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How Long Can You Survive a Bag of Holding? (D&D Science)
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- Опубліковано 16 сер 2024
- Join [THE FACILITY] right now for members-only live streams, behind-the-scenes posts, and office hours with me: / kylehill
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Artist: Masood Safdarian
Editor: Lilit Aramyan
ARIA: @ClaireMax
Smart boi: Kyle
Music: bensound.com
Sound effects: freesound.org
*Thanks for watching Traveler.*
Note: Yes I know the objects in the bag would take up volume, but in this specific case, the avg. volume of a human is negligible compared to the 64ft3 of the bag's capacity.
Good episode Kyle, came out right as I am waiting for the paramedics to take my dad to the ER for vomiting what seems to be bags of blood. This will definitely keep me distracted and thinking on changing how long creatures can survive in the bag. Keep up the amazing videos and podcasts and keep on being a good person
Honestly, i'd totally be down to watch Kyle play in a D&D campaign. He's got a great personality, and i bet he could play some very interesting characters.
Also, MTG and D&D have done plenty of crossover. ;)
... is your hair braided? Idk why but I can't stop noticing it... bet it's still silky smooth
PLEASE go play D&D NOW
What about the items that aren't the "breathing creature" and the space they take up? I can say that I have never been playing a game of DnD and had my bag of holding but not an amount of items that would take up a significant percentage of the available volume inside it. I constantly have several weapons and a ton of generic adventuring supplies along with food.
Dad: raising a family is hard.
Necromancer: not if they're buried close enough to each other.
Dad: what?
Necromancer: what?
Skeleton :what ?
Zombie: what?
Ancient lich: did you have to dig that joke up again?
Dinosaur skeleton: I was told that one by my grandad, and it was old then.
HA!
Love these comments
I love the “I’ve totally played dnd” energy here
"A ball of fire! I'm better do a perception check!" - Professional DnD player
So many good marshmallows
Sébastien Lalonde fireball does 8d6
@lightningstar1231 that’s the point
lightningstar1231 fireball does how much he says, he’s the dm. 😂
10:25 "Definitely not a guy and a place I just made up."
Kyle, you've just figured out how to DM and you don't even realize it.
This is so accurate! :D
I DM and it is 90% winging it and improvising on the fly :D
And my players love this style.
Also, tables and lists help.
Lmao yesss
@@junkabella6324 dm planning: make a strict plan, simplify, then simplify, and simplify, cut it in half, simplify,
Keep that in the back of your mind
Plan to only get to 1 story beat
I audibly gasped when Kyle said he’s never played D&D. Biggest plot twist of the year.
Because he's nerdy? I might want to play something like D&D if it didn't take place in a magical medieval fantasy setting.
@@TheSkullConfernece It can take place in really any setting you desire, if your DM wants to take the time to create a plot and setting. There’s Star Wars adaptations, space, gothic horror, cosmic horror. The skys the limit. All it takes is a little reskin.
@@nashhartley3675 that's pretty cool, but for some reason I'm still not intrigued by it. I know how it's played and what it's about, but I probably won't play it. And I love certain fantasy settings like sci-fi, magical, horror, etc. I'm a very nerdy/geeky person, but don't care about the format of the game so I wasn't surprised at all that Kyle has never played. Some people just don't like the idea of the gameplay or roleplaying in that way. I'll most likely stick to virtual simulations, i.e. video games, Elder Scrolls included.
@@TheSkullConfernece I totally get that! It’s certainly not for everyone! Enjoy life my man!
@@nashhartley3675 you, too. Thank you!
The “I definitely didn’t just make up that person and place” is the most genuine D&D thing in this video.
I was just about to say something similar.
Get this man a module, he's ready to DM!
@@nathanross7448 I think he is ready for homebrew
Some of the best NPC's come about that way :)
Kyle: "You appear humanoid to me or maybe even human"
Me: Well its not the worst compliment Ive gotten
The problem with these calculations is that they assume the bag's volume is a constant.
It's not.
The whole point of the bag is that it can hold that huge volume of stuff, but you can always reach whatever you want right at the mouth of the bag.
It's better to think of the bag as an elastic space that has a maximum stretch of 1.8m^3, which is why you run out of air so quick if you hide inside one - the bag will only accommodate your size space and not much else, so it's more akin to being in a tight coffin than a huge room.
what happens if one would keep the lid open? Or if you do the good old tube out of the lake trick, but now with a bag of holding? Is it really just the fresh air restraining you from staying inside of the bag for longer periods of time?
@@crankpatate3303 Yep - the bag has no suction, and the magic requires intent. Things have to be put into the bag, and since people in D&D can't grab air, they can't really add it to the bag.
There *is* a way to actually pull it off though.
There's another magical item called a Bottle of Air (or Wind). The Bottle of Air can be used to breath underwater - or in this case, from within the Bag of Holding. The Bottle of Wind releases a fierce wind when it's uncorked, so you could use it to fill the bag with air. There's spells that have similar actions, but spells are limited and usually require a spell slot. The Bottles of Air & Wind can be reused indefinitely, though they might have a limit to how often or how long they can be used at a time (or both).
I would say you could suck air in through a snorkel that was sticking out of the bag... but otherwise no. You could also use a blower or pump to try and fill it with air, but that's a lot of work and noise for the payoff.
Also - this gives us a pretty good idea (using Kyle's formula) how much air is in the bag-at-rest... when closed, the bag collapses down to a size equivalent to it's contents + roughly 0.124m^3 of air.
@@bobdole4916 And what would happen if I included a bunch of plants in the bag with me?
@@robbperez1278 Unfortunately, you can't fit enough plants to offset the oxygen you use.
You'd need 300-500 plants and there's about enough room for 30-60 potted plants in a bag of holding.
