Just a small correction. Most anime on VHS never had Macrovision (outside of some disney tapes). The main reason this is a must have for VHS collectors is it fixes dropped frames. Production companies had to make sure any tape they broadcast onto the airwaves never had any "NO SIGNAL" errors. They probably never intended people to use these at home, but in the modern age when you want to make a video about a VHS tape, they're an absolute must otherwise you completely lose the signal any time the tape is damaged.
I have precisely this device, with the same capacitors in trouble - except mine have leaked. Could you possibly let me know which capacitors you used to replace them?
That's what they call a "LINE" TBC. Mine is a "full frame" TBC. Two TBCs for two separate tasks. - The line TBC is for cleaning the image quality. - The external full frame TBC / frame sync is for correcting signal problems.
@@kennylauderdale_en Thanks. I got the AG-1970P and AG-1980P. Someone wrote a FAQ that said "Panasonic's [AG-1970P & AG-1980P] S-VHS professional editing decks, with full frame TBC (instead of line TBC)." but then contradicted himself elsewhere calling it a "full-field" TBC. Guess I don't know what to think! :) Only works for playback though... no pass-thru.
@@RetroTechUSA Yeah, only problem was that I was visiting family across the country and they displaced a lot of other stuff from my luggage! ;) ...then the capacitors went bad a few years later. The people recapping these and selling for several hundred dollars aren't sharing the cap values so I'll eventually make a list but just getting to them all is such a b@!$h that I haven't had the chance (been years).
Panasonic don’t get me started. Most are going to have bad SMD capacitors on the ceramic modules in metal casing like the AG 1980 and bad thing is they used printed on trace resistor so when the SMD capacitors fail and metal casing contains electrolytic it eat though them making it unrepairable. I have 5 of them sitting for very reason and part is unavailable, so you can’t even replace the whole module. So I use my JVC s7600 and s9600 for transfers instead. I wish I could get the AG 1980 working correctly again but ceramic module is destroyed as traces and printed resistor eating up, even metal can on outside is rusted from corrosion. I do have a couple that maybe able to repair as not as bad as the other three as low hours but not holding high hopes till I take module apart, but at least no rust on outside can?
Thanks Bob. I know I make a lot of vids on CRTs, but that's just because that's my biggest area of expertise. However I do have plans to cover more devices in the future and I'm excited about a VCR/VHS player showdown video I'll be making this year. I've been collecting numerous different VCRs to show off, restore and compare.
I stumbled upon that stupid Macrovision protection after buying my first capture card : Radeon All-in-Wonder 1st-gen, coupled with an AMD Duron 700 OC'ed to 900MHz, 128Mb of SDRAM and a UDMA66 20Gb HDD) [dedicated and separated from the system and CD-R drives]. Even when capturing home-recorded tapes, the image constantly shifted luma values and the captures were unusable : when the image was stable, the audio sync drifted further the longer the capture duration... :( ATI was so afraid of lawsuits that they actually implemented Macrovision detection in their drivers and mede them so sensitive that it saw it even where it wasn't present ! A few years later I shelled out the equivalent of $1500 (in 2005 $) to buy a KDV-500 transcoder (since to add to my misfortune I was in SECAM-L land !), a TBC-1000 and a Canopus ADVC-110. This setup is way more hassle-free : even if it captures to the lossy DV codec, it more than makes up for the slight loss of video information with the totally stable video/audio sync at all times ! :)
DV isn't a "slight" loss. You're tossing out 25-50% of your chroma data, and adding blocks, due to that 1990s tech. Yes, DV isn't even 2000s tech, but 1990s. All consumer capture cards must legally add some form of copyright flag recognition. The ADVC-110 does as well.
There is nothing commercial about this, it is as consumer as it gets. Commercial gear use BNC connectors for Y and C not S-Video and RCA connectors. You can actually get rid of that distribution amp all together and use only one single output from the internal TBC board.
That's simply not correct. Lots of professional components also used s-video. The TBC-1000 was a pro units, but made to handle consumer formats. TBCs were never consumer gear, prosumer at least (serious video hobbyists, mix of consumer and pro gear). You're also not correct about the internal TBC board. Many are factory modified, and do not work that way. The TBC-1000 saw multiple revisions over its 10+ years lifespan. Very few were raw TBC-100 boards. At best, you can bypass the VP299 amp. Either way, lots of case and solder mods needed.
