tsultrim and didnt succeed mainly because of the resistance of the 16. Karmapa. I think a prerequisite for this plan was the banning of the sectarian wordly spirit dorje shugden. The paranirvana of the 16. Karmapa brought a second chance for expanding the dominance of the gelug sect by recognising and binding Orgyen Trinley Dorje, which also in the end didnt work well. Orgyen Trinley Dorje, who might be an Tulku, is clearly brought in the wrong position by the means of tibetan politics. The rivalry of the Gelug and Karma Kagyü sect has a long tradition, already after the paranirvana of the 15 th Karmapa, the 13 th Dalai Lama propagated a wrong candidate for the rebirth of the 16. Karmapa.
I really missed his holiness samar Rinpochela, I iam one of the greatest devote of his holiness..I miss his holiness smile and there was so much of positivity in his holiness ❤❤❤❤😢
me too, he was a great bodhisattva! btw -i hope you've seen the joint statement! Shamar's 15th incarnation will be recognized soon and our lineage will heal!
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
If you read 10th Karmapa's biography, he met multiple Karmapa's, his own rebecoming (reincarnation is the wrong word), and few of them recognize each other. Therefore both of them are Karmapas. Be informed about Buddhist concept of Nirmanakaya, before you making controversial videos.
I believe in both karmpas 🙏✨ lets say mind & speech. It doesn't matter who is real or not as long as they're carrying dharma activities in order to benefit all beings. 🙏✨
The 16th Karmapa is my root Guru. I have always said that the true Karmapa candidate will be determined by their Buddha activities. OTD whose, non dharmic behaviors has spoken like a loud all pervasive, lions roar. You can be trained and pretend to be the 17th Karmapa, even look like a one, but if you behave like a spoiled millionaire,, money drunk, " king" who breaks every samaya vow, that is certainly not the 17th Karmapa. Karmapa would not have to 7 million plus $ and that's just we kniw
Thats interesting the money aspect if sharing then thats a good thing isnt it its only if its stacked and not spent on the things that is needed in His community or who ever can benefit from His generous nature ❤😂who knows what the purposes are a small mind is stuck believe me Iam talking from experience so lets all jump outside the box hey ?. ? And widen our perspective HURAY !,! OMMANIPADMEHUM x3 ❤️❤️❤️🌈🌈🌈☔️☔️☔️🙏🙏🙏🌹☸️☮️💟🛐🇳🇿🇮🇩🇺🇦🥰🙏🙏🙏
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different ❤❤❤❤
you think there is a come back from rape. fathering a child from rape and made KTD pay over 10 million $. There s no coming back for OTD. Ges on the for sex abuse and was on the lam from India for tax evasion. He's a fake..
@@traceler have you watched H.H ogyen thinley dorjee’s documentary.? There Dalai Lama has clearly said that he saw a dream about where Karmapa was born and that happens to be the place where Tibetan karmapa, oygen thinley dorjee was born , and situ rinpoche who was very closed to 16th Karmapa identified the reincarnation but ofc I believe in both. Long live the karmapas
Whoever the Karmapa is, we should not judge or compare. We must not identify us self with anyone of them. Our nature is to love and spread more love. Even in Buddhism there are fight, ego, anger, ignorance and all the negative emotions. These negative (claiming power and authority) things should not happen if we are practicing Buddhism
I mean if both of them could guide beings than that is good for us ; and if one of them can prove to be effective then it is good too. But the problem is they fail to lead beings to better place . Now the title karmapa comes with lots of history and responsibility; and I hope they both can upheld that legacy . As a Tibetan, I will always go by the recognition of HH the Dalai Lama and that does not mean other one should be denigrated. I pray both succeed the legacy .
Everyone has their own devotion, don't conclude here saying who is real and who is fake... Go through Shamar Rinpoche's interview once. Karmapa's controversy is far more deep which we humen have not that abilities to understand. Karmapa khenno, may the Karmapa lineage live forever🙏🙏🙏
Ugen Thinlay always mention Rumtek ... We Sikkimise believe that he is the one who is real Karmapa .... Even crown is in Rumtek.. The pine plant which is planted in Rumtek by H.H Karmapa was still alive it was planted in Cemented floor...
Never seen the video on this topic before......nicely done..... only few things need to be corrected. The oldest schools / lineages are Nyingma, Sakya, Kagyu and Gelug. Tai Situpa Rinpoche is 70 years old. People should also watch about Jamgon Kongtrul Rinpoche's previous life will get to know more about Karmapa Orgyen Thrinle Dorje. He knows everything even in his very young age in Tibet. He helped in the search of Jamgon Kongtrul reincarnation lama. I've heard the 16th Karmapa flying hat story but never heard of rainbow body......Indeed, He is very powerful. 🙏 Please bring more videos related to the 16th Karmapa. Karmapa Chenno 🙏🙏🙏🌷🌷🌷☸️🕉️
Every one should follow that Karmapa he trusts most. In my case this is Karmapa Thaye Dordje. If someone trusts Orgyen Thrinlay more he should follow him. But I think Thaye Dordje is more convincing. He gave back his monk vovs and married. Orgyen thrinlay had a sexulal relationship with a nun and is going on like business as usual. That is no good exampel in a word where sexual relationsships should base on trust an emazipation.
Then why community and disciples doesn't follow the HH trulsikh Rinpoche yangsi who was recognize by hh the dalai lama and they follow another HH trulsikh Rinpoche who was recognize by hh drodrupchen Rinpoche... Stop this kind controversy about karmapa...both are genuine karmapa we have to follow both karmapa...
@@tashitshering703 pls send me your adress I'll send you books with full of evidence on this topic.... But pls when you upload on such high level topic which has been deeply connected with people's believes and faith, pls give your time on research.. Pls don't upload whatever comes on your mind or what you think is right... Don't accumulate bad karma🙏
Tashi delek thanks 🙏 story very important I am very longtime thing story and words good tibetan story right ✅ 100 percent right 🙏💟I love indian support
When a reincarnated lama is confirmed by the Chinese government, its good sign that this is not the true reincarnation. And why do you all forget that Urgen said him self that he is not the real Karmapa, and that he is very happy that he manage to share his thought with before 14th Shamapra's death. And now all the stories about Orgen's lovers and the babies he made with them - one can see he is truly not happy and he wants different life.
Traleg Rinpoche points out that the test of a spiritual practice is whether it is beneficial, not which religion it is associated with. Applying this to the Karmapa issue means that as long as both are benefitting human beings the issue of which is the true one is less important- that said Ogyen Trinley Dorje is the true Karmapa and this becomes obvious if you meet him.
