The Problem with Jin - Xenoblade Chronicles 2
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- Опубліковано 18 вер 2024
- Step aside, I'm doing science.
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I think we are ignoring the real problem...JIN'S MOVESET BASICALLY DOES EVERYTHING YOU NEED AN ENTIRE TEAM TO DO, HE HAS A BREAK THEN A TOPPLE+LAUNCH+SMASH.. IN ONE MOVE!!
Uh, what? Break, Topple, and Launch, yes, but it doesn't Smash.
@@BurstFlare He has a single Art which causes the Break effect, then he has another art which causes Topple, Launch and Smash at the same time
Jesus-kun is that you
@@skyfire205 I was about to say that wasn't the case, but I decided to check the wiki, and turns out, he actually does have a skill like that, but only in Chapter 8. I never saw him do it, though, which is probably why I never knew that. Though it turns out, according to the wiki, that he also has an art that does all four when you're fighting against him, though again, I've never seen it myself. I'm thinking that both of these arts might not be able to inflict them all in a single use, and need to be used once for each of them, in which case I don't think he can get to Smash on his own.
I thought he was talking about Stunned Swallow, *which keeps Launching me even though I haven't been toppled!* However, the Launch of it doesn't seem to last long enough for him to get a Smash in, as I never got Smashed afterward.
H E A V E N L Y D I S R U P T !
@@BurstFlare you also get to use one that does all 4 in the same move during challenge mode
The problem with Jin is simple.
He did not ask Tora to make him a robot girlfriend. Such an idiot, meh.
Mr Bubble interesting
Mr Bubble Welp, now I ship QTπ and Jin. Screw you random person.
Mr Bubble ummm, its not a robot girlfriend, it’s called a sexbot. Oh, Nopons and there sexbots.
Mr Bubble I'm late but it's obvious Jin likes guys...
Don't think Jin and Malos relationship is romantic.
Jin and Laura's relationship on the other hand could be seen that way.
The only problem I saw with Jin is that they made him fun to use, then subsequently ripped him away from us never to let us use him again.
Chapter 8
Dlc
@@xionvixon3387 it's weird they didnt utilize his ice powers more in the main story.At best we got "he makes things snowy" instead if his badass ice moves in ttgc.
Chris Heidke i hate Nintendo for this thing. I love Jin why he had to die !? 😢😫
Titan Battleship challenge?
By “elementary” I think he means the elements in the game, being Fire, Water, Ice, Ground, Electric, Wind, Dark and Light.
That's what I thought to, though this interpretation is more fun
Its Ya MF Boy i agree
Its Ya MF Boy I agree. What Jin means is just the elements within the game and that he has control over them.
That's still op as fuck.
lipailong2 it is, but it’s reasonably over powered. He’s basically immune to Rex and his friends attack (that is until Pneuma awakens)
I threw all this out the window when Rex started talking about, “rewriting the laws of physics in the area around us.”
Jonathan Kozlowski i think they just said "We can manipulate every single atom and sub atomic particle for our advantage" and bluntly put it as "Imagination bitch!"
Well they can also create wormholes to let Siren shoot Aion from outside...
Yeah it was told in such a brain dead way in this game. As amazing as the world building is, this writing is just awful.
Xenoblade 1 tells it much better: the entire world is made of ether, he who controls ether controls the world.
@@dugtrioramen Bro, Shulk can read the future. Xenoblade games require suspension of disbelief like most things. You can enjoy stuff without it being realistic.
@@muggas2254 idk how that guy is expecting pure realism in fantasy...
Since Jin's core crystal was damaged and he was weak since the beginning, I think that manipulating all particles in the human/nopon bodies would probally kill him, since that would cost an enourmous quantity of energy. And I think that using this power really damages him since he's an flesh eater, him entering the pod a number of times in the game proves that, I think.
That may be true, but it takes far less energy to move around a little water in Rex's brain to burst a blood vessel than it does to freeze half a dozen giant ice lances to impale Amalthus with. He wasn't acting like going absolute zero was any risk to him at the beginning of the Chapter 7 fight, so there was no way manipulating peoples' bodies before he took a beating from Rex would've killed him.
I don't know, maybe he can't do that, now that I think about it. Remember when Nia had to damage Malos in order to fill his body up with tumors? Maybe that blade guard thing (that we see with the artifices too) is what's blocking it and because of that he can't damage Rex unless he gets a clear hit on him ? I'm not trying to prove anything, though, since it is quite convoluted and it probally slipped the dev's minds when they were designing him.