@@lordsmurf It's a PCI dummy card, Was originally designed to fit inside a desktop into the mother board expansion slot but connections are made externally not via the bus connector, Someone had the idea to put it inside an enclosure and add a distribution amp, It was used in small bootleg houses, schools and churches not in a professional environment like production studios.
@@Capturing-Memories I'm hyper aware of what is in the TBC-1000, including multiple versions. You may need to look up who I am. Your assertions are wildly inaccurate. (And the statement that these were used by "bootleg houses" is even amusing, as bootleggers were cheap SOBs who almost never used quality gear.) Time base correctors (TBCs) are tools, and entirely agnostic to the quaint ideas of "pro" and "non-pro". There are multiple types of TBCs (line, field, frame, some others), and each type can be tweaked to the intended source. DataVideo made multiple TBCs, in multiple form factors, in the late 90s into the 00s, specifically due to the professional need of ingesting (capturing) analog consumer formats to digital. Period, nothing more, nothing less. It's not consumer gear, which is honestly laughable. These were sold by professional gear venues, such as B&H, most of which are now gone ('08-09 recession nuked many AV stores and manufacturers). These weren't being sold to Bucktooth Joe down at the Walmarts, or even at the "upscale" Best Buy or Circuit City. Not even Fry's, for the techno gearheads. Furthermore, these were intended to be used with quality gear, such as S-VHS VCRs with line TBCs, or cameras with line TBCs, not the $50 special from Kmart. Additionally, these TBCs were useful to lower end pro analog formats, such as BetacamSP. Some DataVideos of the era included chroma keys, not for consumers whatsoever. The VP-301x boards of the TBC-100/1000 didn't wary all that much from the larger VP boards of the wide body units, mostly larger due to 2x TBcs and added features. But the base footprint of just the single TBC on those larger VP boards is almost identical to the VP-301x/TBC-100. And again, not all VP-301x boards were the same. Most did not work independent of the VP-299 simple due to the power jump board. True TBC-100 cards had on-card power, and some slight pin changes. You can't just open up a TBC-1000, yank out the card, and have a new TBC. As if, if only.
@@lordsmurf Yes I know who you are Lordsmurf, But that doesn't change my opinion. Maybe we have different definitions of what a professional piece of gear is, Let's just leave it at that.
@@Capturing-Memories I almost forgot to address this: I'm sure some larger richer churches with AV used these (for sync'ing everything), and some colleges and larger/richer schools for TV and broadcasting education. Maybe even some analog-only operations that still existed, such as on-site event duplication (ie, one of many users for the VP-299). But those were not the primary audience. The trend was analog to digital, as far back as 1994-95, a few years after I got into video. And within a few years, DataVideo and Cypress both jumped into TBCs, to fill the void that existed. In fact, I've know multiple broadcasters that retired (2005-2020 time frames) who were doing this exact task, and had been since the 90s.
TBCs would be handy for fixing the D14 sync issues. Too bad there are basically none on the market. I'm hoping more scalers come out with 15 kHz input and output.
Too bad this goes for obscenely expensive prices on Ebay. Hopefully alternate fpga-based solutions like the upcoming PixelFX Morph will completely replace this.
Devices like the ossc, framemeister dont work like TBCs. They are just scalers that need a stable signal from the console, completely different than tape recording. If you look into the forums people that tried it with those devices arent too happpy about the results. What they are probably great for is to tap the image sensor from old analog cameras without having to record on tape.
@@thetechgenie7374 I wonder if even the pro devices from Blackmagic or AJA would do a proper job with accepting signal from those old consoles, Ive read that synch was sometimes quite sporadic, but the old CRTs didnt give much of a shit if the signal was off or not. Probably not so much with the pro equipment.