Step One: turn subject into a small air-breathinv animal.
Step Two: cast water breathing on the animal. This does not create gills, but makes you magically able to breath underwater.
Step Three: place small animal in sealed container filled with water.
Step Four: place container in Bag of Holding.
This was how we got around this when in a pinch.
That makes no sense. Water has less oxigen than air. And the container is smaller than the bag.
Or step 1 :get a bottle of air
Step 2 : jump into bag of holding
Step 3: breath out of bottle of air
(3.5 D&D player)
I had to laugh so hard at this. Couldn't you just stop at step one and then just have the squirrel sit on your shoulder or something?
And even if you really had to have someone sit in this bag... Couldn't you just use a tube / snorkel hanging a little bit out of the bag, in order to breath indefinetly?
@@crankpatate3303 we had to use this when the ranger and the rogue were stranded. The ranger could use the tree-teleport spell (3.5) but it only works on self. The rogue had a cloak that allowed her to turn into a bat.
@@adrs1380 that's why I specified it doesn't create gills. You're not breathing water, you're just magically breathing while underwater.
1. The DM Screen - God I wish mine looked like that.
2. "Elf Scientist" - Scientist isn't a class but I'd allow it
3. "Confusingly Grid-Based World" - What is this, 4th Edition?
4. "Dexterity Check [15]" - Personally, I would make this a contested Sleight of Hand check, but a Dexterity check is actually pretty accurate.
5. "Put stuff in it space and then forget about it until you're reminded by your DM a couple weeks later" - Yeah sounds about right.
6. "Your party encounters an absolute gorgeous, talking rectangle" - Sounds like a mysterious obelisk straight outta Chult. Don't touch it.
7. "You appear humanoid to me" - Humanoid is my creature type, so yeah accurate.
8. "Unless you're a Greater Necromancer" - A Greater Necromancer sounds rad af, regular Necromancers as a player class are kinda underwhelming.
9. "Perception Check! [12]" - To dodge a Fireball, you'd actually make a Dexterity Saving Throw, not a Perception check. But, seeing as how it was small, and you didn't take any damage, you would either have to be a Rogue or Monk with Evasion, or it's actually a Firebolt cantrip, in which case the caster makes a spell attack roll against your Armor Class.
10. "Nice try Kevin, you should've speced into Mage dumb-dumb" - No "Mage" class, but Wizard would be the closest. And it is technically possible to "spec" into Wizard if your DM allows Multiclassing. Although, in order to cast spells you'd have to have at least one spellcasting class already leveled at least once.
11. "Now it's time for some math, something board game players know almost nothing about" - While D&D technically isn't a board game, I do play board games, and I also know almost nothing about math, so...accurate for me I guess.
12. "The Goblin King of Red Hollow" - That sounds exactly like something that would be in a D&D game.
13. "Your party encounters, definitely not a supervillain, and Lola, who has like, so much HP, don't even think about it" - Pretty sure I've said almost those exact words as a DM
14. "The oxygen levels in that space will go down, and the carbon dioxide levels will go up, like the amount of body odor at your local game store on game night" - The one thing I don't miss from pre-covid times.
15. "I cast, DISPLAY EQUATION!" - God I wish that were a spell
16. "What were they trying to do, design a game that's playable in real time?" - Yeah haha what losers haha
17. "An item that small wouldn't even hold a frost trolls attention span" - Frost Trolls aren't a thing, at least not in the latest edition, but you said that with enough fake confidence that I believed you for a second. Well done.
18. "The land with grid on it" - What is this, 4th- oh wait I already made that joke
19. "A classic D&D monster like the Reverse Centaur" - A yes, a classic.
20. "A Warrior Squirrel" - Adorable. I want a party full of them.
21. "Questing through the Duke of Barbaria's lands. Definitely not a guy and a place I just made up" - Hey now you're getting it! It's all made up! All of it!
Overall, decently accurate, good job!
"15. "I cast, DISPLAY EQUATION!" - God I wish that were a spell " Reflavored Illusory Script or Minor Illusion or even Skywrite can serve that function ;)
I once played a trikreen that raised squirrels to track elves and confuse them. He liked the taste of terror in his meals.
My game group thought I played that too well.
You forgot the part about the HyperRail only increasing speed +20. Not very hyper.
Re 2: Elf Artificer probably would be most approriate.
Re 3: Hm, I thought that the TORC RPG featured that grid-based world. *winks*
Re 8: Given the context, I think Kyle was referring to a necromancer in its final state - a lich.
Re 17: He probably was talking about an Ice Troll. Those two are easily mixed.
I adore you for this comment.
Kyle: "I have never played a game of dungeons and dragons"
Also Kyle: *Looks like every d&d character I have ever made*
Bah!
@@draxthemsklonst He's also "not a supervillain ". More lies :)
Larian the makers of Baulders Gate 3 just made fun of players for all making the characters look like him.
@@archivis He's the BBEG
Him and Viggo Mortensen...
is no one going to mention how banging these braids look on kyle? just magnificent!
Totally. Could have added pointy Elf or Vulcan ears and he'd have had to argue a lot harder that he had never played DND.
@@mikesharkey2010 🤣 true!
My girlfriend just told me she doesn't like the hair. Then I proceed to try to Google and forgot what I was thinking...
Thank you for reminding me random comment
An easy get-out-of-jail card: It's highly probable that the interior of a bag of holding is not Earth or even Abeir Toril (the canonical planet of D&D 5th Edition). It's a pocket dimension, possibly of its own design or possibly part of another plane with different properties than Earth.
@cak01vej Well throwing a bag of holding into a portable hole does cause an astral rift destroying everything nearby. So there is probably some truth to that.
Isn't it just Toril, with small parts of Abeir?
It you puncture it anything inside is spewed into the ethereal plane.
