GNB 450mah 3S HV and non-HV: bit.ly/2PaZKha ▼Join my FB group for more discussion: Kabab FPV facebook.com/groups/379155946182689/ The store: www.FPVCycle.com ▼ My typical 5" quad setup: -Hyperlite Glide Floss Lite: fpvcycle.com/collections/frames -Motor: -Xing 2306: bit.ly/2Nqqr25 - ESC: bit.ly/2oDdzvL -WaFL’s Cap Cap: bit.ly/2GUpXxO -Battery: bit.ly/2JnsTDM -FC: bit.ly/2XRc8G8 -FPV Cam: bit.ly/2Q7LfL7 -Vtx: bit.ly/2HsrASs -ND GoPro Mount 30deg: bit.ly/2WC15zc -ND Filter (if used): bit.ly/2WEmQ1j ▼My preferred goggles as of Sept 2019 bit.ly/2k5YNv5 ▼Notable motors: -BH R3 2207 for $9.99: bit.ly/2NaTWEy (limited quantity only) -Xing 2306: bit.ly/2Nqqr25 -Xing 2208: bit.ly/2y3te8R -FANTASTIC 6" motor: bit.ly/2LqghOZ -Starter goggles: bit.ly/2qbJNOS ▼ If you want to solder better: -Fantastic solder: amzn.to/2P5QM2W -Fantastic iron: goo.gl/DqBipa ▼ Tips? Patreon: bit.ly/2oGLP9b -PayPal: www.paypal.me/kababfpv -Bitcoin: 1E4XZXoD4rS6MYWVWuenY7Kw2M1YgyNpoQ -Nano: xrb_1188ek5bd7tb9kw67asnp9o65byuoaxbtpxuznx1ribf75x78awywmakj55f -ETH: 0xD067F93811f2eC31CB1928901002dfdf9A492EF5 -LTC: La2KWYAjp4VT2Lq2M76pbjzXWvRyjpfCtG -Tesla Referal code: ts.la/bob40889 Please use my referral code if you're gonna buy a Tesla. You get some free stuff when you do and I get better status with Tesla.
Even though these videos chock full of knowledge, like the interview one with the Swedish frame builders, don't get as many views as the "ooh shiny!" flight videos, I feel they're much more valuable because they help give us an understanding of the components of our flying robots. Thanks & keep up the good work.
I agree...coming from the wannabe starlites in this community...to here is night and day. Few videos in and the knowledge on this channel is Time well spent.
I'm curious what the long term effects of charging hv pack to stardard voltage would be. If they have a much better life span it might be worth the capacity loss
GNB seems to have a very accurate mAh rating on almoat all of their batteries, they also can take a lot of abuse (like forgetting to storage charge them) Unfortunately some of their batteries are incredibly hard to get - especially in Europe :/
Have you tested the new Hyperion G8 HV they call them Duel voltage now. I had tried their older ones and like you said they worked great for the first 10 cycles but what I noticed was only the first 1 minute of flight. I fly EDF jets so 1 min different then a quad racer but they still pull lot of current then they would voltage sag. Later after about 15 cycles I would charge to storage and let them sit though though hot summer only to find they puffed. Hyperion replaced them but I no longer charge to 4.35V per cell and they are reliable at 4.2V. Now they come out with their new G8 wondering about these cost more but they are lighter.
Not sure if u noticed this issue with the babytooth platform but with my meteor 75 I swapped the bt2.0 out to xt30 and the voltage stays consistent which is great but I’ve also noticed now that I can’t fly below 3.5v without over draining the ma. My ma sensor on my quad doesn’t work properly but when I charge the lipo my smart charger says it put back 411 ma on a 450. Obviously this is far above the 80 percent safe discharge threshold. I’m currently moving my osd warning up to 3.6 to see if that solves the issue. I guess this is a unfortunate side effect of not getting voltage spikes due to the connector being overkill. If I ran my gnb down to 3.0 in the osd I’m sure I’d be using atleast 420ma on a 450 pack which is crazy. Side note my current sensor is wonky it’s not a calibration issue, it literally starts going up at an insane speed regardless if I’m flying or just arming so it’s useless. All I can go off of is voltage and what I put back in the lipo ma wise
KababFPV yeah I agree, but I just think it’s crazy how stable the voltage is now and that I’m actually way over discharging the lipos due to this buy running them down to 3.5v
Joshua Bardwell says he HiV charges all of his batteries regardless. Is there any update to this topic? I am getting a full minute longer by charging my 1S 650 to HiV
Yeah normal batteries charge to HV fine however they will degrade a little faster. I don't see any real benefits to HV on any lithium battery. It's barely the first few seconds of a flight
Dude, thanks for posting. This type of video is very helpful, we all can't afford to do such testing. If I only knew what I know now about batteries, I would have saved myself some time and money through the years. I just received an order of 2x GNB 3s 450 HVs, was also wondering if it was worth it, coincidentally when youtube presented this video. Thanks again dude, keep up the awesome work.
love your videos, i know its an old video, but from my own perception, i like the fact LiHV are lighter..for example 1100 RDQ 3s lihv weights 69g, while 1100 RDQ 3s lipo 109.5g. thats a 40.5g different! i only have 2 of these batteries and no lipo 1100 to test them against, so i came here to see if hv a/h is really true, and do they last. you answer the lasting part, as it doesnt last past 24 cycles, you some what answer the A/H being the same amount can be seen from time in flight. but i am thinking how you get the same flight time if lihv is much lighter? perhaps it isnt the exact A/H rating then? or perhaps at 450ah its the same weight?
It's not lighter. You're getting less battery overall with worse average performance. It's fine if you like them but you should be aware that they are universally concerned worse by the industry as a whole. Marketing is marketing and it works on many unfortunately.
Great information! Thk u! I bought the 450 1S packs for my XK K110 heli (only REASONABLE battery I could find on Banggood, still VERY expensive!) and they seem to perform O-K. Only charging them to 4.2 tho. I don't/can't fly 3D so I just goof around practicing orientation. Might try charging them to 4.35 one of these days, but given your info, it doesn't seem like it makes much diff/is worth the bother. Cheers!
Thank you for testing and sharing your findings. I heard in one of your videos where you didn't recommend lipos below a certain mAh. Been trying to find that video and figure out what the cutoff is that you recommend and if you happen to have any more info on why.
I think the best in my opinion are genuine LG H2 cells, 20A rated and 3000mAh. Much more current than The 3500mAh cells which will sag and lose capacity in flight. Combine that with a wing like one of the Zohds.
@@Kabab Such a shame. Would be so nice if such a quad would be more easily available, instead of having to forage the parts from various sources, and end up paying almost as much for shipping and handling fees, as for the individual components. Maybe a company like Holybro would be interested in producing your design? They have only 5 inch at the moment, and seem to be focusing on quality over low budget solutions.
@@rc-fannl7364 I have tried so hard to work with so many of these companies but it's just not possible. I can work on bits and pieces with them but they just will not give anyone but themselves control of any project. I have tried so so hard and the best i can do is stock all the parts in my own store and keep them in stock as much as possible. So many things are on the way
Thanks for doing all that testing! In most cases, the batteries that are labeled as "HV" are lighter than non-HV packs with the same mAh rating on the label , because they actually have less of the chemistry in them. For example, the GNB 450mah non-HV 2S pack and the RDQ 525mah HV 2S are both good batteries, in fact they appear to me to be the exact same battery. I know from experience that charging the GNB 450 non-HV pack to 4.35v/cell adds about 70mah. The charging behavior you observed on these particular packs, however, is very interesting. It does seem to imply that there is actually something different about these particular HV cells. I find that there are two main use cases for HV packs. 1) Serious 5" racers who want that little bit of extra punch off the starting line and are willing to pay the price (or have sponsors), and 2) 1S whoop racers who would rather hurt their batteries than add another half a gram of weight (and don't care because 1S batteries are cheap).
Oh, one more observation. Batteries that are HV charged and then discharged gently do not appear to degrade any more than usual, or if they do then the difference is subtle. However, HV batteries that are discharged at high rate on a power hungry quad often show considerable loss of performance after just a few flights. I think the problem comes down to heat. Heat kills batteries. If a battery is uncomfortably warm on the outside after a flight, then it was probably super hot inside (at the connection between the cells) during the flight. The HV charge lets it push amps even harder right at the start of the flight and that heats up the battery really fast. There may be something else going on with the chemistry too, I'm not a battery expert, but it seems to me that there is a high correlation between heat and battery degradation. I was discussing battery longevity with Joshua Barker from Max Amps a while back and he told me that the ideal operating temperature for a lipo battery is between 90-110 deg F. Any warmer and the cells start to degrade.
It's definitely heat. If you put a pack in the toaster for a few hours on 150deg it'll noticably degrade. The packs I was testing barely get warm through hard flight on the TP3 and barely get warm on charging too. So I actually wasn't stressing them much at all in all my testing. The quad is just too efficient and I always let them cool between use and charge too. It's because of the odd charging behavior that I was led to believe that the cells are actually different.
Bardwell says he has someone else doing the testing for him and he says the guy has it done but there still writing it up to release to the puplic so he says lol
Need your advice brother 🙏 i’m buying an all in one stack for my next quad Pyrodrone has a bunch but the two I like the most are the hobby wing F7 with 60 amp ESC or the T motor F7 with 40 amp ESC...they are both $104. Mostly freestyle use. Help me decide brother 🙏🙏🙏
KababFPV yes 5in I’m building my first ImpulseRC frame. Using Apex frame CRSF rx And trying some Xing motors because of your recommendation 2208 or 2207 17-1800kv and a F7 all in one board with a micro runcam eagle 😎👍
KababFPV thanks for the reply. I agree with you. Speeix makes a good ESC. I have two quads still running them. No issues ever 👍 I’ve never tried T-motor before and am kind of curious.
