Part 1 - P2293 High Pressure Fuel Pump Diagnosis - 2006 2.0T VW Jetta
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- Опубліковано 3 чер 2020
- P2293 is a relatively common code when it comes to VW/Audi's 2.0L turbo "BPY" engine. In part one of this series, we look at the steps to take in diagnosing this high-pressure fuel system related code. Enjoy!
- Авто та транспорт
Thank you Mike. Good job. Have a blessed and safe week to you and your family.
Hey Billy, thanks! You as well!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great video as always! Can’t wait for part 2! Thanks for sharing w/Us!
Hey Angel, thanks for watching! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
That was a nice "block window" someone created there, Mike! Nice work getting that one going again. That cam didn't look too good, but hopefully that original pump does the trick. I know the feeling of not wanting to dig deep into your own vehicles. Had that same feeling when I saw all the metal chunks on the rear differential magnet in my '07 Silverado a little over a year ago ...
Must be the moon phase. I've been working on my own stuff quite often lately, too! Hub bearings in my '07 Silverado (For the 2nd time! Talk about purchases we regret! Biggest lemon I've ever owned), then I had to rebuild the original power steering pump in my '86 Grand Marquis (34 years, 268k miles! Only rebuilt due to leaks), & replace all the lines. Rockauto sent me the wrong return line, so I attempted to heat and bend the metal portion - big fail! It kinked & twisted, and caused a big restriction. Ended up cutting it off, and double-clamping a hose. Always something! Anyway, looking forward to next Thursday. 👍🍻
Hey Smitty, yeh I had my fingers crossed on that cam...we'll see. Ugh! Isn't it just a blast working on your own stuff. It's funny how much I tend to put my own stuff off haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
GoTech - Same here, brother! I had been planning a total front end overhaul on our Grand Marquis for 5 years. Just got to it last fall ...😂
As South Main Auto says, "A t-shirt without a pocket is a rag". Lol
I think Mike got him in mind when pointing out the pocket tshirts 😉
Haha Eric is a stickler for that pocket!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great video love those side tips.
Hey Bill, thanks!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Great tip on the fuel pressure bleed down test
Hey Codr, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Common problem on those GDIs Mike as you know already! I believe they sell a kit that comes with the HFPP and a new cam follower. Now as to the camshaft scoring,it’s not looking too good...it might have dug a bit into the cam lobe. Hopefully you’ll be ok,just give it a try!
Thanks for the video Mike! 👍
Hey Nick, thanks for watching! Fingers crossed on the cam...but I'm not getting my hopes up too much.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Diggin the videos, I’m really interested in learning about vehicle repairs, it would save so much overhead costs if I could fix minor issues to save $$$ for more projects N free time. Plus I like watching and taking in all the knowledge I Can to help others. Plus you’re a handsome guy, no shame in complementing someone.
My 19 Ram hemi 4x4 (28,850 miles) has been acting up, weird sounds at cold start up. I recorded a few videos if you would listen to them.
Stay happy! Stay healthy, Stay Hard.
Hey GaynNovi, thanks for watching! I agree, Scanner Danner is a great resource for learning. Sounds are typically hard to pick out via a recording and not being by the vehicle, but sure, shoot me the clips in an email. My email comes up at the end of this video.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
GREAT VID MIKE
Hey Mason, thanks!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Sorry Mike..missed this earlier. Already way beyond midnight now and actually closer to your 4am already.. Would love to add to the collection again, especially a shirt with a pocket. NICE
Haven't looked yet but I would assume there is a cam lobe lift spec you could do a lift measurement on to see if that lobe is down some. Glad to see your doing good..and not so shaggy Lol
Look forward to the conclusion in next weeks show. Cheers Bro
Hey man, all good! You should get more sleep haha! I'd guess there is a spec on that...but it is a VW, so who knows.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hello I love your videos... you’re great man
Hey Rodolfo, thanks man! :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Man! it really annoyed me about the fuel pressure bleeding part not shown because of the safety concerns. While I can appreciate the concern but one can get killed changing oil on the car...smh. I don't own a VW but in my opinion that would've made this video very helpful to someone looking to do the job, while you can still throw a warning to be careful. DiagnoseDan showed how to do it in one of his videos if I recall correctly.
Hey BuddysAdventures, sorry to hear you feel that way. I guess your best bet would be to watch Dan's video for the procedure then.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I'd say its actually more dangerous to not show it. He'll end up with someone just going ham and winging it instead. Its not a difficult or exceedingly dangerous procedure to do. Better option would have been a disclaimer such as, "Someone told me I'm a professional parts changing monkey. However, I don't believe you have the same skills. So only follow what I'm doing at your own risk. I'm not liable or responsible for you learning the hard way."
