Colossal Color Showdown Ep. 6: Payne's Grey Part 1 | Comparing 11 Brands
Вставка
- Опубліковано 11 лип 2024
- In this episodes we compare the following 11 Payne's Grey:
+ Payne’s Grey (Daniel Smith) bit.ly/2VwxDvw
+ Payne’s Grey (Holbein) bit.ly/2Rr1UN1
+ Payne’s Grey (Sennelier) bit.ly/2LQsdXF
+ Schmincke’s Payne’s Grey (Schmincke) bit.ly/2RwT7ZV
+ Payne’s Grey (Winsor & Newton) bit.ly/2s86Gkf
+ Payne’s Grey (QoR) bit.ly/2RziU3q
+ Payne’s Grey (M. Graham) bit.ly/2VsdaaV
+ Payne’s Grey (Da Vinci) bit.ly/2QmFkR1
+ Payne’s Grey (Jackson’s Art) bit.ly/2AuNn9n
+ Payne’s Grey (Cass Art) bit.ly/2AunBSm
+ Payne’s Grey (Van Gogh) bit.ly/2GXgfwy
** Please support my Patreon **
/ otokano
** Other Supplies I used **
+ Fabriano Academia www.cassart.co.uk/painting/wa...
+ Cadmium Yellow Light (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Cadmium Yellow Orange (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
+ Quinacridone Rose (Daniel Smith) www.jacksonsart.com/daniel-sm...
+ Phthalo Blue Yellow Shade (Holbein) www.jacksonsart.com/holbein-w...
** Please support my Patreon **
/ otokano
** Shop **
Handmade watercolor paints & original artworks
+ otokano.com/
** My Amazon Wishlist **
+ amzn.eu/fXKAv1n
** Connect with Me **
+ Twitter: / otokano_art
+ Instagram: / otokano_art
+ Facebook: / otokano
** My PO Box **
Oto Kano
PO Box 24120
Edinburgh
EH7 9FB
United Kingdom
Jackson's links are affiliate links in which a small percentage of the sale supports this channel without costing you any extra at all. Thank you so much for supporting this channel grow! - Навчання та стиль
Schmincke has the classical Payne's grey simply called Payne's grey blueish and one of my favorite colours ever. I love to use it for monochromatic paintings. This one is their own version and therefor called Schmincke's payne's grey :)
They could better have named it Neutral, and their Payne's Grey Blue Tint as ordinary Payne's Gray. But ultimately paint names say nothing, every brand come up with their own fantasy names and that has more to do with marketing. So nowadays I look at the pigment content only.
Payne's Grey might be my favorite color, or at least in my top 5. I use Jackson's one very often, because it's very economical, and it does amazing monochromatic studies. I don't know if it's the brighteners, but it seems most luminous to me. (I'm not opposed to brighteners, the way they are used in a few artist quality brands.) I also have Holbein, Sennelier, and Isaro. Isaro's is much bluer. I like Holbein's one if I want it to behave and stay put. :) If I want a Payne's grey hue that granulates, I use D.S. Sodalite.
Jackson's one is so economical, I always wonder how they do that price!
This is not a color I choose often, but I'm so glad you made an episode on it so we can see all the variations! I think my fav is M.Graham, love that depth ♥
I agree, MG's one is lovvveeelllyyy
I have the MGraham version of Payne's Gray in my big studio palette instead of black. I love it.
woooww. as a beginner in watercolour, i had no idea there were so many different tints in the grey. thank you so much for such an informative video!
I use both Jacksons and WN, I like to stick with what I know and what I find most versatile. Winsor Newton Payne's Grey I find is the most versatile for me, it's very fine bluish pigment can create nice cool sky washes - that don't look too grey (great for winter scenes), mixes nice muted greens without the dulling caused by the black in some other mixes (even though WN does contain some black) and works to darken greens better than ultramarine blue or neutral tint. I can also create a good neutral with it by just adding a touch of red... A great allrounder on my palette! Jacksons is great for monochromatic studies and I have even used it for "inking" linework with brush or reed pen as it can deliver a good cool inklike black. I dare say if I tried all the others, some may be just as good or better, but as I said, I've tended to stick with what I know and what has worked for me. I did originally buy the Jacksons as a replacement for the WN... but it could not - so I had to go back to the WN.
