Loading Tools? Always Do This First. Boring Bars and Probes - Haas Automation Tip of the Day.
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- Опубліковано 17 чер 2024
- This time around, Mark shows us some good reasons why you really need to pay attention to how you orient the tool when you're loading boring bars, probes, and large diameter tools. Watch closely because this might keep you from making measurement errors, or worse yet, breaking tools.
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Just about to do a bore for the first time on my Haas. Videos like this are why i bought a Haas.
TerryBerry saying "okay boomer" to himself is the best thing ever.
They know exactly who’s watching this video when they say “ok boomer”
I might just be getting started in CNC and not own any HAAS machines. But these tip of the day's are absolute gold. I am always learning something.
Thanks! Been working on haas machine for years and never knew that about the probe.
Thanks Mark I'm going to Calibrate our probe and loaded it up with the Haas logo facing toward the operator.
That's a really good idea since we keep the probe loaded in to the machine.
I definitely learned something good today.
Thank you again.
I was watching this at a robotics competition last weekend. Just after I finished Mark TerryBerry himself walked past my pit and I just about burst into laughter, that "ok boomer" was fantastic.
jake kiedaisch it was a great competition. I love First Robotics. Haas Automation is a huge sponsor. Now we can relax after the long weekend!
Great Info .Thanks for sharing!!😎
Thank you Mark/Haas
Very informative video. Thx.
Haas Tip of the Day + “Ok Boomer” = legendary
Great info
👍 very helpful! Thanks
Thanks HAAS man. Tony
I am not a CNC machinist but a software developer. From my perspective it would make more sense to add a property to a tool instead, to which direction should it retract. The G code should only specify to do retraction, this way it would be more portable, when you ever have to replace the tool with a differently oriented one.
Gábor Móczik hmmmm. I like it. On our lathes we set a Tip Direction so the control knows which way to compensate toolpaths, but if we used a Tip Direction column for each tool, mill/lathe, it could automatically move in the right direction. Clever. - Mark
Nice to know!!
Everytime he said "ok boomer" my phone registered it as an "ok google" command and hilarity ensued.
Reminds me of the following conversation at work.
Operator: What does 'Q' does?
Boss: Dunno, Just stick it to something big 50mm
Operator: Ok
Machine: BOOM!
lol. How did that person become boss??
Sweet!!
I always orient my tools to the ball notch in the holder facing me, including the probe! If I did that with all my tools except the probe someone would be bound to put the probe in facing the wrong way at some point, we load and unload tools much more often than the probe. Bad advice with the HAAS logo thing. Plus using the notch make's it easier to change the battery without removal on smaller machines. My probe is always in the last pocket of the machine anyway so very rarely removed. One point about loading the probe you probably should touch on is setting its loading speed to 50% in tool settings to prevent jarring any physical calibration settings on the probe itself.
Yeah I wish I could set the loading setting at my siemens control it very often alters the probe..
That magnetic ring gage for Calibration of the probe is slick. Went to the website on the engraving and they don't list it any where. Where can I pick one up?
That's a cool boring head. Can you share EDP # for it?
May I suggest a Video about the G10 code and it's advantages I know not a lot people use it but I find it very useful for setting diameter offsets within the program to foolproof for the less experienced operators.
Thanks!
G10 is great until you use it to define the position of a trunnion on the table, remove and reinstall the trunnion, then forget to update the G10 line.
I knew this would be good with the "ok Boomer" comment
I didn't think the "ok, boomer" was as funny as the "I know." Good solid content.
All my spindles get the tools only in one direction, dont fit the other way ;)
Could you make an intuitive programming systems video for lathes? I might be missing some of the many functions.
I have some learning to do...
Q?
J?
🤔
2nd quarter student, just ran my 1st program yesterday.
Crash free too....👍
Give it time... Unfortunately everybody crashes. 5% rapid and slowing down the feed to 10% will be your best friend. Oh and the single block button.
Q acts as x J acts as yis the value for the stepover he wants his boring bar to step over at the end of the tool path. It steps over to keep the one cutting edge from scraping back up the wall. Haas has several canned cycles that others don't have like the g83ijk.
Also. You will crash eventually. Run your programs in the air. Finger on the stop button. Rapid low or even off while feeding. Single block. All of these are things machinists who have been there before, and crashed those machines, do every time they run a new program or have something that isn't 100% straightened out. Take your time. And theres lots of good advice in these videos. Terry is pretty good
it's actually i,j,k = x,y,z (because those variables were already used for other things. Comes up in vector math a lot)
Q appears to be a stand-in variable for that program specifically (which is why it takes priority over the other values)
@@RaphYkun why isn't it U, V
are there any way to index the live tooling on haas lathes to use boring bars ?
Is it common practice in the US to have Setup guy? Here (in Sweden) it’s more common that the operator does everything including setups.
Hi, great video! Just wondering if you hypothetically had a tool that is at 45° (or any angle I suppose), could you add both an I and a J value to the line to make it retract at an angle? Or will the control only allow you to specify one or the other? Thanks and keep up the great work!