I didn’t think you’d never have played, it seems like a perfect fit. Highly recommend sir.
With the right people, for sure. I’d recommend avoiding sticklers for rules.
Frungi Nobody likes rules lawyers.
unless he likes mechanically deep games more than narrative focused games. there are different ways to play for different people.
Danilo Oliveira true. Doesn’t mean rules lawyers aren’t more annoying than a horde of Orcs against a level 3 party.
Frungi I was wondering. I’m an editor, sooo... yeah. 😂
Kyle: "I have never played Dungeos and Dragons"
Every Dungeon Master in the chat: "Would you like to?"
I mean, who wouldn't want to play a game with Kyle Hill. He would love the Artificer, if you asked me.
Every one of us
Still waiting for the day Kyle gets on Critical Role
I read the "Would you like to" in thresh's voice from league. One of his quotes is "Ever seen your soul? Would you like to?" And he says it in such a manipulative sadistic way.
literally my first thought when he said it
1:24
Players tend to have a character sheet where the inventory is listed. At my table if the item isn't on your list you don't have it, so make sure you write it down.
If you would forget about it you could just look it up in the character sheet.
Now that we're talking D&D, I've been having the doubt about flying mounts.
If a Quetzalcoatlus is considered a Huge beast, but a real life one is only as heavy as a bear, shouldn't it have an ability that limits it's carry weight?
With that thought in mind, would a large sized Giant Eagle be able to pick up a medium size humanoid or a medium sized vulture (did some research, it seems that the closest thing to 5e vultures are Argentavis and Pelagornis, size-wise) be able to pick up a small sized Kobold?
(I kinda came up to the pattern that a flying beast, with no aid from a magic source, would be considered 1 size smaller for carrying, pushing, and pulling things; kinda the opposite of Powerful Build/Beast of Burden).
Also, would a creature be considered 1 size bigger for carrying stuff when moving something underwater?
Using real life values alongside in game carry weights, I determined that an Eagle, or similar bird, can fly off with approximately 10-13% of its carry weight. This being due to the fact that IRL, an eagle can fly off with things around 8-12 pounds, and using the carry limits in the book, they can carry 90 pounds. So, if we continue using this figure, a giant eagle, having a 16 strength, and being a large creature, can carry 480, and could fly with anywhere from 48-63 pounds.
This is of course, only using figures for what an eagle can comfortably fly with irl, as they tend to not grab things heavier than that. But, even if we double the amount, they would struggle with the average medium humanoid.
The way I always understood bags of holding, is that each object you drop in there, creates its own separate space, just as much as It needs, wich all put together cant exceed the limit of the bag. I know thats not exactly supported by the text, but usually with a bag of holding you dont have to worry about the anvil you put in there crushing the carton of eggs and fine china you put in earlier, supporting my interpretation.
yes, the "its bigger on the inside" don't hold up when you look at the mechanics. for example how you don't need to reach inside to find what you want, you just wish it and it comes to you.
Yeah. It seems more plausibe it would create a separate demiplane for each object to safely store it, up to a maximum total volume, rather than be one large space, since none of the objects in the bag appear to affect each other and are all within reach so long as you know they are there.
From my understanding of the bags, it is a contained amount of space (pre-separated and stays separated) that parcels itself out around each of the objects as the object enters (including your hand) and once you let go of the object it remains in that space until you desire that object. The difficulty in enchanting the bags was based on how much volume of cubic space you were attaching to the object.
So, it's like plastic wrap that recombines when the object is completely removed. When you reach in the wrap goes around the object and hand, when you let go the amount used stays on the object that you let go of and in generally the same spot. When you reach in again you are in a new space made from the wrap that isn't touching the space where the last object was let go, and so you put the new object into the same spot. When you reach in to get something you make the space that you are currently reaching into shift to the space where that object was left.
This is why my group played with the rules that the bag could be enchanted to stop time for the object entering and that it wouldn't effect your hand since you were still mostly outside the bag.
I guess it would be easier to imagine it as a Bubble solution that couldn't leave the inside of the bag and each object was in it's own bubble.
HOWEVER, if I'm not mistaken the rules also say you can pierce the bag if you try to store a sharp object that doesn't fit, spilling out all the contents of the bag, doesn't it ?
"It takes ten minutes to suffocate in the bag." -Balnor
"Breathing creatures inside the bag can survive up to a number of minutes equal to 10 divided by the number of creatures (minimum 1 minute), after which time they begin to suffocate."
BEGIN to suffocate.
Am I the only one who wants an Adventure book for the Facility? Imagine having to navigate through all the different rooms and fighting some of the creatures we've talked about on this channel. Idk about you guys but a D&D party interacting with the Rocco's Basilisk would be so freaking interesting!
"Elf scientist" Play an Artificer like me, closest thing you get to a mad scientist. basically a magic engineer. Make bag of holdings and then turn them into black holes. Great strategy
It never said "suffocate"
It says "expire"
Which might imply that the bag just straight up kills you after 10 minutes
Also please play the game
It's really fun!
yo, I never thought of this, you might shrivel up into a skeleton!
It strangles you after 10 minutes.
I just lost The Game
Screw it, imma quickly become a bag of devouring now.
Well its technically not just a bag that's bigger on the inside, like Kyle implies. It's actually connected to a little pocket "space". So the 10 minutes basically means that if you stay in there that long you will definitely die
I love this channel!
"Yeah, let's make D&D scientifically accurate"
Well in that case... I'm my group's DM and always will be, but I got the chance to play it was just a quick run through I think it was lost mine of fandelver needless to say my character was smart enough I made a giant dust explosion and took out an entire town. Has a reward my DM gave me two levels. Lol 🤣 that's what happens when you're DM makes a barrel of gunpowder to gold and a bag of barley for like two copper I bought every grain I could and all the flower. Even bakeries wasn't safe for me I even bought all the powdered sugar. Yeah I just wiped out an entire town. 😎
And this was when I started letting my players stay inside a bag of holding for longer. Fun one!