I'm so intrigued by payne's grey, I have none but whenever I see it I'm so tempted, so this episode was really helpful! So keen to see the tinting/mixing in part 2
Do you think you'll give the color a go now? :)
I really fell in love with Payne’s gray using the reeves Payne’s gray..
now I’m looking to buy more and trying to check out this color from other brands- thanks so much for this video!!
Thanks Oto, I really enjoyed it. Very good series.
Thank you always for watching Julio :)
Thank you. Winsor & Newton totally hits the mark for me and is a personal favourite.
I've been in the market for a tube of paynes grey since I've been mixing my own and this was so helpful. Def. going to wait for the next ep and revise my cart. Colorwise I find the sennelier and m. graham really nice. Thanks for doing these, they help a lot.
I love Payne's Grey. I also love the Schmincke's Payne's Grey because it works so well for wildlife painting. I've gone through almost my entire first tube of it and will definitely restock.
Winsor and Newton's is one of my personal favourites! (I have a Payne's Grey addiction and have it in about 6-7 brands haha). I do find that I have to mist it to rewet it if it's been dried in the pan. Was it a rewetting issue?
Schmincke has a new Payne's Blue Grey that is more fitting with the others if anyone is looking in that brand. (I understand that the series goes by name and you have to stop somewhere ;) )
I love this series so much! All of your videos are so well researched and done. Thank you for these invaluable resources.
I always spray all my dried colors with water to begin with too. However, yeah I guess on the whole Payne's grey required a little more work to get the mass tone.
@@OtoKano Agree! Thank you for taking the time to respond! Your channel is a favourite of mine.
Aw thank you so much Allison, you are so kind :D
W&N paynes grey is one of my all time favourites colours too! ☺
I love Payne's Grey! In fact I just added it back on to my palette. I really was of the philosophy that I should mix all of my shadows and dark areas and for the most part, I do. But Payne's Grey certainly is a wonderful paint color. I use both Holbein and Daniel Smith in separate palettes and usually I prefer the Holbein a little bit more. When I look around and try to match palette to place I find that there are plenty of dark passages and deep, gravelly shadows around, especially in winter time, to warrant having this paint around. This is a great series!!
woooo those all sound like a wonderful use for Payne's Grey JDub :D
This was very helpful thank yoU!
You haven’t included it but, Shmincke Payne’s Grey Bluish is by far my favourite colour watercolour paint of all time. Such a beautiful colour. This is a fantastic series thank you. I want to try the QoR Payne’s grey now as besides Daniel Smith, W&N and VanGogh that’s the easiest to get in Australia! I have the W&N and hate it. 😬🤪
Scrolling down to the comments, I see many listing Payne’s grey as their favourite colour. Amazing to know it is so loved and used. I too have an obsession with it ever since I saw it.
I loved this episode. Thank you! I use Payne's Grey often, and M.Graham is my favorite.
Great choice Mari :) so glad you enjoyed this episode.
I have the winsor newton one and like it so far, but I ordered the m graham too.
Oh myyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy. My current favorite Payne's Grey is the sennelier one, which I got in the test pack I reviewed forever and a day ago, but that gorgeous purple tone works so well in my art. Ugh. It's LIFE. And I use it a lot, especially for my travel pieces since it's so super convenient.
heeeeyyyy :D Lovely to see you Kat :D Yes I can really see that color going really well with all your lovely jewel tones :D
That's the one that caught my eyes first. Might have to try and get it now. :D
that was interesting, I have several brands of Payne's grey but still like to mix my own, with this series of videos i am very much leaning to the M Graham paints..... tfs
I agree Ian, the M. Graham paints are proving to be a pleasant surprise.
The original Payne's gray was a chromatic black that consisted of Prussian blue, yellow ochre, and carmine.