@@maxmustardman298 The reason CRT TV back in the day didn’t care if signal was unstable, or macrovision p- sync pulse was due to they had AGC circuit to compensate. Now a broadcast monitor doesn’t, or when transferring and you can actually see the flaws as how they were designed. VHS due to mechanical vibration has a lot of flaws same with consoles from era. Blackmagic hardware unfortunately from experience handles SD analog signals very poorly. It drops frames quite often and have sync loss even with a TBC. So reason people pay ridiculous amount for the Datavideo and etc. honestly I don’t care for them either as they have a crap VP-299 distribution amplifier and soften picture and cause ghosting issues at times, which thankfully can be bypassed. Plus with age the distribution amplifier board in rear capacitors fail, DC tan board capacitors fail and also connections need resoldering. Definitely not worth what they are going for today. Saw a working one with capacitors changed out and he had priced it at $950 for 3 weeks and no buyers and dropped priced to $800 as one of the watchers on it, I could have got it for $800 as he sent out best offers and he finally sold it and had high feedback. So wondering how many of those Datavideo TBC’s are actually being sold at over 1k suspect they are not and people are not paying, or family and friends are pretending to buy them to inflate price? I highly doubt a AS-IS without adapter scratches all over it is actually selling for 1k? Seen NIB in the box sell for same? The refurbished ones are the funniest as one guy on forum claims it take him over a month to refurbished one? It takes me literally 30 minutes? Even modding them take not long? I love reading some overhyped them and make it seem like it took a lot of labor? All they need is VP-299 distribution amplifier bypass and capacitors replaced and cable connections resolder. Not work the over 1k to 3k premium tech sellers are asking over a AS-IS one?
@@thetechgenie7374 Its a shame with those machines like the Datavideo, they are the only ones that people can easily find out about or find information on without having too look hours upon end, and the sellers know that by now. Add that to the fact that those machines were never meant to be used in the consumer market, and maintaining requires ressources, you've got yourself a very niche market with inflated prices.
Very interesting subject, I'll watch this later today for sure. I have a pro Sony SVO vhs deck and am very happy with that. it is super stable. but I've been eyeing a TBC, mostly for capture.
Interesting stuff. I remember as a kid learning about inputs and outputs on VCRs and TVs. Yeah, I thought I was a pretty clever kid. Can't remember what movie it was but we rented one from a video store and I tried outputting it to another VCR to copy it to a blank tape. Didn't work of course because of the copy protection that I didn't know about. All that got recorded was a garbled picture 😅
Would love to hear your opinions on some of the medical VCR options people out in the community are getting into. Seems like they're pretty great in terms of usually having a high quality TBC as well as lacking any kind of intensive processing to visually alter the signal. The Mitsubishi MD3000U is one I've picked up personally, and god damn is it just wonderful. Seems to be getting more love around the internet too now that people are actually getting hands on with it / informing themselves on the technology beyond just speculation.
Medical VCRs were for documentation recording. The playback is almost always terrible, limited. Something as simple as DOC tends to be missing. There's also the "yuck factor" of having hospital gear in your clean-by-comparison home or office. You can never get that "hospital smell" out of it, no matter how long it's been gone from a hospital. It leeches in.
Too bad these units are extremely hard to find these days, let alone finding one in good working order and then there is the price...Personally I've come to accept what is for the most part small imperfections caused by deviations in the time base, most of the tapes I've done without a TBC has been surprisingly successful, a good VCR will do the trick in most cases.
Always start with a good deck with DNR like a JVC s7600. Yes the Datavideo has a flaw using a junk distribution amp added noise overlaid by mushy softening that is, if the garbage distribution amp doesn't cut out the signal altogether at random. Best TBC I used for consumer tape formats is a Iden ivt-7p but finding one that low hours and still works correctly is going to be hard as most have high hours and resold over the years. Very complex unit to service as two power supplies and two main boards and need test equipment and service manual to service correctly. Once serviced it one of the best TBC I tried to date as doesn’t freeze and proc amps are good on this one and does well with consumer level signals . Reason why most just pay for the Datavideo as much easier to service. Even back then the datavideo was about $500. I did get mines for $99 used back then but been many years and not very many around, so typically go for $500 to $800 for AS-IS $1200 is to much but you have to wait and add to search to get notifications but your likely have to replace a few capacitors. I won’t pay the $1800 to as high as $2749 those sellers are asking way to much for just replacing a few capacitors and for a Decent as will get the job done and better then the Cypress but not that great of a TBC as stated above. Yes they used junk capacitors and parts are under $18 bucks to replace yourself. If you really want to go though capacitors on the main board invest in a ESR meter.
