@@netiturtle yt deleted my comment, so here we go again: You mean illegal migration, right? until this year there was no such thing as irregular migration, used in this context. Confusion of the highest order 🥲🥲🥲🥲🥲
When you're using old tweets in your video, like at 3:17, would you mind also adding the date at which that was written? It'd help me with mentally mapping out a timeline
What is "irregular immigration"?? Its ILLEGAL migration. And please dont switch between terms immigration and illegal immigration, those are two completely different groups.
Before there is no verdict by a court you can't claiM immigration is illegal. But hey "Look at the illegal Muslim immigrants" gets you points in the polls and social media.
The proper legal term is "irregular" not "illegal". Refugees or Asylum seekers (someone waiting to be recognized as a refugee) are not immigrants, they have a whole different set of international rules.
Also they highlight other western countries with “worse” problems to diminish Italian claims. Not at all neutral. This dismissive attitude is what makes people mad in the first place.
Depends on where you live. In the big cities (where most people live), most people are not as anti-immigration. I'm guessing you are not from these places?
@@SuperSniffenbut Sweden saw the first net migration numbers for the first time in 50 years , that wouldn’t be done if immigration wasn’t deeply unpopular
The assumption by TLDR that Migration is all the same is baffling! For years, Italy has been unable to process legally submitted request for immigration due to the avalanche of ILLEGAL migrants that just forced their way in. The issue of shortage in the workforce can be easily solved by issuing permits to people that "does it right" now that the uncontrolled flood is stopped. Skilled migrant are all welcome but we need to put the issue under control of the state, not of human traffickers. Migrants that are a burden for the state and ends in illegal activities, willingly or unwillingly are NOT!
when germany offers double the salaries of what a an italian company can offer what incentive is there to work in italy, even italian citizens are leaving
So I'm a master's student in Italy but after 9 months I still haven't gotten my residence permit. The bureaucracy sucks here. They don't pay me much salary if I work and getting citizenship takes at least 10 years (probably 12-15 years). They doubled the national healthcare price for us last year too (from 150 to 750 for international students). Why would I wanna stay? Italy doesn't want us. Not a problem, another country it is. Maybe Germany, maybe Belgium, perhaps the Netherlands, but not Italy. I refuse to pay taxes here for years and get mistreated.
They're churning out too much content now that their quality standard has just plummeted. Not to mention the blatantly obvious political bias they're always pushing.
In 2019 62% of Sweden thought Immigration made them stronger? Is that why they have voted in an anti immigration party. In the Uk an immigration party is poised to overtake the Torries as second party and could be elected in 5 years time. Using five year old data is ridiculous.
” Immigration made them stronger” It is a bad question… I am a swede and vote for anti imigration party….and I would still say yes to that question… because the immigrants that come here to work and create businesses are essential and adds a lot of value…. We just have a large portion of refugees that never work and are culturally incompatible that should be filtered out and not accepted.
I remember visiting the great City of Rom last year after hearing how beuit is for years only to be greeted by atleast 20 migrants sleeping at one of the main Bus stations on the floor. Their solution to the problem seemed to just ignore it. They treated the migrants like pigeons.
Italian here: boat crossings were reduced but the amount of non-european immigrants increased. My small town got invaded by pakistanis and bangladeshis to the point where some hotels were filled with them. I don't understand what's the point of voting anymore
ditto here in England. My town is now majority foreign - in some parts you wont see a white person. My neighbour quips the only thing British is the buildings that the settlers now occupy... and the generous benefits payments that they collect that keeps them in relative comfort.
@@greenlime8726 it's bad when it's thousands of young men without a job or any future spending their days walking around. I should mention that their accomodation is paid for by workers like me
Italian here. Illegal immigration is a burden both side, dunno where these numbers are taken but go to visit Italy and will see how the situation is atm. Skilled workers will be always welcome, this is what Meloni is trying to do. If italians are not doing enough childern is because we got poorer during last decades due to a lower productivity (..) and politics/politicians are not helping families.
If people are not ethnically European, Italians will consider them foreigners, even if they were born in Italy. For this reason, and because we have so many illegal immigrants hanging about every train station, port, various streets and seafronts selling crap, etc, Italians feel we have a much higher number of immigrants.
As someone who has been working in immigration for the better part of a decade, it is INCREDIBLY complex and i am so tired of the false dichotomy of "you are either pro-immigration or anti-immigration"
@@charlesbrown6581 rather mostly visa expiry overstay which makes the whole "border wall" idea even more useless as the means by which most people are entering is through legal channels
@@soundscape26 if you don’t register, how can you be an asylum seeker? In the system they are essentially non existant or illegal because they don’t exist. If i went from my european country and lived off grid in Poland for the next 10 years i would also be illegal even though schengen allows freedom of movement we still have rules and laws i have to partake in.
@@beepboopbeeppYou only become an illegal asylum seeker if your asylum application is rejected or if the host country hasn’t ratified a humans rights binding treaty
@@beepboopbeepp You register once you're in the country, not in your country of origin. You become an illegal if your registration is denied and you don't leave the country soon after. In your example of course you wouldn't be a refugee nor looking for asylum seeker so yeah, you'd quickly be in trouble. That's why it's important to distinguish between real asylum seekers and economic migrants.
One of the difference is also legal migrants with high education are not coming to Italy (especially North) to do the minimum wage jobs. Every country needs a variety of skill sets and when Italy ages, this certainly be the case
Very true although even on the whole western governments are still legally bringing in too many low skilled workers and that has completely crashed the low skilled wage market
It doesn't make sense that worker visas would be picked up by illegal immigrants. A visa is inherently an application you make to the government that the government has granted. You can't have a visa and be an illegal immigrant. You can become an illegal immigrant if you overstay your visa time allowance, but you can't have both at the same time.
It does make so much sense. I can explain you. The chance for an illegal immigrant finding a job to apply for work visa is exhaustingly higher than a person finding a job online from their original country. You are welcome.
The 5 Star Movement isn't left wing [EDIT: apparently it *wasn't*, but it seems to be now]. Back then it described itself as "neither left nor right" and that was a refreshingly accurate description, as their manifesto was actually peppered by seemingly contradictory ideas
WHY should any western or EU countries pay African countries to halt the illegal immigrants??? If you don't accept them and push them back, then perhaps there'll a stop in the human trafficking!!! SIMPLE SOLUTION!! Enough of this rubbish!!!
The first chart that was used must be extremely old. It shows the Suedes and the Brits being happy with immigration, which couldn’t be further from the truth
If labor shortage is such an issue why don't they just open job listings in other countries via consulates. When people apply / qualify for the job then they get legally migrated.
5:50 Cracking down on illegal immigration isn’t contributing to Italy’s labour shortage. Restricting skilled immigration would do that. It is disappointing how tldr fails to make that distinction in every video concerning immigration.
As an Italian I will believe the worker shortage when they'll start offering decent salaries... Italy also has big unemployment and low number of working people even among the working age population.... Believe me there is no such thing as a worker shortage there is only a shortage of slaves which of course are never enough. 😉
most of works they're talking about don't need skilled workers (contruction, cleaning, transport) so restricting any kind of immigration will make damage on these basic sectors. You don't need to be a doctor to become driver
Yes she can decide who she lets in, not illegal immigrants barging in. There is a huge difference in that! And they are educated skilled workers most of them which is what we want.
Immigration is a subject that short circuits everyone: Right declares it to be an existential threat and are called fascist; the Left declares it a utopian ideal and are called naïve or delusional. And it's an areas where both sides have merit; we can't ignore the *wink wink* behind what the Right says, but neither can we ignore that mass migration causes social tension and the costs/benefits are not equally distributed. Sadly I can't see any common ground being reached as each's base must be maintained.
@@F-F01If there is too much legal immigration, the society taking them in can't integrate them and also sometimes can't afford the cost ( welfare state and need for new infrastructure with more people). So it is more complicated than legal good, illegal bad
@@F-F01 If migrants start raising the cost of living and depressing wages (which they currently are doing across the west) they should be deported en masse. We have no reason nor obligation to lower our living standards to raise theirs.
2:58 Italians do have a very strict mindset on what it means to be Italian. Doesn't matter if you have the passport. I have an italo-american friend raised in Italy that was told multiple times she was not Italian.
Retired people; (vormer not working/partime working woman) we have to pay there retiremend and still they complain of getting to less money. Its a ridiculous system.
Do you really think we misunderstand and overestimate our own problems? How stupid do you think we are? We are neither blind nor stupid, we know for a fact that migration is more than real and is making our cities far more dangerous than how they where before. And this is true both in small cities (like mine) and in big ones (like Milan, Rome, Turin, ecc...), where I know a lot of people who tell me all the time that the situation is becoming worse and worse, and where people do not feel safe anymore... Also these comments really hurt me because I understand this channel's ultimate goal is to criticise right wing parties like Meloni one, and while I do neither support them nor vote for them on migration they are doing great at least in part.
