good to see u guys there and love to hear this exciting update from apple for fitness and health tracking Hoping they could improve the battery so it will last longer w/o charging everyday
Do we have any idea if current weather conditions would factor into the effort rating? for example, going for an afternoon run in 100 degree weather in direct sunlight vs, early morning/darkness?
FYI, Training Load only works using the native Apple Workout on the watch. If you use Peloton or Work Outdoors or another App it doesn’t sync. Understandable. I downloaded the Developer’s Beta last night and did a Peloton ride this morning and when I didn’t see the effort screen pop up it dawned on me that, duh, it only works with Apple Fitness apps. Definitely some neat stuff happening here, though, and Apple is definitely upping the ante on its competitors
That's actually not true. Assuming a workout pushes into Apple Health (as WorkOutdoors does), you can then assign an Effort Rating within the Fitness app. Try it on the workout you did, open it up in the Fitness app, and you'll see the ability to add a Effort Rating to it. Once you've got the required number of establishing days under your belt, you'll start to see training load too.
@@thefitfileYou are correct. I went back in this morning and was able to assign an effort level to all my recent workouts. Also, the ability to set up the activity page the way you want and the new edit functions is a huge improvement. Really nice.
Did my first indoor bike workout on watchOS 11 yesterday and the effort rating it gave was wayyyyyy off. Obviously it’s one workout and day one of the software so absolutely not writing it off. Hopefully they improve it as if I need to manually put RPE in each time it just feels like there’s no point to the feature as it brings their “science” into question. For reference, my Garmin training load basically nailed it. But like I say, day 1, workout 1, so let’s see :-)
For HRV it’s really smart for them not to use it. HRV is influenced by way too many things and people tend to overthink it and take it as the one measurement that dictates if you’re ready for the day or not. There is so much literature that goes into if it’s better to take it overnight? Is it better to do it as you wake up in the morning? Because then you’re taking how you are in the moment and ready for the day. Besides that Apple uses SDNN, which nobody really uses, except maybe in the medical field and to top it off the Apple Watch takes very random readings. If you don’t turn on a-fib, you only get a handful of readings in the day which again they’re meaningless without context. Finally resting heart rate is inversely correlated with HRV so by de facto a high resting heart rate would mean a low HRV and vice versa. All the inferences about a high resting heart rate can be applied with HRV or not (being sick, injury, over training, etc.) so the vitals app application is great for the masses and for a good understanding of your body without diving too deep into complicated data.
Thanx for the excellent coverage! And I guess you nailed it at around 10:45. Introducing a subjective "fudge factor" into the training load calculation renders the whole thing basically worthless from an objective standpoint. Sure, rate of perceived exertion (RPE) as a standalone measure has a lot of merit, but introducing subjectiveness in this context is simply not ideal. To my knowledge-and please correct me if I am wrong- absent elaborate lab and invasive diagnostics (such as a biopsy) or really calculating the weight you are rucking around over what amount of elevation multiplied by time, there is no way of objectifying muscle workload or damage. For instance muscle pain can be something like DOMS or be induced by muscular- skeletal imbalances. Nobody really knows. For that matter I would prefer to have two distinct metrics. Traditional training load and maybe ad RPE but not combining the two in a single output value. But each to their own. Thanx again for putting out so much interesting stuff. Cheers!
Polar actually does some muscle-related fatigue bits, but I find them pretty hit and miss, and they don't seem to meaningfully impact your total training load as much as the aerobic side does. -Ray
This. You saved me some time typing something like this. I completely understand the point raised by Ray and Des about muscle fatigue. I do some hikes (not so crazy ones, but still), so I can relate. And I'm happy that I can give perceived effort on my Garmin after a workout (which could be useful for a coach). But I'd never trust myself to include it as a numeric value. Even if there is a combined metric, having the "raw measurement" available in itself is preferable. Also, my experience is, that RPE is influenced by many things, not just muscle things. Being mentally fatigued or not eating / sleeping enough, heat, etc. Anothir thing: multiplying by duration is maybe also not the best (though I'm not a scientist in this field). Making things simple, I may feel a 20k run (with the same pace) twice as effortful than a 10k run. It will take me twice as long as well, so it's score is quadratic in that nature. Of course, maybe that's the "right formula". Anyhow, if Garmin starts to incorporate RPE into a numeric indicator, I hope that it will be a separate thing, not training load. and of course, Apple can still go this way if they decide to.
"I'm not much of a swimmer, so I'm going to let you Dive In on that one" 🤣🤣
“Pun intended 😂”
Best breakdown I have seen so far on what’s coming up. Appreciate you guys making the trip.
Appreciate it - thanks!
This is a high value podcast for us fitness geek :). Thanks guys!
Thanks for tuning in!