Actually I'm pretty sure when Jin tried to freeze Rex into oblivion in Chapter 9, Pneuma's reality warping powers stopped that from happening (This was before Amalthus appeared).
Admittedly Jin was weakened then but still.
@@Luxin_Xeno actually... maybe he can only slow down or speed up particles externally
@@Luxin_Xeno buen video y análisis, jin solo usa entonces una de las 4 fuerzas de la luz de un universo y no al 100%, si alguien usa taquiones lo podría parar y derrotar, usar gravedad como armas de gravedad de gantz, gravity well y otras formas de ataque pues la luz es débil a la gravedad, las 4 fuerzas de la luz son radiación fuerte, radiación débil, electromagnetismo y gravedad, pero faltan las de la oscuridad, fuerza oscura, energía oscura, materia oscura y quinta escencia o gravedad, el equilibrio de las fuerzas de la luz y la oscuridad permite la existencia de un universo, por lo que si vinieran los térmidos jinetes del apocalipsis realistas y futuristas de udo, onda existencial o lo que sea de dimension 10 y 11 o la hipotética civilización tipo 7, jin sería humillado, derrotado y juzgado ante el cielo y el infierno realistas y futuristas, hay universos de solo las 4 fuerzas de la luz y universos de solo las 4 fuerzas de oscuridad, sugerencia.
I got the Answer
He was made by Tetsuya Nomura
TwilightYonder720 AND that second form makes him look like sephiroth lol
Mitch Man yes
I find his designs so effing difficult
@@tabel0421 that was probably the point why nomura was involved
@@mitchmanexe243 So, who would Lora be then?
While I agree with most of your video, I think it should be pointed out that there is a canonical reason as to why Jin doesn’t have unlimited power. Remember the boss fight against vandam in the beginning of chapter 3? Pyra says something along the lines of “I can’t transfer power that quickly.” Or something like that I don’t remember. That’s probably what’s happening here. Jin just can’t make enough energy to truly perform all the feats he says he can do. Take the cutscene after the fight with Jin and malos for example. If he really was moving even remotely close the light speed, the air around him would have to be pushed out of the way so fast that his movement alone would create a shockwave that would destroy the platform they’re fighting on at least. So in conclusion, Jin probably just doesn’t have the ability to use that much energy
There's also the biggest drawback to being a Flesh Eater - his body is vulnerable to decay. Sure, the rate of decay may differ between Flesh Eaters, as we see between the Torna members and Cole, but we have seen him require ether treatment a few times. Using too much power likely puts a strain on his/Lora's heart.
Cole is Minoth.
So he's outright lying then.
?
@@Jotari No I think it means he can do it. Just not unlimitedly. He just needs enough strength to pull it off bc being a flesh eater his body is decaying. It like he needs a long rest to restore is stamina
Weirdly satisfying video! Didn't expect to find a video on the particle physics of Xenoblade Chronicles 2 let alone finding it entertaining. Well spoken and very nice points, nice work dude! Looking forward to more in the future!
I always assumed Jin's power only affected particles he was physically in contact with, and his ice power existed separately from his blade eater powers. Of course, he'd still be OP by simply touching his enemy and destroying their bodies.
Well, the prequel does confirm that he was originally an ice Blade.
He’s a Flesh Eater. Mikhail, Zeke, and Amalthus are Blade Eaters.
Jin's whole life revolves around short red haired waifus. Can relate.
I think you misunderstood Jin’s statement as it pertains to “elementary.” He’s not talking about particle physics or quantum particles. He’s talking about ETHER elementary particles which can be classified as: light, dark, fire, water, earth, lightning, ice, and wind.
He does mention that the beam shot down by is “slow” and “sluggish” but he doesn’t have full command over physics which is why he cannot manipulate something like flesh or even regenerate his own wounds. The crystal core on his head is more than just ether particles which is likely why even Pneuma cannot fully restore it.
Jin, no doubt, is one of the world’s most powerful blades but he is still no Aegis, which are literally in a class of their own making.
No he wouldn’t be able to accelerate his body to the speed of light or slow down the surroundings to absolute zero
Just like Malos couldn't use his full power at first, so also should Jin be so weak in this game that although he believes he has complete control over elementary particles, he does not truly. Additionally, he understands that using too much energy will destroy himself. Therefore, he reserves quite substantially just so that he doesn't kill himself when fighting others.