It seems modern day Payne's gray is now black with a hint of blue. Perhaps modern day Payne's gray was reformulated for convenience's sake or reformulated to more lightfast pigments.
I am disappointed in the PG made with black. That was the whole purpose, to darken a colour without using black, not to use it as a shade in itself :(
Very interesting. Thank you
These are the US prices for Payne's Grey on Feb 11, 2019. All prices are from Jerry's Artarama with the exception of DaVinci, which can be purchased at Cheap Joe's Art Stuff.
Daniel Smith. 15ml @ $10.34 = $0.69
Holbein. 15ml @ $9.49 = $0.63
Sennelier. 10ml @ $7.45 = $0.75
21ml @ $10.36 = $0.51
Schmincke. 15ml @ $14.56 = $0.97
W&N. 5ml @ $5.81 = $1.16
14ml @ $11.75 = $0.84
37ml @ $18.35 = $0.50
M Graham. 15ml @ $8.51 = $0.57
DaVinci. 15ml @ $8.63 = $0.58
37ml @ $13.60 = $0.37
The only Payne's Grey I own is QOR. I REALLY like M Graham's version though. I use Payne's Grey in loose florals to get a navy blue in whimsical leaves. I also use it to deepen and desaturate greens, again in florals. No surprise there since I'm primarily a floral painter.
Thank you so much for doing the price comparison Christina, you're amazing!
Dr. Oto Kano, you're welcome! It's really no bother. It's interesting to see the price fluctuations between countries. For us in the US, Schmincke and W&N are always very expensive, whereas QOR, while still expensive, is reasonable.
I always cry at how affordable M. Graham and Da Vincis are over there T_T
Thanks. I pretty much use Daniel Smith and Winsor Newton everything, but I don't 'love' their Paynes Gray. I was going to purchase M Graham's Ultramarine Violet (Thanks Dr Oto Kano for the color mixing vid too!), but was waffling over adding their Payne's grey too. This decided it. Time to give M Graham a try. Great vid and helpful comments
I am totally crushing on the Sennelier color, however I’ve been a fan of the W&N for a little while now because I’ve had more time with it. I just received the Payne’s Grey bluish from schmincke and I am in love.
This is the most interesting colour comparison for me personally. (so far) Paynes Grey is such a cool colour and you explained it so well.
So glad you enjoyed it. Which one is your favourite?
@@OtoKano I have the w&n at home but in your swatches the qor really stands out. It's so saturated.
Hey Oto, thank you so much for this series! May I request a comparison of Davy's Greys? not many brands have them but I think it is an amazing color. I only have the Van Gogh one but I know that Winsor & Newton, Holbein, and Mijello also have their own versions of it.
Sennelier Payne's Gray is a regular on my palette. I've never noticed the bloom--going to have to check that out!
I go very tough on these paints in these tests. Add more water to it than I would do in a normal painting. So it doesn't surprise me at all (and I am glad to hear) that you have not experienced it cauliflowering in your painting :)
Thanks Oto. I like paynes grey. I have three. LOL. But now I'm thinking a tube of M Graham could last for years as I use it mostly for tinting. I kind of love the granulation I get with W&N though. Take care.👍💙
yes, M. Graham's one is really nice!
Very interesting video Oto!
So glad you like it Twigga! Thank you for watching.
Thank you so much. I love Payne's Grey and nice to see more options. Another one that's not so blue is White Night's, its REALLY close to their neutral. W&N I've had a couple of pans and I thought I'd bought the wrong paint because one was my favourite blue-black paint that I've ever owned and the replacement was more on the black side.
That's such a shame that there was so much color variance between the two batches of the W&N one :(
I just had the same issue. The Cotman series of WN's PG is dark dray as you say, but the artist version is much truer to traditional PG
Help! Love your videos! I really love colour! Yeah for having a M. Graham colour. I signed up for the Quiller course on colour but am having trouble putting a palette together as most of my paints are M. Graham. Can you help?
I would love to see a comparison of Neutral Tints.