Only 2 minutes in so maybe this is covered later in the video but I’d love to see that data for the United Kingdom being compared to France, Spain, Italy and Germany
The change from '22 to '23 was ~105k to ~157k. That's not remotely "almost doubled". It's not even a full 50% increase. Accuracy is kind of important when it comes to being a credible news source, don't you think, TLDR?
I am puzzled, how can a work permit legalize your stay in the country? Usually you can't even get it if you are in the country illegally, not because of quotas, but because you have no documents. You can't get a work visa while you are in the country illegally, you can only get it outside of the country, in embassies. What is he talking about?
@@mygetawayart bit off topic but sure, can’t say it ain’t true. Hell, even Italians don’t want to live in Italy anymore either. I’d put in an lol if it wasn’t actually fucking tragic IMO
@TLDRnewsEU Could you please consider adding Austrian statistics on topics such as this? I know of course that this specific video is about Italy but stats were posted on Germany and others. It seems rare that Austria is ever mentioned and I am very curious to know. Thanks!
Statistics on Austria are often kinda misleading. They have a much higher share of immigrants and muslims than Germany or Italy (I think it‘s like 20% of the youth in Austria), but these migrants are not from the middle east or Africa, they‘re mostly from the Balkans
@@PaulFromCHGO Also I have to add that Austria has a lot of immigrants from eastern Germany and those people are mostly… well not the best people that Germany offers
Italy's official unemployment rate is 8-9%. Probably bigger in reality. We also have a huge under the table business problem that does not show on official charts. Redirecting and training all those people could partially solve the workers shortage
The official unemployment rate is 6,2% and, if you count all the people that are working but "in Nero" this % could be even less. However you're right, we need to redirect and train this people.
Italy seems to have an education problem much like France. Disconnect with reality and over skilled people who view manual work with disdain Also, I have heard Italy has ridiculous regulations when it comes to hiring
@@Spido68_the_spectator you are exactly right, only in the last couple of years Italy started investing on "job university" (I don't know the exact name but they are university that create high manual level workers ). Furthermore, the high cost and job regulation are not helping at all our situation.
italians overestimate because of A) tourists fill big cities, and B) tourists and immigrants are usually young, more so than native population, therefore they are seen more on streets, schools, jobs, and crime.
Usually tourists are there for a bit and to go and visit places no?, not to do crime. I hate when people start hating on tourists like what they did in Spain It's so ridiculous.
First things first, in Italy ABSOLUTELY NOBODY is against tourism. Both our economy and job market are very dependent on tourism and we are so used to tourists we can spot them instantly. Now you really think we misunderstand our own situation and assume our tourists are actually immigrants???🤣 How stupid do you think we are? More than 90% of our tourists are either American, European, or Asian, while more than 90% of our immigrants are either from Africa or the Middle East. We are neither blind nor stupid! We know for a fact that migration is more than real and is making our cities far more dangerous. And this is true both in small cities (like mine) and in big ones (like Milan, Rome, Turin, ecc...), where I know a lot of people who tell me all the time that the situation is becoming worse and worse, and where people do not feel safe anymore. These videos and these comments really hurt me because I understand this channel's ultimate goal is criticise right wing parties like Meloni one, and while I do neither support them nor vote for them on migration they are doing great at least in part.
@Minimmalmythicist Sure illegal immigration shows desperation, but it also shows who has the money to travel and pay people smugglers, and is physically able to travel long distances. What about the people who don't have enough to pay people smugglers, or are elderly or handicapped and can't travel long distances. Those are the people that deserve assistance! And I don't think you understand what criminal and civil law is.
@Minimmalmythicist Its desperation we can not help each 1 million the US takes in another 80 million are born do you want this to keep happening until we become a third world country just like where the UK is heading it also has detrimental effects on crime, culture, population, causes a housing crisis, language, overpopulation and inflation.
Also, most of them who apply for asylum definitely don’t come from countries at war, just poor and overpopulated countries. In the first half of 2024, the top nationality of those applying for asylum in Italy is Bangladesh.
Why do you not prefix the word migration with "illigal", in the title? The entire video is about how Italy is handling illegal migration. But it is never mentioned once in the video.
But Italy's legal, specially educational immigration schemes are very generous and actually amazing for students. I think they're more focused on asylum seekers and not on students/ professional workers, unlike Netherlands.
Yeah the post study visa for masters students is really lucrative with lot of scholarships but not so easy to get A citizenship afterwards. Dont know much about Netherlands except a post study visa of like only 12 months and housing crisis also
@@dhruvsharma6893 Netherlands has nearly doubled the minimum required amount of financial ability. They have also made it tougher for most non-EU countries to get educational visas.
1:30 These figures are misleading, I live in Spain and I can clearly tell you that I think immigrants are great for our country, that is, legal immigrants, there is a very clear distinction between legal and illegal, I am sure that if Spaniards were polled on the same question but for illegal immigrants the results would be extremely different.
You are clearly not wrong, but while immigration is (partially) good for the economy it harms the overall security of a nation. I'm not like others who say immigration makes us loose our identity, because even if it is true I don't really care about that, but I have to say here in Italy people do not feel safe anymore... I don't know the situation there in Spain but Italy is becoming like the UK and the US, if not even more dangerous (without the "guns problem" of course).
@@Al3ss4s I'm Spanish and can tell you the country is very safe for the most part, but it's only getting worse. It's frightening what it'll be in 10 years.
As many have pointed out, please differentiate between illegal migration, refugees / asylum seekers and highly skilled migrants. The former two groups are net negatives for local population and are a majority of all immigrants (because they don't work but consume welfare). The latter are a smaller group, while being a net positive (because they work in highly paid jobs and pay same taxes as locals).
To those who praise Meloni while living abroad, jusy come to italy and see for yourself how great she and her government are. Good luck finding a job that doesnt pay peanuts, or a house if you don't come from a wealthy family. See how that goes for you.
Anglo-Saxon countries praise Geogggggia Melloooooney, because she is her laché. A real Anglo-Saxon patriot. Speriamo che l'Inghilterra affondi con tutti gli Inglesi dentro.
Then that must be the reason she is rock solid in the political polls, which are done mostly by the Left themselves, and all the Poor Left while desperately trying, has exactly 0.0%(!) possibility of ever defeating her. She has carte blanche to do whatever she wants in Italy for as long as she wants, and that time will indeed be very long. This has always been the case with Meloni. Since the video is talking about illegal immigration, the new official updated govt. stats released yesterday show now an 83%(!) reduction compared to last year. That number is Definite, not maybe.
I'm starting to think that we should just expand Europe into Africa. It sounds like colonisation all over again, but hear me out. The local governments appear to not have a grip on their countries, and people want to come to Europe for a better life, so why not take Europe to them?
@@JJ-qd9yl That's not how the economy works, we don't need other countries to be poor in order to get rich, the pie can get bigger, wealth isn't a zero sum game.
The majority of people don’t come to Europe and actually stay in Africa. If Europe and the US would stop meddling in African politics and destabilizing governments. People could actually build they countries. Look at what Europe did in Libya, Sudan, Somalia, Egypt, Mali, Burkina Faso, Ivory Coast. We have ourselves to blame that people now come to Europe. We meddle in their affairs. There European companies who don’t even pay taxes in Africa, even though they produce and sell in Africa. The taxes are paid to Europe. Make that make sense.
I always hear this lie about the labor market. It's true that certain sectors are short of workers, but a migrant from North Africa would never be qualified or suitable for this work. Most of them remain illiterate and cost the country more than they earn throughout their lives.
Apart from the prohibitively expensive cities and tourist hotspots Italy's hinterland is already dying. Every village looks deserted, buildings are cumbling, you are lucky to find anyone under 65.
As Italian I am often appalled that these videos are praising so much the mediocrity of italian politicians all of the damn times, while never talking in depth about any topic. Not to mention all of the mistakes of this video. Migration became a hot topic in the 2010s. LOL Bossi-Fini law is from 2002
Why are you so scared of using the word "illegal" migration? Then the video would at least seem to have less bias. "Meloni has made slashing immigration a central..." - see, this sounds like she is some kind of an extremist, however, if you were to accurately and truthfully report what is actually taking place, the sentence would be "Meloni has made slashing ILLEGAL immigration a central..." - now she doesn't sound so bad, does she? She wants to make something which is illegal less prevalent. Meloni has no problem with legal migrants, international students, seasonal workers, etc, she has a problem with ILLEGAL migration.
One thing about the overestimation of immigration in the country may be due to majority of immigrants move to the north of Italy and only a percentage move to the south. Since it is not a widespread phenomenon, many regions in the north of the country have higher percentage which may corresponds to the table you showed.