Malos is only weakened because Mythra took data from him at the end of the war 500 years ago, which is what caused the damage to his core. Jin has access to his full power the entire time, he just chooses not to use it until Chapter 6.
I know Jin and Malos are not both weakened for the same reason; however, similarities can lead to answers
I don't feel they are similar enough to use in comparison
Jin does have a regeneration chamber so using the Power could somewhat destroy him
In the Temperetia chapter, you saw Jin being unable to fight after using too much power and ended in a the mentionned regeneration chamber. Futhermore, Jin is not as set as Malos to end the world. From a storywise point of view, he is waiting for someone to stop him. He could have ended it anytime indeed, but deeply did not want to. It just as simple as that.
Based on the fact that Jin is not immortal, using a faction of his power would instantly kill him. He'll probably die WAY before he can use his full power.
TL;DR: 90% of Jin's power is useless because he's not a god.
Or he's bluffing. Or skipped physics class.
Just the energy needed to reach light speed is already more absurd than the energy one would need to do any minor form of control though. Functionally infinitely greater even.
Do you really think Jin was referring to quarks and leptons when he said "elementary particles?" We first discovered the proton 100 years ago, so I'd wager probably only one character in the game would even realize subatomic particles exist ;P. I take it to mean he is referring to the basic particles of ether, which is the building block of his universe.
that said, any video game video with the word "meson" in it gets a like from me, son
You're forgetting it's Amathatober 4058
Zero 1 (sadly that isnt in the original dub)
This world is full of energy called Ether which comes in Elements like Water and Fire"
HMMMMMMM....really makes you think
no, but that date is. the way they say dates in japan doesn't name the month. they basically say the number of the month. so while the name of the month is a dub-ism, they didn't just call it sptember in japanese
4058 isn't on our timeline. It's on Alrest's timeline, so in fact, eventhough 4058>2018, they have in fact regressed from what Earth used to be. The tech in xeno 2's world is not that of a society that knows about quarks and other subatomic particles.
Just look at their buildings and their reaction to the world tree; there are no crazy advancements in tech that don't depend on titans as a source of energy except for the Torna ship which is a mystery to the world somehow; Rex is hella confused about it. Their impressive feats are more geared toward weaponzing titans rather than our scientific culture where its all about discovery. Due to this different cultural climate, I say that their scientists don't dick around trying to find out about subatomic particles but rather find better and more effective ways to wage war(especially due to the political climate in Alrest) Scientific research needs funding as well and how would any of that be funded if all their assets are focused on war and not human capital... There's a focus toward that basically. There's also more of a focus toward archealogy than lab science based on some quests and merc missions dealing with deciphering and all that.
Also, the population in Alrest is so much smaller and most people don't have the opportunity or drive to be scientists since it seems all the kids want to be drivers and a lot of the adult NPC we see have occupations like farmers, salvager, vendors, and other humble trades and wouldn't even have the realistic access to the vocation because of their educational background, location and etc. In fact the only place that seems industrialized is Mor Ardain(Argentum doesn't count because it's basically a ship and I've already established their focus on titans), so only people in Mor Ardain have that push to even be exposed to science. (Tora and his family are alittle bit of an outlier. They def did not get those ambitions from Torigoth though) I say their tech is somewhere near the start of industrialization, not putting them anywhere to knowing what a quark is.
And yes, I get that subatomic particles like protons were discovered in Arhenius's time and such meaning that you don't need to be industrialized to make scientific discovery of subatomic particles, but a discovery-driven science world is needed which the Greeks had a ton of and Alrest does not. And besides, I'm talking about quarks and all that nonsense which were discovered by a more discovery driven science world (1964) and not one exclusively focused on war with a low population and an even lower pool of potential scientists. And to be more scientific speaking instead of talking about culture. We also make many advancements when focused on war, but that is only because of the means of energy we use like electrons, protons, and other particles that can be used to make energy and highly destructive weapons In Alrest, they solely depend on titans and ether and when a society depends on something, they usually don't go far beyond that even if it could lead to their detriment and studying titans and ether energy which is just life energy has little to nothing to do with subatomic particles.
To be honest I just blame it on the human part of him, that could be holding him back, the fact that it wasn't translated right, or physics in the conduits world just works different
Interesting video. As for fighting Pyra's ascended state, he loses because her Core Crystal receives data from all other Core Crystals. In other words, Pyra's ascended state has literally all blade powers in the world, and it would be safe to assume that this also includes Flesh-eaters. This means that she has Jin's powers, and, through experience alone, can use it better than him. As Jin put it, her powers are "truly awesome".
