An indie writer friend of mine and I were discussing what felt off about this From the Ashes launch and by extension the end of Krakoa, and I think the disconnected nature stems from even thinking they needed to completely wrap HoX/PoX to get into the new status quo. What would have put these books over better was probably finding a way to set up each of these teams over time. All the ingredients were there for a more natural release: 1. Krakoa was off limits, supposedly a town had a Sentinel factory and Cyke had a case - why not have the Trial of Cyclops roll over into what they said happened and literally show Cyke having a reason to be based out there while HoX/PoX was still running? Let that book coexist with Krakoa's last 4 months or something so when it ended it is simply where Cyke already is, and maybe a few mutants come his way. 1b. They make a big deal about resurrecting Magneto. Age him down again, then immediately turn around and build a mystery around him beint aged up and infirm in Cyke's corner of Ashes? Why? 2. The Dominions wholesale turning their back on Essex made sense at the time, but I feel like having a Dominion based threat out in deep space (or a Shi'Ar related event) was a more fitting way to remove Phoenix from the board for her to soar solo while still feeling like an X-Book. 3. Shadowkat just went full bloodlusted, but missed her mark, Xavier. I get her wanting to be off on her own then getting dragged back into things. I feel like with a slight tweak she could have been playing out the Exceptional X-Men premise while Orchis tensions were still around, but in a corner they didn't necessarily have as much inroads. 4. Rogue heading South could have been for 12 different reasons. If it used the Uncanny Avengers slant to roll into what this book is trying to be it probably would have felt more earned than it currently does. Also, building a schism between her and Cyclops would feel more natural if she kept pushing for Xavier to be rescued while Cyke tried "commanding" her not to. Would play out even more naturally too if she wasn't present and as privy to half his attrocities while held by the machines of Orchis. Basically these teams should have had natural reasons to be spread across the States (and World) to keep Orchis losing ground before the big finale, so when Krakoa returned for the brief moment then went off to exist in the WHR neighborhood we'd be alteady into what these books represented (and gearing up for a more earned X-Civil Dispute that's apparently coming). P.S. Instesd of the abstract stuff Forge is leading X-Force around doing, there are a few machine intelligences he should have been globetrotting to keep in check instead (patchwork to loose ends Nimrod, Omega Sentinel et al had going for A.I. dominance). So confused why they always feel like they need these hard shifts into the next era when the idea of coming off a half-decade event was always going to disorient readers.
Marvel erred when they decided to end Krakoa. Krakoa could have been a mainstay in the Marvel Universe for the next 40 years, just like the X-mansion was. And we will all spend the next few years reminiscing about what could have been and what should have been when it comes to Krakoa. But I do believe that certain characters indeed deserve their own solo series. Storm is the number one X-men character that deserves her solo series. She is now more popular than ever and frankly she has outgrown the X-men, her and Jean Grey. The two of them are characters that need to be contending with cosmic level entities and universal threats. Let Psyclops and Rouge handle the threats to New York.
I agree both Storm and Phoenix could carry their own solo series, and while I don't want to always shackle Jean to Scott to be relevant, I feel her "solo" series would have felt more "earned" if she had more of a relatable reason for being out there like visiting the Shi'Ar Galaxy to deal with something Corsair related alongside Cyke. In the process she could end up needing to venture further into space while they head for Earth or something, but this interview discussion voiced something I was feeling that I couldn't place before: there is no proper set up for why some characters are just so spread out and acting weird towards some next group. You'd think there'd be at least one book where some large argument broke out about how different individuals handled certain situations leading to strained relationships, e.g., being too OK partnering with certain villains, or leaving Xavier to rot vs wanting to rescue and forgive him, or distrusting new-Beast, etc. They could even have written it like they allude to the fall out but would show it/flesh it out down the line. Instead it feels like everyone was just told to have some characters be catty towards the others because that's a cool go-to. Storm definitely secured her solo book slot, but somehow feels like the last to get going. I wouldn't necessarily consider her to have outgrown the X-Men though, I'd say she more outgrew the strike team dynamic, so more of the Arakko/X-Men Red dynamic would have suited her. An Arakki embassy might have been a good setup for her, but I have yet to see her solo to see if they'll nail it. At the very least we saw her telling Cyke neither of them could ever go back to taking orders from each other.
In the late 80s you knew Uncanny X-Men was the book in charge and everything else was the satellite book. Sometimes like with New X-Men or Astonishing another book will ascend to that top spot but there is a top spot.