Something that people should understand from the Meloni case in the video is that this is basically what happens to ALL populist, far right, conservative, and anti-immigration politics in all nations where immigration became a hot button issue. And yes, this includes UK, Germany, US and other nations. This isn't because immigration is not an issue, which it is, but because basically, what these parties and politicians are doing is using the problem in a superficial and sensationalist manner, because they don't have better plans, they don't have better ideas, they just have a project for power that has absolutely nothing to do with ideology or stance. It's from the mouth out that they will solve all the major worries people have, and nothing of substance. The immigration crisis is not something that one politician or party in one single nation will be able to solve with superficial, boneheaded or simply inexistent plans. This will require a ton of diplomacy, very strong international relations, and a lot of negotiation. Plus a ton of internal investment too, because you cannot just close borders and start shooting everyone that is trying to come in, unless you want to live in North Korea. Not even North Korea, being as isolated as it is from the rest of the world, really can stop transit in borders - let alone countries that still want to keep democratic rule going. What these politicians say they'll do isn't a measure of what they can do. In fact, it should be obvious to anyone who looked minimally at the issue that any idiot that comes out saying they have the solution should raise all the red flags from start. It should be more obvious than me coming to you to say I have a cure for cancer or I have a free energy machine. Ultimately, the problem here is that we're living in societies with huge portions of the population stupid enough to believe empty promises and scapegoating like that. Oh, everything is to blame on immigrants, so we're gonna solve the issue for you bud. No one stops to question whether those affirmations are true or not, whether their plans will work or not, why this is happening, what is the perspective from the immigrants' side, what is required for effective measures to happen, what is the origin of the issue, and so on. If all voters want is to elect people who promises a piece of land on the moon, a bridge to sell, or pie in the sky stupidity, this is all you are going to get in the end. At the cost of giving power to scammers and grifters. You will be left with nothing in exchange other than a hole in your pocket. People that are this ignorant and stupid about things are easy targets for scams and exploitation. Easy to brainwash and sell a piece of land on the moon. Which turns politics in a game of who shouts the loudest. The parties who are trying to do the responsible thing and treat the subject with the care and attention that it needs rather than raw emotion loses. And so, the issue comes to a stalemate. It's because people cannot stop shouting about this issue while doing nothing about it that it cannot go away. Here is the harsh truth for the anti-immigrant folks: no one is gonna solve the immigrant crisis. No one. No one politician, no one party, no one government. It is a global issue that is currently as intractable as famine, disease, Climate Change, war and conflicts, corruption, income gap, and others - because it is directly related to those. If YOU don't want to deal with immigrants, I suggest you move to some isolated portion of the world and live there the rest of your life by yourself. If that's truly what you want, this is the rational way of doing it. Because the immigrant crisis is directly related to us living in a world where some nations have people who have enough money to straight buy out entire nations with cash to spare, while we have nations with people living with so little they can't even dream of having a life of poor citizens of developed nations. It's the economic disparity, in all levels, that led to this. We have countries where people are throwing and trashing so much food and things in general, while other countries are trying to make some living out of the trash of these developed nations because they have nothing else to go for. It's better to live the life of the lower strata of society in rich nations rather than living an average life in poor nations. The more this equation gets unbalanced, the worse the immigrant crisis will become. And with Climate Change already rearing it's ugly head all over the world, this will only exacerbate the situation further. And from yet another perspective, like TLDR put it well enough, it's not a matter of stopping immigration and everything will be fine. Particularly for developed nations where no one wants to work in several types of jobs that only immigrants will work in. We have been talking for decades now how entire sectors of the economy are filled with poor and immigrant workers because no one else wants to do hard labor jobs that pay paltry sums of money at conditions that looks like modern slavery. All of the nations I've mentioned have become completely dependent on those sectors of the economy, and thus, immigrant work. Every single citizen in these developed economies have their livelihoods dependent on this exploitive system, and now they wanna complain about it without even understanding how it works. If you want to get an example that is clear for everyone, think about how Dubai was built. Dubai is an extreme case of a city that was built on top of the corpses of immigrants worked to exhaustion, but all developed nations share this sort of system to varying degrees. You know what happens to all these anti-immigration politicians when they get elected? When they don't already know all the bullsh*t they've been spewing for their personal project for power, when they do get in power they start understanding what is truly happening. Then they have to produce a fake image of them doing "something" about it, while having to content with the status quo, rich people pressure of not doing anything about it. Because of course, when they get to that level, all the sectors of the economy who relies heavily on immigrant work will stop them from doing anything about it. For entire sectors of the economy, particularly the ones that directly hits against monopolies bottom lines, immigrants are not a problem - they are the source of their revenues. And this isn't only small farmers who recruit immigrant labor, small industries who give them jobs, service sector that requires people who will accept to work at very low wages and whatnot. It's huge entire sectors of the economy. Entire industries. Huge portions of agribusiness. Huge portions of logistics. Huge portions of the service sector. They are building your homes and general infrastructure, they are serving you in restaurants and shops, they are transporting your crap from one side of the country to another, they are collecting your garbage, they are harvesting and transporting your food, they are mining your resources to feed the industries they are also working at, and so forth and so on. At prices your monopolies are willing to pay. So, stop and think about what you are asking for a moment. Oh, they are coming to get our jobs, get our cultures, get our traditions, get our way of living, blablabla. I'm sorry if you haven't realized this so far, but this has all already given and built on top with foreign labor. Actually, I'm not sorry, it's your own fault for being this blind for this long. People who voluntarily become this ignorant and blind to their own surroundings don't deserve pity. They'll get what they deserve.
When I visited Italy last summer a lot of the hotel workers were foreigners, but from countries in South America like El Salvador and Venezuela. I don't think Italians mind those sorts of immigrants who come with secured work, follow the rules, and respect the local culture. But even so, you cannot be completely reliant on immigration to solve your aging population problem, because it will leave you permanently dependent on the will of people to move to a country that is not very welcoming to prospective parents. You need to face the rooth of the problem, immigration at best only buys you some time.
Cultures rooted in Christianity are compatible to some degree. Same goes for Islamic ones. But when mixing Christianity and Islam... well let's just say that everyone knows that water and oil don't mix.
@@MustraOrdo It's not because of christianity, it's because southern europe and south america have similar culture, mostly because of their iberian heritage
@@MustraOrdo Yeah? That's why the US is trying to keep them out? South America is the most Christian part of the world, also some of the most aggressive... because I can't use other words. So your statement means nothing. The only reason why the bad apples don't reach Italy is the ocean in between. But they can still send their Christian cocaine.
@@JonathanB138 It's crucial to break free from the repetitive and loud slogans and recognize that there are individuals who can perceive the nuances in various situations, rather than viewing everything in stark terms such as black and white, left and right, fascists, and communists. This becomes especially evident when media outlets unquestioningly comply with the directives of their owners, investors, and other influential figures, irrespective of the underlying truth.
No Country, No Regime has ever managed to increase the fertility rate medium/long term of its productive population ever. I mention medium/long term, because giving financial incentive will increase the fertility rate in the short term and then it would drop below what it was before , as people that were delaying starting a family would take advantage of the benefits now, but not have more children than initially planned. I also mention productive population (working/middle class, tax paying), you can have increased fertility among religious/ethnic communities, but that fertility increase does not help the state in the long run. A good example being the ultra-ortodox Jews (Hareidim) in Israel, that have 3x the fertility rate of the secular population, but pay on average 1/5 in taxes.
@@agmuntianu That's because they're never fixing the problem. -Housing -Cost of living That's literally it. Both are improved by stopping mass migration.
Its weird to mix statistics of the perception of societies towards immigration, while the main concern on the west is about illegal migrations. Two different topics and too much confusion between them.
Wait, what's the source on that chart about guess estimates of foreign-born residents in multiple countries? It's not on the links list, that I can see, and some of those numbers are *wild*.
Cultures that refuse to integrate other cultures are not going to survive. History has taught us so. The Roman Empire wouldn't have lasted as long if it didn't integrate aspects of cultures they conquered. Just look at the transition from pagan religion to Christianity, or Vespasian's, Titus, Domitian, Antoninus Pious, Marcus Aurelius, Costantine I's politics in this field. The same can be said about the Holy Roman Empire, which in the late X century became the Holy German Roman Empire, which lasted until 1806. Lastly, look at the Multinational Empires of Europe, like the Austrian Empire. It forced the Austrian culture and rule on its hungarian and balcanic subjects, and this led to the First World War. Cultures MUST evolve to survive. Italy's culture is no exception. And I say this as a patriot who loves his country, who puts the Italian flag up the balcony during June 2nd and April 25th.