@@thetechgenie7374 This is NOT correct: "those sellers are asking way to much for just replacing a few capacitors". These units have many issues, and many are NOT related to caps whatsoever. I have to fully tear down and rebuild these at times, sometimes even having to completely replaced or bypass the VP299 boards. It's not cheap or easy to do all of this. Also tedious, time consuming. When you get a truly refurb'd unit, it's worth $2749 or so. But I would agree that it's overpaying eBay sellers, who most often wouldn't know a TBC from a toaster, and just want to flip units for a quick buck. They have no idea if the unit functions properly, or at all. That's not the same whatsoever. You're gambling, not buying. Odds are you're just paying big bucks for a DIY project. Or you can return it, so the seller can offload it to another sucker. And you still don't have a TBC, wasted time. There's been a few hack repair units on eBay, and those almost all entirely failed within a year. I know this, because I've fixed a few, or referred it to somebody that I know can do a good job. That's more what you're speaking about. Amateur hour repairs.
Their other frame TBC’s that can handle VHS and other consumers formats well and actually better then the datavideo 1000 I have plus the professional TBC as has Proc amps and one of the only one that can handle consumer lever signal well as most don’t. Won’t say as prices will shoot up due to stupid eBay sellers. The problem with the Datavideo is find the DataVideo added noise overlaid by mushy softening that is, if the garbage distribution amp doesn’t cut the signal. The Iden doesn’t and proc amps work great. It my go to but finding one low hours is hard and working correctly is like Finding a needle in the haystack as most were abused and have tons of hours on them and likely been resold over the years and will likely not work correctly anymore. The Datavideo is better the Cypress AVT and the Datavideo would be the one to go with between the two and usually one I recommend, but replace junk capacitors on the tan board on power supply as seal breakdown and they leak and go high ESR. The AVT 8710 green color one good, avoid the black ones. But the green ones also have flaws as when it lost sync on a field, it would hold it frozen while the other field remained in motion. The ghosting on bad patches of tape was unacceptable, so was the flaw with the Cypress. I can say this model as eBay sellers already know about that one as on forums. I know these as a engineer that dealt with all sort of TBC’s and serviced and calibrated them.
That's not entirely accurate. (1) In recent years, shady eBay sellers would swap black boards into green cases. (2) TVONE (AVToolbox) had commercial contracts, and it's believed that bad green units were warranty serviced in the "black" era. At this late date, all I.Den units are trashed. I've only seen one good IVT-7 in the past decade. It was a PITA to calibrate correctly, something that you'll never have to do with DataVideo/Cypress type units. After that experience, I'll never touch another I.Den if I do see one again. There are other units, but each has issues, most of them worse than any DataVideo on a bad day.
@@lordsmurf eBay as always doesn’t shock me they do that to be honest, you always have sellers trying to get over, I seen that a couple times so far. Now yes your correct most broadcast units will be trashed at this point. The hours and abuse they put on them very high compared to a consumer unit and way more complex. Thankfully the I.Den that I got was never really used much at all and still even had the feet and was never rack mounted. So got lucky but do agree most are junk by now as they are a pain to overhaul especially since it dual two large boards you have to go though and calibrate afterwards. If you don’t have the test equipment, or knowledge avoid pretty much is what I tell people. The I.Den it done good for me and ironically same model. For the general consumer I get why they pay for the data video as not much you have to do to get working correctly may not be commercial quality but does get the job done reasonably well.
Just a small correction. Most anime on VHS never had Macrovision (outside of some disney tapes). The main reason this is a must have for VHS collectors is it fixes dropped frames. Production companies had to make sure any tape they broadcast onto the airwaves never had any "NO SIGNAL" errors. They probably never intended people to use these at home, but in the modern age when you want to make a video about a VHS tape, they're an absolute must otherwise you completely lose the signal any time the tape is damaged.