Karmapa invented the tulku system. The system likes it because they can control the future leader from the very young age. It will always create controversies. I just pray that the leaders can see it and dare to change. For the sake of Buddhadharma.
Orgen trinlay Dorjee is the only Karmapa. He has the great power I myself experienced. Whatever people whispering, I believe in him. My Guruji is Tai Situ Pa and he has the power of knowing the correct Karmapa. I am following Vajrayana Buddhism since 30 years and believe in only Orgen Trinlay Dorjee who resembles so much to previous 16 Karmapa. Don’t confuse people. I don’t think you are Tibetan must be Indian who is trying to sell his little rough reading. Vancouver BC
The Buddha said, "Be a lamp unto yourself." That means we each must find our own way by our own practice. Whether someone else is a tulku or not should not change our practice. May all beings find happiness and liberation.
The BEST comment thus far. Decades ago I was obsessed with fact finding of who is most likley to be the real Karmapa. But nowadays it dawns on me that whoever sincerely and consistently practice is a Bodhisattva. Peace be with all!
Problem of Tibetan Rinpoche lies with egoism of high lama. It would dissolve with the presence of Dalai Lama I agree with what Dalai Lama advice and instruct. Game of this Lamaism is still exist in this modernised world I need a true enlightened lama rather than the game of of democracy party.
Since when does the Dalai Lama determine who is a Karmapa?! There are two Karmapas. One is for the Chinese and those who trust them. The other is for the others.
There is only one Karmapa and that is Ujyen Thinley Dorjee who was recognized by HH Dalai Lama, Tai Situ Rinpoche and all the High Lama’s of Tibetan Buddhism . Other boy was only recognized by one man shamar and his few followers and few foreigners who really don’t understand the true importance of your master. In Tibetan Buddhism there’s four major schoolsNyingma Gelugpa Kagyu and Sakyapa all the high Lamas from these schools only accept HH Urgyen Thinley Dorjee, even after all these explanations if you have any doubts then may god help you …Love & Peace 🙏🌷🌷🌷🙏
Namo Buddhay. There's was a movie...A Rinpoche was incarcerated into 3 persons... Hence, Karmapa Khenno maybe reincarnated into 2 persons. Both are doing great in Buddha's teachings. Compassion, kindness, helpful loving....etc.. I respect Both Karmapa Khenno.🙏🙏🙏
This is silly. 1. Respectfully... HH the 14th Dalai Lama (peace and long life to him ♥) is not the leader of Karma Kagyud. HH has NO SAY in Karma Kagyud lineage. The Dai Lama's own lineage is inferior and younger then the Karma Kagyud. 2. KK embraces dual eminations. If you believe in and understand Tibetan KK reincarnation (which the Chinese occupiers and rulers of Tibet do NOT being atheist) there is no difficulty in 2 simultaneous Tulku eminations. Buddha's incarnate out of time. 🕒 There is no difficulty for a Buddha nor Bodhisatva to occupy two bodies. Many precedents in almost every Buddhist school including Karma Kagyud.
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
I don´t know who really brought up that myth, that the dalai lama would be the spiritual leader of all tibetan buddhists. who claimes something like that has zero knoledge about the meaning and order of the 3 teachingcycles of buddha shakyamuni and the 4 main lineages of tibetan buddhism. the dalai lama might be some kind of political leader of a destroyed nation, that is spread around the world, but mainly genozided by china. he´s also the spiritual leader of the gelugpa school, which is by far the youngest of all 4. gelugs focus mainly on the 1st and 2nd teachingcycle of buddha. the main focuspoint of karmapas kagyü lineage is the 3rd cycle. vajrayana. how should the gelug-chief be able to judge about something like that? and such has never ever happened in the history of the 4 schools before. they allways find their top tulkus theirselves. again: there is no leading role or function of the dalai lama!!! and tai situs claims about the letter that could never be investigated because it was to holy and finally lost. the attempt of china to install their bought or frightened candidates to control the minds of the annexed tibetans have to be seen and understood. and yes, tibet was never a part of china. check the history. but a lot of chinese and even westeners believe that because they heard it often enough. last not least... the in the beginning cinese-installed candidate urgyen trinley escaped from the chinese control and tried to go on as karmapa for a couple of years. untill he finally gave up and said that he is not the karmapa. but the dalai lama is still right, right? haha
If you read the short biography of the first Karmapa, Dusum Khyenpa, contained in the Blue Annals (དེབ་ཐེར་སྔོན་པོ་, ) - written by Gö Lotsawa Shyönnu Pal (1392-1481), it clearly states that Karmapa is one of the Buddhas of the fortunate aeon (བསྐལ་པ་བཟང་པོ) and that noone, not even a 10th level Bodhisattva, can tell how many emanations he has.
For you he is the H.H 17th and for me other one is the 17th H.H. So you can do your way without disturbing me and I will do my way without disturbing anybody. Winner winner but no chicken dinner as we both are follower of karmapa.
This is definitely a dual incarnation, Karmapa reincarnated in 2 bodies , this is understandable because of Tibetan and chinese politics , i have had the good fortune to meet with Orgyen Thrinley Dorjee twice, was a good experience. 🙏
There is no soul involved here. 🤔 This comment reflects a lack of understanding of reincarnation in the Karma Kagyud tradition. @@anshul0961, Buddha's are not bound by linear passage of time as perceived by our skandas. If you believe in KK, you believe in dual incarnations. Many precedents for them in KK.
He,has not shown any miracles, Ugyen Durje, has shown, ..This, narration has no base, very poor narration, Tenlay Dorje miracle are Countless,. Your narration is very very. Poor.
Long live H.H 17th Karmapa Thaye Dorje...Recognised by the head of Kagyu lineage, 14th Shamar rinpoche, as we all know Karmapas and Shamarpas through centuries considered as one.Urgen trinley is a fake karmapa recognised officialy by chinese goverment.Dalai lama as head of gelugs lineage has no any spiritual authority to confirm who is the real recarnation for the head of kagyu lineage.