Actually, maybe a handsome elf scientist sells bags that don't have the "leaking air" flaw.
Fool! Other planes care not for the rules of 'Oerth', nor the rest of the Material Plane! You have doomed your party to asphyxiation within a magical void!
I am not sure if it changed in more recent editions of the game but i remember (back in DnD 3.5) Bags of holding acted as portals to a pocked dimention and the reason why living thing didn't survive long was the atmosphere in this pocked dimension not being suitable for life.
I'm not sure either, but that is how i run them even in 5e
Right, the bag opens up to a pocket dimension similar to the Astral Sea.... which has no air, just the interstellar ether.
That's what i always thought also. Sometimes I've heard them referred to as Dimensional Bags of Holding also which would give further proof that the bag is its own pocket dimension.
In 5e the description specifically says that creatures will "begin to suffocate". The time this takes is 10min divided by the number of creatures inside. This implies that there is breathable oxygen inside that runs out as it's being breathed
@@TheRealBrit Could just be the bubble of air that moves in with you.
“Dexterity check! Yoink!” Is what I’m gonna yell every time I make a sleight of hand check to steal things from now on
I would like to roll for YOINK
If you haven't played D&D or other TTRPGs yet, I highly encourage you to Kyle. It's an unforgettable experience, no matter if online or in-person.
False: A reverse centaur is a horses head on a pair of human legs. Basically, the parts left out of a normal centaur
Totally had this same thought. It should really be a reverse faun. I gotta admit though that something about the pic makes laugh and almost prefer it to be the result ;p
(As a second thought that I just had for some reason) This does make me think of the car insurance commercials with the motars(?). They have both wheels but still have arms :/ A centaur removes the head and adds the whole upper body of a human. I feel the first part of my comment is now wrong and that Kyle's pic does show an accurate depiction :/
According the the third book of the Black Company series, a reverse centaur has the human part at the back of the horse instead of the front.
That really wouldn't work well unless it was more Minotaur like and not just a horse upper body with little human legs.
@@Shotokan1001 have you ever considered how unbelievably fucked up a centaurs spine and digestive system would be? Human spines are bad enough, but then slap s right angle in there to a horse spine? Awful. And are they omnivores like humans, or vegetarian like horses? Are there any organs in the human torso, or are they just a glorified esophagus with arms? How many stomachs, hearts, lungs, kidneys do they have?
Being a horse head attached to a pair of human legs might actually work better. Just shrink the organs a bit, and you got a critter that can run around and bite things with reckless abandon.
@@Serkisist damn. Horses already spend most of the day eating. A centaur probably couldn't afford doing anything else but eating when not sleeping.
I would love to see at least a one-shot of Kyle being either the evil BBEG as the DM or a high charisma and intelligence bard or artificer
Definitely artificer imo
@@joshualogue984 why not both?
@@mister_muffin3625 Bardificer.
@@cayhle Internet, make it so!
Evil Big Bad Evil Guy?
''Your party encounters an absolutely gorgeous rectangle''
Me: ''Mettaton?!''
They’ve met-a-ton
I would love to see a coffee chat between Mettaton, A.R.I.A., and J.B. (the super intelligent planet-sized object in outer spaaaaaace)
@@bobthegamingtaco6073 Perhaps also Deep Rot...
Gelatinous cube
I love Modrons
I'm pretty sure that things can only get in/out of the bag if they're put in/taken out with intention. So, the only time that air actually gets in is when you're putting something in (only a second or so). This would explain why there isn't really that much air in there - air isn't just constantly flowing in (Kyle even assumes in the video that the bag is an "enclosed space", meaning that air isn't constantly going in or out...)
I love the video. Something to keep in mind (also maybe a topic for a future vid if ya want). Putting sharp or pointy objects in a bag of holding is a no-no because if they puncture the bag it becomes a space-time warping bomb.
What about the volume of atmosphere displaced by the human itself?
an average human occupies less than 5% of the internal volume of the bag: an 80 Kg adventurer with a density similar to water should displace around 0,08 m^3 of air off the total of 1,8 m^3 bringing down the available volume of air to 1,72m^3 , so the final result does not change much.
@@wizzolo What about the fact that you are not just adding Co2, you are also subtracting O2? Would that not increase the rate the percentage rose?
@@wizzolo I got 138 minutes for a 150 lb (68kg) human assuming density of water instead of the more accurate 985 kg/m3 density. Sill every human you stuff in is going to increase the N value and reduce the volume... So how large a party would it take to reach the 10 minute mark... Calculating!
Nine 68kg people gave me 10.56 min
Joe Allen what about halflings?
@@sirforgotten5443 No, it doesn't increase the rate because the formula is already assuming you are replacing air with carbon dioxide. Not exactly true since you are only replacing oxygen and the two gases are different densities, but its close enough at such low percentages.
This assumes the Bag of Holding is filled with a normal composition of air. Considering it is an extradimensional space, created probably as a vaccum, it'd probably only have the air that gets sucked into it every time it's opened. Or any air immediately around any object you put into it.
Given that Bags of holding have multiple different sizes and it talks about putting too much in causing it to rupture, it sounds like the interior of the bag is analogous to a balloon, which means the interior takes up the volume of the combined objects rather than a fixed size (like a portable hole). So, the amount of breathable air would just be at the orifice, i.e. the volume of the non-magical sack that it resembles. So, that's like 2 cubic feet, which is like 1/32nd the maximum capacity (64 cu ft). So the calculation would go from 145ish minutes down to the 4-5 minute range. If you figure in holding your breath for a few minutes and then a few minutes between unconscious and death, then yea, that's about 10 minutes. Numbers are not precise because it is magic. And since the rules specify a time, and your calculation is off, then the calculation is missing something. Much like trying to model the real world and model not yielding the same results as reality.