By not providing the information on how to do the job safely but letting you know that it is possible to do, Id say he is more liable.
Very good work
Thanks Nigel!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Here are some more informations about this system. (VW SSP 334) Great videos btw.
Hey Jure, i'll check it out. Thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
SSP stands for Self - study program.(A lot of useful informations about VW and AUDI all systems)
That cam is trashed, you're not going to get significant wear on the follower and not trash the lobe also, the close up you showed gives clear evidence that the lobe is wiped. I deal with high pressure diesel common rail and have seen what happens. Sadly you're gonna have to replace the cam 🙁 and you run the risk of trashing the follower on the newer pump if you run it against a trashed cam lobe. 🤔
Hey Bryan, I wish it weren't true :(
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Cool video👍
Hey Philly, thanks!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
very good my brother
Thanks Cesar!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I know very little about these GDI systems. My 7 month ownership of a 2020 Toyota RAV 4 has shown the vehicle to be very impressive in economy and power. One interesting thing. When you put the key (mine is the base model, not the pushbutton model) in the ign switch, before you turn it to on, you can hear the pump run for 2 seconds. A good idea I say. The high press pump is a little, but not much, noisy. The engine takes 0W-16 oil. For now I'm using Toyota oil and filter for the warranty.
Hey Mike, thanks for watching man! Enjoying the vehicle? I have two GDI Fords with pushbutton start, when the key is close I can hear it prime. 0W-16 is crazy...I can't believe that is acceptable.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Thanks dad for not giving us the info and letting us decide if we can depressurize all by ourselves
I am going to call the camshaft as toast. For a customer, a new/used good HP pump on that shaft is a recipe for a come back.
Hey, yes, if this were a customers car I would have suggested a camshaft right away just judging by that followers wear.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hi Mike you might want check out Frank Massey top ten test he tests the whole system doing pump proof test using the oscilloscope extremely clever chap definitely one to watch on UA-cam
Hey, thanks man, I'll check it out!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Wished you showed us a real close-up of the follower but that thing looks absolutely trashed, hole in it even? The camshaft is junk as well, if I'm not mistaken the BPY had the Rev A cam with a coating on the surface from the factory. Anyway, it's scrap either way with all that wear and pitting, the follower should be able to spin on the cam and only have minor and even wear in the middle.
But usually the fault would be low fuel pressure when the lobes wear down, so that's interesting. Just a worn follower would still yield the same relative displacement in the pump, that's why it's so easy to miss before it's too late.
Hey G E, join in for part 2, i'll show it in there :) Interesting about the cam Rev A. I'm really not looking forward to probably throwing a cam in here....
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTrainingWell don't quote me on that rev. A part, I have no experience with the BPY hands on. Just did my research before I bought a BUL, and I have confirmed that one has the rev. B cam.
It'll be interesting to see what it all looks like up close, and if you have an borescope have a look at the intake valves while you're at it.
Fun video to watch, though now you have me wondering how the dealership pros safely decompress the high pressure line. With it driven off the camshaft, you can't just turn it off with the scan tool, pull the fuse, or unplug the high pressure pump. Even with the tank pump turned off that high pressure pump will mount significant pressure. Maybe one could find a fuel injector test procedure in the scan tool to spray fuel into cylinders with engine off, decompressing the line into a cylinder, hopefully not enough volume to hydrolock. Without the factory scan tool I wonder if people use a dangerous work around, which responsible authors don't want to show....
Hey Spelunkerd, thanks for watching! I'm not going to get into the procedure, but it is possible to bleed off the high pressure without a factory scanner :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I can't imagine it being that complicated or 'dangerous' if you take basic precautions. I would guess you'd start up the car and disable the primary fuel pump until the car shuts off. Check the pressure using the scan tool to be certain. Then drape a rag etc and crack the fuel bolt loose.
Hi, one question to gotech and everyone, please help, on 2010 audi a4 with high pressure pump, what is normal fuel rail pressure to expect after the car sat for few hour or the next day in the morning in a normal day with 75 degrees weather? Before starting the engine.
I have a audi q7 getting p2296 and p2293 just changed the fuel pressure regulator
I have the same code and I replace the HPP and now my car cranks but wont start
I did the same thing but bought am old 2003 Jetta Vr6, 6 speed, lots of fun to drive but hate all the plastic parts that it has in the engine bay. My first and last VW!
Hey Bernarda, some lessons have to be learned the hard way...haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Wery good video!
