Heat shrinking using a blowlamp panel beating Tips and Tricks #4
Вставка
- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- If you feel that you would like to help support Trev’s Blog channel please consider making a donation, money raised from donations will be used to buy tools and equipment to help produce new videos. Click on this PayPal to make a donation www.paypal.me/...
xtremeplasma.e...
Please feel free to contact me (Trevor Hatton). auto-shaper@mail.com
Visit my website auto-shaper.com/
Please check out the music by Messer Chups by clicking on the link below
messer-chups.b...
More Very High Quality from a Professional.
Thanks for sharing !
I really appreciate your work to show how the light shows the high and low spots. Not easy to see on the camera but easy to understand. It is obvious you take a lot of effort in your filming, thank you.
Great work
Please tell us you kept those patina panels as is!!!
I expected a different mode of operation here, I expected you to heat the spot up until it was glowing red, then let it cool. That would have caused the metal to shrink to a smaller state than it was in before, pulling the metal in from all sides.
Right at the start of the video there is a basic explanation that this video was made to help out a viewer that didn’t have proper panel beating equipment and only had a blow lamp to use as a heat source. You were right in what you were saying about the metal pulling in from both sides. The blowlamp has too large a flame to be specifically suited to heat shrinking however virtually any heat source will do because you are causing expansion of the steel in a targeted area that puts tension in the panel that would otherwise pop in and out “oil canning” when the area is hammered this produces lateral compression forcing the metal together creating a heat shrink affect. A better flame would be from an oxygen and acetylene welding torch with a number two tip this would result in a far smaller hotter flame keeping the heat focused in one area and for a very short amount of time, The cool steel around the heated area would produce a an expansion block forcing the heated area to increase in thickness thus creating shrink when the metal has cooled. Cheers Trev 👍
@@trevsblog Thanks for the answer, I have no experience with working sheet metal so I wasn't sure what to expect but I'd heard of flame straightening like I mentioned. Is this technique used any in this business? I've wondered if a TIG torch might work as well as an O/A torch.
It seems more complicated than it is. Because bodywork typically doesn’t stay uniform when you hammer it or heat it etc it seems like it has a mind of its own, this is because it’s relatively thin and there are normally a lot of complex shapes going on in bodywork that have an enormous effect on buckling etc. It’s no different to flame straitening as described in my last message, and the added blow with a hammer places lateral compression to increase the shrinking effect. As said any heat source will work, ideally smaller the better but you can use friction, a hot iron, TIG, I have even used a hot air gun. Cheers Trev 👍
Back in 77, (old school), I was taught how to remove stretched spots, (high Spots), in fender panels with only a rosebud tip to heat with, and a wet rag to quench with. I could literally hear the panel pop back into place while doing so. Its a bit of artwork to achieve and does take practice but in most cases, I did not need to hammer at all. I actually became quite good at doing so in under a day. I simply heated and quenched strategically. Its all about understanding what caused the stretch and where to heat to remove it. Small circular dents were easy. The skillful part was removing an oval or even curved stretch.
As for the hammering, I was also taught to angle my hammer taps with strokes going inward towards the center of the high spot, from all angles around the high spot, not to hammer directly downward on the high spot.
Dave Boling Do you have a video of your technique?
I really like Trev's 'flavor'. He has a mellow approach to his work, and you can see that his perception just gets right in there and he always knows how things are going. I am not at his level, but i strive for just such a focused approach where you keep correcting it until it is pretty dialed in.
thats the way I leaned about 40 years ago. But sometimes I use a shrinking hammer
A 13:00 you admit that shrinking went too far and is now a low spot. Then you find a new oilcan. This is where you use the hammer to bring the low spot up, hopefully pulling on the oilcan and eliminating it
I've just recently been introduced to your channel and I'm delighted to be enlightened by your knowledge. You have a great teaching style, patience in both your work and explanations. Thank you for taking the time to do this 👍🏻
sorry Trev, I love your work- But a compulsory 6 minute advert on "supply chain transformation using AI" just killed it. - from another content creator
Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I’ve noticed that UA-cam have changed the way ads are applied to videos and I would never willingly push anyone through a six minute video. I’m looking into changing the ads applied but to do this I have to change the way the ads are applied for the lifetime of the video! Once I change things I cannot go back on my decision, so I’m going to do some research. I’d prefer all ads to be skippable 👍
Ha Ha. I was wondering what a blowlamp was. Its a propane torch! Ha Ha excellent! Great vid as always Trev. From across the pond here in California.