The situation looks like two sticks with shit on both ends. First stick is that Italy can't sustain the worker shortage so they need immigrants. But the immigrants are incompatible with the European society. The second stick is they want to prevent irregular migration but it's only convenient to give work visas to immigrants who have migrated to Italy irregularly.
Pretty sure refugee is a subset of migrant. It’s very useful to disentangle that state’s humanitarian obligations and voluntary migration policy, but they are both fundamentally part of a larger category. Furthermore, until an ‘asylum seeker’ is recognised to have a legitimate claim they are not a refugee, just a seeker, if they fail they may have the opportunity to apply for migration under the normal processes.
because most crossing the med come from North Africa, which outside of libya, aren't nations currently at war or in political or economical turmoil, and therefor their citizens aren't at fear of persecution, or they have experienced violence or human rights violations. If refugees are going to N. Africa to then go onto Europe then they aren't refugees/asylum seekers anymore because they didn't seek asylum in the first safe country.
He's basically kissing her feet and you think this is left wing propaganda? Would there need to be Faccetta nera as background music for you to not consider this left wing propaganda?
The video says that migration is the solution for low natality, it is not. Also, the effect of low natality are not yet visible, they will be visible in the next 20 years, therefore it’s not the cause of the “labour shortages” the video talks about. Just mentioning such a stupid thing shows that TLDR is leaning towards the ideology that is the cancer of modern left wing politics. I don’t care about FDI, I didn’t vote for them in the last election, if you’re wondering.
3:24 Thank you for reminding me of this. We’ve spent so long with Meloni as the recognised leader, receiving all the usual respect and treatment, that it’s been easy for me to forget where her dangerous heart lies when not constrained by constitutional checks.
It's by all accounts a way to discipline migration through work. In essence "be a worker or give up rights". Dystopian but effective. As Italian this country is an hellhole to live anyway, no surprise that nationals aren't happy until guests also suffer the same. Most leave for places where the manager doesn't tell you "haha, today only half-day of work?" if you leave office at 18:00 in a 9-17 job
1:20 Terms 'immigration' and 'irregular immigration' should not be used interchangeably
You mean illegal or ? actually, what does irregular immigration mean? made up terms to confuse the peeps even more 🥲🥲🥲🥲🥲
Both IS Bad for us
@@netiturtle yt deleted my comment, so here we go again:
You mean illegal migration, right? until this year there was no such thing as irregular migration, used in this context. Confusion of the highest order 🥲🥲🥲🥲🥲
@@PeterPeter-qc7kyImmigration is good for the economy. Irregular isn't.
@@adelinrosca6649 report for re-training. 'Illegal' is no longer to be used in the context
TLDR does love to use that barbed wire PNG when immigration comes up
They would like to associate it with concentration camps. But is the realtime its a bloody hotel.
Yeah, definitely not super biased. The constant "far right is against mass migration" nonsense they're pedalling is also pathetic.
What’s wrong with barbed wire? We use barbed wire in the river in Texas to keep out illegals
@@Patrick-y4d1z Of course. Far right ideologies are known to be among the most migration friendly in the world.
@@Eder-bk5mm LET THEM ALL IN LET THEM ALL IN REEEEE /s. fuck off Neoliberal
When you're using old tweets in your video, like at 3:17, would you mind also adding the date at which that was written? It'd help me with mentally mapping out a timeline
It wuld be also helpful to add years to the graphs.
What is "irregular immigration"?? Its ILLEGAL migration. And please dont switch between terms immigration and illegal immigration, those are two completely different groups.
Isn’t the official term asylum seekers?
Before there is no verdict by a court you can't claiM immigration is illegal. But hey "Look at the illegal Muslim immigrants" gets you points in the polls and social media.
Doesn’t irregular in this context just mean it’s risen quite sharply?
There is an argument they have a right to seek asylum under international law hence why some dont use illegal immigration
The proper legal term is "irregular" not "illegal". Refugees or Asylum seekers (someone waiting to be recognized as a refugee) are not immigrants, they have a whole different set of international rules.
Ah yes the "let's not count them" approach
Wow ur name is so Italian
sounds like the italian goverment in a nutshell
3:00 WTF Colombia😮
And yes, as an Italian I can tell you "you know nothing".
*if i don’t see them, then it doesn’t exist*
No. She has just bought a bigger rug to hide the dust.
@@Dagua that's How us Italians do things, we ignore the problem untill It becomes unsormountable
The rug of center-northern Europe is at this point of galactic dimensions
@@marcoac-sx6lq the real problem is that there is no real policy of integration, no minimum wage, and no plan for reducing no-contract work
Dagua 🙏🏼
Albania isn't even that big
The way you designed the foreign born population chart for france is pretty misleading compared to the german and italian ones.
Also they highlight other western countries with “worse” problems to diminish Italian claims. Not at all neutral. This dismissive attitude is what makes people mad in the first place.
No way there is only 32% of Sweden thinks immigration is a burden and 62% its good hell na that is soo wrong...... when was this study done 2015?
Depends on where you live. In the big cities (where most people live), most people are not as anti-immigration. I'm guessing you are not from these places?
You'd be surprised how short sighted people can be even in the face of absolute destruction.
No way it was 2015 - as he says 2019.... Also, they give the sources
@@SuperSniffenbut Sweden saw the first net migration numbers for the first time in 50 years , that wouldn’t be done if immigration wasn’t deeply unpopular
@@SuperSniffensure but 40% of swedes voted for the moderates or SD, didnt those parties campaign on reducing immigration?
The assumption by TLDR that Migration is all the same is baffling!
For years, Italy has been unable to process legally submitted request for immigration due to the avalanche of ILLEGAL migrants that just forced their way in.
The issue of shortage in the workforce can be easily solved by issuing permits to people that "does it right" now that the uncontrolled flood is stopped.
Skilled migrant are all welcome but we need to put the issue under control of the state, not of human traffickers.
Migrants that are a burden for the state and ends in illegal activities, willingly or unwillingly are NOT!
If they are as slum seekers than they are not illegal
when germany offers double the salaries of what a an italian company can offer what incentive is there to work in italy, even italian citizens are leaving
So I'm a master's student in Italy but after 9 months I still haven't gotten my residence permit. The bureaucracy sucks here. They don't pay me much salary if I work and getting citizenship takes at least 10 years (probably 12-15 years). They doubled the national healthcare price for us last year too (from 150 to 750 for international students). Why would I wanna stay? Italy doesn't want us. Not a problem, another country it is. Maybe Germany, maybe Belgium, perhaps the Netherlands, but not Italy. I refuse to pay taxes here for years and get mistreated.
@@TheMaldingZucchinias an Italian, I feel ashamed.
i see now that TLDR got much bigger than when i started watching, they now also struggle to differiente illegal migrants and foreign workers
They're churning out too much content now that their quality standard has just plummeted.
Not to mention the blatantly obvious political bias they're always pushing.
Both are Bad
@@PeterPeter-qc7kyif both are bad then Italian migrant workers in other nations should be deported
@@PeterPeter-qc7ky Why are foreign workers bad? They often do what locals don't want to do.
@@PeterPeter-qc7ky yes it's bad so next time your country economy is struggling don't complain chad.
In 2019 62% of Sweden thought Immigration made them stronger?
Is that why they have voted in an anti immigration party.
In the Uk an immigration party is poised to overtake the Torries as second party and could be elected in 5 years time.
Using five year old data is ridiculous.
62% didn’t vote anti. Despite the hysterical media, right gains are very small.
” Immigration made them stronger” It is a bad question… I am a swede and vote for anti imigration party….and I would still say yes to that question… because the immigrants that come here to work and create businesses are essential and adds a lot of value…. We just have a large portion of refugees that never work and are culturally incompatible that should be filtered out and not accepted.
@@nicke0b i think your comment got deleted bro.
Reform is nowhere near winning, they'll be capped like UKIP
The right nuts deceived 30% of the voters in 2022, so it checks out.
I remember visiting the great City of Rom last year after hearing how beuit is for years only to be greeted by atleast 20 migrants sleeping at one of the main Bus stations on the floor. Their solution to the problem seemed to just ignore it. They treated the migrants like pigeons.
My aunt was at Roma and she was almost robbed
Average Termini experience
@@Patrick-y4d1z dehumanizing much?
@@Patrick-y4d1zand you're worse than them
And what should they do? give them houses that even Italians can''t afford, they would be better back home.
Italian here: boat crossings were reduced but the amount of non-european immigrants increased. My small town got invaded by pakistanis and bangladeshis to the point where some hotels were filled with them. I don't understand what's the point of voting anymore
What’s bad about people of other nationalities staying in Italy? Pakistanis and Bangladeshi are not different from Italians in any way.
ditto here in England. My town is now majority foreign - in some parts you wont see a white person. My neighbour quips the only thing British is the buildings that the settlers now occupy... and the generous benefits payments that they collect that keeps them in relative comfort.