I use WN and Jacksons Payne's Grey. I find WN works best for cleanly tinting greens and creating nice olive greens with most yellows. Jacksons I have a problem with, it can look dirty in green tints with the black clearly visible settling into dull patches. It will not mix well with yellows at all. Jacksons I find worksreally well though with earth tones and blues.
Ohhh~ I love this colour the most (also because it's a relaxing colour)~ I've even painted circles of it just because I want to see this colour. I love the WN one especially. Although, I must say that I don't have experiences with other brands other than Van Gogh, I think M. Graham's and Holbein's really pretty too~ I have my own mix of this sort of Payne's Grey on the side using Holbein's Ultramarine Deep and Burnt Umber (the granulation effect of it is just oomph!). Sennelier there looks just like my Mission Gold's Shadow Violet LOL.
HIMAWARI!!!!!! Thank you for posting a comment :D I've been trying to get hold of you!!! Thank you so much for your wonderful package. It's so very kind of you to send me all those gogreous paints, I was soooo touched. I am sorry I didn't have any way to contact you until now.
Ahaha!! I was really really busy, and there was a long holiday for the Lunar New Year too. I'm glad you love it. Although it was kinda sad that I could not find all of them. Nonetheless, it was a great accidental find too. I was really afraid that it would not reach you but it did! So, that's great.
Anyway, you did do about 2 videos on it, and I found it. So, might as well get them to you to play with it hahaha! Have fun~
I am suuuuuper grateful that you sent them to me Himawari :D Thank you so much.
Hehe~ it's my pleasure 😁
Love this comparison! I have Sennelier and Winsor & Newton ones, with the latter being my favorite. I use it dried from tube and it has matching if not more intensity to the Sennelier version. So strange, on these swatches it looks inferior, though in my case, it's been the best one for monochromatic paintings, has an incredible value range. I'm starting to like Holbein versions through this series tbh, wish it was more affordable outside Japan (also, Schmincke does offer a bluer version of their Payne's Grey, just like Daniel Smith, under different names)
It could be the difference in paper that is creating the difference in intensity of color with the W&N one. Maybe your paper agrees more with W&N paints :)
@@OtoKano Could be a paint-paper conspiracy :D But I'm happy with it so, can't complain. One W&N color I don't have to fight with my brush
It's certainly a test I'd be interested in carrying out :)
I have no rewet issues with my DS, I just swatched it out and mine is way darker than yours....
I have the Daniel smith Paynes Blue grey (not shown) and its absolutely stunning! Tinted out has a beautiful blue tint and it 'glows'. Thank you so much for the comparison Oto.
Yes, I LOVE that color too!
Agree, love both the DS Payne's Blue Grey and DS Indigo (both made with PB60 and PBk6) for value studies. The best darks are ones you mix yourself without black, but it's not always practical for value studies and monochromatic pieces. The Mayan Dark Blue Genuine and Lunar Blue are really nice substitutes for Paynesque monochromatics, and I've noticed a lot of handmade paint makers have lovely dark blue-greys that probably work well.
I love daniel smith one
I have Payne’s BG from schmincke and also Indigo. I’m having a hard time telling a huge difference in the two. Would you suggest keeping both or only keeping one of the two ?
My palette is all DS. Can i add sennelier payne’s grey to it? Will it mix well with DS paints? Kindly help Dr. Oto
From my own exp with Sennelier, all of their paint have that white film and my guess it's some kind of brightner added to the paint formula. Which would explain also why they look a bit dull with one layer and catch up on intensity with layering- as the brigthner builds up.
It would be super interesting to test out this theory :D
@@OtoKano I did, haha. QoR on black paper is pretty much invisible (except opaque pigments that are ...opaque) and Sennelier has alway white sheen. It's also very good way to test what manufacters add to the mix that they don't disclame. It's good to compare Sennelier to student line like van Gogh- one has brightners the other opacifier to up the volume. It's subtle difference hard to catch on camera, but shows quality difference nicely.
Great episode! The swatches with the white have carbon black in them. I'm guessing that what you're seeing is residue from bone.
Interesting!
It's not. It's added brightner that Sennelier has in its paint formula.
So you think they all have it?