Saludos de Peru, espero ganar algo algun dia. Excelentes Videos
the worst thing that happens is when the damage transfers to a spot behind a support in the panel that you cannot get your hands behind to straighten. that is the worst luck. Had that happen many many times
Great video 👍 hope all young beaters will find it very helpful like myself. You can't find those informations on the spotter datasheet 😂 Some people like you had to spend years to learn this the hardest way we have it on the plate. Hope will be much appreciated. Regards Mike
Definitely love the DIY tools. Much better than hundreds of dollars in less effective name brands.
As a request, I would like to see a cut-out and patch welded in. I've seen others on youtube but I would like to see how you do it just cause you seem to explain the processes better. Thank you for your efforts they really are helpful.
Nevermind on that request I just saw Old School Gas welding video. Very helpful. Go figure as soon as I comment, the next video I watch is what I needed.
Hi Trev, nice video again, as usual :)
However it raised some questions that I would ask the teacher if I would stand next to him in the room. UA-cam is not the best medium for Q&A, but anyway...
You basically turned a highspot into a lowspot here, metal being stretched up in the beginning and being stretched down at the end of the job. Am I right that the end result still is a stretched area, only the other way up (down)? Did you hammer it a bit too hard then?
And then you state something interesting about a low spot being (relatively) easy to solve, versus a highspot being very annoying. But they basically are the same, or? Just flip the pannel and a highspot turns into a lowspot. How come you can bring up a low spot with hammer and dolly, but a hightspot not down? Where does my reasoning go wrong...?
I will purchase one of these stainless discs to be used on the disc-grinder to apply heat to highspots, one of these days. Did you ever work with those?
And what's you opinion on shrinking, only by cooling the hotspot down rapidly, without hammering?
ua-cam.com/video/FGMUEXGiySA/v-deo.html and www.vocor.nl/krimpschijf-shrinking-disk/1847-krimpschijf-shrinking-disk-125mm.html
thx, cheers from Holland!
Dutch Classic Exhausts if someone asks this question they are truly asking a great question because it means that they are really trying to understand something that on the face of it seems straight forward. Most car panels are convex, if you have a high spot in a convex panel it means that it is stretched and needs to be shrunk normally by means of heat shrinking which is a harder operation compared to a low spot that needs stretching. I hope we’re agreed upon that. If you now flip the panel over, the panel is now concave and the reverse applies a high spot in a concave panel needs to be stretched not shrunk. If you shrink a high spot on a concave panel it becomes higher. If you ponder this for a while it answers many questions about the nature of high and low spots. The most controllable tool I have personally used for heat shrinking is my dent puller with the heat shrinking attachment. Cheers Trev 👍
@@trevsblog Thanks, Trev, I understand the nature of high and low spots better now. A low spot on a convex pannel is basically shrunk a bit: the metal takes a shorter road from A to B. That was my missing context.
My new tools will come in this week; I will give it a try and see what happens. I already found that the fenders of my Citroën U23 light truck are quite solid steel, 1,5 mm at least. Probably not the best to practice on. Maybe I should practice on my neighbors car first :)
cheers!
The advantage of an oxygen acetylene system is you can make pin shrinks (tiny spots, very localized heat) . A dolly backup might help when you hammer, but that's always been my approach and I don't know everything. Very interesting the way you are doing it. Cheers from Canada !
Ive been a painter for over 20 years...
Now starting to do full frame off restorations...
Ive been hard pressed to find quality craftsmen in my area or in canaduh period..
Ive recently subbed to your channel and your ability is awesome...
I love to learn from talented craftsmen.
Thanks Trev!
Another brilliant video by a great craftsman,. well done Trev,..love your work !
A more concentrated flame, smaller area,40years experience, even heat,even distortion. Love your videos, simplifying things for the diy
I like to use tig welder as my heat source its very very controlled with practice especially on stainless trim from the old cars
I seem to remember my dad who was a sheet metal worker saying you can also take high spots out by using a torch turning the area red and then rapidly cooling the are with a cold wet rag. He also did it the way you showed. Great video many thanks.
The science of what's going on explanation really adds value and appeal. More that. pls.
This is one of very few channels where I learn something and don’t judge say this guy doesn’t know what he is doing. Very good teacher
Top job Mate. I've learned so much from your wealth of knowledge and experience. I have been in paintless dent repair for 25 years and always try to increase my abilities. Thank you.