@@greenlime8726yes they are 100% different and the sheer présence of bengladeshi or Pakistanis is a problem
@@greenlime8726 it's bad when it's thousands of young men without a job or any future spending their days walking around. I should mention that their accomodation is paid for by workers like me
@@greenlime8726 also if you think italians and pakistanis are the same, either ethnically or culturally, you are blind
Italian here. Illegal immigration is a burden both side, dunno where these numbers are taken but go to visit Italy and will see how the situation is atm. Skilled workers will be always welcome, this is what Meloni is trying to do. If italians are not doing enough childern is because we got poorer during last decades due to a lower productivity (..) and politics/politicians are not helping families.
If people are not ethnically European, Italians will consider them foreigners, even if they were born in Italy. For this reason, and because we have so many illegal immigrants hanging about every train station, port, various streets and seafronts selling crap, etc, Italians feel we have a much higher number of immigrants.
You Eur0peans better start to own lots of weap0ns. The future is not g00d for you.
An advice coming from an Indian.
Well, yeah. They signed up for the EU only.
@@diogomm710 And your point?
They're right though. It doesn't matter if an African is born in Italy, they're not Italian and never will be.
As someone who has been working in immigration for the better part of a decade, it is INCREDIBLY complex and i am so tired of the false dichotomy of "you are either pro-immigration or anti-immigration"
The main issue in the USA is NOT immigration, but the illegal immigration.
@@charlesbrown6581 rather mostly visa expiry overstay which makes the whole "border wall" idea even more useless as the means by which most people are entering is through legal channels
What are you?
Illegal immigrants. Fixed it for you.
@@jamessaintjames1387 Asylum seekers are not illegal by definition, they won't be charged. That's the whole point of the refugee status.
@@soundscape26 if you don’t register, how can you be an asylum seeker? In the system they are essentially non existant or illegal because they don’t exist.
If i went from my european country and lived off grid in Poland for the next 10 years i would also be illegal even though schengen allows freedom of movement we still have rules and laws i have to partake in.
@@beepboopbeeppYou only become an illegal asylum seeker if your asylum application is rejected or if the host country hasn’t ratified a humans rights binding treaty
@@beepboopbeepp You register once you're in the country, not in your country of origin. You become an illegal if your registration is denied and you don't leave the country soon after.
In your example of course you wouldn't be a refugee nor looking for asylum seeker so yeah, you'd quickly be in trouble. That's why it's important to distinguish between real asylum seekers and economic migrants.
@@beepboopbeepp The joke is they register and then don't leave the country when they are found illegible.
There’s a distinct difference (educations, skills….) between Legal Immigration and Illegal Migration
Name one.
Still more Afrikans in Italy
Dont be naive.
One of the difference is also legal migrants with high education are not coming to Italy (especially North) to do the minimum wage jobs. Every country needs a variety of skill sets and when Italy ages, this certainly be the case
Very true although even on the whole western governments are still legally bringing in too many low skilled workers and that has completely crashed the low skilled wage market
It doesn't make sense that worker visas would be picked up by illegal immigrants. A visa is inherently an application you make to the government that the government has granted. You can't have a visa and be an illegal immigrant. You can become an illegal immigrant if you overstay your visa time allowance, but you can't have both at the same time.
It does make so much sense. I can explain you. The chance for an illegal immigrant finding a job to apply for work visa is exhaustingly higher than a person finding a job online from their original country. You are welcome.
@@cerenyy4333 That's not how it works.
The 5 Star Movement isn't left wing [EDIT: apparently it *wasn't*, but it seems to be now]. Back then it described itself as "neither left nor right" and that was a refreshingly accurate description, as their manifesto was actually peppered by seemingly contradictory ideas
WHY should any western or EU countries pay African countries to halt the illegal immigrants???
If you don't accept them and push them back, then perhaps there'll a stop in the human trafficking!!! SIMPLE SOLUTION!! Enough of this rubbish!!!
It is far-left populist.
It's actually left wing
At the moment it's decidedly left-wing. It's not the same as it was back then.
@@edyslavico3761 Yes
5:50 regular and “irregular” immigration have vastly different economic effects, please do not conflate these
More like European/East Asian immigration vs African/Muslim/Gypsy immigration.
The first chart that was used must be extremely old. It shows the Suedes and the Brits being happy with immigration, which couldn’t be further from the truth
If labor shortage is such an issue why don't they just open job listings in other countries via consulates. When people apply / qualify for the job then they get legally migrated.
They'll apply at a consulate, travel to the country then disappear. Same as coming by rubber dinghy but without the risk of drowning.
Because the real goal is disruption.
5:50 Cracking down on illegal immigration isn’t contributing to Italy’s labour shortage. Restricting skilled immigration would do that. It is disappointing how tldr fails to make that distinction in every video concerning immigration.
@@n.s-j.6214 that was implicit
As an Italian I will believe the worker shortage when they'll start offering decent salaries... Italy also has big unemployment and low number of working people even among the working age population....
Believe me there is no such thing as a worker shortage there is only a shortage of slaves which of course are never enough. 😉
Not if the labour shortage is for unskilled labour
most of works they're talking about don't need skilled workers (contruction, cleaning, transport) so restricting any kind of immigration will make damage on these basic sectors. You don't need to be a doctor to become driver
@@theinternetofrandomthings7796 To be frank, the labour shortage is for both.
They're out of migrants... The bigger problem is what to do with the thousands already in.
remigration
You mean milions
It depends, you cannot treat them all the same way. Some are skilled some are not, some have a job other have not, etc.
D E P O R T
Send em back
Yes she can decide who she lets in, not illegal immigrants barging in. There is a huge difference in that! And they are educated skilled workers most of them which is what we want.
5:30 “No! Anything but Albania!” 😂
I seriously thought: "Going to Albania is a punishment?"
Immigration is a subject that short circuits everyone: Right declares it to be an existential threat and are called fascist; the Left declares it a utopian ideal and are called naïve or delusional. And it's an areas where both sides have merit; we can't ignore the *wink wink* behind what the Right says, but neither can we ignore that mass migration causes social tension and the costs/benefits are not equally distributed. Sadly I can't see any common ground being reached as each's base must be maintained.
Centrist opinion: 'migration is a thing.'
Migration is good if done legally, bad if done illegally. It’s really not that hard to understand
@@F-F01 There is something called mass migration too lol, and that's not good in most cases either.
@@F-F01If there is too much legal immigration, the society taking them in can't integrate them and also sometimes can't afford the cost ( welfare state and need for new infrastructure with more people). So it is more complicated than legal good, illegal bad
@@F-F01 If migrants start raising the cost of living and depressing wages (which they currently are doing across the west) they should be deported en masse. We have no reason nor obligation to lower our living standards to raise theirs.
2:58 Italians do have a very strict mindset on what it means to be Italian. Doesn't matter if you have the passport. I have an italo-american friend raised in Italy that was told multiple times she was not Italian.
You can call it very strict mindset. Still doesn’t mean it’s not xenophobic and racist. Let’s call it what it really is.
Retired people; (vormer not working/partime working woman) we have to pay there retiremend and still they complain of getting to less money. Its a ridiculous system.
Do you really think we misunderstand and overestimate our own problems? How stupid do you think we are? We are neither blind nor stupid, we know for a fact that migration is more than real and is making our cities far more dangerous than how they where before. And this is true both in small cities (like mine) and in big ones (like Milan, Rome, Turin, ecc...), where I know a lot of people who tell me all the time that the situation is becoming worse and worse, and where people do not feel safe anymore... Also these comments really hurt me because I understand this channel's ultimate goal is to criticise right wing parties like Meloni one, and while I do neither support them nor vote for them on migration they are doing great at least in part.
We love Meloni. A great role model.
Only 2 minutes in so maybe this is covered later in the video but I’d love to see that data for the United Kingdom being compared to France, Spain, Italy and Germany
They won't show us it will high light how we are being fked over!
The change from '22 to '23 was ~105k to ~157k. That's not remotely "almost doubled". It's not even a full 50% increase.
Accuracy is kind of important when it comes to being a credible news source, don't you think, TLDR?
Denmark also showed how easily it can be solved, those states who make excuses are governed by those making money from mass immigration
Oh stop with this stupid comment. Italy changed government from all political spectrum, it's just not an east thing to do, that's it.
@@zedtrek more excuses, countries can easily stop high levels of immigration if they want
@@shutup2751 Denmark doesn't have a huge maritime border right next to Africa
I am puzzled, how can a work permit legalize your stay in the country? Usually you can't even get it if you are in the country illegally, not because of quotas, but because you have no documents. You can't get a work visa while you are in the country illegally, you can only get it outside of the country, in embassies. What is he talking about?