KababFPV thanks for the advice. I think I’ll try something else. Hey I bet you could tell me why the CL V2 Racing stack is on sale for $65?? Is it worth it or stayyyyyy away? That’s a crazy price for an F7 and BLheli32 ESC 🤔
Your experience with the "high volt" doesn't surprise me. Racers often overvolt their packs for their competitions. When you have that much invested in the race, then charge it to 4.4 and screw that battery. Does anyone know if there are places who can recycle the lithium?
@@Kabab That's crazy because it's kind of spendy and we can easily run out. I've even asked environmentalists about battery recycling and they came up empty. Car batteries are worth 8 bucks no matter the condition for the lead.
Will the HV cells generally last longer than the normal ones if they are all charged to 4.2V? How much capacity do you think I'm going to get out of a 2400mah HV pack charged to 4.2v?
@@Kabab I was actually talking about how many cycles I can put through it until it breaks (or the performance is so bad it can't be used any more) The Question: How much capacity do you think I'm going to get out of a 2400mah HV pack charged to 4.2v? was not related to the first one at all, sorry for not asking an understandable question..
@@ELValenin probably about ~2150mah. You can run any lipo through hundreds of cycles and it'll still work. What happens is that after about 70-120 cycles on any pack it begins to loose it's 'zest'. It no longer gives you that same punch of power or as much capacity as it used to.
Ok, althogh there's a few things missing from when people test H.V packs including yourself 1. Charge only to 4.2v per cell for both H.V and regular packs for every single cycle and test perforce, capacity and deterioration/in crease in IR over time. 2. Charge both regular and H.V packs to 4.35v every single cycle and test perforce, capacity and deterioration/in crease in IR over time. 3. Charge both regular and H.V packs to 4.2v four out of five times and to 4.35v once every fifth cycle.and test perforce, capacity and deterioration/in crease in IR over time. The main problems with these test is when they compare H.V batteries they're not treated the same way and usually always H.V charge the H.V batteries and only occasionally charge them to regular 4.2v also likewise they always charge the regular batteries only to 4.2v and occasionally to 4.35v like what you did. I feel like a test needs to be done where both H.V and regular lipos are both charger and discharged in the exact same way and voltage.
This test was done by treating the batteries as designed. As I explain in the video, there's absolutely zero point to charging an HV pack to 4.2v because you're not getting the full capacity of the cell and resulting performance is definitely worse than a standard voltage pack...which makes HV pointless. There isn't a single HV pack on the market that has notably better performance than a standard voltage pack. The best ones give you a few seconds of more power at the beginning of the flight only. Every single known HV pack on the market so far as of Aug 2021 has the same flaws which makes them not worth it. You're obviously welcome to keep using them but they're a waste of money and time if you look at real world tests.
Got FPV gear in the mail today 😎👏 My full size crossfire and nano RX’s came today. I set it up on my DX8 in like 10 mins. If anyone is trying to run CRSF on Spektrum DX8 I can help. Love the content brother. I’ve been thinking allot about lipos lately 👍👏
RcHaze yes you use the trainer jack but you don’t use PWM you use the CRSF protocol. You need the full size module. It comes with the adapter you need. Only catch for Spektrum you have to switch the wires. You won’t have read out telemetry but you can set up LQ in the OSD on channel 12.
@@Politicallyhomeless957 wait so dx8 now is able to run full crossfire ? No latency?. I modded the dx9 to use full crossfire protocol. Firmware upgrade as well.
RcHaze yes! You need the full size module. Use the connector with the trainer jack and swap the wires. I just cut soldered and shrink wrapped. Then when you power up your module plug it into the DX8. It powers up your transmitter and uses full crsf protocol. No ppm, pwm or SBUS. Just sweet crossfire 👍 How do you like it so far?
@@Politicallyhomeless957 once I did the spektrum dx9x fire mod and firmware update the experience has been awesome! I never have to worry about failsafes . 2 20700 3500mah in series as an external power supply just for those long range occasions. Had this mod for over a year. I wonder if I could do what you done on my dx6i.
February is right around the corner, I’m looking forward to seeing this new bt2 alternative connector hopefully it’s lighter than the xt30 so I can save some weight on my 1s lipos and quads
I finally got to fly my TP3 build and it's absolutely fun as hell to fly. Super precise through tight turns and flips, 1303 motors+GF Hurricane props are smooth and quiet. I'm using the GNB 3S HV packs that you discussed in your video and they performed well. I'm looking forward to more of your designs👍.
Just realized my charger doesn't go hv. I ordered 4 of the hv gnb batteries from fpvcycle. Will it hurt them to charge them to normal voltage instead of hv?
Not at all. They'll last way longer. But you just won't get full capacity. Even if it doesn't do HV charge you can probably get it to go to around 4.3v per cell maybe.
@@Kabab only thing my charger has wrote on it is 680ac. No manufacturer it anything. Probably just gonna pick up that toolkit rc charger and power supply pyro has. I can only choose the cell count that I'm charging
@@Kabab got it in the cart right now along with the reciever I forgot to get for my tp3. Can't beat the price for the charger or the power supply. Got the predator nano and a canopy too. Can't wait for the stuff to get here. Never flown a toothpick or built one been wanting to for a while now
I always standard charge the HV packs and it works great. Longevity problem solved. Also, maybe just doing a lower HV would be a compromise for performance and longevity. 4.25V or something.
I know this is a somewhat "old" video, but one thing no one talks about is the lifetime of an HV pack if they are only charged to 4.2V. For example, there is the GNB 3s 520mah HV and the there is the GNB 3s 450mah, both have the same weight. So the question is: are both actually the same capacity when charged to 4.2? Does the HV last the same amount of cycles when charged to 4.2? What is the best buy and for what margin? These are just useful questions, if you could answer them and pin this comment i'm sure it would help a lot of people. Thank you anyways.
These are questions I answer in this video. Charging an HV pack to non HV is just a partial charged pack. Sure it'll last more cycles but it also won't fly as long
No, you do ask a good question. Being the same weight, it looks suspiciously like those two batteries are the same, the manufacturer just claiming one batch is "hv" and thereby increasing the mAh rating.
Some of this seems a little contradictory to what I *think* I know about batteries. It sounds like you are getting a mixture of usage advice and the actual capabilities of the cell. I am reasonably sure the *chemistry* is the same but there is a *physical* difference in the construction. I also do not believe that ANY lithium polymer battery should be run down below 3.3v *at the cell terminals*. The physical difference in the battery is obvious, it's bigger for less capacity (at the same voltage), this implies more substrate and/or more electrode materiel. The substrate thickness is closely related to the C rating and IR of the battery so this seems likely. That's my thought on what it is at any rate. I reckon the voltage advice was more advice for usage. I think the 0.4v difference represents losses in the system. That would be testable though, I bet if you ran one on the 20A board (or some other high capacity board) with 20awg wires down to 2.9v you'd see a substantial increase in IR vs running it on a lower capacity one with higher resistance in the traces.
yeah it very well could be the construction and not the chemistry. Whatever it is, these are my results from actual use. Both packs hold up really well when abused a little. That's really the only confirmed result here.
@@Kabab So, in detail there can be chemistry and construction differences, but you do actually want slightly different electrolytes setups in LiHV to actually get the most extra capacity out of them. For lifecycle, silicon doping cathodes goes a fairly long way (mostly in discharge side, but does help withstand aggressive charging schedules), which does work on LiPO/LiHV, but it more noticeable in HV setups. The hard physical limit is that being ran under 3V within the cell puts the battery in a regime where it is plating lithium onto the anode surfaces - which both ties up Li+ ions (capacity loss) and those dendrites that get formed contribute to lost peak discharge (effective C rating) and will eventually create shorts in the cell (lifecycle loss). What this means in the OSD varies - ~2.9V on a 1S whoop, ~3.3V on something larger. This actually comes down to what the resting voltage versus loaded cell output voltage is, and that plating effect is far less pronounced during actual discharge (and also, murdering whoop batteries isn't so terrible) When you start thinking of the substrate as a 3-D intercalation foam, it starts to make a bit more sense why amorphous graphene products work as well as they do, and you're right that varying the electrode/electrolyte ratios and sizes do play a significant role in optimizing capacity versus current (energy dense vs. power dense), and I suspect a lot of the used tradespace in battery development is varying these parameters more so than actual battery research into the electrochemistry, but there are electrolyte changes that favor those which can be used... but as always, the caveat is "because China" on all these
It’s so frustrating that no one really sells non hv lipos for 300mah and 350mah. Gnb is the best IMO but all I can find is hv. I know rdq gets there lipos from gnb also but after maybe 20 cycles these lipos are losing there zest. I was able to fly to 280 mah on my 350s and I’d land at 3.2v. I stopped at 280 so I don’t over drain the lipos seeing as 280 is 80percent. Now after 20 cycles all 15 of my lipos are getting maybe 240 mah and there at 3.1v. So annoying. I even used deox gold contact cleaner to clean the lipos and the ph2.0 which always does the trick on my non hv nitro nectars. Guess I’ll just have to buy more lipos 🤷♂️
As one of the goofballs that actually has done research on this - I actually would agree with your HALT testing methodology on abusing these packs in the name of science (and also impatience/laziness). 5C charging won't diminish cycle life terribly, even going to 10C is just accelerated lifetime (half to quarter cycle endurance at worst), ditto on the discharge schedule - if you are going from fully charged to fully discharged, especially in less than three minutes, then you're going to see the same sort of accelerated loss in capacity and discharge capability... so actually excellent job on figuring out a HALT regime that doesn't cost thousands of dollars, and is more directly relevant to the way most of us are going to use these packs.