Edit: Oooh, I see someone else mentioned the bag was 2x4x1. So 8 cu ft. Which is 1/8th the volume not 1/32. So, that's 18 minutes. A lot closer and within tolerance of speculated variables like gas concentration.
"You can survive as long as you can hold your breath." -my dm when I asked if we could smuggle the princess out in the bag
"Breathing sacky-sacks" is how I will be referring to lungs now
When you realize Bag of holding technology means pockets of holding.
**INVEST**
D&D has those too.
@@evilbeardedman Thieves Jacket was the name I think? Or something along those lines.
NEVER MIX THE TWO!
Also hewards handy haversack has holding pouches
@@skullsquad900 wdym, i wouldn't have a clue what could POSSIBLY happen if i were to add two objects like this together
My favorite part about this video is Kyle falling in and out of his "elf scientist" voice as he goes into teaching mode.
The reverse centaur really got me. Kudos, Sir.
Honestly you got the dnd stuff pretty spot on. Excellent video, and fun idea!
Me: Reads title
Also me: Laughs in Air Genasi
~Scoffs in Lich~
@Sasquatch Studios yeah our warforged just hopped in without any hesitation.
YES
Yup, me and my party realized the same thing. Party shoved my Monk Air Genasi butt into a Bag of holding to smuggle me into somewhere after the Wizard mentioned that you would have to not breath in order to stay in longer than allowed. Was forgotten in there for almost half of the next session, I just stayed silent to see how long it took XP
Hey there, Cousin😁
Love the real science here!
In d&d lore, though, the bag of holding acts as a portal to a pocket dimension which lacks an atmosphere, and interdimensional travel in d&d always causes you to bring a bit of atmosphere with you. So the 10 minutes is for your personal air supply, which is why it's a flat 10 minutes per person.
Just in case anyone was wondering
why arent you at the top of this thing! @kyleHill should see this and rethink the calculations
I think that reverse centaur did about 5 points of psychic damage to me in the few seconds I looked at it
Kyle: "What is a Kolbold Quickblade?"
Me who has survived Tucker's Kolbolds: "Dooooom...."
Pain incarnate 😭
"Put stuff in it space and forget it until weeks later when your DM reminds you." If you haven't played before, you rolled high on your Outsider Knowledge check :D
history check...
@@T3AMstudios Knowledge Outsiders is a skill from 3.5e and History (At least as a *The* general knowledge skill) is from 5e. Both are Accurate in their respective systems.
weeks? try months, or even years!
Only started playing in 5th O.o, wanted too beforehand but never really got the chance
@@T3AMstudios 5th can be very fun but each edition has its pros and cons, I definitely reccomend trying each one and finding which one you like, its a good way to spend time especially this year.
His mouth says, " I've never played D&D before."
His demeanor says, "I'm Sooooo lying."
Sounds like a double bluff. Know exactly what not to know quite right just so to convince people he actually had to look stuff up
I literally have not ever played D&D.
He definitely just read about it a ton
He must have meant he only played AD&D and RuneQuest.
“Dexterity check!
...
Haha! Yoink!”
@kylehill Would like to mention that further clarifications to the description of the Bag of Holding state that no breathable air is present inside the extradimensional space it opens to. Food doesn't spoil, no decay occurs, etc. Nothing oxidizes. So technically the 10 minutes that Wizards gives to people who enter the Bag of Holding is reliant on the rule that a heroic character at least in the 3.5 edition of the game can hold their breath for 1 minute +1 Minute per point of Constitution Modifier, then they must make increasingly difficult Fortitude Saves, increasing by +1 every round, until death occurs after 2 failed saves. On AVERAGE, that is 1 minute and then 7 successful saves (7 more minutes) with 2 failed saves afterward resulting death (Minutes 9 and 10).
Note that the average human character has a 10 in their Constitution in 3.5 and that means a +0 modifier. With 1 as the minimum variable here due to the laws of the game, the reason you have 10 minutes in a Bag of Holding is that you only have the air you bring with you, and once that's used up, it's get out or die of suffication
D&D Science?! AWESOME!
“It’s bigger on the inside”
Edit: 10 minutes isn’t even enough time to get your Mt. Dew and Cheetos.
If that's all that is in your BoH, it won't take long. And excuse you, it's DORITOS, TYVM. lol kidding but no seriously I'm watching you and your Cheetos... ಠ_ಠ
@@techrakatt Don't make me magic missile... The Darkness. LoL
Does anyone have another quarter? ‘Cause otherwise I gotta get FUNYUNS.
It's in the fridge. Duh!
@@franklyanogre00000 But if you're a Sorcerer of Light. how come you had to cast magic missile?
Kyle: I've never played D&D.
Everyone: He's no geek. He's no geek at all.
Me: Never was.
The way my game plays it, items tossed into the bag of holding are stored in their own individual little pocket dimension, which is how you dont actually have to rummage around to find the thing you want. You reach in, think of what you want, and suddenly you're reaching into that particular pocket dimension. So if a person is tossed into a bag of holding, they'll be in a pocket space that can essentially only hold them and nothing else until they are able to force their way out again, or are pulled out, rather than a space that equals the maximum found inside a bag of holding.
Imagine evading a fireball with a perception check.
Perception to spot or hear a Firebolt before it is launched to dodge in time
Looked so hard at the caster they miss
@@patheronaetherson2860 Though Fire Bolt is different from Fireball, I'll consider Fire Bolt here as that's what you said.
That's certainly a good descriptor for why it would work, but I still don't think it'd work well with D&D 5e mechanics.