The other half of her strategy is tanking the economy so there’s no point moving to Italy from Africa. 4D chess right there
most migrants already don't wanna stay in Italy. They just arrive here but leave for other EU countries.
@@mygetawayart bit off topic but sure, can’t say it ain’t true. Hell, even Italians don’t want to live in Italy anymore either. I’d put in an lol if it wasn’t actually fucking tragic IMO
@TLDRnewsEU Could you please consider adding Austrian statistics on topics such as this? I know of course that this specific video is about Italy but stats were posted on Germany and others. It seems rare that Austria is ever mentioned and I am very curious to know. Thanks!
Statistics on Austria are often kinda misleading. They have a much higher share of immigrants and muslims than Germany or Italy (I think it‘s like 20% of the youth in Austria), but these migrants are not from the middle east or Africa, they‘re mostly from the Balkans
@@Jekoo63 Very interesting! Thanks for that.
@@PaulFromCHGO Also I have to add that Austria has a lot of immigrants from eastern Germany and those people are mostly… well not the best people that Germany offers
Italy's official unemployment rate is 8-9%.
Probably bigger in reality.
We also have a huge under the table business problem that does not show on official charts.
Redirecting and training all those people could partially solve the workers shortage
The official unemployment rate is 6,2% and, if you count all the people that are working but "in Nero" this % could be even less. However you're right, we need to redirect and train this people.
Italy seems to have an education problem much like France. Disconnect with reality and over skilled people who view manual work with disdain
Also, I have heard Italy has ridiculous regulations when it comes to hiring
@@Drakexis6637I believe Spain has the same problem with informal work qnd such. What would you say it is there?
What you mean bigger in reality 😂😂😂 it could be lower "in reality" not higher 😂
@@Spido68_the_spectator you are exactly right, only in the last couple of years Italy started investing on "job university" (I don't know the exact name but they are university that create high manual level workers ). Furthermore, the high cost and job regulation are not helping at all our situation.
Video starts at 0:44
italians overestimate because of A) tourists fill big cities, and B) tourists and immigrants are usually young, more so than native population, therefore they are seen more on streets, schools, jobs, and crime.
Usually tourists are there for a bit and to go and visit places no?, not to do crime. I hate when people start hating on tourists like what they did in Spain It's so ridiculous.
@@MrBurnsExcellentEspecially on tourism-dependent countries like those two
@@MrBurnsExcellent just because tourists don't break laws doesn't mean they're annoying people hate tourists because they suck as people
Tourism is 13% of the Italian GDP. It's important but the country is not dependent on it. @@CristianmrWuno
First things first, in Italy ABSOLUTELY NOBODY is against tourism. Both our economy and job market are very dependent on tourism and we are so used to tourists we can spot them instantly. Now you really think we misunderstand our own situation and assume our tourists are actually immigrants???🤣 How stupid do you think we are? More than 90% of our tourists are either American, European, or Asian, while more than 90% of our immigrants are either from Africa or the Middle East. We are neither blind nor stupid! We know for a fact that migration is more than real and is making our cities far more dangerous. And this is true both in small cities (like mine) and in big ones (like Milan, Rome, Turin, ecc...), where I know a lot of people who tell me all the time that the situation is becoming worse and worse, and where people do not feel safe anymore. These videos and these comments really hurt me because I understand this channel's ultimate goal is criticise right wing parties like Meloni one, and while I do neither support them nor vote for them on migration they are doing great at least in part.
It's important to differentiate illegal migration from legal migration. Just like we differentiate thieves from moving companies.
@Minimmalmythicist Sure illegal immigration shows desperation, but it also shows who has the money to travel and pay people smugglers, and is physically able to travel long distances. What about the people who don't have enough to pay people smugglers, or are elderly or handicapped and can't travel long distances. Those are the people that deserve assistance!
And I don't think you understand what criminal and civil law is.
@Minimmalmythicist Its desperation we can not help each 1 million the US takes in another 80 million are born do you want this to keep happening until we become a third world country just like where the UK is heading it also has detrimental effects on crime, culture, population, causes a housing crisis, language, overpopulation and inflation.
It's Irregular immigration, it seems pretty regular.
It's ILLEGAL immigrantion.
Didnt Orwell have a lot to say on policing of language?
Aren't you the one policing language?
I think “”asylum”” seekers are legal but irregular
@@00dude3 Asylum seekers won't be charged as the term "illegal" suggests. That's one of the core tenets of the refugee status.
Orwell also said that borders should not exist
he's calling Signorina mussolini "mirgrant sceptic". british humour 😂
Meloni is a good leader. She opposes harmful immigration but accepts immigration for work while in goverment.
Cool video, keep up the good work
Migration is not the same thing as "immigration" and Asylum is its own category - definitely not "immigration".
Also, most of them who apply for asylum definitely don’t come from countries at war, just poor and overpopulated countries. In the first half of 2024, the top nationality of those applying for asylum in Italy is Bangladesh.
@@stefano_etrusco Anyone who applies for Asylum who does not qualify is deported (sent home to where they came from).
Thanks for posting this video]
Don't worry folks! Valentina Nappi will take care of all this african immigrants!
Why do you not prefix the word migration with "illigal", in the title? The entire video is about how Italy is handling illegal migration. But it is never mentioned once in the video.
But Italy's legal, specially educational immigration schemes are very generous and actually amazing for students. I think they're more focused on asylum seekers and not on students/ professional workers, unlike Netherlands.
Yeah the post study visa for masters students is really lucrative with lot of scholarships but not so easy to get A citizenship afterwards. Dont know much about Netherlands except a post study visa of like only 12 months and housing crisis also
@@dhruvsharma6893 Netherlands has nearly doubled the minimum required amount of financial ability. They have also made it tougher for most non-EU countries to get educational visas.
They're not asylum seekers - just illegal migrants.
Let’s also remember that Italy has much less land available compared to Spain, France and Germany.
1:30 These figures are misleading, I live in Spain and I can clearly tell you that I think immigrants are great for our country, that is, legal immigrants, there is a very clear distinction between legal and illegal, I am sure that if Spaniards were polled on the same question but for illegal immigrants the results would be extremely different.
No estoy seguro. Depende de cada persona. Votantes de Vox y PSOE tienen differents opiniones. El PP también.
Most are from Latin America, which are good.
The ones that are he@dache are Afri€ans and muzlims.
You are clearly not wrong, but while immigration is (partially) good for the economy it harms the overall security of a nation. I'm not like others who say immigration makes us loose our identity, because even if it is true I don't really care about that, but I have to say here in Italy people do not feel safe anymore... I don't know the situation there in Spain but Italy is becoming like the UK and the US, if not even more dangerous (without the "guns problem" of course).
@@Al3ss4s I'm Spanish and can tell you the country is very safe for the most part, but it's only getting worse. It's frightening what it'll be in 10 years.
No she hasn’t stopped migration .
But she is a great leader and will hopefully be able to prove her huge potential 🇨🇭💗🇮🇹
JFC do you have some kind of deal with Meloni? This fawning is incredible.
As many have pointed out, please differentiate between illegal migration, refugees / asylum seekers and highly skilled migrants. The former two groups are net negatives for local population and are a majority of all immigrants (because they don't work but consume welfare). The latter are a smaller group, while being a net positive (because they work in highly paid jobs and pay same taxes as locals).
I'm sure the illegal immigrants are highly skilled people that are able to plug the so called skill gap Italian businesses lack.
Good joke
/s
Italians themselves aren't even able to do that so yea they need the inmigrants they hate so much.
@@EJH783 Due to the number of migrants in Italy, lowering the wages there in the first place. Simple offer and demand trick.
@@mrsupremegascon which is exactly what these migrants are doing too. So hey, your country is competitive in the market good for you
Movimento Cinque Stelle (5-star movement) is not a left wing party. It prides itself of being "anti-political:" neither left-wing, nor right-wing
To those who praise Meloni while living abroad, jusy come to italy and see for yourself how great she and her government are. Good luck finding a job that doesnt pay peanuts, or a house if you don't come from a wealthy family. See how that goes for you.
News today, unemployment fell to 6.2 per cent in August, not since 2007, and record employment.
Anglo-Saxon countries praise Geogggggia Melloooooney, because she is her laché. A real Anglo-Saxon patriot. Speriamo che l'Inghilterra affondi con tutti gli Inglesi dentro.
Then that must be the reason she is rock solid in the political polls, which are done mostly by the Left themselves, and all the Poor Left while desperately trying, has exactly 0.0%(!) possibility of ever defeating her. She has carte blanche to do whatever she wants in Italy for as long as she wants, and that time will indeed be very long. This has always been the case with Meloni. Since the video is talking about illegal immigration, the new official updated govt. stats released yesterday show now an 83%(!) reduction compared to last year. That number is Definite, not maybe.