One thing you touched on briefly with the '47 books this week' tweet is that part of the disconnect is also at the publishing side. As someone keeping up with all these books, I'm still constantly surprised week on week about which books are out. Having 2 major books double-shipping and the rest not just made, and continues to make, the relaunch feel a little messy and haphazard in a way that's not the fault of any of the stories at all.
I'm not mad at the krakoa age ending but like Dave said.....we need a new and better idea to keep us interested. So far that hasn't developed in an exciting way. Whats the selling point for fans.
The team he is leading is very reminiscent of all the teams he was leading before Krakoa. Illyana has been with him since right after Schism. Magneto has also been with him on more than one team. Now I'm also wondering why his book is not the Uncanny book.
@@darksaint0124 I remembered it being called Uncanny X-Men when it was first announced, but I just went back to look and it seems like the original name for it was actually "Cyclops" which definitely makes a bit of sense reading it lol
So... they gave us the glory of Krakoa.... and now they are giving us bad artstyle and horrible writing. I really tried to read. I really did. But now? Nah. I'm good. The one with Scott looks like it was written by AI. But I disagree they won. They beat Orchis, sure. But they lost Krakoa. Krakoa is gone. Can you imagine the sense of loss for those who are without a home. Krakoa was a home, was a haven. I get the sense of anger and regret and dread, it is a powerful setting. But still....
i'M not buying any of these books, i'M hoping STORM is good, I wish Magneto would go to the home he created and they would do an ARAKKO Book with HiM and Apocalypse.
Not only did they end krakoa they are also dragging its legacy through the dirt. Why are so many characters now speaking of negative experiences on krakoa. This era sucks and i cant be convinced otherwise. Im 32 years old and a lifelong xmen comic reader. This era almost makes me want to stop reading.
What a bunch of nonsense... diversity this diversity that... its about quality, quality sells, and i can already tell you that "from the asses" will flop hard. Sales already show it. And everything thats being praised here is being disputed by the sales, people dont want this, they want the x-men
An indie writer friend of mine and I were discussing what felt off about this From the Ashes launch and by extension the end of Krakoa, and I think the disconnected nature stems from even thinking they needed to completely wrap HoX/PoX to get into the new status quo.
What would have put these books over better was probably finding a way to set up each of these teams over time. All the ingredients were there for a more natural release:
1. Krakoa was off limits, supposedly a town had a Sentinel factory and Cyke had a case - why not have the Trial of Cyclops roll over into what they said happened and literally show Cyke having a reason to be based out there while HoX/PoX was still running? Let that book coexist with Krakoa's last 4 months or something so when it ended it is simply where Cyke already is, and maybe a few mutants come his way.
1b. They make a big deal about resurrecting Magneto. Age him down again, then immediately turn around and build a mystery around him beint aged up and infirm in Cyke's corner of Ashes? Why?
2. The Dominions wholesale turning their back on Essex made sense at the time, but I feel like having a Dominion based threat out in deep space (or a Shi'Ar related event) was a more fitting way to remove Phoenix from the board for her to soar solo while still feeling like an X-Book.
3. Shadowkat just went full bloodlusted, but missed her mark, Xavier. I get her wanting to be off on her own then getting dragged back into things. I feel like with a slight tweak she could have been playing out the Exceptional X-Men premise while Orchis tensions were still around, but in a corner they didn't necessarily have as much inroads.
4. Rogue heading South could have been for 12 different reasons. If it used the Uncanny Avengers slant to roll into what this book is trying to be it probably would have felt more earned than it currently does. Also, building a schism between her and Cyclops would feel more natural if she kept pushing for Xavier to be rescued while Cyke tried "commanding" her not to. Would play out even more naturally too if she wasn't present and as privy to half his attrocities while held by the machines of Orchis.
Basically these teams should have had natural reasons to be spread across the States (and World) to keep Orchis losing ground before the big finale, so when Krakoa returned for the brief moment then went off to exist in the WHR neighborhood we'd be alteady into what these books represented (and gearing up for a more earned X-Civil Dispute that's apparently coming).
P.S.
Instesd of the abstract stuff Forge is leading X-Force around doing, there are a few machine intelligences he should have been globetrotting to keep in check instead (patchwork to loose ends Nimrod, Omega Sentinel et al had going for A.I. dominance).
So confused why they always feel like they need these hard shifts into the next era when the idea of coming off a half-decade event was always going to disorient readers.
very well said
Great conversation, love it
Marvel erred when they decided to end Krakoa. Krakoa could have been a mainstay in the Marvel Universe for the next 40 years, just like the X-mansion was. And we will all spend the next few years reminiscing about what could have been and what should have been when it comes to Krakoa.