What is the low pump fuel pressure (psi) have Volkswagen jetta gli 2.0 turbo 2012?
Hello! What fault produce the noise at 3:48? My car have the same engine and do the same noise. The noise disappears when disconnect the HPFP. The workshop says that is the HPFP and not the turbo. Did you now if the noise is really for the turbo. Thanks.
This! My GLI is doing the same weird noise. Have you gotten anywhere with this? Just replaced my engine and did all of my big maintenance. Made sure I went through everything.
for the low pressure side. if you have idle 50 psi and wide open throttle 72 psi. can you conclude the low pressure side pump is okay. or do i need to removed the line and see how much volume it came out. because i think you can have good psi and low volume.
and also when you said the hot soak. after 10 minutes the pressure will rises, due to temperature in the engine bay. can you explain a little bit, i am kinda lost.thank you!!
Hey Hua Jack, if there was a volume issue it would result in a lower pressure...unless there was a severe restriction. As far as the pressure rising, the fuel rail is sealed off when the car is shut off. The fuel is cooler than the engine, it came from the gas tank. When fuel increases in temperature, due to the hot engine, it increases in pressure. Therefore we see an increase in pressure on our sensor.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have a problem with my 2008 2.0t FSI. One day I was driving and I had almost no power at all I could barely get up to speed. Then later i tried to start it and It cranks but won’t start, I have low fuel pressure I only have 4 psi. I replaced the in tank fuel pump, the high pressure fuel pump, fuel pump module, and the fuel filter. Do you know what else it could be.
Hello Rudd. Did you figure out what was it? Thanks Jeet
Hai iam from indonesian . Goodjob friend 👍
Hey, thanks for watching!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I have this code on a 2010 also. I also have a extremely weak engine off idle won’t build power till like 3,500 rpm. Did you have any symptoms other than the code?
Thanks for watching and good luck in your diagnosis.
Ryan W, Technical Instructor
My 2011 gti has a 3.77 bar for fuel rail pressure when cranking and does not increase in bar. Car cranks but wont start with no codes present
Did a see a fuel pressure tester, for low side, then after the pump replacement, no pressure tester? Assuming low pressure was good? If so, Pump and follower and youre golden.
Hey Kurt, low pressure was in spec on this car. I really hope that it fixes it!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
My reading in the low side was 85 and shakes thru 83psi to 90psi when accelerate the psi stay at 90 and the HPFP pressure at idle is 556psi and when i dive it stays above 1200 psi ? Whats the normal Low pressure PSI and normal High pressure PSI?? Please help me out i cant find the right info
I found my answer-- low pressure normal PSI between 50.7psi(3.5bars) - 87.1psi(6.0bars) and the High Pressure Pump normal psi is between 725.1psi (50 bars) - 2175.5psi (150bars). Hope this is helpful.
A lot of GDI engines have problems. It is called fuel dilution and abrasive, chain wearing soot from incomplete combustion of large fuel droplets. It is so bad the OEMs and oil companies have known for 6 years and only now have come out with API SP and GF-6 with many new tests for timing chain wear.
Hey Brian, I knew there had to be a reason for this uptick in chain issues. Interesting that they are making new standards for oil. I'll have to check that out, thanks!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
A VW auto group with problems, no way that never happens. That’s a pretty sweet shirt I’ve got to get me one.
The counter balance oil pumps are a blast in those... The 1.8 pump is so much more reliable. The 2.0 Delete is the way to go....
These ARE really nice engines until they start acting up. First sign of metal flake, it's time to rebuild it or junk it... After replacing the oil pump, the high pressure fuel pump follower disintegrated and took out the cam lobe! After replacing the head, the car continued being problematic. ANY metal flake in those engines, is BAD NEWS. (Those followers are problematic too...)
I may never buy a 2.0T VW again haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
you need the snap on blue tooth fuel pressure gauge.it is great for road tests
Hey Randy, so I went into this comment thinking you were joking...until I Googled it. Woah!!! I never knew they made such a thing. Now I need a new tool :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Hey my mk5 GLI has that same weird chatter that you said was turbo noise.. what exactly is that? Audi tech here and I’ve never heard the sound before @gotech
How about checking the fuel pressure sensor for accurate reporting?
Good point. I am guessing that Mike does not have a high [enough] fuel pressure gauge to test the "secondary" [high side] pressure. This would be my next step after confirming the "delivery" [low side] pressure was in spec.