Thanks for your comment, PDR has always impressed me greatly. Cheers Trev 👍
I watch Trev's videos which all seem to have really tempting titles and intro's. The thing is, I've realised that after watching about ten I'm not actually learning anything! He seems to cover way too much way too scantily and doesn't explain things fully. For example in this one, at 2' 40'' he shows that the panel's 'stretched' by putting a hacksaw blade on it and rocking it. The panel is clearly curved tho' and isn't even sitting flat on the bench!! In a separate video he says all panels have two curves in them and anyway, how does metal stretch and magically get more metal in it? I mean, does anyone else find it annoying or am I just dim-witted!!?
I watched it & think I've learned... now I've got to go out and give it a try myself.
@@billythebake Like I say it could be my own frustrations around metal work & I could just be a bit slow too but I do find it hard to take in all Trev says. He reminds me of another metal working/panel beater guy I once met out in Essex towards the coast.
Great job, I am learning so much from you. Love the Outro music
your a master autoplateworker good video and never understand I my father when me said (making hot here make hot there) and Inot understand it and all this is for expancion an crimping wow Ive learn today a thing bye
Thanks for keeping the art alive Trev! Your a real craftsman!!!
Easiest way to tell a quality tradesman, they make it look easy! Make you think I can do that. Which is exactly what you've done. Having been in the painting/panel industry many years ago I know I can't do this, but I'll find some scrap and try it 👌 awesome work mate, pleasure to watch.
As always fantastic , I couldn’t. Help laughing.....the weld breaks and you knock yourself out with that slide hammer , I wouldn’t want it too happen but thanks for titalating my humour 🥳🥳
Super job Trev! I've got an oil canning patch on a mower cutting deck I've made out of 2mm steel and will give this trick a try this weekend. Cheers!
The finish on the metal is so good would really help with paint finish what files do you use to achieve this as I would like to try and get same finish to my panels
Fascinating watching you shrink that dented panel, very skilful thanks !
I remember my dad trying to explain to me how to shrink high spots and it wasn't getting in. Maybe i'm a bit thick but the way you showed gave me hope. Thanks much, so interesting.
Great video. I was just trying to shrink excess metal from a panel today, but was unsuccessful. It is "tramping" as I call it, but the same thing, it's high to begin with but will flip to a low point if I push it.
A couple of things that will make a difference is that my butane torch does not produce a fine, pointed flame like yours. It makes the heated area twice the size. Plus, I was just quenching it, I wasn't tapping it while it was hot.
I'll be having another go in the morning.
I really enjoyed the video and the way you explain things, so I've subscribed and look forward to any future videos.
Cheers.
Ray Plant by putting the heat into the area you are actually expanding the metal, this expansion causes a lot of tension allowing you to hammer the metal without it popping back in. When you hammer it, it causes the metal to shrink. The quenching isn’t as important as it appears as I’m mostly using this to bring the temperature down so that I can inspect the repair. Cheers Trev 👍
@@trevsblog cheers Trev, I appreciate your response. I'm about to give it another go right now. Thanks.
Hi Trev, just watched your interesting blog on heat shrinking a panel. As a plumber l noticed that you are holding the flame a bit to close to the metal. the hottest part of the flame is the tip of the dark blue cone, the flame is not so effective if the cone impinges on the metal. otherwise a good blog.
I’m looking at an old Dodge a108 Xplorer and anticipate building some rocker repair panels, a door bottom and tackling some dreaded A-pillar rust. Your channel is an inspiration!
When dad did a shrink (oxy acet, so it was faster). He always held a dolly "around" the edge of the shrink as he tapped it. Then he moved the dolly gradually into the shrink to move the metal back to the profile. I was the kid inside the panel holding the dolly when he couldn't reach the spot.😉
Enjoyed that. Looking forward to the compressor drier.
Just fixed the wavy bonnet on my 1960 Falcon using a blow torch and a few basic tools thanks to your blog. Always been into welding, but not panel beating, never thought I be able to shrink. Cheers
Glad to have been of help. Cheers Trev 👍
right - so the shrinkage is caused by he upsetting(blacksmith term) of the material, I always thought it was caused by the rapid cooling of the thin steel! ahuh!
No doubt Trev ,your blog is most informative . THANKYOU again . Good music as well
Amazing work your doing making all these panels very nice work Trev.
Ere Trev, are we shrinking or shinking the metal? different dialects and all, cracking vid though fella, keep up the good work and keep on smiling.
Great video! I needed a close up explanation of this hammer heat technique. Now I can take on some hail damage on my hood. Cheers!
lol hes like the guy in the fast show lmao,must admit you know your stuff.