Yes, lets ignore the fact that the country has been stagnating since 2008 and pretend that its all Meloni's fault.
@dontaskmewhy266 It's not stagnating, it's growing a little, but it's growing. Exports are doing well, we have overtaken Japan as 4th in the world.
And in Germany increasing +30% from last year. Is not a solution just passing the ball.
I'm starting to think that we should just expand Europe into Africa. It sounds like colonisation all over again, but hear me out. The local governments appear to not have a grip on their countries, and people want to come to Europe for a better life, so why not take Europe to them?
You are delusional and showing your true colours
Indeed
European countries already do that, they control Africa to keep them poor so Europe doesn’t become poor. Hope that helps
@@JJ-qd9yl That's not how the economy works, we don't need other countries to be poor in order to get rich, the pie can get bigger, wealth isn't a zero sum game.
The majority of people don’t come to Europe and actually stay in Africa. If Europe and the US would stop meddling in African politics and destabilizing governments. People could actually build they countries. Look at what Europe did in Libya, Sudan, Somalia, Egypt, Mali, Burkina Faso, Ivory Coast. We have ourselves to blame that people now come to Europe. We meddle in their affairs. There European companies who don’t even pay taxes in Africa, even though they produce and sell in Africa. The taxes are paid to Europe. Make that make sense.
You're just reading off stats, and missing the part where you tell us _how_ she stopped the boats
He said skills gap...
Yep, there we go, you are no longer trustworthy.
We need to talk about ways to increase the indigenous birth rate.
I always hear this lie about the labor market. It's true that certain sectors are short of workers, but a migrant from North Africa would never be qualified or suitable for this work. Most of them remain illiterate and cost the country more than they earn throughout their lives.
Apart from the prohibitively expensive cities and tourist hotspots Italy's hinterland is already dying.
Every village looks deserted, buildings are cumbling, you are lucky to find anyone under 65.
As Italian I am often appalled that these videos are praising so much the mediocrity of italian politicians all of the damn times, while never talking in depth about any topic.
Not to mention all of the mistakes of this video.
Migration became a hot topic in the 2010s. LOL Bossi-Fini law is from 2002
You can move to North Korea.
Yeah this is extremely surface level.
He didn't even mention Minnitti.
@@ad_astra468 every video from this channel is "extremely surface, almost AI written" level. This is la disgrazia, porcoddio
Explain then
6 SA's per day in Italy by migrants, just over 50% of all SA cases per year are committed by migrants in Italy.
migration is not going to fix any economic issues lol
SHE DIDN'T.
Italians don’t overestimate “foreign born population”, they’re referring to race
As an Italian i cas say NO. This government is a joke.
Why are you so scared of using the word "illegal" migration? Then the video would at least seem to have less bias. "Meloni has made slashing immigration a central..." - see, this sounds like she is some kind of an extremist, however, if you were to accurately and truthfully report what is actually taking place, the sentence would be "Meloni has made slashing ILLEGAL immigration a central..." - now she doesn't sound so bad, does she? She wants to make something which is illegal less prevalent. Meloni has no problem with legal migrants, international students, seasonal workers, etc, she has a problem with ILLEGAL migration.
One thing about the overestimation of immigration in the country may be due to majority of immigrants move to the north of Italy and only a percentage move to the south. Since it is not a widespread phenomenon, many regions in the north of the country have higher percentage which may corresponds to the table you showed.
I am Italian and i can confirm She didn't solve anyghing .So absolutely NO!!!
Seems no one will.
I guess u are voting for the left
Vattene in Spagna, in Svezia o in Germania fenomeno...
Something that people should understand from the Meloni case in the video is that this is basically what happens to ALL populist, far right, conservative, and anti-immigration politics in all nations where immigration became a hot button issue. And yes, this includes UK, Germany, US and other nations.
This isn't because immigration is not an issue, which it is, but because basically, what these parties and politicians are doing is using the problem in a superficial and sensationalist manner, because they don't have better plans, they don't have better ideas, they just have a project for power that has absolutely nothing to do with ideology or stance. It's from the mouth out that they will solve all the major worries people have, and nothing of substance.
The immigration crisis is not something that one politician or party in one single nation will be able to solve with superficial, boneheaded or simply inexistent plans. This will require a ton of diplomacy, very strong international relations, and a lot of negotiation. Plus a ton of internal investment too, because you cannot just close borders and start shooting everyone that is trying to come in, unless you want to live in North Korea. Not even North Korea, being as isolated as it is from the rest of the world, really can stop transit in borders - let alone countries that still want to keep democratic rule going.
What these politicians say they'll do isn't a measure of what they can do. In fact, it should be obvious to anyone who looked minimally at the issue that any idiot that comes out saying they have the solution should raise all the red flags from start. It should be more obvious than me coming to you to say I have a cure for cancer or I have a free energy machine.
Ultimately, the problem here is that we're living in societies with huge portions of the population stupid enough to believe empty promises and scapegoating like that. Oh, everything is to blame on immigrants, so we're gonna solve the issue for you bud. No one stops to question whether those affirmations are true or not, whether their plans will work or not, why this is happening, what is the perspective from the immigrants' side, what is required for effective measures to happen, what is the origin of the issue, and so on.
If all voters want is to elect people who promises a piece of land on the moon, a bridge to sell, or pie in the sky stupidity, this is all you are going to get in the end. At the cost of giving power to scammers and grifters. You will be left with nothing in exchange other than a hole in your pocket.
People that are this ignorant and stupid about things are easy targets for scams and exploitation. Easy to brainwash and sell a piece of land on the moon. Which turns politics in a game of who shouts the loudest. The parties who are trying to do the responsible thing and treat the subject with the care and attention that it needs rather than raw emotion loses. And so, the issue comes to a stalemate. It's because people cannot stop shouting about this issue while doing nothing about it that it cannot go away.
Here is the harsh truth for the anti-immigrant folks: no one is gonna solve the immigrant crisis. No one. No one politician, no one party, no one government.
It is a global issue that is currently as intractable as famine, disease, Climate Change, war and conflicts, corruption, income gap, and others - because it is directly related to those. If YOU don't want to deal with immigrants, I suggest you move to some isolated portion of the world and live there the rest of your life by yourself. If that's truly what you want, this is the rational way of doing it.
Because the immigrant crisis is directly related to us living in a world where some nations have people who have enough money to straight buy out entire nations with cash to spare, while we have nations with people living with so little they can't even dream of having a life of poor citizens of developed nations. It's the economic disparity, in all levels, that led to this.
We have countries where people are throwing and trashing so much food and things in general, while other countries are trying to make some living out of the trash of these developed nations because they have nothing else to go for. It's better to live the life of the lower strata of society in rich nations rather than living an average life in poor nations. The more this equation gets unbalanced, the worse the immigrant crisis will become. And with Climate Change already rearing it's ugly head all over the world, this will only exacerbate the situation further.
And from yet another perspective, like TLDR put it well enough, it's not a matter of stopping immigration and everything will be fine. Particularly for developed nations where no one wants to work in several types of jobs that only immigrants will work in. We have been talking for decades now how entire sectors of the economy are filled with poor and immigrant workers because no one else wants to do hard labor jobs that pay paltry sums of money at conditions that looks like modern slavery. All of the nations I've mentioned have become completely dependent on those sectors of the economy, and thus, immigrant work. Every single citizen in these developed economies have their livelihoods dependent on this exploitive system, and now they wanna complain about it without even understanding how it works.
If you want to get an example that is clear for everyone, think about how Dubai was built. Dubai is an extreme case of a city that was built on top of the corpses of immigrants worked to exhaustion, but all developed nations share this sort of system to varying degrees.
You know what happens to all these anti-immigration politicians when they get elected? When they don't already know all the bullsh*t they've been spewing for their personal project for power, when they do get in power they start understanding what is truly happening. Then they have to produce a fake image of them doing "something" about it, while having to content with the status quo, rich people pressure of not doing anything about it.
Because of course, when they get to that level, all the sectors of the economy who relies heavily on immigrant work will stop them from doing anything about it. For entire sectors of the economy, particularly the ones that directly hits against monopolies bottom lines, immigrants are not a problem - they are the source of their revenues.
And this isn't only small farmers who recruit immigrant labor, small industries who give them jobs, service sector that requires people who will accept to work at very low wages and whatnot. It's huge entire sectors of the economy. Entire industries. Huge portions of agribusiness. Huge portions of logistics. Huge portions of the service sector.
They are building your homes and general infrastructure, they are serving you in restaurants and shops, they are transporting your crap from one side of the country to another, they are collecting your garbage, they are harvesting and transporting your food, they are mining your resources to feed the industries they are also working at, and so forth and so on. At prices your monopolies are willing to pay.