Hey Traveler X, that's correct. I don't have a gauge capable of reading that high. Plus, the TSB and noise from the HPP area was enough to lead me into that path. Seeing wear on the follower and a questionable cam was evidence enough. I suppose it's possible that even with a perfect cam/follower/pump that the sensor could still be bad...but my guts leaning towards pressure creation instead of pressure reading.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
On my car I have a p2293 fault code and the car stall and won't start until it's cooled down any one experience this ?
this kinda damage was shown by Positive Lead Diagnostics (student of ScannerDanner) here on UA-cam quite a while ago. makes you wonder.
also: nice hair / beard cut!
with damage i meant the hole in the block. not the "hole" in the fuel pump cam follower. ;-)
Hey, thanks for watching! It was refreshing to finally get my hair cut, haha!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
👍 who couldn't use more fuel economy!
Especially these days, right!?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Nice info on that fault code ,where did you get that info?
Hey Martijn 83, thanks for watching! The fault code data was pulled from Alldata and Identifix.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Thanks Mike!
Is there any way to buy one of those T-shirts?
Hey CannMan, nope these shirts are "earn them" only.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Mike that cam looks kind of rough, what the condition of blown engine cam. If all else fails, just dump the car off at Bean Snapers .
Hey Over Load, yeh, I'm not too thrilled about it. Snappers huh? You're familiar with WI?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Native
Do you still have the lexus? what does the wife drive everyday ? Hope you got her something niced. Please stay safe from covid-19.
Hey Jeremy, thanks for watching! No, I got rid of the Lexus a while back. Ended up with this...project next. My wife drives a 2017 Ford Edge. She enjoys it. You stay safe too!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
You are going to throw a new cam at it for sure.
Ugh, I think you may be right Blocki :*(
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining Hey Mike, I think you are in bigger trouble. The german "Die Autodoktoren" recently had a Seat TDI where the high pressure pump had the same problem. VW quoted the owner ~8000 Euro because they wanted to rip out and replace EVERYTHING related to fuel (incl. tank, injectors, lines and rails). It's a TDI but it seems your car uses similar, if not the same technology.
Part 1 (introduction): ua-cam.com/video/kC8mBa2Oo7U/v-deo.html
Part 2 (where they show the culprit, starting at 05:40): ua-cam.com/video/LHkXp7jZyxU/v-deo.html
They ended up cleaning and backflushing everything including wiping the inside of the tank with some magnets. They also installed an additional fuel line which was wrapped around a huge magnet + installed an additional filter after they were done. They recently removed that fuel line and magnet and showed how much it still catched of that fine "sweet" metal bits and pieces. The car still runs fine. It just recently stopped because they got a bad rubber fuel line which was new, meant for fuel but failed just within weeks. Apart from that all is good.
If your engine is setup remotely similar to this one, it won't be the actual camshaft but more like an additional kinda "cam" which is in a separate housing.
Hopefully your injectors are not damaged. I'm not sure if the Autodoktoren replaced the injectors in this car or not. But I'm pretty sure they did - also as a safty measure.
Good luck!
you gotta be kiddin me, there is part too lol
Depending on the results of part 2...there may even be a part 3 :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
13:00 you tried to sound like a parts changer there :p
Camshaft doesn't look good Mike. Replacement is coming.
I have been dreading this exact thought :(
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining You can always use it for you show.
I stopped your video at about 12:25 to write this and also to give me the time to decide whether to continue or move on to the voluminous amount of videos stacked up to still watch. Now, Mike, I watch your videos because you go through all the nitty-gritty, it is not up to you to decide not to share this or that part of the grit. I put up with your tendency to be pedantic to get all the info I would need if the problem with the vehicle you're having arrises with me. You have already covered your self with your Terme of agreement. In other words, you are acting like my dad and I am just getting out of my pre-teens. No, I won't stand for that. I decided to watch your video up to the ultimate diagnosis and then move on. From there I will wait to see if you post a re-traction video, making it clear what kind of audience I am. By the way, I will apologize for being slightly touchy this morning; I am 73 and my plate is overflowing with projects that need to be done and I am taking the time to watch your video. with that, good day.
Hey Ben, sorry you feel like you may have wasted your time. Covered or not from legal issues isn't really my worry here...my concern is someone who doesn't listen to all of the directions ends up hurting themselves.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
So, then we search for other instructions that may totally be wrong or out of date. Where does that leave me? Hurt again, yes? It would be best for you to give the proper instructions with the appropriate warnings about not following them and or being careless. I am in turmoil in how to reach you without blowing my own horn. I do know this would be the right approach. Please step back and rethink this, Mike.
If you guys ever get this code and it's not the hpfp and cam combo.....try the sensor on the rail if that's not it. The sensor on the hpfp is going to be the culprit.