I get all the lab tests but actual flight testing gives me so much more information. I realize that it's not as standardized but again, the actual flight experience is just as important IMO. I also didn't clearly explain everything. I let all the packs return to resting temps before charging and after charging. They barely changed temps during charging. I cannot believe the abuse they take however. I've been charging at 11C the entire time and it's been as if I'm charging at 1C so far. I'm currently around cycle 40 on all the packs and the IR really has not changed all that much. Far less than I was expecting. Under normal non-abusive use conditions I'd give both of these packs at least a 100 cycle rating. The HV pack really is unlikely to see the end of it's life from charge cycles. Even I will eventually destroy the pack physically over 100+ cycles.
@@Kabab That's the thing most people miss - all of my 100+ cycle CNHL packs are going to be mechanically destroyed before they actually stop working well electrically. I've lost about 10% of the total capacity, and probably 15-20% of the peak discharge capability over two years of racing abuse and 5C charging... and these are $12 batteries (4S 1300mAh 100C). Most are on repaired balance leads, replaced heatshrink, and taped-over leads because they've been fed to props - all are deformed from crashes, but those six packs are my daily drivers still... and I'm convinced they'll fail mechanically before electrically.
650mah 3S is gonna be a better option on the 1404 motors....however I'd recommend bigger motors for that thing. Consider 1407 if you don't have them yet.
Hi, those motors for 3s. look like Amax Inno. What size and KV are you running for good balance between power, and good flight times? Are those 1303-4800KV?? cheers, keep up the good work.
There are no hard voltages on lipo. 4.2Volt is just set as a nice compromise, for long livety. In the very beginning of lipo standard was 4.3v this was then lowered to 4.2 to reach longer battery life. I think if you use good quality lipo, just top off your batteries to HV just before flight in the field, but don't store them leave them laying around full and especially not HV as packs will degrade fast.
Does improve cycle life for the battery, but not by all that much. If you're happy with that capacity, party on. (FWIW, on my GTB339 3" TP-esque setup, I am perfectly happy with this - on my 1S setups, I'm not, so I just abuse those)
Do you think you'll design a canopy for your tp3, or are you just going to stick with the one shown there that you've been running? I really would love to get behind this kwad because I believe in you and what you're doing but honestly, I'm shallow when it comes to my kwads and looks matter somewhat to me. I hate saying that but it's true and I just can't stand the aio camera mounting option.
unfortunately I've gotta go with function over aesthetics. There is a printed option I'm working on but it looks very similar. It's a pretty difficult challenge to make it durable, light and good looking. I'm open to options.
I had similar experiences using 1500mAh (HV and standard) at my 5", thanks for that information. Btw.: where can I get those blue rubber bands for attaching the battery? The black ones came with my TP3 frames are way to short.
Fantastic info. Please test the GNB 520mah 3s HV packs. They're very similar to the 450's. I hope they are good because I just got 8 of them for my toothpick. Performing well so far. They have had similar flight times to the 450mah HV's from my experience.
Gday Bob, 5 amp to charge those small batteries, dam!! JB still has the battery tester but hasn't done any testing lately he has someone that runs his testing just get in touch with him im sure he would help you out with battery testing, interesting results so if you treated the batteries normally (not abused them) which ones do you recommend Bob the hv or standards great review mate.👍🛸
Originally I would have said just the standard voltage. Now that I've tested them in the real world, both are actually excellent. It's totally up to you. Do you want that extra burst of power for the first dozen seconds of flight or so...
@@marc_frank When you demand the amps, the voltage dropoff will be what it will be (and really you tend to hit wattage targets) - so you want something that doesn't fall completely off the cliff.
@@tehllama42 yes, you do want the lowest internal resistance as possible additionally, it would be advantagious, if the chemistry allowed the same capacity to be used between two less different voltages now between 3.3 and 4.2 better would be between 3.9 and 4.2 also higher voltage per cell is better so between ~6V and 5.8V would be perfect why 6V? thats the difference of potential between lithium and fluor, the highest possible voltage any single cell battery can have
Are you going to list 1S and 2S packs? I was going to run 2S on my Toothpick as a happy medium between 1S & 3S for getting my kids flying after they get the hang of the simulator.
2S is really great for learning on the TP3. The 1S version called the BabyTooth should be coming end of next week I hope. Just waiting on delivery. I'd say 1S on the BabyTooth is pretty frikin awesome.
Great vid bob. GNB packs are definitely good. I’m still running my 2 original 450 2s packs 3 years and hundreds of cycles later and they are just now starting to feel like the power isn’t as good as it used to be.
KababFPV definitely. On my very first gnb 450 I’ve lost count of how many cycles are on it. Lol. Just found my notebook with all of my notes and one gnb at last count prolly 6 months ago had 723 cycles on it and still going strong. My original one has at least twice that and just now starting to feel like it’s suffering and not by much but it is noticeable.
@@pkvillager it does matter cause one of my 1s battery explored in flight and it cost me 130 $ . Before the fly it look like new only used it more than 20 cycle .
@@techvirus9541 I highly doubt the battery exploded due to the battery, you probably had a short or severely damaged the pack by over charging/discharging. No one makes worse lipos that BetaFPV and I still never had one of those explode or any lipo for that matter and I am not nice to my packs.
1s LiHV is what is in your cell phone. I've noticed the phone, when it switches off due to flat battery is at absolute min just under 3.7 V. So maybe I think LiHV needs a higher cut off to keep them in good shape over many many cycles? If so then the benefit of HV is simply higher volts = more rpm, you don't really get longer flights if you have to cut off higher? Caveat here is discharge rate is much higher of course on quad vs phone. Note the phone does charge the battery to 4.35V
It's the current draw and push during charging that kills a pack. That's why 1s cells can be run down to 2.9v. Because the current on 1snis naturally very low.
@@Kabab it is subjective, but I'm sure that I am getting more good cycles from whoop batteries now that I don't go lower than 3.1, a lot of the time I don't go this low even. Based on that I wouldn't agree you should go as low as 2.9, even on a 1s whoop
I can measure the internal resistance ten times on the same pack and get ten different readings back to back to back ect. I can't trust the way it is measured with these chargers. Do you get consistent readings?
Awesome testing and review, Bob! Yeah, GNB is fantastic! I only buy cheaper lipos for rc cars, because they don't need high C rating. 😊 Other than that, most my batteries are GNB. I guess I have one Tattu and one CNHL. 😊
I'd recommend not bothering with CNHL at this point in time. Especially their small packs. They're bigger, heavier and significantly under perform. They're not even much cheaper when you look at the dollar amount. No idea what URUAV are but they're likely not GNB.
Thanks for all the work, it is appreciated. Please stock the standard voltage, as they are really hard to find and they do last longer. Also, please keep stocking the Infinity batteries, as those seem to be great as well.
They are really hard to find. I'm hoping people realize that the HV, while really really good in this case, isn't even worth the extra 50c you pay for it imo. However, both are truly excellent and I'd give both of them at least a 100+ cycle lifespan under normal non-abusive conditions.
Love these type of videos! Just FYI the packs aren't showing a huge difference bc your running them through a toothpick. If you were to do this test on a 3 or 5 inch (more amp draw) your results would probably be way different! Also if you want to know the exact chemical difference between the two packs I could rip em open and test the powders, my guess tho is that the HV uses a high purity naturally sourced graphite anode (higher crystaline structure) and maybe some conductive additive and thats it! 95% of the cathodes in all lipos are the exact same LiCoO2 formula so its the anode that changes (theres like 6 types of graphite available) and perhaps the amount of additive or SEI. The type of graphite used can significantly affect the things your talking about and would be even more prevalent at higher amperage. yay long ass comment :)
KababFPV could be, Ive never popped those particular packs open to check, that would be odd however to change the manufacturing process when u can just change ingredients for the same result. 🤷♂️
I cant handle this anymore!!! You always say amazing things coming and then boom gone like a sandwich in front of my fat aunt!! MADNEDSS BOB MADNESS!!! LOL
Oh no, you called him out! You gonna learn something today. I repeat this sentence every day, when my apprentice did some weird shit and we have to fix it together.
Just knowing it's an honest company to work with, I'd personally be very interested to know a whole lot more - especially since I do have some excessive background in this area. Hard for me personally to justify anything other than dirt cheap CNHLs most of the time, but I've been pretty impressed with the performance of the 520mAh LiHV variant of these packs over 48 cycles.
The CNHL packs were pretty good when they first came out but over the years they've been getting worse and worse. Especially the small size cells. They're bigger, weigh more and perform far worse in my testing. The larger packs can be okay if your quads power requirements are not huge. Especially the 6S packs because moving to 6S and lower kv reduces the overall amp requirements on the battery so it seems to perform similar. But don't be mistaken, they are cheap cells and you're not getting the best performance.....but that may be just fine for you which I'd say is totally fine. If I can, I'll get higher end cells but I'd be fine with CNHL 6S packs too.
@@Kabab Totally use case dependent - I get away with landing @ or near storage voltage (even when racing), so I'm pretty rarely battery limited. I definitely prefer to have a pile of packs I can practice with rather than a 10% performance improvement in my flight regime that costs 2x as much for my 5" and 7" uses, so I'll take the peak performance hit for that. The Orange series has just been 'meh', the White/Black are definitely better packs. The real tradeoff is that you are carrying extra weight relative to the power on offer compared to others, but I'm either running them as race quads (F2.1 Hybrid), or on 7" GoPro haulers, which have so much performance overhead it doesn't matter. Especially on my 7" setups where I expected to annihilate batteries, what I find is the opposite, I can operate well within the ability of the batteries and still get performance that far exceeds my expectations for them basically being Banggood specials on F2.1 frames.
Does anyone actually know who the OEM is on the Pyrodrone Graphene battery line? I keep hearing good things about these batteries, but not sure if they're that much worse or better than GNB's...
I have been charging my HV's to simple lipo 4.2 volts for a long time except in my 1s whoops where I need any thing I can get to fly for more than 2 minutes....
I don't agree that hv batteries are different chemistry. HV batteries are smaller mah standard lipos that get more mah when charged to hv. So 450mah hv batteries are actually 400 or 350mah packs.