Hans Christian Johnsen well not only that, but that data can also mean she already knows how her opponents would fight since that should also become data to fuel their muscle memory to do attacks easier or improve upon them
You're not wrong here, but she actually wouldn't have his particle manipulation data because of a technicality. Blades only transmit data to the Aegises when they revert to a core crystal and no Flesh Eaters we've seen have done that since getting their new powers, so Pneuma wouldn't have access to powers like Jin's or Nia's regeneration, but can obviously approximate them with her reality warping.
Luxin But Jin has reverted to his core crystal at least one time, that we know of. And considering Lora says “I’d have to bring out my original blade” in response to Addam asking her what she’d do if he used Mythra’s full strength, I’d say that he had these superspeed and particle manipulation powers already, unless he got them from data he got from resonating with Lora.
@@thestormwizard6447 I know I'm late to the party, but Lora said that because she was fighting with Haze. She just meant if she had to fight full power Mythra, she'd have to use Jin, her first blade, so her "original blade" instead of Haze.
His new powers likely come from being a flesh eater.
I don’t think they use Elementary Particles as in the physics ones. I think they meant purely Elemental. Since he doesn’t seem to be able to affect living beings. Not only that, but Pneuma’s attacks may fall under light in code, in chain attacks they seem to count as no element, which deals damage to all of them instead. This is why Jin is seemingly helpless against them and why the only thing he could really manipulate was the Siren Laser, which was counted as Light Element.
I doubt the average teenager knows what Elementary Particles are, so when they say that, I thought “Elemental”. Just saying.
Jin could literally deconstruct any human body.
Jin may already have an "own body or nearby air" limitation. He's never seen manipulating particles in a person or blade. Manipulation of living things seems more nias skillset which is probably why he chose her.
Two problems with your explanations though:
1) Obvious exaggerations in the game's narrative. Jin saying he can move at the speed of light, and saying that he can control the elementary particles are exaggerations.
First of all, Siren's ray isn't moving "just a bit slower than the speed of light", it's moving A LOT slower than the speed of light, not even close! The speed of light is ~ 300.000 km/s. Siren is supposed to be somewhere at low earth orbit, so let's say 1000 km above ground. If something moved at the speed of light, it would take 1/300 seconds to reach the earth, however, whenever Mythra uses Siren's bolts, they move nowhere near that speed, taking more than a second to get there (to the point even "normal" enemies can dodge them).
Him saying he can control elementary particles is probably just him using absolute zero to stop them "in place" (I.E. deflect Siren's rays), since he is an ice blade after all (torna the golden country confirms it). You never see him directly manipulate any other "particles" (or matter for that matter (pun intended :D)), except for creating his icycle attacks and ice all around.
2) Whatever he CAN control, is all within the Aether. That's what blades can do, and the ONLY thing blades can do (outside of special blades that take power from the conduit). So he basically only manipulates the Aether based on his ice power.
Nice video, I actually hadn't really thought about Jin's abilities until I watched this, so it was interesting to explore new aspects of the story I hadn't thought about. A lot of people have already said potential reasons for why Jin doesn't/can't use the power that he claims he has that I think are good explanations, but I'll add to that chorus by saying that I don't think Takahashi is a man where stuff like this would slip his mind. He probably has it figured out in his head, and they just decided not to include any information about it in the game to not ruin the flow and have a billion footnotes.
One other thing I'll say is that after Pyra/Mythra become Pneuma, it's pretty much impossible to kill Rex besides some very specific circumstances because Pneuma and her sword can pretty much do anything within a certain physical range because of Zohar powers.
His ability is under-utilized on purpose. I think either Lora's heart can't handle the strain if he uses his power or it's getting too old. Note he doesn't do anything that requires a lot of physical effort, and the little skirmish atop of the Tornan weapon seemed to almost kill him. Chapter 6 onwards, he stops caring to protect himself and everyone's half healing him was merely delaying the inevitable. He's running on fumes by the time you reach him near the top of the world tree. I mean he's seeing Lora and hearing her voice, sounds pretty close to death to me or at least certainly not in his right mind.
Jin is the kind of character you love to hate. He didn't take pages from the edgy antagonist's handbook, he took the entire book and ate it whole.
This is a game where clouds have the density of oceans, people live on giant animals, random scientists destory the world and become gods, and anime girls are summoned through large jewelry to be used as weapons. This game lacks more logic than it has.