Hi, Can you explain what you mean a little better? There's a sensor that connects to the HPFP and then a sensor that connects directly to the rail correct? Which one are you referring to? If I get this code because the fuel pressure difference before it starts bucking is around 20 bar (290 psi), would that point more to camshaft than to sensor being the culprit? I already put new HPFP in, new fuel pressure regulator valve P/N: 06D-130-757-C, known good ignition coils, and it starts misfiring and hesitating hard once engine is warm and I'm accelerating on highway at about 70 mph. I can't get more than 91 bar (1319 psi) and the commanded pressure peaks at 109 bar (1580 psi) for me. Sometimes it will drop from the 91 bar down to 75 bar and that's when I get spike readings of 30-31 bar difference. I'm thinking camshaft but would try a sensor or something to do with timing as a last resort.
@LarryMendizabal There's a sensor that measures the hp coming from the hpfp, if that sensor is faulty you'd get the symptoms you're describing. Was the pump oem?
Pump is a hitachi unit from fcp euro. Which sensor are you referring to that measures the hp [pressure] coming from the hpfp? Do you have a part number? Is it the one directly connected to the hpfp or the one on the fuel rail?@@zuperzleeper
Cam not looking too healthy! ☹️😓
Hey Brannon, yeh, that's what i'm afraid of :(
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Part three: car driven into a lake
It's stick, I could technically roll it and have a good alibi ;)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Mike is that a phone in your pocket?? Or you just HaPpy to see Me?!!..
Hey Uneek Logik, always happy to see you! ;)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Damn RIGHT!!.. lol
Not homeless....rugged.
Hahah Shaun, thanks! ;)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Personally I think you are doing a disservice by not explain how to relieve the fuel pressure. Even though it can be dangerous, those that do there own work will try to figure it out on their own. Your disclaimer at the beginning should keep your conscious clear.
Hey WW_Big_Al, yeh, that may be true.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Dang Mike. I used to think that you were a really smart guy. But you track down a broke down VW to pour money into? Wow. I still think you're pretty dang smart, maybe you just like pain and suffering
Ugh Frank, I know right!? Never again!!!!!!!!!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
While I like your videos, this setting of a "premiere" thing is pretty irritating. Better for me to just unsubscribe and then watch them later in a batch.
Hey GS, sorry you feel that way. Premiere offers a way for interaction between myself and you guys. I'd hate to see you go over this!
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
@@GoTechTraining No worries, I'm in these less for the chat / narration anyway, I like seeing different motors get tested and taken apart. Keep up the cool work.
Premiere is just a notification of when a video is released... with the ability of having a live chat, with which the channel creator can then interact with viewers (when the video goes live). Premiere or not, you would still have to wait a week to see part 2... if 1 video per week is the norm for whatever channel you are watching. Watching a premiere (with chat) is better, because the video creator is there to answer questions. Most channels that post videos, either don't reply to any comments, or only reply now & then. The only downside to chat questions, is when there are too many viewers & questions... but you can always place a super chat (a money donation) question. The more money you donate, the longer the question stays visible in the chat window). On a channel like this one, super chat wouldn't be necessary, as most who watch are fellow technicians. Meaning that questions will be answered by not only the host, but also by many knowledgeable peers.
Hey Thomas, thanks for chiming in! All well said my friend :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
If you showed something sensible how to depressurize the system it would be something and you are afraid and there is only empty talk blah blah blah
Hey Zbiginew, maybe, i'm just worried that someone would skip steps and get hurt.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
I would like to get a shirt
You'll have to earn one on the next giveaway then :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Check out m_g_t_o_w for wife issues
Lol ok.
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Part 1 should be scrape car. Part 2 go buy a Toyota or Honda problem solved
Hey John, not a fan of VW's? haha
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Screw modern cars. Go get old analog vehicle and be rid of cheap plastic computerized vehicles that will be totaled due to one of the shitty computers failing. Emmisions? How much strip mining is done to make current car. Disposable plastic. Crap.
Hey Duke, sorry you feel that way. Modern cars do seem to have more problems, that's for sure. More stuff to go wrong. But how many "old" cars made it 200+ thousand miles?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Why do you keep talking and not showing the problem
To much bla-bla-bla
Sorry you feel that way Vadim. Try playing the video at 1.5x speed?
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
Worthless video not actually showing the removal of the pump!
Give up the procedure and stop being soft
you talk too much, get to the point, this video could be condensed to 10 mins
Hey Eli, sorry man. I do tend to talk a lot...try playing the video at 1.5x speed. It helps :)
Mike Becker, Senior Instructor
This video is a waste of your time.
Lol ...watching in 2023 and remembering the COVID period.