Within the mechanics of the game, a fire bolt essentially hits or misses the target as soon as it's cast, so spotting one and acting immediately would be mechanically difficult.
What if you wanted to move before the fire bolt was cast? Well if you happened to see a mage casting a fire bolt and wanted to move before they did, you'd likely roll Initiative to see if you're quicker than them. That's if you're not already in combat.
Even if it was a matter of seeing the spell early, passive perception is what's generally used for seeing things unless the character is specifically looking for something (though I've seen many differ from this)
The closest thing I could imagine to a perception check allowing you to evade a fire bolt would be if the mage casting it was hidden from the party.
This could work! Well, kind of.
If the player makes a perception check and sees the evil mage before the mage's turn, the character could drop prone, which looks like what Kyle did. That would give disadvantage on a fire bolt which could make the difference between a hit and a miss. In this instance, the player would have to act before the spell was cast.
And Fireball, well that's an entirely different story as it explodes in an area instead of 'attacking' a single player. That one requires a Dexterity Saving Throw and to be honest, a Dex save does look like what Kyle was doing here.
Sorry for the stupid long reply, I like nerding over little things like this.
@@noah_the_nerd dodging would act on this situation, or don't?
@@fabriciogoulart4564 If it's Fire Bolt, taking the dodge action would help you out by giving the attacker disadvantage, but dodging takes a full action, just like casting the spell. Dropping prone would give the same effect without an action, because fire bolt uses a ranged spell attack.
If it's Fireball, neither the dodge action nor dropping prone would help.
Kyle never played D&D? That has to be fixed :D
When I was still new to DnD my Orc character (Brogan OrcBro) unknowingly jumped into an infinite bag of holding out of curiosity. We just went by sure, but what now. I realized I could reach out and grab anything, so I decided to try to grab the bag I was inside of. This set of a detonation that made everyone have to roll to see how much damage they were taking and the teifling was knocked down to 1hp. I was unscathed. (Also later banged a chaos God to save my friends from a lynch-like superboss, solid campaign)
Man, imagine needing to breathe. *laughs in undead*
Continues to laugh in warforged.
"Hairless ape" - description of humans by human with fantastic hair
That is an inaccurate description, humans actually have more hair follicles than chimpanzees
Side note I love the progression of this channel, he used to just be a guy with a glass board
Kyle, did you forget that the Bag of Holding Demiplane is in the Void of Space, and that you have a Size variable which you forgot to factor in as well. Large Creatures are 2³ bigger than a Medium, and a Tiny Creature is ¼³ the size of a Medium size Creature, and this scales for all Consumption Rates as well, so Food, Water, Breathable Atmosphere as it achieves equilibrium with 0 AU Void the Size of our entire Sun, using your suddenly limited ~2³ ft of 1 AU Atmosphere, because someone closed your Wormhole to the 1 AU Atmosphere outside of the Bag of Holding.
Thus, you have roughly ten minutes, and then you have no Atmosphere.
Oh, and yes there is an additional layer of Rules for holding one's Breath, but that doesn't work very well for Astronauts without any form of Atmosphere or Exosuit, side effects include Explosive Decompression & Death.
My group always assumed the bag, being an extra dimensional space, would have no atmosphere of its own. It would function as a vacuum, and attempting to breath inside would behave much like it does in space. The 10 minutes were therefore assumed to be how long the player could hold their breath. (Nevermind the host of other problems this would cause.)
My group then proceeded to concoct a plan involving the spells 'Daylight', 'Create Water', 'Permanancy', and numerous potted plants... 🙃 They were going to try and create an atmosphere from scratch.
I love it XD
Oh you would dig playing a Bard or Rogue.
Try it out.
I’d love to see the fun science exploits he could come up with as an artificer
He'd probably love playing a Barbarian, after having some coffee.
Or better yet, a bard/rogue
@@cz1822 Mastermind/Glamour
How do you think he gained A.R.I.A.? Soldering circuits?
Thanks for the awesome video! I think there is one more thing worth considering: we optimally breathe at ~20% oxygen concentration, but already at about 14% we get quickly exhausted unable to do any physical activity, and at about 6% we lose all HP. I had to learn these things as I work regularly with large quantities of liquid nitrogen, and the main hazard with it is surprisingly not frost, but asphyxiation by nitrogen boiling and replacing oxygen. It is a silent killer! You don't realize when it is too late and you can't save yourself because of losing motoric functions. On this cheerful note, bless ;)
I think I'll actually use this for my games. Back in 1st Edition AD&D there was no limit to breathing time included in the rules for the Bag of Holding, because 1E just gave you the numbers and let you calculate those things for yourself, as you did right here (for example, casting a Fireball spell was an exercise in calculating how much cubic volume an expanding 20' radius explosion would fill... an astute Magic-User could easily sterilize an entire connected series of small chambers with a single Fireball, but conversely it was very common for sloppy Magic-Users to catch themselves in their own Fireballs.)
So what I'm saying is that these were the kinds of calculations we were making a lot for 1st Edition.
Fun anecdote for 1E - DM'ing for a wizard who decides to throw a fireball into a 20' square x 10' high room, and watching his face as I tell him just how badly he calculated that (also, fireballs exerted pressure back then).
Well, a couple of extremely jammy roles later, and said wizard is surfing down the corridor on a door propelled by the bottled explosion like a badass.
There is one variable unaccounted for: The true nature of the Bag of Holding. I refer to a short story printed in Dragon Magazine, many years ago, which describes a cursed version of the bag, known as a Bag of Devouring. This "bag" turns out to be the extraplanar mouth of a living creature.