Why did I sell my TBC-1000 years ago. Thanks for the video.
Beautiful! I used this vid to help me change a few caps on my device. More power to you RT! Thank you for this!
Awesome! Congrats. It's a great piece of hardware
@@RetroTechUSA I also followed your Mouser tutorial to order the caps, so thank you for that as well.
I have precisely this device, with the same capacitors in trouble - except mine have leaked. Could you possibly let me know which capacitors you used to replace them?
Can you say what is your source for the replacement capacitors?
I got two "Commercial Use Only" Panasonic S-VHS players from Goodwill and they have built-in TBC.
That's a great deal.
That's what they call a "LINE" TBC. Mine is a "full frame" TBC.
Two TBCs for two separate tasks.
- The line TBC is for cleaning the image quality.
- The external full frame TBC / frame sync is for correcting signal problems.
@@kennylauderdale_en Thanks.
I got the AG-1970P and AG-1980P. Someone wrote a FAQ that said "Panasonic's [AG-1970P & AG-1980P] S-VHS professional editing decks, with full frame TBC (instead of line TBC)." but then contradicted himself elsewhere calling it a "full-field" TBC. Guess I don't know what to think! :)
Only works for playback though... no pass-thru.
@@RetroTechUSA Yeah, only problem was that I was visiting family across the country and they displaced a lot of other stuff from my luggage! ;)
...then the capacitors went bad a few years later. The people recapping these and selling for several hundred dollars aren't sharing the cap values so I'll eventually make a list but just getting to them all is such a b@!$h that I haven't had the chance (been years).
Panasonic don’t get me started. Most are going to have bad SMD capacitors on the ceramic modules in metal casing like the AG 1980 and bad thing is they used printed on trace resistor so when the SMD capacitors fail and metal casing contains electrolytic it eat though them making it unrepairable. I have 5 of them sitting for very reason and part is unavailable, so you can’t even replace the whole module.
So I use my JVC s7600 and s9600 for transfers instead. I wish I could get the AG 1980 working correctly again but ceramic module is destroyed as traces and printed resistor eating up, even metal can on outside is rusted from corrosion.
I do have a couple that maybe able to repair as not as bad as the other three as low hours but not holding high hopes till I take module apart, but at least no rust on outside can?
Nice! I love when Steve works on something other than monitors.
Thanks Bob. I know I make a lot of vids on CRTs, but that's just because that's my biggest area of expertise. However I do have plans to cover more devices in the future and I'm excited about a VCR/VHS player showdown video I'll be making this year. I've been collecting numerous different VCRs to show off, restore and compare.
I'm glad I got my JVC VCRs with TBC when I did...these things are going for PVM prices nowadays.
I stumbled upon that stupid Macrovision protection after buying my first capture card : Radeon All-in-Wonder 1st-gen, coupled with an AMD Duron 700 OC'ed to 900MHz, 128Mb of SDRAM and a UDMA66 20Gb HDD) [dedicated and separated from the system and CD-R drives]. Even when capturing home-recorded tapes, the image constantly shifted luma values and the captures were unusable : when the image was stable, the audio sync drifted further the longer the capture duration... :( ATI was so afraid of lawsuits that they actually implemented Macrovision detection in their drivers and mede them so sensitive that it saw it even where it wasn't present !
A few years later I shelled out the equivalent of $1500 (in 2005 $) to buy a KDV-500 transcoder (since to add to my misfortune I was in SECAM-L land !), a TBC-1000 and a Canopus ADVC-110. This setup is way more hassle-free : even if it captures to the lossy DV codec, it more than makes up for the slight loss of video information with the totally stable video/audio sync at all times ! :)
DV isn't a "slight" loss. You're tossing out 25-50% of your chroma data, and adding blocks, due to that 1990s tech. Yes, DV isn't even 2000s tech, but 1990s. All consumer capture cards must legally add some form of copyright flag recognition. The ADVC-110 does as well.
There is nothing commercial about this, it is as consumer as it gets. Commercial gear use BNC connectors for Y and C not S-Video and RCA connectors. You can actually get rid of that distribution amp all together and use only one single output from the internal TBC board.