Daniel Smith I just tried this out on my simulator, and yes, it looks like the control allows the use of a combine IJ shift just fine. This would allow you to retract at the 45 degrees you mentioned. - Mark
Please make a video on canned cycle
Here are some videos that cover drilling canned cycles. You can do just about every drilling operation using just a G83. Pecking ua-cam.com/video/AM6nVgKjBQo/v-deo.html Chip removal: ua-cam.com/video/d1ATntHemHk/v-deo.html Clearance: ua-cam.com/video/YbbZJ7H0NUw/v-deo.html Tap: ua-cam.com/video/TIZL4LeTms8/v-deo.html Dwelling: ua-cam.com/video/Euh_xrcJ5SI/v-deo.html If you're looking for something specific, let us know and we'll put it on the list. - Mark
Who makes the magnetic probe ring gauge you used in this video?
Bill Weber this is a 1.5” Magnetic Ring Gage from Productivity Quality, Inc, a division of PQI. The magnetic ring works fantastic if you are running on horizontal mills, but it’s also a timesaver on verticals. It is pricey, but I love mine. - Mark
Is that face mill actually aligned in the spindle at 1:21?
Hahhaa. It looks way off. I think what we are seeing isn't the notch for the drive dogs, its the notch that we will see on DIN 69871 Metric toolholders. They are built to a different spec than Inch Cat-40 holders. That extra notch is to accommodate different styles of machines that require it for their tool changers. Haas Mills can run tools with or without those metric flange notches.
Can we achieve Dia.80H6 Fit (+0.015,0.0) using an adjustable boring bar?
🙏🤝tq sir
It is better to keep the probe in the tools magazine or outside the machine?
dejvg0d I would just leave it in the machine all of the time unless you need to take it out for some reason. It’s the safest place for it. - Mark
@@markterryberry4477 thank you very much
Man this video was boring! ;)
Super informative guys, and "ok boomer" had me rolling! Keep the awesome content coming.
I'm looking at the y+ and y- directions at the 7:00 mark. We have two VF4 mills and our y- movement is away from the operator. Are you positive this video is correct?
The x-y plane is in the perspective of the spindle since the spindle itself doesn't actually move in this plane. Negative movements will have the table traverse in the positive direction of each axis. What you just described is exactly what was portrayed in this video.
Since a CNC can have many configurations, it is best to ALWAYS think of driving the tool, NOT moving the machine.
Same CNC program can run on fixed table moving X,Y and Z gantry or an x table with head moving in Y and Z, or the common "C Frame" where table moves in X and Y and head only moves in Z.
Drive the cutter / tool, and none of this matters !
I have a quick question since you're touching on M19. What's your thoughts on using M19 while adjusting and tightening large lathe jaws?
Beckoning Jinx it can be dangerous. If you push too hard, the control will try and and reposition, and it could forcefully spin the chuck around. Ouch. Best to hold the jaw with a large crescent wrench, or do what I do which is just to set the allen wrench as perpendicular to the spindle centerline as possible and give the wrench 3-4 solid smacks with a dead blow hammer. It’s a feel-thing but after years of doing it (and comparing to torque wrench values), I am comfortable doing it that way. - Mark
@@markterryberry4477 Alright, thanks for the tip.
My friend John Nelson made a video on calibrating the probe and its worth checking out m.ua-cam.com/video/VUY2c39jykM/v-deo.html. If the ruby tip on the spindle probe is dialed in dead-nuts to zero, the orientation of the spindle isn’t that big of a deal with the probe, but I still load it the same way each time, because sometimes a tenth of a thou (a few micron) matters. - Mark
wouldn't it be easier if you had two different sized lugs in the spindle or even just a pin in the spindle with the toolholder only having one cutout for it, so one can only put it in the right way, otherwise the pullstud won't be gripped and the tool will slip back into his/her hand?
it's not really hard to do, so I'm wondering why you don't do that in the US? Something along the Lines of DIN 69871, if I remember correctly.
sound easy, but what about balance?
I blame my OCD that I put tools and especially our probe in the same way, despite never actually using this kind of boring cycle.
@@rokbottom8121 Balance is achieved with the spindle being balanced for those two slightely different sized blocks. the toolholder themselves are also balanced from the manufacturer, G6.3 I think is the standard for the one I get mine from (here's their website in case you're interested: kemmler-tools.com/ ), so good to 15000rpm out of the box, but for a not much extra they'll go to G2.5 which would allow much higher rpm. Granted, I doubt it'll be good for above 25000rpm or so, but at those spindle speeds one should considder an hsk spindle, not a tapered one anyways.
this is how the okuma mills are at the shop i work at, but not the haas mills. never understood why the haas machines werent built that way, maybe just a convenience thing. could be a good option when spec'ing the machines, maybe?
Why not use the "oriente spindle" button in MDI?
Since you are using SK-40 tapers on your machine the orientation of tools should not be an issue because the two notches on the toolholders are different depth according to standards. By using different positioned keystones on the spindel you won't be able to put the toolholder in the wrong way again!