This is not something for you to make UA-cam content entitled “who is the real karmapa”. Instead of buddha’s footsteps and teachings, people are out here advocating for their own lineage’s 🙏🏼
After the conflict in Rumtek monastery most of the senior monks around 150 monks supported Shamarpa and came along with him just few few monks left behind.... Pls study hard before posting anything wrong information 🙏
There is only 1 Karmapa, before now n forever. Other one is a pariah just like the one who recognised him but died early due to his karma n for misguiding followers
Hi ❤well iam really nobody to say anything about this situation but one day i was in singapore in a darma shop and i saw a picture of Orgen Trinley Dorge and i got such a surprise because i mustv had some kind of connection with the last karmapa I recognised Him as the 17 th karmapa I dont know how I knew i just did anyway after that people told me about the other karmapa and i allways thought that and the rumours at the time was that this second one was a setup by the chinese but then one of my Lamas suggested that because of the power of the Last karmapa this Lama said it was more than possible that the 16 th karmapa couldv easily have the two incarnations and having different functions to serve humanity and I feel this Lama Is right and I think HHDLL might be in agreance with that although don’t quote me on that because I might be wrong Iam sure HHDLL has his own thoughts and opinions on that ( its just an suggestion and a thought theres nothing to say that the Last Karmapa wasnt capable of that In my opinion and feeling more than Likely there shouldnt be any contreversy about that we shoulld all embrace both these great beings ❤but then who am I to say like I said iam a nobody to take any notice of but its something to think about if your interested in this matter whatever both are recocnized by the highest Lamas in existence so who could actually challenge that I think its a incredible opportunity to see thegreat compassionate nature of this great being ❤with no contreversy or arguments get past the mind games and just watch the wonders of the universal Love for all sentient beings ❤😂☮️☮️☮️💟💟💟🛐🛐🛐🕉️🕉️🕉️☸️☸️☸️💝🌈🌈🌈☔️☔️☔️🇳🇿🇳🇿🇮🇩🇮🇩🇺🇦🇺🇦🌹🍀😍🌺🌼🌸🥰💐🌷🌎🌏🌍😇☸️☸️☸️🙏🙏🙏🌹🌹🌹🌷🌷🌷😍😍😍💝😇
There was a letter that was not scrutinized or authenticated by experts because Tai Situ did not allowed it, that would have solve the issue once and for all... I think Tai Situ was scare of testing the legitimacy of that letter because bringing experts to use science with respect has nothing bad about that... even HH Dalai Lama was open to use science to authenticated the bones of the Buddha and using fMRI to see the working brains of mediators ( even the Catholic Church allowed science to test the Holy Shroud of Christ) so checking if the letter was actually handwritten by HH the 16 Karmapa or was a counterfeit was the right thing to do but Tai situ say " it is too Holy" so it is Holier than the remains of the Buddha or the Shroud of Christ? Cm on! If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear from science that after all is looking for the truth. and the truth does not harm if you are in the right path.
Tai Situpa is an expert. There is nothing 'anti science' about it. Scientists can also have an opinion, but no proof. Whose opinion is worth more regarding the rebirth of the Karmapa? His inner circle of Golden Rosary or a scientist who is not Buddhist and doesn't believe in rebirth?
Don’t try to insult my Guru Tai Situ Pa. Whatever he has declared is correct. I myself had great experience with him and Ogyen Trinlay Dorjee. Remember insulting a high Guru is sin, remember it. Vancouver bc
Better to judge the real Karmapa is on their action. Buddhist Monk never keep the wife and child with their buddhist Monk dress. Once the monk or lama or rinpoche fall in sexual activity is not so long Rabhjung. So better to wear lay man dress and keep the wife and children and can give the teaching if having a capacity of buddhism knowlegde. 🤔🤔🤔😏😏😏
Not true 10 and 13th Karmapas had a wife or consort. Read history before commenting. Every Buddhist master who undergoes tantric training has to take up a consort, most of them do it in a secret and Gelugs takes a wisdom consort or yeshe in chag gya, that doesn't mean all other schools follow the same thing. Plus the monk vow says sexual misconduct is not allowed, this is why even Gelongs after taking up tantric consort doesn't fall from the vow as it is not considered a sexual misconduct. As far as my knowledge goes. So stop judging. Respect everyone, I hope you remember the dog tooth story. I sometimes feel weird about Tibetan Lamas they will on one hand stay the dog story but on the other hand leave no stone unturned to vile another and this is DHARMA
We should analyse more about Buddhist not only one part..I think so...without analyse will create misunderstand ...dilgo khentse rinpoche was married and dalai lama get most of empowerment from khentse rinpoche why???? Dalai lama said about khentse rinpoche UA-cam
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
Chabsuchee,,,,, karmapa,,,,,,ugen trinlay dorjee,,,,, 🙏💐🙏 Everywhere there were negetive and positive energy.....world even form by negetive and positive,thats why this is the example for the world,but negetive always lose,,,, right,,,,, ancient buddha was born and devdat was also born,is this the same case right .....no matter,we must prey heartly,worthfully to our real one.....thats the matter.....its my only views.....thank you.....karmapa khennoo from my heart....🙏💐🙏
Tulku issue is hectic and confusing once the there comes different claimers. However, to find the pure gold depends on how we investigate upon. Unlike the Thaye Dorjee born in Bhutan, whose father was self proclaimed re-incarnation of Jumipham and his younger brother was also a reincarnation of one Lama, but local people who knows the father of Thaye Dorjee, don’t agree him as reincarnation of Jumipham Rinpochey, a very famous Nyingmapa master. By looking upon all these Tulku making claiming & proclaiming tactics, it’s unfortunate that it is misused. Karmapa Ogyen Thrinley Dorjee was born in a simple nomad parents, whose parents were pious Buddhist practitioners, before and after the birth of Karmapa in Kham Lhadhok, many good signs had been seen. Which proves Ogyen Thrinley Dorjee to be a real Karmapa, like his previous predecessors, Ogyen Thrinley Dorjee is very good arts, specially in thanks paintings, this truly shows his authenticity. However, It is truly unfortunate to see these title claimers of Karmapa, who doesn’t walk the path shown by Buddha from home to to homelessness???
Perhaps it is neither one of them. It would naturally be quite common that others, no matter how profound the teachings may be, are not going to be able to locate the reincarnated memories within the hidden variables of manifested chaos, regardless of the shared information of universal consciousness between lives. Just because the Dalai Lama recognizes someone as this or that does not mean they are right. In fact the odds are extremely high that the line of Dalai Lama's, Karmapas, or Panchen Lama's have been broken numerous times in the past. This however does not invalidate the profound teachings of dharma; on the contrary dharma still spreads and dharma as we know it on this planet is but a tiny drop of water in a vast ocean veiled within our concept of time. I know this from experience and what I know from experience can not be shared directly in this manifested form but the information is encoded within the universe and entangled with the symetry between time, timelessness and cyclical universe creation because a symbiotic relationship between all these are necessary.
I think Buddhist should be more happy that there is two Karbala. We have one more guru and one more choice. Long live both Karmapa rinpoche and flourish their teaching.