Those infinity 3s 450mah are a little heavier but I get soooo much flight time from them. About 1 min longer on a tp3. Now they are sold out everywhere.
Mutefpv has tested both the blue and pink HV ones. The 4.2v were larger and heavier and had slightly worse performance under load but both had their stated capacity ua-cam.com/video/cv-Y6pmV7A8/v-deo.html ua-cam.com/video/C-x_b0KSVhA/v-deo.html I use the 1s HV ones since they are half the cost of the blues and just charge them to 4.2 Dont know about RC lipo tech but if you search for any modern samsung or iphone battery you can see many labelled 3.85v/3.81v etc
Yeah 1S is a little different. I think I'm gonna go with the HV 550 cells for my up coming 1S 3" BabyTooth product. The HV is actually cheaper than the non-HV and I think it's okay to throw away the cell after about 30-40 cycles.
Probably also worth mentioning that we ran 450mAh 3S NanoTechs on our Atoms... which is EXACTLY like a Toothpick,.. only twice the weight and 3 years ago. Small stuff is the more fun.
This video pissed me off... It reminded me of my $ wasted on HV packs in the past that died after 50 cycles. And that Bardwell took my money for the fancy tester and doesn't test batteries anymore... If I had that tester, every pack would be tested as they get released. I want my $30 back, that will buy me a decent amount of packs for my toothpick lol
We don't even stock the HV anymore. There's just no point in a battery that doesn't have any better performance, has worse cycle endurance and costs more. I've had my packs for a while now and the HV ones are totally shot while the regular ones still work fine. Neither is good as it was when they were new but the regular voltage one is damn close after about 100 cycles.
This was very very interesting. Long efficient flights is not just your goal 😉 I think we all want that. Imagine a 25min. Flight time with an hd toothpick. Hopefully it will happen one day 😁
If you run a ~1100mah 3S on this quad you could probably get close to 20min. The quad weight is extremely low for it's build stature and it's quite powerful.
i bought the cheapest hv batterys that i have found wich been the uruav 450mah, i killed some of them by threating them like a non hv runnning them down to 3.3 but since i strictly land at 3.5 they just keep working. by now i have more than 100 cycles on them and they still work nice
They may be genuinely different, the high voltage cells, but by what you describe, they aren't genuinely better. I don't believe in HV voltage batteries. Sure, you say these are different than the regular voltage bats, but by what you are telling us, they don't give us any improvements in return. I will always believe regular voltage batteries will give us more amount of decent charges and flights. I think 99% of HV batteries are regular batteries with an HV on the label... And don't give us very many charges before they are junk. Thanks for doing all of this testing and research! It's really helpful! 😎 🤘
Yes these tests take frikin forever. I spent about 2hrs each night flying back and fourth for so many days I don't even wanna think about it. But a huge positive is that I've run so many packs through this one quad I cannot even believe that it's still running like new.
I use the I charger 4010 Duo, charger mine came even with calibration certificate/report, were voltages were accurately calibrated on HP voltmeter. The IR measurement is very reliable especially at higher capacity packs it becomes difficult to be reliable, some standard chargers even state in their manuals that IR cannot be used reliably under f.i, 10m ohm. So for smaller capacity packs it is more accurate in general. Anyway I recommend highly the I charger, addionally due it's 2.2amp balance current it is very fast charger, as it keeps the full charge current almost to the end without slowing down. Anyway I also bring packs to storage 3,8, then do a 5c or high rate charge to find IR. Take care when comparing IR take note that hot cells show much lower IR values than cold cells so not compare at the bench and just after flying. For racing pre-warming cells first could be a good thing. Final point on fast charging, I do not believe fast charging 5c or possibly 10c does any hurt to batteries, as long as battery C rating is much higher, so a 100C discharge capable battery, charging at 10c is only 10% from it's current rating. In general as long as pack do not warm up during charging it is not hurting the pack. I did not find any degradiation and always fast charge 5c. For me this is purely a safety thing manufacturrs put, when fast charging a bad cell or slightly damaged pack things can get explosively out of hand very quickly, so yes it is much more dangerous to fast charge. Discharging below 3.5Volt especially under high loads = very bad. The weakest cell in the pack will be get down too far..... (ideally on our 5 inch quads we could have a lowest cell volt measurement sensor on the balance lead and use that for monitoring, instead of pack voltage) Leaving packs stored fully charged is also bad and degrades packs quite quickly. I honestly do not believe HV is any different to non HV, rather than they can play with several things, like thicknes of laminates/substrates, the thicknes of isolation etc. everything has a tradeoff or downside, otherwise all lipo would be manufactured to the HV standard. For lipo buy a good deal, be kind to them. Monitoring the IR consistently and reporting them I would like to see it, but you need a good device or charger. to me IR = equal to C rating.
Yeah since making this video I've done more research and also believe it's some sort of construction change. Not a chemical one. I also didn't mention that I let all batteries cool to ambient before and after charging and after use.
From my extensive battery testing lithium high volt batteries are a complete waste of money. Yes the extra .15 volts is initially beneficial for extra power and flight times, but it's literally for the first 10 seconds and only extends flight time for roughly the same amount of time. The extra cost and low life cycle from charging to lihv levels just don't justify the extra cost incurred.
My guess is that JB's battery testing wasn't generating enough affiliate clicks to justify the labour. It's a real shame. There seems to be more shilling and less science on his channel now days.
You could not be more wrong. If I were publishing these results there would be tons of affiliate clicks. It's hilarious to see people accuse me of not doing the testing because it wouldn't be profitable when the exact opposite is true. I'm putting out a video today about the truth, since clearly there is a lot of interest. The short version is that running the tests is basically a full time position in order to generate enough results to be meaningful, and in order to produce those results I would have to basically stop making videos and do nothing else. So when I realized that was the case, I set out to hire people to do the testing for me, and so far I have not been able to do that.
I didn't mean to stir up anything. Half way through my own rudimentary testing I just remembered that you had a legit tester I had heard nothing of for a while. Sorry if it's caused any trouble for you.
Hi @@JoshuaBardwell. Sorry if I offended, I'm not here to try and start anything. I was just expressing my thoughts as an outsider looking in. I'm a business owner as well and constantly find myself having to manage the limited time I have available to me. A lot of this comes down to prioritising the projects that provide either the most personal enjoyment or financial reward. I assume that there is a component of this in every successful UA-camr's day as well, though I could be wrong. Looking forward to seeing more battery tests when they drop. Cheers Jake.
Hi @@Kabab. Sorry man. I didn't want to start shit in your comments. As always, I really appreciate your videos and thoughts. Keep the great videos coming.
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Even though these videos chock full of knowledge, like the interview one with the Swedish frame builders, don't get as many views as the "ooh shiny!" flight videos, I feel they're much more valuable because they help give us an understanding of the components of our flying robots.
Thanks & keep up the good work.
The engineering is more interesting to me in the videos than the flying, I often skip at least some of the flying ✈
humans are primitive
I agree...coming from the wannabe starlites in this community...to here is night and day. Few videos in and the knowledge on this channel is Time well spent.
I'm curious what the long term effects of charging hv pack to stardard voltage would be. If they have a much better life span it might be worth the capacity loss
They will last longer but you'd be cutting a good bit off your flight time for the same size and weight pack. Might as well go with the standard
GNB seems to have a very accurate mAh rating on almoat all of their batteries, they also can take a lot of abuse (like forgetting to storage charge them)
Unfortunately some of their batteries are incredibly hard to get - especially in Europe :/
Have you tested the new Hyperion G8 HV they call them Duel voltage now. I had tried their older ones and like you said they worked great for the first 10 cycles but what I noticed was only the first 1 minute of flight. I fly EDF jets so 1 min different then a quad racer but they still pull lot of current then they would voltage sag. Later after about 15 cycles I would charge to storage and let them sit though though hot summer only to find they puffed. Hyperion replaced them but I no longer charge to 4.35V per cell and they are reliable at 4.2V. Now they come out with their new G8 wondering about these cost more but they are lighter.
I wouldn't bother. Just keep it to the standard cells. There's nothing else out there that's any better in any significant way consistently
And now I'm glad most of my lipos (all of my hv) are GNB. 😁
Same!
Not sure if u noticed this issue with the babytooth platform but with my meteor 75 I swapped the bt2.0 out to xt30 and the voltage stays consistent which is great but I’ve also noticed now that I can’t fly below 3.5v without over draining the ma. My ma sensor on my quad doesn’t work properly but when I charge the lipo my smart charger says it put back 411 ma on a 450. Obviously this is far above the 80 percent safe discharge threshold. I’m currently moving my osd warning up to 3.6 to see if that solves the issue. I guess this is a unfortunate side effect of not getting voltage spikes due to the connector being overkill. If I ran my gnb down to 3.0 in the osd I’m sure I’d be using atleast 420ma on a 450 pack which is crazy. Side note my current sensor is wonky it’s not a calibration issue, it literally starts going up at an insane speed regardless if I’m flying or just arming so it’s useless. All I can go off of is voltage and what I put back in the lipo ma wise
I don't even bother setting my current meter anymore. takes way too much time to try and calibrate.
KababFPV yeah I agree, but I just think it’s crazy how stable the voltage is now and that I’m actually way over discharging the lipos due to this buy running them down to 3.5v
Joshua Bardwell says he HiV charges all of his batteries regardless. Is there any update to this topic? I am getting a full minute longer by charging my 1S 650 to HiV
Yeah normal batteries charge to HV fine however they will degrade a little faster. I don't see any real benefits to HV on any lithium battery. It's barely the first few seconds of a flight
Dude, thanks for posting. This type of video is very helpful, we all can't afford to do such testing. If I only knew what I know now about batteries, I would have saved myself some time and money through the years. I just received an order of 2x GNB 3s 450 HVs, was also wondering if it was worth it, coincidentally when youtube presented this video. Thanks again dude, keep up the awesome work.
Man I can’t wait for solidstate battery’s!! Game changer!!!