One trick to do where the crack is still a small hole right at the end of the crack to stop it from going any farther then weld it all up I have seen cracks that were welded before crack again because it was not drilled to stop it ... It like a oil filter that has a dent don't use it the dent will crack from the changing if the motor. Same with the panel with the vibration of the car..
Other that that great job for the tools that you used..
What do you think about shrink discs? I've had a lot of success with them when dealing with stretched metal and I suck at this stuff.
Would you show your metal finishing and the finishing of the panel where you used your door hinge slide hammer MIG welded to the panel. Thank you.
A stud welder would be the best way to pull low spots and avoid making tools from coil springs but downside is cost to buy one😬
that was a neat little dent puller!! im only hoping once i strip back my mini i don't need one aha. but i guess dent is better than rust so maybe it wouldn't be so bad
Amazing knowledge brother!!! Thanks for sharing!!! I Love your channel!👍🏼👍🏼
Good gravy Trev, it works! I found a previous repair last night on the tail panel of my Firebird so I decided to pop the filler out and repair the dent, unfortunately, I pounded the metal a little thin and it had the feel of a pop tin, so this morning I watched your video and tried it and with 2 minutes and 2 tries it was back straight, nice and tight, it worked perfectly. Thanks for the awesome tip! Cheers
I often wonder what a 3000 lb. spot welder looks like.
You need to be the next Dr.Who! Seriously you would be smashing.
Love your work bud👍👍
If only everything in life was as reliable as a wet rag.
It’s not a blog. It’s a vlog! And cars don’t have wings 🤔
Looks like it can oil can is what we call it,thank you Trevor, shrinking metal is an art.
if you were to do that to a panel you couldnt get to the inside of to paint would it be better not to use this method due to the potential of initiating/accelerating rust on the back of the heated area?
I like the plain language, and IMO you're able to avoid the one thing that trips up a lot of experts that teach. You break your process down and cover the critical parts you've been doing so long that it's almost automatic to you.
Good tip for you when welding a pull bar [20:20] run a weld to panel first then weld bar on to weld so after work you do not damage panel when removing bar [often pit marks /holes ]
With the converted spring pick… how do you use it?
Is it just a case of pulling on it?
Or do you hammer down on top of it?
🇦🇺🤜🏼🤛🏼🍀☮️😎
The pick end goes inside the panel and you just pull dents out. The part that you hold in your hand lines up with the pick end so you can easily see where to hold it. Cheers Trev
Brilliant mate. Simply brilliant!
Please Trev, more of heat skrinking. A roof or a bonnet shuld be great.
Ho trev. Thats what I hate. You hit down one high spot. 2 more high spot show up now. And so on
another great video .. i better get on and try your tips on my mini van back doors and see if i can save them ..
Nice 1 Trev! I got a ballache dent right at the balls end of my trials bike tank and that pick tool will do the job just nice.
theravedaddy Hey Thanks 🤩, your comment is very much appreciated. Cheers Trev 👍
had to watch to figure out what a blowlamp was. I was thinking it was light, but I understand that would be a torch? silly brits... lol
gas is a bit low - carries on talking for a minute / haha
Trev beautiful job. The wagon is looking great.
Your videos are very informative would like to see you make a ute tailgate skin.
To better show dents you can use those striped panels that the dentless repair guys are using
Another great video, you explained the shrinking process really well, and your home made tools are fascinating. Thanks for another quality video.
Another mine of information, janner! Love that old weight!
A very helpful video. Many Thanks.
Question.
Heat shrink the high spots. Isn't a low spot just a high spot on the other side of the panel?
Can the more difficult low spots be heat treated from the backside of the panel, same way a high spot is treated from the front side of the panel?
Access issues aside...
I’m working on a new video that will explain this 👍
Im finding new stuff to me Trev. This is great as usual. I love the clock and tin man you made. The vespa model is superb too. Thanks for what you do. Im going to look for your video where you use some copper. Cheers col
Ive fashiened a panel for the jacking point on my suzuki wagon R rear sill arch area using your advice and explanations. Thanks ever so much Trev
It's important to not let the heat wander into the surrounding area. While that area stays cool it holds back the force of the expanding metal, thereby shrinking it. If the heat moves too far out, the effect is lost. Get in, get out, and don't get famous, as they say in burglary work.
Yes Alex you’re 100% correct, I had made this particular video for a guy that had extremely limited tools. It wasn’t a “the best way” type video. Cheers Trev 👍
Great video. I love making my own tools. 👍👍👍
What is a blow lamp is that so you can see at night or is it called a torch
Thank You. You are an excellent teacher. I appreciate the time and effort to teach us mere mortals.