That's simply not correct. Lots of professional components also used s-video. The TBC-1000 was a pro units, but made to handle consumer formats. TBCs were never consumer gear, prosumer at least (serious video hobbyists, mix of consumer and pro gear).
You're also not correct about the internal TBC board. Many are factory modified, and do not work that way. The TBC-1000 saw multiple revisions over its 10+ years lifespan. Very few were raw TBC-100 boards. At best, you can bypass the VP299 amp. Either way, lots of case and solder mods needed.
@@lordsmurf It's a PCI dummy card, Was originally designed to fit inside a desktop into the mother board expansion slot but connections are made externally not via the bus connector, Someone had the idea to put it inside an enclosure and add a distribution amp, It was used in small bootleg houses, schools and churches not in a professional environment like production studios.
@@Capturing-Memories I'm hyper aware of what is in the TBC-1000, including multiple versions. You may need to look up who I am.
Your assertions are wildly inaccurate. (And the statement that these were used by "bootleg houses" is even amusing, as bootleggers were cheap SOBs who almost never used quality gear.)
Time base correctors (TBCs) are tools, and entirely agnostic to the quaint ideas of "pro" and "non-pro". There are multiple types of TBCs (line, field, frame, some others), and each type can be tweaked to the intended source. DataVideo made multiple TBCs, in multiple form factors, in the late 90s into the 00s, specifically due to the professional need of ingesting (capturing) analog consumer formats to digital. Period, nothing more, nothing less.
It's not consumer gear, which is honestly laughable. These were sold by professional gear venues, such as B&H, most of which are now gone ('08-09 recession nuked many AV stores and manufacturers). These weren't being sold to Bucktooth Joe down at the Walmarts, or even at the "upscale" Best Buy or Circuit City. Not even Fry's, for the techno gearheads. Furthermore, these were intended to be used with quality gear, such as S-VHS VCRs with line TBCs, or cameras with line TBCs, not the $50 special from Kmart.
Additionally, these TBCs were useful to lower end pro analog formats, such as BetacamSP. Some DataVideos of the era included chroma keys, not for consumers whatsoever. The VP-301x boards of the TBC-100/1000 didn't wary all that much from the larger VP boards of the wide body units, mostly larger due to 2x TBcs and added features. But the base footprint of just the single TBC on those larger VP boards is almost identical to the VP-301x/TBC-100.
And again, not all VP-301x boards were the same. Most did not work independent of the VP-299 simple due to the power jump board. True TBC-100 cards had on-card power, and some slight pin changes. You can't just open up a TBC-1000, yank out the card, and have a new TBC. As if, if only.
@@lordsmurf Yes I know who you are Lordsmurf, But that doesn't change my opinion. Maybe we have different definitions of what a professional piece of gear is, Let's just leave it at that.
@@Capturing-Memories I almost forgot to address this:
I'm sure some larger richer churches with AV used these (for sync'ing everything), and some colleges and larger/richer schools for TV and broadcasting education. Maybe even some analog-only operations that still existed, such as on-site event duplication (ie, one of many users for the VP-299). But those were not the primary audience. The trend was analog to digital, as far back as 1994-95, a few years after I got into video. And within a few years, DataVideo and Cypress both jumped into TBCs, to fill the void that existed. In fact, I've know multiple broadcasters that retired (2005-2020 time frames) who were doing this exact task, and had been since the 90s.
TBCs would be handy for fixing the D14 sync issues. Too bad there are basically none on the market. I'm hoping more scalers come out with 15 kHz input and output.
Too bad this goes for obscenely expensive prices on Ebay. Hopefully alternate fpga-based solutions like the upcoming PixelFX Morph will completely replace this.
Devices like the ossc, framemeister dont work like TBCs. They are just scalers that need a stable signal from the console, completely different than tape recording. If you look into the forums people that tried it with those devices arent too happpy about the results. What they are probably great for is to tap the image sensor from old analog cameras without having to record on tape.
@@maxmustardman298 Yes 100% correct.
@@thetechgenie7374 I wonder if even the pro devices from Blackmagic or AJA would do a proper job with accepting signal from those old consoles, Ive read that synch was sometimes quite sporadic, but the old CRTs didnt give much of a shit if the signal was off or not. Probably not so much with the pro equipment.