There are 10 levels of bodhisattva which is call ma dak sa dun & dakpa sa sum one who complete all these then we can say enlighten one so its very important to choose right master who already enlighten one so to know which is right master in buddha darma said we should analysis for 10 years So its showing choosing master is very important
the great master tulku Urgyen Rinpoche whos also the father of Mingyur Rinpoche and also the guru of 16th karmapa told that one should respect both of them or you can venerate both of them equally and also my personal opinion that whatever they teach its the Buddhas teaching wats more relevant is if we follow the teachings without our own bending and twisting it and as for the great black hat ceremony and all i think maybe its because of our karma in this degenerate age that we are not being allowed the golden fortune karmapa khenno
Both the karma are guiding us but ogyen trinley Dorjee is our real karmapa as well as we have huge respected fir him. We donot need married lama like Thaye dorjee.
brother alot of facts are not mentioned at all what about the letter that was found and Shamar Rinpoche agreeing to it at first and also tsurpu is in tibet but you should mention that it has been the main seat of karmapas since the beginning of karamaps why is such an important high lama like Jamgon kongtrul not mentioned his death and gyaltsap Rinpoche the reagents of 16th karmapa their opinions at first many2 things are not in order it feels almost like a biased representation although your intentions may not be so it almost feels like you already have an opinion and a verdict which for historical studies is not a good thing as you're posting in a public platform it should be as it is not bending and twisting as it can misled people who are not so aware of this controversy, can you please also mention the sources of your information without the sources anyone can say anything as this thing is quite famous and clear you can find everything for this one
The physical image of Orgen Trinley Dorjee is exactly same to same with previous Karma Rinpoche so there is no doubt he would be a real reincarnate of Previous Karmapa
What a sad thing that happened to these 2 young Karmapa reincarnation. It should never had happened in this way. There are many revered Rinpoches who have many reincarnations like: mind, body etc and such system never caused any schism…. Hopefully the both Karmapas will overcome the schism of their supporters and unite for the benefit of all sentient beings …..
if one looks at the photographs of the former Karmapa and the HH Ogyen Trinley Dorje there's no doubt he's the reincarnation of the 16th Karmapa...from childhood to teens to adulthood they look so simlar..and what's more he has the dynamism and charismatic personality of a Karmapa.. ua-cam.com/video/to5WkEJw9e0/v-deo.html
His Holiness 14th Dalai lama, not the 17th Dalai lama. Maybe slip of the tongue you said 17th Dalai lama, and I accepted that. But other people will think in other ways. If you can correct it that would be better. 🙏🙏🙏thank you for your wonderful message sir.
Real Karmappa photo is placed inside the Rumtek monastery. It section of Indian intelligence who has posed hindrances by opposing the real one. Unnecessarily kept the Karmapa under detention and not letting him visit his monastery Rumtek.
There is no doubt that Orgen thrinlay Dorjee is the Karmapa declared and recognised by HH the Dalai Lama, the spiritual head of Tibet and also by all eminent lamas.
And also got official recognize from Beijing central government
True . We believe Ogyen Thinley dorjee because he was recognised by HH 14th Dalai Lama .
Recognised by Shamar Rinpoche who is the one with that responsability.
@@traceler 😅🤣😂😆 r u joking me who is shemar rinpochey my ligpa😆😆
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big position has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different ❤❤❤❤❤
Long live Karmapa Thinley Thaye Dorji
if one meets Thaye Trinley Dorje, one has no doubts any more who the Karmapa is. It is that simple. Karmapa chenno
His Holiness The 16th Karmapa’s hat has a dark blue color. Long live His Holiness the 17th Karmapa Ogyen Thrinley Dorje.
We tibetan are ok with both as both Carrie's dharma.
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
For me the two are karmapa.. Because their teaching is about wisdom... Because it's important that what kind of teaching they r giving us who is it's doesn't matter... The way of buddha teaching is important ❤..
my man , gets it,, well done,,, that is 100% correct yes.
Bro I would suggest you to do more research or study of these topic cause this is not a small thing for us Tibetan.. many of your information are not up on the point..
I follow both H. H. Gyalwa Karmapa 💐🙏🏿🌸🙏🌺🙏🏻🌹🙏🎁🙏🏻💐🙏🏽🌸🙏🏻🎁🙏💐🙏🏽💐
Beside my personal appreciation of his Holiness the 14. Dalai Lama from a distance it seemes obvious, that since the 1960s the tibetan government had the plan to unify the 4 main sects of tibetan Buddhism under Gelug leadership, which culminated in the death of Gungthang Tsultrim and didnt succeed mainly because of the resistance of the 16. Karmapa. I think a prerequisite for this plan was the banning of the sectarian wordly spirit dorje shugden. The paranirvana of the 16. Karmapa brought a second chance for expanding the dominance of the gelug sect by recognising and binding Orgyen Trinley Dorje, which also in the end didnt work well. Orgyen Trinley Dorje, who might be an Tulku, is clearly brought in the wrong position by the means of tibetan politics. The rivalry of the Gelug and Karma Kagyü sect has a long tradition, already after the paranirvana of the 15 th Karmapa, the 13 th Dalai Lama propagated a wrong candidate for the rebirth of the 16. Karmapa.
I really missed his holiness samar Rinpochela, I iam one of the greatest devote of his holiness..I miss his holiness smile and there was so much of positivity in his holiness ❤❤❤❤😢
me too, he was a great bodhisattva! btw -i hope you've seen the joint statement! Shamar's 15th incarnation will be recognized soon and our lineage will heal!
Long life HH Gyelwang Karmapa Ugyen Thinley Dorjee
You have obviously a tendency in your Posting. Sad. Karmapa is NOT about "power" His activity is about WISDOM and COMPASSION.
Ya but he got the point bcz there can't be fake guru or lama
exactly
@@tenzintsephel713❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤3
17 Karmapa Urgen thinley dorjee long live 🙏🙏🙏
Long Live H.H.17th The Gyalwang Karmapa Urgen Thinley Dorjee Rinpo Chey…🙏🙏🙏🌹🌹🌹
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
If you read 10th Karmapa's biography, he met multiple Karmapa's, his own rebecoming (reincarnation is the wrong word), and few of them recognize each other. Therefore both of them are Karmapas. Be informed about Buddhist concept of Nirmanakaya, before you making controversial videos.
I believe in both karmpas 🙏✨ lets say mind & speech.
It doesn't matter who is real or not as long as they're carrying dharma activities in order to benefit all beings. 🙏✨
I AM TIBETAN .N I AGREE WITH YOU.
Sure
The 16th Karmapa is my root Guru. I have always said that the true Karmapa candidate will be determined by their Buddha activities.