Those batteries I don’t think are quite common knowledge yet!
I too am looking forward to this technology. 😎🎮🤙🏻stay up
would be cool, but a while out, still
BrknProp FPV check out this ua-cam.com/video/g0nA8CfxBqA/v-deo.html
Johnny be good! 😂 👍
love your videos, i know its an old video, but from my own perception, i like the fact LiHV are lighter..for example 1100 RDQ 3s lihv weights 69g, while 1100 RDQ 3s lipo 109.5g. thats a 40.5g different! i only have 2 of these batteries and no lipo 1100 to test them against, so i came here to see if hv a/h is really true, and do they last. you answer the lasting part, as it doesnt last past 24 cycles, you some what answer the A/H being the same amount can be seen from time in flight. but i am thinking how you get the same flight time if lihv is much lighter? perhaps it isnt the exact A/H rating then? or perhaps at 450ah its the same weight?
It's not lighter. You're getting less battery overall with worse average performance. It's fine if you like them but you should be aware that they are universally concerned worse by the industry as a whole. Marketing is marketing and it works on many unfortunately.
Great information! Thk u! I bought the 450 1S packs for my XK K110 heli (only REASONABLE battery I could find on Banggood, still VERY expensive!) and they seem to perform O-K. Only charging them to 4.2 tho. I don't/can't fly 3D so I just goof around practicing orientation. Might try charging them to 4.35 one of these days, but given your info, it doesn't seem like it makes much diff/is worth the bother. Cheers!
Thank you for testing and sharing your findings. I heard in one of your videos where you didn't recommend lipos below a certain mAh. Been trying to find that video and figure out what the cutoff is that you recommend and if you happen to have any more info on why.
Nothing below 450mah is what I recommend. They just get super wonky below that.
Would love to see some tests on 18650 type batt. For longer range stuff.
Oh, also money burning a whole in my pocket waiting for another Glide frame😜
Hold on. Things on the way. Glide and more awesome
I think the best in my opinion are genuine LG H2 cells, 20A rated and 3000mAh. Much more current than The 3500mAh cells which will sag and lose capacity in flight. Combine that with a wing like one of the Zohds.
Thanks for the information. Unfortunately, your toothpick is not available.... Will you do a test of the Tyro89? Hope so!
In about a week to 10 days it'll be all available
@@Kabab How about BnF or PNP options? Would be nice besides all the much less efficient stuff that is widely available.
@@rc-fannl7364 yeah I'd love to build them but unfortunately I'm not in China and don't have that sort of resources
@@Kabab Such a shame. Would be so nice if such a quad would be more easily available, instead of having to forage the parts from various sources, and end up paying almost as much for shipping and handling fees, as for the individual components. Maybe a company like Holybro would be interested in producing your design? They have only 5 inch at the moment, and seem to be focusing on quality over low budget solutions.
@@rc-fannl7364 I have tried so hard to work with so many of these companies but it's just not possible. I can work on bits and pieces with them but they just will not give anyone but themselves control of any project. I have tried so so hard and the best i can do is stock all the parts in my own store and keep them in stock as much as possible. So many things are on the way
good vid, I love my lipos, is this normal?
Thanks for doing all that testing! In most cases, the batteries that are labeled as "HV" are lighter than non-HV packs with the same mAh rating on the label , because they actually have less of the chemistry in them. For example, the GNB 450mah non-HV 2S pack and the RDQ 525mah HV 2S are both good batteries, in fact they appear to me to be the exact same battery. I know from experience that charging the GNB 450 non-HV pack to 4.35v/cell adds about 70mah. The charging behavior you observed on these particular packs, however, is very interesting. It does seem to imply that there is actually something different about these particular HV cells.
I find that there are two main use cases for HV packs. 1) Serious 5" racers who want that little bit of extra punch off the starting line and are willing to pay the price (or have sponsors), and 2) 1S whoop racers who would rather hurt their batteries than add another half a gram of weight (and don't care because 1S batteries are cheap).
Oh, one more observation. Batteries that are HV charged and then discharged gently do not appear to degrade any more than usual, or if they do then the difference is subtle. However, HV batteries that are discharged at high rate on a power hungry quad often show considerable loss of performance after just a few flights. I think the problem comes down to heat. Heat kills batteries. If a battery is uncomfortably warm on the outside after a flight, then it was probably super hot inside (at the connection between the cells) during the flight. The HV charge lets it push amps even harder right at the start of the flight and that heats up the battery really fast. There may be something else going on with the chemistry too, I'm not a battery expert, but it seems to me that there is a high correlation between heat and battery degradation. I was discussing battery longevity with Joshua Barker from Max Amps a while back and he told me that the ideal operating temperature for a lipo battery is between 90-110 deg F. Any warmer and the cells start to degrade.
It's definitely heat. If you put a pack in the toaster for a few hours on 150deg it'll noticably degrade. The packs I was testing barely get warm through hard flight on the TP3 and barely get warm on charging too. So I actually wasn't stressing them much at all in all my testing. The quad is just too efficient and I always let them cool between use and charge too. It's because of the odd charging behavior that I was led to believe that the cells are actually different.
very interesting results and testing. thanks for this video!
Dumb question for this older, but still relevant video, what do you use to mark your batteries? I use a Sharpie and the ink seems to rub off easily.
Yeah a sharpie and I'm careful about rubbing it around too much.
Bardwell says he has someone else doing the testing for him and he says the guy has it done but there still writing it up to release to the puplic so he says lol
Need your advice brother 🙏 i’m buying an all in one stack for my next quad Pyrodrone has a bunch but the two I like the most are the hobby wing F7 with 60 amp ESC or the T motor F7 with 40 amp ESC...they are both $104. Mostly freestyle use. Help me decide brother 🙏🙏🙏
This is for a 5"? I'd go with a 20x20 ESC and your choice of any 20x20 FC. The spedix 6s 20x20 with the dual boards is my preference right now
KababFPV yes 5in I’m building my first ImpulseRC frame. Using Apex frame CRSF rx And trying some Xing motors because of your recommendation 2208 or 2207 17-1800kv
and a F7 all in one board with a micro runcam eagle 😎👍
KababFPV thanks for the reply. I agree with you. Speeix makes a good ESC. I have two quads still running them. No issues ever 👍 I’ve never tried T-motor before and am kind of curious.
@@Politicallyhomeless957 Tmotor makes some okay motors but they don't do much special anymore. You can skip them if you like. For now
KababFPV thanks for the advice. I think I’ll try something else. Hey I bet you could tell me why the CL V2 Racing stack is on sale for $65?? Is it worth it or stayyyyyy away? That’s a crazy price for an F7 and BLheli32 ESC 🤔
Your experience with the "high volt" doesn't surprise me. Racers often overvolt their packs for their competitions. When you have that much invested in the race, then charge it to 4.4 and screw that battery. Does anyone know if there are places who can recycle the lithium?
I've actually never heard of lithium recycling
@@Kabab
That's crazy because it's kind of spendy and we can easily run out.
I've even asked environmentalists about battery recycling and they came up empty. Car batteries are worth 8 bucks no matter the condition for the lead.
@@billybbob18 intesting idea. Maybe Elon will talk about it on battery day
Will the HV cells generally last longer than the normal ones if they are all charged to 4.2V? How much capacity do you think I'm going to get out of a 2400mah HV pack charged to 4.2v?
HV will NOT last as long as a normal cell when charged to 4.2v. You only get full capacity when charged to HV.
@@Kabab I was actually talking about how many cycles I can put through it until it breaks (or the performance is so bad it can't be used any more)
The Question: How much capacity do you think I'm going to get out of a 2400mah HV pack charged to 4.2v? was not related to the first one at all, sorry for not asking an understandable question..
@@ELValenin probably about ~2150mah. You can run any lipo through hundreds of cycles and it'll still work. What happens is that after about 70-120 cycles on any pack it begins to loose it's 'zest'. It no longer gives you that same punch of power or as much capacity as it used to.
@@Kabab okay, thank you very much!
Ok, althogh there's a few things missing from when people test H.V packs including yourself
1. Charge only to 4.2v per cell for both H.V and regular packs for every single cycle and test perforce, capacity and deterioration/in crease in IR over time.
2. Charge both regular and H.V packs to 4.35v every single cycle and test perforce, capacity and deterioration/in crease in IR over time.
3. Charge both regular and H.V packs to 4.2v four out of five times and to 4.35v once every fifth cycle.and test perforce, capacity and deterioration/in crease in IR over time.
The main problems with these test is when they compare H.V batteries they're not treated the same way and usually always H.V charge the H.V batteries and only occasionally charge them to regular 4.2v also likewise they always charge the regular batteries only to 4.2v and occasionally to 4.35v like what you did.
I feel like a test needs to be done where both H.V and regular lipos are both charger and discharged in the exact same way and voltage.
This test was done by treating the batteries as designed. As I explain in the video, there's absolutely zero point to charging an HV pack to 4.2v because you're not getting the full capacity of the cell and resulting performance is definitely worse than a standard voltage pack...which makes HV pointless. There isn't a single HV pack on the market that has notably better performance than a standard voltage pack. The best ones give you a few seconds of more power at the beginning of the flight only. Every single known HV pack on the market so far as of Aug 2021 has the same flaws which makes them not worth it. You're obviously welcome to keep using them but they're a waste of money and time if you look at real world tests.
Got FPV gear in the mail today 😎👏 My full size crossfire and nano RX’s came today. I set it up on my DX8 in like 10 mins. If anyone is trying to run CRSF on Spektrum DX8 I can help. Love the content brother. I’ve been thinking allot about lipos lately 👍👏
Through the trainer jack? Pwm.
RcHaze yes you use the trainer jack but you don’t use PWM you use the CRSF protocol. You need the full size module. It comes with the adapter you need. Only catch for Spektrum you have to switch the wires. You won’t have read out telemetry but you can set up LQ in the OSD on channel 12.