@@maxmustardman298 The reason CRT TV back in the day didn’t care if signal was unstable, or macrovision p- sync pulse was due to they had AGC circuit to compensate. Now a broadcast monitor doesn’t, or when transferring and you can actually see the flaws as how they were designed. VHS due to mechanical vibration has a lot of flaws same with consoles from era.
Blackmagic hardware unfortunately from experience handles SD analog signals very poorly. It drops frames quite often and have sync loss even with a TBC.
So reason people pay ridiculous amount for the Datavideo and etc. honestly I don’t care for them either as they have a crap VP-299 distribution amplifier and soften picture and cause ghosting issues at times, which thankfully can be bypassed. Plus with age the distribution amplifier board in rear capacitors fail, DC tan board capacitors fail and also connections need resoldering. Definitely not worth what they are going for today. Saw a working one with capacitors changed out and he had priced it at $950 for 3 weeks and no buyers and dropped priced to $800 as one of the watchers on it, I could have got it for $800 as he sent out best offers and he finally sold it and had high feedback. So wondering how many of those Datavideo TBC’s are actually being sold at over 1k suspect they are not and people are not paying, or family and friends are pretending to buy them to inflate price? I highly doubt a AS-IS without adapter scratches all over it is actually selling for 1k? Seen NIB in the box sell for same?
The refurbished ones are the funniest as one guy on forum claims it take him over a month to refurbished one? It takes me literally 30 minutes? Even modding them take not long? I love reading some overhyped them and make it seem like it took a lot of labor? All they need is VP-299 distribution amplifier bypass and capacitors replaced and cable connections resolder. Not work the over 1k to 3k premium tech sellers are asking over a AS-IS one?
@@thetechgenie7374 Its a shame with those machines like the Datavideo, they are the only ones that people can easily find out about or find information on without having too look hours upon end, and the sellers know that by now. Add that to the fact that those machines were never meant to be used in the consumer market, and maintaining requires ressources, you've got yourself a very niche market with inflated prices.
Very interesting subject, I'll watch this later today for sure. I have a pro Sony SVO vhs deck and am very happy with that. it is super stable. but I've been eyeing a TBC, mostly for capture.
Interesting stuff. I remember as a kid learning about inputs and outputs on VCRs and TVs. Yeah, I thought I was a pretty clever kid. Can't remember what movie it was but we rented one from a video store and I tried outputting it to another VCR to copy it to a blank tape. Didn't work of course because of the copy protection that I didn't know about. All that got recorded was a garbled picture 😅
Would love to hear your opinions on some of the medical VCR options people out in the community are getting into. Seems like they're pretty great in terms of usually having a high quality TBC as well as lacking any kind of intensive processing to visually alter the signal. The Mitsubishi MD3000U is one I've picked up personally, and god damn is it just wonderful. Seems to be getting more love around the internet too now that people are actually getting hands on with it / informing themselves on the technology beyond just speculation.
Medical VCRs were for documentation recording. The playback is almost always terrible, limited. Something as simple as DOC tends to be missing.
There's also the "yuck factor" of having hospital gear in your clean-by-comparison home or office. You can never get that "hospital smell" out of it, no matter how long it's been gone from a hospital. It leeches in.
Too bad these units are extremely hard to find these days, let alone finding one in good working order and then there is the price...Personally I've come to accept what is for the most part small imperfections caused by deviations in the time base, most of the tapes I've done without a TBC has been surprisingly successful, a good VCR will do the trick in most cases.
Always start with a good deck with DNR like a JVC s7600. Yes the Datavideo has a flaw using a junk distribution amp added noise overlaid by mushy softening that is, if the garbage distribution amp doesn't cut out the signal altogether at random. Best TBC I used for consumer tape formats is a Iden ivt-7p but finding one that low hours and still works correctly is going to be hard as most have high hours and resold over the years. Very complex unit to service as two power supplies and two main boards and need test equipment and service manual to service correctly. Once serviced it one of the best TBC I tried to date as doesn’t freeze and proc amps are good on this one and does well with consumer level signals .