OTD whose, non dharmic behaviors
has spoken like a loud all pervasive, lions roar. You can be trained and pretend to be the 17th Karmapa, even look like a one, but if you behave like a spoiled millionaire,, money drunk, " king" who breaks every samaya vow, that is certainly not the 17th Karmapa. Karmapa would not have to 7 million plus $ and that's just we kniw
ua-cam.com/video/CA6QFN8Lzz0/v-deo.html
Thats interesting the money aspect if sharing then thats a good thing isnt it its only if its stacked and not spent on the things that is needed in His community or who ever can benefit from His generous nature ❤😂who knows what the purposes are a small mind is stuck believe me Iam talking from experience so lets all jump outside the box hey ?. ? And widen our perspective HURAY !,! OMMANIPADMEHUM x3 ❤️❤️❤️🌈🌈🌈☔️☔️☔️🙏🙏🙏🌹☸️☮️💟🛐🇳🇿🇮🇩🇺🇦🥰🙏🙏🙏
Of course, no doubt. His Holiness The Gyalwang Ogyen Thinley Dorjee. ❤
It is Shamar Rinpoche responsability to identify reincarnation.
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different ❤❤❤❤
ua-cam.com/video/CA6QFN8Lzz0/v-deo.html
you think there is a come back from rape. fathering a child from rape and made KTD pay over 10 million $.
There s no coming back for OTD.
Ges on the for sex abuse and was on the lam from India for tax evasion. He's a fake..
@@traceler have you watched H.H ogyen thinley dorjee’s documentary.? There Dalai Lama has clearly said that he saw a dream about where Karmapa was born and that happens to be the place where Tibetan karmapa, oygen thinley dorjee was born , and situ rinpoche who was very closed to 16th Karmapa identified the reincarnation but ofc I believe in both. Long live the karmapas
Long live His Holiness the 17th karmapa Thinley theye dorjee
ua-cam.com/video/CA6QFN8Lzz0/v-deo.html
Whoever the Karmapa is, we should not judge or compare. We must not identify us self with anyone of them. Our nature is to love and spread more love. Even in Buddhism there are fight, ego, anger, ignorance and all the negative emotions. These negative (claiming power and authority) things should not happen if we are practicing Buddhism
I mean if both of them could guide beings than that is good for us ; and if one of them can prove to be effective then it is good too. But the problem is they fail to lead beings to better place . Now the title karmapa comes with lots of history and responsibility; and I hope they both can upheld that legacy . As a Tibetan, I will always go by the recognition of HH the Dalai Lama and that does not mean other one should be denigrated. I pray both succeed the legacy .
I think you’re right after all , there must be a reason for 2 karmapa
Everyone has their own devotion, don't conclude here saying who is real and who is fake... Go through Shamar Rinpoche's interview once. Karmapa's controversy is far more deep which we humen have not that abilities to understand.
Karmapa khenno, may the Karmapa lineage live forever🙏🙏🙏
Ugen Thinlay always mention Rumtek ...
We Sikkimise believe that he is the one who is real Karmapa ....
Even crown is in Rumtek..
The pine plant which is planted in Rumtek by H.H Karmapa was still alive it was planted in Cemented floor...
Never seen the video on this topic before......nicely done..... only few things need to be corrected. The oldest schools / lineages are Nyingma, Sakya, Kagyu and Gelug. Tai Situpa Rinpoche is 70 years old. People should also watch about Jamgon Kongtrul Rinpoche's previous life will get to know more about Karmapa Orgyen Thrinle Dorje. He knows everything even in his very young age in Tibet. He helped in the search of Jamgon Kongtrul reincarnation lama. I've heard the 16th Karmapa flying hat story but never heard of rainbow body......Indeed, He is very powerful. 🙏
Please bring more videos related to the 16th Karmapa.
Karmapa Chenno 🙏🙏🙏🌷🌷🌷☸️🕉️
Thaye,Dorje, is a good father, and a good husband, but- -, -
Every one should follow that Karmapa he trusts most.
In my case this is Karmapa Thaye Dordje.
If someone trusts Orgyen Thrinlay more he should follow him.
But I think Thaye Dordje is more convincing. He gave back his monk vovs and married.
Orgyen thrinlay had a sexulal relationship with a nun and is going on like business as usual. That is no good exampel in a word where sexual relationsships should base on trust an emazipation.
Ugen Thinlay Dorjee is the real KARMAPA who is recognized by His Holiness The 14th DALAI LAMA 🙏 ❤
True
True ugen thinley dorjee is the real 17 th kàrmapa🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻
Thanks you so much good information lord Buddha🙏🏻
Then why community and disciples doesn't follow the HH trulsikh Rinpoche yangsi who was recognize by hh the dalai lama and they follow another HH trulsikh Rinpoche who was recognize by hh drodrupchen Rinpoche...
Stop this kind controversy about karmapa...both are genuine karmapa we have to follow both karmapa...
Really? How do you clarify that unknown things.
Why didn't you mention that prediction letter was proved forgered, fake.. The hand writing on the letter was matching with situ Rinpoche...
Evidence please.
@@tashitshering703 pls send me your adress I'll send you books with full of evidence on this topic.... But pls when you upload on such high level topic which has been deeply connected with people's believes and faith, pls give your time on research.. Pls don't upload whatever comes on your mind or what you think is right... Don't accumulate bad karma🙏
Tashi delek thanks 🙏 story very important I am very longtime thing story and words good tibetan story right ✅ 100 percent right 🙏💟I love indian support
Long live H.H the Ugyen Trinley Dorjee 🙏🙏🙏💐💐💐💐🙏🙏🙏Karmapa Khenno 🙏🙏🙏
When a reincarnated lama is confirmed by the Chinese government, its good sign that this is not the true reincarnation. And why do you all forget that Urgen said him self that he is not the real Karmapa, and that he is very happy that he manage to share his thought with before 14th Shamapra's death. And now all the stories about Orgen's lovers and the babies he made with them - one can see he is truly not happy and he wants different life.
Did you make the video about karmapa’s rainbow body photo?
His Holiness the 17th karmapa ugen thinley dorje right 🙏🙏🙏🌺
UTD real karmapa🙏🙏🙏
What happened with other Karmapa?
Traleg Rinpoche points out that the test of a spiritual practice is whether it is beneficial, not which religion it is associated with. Applying this to the Karmapa issue means that as long as both are benefitting human beings the issue of which is the true one is less important- that said Ogyen Trinley Dorje is the true Karmapa and this becomes obvious if you meet him.
@luckylongshotz
Have you personally met both?
Karmapa invented the tulku system. The system likes it because they can control the future leader from the very young age. It will always create controversies. I just pray that the leaders can see it and dare to change. For the sake of Buddhadharma.