From Handprint, "The common complaint against any carbon black paint is that the dullness of the finished pigment contrasts unpleasantly with the other paints around it, even other dark paints. This is because carbon pigments are totally opaque, and therefore the light scattering from the surface of the pigment is enhanced after the paint dries, adding a distinct whitish veil to the finished color."
@@jaimeanderson9238 Sennelier- yes, in varying amount. As for black's dullness it's due to the physical properties of colour black in general, as in it does not allow for the light to go through the pigment and bounce off the white of paper that gives the watercolour the luminance on top of black pigments being matte in finish dulling it even more. So to counteract that Sennelier added good amount of brightner to the mix to make the colour more luminous.
This series has really opened my eyes that QoR:s are expensive and they seems not to stand out that much. I currently has QoR:s in my main palette, but I'm not refilling those with QoR. Their "fullsize" tubes are so expensive and smaller than other makers.
I agree with you Cyane, so far, I've not seen anything that justifies the huge price of QoR. They're not so much more amazing than any of the other artist's quality colors. I've also not noticed much of the much talked about synthetic oxgall in action.
I recently got Neutral Grey from Schmincke and am unsure how to feel about it or how to use it. Anyone have this color and like it? I compared it to Daniel Smith neutral tint and it’s a tiny bit more grey and less black the the neutral tint. In mixes it is pretty close to the NT. I’m not sure which one I should go for. My entire reasoning of going for the Schmincke version was because it doesn’t contain a black pigment. That really appealed to me since black is usually opaque and kinda grainy. But they performed similarly to me 🤔🤔
I am a newbie to watercolour and bought a range of reeves Watercolours which you have not mentioned. Is it because to an inferior brand?
Wow, seems like M. Graham almost always has the most beautiful version of all of the colors in this series.
Tried about the Sennelier Payne's Gray on black paper, and it does not have that white cast that your swatch does. Are you using a pan or a tube?
I'm using paints from tubes :)
Thank you Oto ! I dont Get Schmincke on this... if the color Is named after an artist I guess he used it a lot so they should have respected the hue...
Or are all the other brands wrong ? ^^
Also, the blues made from Pb60 seems very dark form me I don't really get the need for a Payne's grey... maybe because I never say the difference side to side ? What are your thoughts on this ?
As always, thanks for the video
Schmincke has the classical Payne's grey simply called Payne's grey blueish... and this one is called Schmincke's payne's grey :)
Sophie - Indanthrone blue and Payne's grey and Indigo are all similar dark blues. I would say that Indanthrone is a bit more brighter in their blue-ness. Indigo to me is like a navy color. Payne's feels more black than the other two, but the differences between them are quite small and you'd probably only need one of the three on your palette.
These Payne's Greys are a lot different than the Payne's Grey I started with namely Grumbacher. My Payne's Grey was just a little bit (to my eyes) on the greenish. I thought it was a very usable color.
I wish there was more talk about Grumbacher Finest Watercolors I like them. It seems to me watching youtube videos that Grumbacher is non-existent.
For just one colour, they're all so different, you could make a rainbow out of them! A very sad rainbow.
I was initially taken back too by the Schmincke's Payne's Grey. But now I love it, I use it when I need black in a painting like for clothes or hair, it doesn't over power or darken too quickly. The DS is shocking, I'm actually a little ashamed for them!!
that is a great use for the Schmincke's one, it does have great value range and much easier to work with than black :)
/pictures Dan wagging his finger at paint tube/- /falls down laughing/
Schmicke is selling graphite as Payne’s grey 😂
Its the wrong colour of Schmincke. The " Payne s Grey blueish " is the right one by Schmincke... But the right mix is by William P. : It was yellow ochre, crimson and ultramarine, no black. See his work , the grey was used in light hue for middle distance. See the pic River Scene ( in Wiki about P.s grey. That blue grey is used for nearly all the picture in the middle distance !
Hmm, Sennelier's payne's gray looks more like Jane's gray...
It doesn't in real life. The PV 19 gives it a depth and glow that most Payne's Grays lack.
Boring voice tone, sorry didn’t enjoy it