So, stop and think about what you are asking for a moment. Oh, they are coming to get our jobs, get our cultures, get our traditions, get our way of living, blablabla. I'm sorry if you haven't realized this so far, but this has all already given and built on top with foreign labor. Actually, I'm not sorry, it's your own fault for being this blind for this long. People who voluntarily become this ignorant and blind to their own surroundings don't deserve pity. They'll get what they deserve.
When I visited Italy last summer a lot of the hotel workers were foreigners, but from countries in South America like El Salvador and Venezuela. I don't think Italians mind those sorts of immigrants who come with secured work, follow the rules, and respect the local culture. But even so, you cannot be completely reliant on immigration to solve your aging population problem, because it will leave you permanently dependent on the will of people to move to a country that is not very welcoming to prospective parents. You need to face the rooth of the problem, immigration at best only buys you some time.
Cultures rooted in Christianity are compatible to some degree. Same goes for Islamic ones. But when mixing Christianity and Islam... well let's just say that everyone knows that water and oil don't mix.
@@MustraOrdo It's not because of christianity, it's because southern europe and south america have similar culture, mostly because of their iberian heritage
@@MustraOrdo Yeah? That's why the US is trying to keep them out? South America is the most Christian part of the world, also some of the most aggressive... because I can't use other words. So your statement means nothing. The only reason why the bad apples don't reach Italy is the ocean in between. But they can still send their Christian cocaine.
You TLDR guys are not biased at all. Not even a hint of bias. 😂
It's not hard to bias against Fascists unless you are FASCISTS or support Musseloni's terror.
@@JonathanB138 It's crucial to break free from the repetitive and loud slogans and recognize that there are individuals who can perceive the nuances in various situations, rather than viewing everything in stark terms such as black and white, left and right, fascists, and communists. This becomes especially evident when media outlets unquestioningly comply with the directives of their owners, investors, and other influential figures, irrespective of the underlying truth.
The real problem with Meloni is not her, it's all the people she carries with her
she chose the people around her, therefore she is the problem
finish your soy milk now
Too be fair. I do think her way of handling the crisis with actively trying to stem some of the problems in North Africa is more sustainable over time
Seems like the best solution would be to increase native fertility rates
You haven't learned anything from Hungary
Yeah, but how?
@@larswillems9886 lower the cost of living.
No Country, No Regime has ever managed to increase the fertility rate medium/long term of its productive population ever.
I mention medium/long term, because giving financial incentive will increase the fertility rate in the short term and then it would drop below what it was before , as people that were delaying starting a family would take advantage of the benefits now, but not have more children than initially planned.
I also mention productive population (working/middle class, tax paying), you can have increased fertility among religious/ethnic communities, but that fertility increase does not help the state in the long run. A good example being the ultra-ortodox Jews (Hareidim) in Israel, that have 3x the fertility rate of the secular population, but pay on average 1/5 in taxes.
@@agmuntianu
That's because they're never fixing the problem.
-Housing
-Cost of living
That's literally it. Both are improved by stopping mass migration.
She's a savvy political operator you have to give it to her.
Only the sheeple believe her. Everyone else can see that she isn't solving anything.
@@07Flash11MRC most of the electorate are sheeple. Governments don't get into power off the backs of the enlightened.
Its weird to mix statistics of the perception of societies towards immigration, while the main concern on the west is about illegal migrations. Two different topics and too much confusion between them.
Purposefully so
Wait, what's the source on that chart about guess estimates of foreign-born residents in multiple countries? It's not on the links list, that I can see, and some of those numbers are *wild*.
I don't care if limiting migration also worsens labor shortages or reduces GDP. Its about our heritage.
Sadly people don't get that, see what Dominik Tarczyński says he's got it right.
The grave calls to your people, embrace it, it’s the future of the continent.
If they increased pay there wouldn't be labor shortages
No, ppl should be entitled to ask their rich governments for a better leaving rather than wasting their money on NGOs to bring cheap labor
Cultures that refuse to integrate other cultures are not going to survive.
History has taught us so.
The Roman Empire wouldn't have lasted as long if it didn't integrate aspects of cultures they conquered. Just look at the transition from pagan religion to Christianity, or Vespasian's, Titus, Domitian, Antoninus Pious, Marcus Aurelius, Costantine I's politics in this field.
The same can be said about the Holy Roman Empire, which in the late X century became the Holy German Roman Empire, which lasted until 1806.
Lastly, look at the Multinational Empires of Europe, like the Austrian Empire. It forced the Austrian culture and rule on its hungarian and balcanic subjects, and this led to the First World War.
Cultures MUST evolve to survive. Italy's culture is no exception. And I say this as a patriot who loves his country, who puts the Italian flag up the balcony during June 2nd and April 25th.
Fair assessment of a difficult topic.
OMG ITALIANS DON'T WANT UNSKILLED MOOZLEEMZ IMMIGRANTS? HOW RACIST!!!
Not much they can do about it though lol
@@gijane2cantwaittoseeyou203 Funny that countries with the worlds "strongest armies" cant even have closed borders.
@@gijane2cantwaittoseeyou203 They can do plenty. Just not with muh human rights
that sweater is from superdry, I have the same one, nice one geez
What is the difference between this channel and the Daily Mail at this point🤔
The situation looks like two sticks with shit on both ends. First stick is that Italy can't sustain the worker shortage so they need immigrants. But the immigrants are incompatible with the European society. The second stick is they want to prevent irregular migration but it's only convenient to give work visas to immigrants who have migrated to Italy irregularly.
Why do so many use the word immigrant for refugee especially in Europe
Because they are immigrants.
You have legal and illegal immigration.
Yes, I strongly agree since I see the same conflation in usage.
Pretty sure refugee is a subset of migrant.
It’s very useful to disentangle that state’s humanitarian obligations and voluntary migration policy, but they are both fundamentally part of a larger category.
Furthermore, until an ‘asylum seeker’ is recognised to have a legitimate claim they are not a refugee, just a seeker, if they fail they may have the opportunity to apply for migration under the normal processes.
they are neither refugees nor immigrants, they are illegal migrants
because most crossing the med come from North Africa, which outside of libya, aren't nations currently at war or in political or economical turmoil, and therefor their citizens aren't at fear of persecution, or they have experienced violence or human rights violations. If refugees are going to N. Africa to then go onto Europe then they aren't refugees/asylum seekers anymore because they didn't seek asylum in the first safe country.
Far better to have a workers crisis then a messed up society
The left wing propaganda on issues like migrations is nauseating, I will never watch a TDLR video ever again.
So they praise a right wing leader and you talk about left wing propaganda? Uh?
He's basically kissing her feet and you think this is left wing propaganda?
Would there need to be Faccetta nera as background music for you to not consider this left wing propaganda?
so pointing out what meloni promised and what actually happened afterwards is too painful to watch right?
The video says that migration is the solution for low natality, it is not.
Also, the effect of low natality are not yet visible, they will be visible in the next 20 years, therefore it’s not the cause of the “labour shortages” the video talks about.
Just mentioning such a stupid thing shows that TLDR is leaning towards the ideology that is the cancer of modern left wing politics.
I don’t care about FDI, I didn’t vote for them in the last election, if you’re wondering.
TLDR, learn the difference between migration and irregular migration.
3:24 Thank you for reminding me of this. We’ve spent so long with Meloni as the recognised leader, receiving all the usual respect and treatment, that it’s been easy for me to forget where her dangerous heart lies when not constrained by constitutional checks.
what are you talking about
Well, she is right. Soros spends millions financing NGOs that actively supports mass migration. Why does he do that?
@@JoelLinus she's part of the Great Replacement weirdos. As if Italy was part of the "superior european race" in the first place lol
He is confusing decretto flussi and sanatoria law. NO, the work visas will not "be picked" by the illegal immigrants already present in Italy.
Meloni is the best prime minister statistically speaking that Italy has seen in the last 25 years.
You don't know anything about Italy if you say that shit with a straight face my friend
@AkhmatProductions just cope
@AkhmatProductionsand yet She is themost popular PM in the past 15 yrs?
@@marcoac-sx6lq "Just cope"
Bro is Socrate
@@silverdoctor6298 😂
they should make a movie about italy and call it "No Country for Young Men"
Europe for Europeans!
no.
Fertility rate!
nazi vibes comment
@@miramuchachito296China has lower and they are definitely not going to import half a billion people to fix that....
@@miramuchachito296Japan is fine rather low fertility than importing arabs
It's by all accounts a way to discipline migration through work. In essence "be a worker or give up rights". Dystopian but effective. As Italian this country is an hellhole to live anyway, no surprise that nationals aren't happy until guests also suffer the same. Most leave for places where the manager doesn't tell you "haha, today only half-day of work?" if you leave office at 18:00 in a 9-17 job