IF Bags of Holding were originally designed around these "mouths", then it is quite possible that a side-effect of the enchantments means that the bags are in some manner "alive", and therefore also consume oxygen. And, if this is true, then the much greater rate at which the Bag breathes and uses oxygen will be vastly faster than most creatures residing within, and therefore a single creature inside will generally end up with no more than 10 minutes before sufficient oxygen is consumed by the bag itself that the creature expires.
Surprisingly, the size of the creature inside the bag is almost irrelevant. Despite an average sized human likely feeling a little cramped inside a bag of holding, they nonetheless displace just 75,000 cubic centimeters of volume, or 0.07 cubic meters. Reevaluating the two equations presented while accounting for the displaced volume shows that one would run out of oxygen in 1453.2 minutes, and one would reach 3% CO2 concentration in 138.4 minutes. Ultimately, a difference of approximately 4.5%, which in comparison to the original time of 10 minutes from WOTC, is negligible.
That is definitely a smaller difference than I originally expected it to be.
Though let's assume the space you take and only few inches away from your body will manifest when you are put in the bag I do recon the math should work?
I don't believe you can interact with items that are put in the bag unless you are put there at the same time as said items? Would that make the calculations fit the given time better?
But, the nonmagical part of the bag is 4ft³ so the bag holds items magically... But not oxygen. The equation matches nearly perfectly to the perceived size of the bag.
THANK YOU! Came to say this. Missed opportunity, Kyle! :)
and then you play as a 2m 120kg dragonborn with another couple cubic feet of gear. suddenly, you take up 10% of the space, and it's possible that other party members follow. And I don't think a goliath cleric would weigh any less.
I loved this lol. I understand you've never played and I always love to see the Rules As Written challenged by science.
I would like to educate you some without coming off as upset or contributing to the hatefulness that comment sections usually come off as. Some people probably already have mentioned some if not all of what im going to say, but TLDR lol.
In the video you're assuming the bag allows air flow. Rightly so, most bags do, but most bags also exist soley on the Material Plane, the plane of existance we currently exist in.
Further along in the text for the bag's description it begins mentioning outcomes of tampering with the bag that involve the Astral Plane. Through magic the bag acts as an extension into a pocket of the Astral Plane that is self contained. There is no atmosphere to speak of on the Astral Plane and so the entry point into the bag uses magic to keep the two seperate while allowing dense matter to pass through. Gases and other less dense matter from the Material Plane have a harder time casually entering this Astral Plane "pocket".
This information leads most players into the understanding that this bag has no conventional air or atmosphere present, and the lack of these makes it nearly into a vacuum, which again is contained by magic. The text on the bag describes the outcomes of tampering with this containment.
So, the 10 min timeline for "breathing creatures" to survive does work with the understanding that the bag has no air or atmosphere. They suffocate.
I hope this explaination was interesting at the very least, I love your show and love the challenges you put forth within every episode.
On another note, you should try D&D sometime. It can be very fun and relaxing with the right group of people :)
Depends on the version, in 5e it is specifically said that creatures 'start' to suffocate after 10 minutes % by number of creatures, but the bag is still an extra dimensional space designed to hold items so it makes sense that it does not have a suitable atmosphere.
@@kamencraftbrasil4367 but as soon as you open the bag air will be pushed in by our atmosphere if there wasn't one there already.
@@baconghoti this is the same universe where if you leave the atmosphere of your planet you will automatically bring an air bubble with you making a mini atmosphere so it is not like it wants to imitate the rules our air follows.
This is essentially what I said:
Air can only get in/out by being allowed to pass when you're putting something else inside, but that's only for a second or so. So there's not a constant stream of air going in, just a very small amount
@@Kokonutzlz perhaps the reason the time before suffocation does not change no matter how much objects you put in the bag is because there can be only so much air pressure in the bag, like how in the elemental plane of water the water pressure is the exact same everywhere, or the elemental ane of air and its air pressure, and since the bag is a confirmed portal to an extra dimensional space instead of just being bigger inside (for example you can move an active immovable rod with a bag of holding) perhaps we have a similar situation.
The bag of holding is the best and funniest item in all of D&D. Shoving people in the bag, spending their last minutes trying to eat that tuna sandwich.
0:30 is the single most insulting piece of media I have ever witnessed as a DND player/DM. My blood boiled, I ripped out my hair and tore my shirt asunder as I screamed to the gods asking why they allow such vile filth to taint our realm. 10/10 subscribed.
* shoves cohort intot the bag, sticks arms through the bars of the cell, opens bag & dumps cohort onto the floor *
Me, who has never played d&d:
Yes yes dexterity bag go *magic attack*
Yes
Relatable
Fun fact about D&D grid. It is actually Non-Euclidean Geometry. As a distance of 30ft in the X direction, and going 30ft on the diagonal (X=Y), the X component is still 30ft. Its due to the fact that 5ft of movement in a direction doesn't change for the cardinal or thr diagonal
genuinely shocked - kyle absolutely vibes like the kind of person who enjoys an occasional game of D&D
You got a surprising amount of accuracy of what happens in a D&D game in your jokes
Two things I thought about:
1. CO2 is heavier than air, so in a closed space, it probably wouldn't disperse uniformly
2. You're also in the bag, so your volume should be subtracted from the total volume of air
I don't think those would change the results too much, but they might
So how narrow of a closet would we be talking for a humanoid to start suffocating AND wouldn't that mean in this case that halfling
A human has about 3 ft3 (75 liters) of volume. That would take of about 7 minutes.
An additional point: each object in a bag of holding occupies a strict partition of the pocket dimension. (Evidenced by the fact that you cannot simply reach in and feel around for things, instead having to think of the item you want and it appears in your hand.) If these partitions are air tight, then even before we account for the creature's displaced volume, we're probably working with a volume of air that is a fraction of the bag's total volume.
Well, that and it’s magic.