I don’t understand why won’t Apple give us options on the screen for custom workout. I would love to use the pacer view for intervals
good to see u guys there and love to hear this exciting update from apple for fitness and health tracking
Hoping they could improve the battery so it will last longer w/o charging everyday
Knowing what you know so far, is it still better to get a Garmin Epix pro for maps and navigation?
If you also want the battery time
Do we have any idea if current weather conditions would factor into the effort rating? for example, going for an afternoon run in 100 degree weather in direct sunlight vs, early morning/darkness?
It's absolute effort regardless of external factors
Did apple add any new changes to the HIIT workout
FYI, Training Load only works using the native Apple Workout on the watch. If you use Peloton or Work Outdoors or another App it doesn’t sync. Understandable. I downloaded the Developer’s Beta last night and did a Peloton ride this morning and when I didn’t see the effort screen pop up it dawned on me that, duh, it only works with Apple Fitness apps. Definitely some neat stuff happening here, though, and Apple is definitely upping the ante on its competitors
That's actually not true. Assuming a workout pushes into Apple Health (as WorkOutdoors does), you can then assign an Effort Rating within the Fitness app. Try it on the workout you did, open it up in the Fitness app, and you'll see the ability to add a Effort Rating to it. Once you've got the required number of establishing days under your belt, you'll start to see training load too.
@@thefitfileYou are correct. I went back in this morning and was able to assign an effort level to all my recent workouts. Also, the ability to set up the activity page the way you want and the new edit functions is a huge improvement. Really nice.
Do Des and Ray own a pair of pants? 😛
Did my first indoor bike workout on watchOS 11 yesterday and the effort rating it gave was wayyyyyy off. Obviously it’s one workout and day one of the software so absolutely not writing it off. Hopefully they improve it as if I need to manually put RPE in each time it just feels like there’s no point to the feature as it brings their “science” into question.
For reference, my Garmin training load basically nailed it.
But like I say, day 1, workout 1, so let’s see :-)
For HRV it’s really smart for them not to use it. HRV is influenced by way too many things and people tend to overthink it and take it as the one measurement that dictates if you’re ready for the day or not. There is so much literature that goes into if it’s better to take it overnight? Is it better to do it as you wake up in the morning? Because then you’re taking how you are in the moment and ready for the day. Besides that Apple uses SDNN, which nobody really uses, except maybe in the medical field and to top it off the Apple Watch takes very random readings. If you don’t turn on a-fib, you only get a handful of readings in the day which again they’re meaningless without context. Finally resting heart rate is inversely correlated with HRV so by de facto a high resting heart rate would mean a low HRV and vice versa. All the inferences about a high resting heart rate can be applied with HRV or not (being sick, injury, over training, etc.) so the vitals app application is great for the masses and for a good understanding of your body without diving too deep into complicated data.
Any info on the Fenix 8?
Soon
August
Thanx for the excellent coverage! And I guess you nailed it at around 10:45. Introducing a subjective "fudge factor" into the training load calculation renders the whole thing basically worthless from an objective standpoint. Sure, rate of perceived exertion (RPE) as a standalone measure has a lot of merit, but introducing subjectiveness in this context is simply not ideal. To my knowledge-and please correct me if I am wrong- absent elaborate lab and invasive diagnostics (such as a biopsy) or really calculating the weight you are rucking around over what amount of elevation multiplied by time, there is no way of objectifying muscle workload or damage. For instance muscle pain can be something like DOMS or be induced by muscular- skeletal imbalances. Nobody really knows. For that matter I would prefer to have two distinct metrics. Traditional training load and maybe ad RPE but not combining the two in a single output value. But each to their own. Thanx again for putting out so much interesting stuff. Cheers!
Polar actually does some muscle-related fatigue bits, but I find them pretty hit and miss, and they don't seem to meaningfully impact your total training load as much as the aerobic side does. -Ray
This. You saved me some time typing something like this. I completely understand the point raised by Ray and Des about muscle fatigue. I do some hikes (not so crazy ones, but still), so I can relate. And I'm happy that I can give perceived effort on my Garmin after a workout (which could be useful for a coach). But I'd never trust myself to include it as a numeric value. Even if there is a combined metric, having the "raw measurement" available in itself is preferable. Also, my experience is, that RPE is influenced by many things, not just muscle things. Being mentally fatigued or not eating / sleeping enough, heat, etc. Anothir thing: multiplying by duration is maybe also not the best (though I'm not a scientist in this field). Making things simple, I may feel a 20k run (with the same pace) twice as effortful than a 10k run. It will take me twice as long as well, so it's score is quadratic in that nature. Of course, maybe that's the "right formula". Anyhow, if Garmin starts to incorporate RPE into a numeric indicator, I hope that it will be a separate thing, not training load. and of course, Apple can still go this way if they decide to.
The new Vitals app sounds anxiety inducing
I seem to becoming more and more a jealous android and windows user