Orgen trinlay Dorjee is the only Karmapa. He has the great power I myself experienced. Whatever people whispering, I believe in him. My Guruji is Tai Situ Pa and he has the power of knowing the correct Karmapa. I am following Vajrayana Buddhism since 30 years and believe in only Orgen Trinlay Dorjee who resembles so much to previous 16 Karmapa. Don’t confuse people. I don’t think you are Tibetan must be Indian who is trying to sell his little rough reading. Vancouver BC
What did it happen at the moment we have both 17th Karmapa? Do they excommunicate each other?
But karma thayea Dorjee married and have child, at the same time wearing monks clothe , This is not allowed. in Buddhism.
The Buddha said, "Be a lamp unto yourself." That means we each must find our own way by our own practice. Whether someone else is a tulku or not should not change our practice. May all beings find happiness and liberation.
The BEST comment thus far. Decades ago I was obsessed with fact finding of who is most likley to be the real Karmapa. But nowadays it dawns on me that whoever sincerely and consistently practice is a Bodhisattva. Peace be with all!
Problem of Tibetan Rinpoche lies with egoism of high lama. It would dissolve with the presence of Dalai Lama I agree with what Dalai Lama advice and instruct. Game of this Lamaism is still exist in this modernised world I need a true enlightened lama rather than the game of of democracy party.
Since when does the Dalai Lama determine who is a Karmapa?!
There are two Karmapas.
One is for the Chinese and those who trust them.
The other is for the others.
Very well said.
Why not better go meditate and do your practice instead of discussions. Karmapa lineage and the Kagyu school is too precious for that.
There is only one Karmapa and that is Ujyen Thinley Dorjee who was recognized by HH Dalai Lama, Tai Situ Rinpoche and all the High Lama’s of Tibetan Buddhism . Other boy was only recognized by one man shamar and his few followers and few foreigners who really don’t understand the true importance of your master. In Tibetan Buddhism there’s four major schoolsNyingma Gelugpa Kagyu and Sakyapa all the high Lamas from these schools only accept HH Urgyen Thinley Dorjee, even after all these explanations if you have any doubts then may god help you …Love & Peace 🙏🌷🌷🌷🙏
but if we examine their activities thaye dorjay's activities looks a great buddhisatvas activity.
who are you actully to deside who is real HH karmapa. Who are you ????
And also the importance of recognize by central government Beijing
@@jackytang3683 we normol people cant jugde who is real HH respect both is good thing
tashi maeda where are from?
Very powerful ungainly dorjee🙏🏼
Can someone please share me chants on background
Dalai lama has never ever recognised any karmapa in history... Pls research thoroughly before posting anything ...
You are soso wrong.....Pls get full and proper knowledge before posting anything in social media ...
Namo Buddhay. There's was a movie...A Rinpoche was incarcerated into 3 persons... Hence, Karmapa Khenno maybe reincarnated into 2 persons. Both are doing great in Buddha's teachings. Compassion, kindness, helpful loving....etc.. I respect Both Karmapa Khenno.🙏🙏🙏
Well said me also🙌🏻
Because it happened in a movie it happened in real life?
@@joeblack363 who knows. Many Buddhas n Bodhisattvas reform into many forms too🙏🙏🙏
You cannot judge the book by it's cover...but I respect your faith in both.🙏🙏
This is silly.
1. Respectfully...
HH the 14th Dalai Lama (peace and long life to him ♥) is not the leader of Karma Kagyud.
HH has NO SAY in Karma Kagyud lineage.
The Dai Lama's own lineage is inferior and younger then the Karma Kagyud.
2. KK embraces dual eminations.
If you believe in and understand Tibetan KK reincarnation (which the Chinese occupiers and rulers of Tibet do NOT being atheist) there is no difficulty in 2 simultaneous Tulku eminations.
Buddha's incarnate out of time. 🕒
There is no difficulty for a Buddha nor Bodhisatva to occupy two bodies.
Many precedents in almost every Buddhist school including Karma Kagyud.
H.H Gyelwang Karmapa Kheno@🙏🙏🙏 I believe in both "KU SUNG THUG"
17th Karmapa is Ugen Tenley Dorjee. 🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
I don´t know who really brought up that myth, that the dalai lama would be the spiritual leader of all tibetan buddhists.
who claimes something like that has zero knoledge about the meaning and order of the 3 teachingcycles of buddha shakyamuni and the 4 main lineages of tibetan buddhism.
the dalai lama might be some kind of political leader of a destroyed nation, that is spread around the world, but mainly genozided by china.
he´s also the spiritual leader of the gelugpa school, which is by far the youngest of all 4.
gelugs focus mainly on the 1st and 2nd teachingcycle of buddha.
the main focuspoint of karmapas kagyü lineage is the 3rd cycle. vajrayana.
how should the gelug-chief be able to judge about something like that?
and such has never ever happened in the history of the 4 schools before.
they allways find their top tulkus theirselves.
again:
there is no leading role or function of the dalai lama!!!
and tai situs claims about the letter that could never be investigated because it was to holy and finally lost.
the attempt of china to install their bought or frightened candidates to control the minds of the annexed tibetans have to be seen and understood.
and yes, tibet was never a part of china. check the history.
but a lot of chinese and even westeners believe that because they heard it often enough.
last not least...
the in the beginning cinese-installed candidate urgyen trinley escaped from the chinese control and tried to go on as karmapa for a couple of years.
untill he finally gave up and said that he is not the karmapa.
but the dalai lama is still right, right? haha
If you read the short biography of the first Karmapa, Dusum Khyenpa, contained in the Blue Annals (དེབ་ཐེར་སྔོན་པོ་, ) - written by Gö Lotsawa Shyönnu Pal (1392-1481), it clearly states that Karmapa is one of the Buddhas of the fortunate aeon (བསྐལ་པ་བཟང་པོ) and that noone, not even a 10th level Bodhisattva, can tell how many emanations he has.
For you he is the H.H 17th and for me other one is the 17th H.H. So you can do your way without disturbing me and I will do my way without disturbing anybody. Winner winner but no chicken dinner as we both are follower of karmapa.
🙏
Ogyen Trinley Dorje chenno🙏🙏🙏🌼🍎🍎💐💐💐
Who is the karmapa at last
Karmapa thinly thaye Dorje is real no doubt 🙏
Wrong
which one looks like K16? That should clear your politics
This is definitely a dual incarnation, Karmapa reincarnated in 2 bodies , this is understandable because of Tibetan and chinese politics , i have had the good fortune to meet with Orgyen Thrinley Dorjee twice, was a good experience. 🙏
Soul can't divide
There is no soul involved here.
🤔
This comment reflects a lack of understanding of reincarnation in the Karma Kagyud tradition.
@@anshul0961, Buddha's are not bound by linear passage of time as perceived by our skandas.