@@Politicallyhomeless957 wait so dx8 now is able to run full crossfire ? No latency?. I modded the dx9 to use full crossfire protocol. Firmware upgrade as well.
RcHaze yes! You need the full size module. Use the connector with the trainer jack and swap the wires. I just cut soldered and shrink wrapped. Then when you power up your module plug it into the DX8. It powers up your transmitter and uses full crsf protocol. No ppm, pwm or SBUS. Just sweet crossfire 👍 How do you like it so far?
@@Politicallyhomeless957 once I did the spektrum dx9x fire mod and firmware update the experience has been awesome! I never have to worry about failsafes . 2 20700 3500mah in series as an external power supply just for those long range occasions. Had this mod for over a year. I wonder if I could do what you done on my dx6i.
February is right around the corner, I’m looking forward to seeing this new bt2 alternative connector hopefully it’s lighter than the xt30 so I can save some weight on my 1s lipos and quads
Likely delayed by the virus
I finally got to fly my TP3 build and it's absolutely fun as hell to fly. Super precise through tight turns and flips, 1303 motors+GF Hurricane props are smooth and quiet. I'm using the GNB 3S HV packs that you discussed in your video and they performed well. I'm looking forward to more of your designs👍.
I could listen to this stuff forever
Just realized my charger doesn't go hv. I ordered 4 of the hv gnb batteries from fpvcycle. Will it hurt them to charge them to normal voltage instead of hv?
Not at all. They'll last way longer. But you just won't get full capacity. Even if it doesn't do HV charge you can probably get it to go to around 4.3v per cell maybe.
@@Kabab only thing my charger has wrote on it is 680ac. No manufacturer it anything. Probably just gonna pick up that toolkit rc charger and power supply pyro has. I can only choose the cell count that I'm charging
@@_Brando_69 the toolkit rc one is good
@@Kabab got it in the cart right now along with the reciever I forgot to get for my tp3. Can't beat the price for the charger or the power supply. Got the predator nano and a canopy too. Can't wait for the stuff to get here. Never flown a toothpick or built one been wanting to for a while now
are we going to see a review of the armattan tadpole?
Sorry probably not gonna happen
I always standard charge the HV packs and it works great. Longevity problem solved.
Also, maybe just doing a lower HV would be a compromise for performance and longevity. 4.25V or something.
You wouldn't be getting full capacity by undercharging HV packs unfortunately
Hv packs have a higher storage voltage of like 3.9v right?
Ehh.. not necessarily. Just a higher nominal of 3.85
It's really just an average of the highest and lowest voltage in it's range. It's about the same as a standard really. I store everything at 3.85v
I know this is a somewhat "old" video, but one thing no one talks about is the lifetime of an HV pack if they are only charged to 4.2V. For example, there is the GNB 3s 520mah HV and the there is the GNB 3s 450mah, both have the same weight. So the question is: are both actually the same capacity when charged to 4.2? Does the HV last the same amount of cycles when charged to 4.2? What is the best buy and for what margin?
These are just useful questions, if you could answer them and pin this comment i'm sure it would help a lot of people. Thank you anyways.
These are questions I answer in this video. Charging an HV pack to non HV is just a partial charged pack. Sure it'll last more cycles but it also won't fly as long
No, you do ask a good question. Being the same weight, it looks suspiciously like those two batteries are the same, the manufacturer just claiming one batch is "hv" and thereby increasing the mAh rating.
Some of this seems a little contradictory to what I *think* I know about batteries. It sounds like you are getting a mixture of usage advice and the actual capabilities of the cell. I am reasonably sure the *chemistry* is the same but there is a *physical* difference in the construction. I also do not believe that ANY lithium polymer battery should be run down below 3.3v *at the cell terminals*.
The physical difference in the battery is obvious, it's bigger for less capacity (at the same voltage), this implies more substrate and/or more electrode materiel. The substrate thickness is closely related to the C rating and IR of the battery so this seems likely. That's my thought on what it is at any rate. I reckon the voltage advice was more advice for usage. I think the 0.4v difference represents losses in the system. That would be testable though, I bet if you ran one on the 20A board (or some other high capacity board) with 20awg wires down to 2.9v you'd see a substantial increase in IR vs running it on a lower capacity one with higher resistance in the traces.
yeah it very well could be the construction and not the chemistry. Whatever it is, these are my results from actual use. Both packs hold up really well when abused a little. That's really the only confirmed result here.
@@Kabab So, in detail there can be chemistry and construction differences, but you do actually want slightly different electrolytes setups in LiHV to actually get the most extra capacity out of them. For lifecycle, silicon doping cathodes goes a fairly long way (mostly in discharge side, but does help withstand aggressive charging schedules), which does work on LiPO/LiHV, but it more noticeable in HV setups.
The hard physical limit is that being ran under 3V within the cell puts the battery in a regime where it is plating lithium onto the anode surfaces - which both ties up Li+ ions (capacity loss) and those dendrites that get formed contribute to lost peak discharge (effective C rating) and will eventually create shorts in the cell (lifecycle loss). What this means in the OSD varies - ~2.9V on a 1S whoop, ~3.3V on something larger. This actually comes down to what the resting voltage versus loaded cell output voltage is, and that plating effect is far less pronounced during actual discharge (and also, murdering whoop batteries isn't so terrible)
When you start thinking of the substrate as a 3-D intercalation foam, it starts to make a bit more sense why amorphous graphene products work as well as they do, and you're right that varying the electrode/electrolyte ratios and sizes do play a significant role in optimizing capacity versus current (energy dense vs. power dense), and I suspect a lot of the used tradespace in battery development is varying these parameters more so than actual battery research into the electrochemistry, but there are electrolyte changes that favor those which can be used... but as always, the caveat is "because China" on all these
It’s so frustrating that no one really sells non hv lipos for 300mah and 350mah. Gnb is the best IMO but all I can find is hv. I know rdq gets there lipos from gnb also but after maybe 20 cycles these lipos are losing there zest. I was able to fly to 280 mah on my 350s and I’d land at 3.2v. I stopped at 280 so I don’t over drain the lipos seeing as 280 is 80percent. Now after 20 cycles all 15 of my lipos are getting maybe 240 mah and there at 3.1v. So annoying. I even used deox gold contact cleaner to clean the lipos and the ph2.0 which always does the trick on my non hv nitro nectars. Guess I’ll just have to buy more lipos 🤷♂️
As one of the goofballs that actually has done research on this - I actually would agree with your HALT testing methodology on abusing these packs in the name of science (and also impatience/laziness). 5C charging won't diminish cycle life terribly, even going to 10C is just accelerated lifetime (half to quarter cycle endurance at worst), ditto on the discharge schedule - if you are going from fully charged to fully discharged, especially in less than three minutes, then you're going to see the same sort of accelerated loss in capacity and discharge capability... so actually excellent job on figuring out a HALT regime that doesn't cost thousands of dollars, and is more directly relevant to the way most of us are going to use these packs.
I get all the lab tests but actual flight testing gives me so much more information. I realize that it's not as standardized but again, the actual flight experience is just as important IMO. I also didn't clearly explain everything. I let all the packs return to resting temps before charging and after charging. They barely changed temps during charging. I cannot believe the abuse they take however. I've been charging at 11C the entire time and it's been as if I'm charging at 1C so far. I'm currently around cycle 40 on all the packs and the IR really has not changed all that much. Far less than I was expecting. Under normal non-abusive use conditions I'd give both of these packs at least a 100 cycle rating. The HV pack really is unlikely to see the end of it's life from charge cycles. Even I will eventually destroy the pack physically over 100+ cycles.
@@Kabab That's the thing most people miss - all of my 100+ cycle CNHL packs are going to be mechanically destroyed before they actually stop working well electrically. I've lost about 10% of the total capacity, and probably 15-20% of the peak discharge capability over two years of racing abuse and 5C charging... and these are $12 batteries (4S 1300mAh 100C). Most are on repaired balance leads, replaced heatshrink, and taped-over leads because they've been fed to props - all are deformed from crashes, but those six packs are my daily drivers still... and I'm convinced they'll fail mechanically before electrically.
hey bob what can yoy recommend a 3s for tiny trainer gnb 450 or 650? i xant find any 520
650mah 3S is gonna be a better option on the 1404 motors....however I'd recommend bigger motors for that thing. Consider 1407 if you don't have them yet.
@@Kabab i use xing 1404 4600kv and i ise 520 but its not available thanks!! im gonna get some 650
@@angelfpv4825 don't do the 520mah. That's the HV pack I believe. No good. Forget anything HV
@@Kabab okay thankyou!!!
I just picked up some of the 3s 520 hv and there coming in at 41.5 g same as the 450
Have you tried these
I haven't tried those. Next batch we'll get some.
@@Kabab The Gnb 2s 450 weighs 3g less than the 2s 520, the 520 weighs as much as the 650 in 2s. seems odd. dimensions also pretty similar
@@MrKillerHobbes probably the same but some cells turned out with more and some with less capacity is what I'm thinking.. 🤔
Hi, those motors for 3s. look like Amax Inno. What size and KV are you running for good balance between power, and good flight times?
Are those 1303-4800KV??
cheers, keep up the good work.
The re-release of this micro I've been working on should be some time around the end of next week I hope.
There are no hard voltages on lipo. 4.2Volt is just set as a nice compromise, for long livety. In the very beginning of lipo standard was 4.3v this was then lowered to 4.2 to reach longer battery life. I think if you use good quality lipo, just top off your batteries to HV just before flight in the field, but don't store them leave them laying around full and especially not HV as packs will degrade fast.
That's totally reasonable as well
What bout hv batts just charged to 4.2. Prob last a long time right?
The capacity is just really low then.