To the operator (of different machines) you can often correct this production fault by loosening one keystone and turning it 180° since they are often made asymetric so that you can choose to force toolorientation or not.
tools may be inserted into collets or shrink fit different ways, but the tool holder always need to go the same way,
If the spindle orientation is incorrect just run a M82 and the tool will adjust itself to the part.
Reamer-noun- tool used for reaming
Ream-noun-500 sheets of paper
doesnt sk40 have a notch in the toolholder and two different sized drivekeys to prevent loading the tool the wrong way?
At least our machines have this
Does m19 lock the spindle as well?
Yes it locks the spindle.
Aren‘t the drive dogs on the spindle nose uneaqual so you can‘t put the tool in the wrong way?
I was wondering that too. European "SK-(size)" holders cannot be put in the wrong way. American "(size)-taper" holders seem to be specified differently (or it's a Haas-specific thing, which I doubt).
Haha, when you said OK Boomer it triggered my Google assistant on my phone and stopped the video. Now that was funny.
Thought you had to load the tools with the dimple facing towards you?
That's how I do it
Haha when you said ok boomer, my google voice detection googled "boomer"
...twice
First thing you do when loading a boring bar is run an M19 spindle orient to see which way it's facing then in your boring program just set your retraction direction opposite of that.
John-Peter Kivedo yep. Nice. Not bad for a 30 second script! That’s pretty much it in a nutshell :). Thanks for commenting. - Mark
Responsible of the programmer to insert a warning instruction(#3006) before the boring cycle. Always make the program safe for every users not only for set up guy.
Why is changing the Q to J better than adjusting the setting 27?
Because you may have more than one boring bar in a program, and one orients tip left and another orients tip forward, so leave setting 27 at standard and adjust the program for each tool. No surprises.
@@DavidtheSwarfer Ok. That makes sense. Thanks for replying.
Remember the right hand rule folks!
ooof sneak peak behind scenes for few seconds. they say picture says more than 1000 words. if you have video at 30 fps and 10 minutes then you got a lot of pictures.
What to do if you dont have spindle orientation enabled?
Tool chang?
Așa la lucru cât și la școală!
I bet Mark actually is a boomer.
No. He is gen x.
Why is there no poka yoke to avoid these mistakes entirely?
I know, right? I've wondered the same thing on occasion, then done some quick mental math. The vast majority of tools that get loaded into Haas mills don't need any special orientation (drills, end mills, face mills, taps, reams, chamfer tools..), so overall it saves quite a lot of time for Haas operators to not have to think about which way most tools go into the spindle. It's just simpler and faster allowing the tools to be loaded either way. Of course, we have to look out for the exceptions, like boring bars! Thanks for the comment.
That's easy. Sometimes you actually have to know what you're doing. LOL! Really good explanation.
When you say.. *Ok boomer" my Google turn on waiting for instructions!
I hope the 'aliens' know how to load their probes when you get abducted. Great video thx.
And hopefully the programmer gives you a hint which direction. (Yes, I'm a programmer)
0:36 twins ,eh?
this reminds me of spongebob squarepants where plankton was mr crabs so there were two mr crabs´s
tks boomer! :P
en español
Eu sunt sută la sută produsul educației tatalui meu și studiul individual!
А как же разная глубина пазов в оправке ??
how can i calculate speed and feed for lathes
Ok Boomer, love this
Debería ya estar automatizado.
Entrar commando (boring), especificar diametro y profundidad.
El resto es automatico.
Es mi aporte, saludos.
Fanuc ftw with the spindle orient button
Too bad them Haas spindles are so far out of concentric.
Aw hell, we can work with it.
No, I couldn't help the kick in the ribs.
Thanks Mark, another great tip, even though I always clock my tools.
Mark
Pentru toate lucrurile urâte care le am făcut în viață explicația sunt problemele și societatea.
What about using a pair of gloves ? 😊
what about using a pair of gloves? do you have a problem with people using a pair of gloves, AFNAN?
Using gloves does not change the calibration as long as you using matched pairs. 😉
6:47 MAKE NO SENSE HAVE Q VALUE WHEN I AND J WORK. Oh caps. why q value not move 34 degree then it make sense lol i and j is there why need q
Always, always, always, blame the setup guy.
😂😂😂😂 he said "boomer" priceless!
“ok boomer” 😂😂😂😂
LACES OUT FINKLE... errr HASS LOGO OUT TERRYBERRY
🇧🇷Daniel Machado - Brazil🌎🇺🇸
Próximo mês feira de máquinas em São Paulo - Brasil, eu estarei lá...
“Ok boomer”
Okay boomer
ok boomer
9:19 bcoz those probe suck its only 2 axis gimbal. og wait there 3 axis why lol. of course it read wrong
this is why you do not hire your twin
Eu lucrurile le inteleg nu le notez!
Pot spune cu certitudine pe pământ iubesc doar familia mea.
Dacă nu inteleg sau nu accept degeaba nu cred că sunt absurd
I was actually going to watch this until he said "ok boomer".... That is the least funny statement I've heard all year. No, I'm not a boomer. Shit is corny.
OK NOT A BOOMER...your corny
Your mom corny
Dacă nu inteleg sau nu accept degeaba nu cred că sunt absurd