Reason why most just pay for the Datavideo as much easier to service. Even back then the datavideo was about $500. I did get mines for $99 used back then but been many years and not very many around, so typically go for $500 to $800 for AS-IS $1200 is to much but you have to wait and add to search to get notifications but your likely have to replace a few capacitors. I won’t pay the $1800 to as high as $2749 those sellers are asking way to much for just replacing a few capacitors and for a Decent as will get the job done and better then the Cypress but not that great of a TBC as stated above. Yes they used junk capacitors and parts are under $18 bucks to replace yourself. If you really want to go though capacitors on the main board invest in a ESR meter.
@@thetechgenie7374 This is NOT correct: "those sellers are asking way to much for just replacing a few capacitors".
These units have many issues, and many are NOT related to caps whatsoever. I have to fully tear down and rebuild these at times, sometimes even having to completely replaced or bypass the VP299 boards. It's not cheap or easy to do all of this. Also tedious, time consuming. When you get a truly refurb'd unit, it's worth $2749 or so.
But I would agree that it's overpaying eBay sellers, who most often wouldn't know a TBC from a toaster, and just want to flip units for a quick buck. They have no idea if the unit functions properly, or at all. That's not the same whatsoever. You're gambling, not buying. Odds are you're just paying big bucks for a DIY project. Or you can return it, so the seller can offload it to another sucker. And you still don't have a TBC, wasted time.
There's been a few hack repair units on eBay, and those almost all entirely failed within a year. I know this, because I've fixed a few, or referred it to somebody that I know can do a good job. That's more what you're speaking about. Amateur hour repairs.
Their other frame TBC’s that can handle VHS and other consumers formats well and actually better then the datavideo 1000 I have plus the professional TBC as has Proc amps and one of the only one that can handle consumer lever signal well as most don’t. Won’t say as prices will shoot up due to stupid eBay sellers.
The problem with the Datavideo is find the DataVideo added noise overlaid by mushy softening that is, if the garbage distribution amp doesn’t cut the signal. The Iden doesn’t and proc amps work great. It my go to but finding one low hours is hard and working correctly is like Finding a needle in the haystack as most were abused and have tons of hours on them and likely been resold over the years and will likely not work correctly anymore. The Datavideo is better the Cypress AVT and the Datavideo would be the one to go with between the two and usually one I recommend, but replace junk capacitors on the tan board on power supply as seal breakdown and they leak and go high ESR.
The AVT 8710 green color one good, avoid the black ones. But the green ones also have flaws as when it lost sync on a field, it would hold it frozen while the other field remained in motion. The ghosting on bad patches of tape was unacceptable, so was the flaw with the Cypress. I can say this model as eBay sellers already know about that one as on forums.
I know these as a engineer that dealt with all sort of TBC’s and serviced and calibrated them.
That's not entirely accurate.
(1) In recent years, shady eBay sellers would swap black boards into green cases.
(2) TVONE (AVToolbox) had commercial contracts, and it's believed that bad green units were warranty serviced in the "black" era.
At this late date, all I.Den units are trashed. I've only seen one good IVT-7 in the past decade. It was a PITA to calibrate correctly, something that you'll never have to do with DataVideo/Cypress type units. After that experience, I'll never touch another I.Den if I do see one again.
There are other units, but each has issues, most of them worse than any DataVideo on a bad day.
@@lordsmurf eBay as always doesn’t shock me they do that to be honest, you always have sellers trying to get over, I seen that a couple times so far.
Now yes your correct most broadcast units will be trashed at this point. The hours and abuse they put on them very high compared to a consumer unit and way more complex. Thankfully the I.Den that I got was never really used much at all and still even had the feet and was never rack mounted. So got lucky but do agree most are junk by now as they are a pain to overhaul especially since it dual two large boards you have to go though and calibrate afterwards. If you don’t have the test equipment, or knowledge avoid pretty much is what I tell people. The I.Den it done good for me and ironically same model. For the general consumer I get why they pay for the data video as not much you have to do to get working correctly may not be commercial quality but does get the job done reasonably well.
This is a cheap TBC for consumers, not professional stuff.
False. Professionals needed to ingest consumer sources. That's why these existed.