Does improve cycle life for the battery, but not by all that much. If you're happy with that capacity, party on. (FWIW, on my GTB339 3" TP-esque setup, I am perfectly happy with this - on my 1S setups, I'm not, so I just abuse those)
Do you think you'll design a canopy for your tp3, or are you just going to stick with the one shown there that you've been running? I really would love to get behind this kwad because I believe in you and what you're doing but honestly, I'm shallow when it comes to my kwads and looks matter somewhat to me. I hate saying that but it's true and I just can't stand the aio camera mounting option.
unfortunately I've gotta go with function over aesthetics. There is a printed option I'm working on but it looks very similar. It's a pretty difficult challenge to make it durable, light and good looking. I'm open to options.
I had similar experiences using 1500mAh (HV and standard) at my 5", thanks for that information. Btw.: where can I get those blue rubber bands for attaching the battery? The black ones came with my TP3 frames are way to short.
Go to your grocery store. Check out the celery bunches. I'm not even kidding.
KababFPV OK, will try it. THX!
Fantastic info. Please test the GNB 520mah 3s HV packs. They're very similar to the 450's. I hope they are good because I just got 8 of them for my toothpick. Performing well so far. They have had similar flight times to the 450mah HV's from my experience.
They're fine cells. Should hold up well.
Do you still charge at 5amps per 3S lipo? :)
Na. Usual around 2A on these small cells
@@Kabab good to know. Do you charge your LiHV batteries to 4.20 or 4.35, or did you stop using the LiHV batteries? :)
@@Crftbt I don't use any HV packs. The ones from GNB aren't actually bad but it's still a waste of time to bother.
Gday Bob, 5 amp to charge those small batteries, dam!! JB still has the battery tester but hasn't done any testing lately he has someone that runs his testing just get in touch with him im sure he would help you out with battery testing, interesting results so if you treated the batteries normally (not abused them) which ones do you recommend Bob the hv or standards great review mate.👍🛸
Originally I would have said just the standard voltage. Now that I've tested them in the real world, both are actually excellent. It's totally up to you. Do you want that extra burst of power for the first dozen seconds of flight or so...
16:43 what could the engineers be working on? Must be top secret//
I decided to respect them...
three.f...
4
but why? don't you want the shortest voltage range throughout the discharge?
@@marc_frank When you demand the amps, the voltage dropoff will be what it will be (and really you tend to hit wattage targets) - so you want something that doesn't fall completely off the cliff.
@@tehllama42 yes, you do want the lowest internal resistance as possible
additionally, it would be advantagious, if the chemistry allowed the same capacity to be used between two less different voltages
now between 3.3 and 4.2
better would be between 3.9 and 4.2
also higher voltage per cell is better
so between ~6V and 5.8V would be perfect
why 6V? thats the difference of potential between lithium and fluor, the highest possible voltage any single cell battery can have
Are you going to list 1S and 2S packs? I was going to run 2S on my Toothpick as a happy medium between 1S & 3S for getting my kids flying after they get the hang of the simulator.
2S is really great for learning on the TP3. The 1S version called the BabyTooth should be coming end of next week I hope. Just waiting on delivery. I'd say 1S on the BabyTooth is pretty frikin awesome.
Anyone have experience with Hyperion lipos?
Great information! I had some HV but wasnt charging them as HV, life was longer than those ive use with HV setting (they did not bloat) .
Great video, what would be your favourite prop for the fywoo n2306 1750kv on 6s?
Right now my favorite is a prop that isn't even out yet. The gemfan 51433. Supposed to come soon. The Ethix S4 and Nazgul 5140 are damn good too
Great vid bob. GNB packs are definitely good. I’m still running my 2 original 450 2s packs 3 years and hundreds of cycles later and they are just now starting to feel like the power isn’t as good as it used to be.
I'm really impressed at how they hold up
KababFPV definitely. On my very first gnb 450 I’ve lost count of how many cycles are on it. Lol. Just found my notebook with all of my notes and one gnb at last count prolly 6 months ago had 723 cycles on it and still going strong. My original one has at least twice that and just now starting to feel like it’s suffering and not by much but it is noticeable.
Bob how about infinity 450mah 1s ? You recommend me infinity over gnb a month ago
@@karoo_bushman6880 yes you are right I have also bought 3 pack because of that
At the amp draw of a good light 1S setup I don't think it matters much.
@@pkvillager it does matter cause one of my 1s battery explored in flight and it cost me 130 $ . Before the fly it look like new only used it more than 20 cycle .
@@techvirus9541 I highly doubt the battery exploded due to the battery, you probably had a short or severely damaged the pack by over charging/discharging. No one makes worse lipos that BetaFPV and I still never had one of those explode or any lipo for that matter and I am not nice to my packs.
The infinity are great. The only reason I stopped working with them is because they ripped us off and provide very poor customer service.
1s LiHV is what is in your cell phone. I've noticed the phone, when it switches off due to flat battery is at absolute min just under 3.7 V. So maybe I think LiHV needs a higher cut off to keep them in good shape over many many cycles? If so then the benefit of HV is simply higher volts = more rpm, you don't really get longer flights if you have to cut off higher? Caveat here is discharge rate is much higher of course on quad vs phone. Note the phone does charge the battery to 4.35V
It's the current draw and push during charging that kills a pack. That's why 1s cells can be run down to 2.9v. Because the current on 1snis naturally very low.
@@Kabab it is subjective, but I'm sure that I am getting more good cycles from whoop batteries now that I don't go lower than 3.1, a lot of the time I don't go this low even. Based on that I wouldn't agree you should go as low as 2.9, even on a 1s whoop
I can measure the internal resistance ten times on the same pack and get ten different readings back to back to back ect. I can't trust the way it is measured with these chargers. Do you get consistent readings?
I get mostly consistent readings. Not exactly the same but within 0.3 when I run the test the exact same way.
I brushed my teeth twice just now.... cuz of The dear inducing public service announcement of the folding prop video
Awesome testing and review, Bob!
Yeah, GNB is fantastic! I only buy cheaper lipos for rc cars, because they don't need high C rating. 😊
Other than that, most my batteries are GNB. I guess I have one Tattu and one CNHL. 😊
GNE 520HV battery and GNE 450HV battery are the same weight
Yeah I can't explain that one lol. I focused on these two cells for this sort of testing.
when are we going to be able to get those 3 blade 3018??
There won't be a 3018 three blade. They're 3016 three blades fpvcycle.com/collections/props/products/gemfan-tri-blade-3018-props-4cw-4ccw-2mm
Lol, I think Joshua got upset, he made a video this morning. But now it's marked private. Can't we all get along?
Na he's cool. No issues
Cnhl also makes regular noh HV 3s 450mah and 350mah, have you tried them by any chance?. Also are the uruav 450 HV batteries are gnb rebrands?
I'd recommend not bothering with CNHL at this point in time. Especially their small packs. They're bigger, heavier and significantly under perform. They're not even much cheaper when you look at the dollar amount. No idea what URUAV are but they're likely not GNB.
Thanks for all the work, it is appreciated. Please stock the standard voltage, as they are really hard to find and they do last longer. Also, please keep stocking the Infinity batteries, as those seem to be great as well.
They are really hard to find. I'm hoping people realize that the HV, while really really good in this case, isn't even worth the extra 50c you pay for it imo. However, both are truly excellent and I'd give both of them at least a 100+ cycle lifespan under normal non-abusive conditions.
Love these type of videos! Just FYI the packs aren't showing a huge difference bc your running them through a toothpick. If you were to do this test on a 3 or 5 inch (more amp draw) your results would probably be way different! Also if you want to know the exact chemical difference between the two packs I could rip em open and test the powders, my guess tho is that the HV uses a high purity naturally sourced graphite anode (higher crystaline structure) and maybe some conductive additive and thats it! 95% of the cathodes in all lipos are the exact same LiCoO2 formula so its the anode that changes (theres like 6 types of graphite available) and perhaps the amount of additive or SEI. The type of graphite used can significantly affect the things your talking about and would be even more prevalent at higher amperage. yay long ass comment :)
Yeah I've since realized that it's the construction that's probably different. Not the chemistry
KababFPV could be, Ive never popped those particular packs open to check, that would be odd however to change the manufacturing process when u can just change ingredients for the same result. 🤷♂️
I cant handle this anymore!!! You always say amazing things coming and then boom gone like a sandwich in front of my fat aunt!! MADNEDSS BOB MADNESS!!! LOL
They're all in shipping. I can't make it deliver faster unfortunately.
Oh no, you called him out! You gonna learn something today. I repeat this sentence every day, when my apprentice did some weird shit and we have to fix it together.
Just knowing it's an honest company to work with, I'd personally be very interested to know a whole lot more - especially since I do have some excessive background in this area.
Hard for me personally to justify anything other than dirt cheap CNHLs most of the time, but I've been pretty impressed with the performance of the 520mAh LiHV variant of these packs over 48 cycles.
The CNHL packs were pretty good when they first came out but over the years they've been getting worse and worse. Especially the small size cells. They're bigger, weigh more and perform far worse in my testing. The larger packs can be okay if your quads power requirements are not huge. Especially the 6S packs because moving to 6S and lower kv reduces the overall amp requirements on the battery so it seems to perform similar. But don't be mistaken, they are cheap cells and you're not getting the best performance.....but that may be just fine for you which I'd say is totally fine. If I can, I'll get higher end cells but I'd be fine with CNHL 6S packs too.
@@Kabab Totally use case dependent - I get away with landing @ or near storage voltage (even when racing), so I'm pretty rarely battery limited. I definitely prefer to have a pile of packs I can practice with rather than a 10% performance improvement in my flight regime that costs 2x as much for my 5" and 7" uses, so I'll take the peak performance hit for that. The Orange series has just been 'meh', the White/Black are definitely better packs. The real tradeoff is that you are carrying extra weight relative to the power on offer compared to others, but I'm either running them as race quads (F2.1 Hybrid), or on 7" GoPro haulers, which have so much performance overhead it doesn't matter.