Great stuff here! So many great tips and tricks. I'm sub'd now.
Trev, can you do a video using a shrinking disk to remove highs? I ruined a panel or two as a beginner using a torch. The shrinking disk is easier to control the heat and has worked more effectively for me but I would like your opinion on where to use one method versus the other.
I’ve never used a shrinking disc, maybe I’ll try one, one day... using a gas torch with a no2 is preferable to a blow lamp but that was the request I was asked to do a video on. My favourite tool is definitely a single sided type spot welder with shrinking attachment. Cheers Trev 👍
Ah! I think I get the heat shrinking concept now! Thanks! Al in USA
Thank you Trev, great video!
Ice cold water, Then heat. Super fast.
this is something that i tried a few years ago unsuccessfully. now i know that i was doing the hammering part wrong (i was using a dolly behind it and just stretching it further) so thank you for filling that gap in my knowledge.
You were doing it correctly,the idea is to heat up the metal to a small red spot and then with a hammer and dolly gently planish around the circumference of the red spot which has the effect that as the hammer hits where the dolly is it sqeeezes the metal into the red dot thereby shrinking the panel.I learnt how to do it in the 1960s as an apprentice panel beater.
Good video Trev that will help me a lot with my build, I have a high spot I have been trying and trying to get rid of I will try this now thanks mate
Neville Nevstoy Brilliant I one it works for you. Cheers Trev 👍
Very nice and intuitive video 👍 I’ve just done a sunroof delete on my old Porsche 911 using a blank which was English wheeled out to follow the correct contour. After trimming to size etc I followed up butt-welding (10” apart working one side to the other) to try and keep the heat distortion to a minimum but whilst the remaining original part of the roof skin has remained relatively distortion free, the wheeled panel has mushroomed up about 3mm 🙄. I have purchased one of those planishing discs from the US in 9” size but a little shy to use it yet... if you could do a video of using one correctly that would be fantastic as most of the ones on YT are of poor substance 😟 Oh and yes please for the aircooler/dryer you’ve made for you compressor as that would be very helpful to 🤗 Keep them vids coming, many of us viewers learn so many great techniques from you, it’s greatly appreciated 👍
Mark Shepherd Hi Mark, I’ve never used a shrinking disc, I’ve thought about it though 🤔 I actually use my welding torch or my spot welder I’ve converted into a shrinking machine. I’m saving up for a proper stud welder at the moment to do a follow up video for more advanced heat shrinking methods. Lots more stuff to come for sure. Cheers Trev 👍
I made my own shrinking disc from an old circular saw blade with the teeth cut off. *( safety note: cutting the teeth off by running the disc grinder against the running saw does work but can be painful!) I recessed the center hole with a ball peen hammer over the end of a pipe. It works. Trev, you do great work.
Wow, that blowlamp leaves mine looking like a cigarette lighter. What is it and what gas are you using.
Hi Andrew
Please don’t be too focused on the whole blow lamp detail. One of my failings with this video was not pointing out at the start that the video was made after a viewer request for ideas on how he could perform shrinking without any specialist tools. I asked him what he had that could heat up metal and he replied a blow lamp. Although it was effective it isn’t the best tool that I could have used BUT it was a cost effective way of performing a quite advanced skill utilising a tool he already had. A more effective tool using a flame would be a proper oxygen acetylene welding torch with a very small jet, like a no2. The smaller and hotter the flame the less heat spread you get which is what you ideally want for the shrinking process to work more effectively, as it’s the cold metal around the heated area that holds compression against the heated area. Having said all of this the video as far as I’m concerned contains good information, I have also successfully used a spot of mig weld, a TIG welder, single sided stud welder, gas welding torch and even a hot air gun to shrink metal. Some people even use friction, which is supposed to work well.Cheers Trev 👍 ps the blow lamp was nothing special just a vintage one
Like your work! I am in Australia and really find your videos most helpful. Cheers
dave coate Hey Thanks Dave. Cheers Trev 👍
Love your work.
Question, if you have a high spot on panel is it not a low spot if worked from the other side.
I’ll be covering this in an upcoming video 👍
Why not using water or cold air from the compressor? It makes the metal shrink.
Absolutely👍
Super informative. Well delivered. Subscribed. Thank you
So nice to see true tradesmanship in this day and age, thanks!
I like the fact you make your own tool's I had to do that to with many diffrent dolly shapes of metals for diffrent corners.
SNOOP U 2 Hey Thanks 🤩. Your comment is very much appreciated. Cheers Trev 👍
Another great video mate. Many thanks.