If you believe in KK, you believe in dual incarnations.
Many precedents for them in KK.
He,has not shown any miracles, Ugyen Durje, has shown, ..This, narration has no base, very poor narration,
Tenlay Dorje miracle are
Countless,. Your narration is very very. Poor.
Nothings more than, only by God H.H the 14h DALAI Lama recognised thats Karmapa.
Kap chu chee gyalwa karmapa kheno. 🙏🙏🙏🌹🌹🌹🙏🙏🙏
Who is karmapa?
Long live H.H 17th Karmapa Thaye Dorje...Recognised by the head of Kagyu lineage, 14th Shamar rinpoche, as we all know Karmapas and Shamarpas through centuries considered as one.Urgen trinley is a fake karmapa recognised officialy by chinese goverment.Dalai lama as head of gelugs lineage has no any spiritual authority to confirm who is the real recarnation for the head of kagyu lineage.
We respect both karmapa. It's up to you to whom you worship.
I truly appreciate your golden pov!!! I agree with you too .
As a Naepali Buddhist both are H H karmappa do not compare ❤
This is not something for you to make UA-cam content entitled “who is the real karmapa”. Instead of buddha’s footsteps and teachings, people are out here advocating for their own lineage’s 🙏🏼
After the conflict in Rumtek monastery most of the senior monks around 150 monks supported Shamarpa and came along with him just few few monks left behind.... Pls study hard before posting anything wrong information 🙏
There is only 1 Karmapa, before now n forever. Other one is a pariah just like the one who recognised him but died early due to his karma n for misguiding followers
You should get knowledge before posting the video. Without evidence and authentication you can't be declared it.
100 💯 persent true.. useless reported
Hi ❤well iam really nobody to say anything about this situation but one day i was in singapore in a darma shop and i saw a picture of Orgen Trinley Dorge and i got such a surprise because i mustv had some kind of connection with the last karmapa I recognised Him as the 17 th karmapa I dont know how I knew i just did anyway after that people told me about the other karmapa and i allways thought that and the rumours at the time was that this second one was a setup by the chinese but then one of my Lamas suggested that because of the power of the Last karmapa this Lama said it was more than possible that the 16 th karmapa couldv easily have the two incarnations and having different functions to serve humanity and I feel this Lama Is right and I think HHDLL might be in agreance with that although don’t quote me on that because I might be wrong Iam sure HHDLL has his own thoughts and opinions on that ( its just an suggestion and a thought theres nothing to say that the Last Karmapa wasnt capable of that In my opinion and feeling more than Likely there shouldnt be any contreversy about that we shoulld all embrace both these great beings ❤but then who am I to say like I said iam a nobody to take any notice of but its something to think about if your interested in this matter whatever both are recocnized by the highest Lamas in existence so who could actually challenge that I think its a incredible opportunity to see thegreat compassionate nature of this great being ❤with no contreversy or arguments get past the mind games and just watch the wonders of the universal Love for all sentient beings ❤😂☮️☮️☮️💟💟💟🛐🛐🛐🕉️🕉️🕉️☸️☸️☸️💝🌈🌈🌈☔️☔️☔️🇳🇿🇳🇿🇮🇩🇮🇩🇺🇦🇺🇦🌹🍀😍🌺🌼🌸🥰💐🌷🌎🌏🌍😇☸️☸️☸️🙏🙏🙏🌹🌹🌹🌷🌷🌷😍😍😍💝😇
what about Yung Drung Bon lineage they are also Buddhist
There was a letter that was not scrutinized or authenticated by experts because Tai Situ did not allowed it, that would have solve the issue once and for all... I think Tai Situ was scare of testing the legitimacy of that letter because bringing experts to use science with respect has nothing bad about that... even HH Dalai Lama was open to use science to authenticated the bones of the Buddha and using fMRI to see the working brains of mediators ( even the Catholic Church allowed science to test the Holy Shroud of Christ) so checking if the letter was actually handwritten by HH the 16 Karmapa or was a counterfeit was the right thing to do but Tai situ say " it is too Holy" so it is Holier than the remains of the Buddha or the Shroud of Christ? Cm on! If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear from science that after all is looking for the truth. and the truth does not harm if you are in the right path.
A 'no' is also an answer.
Tai Situpa is an expert. There is nothing 'anti science' about it. Scientists can also have an opinion, but no proof. Whose opinion is worth more regarding the rebirth of the Karmapa? His inner circle of Golden Rosary or a scientist who is not Buddhist and doesn't believe in rebirth?
Don’t try to insult my Guru Tai Situ Pa. Whatever he has declared is correct. I myself had great experience with him and Ogyen Trinlay Dorjee. Remember insulting a high Guru is sin, remember it. Vancouver bc
Better to judge the real Karmapa is on their action. Buddhist Monk never keep the wife and child with their buddhist Monk dress. Once the monk or lama or rinpoche fall in sexual activity is not so long Rabhjung. So better to wear lay man dress and keep the wife and children and can give the teaching if having a capacity of buddhism knowlegde. 🤔🤔🤔😏😏😏
Not true 10 and 13th Karmapas had a wife or consort. Read history before commenting. Every Buddhist master who undergoes tantric training has to take up a consort, most of them do it in a secret and Gelugs takes a wisdom consort or yeshe in chag gya, that doesn't mean all other schools follow the same thing. Plus the monk vow says sexual misconduct is not allowed, this is why even Gelongs after taking up tantric consort doesn't fall from the vow as it is not considered a sexual misconduct. As far as my knowledge goes. So stop judging. Respect everyone, I hope you remember the dog tooth story. I sometimes feel weird about Tibetan Lamas they will on one hand stay the dog story but on the other hand leave no stone unturned to vile another and this is DHARMA
Go back to some dalai lama incarnation married སྐུ ་ཕྲེང་...when dalai lama female incarnation in future, can you reject
We should analyse more about Buddhist not only one part..I think so...without analyse will create misunderstand ...dilgo khentse rinpoche was married and dalai lama get most of empowerment from khentse rinpoche why???? Dalai lama said about khentse rinpoche UA-cam
I accept ngyingma gayluk kargue sakya all...