Especially on my 7" setups where I expected to annihilate batteries, what I find is the opposite, I can operate well within the ability of the batteries and still get performance that far exceeds my expectations for them basically being Banggood specials on F2.1 frames.
everything TP3 in stock within two weeks?
That's the hopes and dreams
Does anyone actually know who the OEM is on the Pyrodrone Graphene battery line? I keep hearing good things about these batteries, but not sure if they're that much worse or better than GNB's...
11:07 theres a tiny little bug running around!!!
thank you for sharing the info and interesting results of your tests
red micro spider
i don't know the real name 😂
i watched them when i was child
Always interesting and educational, I learned something today.
Love these super informative videos!
I have been charging my HV's to simple lipo 4.2 volts for a long time except in my 1s whoops where I need any thing I can get to fly for more than 2 minutes....
A lot to digest . Great info. Thx
😁👍
I don't agree that hv batteries are different chemistry. HV batteries are smaller mah standard lipos that get more mah when charged to hv. So 450mah hv batteries are actually 400 or 350mah packs.
Well it's the same weight and size but a charge to just 4.2v doesn't give you the same mAh so 🤷🏻♂️
Ask Alex Vanover about charging too fast.
Those infinity 3s 450mah are a little heavier but I get soooo much flight time from them. About 1 min longer on a tp3. Now they are sold out everywhere.
I've confirmed that the infinity cells are actually made by GNB. Infinity was just ripping us off so I moved to GNB
@@Kababis it possible re-badge companies are paying for the better batches though?
@@OranJuno eh, there's probably not enough money in there to matter
Mutefpv has tested both the blue and pink HV ones. The 4.2v were larger and heavier and had slightly worse performance under load but both had their stated capacity
ua-cam.com/video/cv-Y6pmV7A8/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/C-x_b0KSVhA/v-deo.html
I use the 1s HV ones since they are half the cost of the blues and just charge them to 4.2
Dont know about RC lipo tech but if you search for any modern samsung or iphone battery you can see many labelled 3.85v/3.81v etc
Yeah 1S is a little different. I think I'm gonna go with the HV 550 cells for my up coming 1S 3" BabyTooth product. The HV is actually cheaper than the non-HV and I think it's okay to throw away the cell after about 30-40 cycles.
I flew my 1st edition Toothpick with Turnigy NanoTech 300mAh 2S... that's how efficient the platform really is ; )
Probably also worth mentioning that we ran 450mAh 3S NanoTechs on our Atoms... which is EXACTLY like a Toothpick,.. only twice the weight and 3 years ago. Small stuff is the more fun.
My favorite battery👍😝
This video pissed me off... It reminded me of my $ wasted on HV packs in the past that died after 50 cycles. And that Bardwell took my money for the fancy tester and doesn't test batteries anymore... If I had that tester, every pack would be tested as they get released. I want my $30 back, that will buy me a decent amount of packs for my toothpick lol
apparently he's been working on it and has just been putting the data together.
How much batteries could 30 bucks possibly get you, mine are 10 a pop
@@boratsagdiyev1586 here you go fpvcycle.com/collections/batteries/products/gnb-3s-11-1v-450mah-lipo-battery
@@boratsagdiyev1586 I'll let you calculate that one LOL
Do you have any new experience with them hv 3s 450?
What was the lifetime like?
Thanks
We don't even stock the HV anymore. There's just no point in a battery that doesn't have any better performance, has worse cycle endurance and costs more. I've had my packs for a while now and the HV ones are totally shot while the regular ones still work fine. Neither is good as it was when they were new but the regular voltage one is damn close after about 100 cycles.
10 amps JFC 😂 I'm surprised they didn't pop
10c*
This was very very interesting. Long efficient flights is not just your goal 😉 I think we all want that. Imagine a 25min. Flight time with an hd toothpick. Hopefully it will happen one day 😁
If you run a ~1100mah 3S on this quad you could probably get close to 20min. The quad weight is extremely low for it's build stature and it's quite powerful.
When kabab says there’s gonna be no flying in the video
😢😢😢
Gnb batt is reasonable
i bought the cheapest hv batterys that i have found wich been the uruav 450mah, i killed some of them by threating them like a non hv runnning them down to 3.3 but since i strictly land at 3.5 they just keep working. by now i have more than 100 cycles on them and they still work nice
They may be genuinely different, the high voltage cells, but by what you describe, they aren't genuinely better. I don't believe in HV voltage batteries. Sure, you say these are different than the regular voltage bats, but by what you are telling us, they don't give us any improvements in return. I will always believe regular voltage batteries will give us more amount of decent charges and flights. I think 99% of HV batteries are regular batteries with an HV on the label... And don't give us very many charges before they are junk.
Thanks for doing all of this testing and research! It's really helpful! 😎 🤘
You are likely correct that 99% are normal with HV stickers. Likely shittier cells too
That's really interesting. I never knew about this thanks for informing us. :D
I've tried 18650s. A 5s battery is heavy
Am I the only one worried about Bob's thumb? see 4:44
Thanks. I don't have psoriasis. At least not that I know of yet. No idea why my nails are like that and no doctor knows either.
@@Kabab ha, no, I was referring to how flexible your thumb is, mine can't bend back like that at all, caught me by surprise
@@PhilArndt1 I was a hitchhiker in a past life 😅
So all your references in other videos that you have so much stuff to do is because you are out flying all the time (10 packs, 50 cycle a pack)!? :)
Yes these tests take frikin forever. I spent about 2hrs each night flying back and fourth for so many days I don't even wanna think about it. But a huge positive is that I've run so many packs through this one quad I cannot even believe that it's still running like new.
I use the I charger 4010 Duo, charger mine came even with calibration certificate/report, were voltages were accurately calibrated on HP voltmeter. The IR measurement is very reliable especially at higher capacity packs it becomes difficult to be reliable, some standard chargers even state in their manuals that IR cannot be used reliably under f.i, 10m ohm.
So for smaller capacity packs it is more accurate in general. Anyway I recommend highly the I charger, addionally due it's 2.2amp balance current it is very fast charger, as it keeps the full charge current almost to the end without slowing down.
Anyway I also bring packs to storage 3,8, then do a 5c or high rate charge to find IR. Take care when comparing IR take note that hot cells show much lower IR values than cold cells so not compare at the bench and just after flying. For racing pre-warming cells first could be a good thing.
Final point on fast charging, I do not believe fast charging 5c or possibly 10c does any hurt to batteries, as long as battery C rating is much higher, so a 100C discharge capable battery, charging at 10c is only 10% from it's current rating. In general as long as pack do not warm up during charging it is not hurting the pack. I did not find any degradiation and always fast charge 5c. For me this is purely a safety thing manufacturrs put, when fast charging a bad cell or slightly damaged pack things can get explosively out of hand very quickly, so yes it is much more dangerous to fast charge.
Discharging below 3.5Volt especially under high loads = very bad. The weakest cell in the pack will be get down too far..... (ideally on our 5 inch quads we could have a lowest cell volt measurement sensor on the balance lead and use that for monitoring, instead of pack voltage)
Leaving packs stored fully charged is also bad and degrades packs quite quickly.
I honestly do not believe HV is any different to non HV, rather than they can play with several things, like thicknes of laminates/substrates, the thicknes of isolation etc. everything has a tradeoff or downside, otherwise all lipo would be manufactured to the HV standard.
For lipo buy a good deal, be kind to them.
Monitoring the IR consistently and reporting them I would like to see it, but you need a good device or charger. to me IR = equal to C rating.
Yeah since making this video I've done more research and also believe it's some sort of construction change. Not a chemical one. I also didn't mention that I let all batteries cool to ambient before and after charging and after use.
I thought of his battery tester as soon as soon as I started watching this video
😮😅 5amp chager ....i'm charge only 2amp...clean 2amp...faster 👍
Best content (informational) in the whole industry apart from JB. You guys Should team up
4 years ago! seriously!! iv been using lipo batteries in rc for well over 10 years
well the FPV LiHV packs were new to us when they came out. I dunno bout cars and such.
@@Kabab hv yes but high c rated lipos definitely not. I built my first fpv quad about 10 years ago and that was on 4s 60c lipo
From my extensive battery testing lithium high volt batteries are a complete waste of money. Yes the extra .15 volts is initially beneficial for extra power and flight times, but it's literally for the first 10 seconds and only extends flight time for roughly the same amount of time. The extra cost and low life cycle from charging to lihv levels just don't justify the extra cost incurred.
10C Charge?! OMG Kabob
it's actually 11C :-D
My guess is that JB's battery testing wasn't generating enough affiliate clicks to justify the labour. It's a real shame. There seems to be more shilling and less science on his channel now days.
You could not be more wrong. If I were publishing these results there would be tons of affiliate clicks. It's hilarious to see people accuse me of not doing the testing because it wouldn't be profitable when the exact opposite is true.
I'm putting out a video today about the truth, since clearly there is a lot of interest. The short version is that running the tests is basically a full time position in order to generate enough results to be meaningful, and in order to produce those results I would have to basically stop making videos and do nothing else. So when I realized that was the case, I set out to hire people to do the testing for me, and so far I have not been able to do that.
I didn't mean to stir up anything. Half way through my own rudimentary testing I just remembered that you had a legit tester I had heard nothing of for a while. Sorry if it's caused any trouble for you.
Hi @@JoshuaBardwell. Sorry if I offended, I'm not here to try and start anything. I was just expressing my thoughts as an outsider looking in. I'm a business owner as well and constantly find myself having to manage the limited time I have available to me. A lot of this comes down to prioritising the projects that provide either the most personal enjoyment or financial reward. I assume that there is a component of this in every successful UA-camr's day as well, though I could be wrong. Looking forward to seeing more battery tests when they drop. Cheers Jake.
Hi @@Kabab. Sorry man. I didn't want to start shit in your comments. As always, I really appreciate your videos and thoughts. Keep the great videos coming.
You need a lot more credit.