Suggested variable: density. A bag of holding is much bigger on the inside, which means each inch outside is stretched on the inside (or inches inside are crunched compared to outside). Air then becomes thinner and harder to breathe? Or, because I'm bad at math does the opposite happen and the airs thicker?
Wizards of the coast had nothing to do with this- the bag of holding predates them acquiring d&d by decades. The origional company / developers of d&d was TSR.
Him: Board game player's don't know math.
Any experienced D20 player: Dafuq?!...Is that a challenge?
Awesome video, dude. 😛✌
*Laughs in Advanced Dungeons and Dragons 1st edition*
@@kyzer422 Throw him into the pit of THAC0! [Minute later, he crawls out...]
Laughs in 1e and 4e dmg and phb
Tabletop games aren't board games, he's being a fool
My take away: Lungs are the real bags of holding
the gnome cleric in my party who always sneaks into somebodies pocket or travel pack cuz she doesn't want to walk " what if the bag of holding was the freinds we made along the way" me, " wait, how long have you been in there" " bout a week" " we thought you died from the blue dragon fight, you were alive this whole time? "
Kyle... you have made me spread positive vibes by watching you videos and sharing them to others. You have had made me happy when I was going through unbelievably tough times and I have been watching your videos for a very very long time... all I'm trying to say is thank you for the support and thx u all for watching and subbing to his vids (:
Oh, you had me at Elf Scientist. Take my money!
I love the "I'm gonna piss off as MANY nerds as possible" energy
His entire fan base is almost every type of nerd type. If he's not pissing off every group and making them feel welcome he's doing it wrong.
Just keep it away from your portable hole. I've heard some humorous stories
Kyle should know better. How long was he trapped in the Void? Because...
The way I think of it, as you put things into it, the space expands to a maximum of 64 cubic feet , but the space inside is only ever enough to hold whatever is in it. A person inside it isn’t just sitting in a large room.
When for the sake of "simplicity" we ignore that the bag is mostly closed all the time and bacteria in the air also consumes oxygen.
Try sniffing the air that comes out of a clean plastic pot that was closed for a long time.
Hasn’t played D&D?! Someone revoke his nerd card.
Are you really gatekeeping being a nerd you must be an omega level nerd /s
@@thanatosignis5702 How can he claim himself a Nerd if he hasn't at least played DnD once!? revoke his Nerd Card and give him a DM!
@@stalebread2997 He's played Magic the Gathering, which, I think, is made by the same company.
@@zemorph42 MTG and D&D are both most definitely made by Wizards of the Coast.
"Your party senses the "Administrator" is coming to a conclusion" 🤣
Note that the bag of holding opens a cross dimensional space, so there could be a bunch of things that could affect the amount of air that the bag would have. For example, if the atmospheric pressure within the bag's dimensional were higher than 1 bar, less air would be sucked in when the bag is opened.
I assumed that the faced bag was alive and intentionally killing by smothering yet the idea that the bag is constantly adjusting size make more sense and feels more satisfying
How is your Baby-Ti doing Kyle?
Did he learn to solve calculus yet?
0:01 Just when I thought his hair couldn't possibly get any more majestic...
as someone who's played a little bit of DnD, as much as i love this scientific breakdown, in my experience the bag is just big enough so that the mouth of the bag can be the size it is, inside the bag is more akin to a pocket dimension where the bag lets you pull the object out if you're thinking of it. there is no air in there, realistically you shouldn't be able to survive longer than how long you can hold your breath before your lungs collapse, in my opinion 10 minutes is generous to allow for cool plans
Entire video feels like old people trying to relate to gen-Z and yet I still fully respect it and appreciate the attempt
Thor is beginning to look more and more like Kyle everyday.
hey kyle!
what if the 10 minutes have nothing to do with breathing? but "something" that makes "breathing creatures" "expire"?
Exactly. Whether it is a human or a goldfish, both begin suffocating after 10 minutes. Even though the goldfish is not breathing from the surrounding air.
Yeah, theres a spell that kills everything inside after 10 munutes.
Astral dreadnough?
@@diobrando9842 probably a astral storm tbh
SCP106 finds you
You forgot to account for the volume of air that is displaced by the creature residing in the bag, effectively reducing the amount of air in the bag
I will now be calling lungs “breathie sacky sacks”
HOW HAVE YOU NEVER PLAYED!?!? Find Matt Mercer and fix this problem now.
Also Wil Wheaton
they even both worked at geek and sundry at the same time... what a shame, so much missed potential. Kyle's character and percy, eventually also taryon...
This poor guy had to do a 30 second disclaimer just to stave off the D&D fans
Look at what you people have done
Lol not our fault he rolled high on his wisdom check for that🤣
@@daniellaycock2156 It's only wise to coddle a vocal minority if you think it's wise to complain about trivial things in the first place.
@@wendygo7962 fair, or you just wish to avoid the headache, or not alienate your target audience. (A.k.a. It wasn't worth the risk to chance it with the obviously very nerdy community)
@@daniellaycock2156 Good point, you can't be too brutal and risk alienating a portion of your audience.
But I'd argue that if the group you're alienating is so sensitive that they need trigger warnings in order to *not* be alienated: It's their problem and not yours
@@wendygo7962 well, yes and no, it'd be convenient to not have to worry about others' thoughts on you. But not when your income and brand (his likable look, mannerisms, and persona. As well as the safe feeling this nerdy channel has for nerds that are known to have strong opinions especially on their hobbies) basically it's not worth the possible negatives when you can save yourself the trouble with a casual disclaimer.
i think for a squirrel, an acorn to would be used more as a buckler than a shield.
but unless his sword was made of a very dense material he'd probably rely more on a piercing weapon like a tiny spear than a sword that might be used for any kind of chopping motion
I can only imagine the amount of research that went into this video only for Kyle to make a perception check to dodge a fireball.