But I do believe that certain characters indeed deserve their own solo series. Storm is the number one X-men character that deserves her solo series. She is now more popular than ever and frankly she has outgrown the X-men, her and Jean Grey. The two of them are characters that need to be contending with cosmic level entities and universal threats. Let Psyclops and Rouge handle the threats to New York.
I agree both Storm and Phoenix could carry their own solo series, and while I don't want to always shackle Jean to Scott to be relevant, I feel her "solo" series would have felt more "earned" if she had more of a relatable reason for being out there like visiting the Shi'Ar Galaxy to deal with something Corsair related alongside Cyke. In the process she could end up needing to venture further into space while they head for Earth or something, but this interview discussion voiced something I was feeling that I couldn't place before: there is no proper set up for why some characters are just so spread out and acting weird towards some next group.
You'd think there'd be at least one book where some large argument broke out about how different individuals handled certain situations leading to strained relationships, e.g., being too OK partnering with certain villains, or leaving Xavier to rot vs wanting to rescue and forgive him, or distrusting new-Beast, etc. They could even have written it like they allude to the fall out but would show it/flesh it out down the line. Instead it feels like everyone was just told to have some characters be catty towards the others because that's a cool go-to.
Storm definitely secured her solo book slot, but somehow feels like the last to get going. I wouldn't necessarily consider her to have outgrown the X-Men though, I'd say she more outgrew the strike team dynamic, so more of the Arakko/X-Men Red dynamic would have suited her. An Arakki embassy might have been a good setup for her, but I have yet to see her solo to see if they'll nail it. At the very least we saw her telling Cyke neither of them could ever go back to taking orders from each other.
Omg i missed this! I love Adam!
Love Adam & Anna content. Great get!
In the late 80s you knew Uncanny X-Men was the book in charge and everything else was the satellite book. Sometimes like with New X-Men or Astonishing another book will ascend to that top spot but there is a top spot.
One thing you touched on briefly with the '47 books this week' tweet is that part of the disconnect is also at the publishing side. As someone keeping up with all these books, I'm still constantly surprised week on week about which books are out. Having 2 major books double-shipping and the rest not just made, and continues to make, the relaunch feel a little messy and haphazard in a way that's not the fault of any of the stories at all.
When hot guys talk about X-men??? I tune in.
I'm not mad at the krakoa age ending but like Dave said.....we need a new and better idea to keep us interested. So far that hasn't developed in an exciting way. Whats the selling point for fans.
Its weird not seeing Cyclops in Uncanny X-Men
The team he is leading is very reminiscent of all the teams he was leading before Krakoa. Illyana has been with him since right after Schism. Magneto has also been with him on more than one team. Now I'm also wondering why his book is not the Uncanny book.
@@darksaint0124 I remembered it being called Uncanny X-Men when it was first announced, but I just went back to look and it seems like the original name for it was actually "Cyclops" which definitely makes a bit of sense reading it lol
beautiful bowie cover to start the stream!
X - Men sucks so much at the moment. I get Tom wanted to put X-men back in the Universe but they feel so pointless right now its so boring.
Is that what he says? Cuz the X line was the center of the universe during krakoa
From the ashes era is Horrible....
Krakoa rules!!!
So... they gave us the glory of Krakoa.... and now they are giving us bad artstyle and horrible writing. I really tried to read. I really did. But now? Nah. I'm good. The one with Scott looks like it was written by AI. But I disagree they won. They beat Orchis, sure. But they lost Krakoa. Krakoa is gone. Can you imagine the sense of loss for those who are without a home. Krakoa was a home, was a haven. I get the sense of anger and regret and dread, it is a powerful setting. But still....
i'M not buying any of these books, i'M hoping STORM is good, I wish Magneto would go to the home he created and they would do an ARAKKO Book with HiM and Apocalypse.
Not only did they end krakoa they are also dragging its legacy through the dirt. Why are so many characters now speaking of negative experiences on krakoa. This era sucks and i cant be convinced otherwise. Im 32 years old and a lifelong xmen comic reader. This era almost makes me want to stop reading.
What a bunch of nonsense... diversity this diversity that... its about quality, quality sells, and i can already tell you that "from the asses" will flop hard. Sales already show it. And everything thats being praised here is being disputed by the sales, people dont want this, they want the x-men