His holiness the 17th karmapa ugen thinley dorjee 🙏🙏🙏🙏
Karmapa Thenley thaye dorje had recognise by 16 th karmapa last latter.. But urgen renpoche is just tulku and he himself expose his own identity and now tibetan big polititon has stopped him to talk in English.. But karmapa thenley thaye dorje had no thing to prove himself karmapa because his holiness is as same as 16karmapa and no different
His Holiness the 14th Dalai lama recognise is the real one and Mepham Rinpoche son is the Lingauge Rinpoche
Chabsuchee,,,,, karmapa,,,,,,ugen trinlay dorjee,,,,,
🙏💐🙏 Everywhere there were negetive and positive energy.....world even form by negetive and positive,thats why this is the example for the world,but negetive always lose,,,, right,,,,, ancient buddha was born and devdat was also born,is this the same case right .....no matter,we must prey heartly,worthfully to our real one.....thats the matter.....its my only views.....thank you.....karmapa khennoo from my heart....🙏💐🙏
Tulku issue is hectic and confusing once the there comes different claimers. However, to find the pure gold depends on how we investigate upon. Unlike the Thaye Dorjee born in Bhutan, whose father was self proclaimed re-incarnation of Jumipham and his younger brother was also a reincarnation of one Lama, but local people who knows the father of Thaye Dorjee, don’t agree him as reincarnation of Jumipham Rinpochey, a very famous Nyingmapa master. By looking upon all these Tulku making claiming & proclaiming tactics, it’s unfortunate that it is misused.
Karmapa Ogyen Thrinley Dorjee was born in a simple nomad parents, whose parents were pious Buddhist practitioners, before and after the birth of Karmapa in Kham Lhadhok, many good signs had been seen. Which proves Ogyen Thrinley Dorjee to be a real Karmapa, like his previous predecessors, Ogyen Thrinley Dorjee is very good arts, specially in thanks paintings, this truly shows his authenticity. However, It is truly unfortunate to see these title claimers of Karmapa, who doesn’t walk the path shown by Buddha from home to to homelessness???
Long live both Karmapa 🙏🏻
HALLELUJAH
Both are real human beings .nothing others ..
I think there is other two lamas one from Sikkim and another from Algarah,kalimpong also claiming for Karmapha.
😂😂😂
Perhaps it is neither one of them. It would naturally be quite common that others, no matter how profound the teachings may be, are not going to be able to locate the reincarnated memories within the hidden variables of manifested chaos, regardless of the shared information of universal consciousness between lives. Just because the Dalai Lama recognizes someone as this or that does not mean they are right. In fact the odds are extremely high that the line of Dalai Lama's, Karmapas, or Panchen Lama's have been broken numerous times in the past. This however does not invalidate the profound teachings of dharma; on the contrary dharma still spreads and dharma as we know it on this planet is but a tiny drop of water in a vast ocean veiled within our concept of time. I know this from experience and what I know from experience can not be shared directly in this manifested form but the information is encoded within the universe and entangled with the symetry between time, timelessness and cyclical universe creation because a symbiotic relationship between all these are necessary.
Cool story, bro.
I think Buddhist should be more happy that there is two Karbala. We have one more guru and one more choice. Long live both Karmapa rinpoche and flourish their teaching.
There are 10 levels of bodhisattva which is call ma dak sa dun & dakpa sa sum one who complete all these then we can say enlighten one so its very important to choose right master who already enlighten one so to know which is right master in buddha darma said we should analysis for 10 years
So its showing choosing master is very important
the great master tulku Urgyen Rinpoche whos also the father of Mingyur Rinpoche and also the guru of 16th karmapa told that one should respect both of them or you can venerate both of them equally and also my personal opinion that whatever they teach its the Buddhas teaching wats more relevant is if we follow the teachings without our own bending and twisting it and as for the great black hat ceremony and all i think maybe its because of our karma in this degenerate age that we are not being allowed the golden fortune karmapa khenno
Both the karma are guiding us but ogyen trinley Dorjee is our real karmapa as well as we have huge respected fir him. We donot need married lama like Thaye dorjee.
brother alot of facts are not mentioned at all what about the letter that was found and Shamar Rinpoche agreeing to it at first and also tsurpu is in tibet but you should mention that it has been the main seat of karmapas since the beginning of karamaps why is such an important high lama like Jamgon kongtrul not mentioned his death and gyaltsap Rinpoche the reagents of 16th karmapa their opinions at first many2 things are not in order it feels almost like a biased representation although your intentions may not be so it almost feels like you already have an opinion and a verdict which for historical studies is not a good thing as you're posting in a public platform it should be as it is not bending and twisting as it can misled people who are not so aware of this controversy, can you please also mention the sources of your information without the sources anyone can say anything as this thing is quite famous and clear you can find everything for this one
I believe both ❤
The face structure of Ugen Trinley Dorjee and 16th Karmapa young face are very much similar which make us believe the real one
The physical image of Orgen Trinley Dorjee is exactly same to same with previous Karma Rinpoche so there is no doubt he would be a real reincarnate of Previous Karmapa
Both are great lama we accept both as our karmapa lama
His Holiness The Gyalwang Ogyen Thinley Dorjee. ❤。 we only have one Karmapa . i really dont know the other one.
What a sad thing that happened to these 2 young Karmapa reincarnation. It should never had happened in this way. There are many revered Rinpoches who have many reincarnations like: mind, body etc and such system never caused any schism….
Hopefully the both Karmapas will overcome the schism of their supporters and unite for the benefit of all sentient beings …..
Urgen trinley dorjee 🙏🙏🙏🌺🌺🌺🙏🙏🙏
Whoever serve people is the real one.
Karmapa chenno karmapa chenno karmapa chenno
I am still confused after watching this entire video. Who is the real Karmapa? Can't there be more than one?
It has never happened before but for my now. Both Thaye Dorjee and Thrinley Dorjee are looked upon as the 17th Karmappa.
Why not thr can be hundred karmapa
@@cshering11 I am also karmapa
The one with the evil face is a fake one.
@@soprotivleniye7620 who evil ?
if one looks at the photographs of the former Karmapa and the HH Ogyen Trinley Dorje there's no doubt he's the reincarnation of the 16th Karmapa...from childhood to teens to adulthood they look so simlar..and what's more he has the dynamism and charismatic personality of a Karmapa..
ua-cam.com/video/to5WkEJw9e0/v-deo.html
Good observation
I must say Karna Kagye sect is enriched with two Karnapa.
I wish there is ten Dalai Lama and hundred Sakya and thousand Kagyue Lamas!
If u don't know then please don't speak in this type news...u can make vedio in other types vedio..🙏🙏🙏my request
His Holiness 14th Dalai lama, not the 17th Dalai lama. Maybe slip of the tongue you said 17th Dalai lama, and I accepted that. But other people will think in other ways. If you can correct it that would be better. 🙏🙏🙏thank you for your wonderful message sir.
Real Karmappa photo is placed inside the Rumtek monastery. It section of Indian intelligence who has posed hindrances by opposing the real one. Unnecessarily kept the Karmapa under detention and not letting him visit his monastery Rumtek.