Some Kind of Democrat Those clouds aren't really clouds but a swarm of nanobots, the titans are artificial lifeforms, Klaus got his powers in X2 through science (and probably the conduit), and that jewelry is futuristic neuro-data crystals.
And it's all clearly science fantasy rather than science fiction.
KaeYoss Either way, could any of that happen in real life? XD
You are confusing logic with realism.
But yes, most of these things are possible in theory.
Nanobots is something people are looking into, and if they're possible, I'm sure giving them water-like qualities and a cloud-like appearance wouldn't be too much of a problem.
God-like power is relative. People today can do stuff that would have been considered miraculous in the past, and even today by some primitive tribes with no link to civilization. Advance science enough and you can probably build a device that can grant seemingly divine powers.
And artificial life-forms should be completely doable sooner or later.
When he said elementary particles I thought he meant ether and that's why he could do what he did. He used light ether to dash around and ice to bring the temperature down to absolute zero
So... to beat Jin we need to control gravity.
You’ve got problems with Jin until
E M P T Y M O M E N T
I really liked this video, but I definitely think it's an exaggeration when Jin says he has control over all elementary particles. No where is it stated Jin is a master of how the physics of his world works. He's not a physicist. Having established that point, it is more likely that Jin has control over something related to atoms than elementary particles themselves. Also he never states the extent of his control over these particles, just that he has control. From that point, we can make the case that he likely has control over Atomic Vibration which would explain his abilities to freeze things to absolute zero and accelerate things to the speed of light. He would also be able to catch the Sacred Arrow by slowing down the particles which make up the attack, and then reversing the velocity of the particles as soon as they entered his area of influence. I really do like the breakdown, because I overthought these things too.
Or you know something we fon't have in our world and that has a great importance in the physics of the Xenoblade multiverse: Ether.
This whole franchise was founded on a quantum physics experiment. Best believe we're gonna pick it apart at the sub-atomic level.
I was under the impression that when Jin said "elementary particles" what he meant was "elemental ether particles." Basically, Jin could manipulate the ether in his immediate vicinity, using light element ether to accelerate his body and ice element ether to freeze the environment to absolute zero. That would explain why he can deflect Mythra's Siren beam. Although this doesn't solve the issue that if Jin can move at the speed of light, then there's no reason he couldn't just kill the entire party sans Rex and Pyra as soon as line of sight is established and just grab Pyra. It's freaking light speed, dude, nobody can come even close to reacting to that.
When i first saw Jin's true power, I immediately thought of Accelerator from A Certain Magical Index.
There are certainly some similarities, with what their powers do and even similarities in their character designs lol.
Whenever someone says or claims that they can cause or achieve absolute zero I know that they are boasting and attacks that mentions absolute zero in their text is nothing more than flavor text, as it is, according to the laws of physics, impossible to achieve unless you can control the transference of energy.
If Jun could really control all elementary particles it would mean that he’s more powerful than The Architect. He could literally cause nuclear explosions out of nothing, create black holes, disintegrate anything he wanted and make anything he wanted it of thin air. I don’t think the writers realised how incredibly OP that ability would actually be.
Jinn is god, basically. If you can manipulate all elementary particles at will, then you have he power to create and destroy anything.
No one ever questions why Jin's core crystal is in his head.
No other blade is like that.
Since most blades have differently-shaped core crystals it doesn't seem like much of a stretch for them to also potentially be in different locations
Rex could move faster than the speed of light if he used the same space-time warping technology that an Alcubierre Drive uses.
I know this is kinda late, but if he had *complete* control over elementary particles, then he could simply raise a certain group of particles’ energies to the grand unified theory’s energy level (don’t know exactly how to put that) and then he would be able to create antiparticles and once they come into contact with their normal counterparts, they would annihilate each other and release enough energy to destroy probably all of alrest.
I though he meant the elementary particles, as in like the ether in the air... I didn't though he was talking science stuff
As someone who is a fan of Jin character, that video was really interesting! 'Guess that Malos couldn't get a better partner, lol.
Though, just curious, in the first fight with Jin, isn't Haze using her power to "nerf" Jin's power? If yes, would Jin still be powerful enough to wipe out the party at this moment?
Also, while you did mention that Jin's core crystal was ready to break out at any moment after his fight with Pneuma/Rex, isn't it mentionned before that his body was also unstable before? Which is why he need Torna treatement to make sure he can stay alive until he and Malos can achieve their goals? If yes, then maybe that's why he use his power in such limited way, because if he would go really all out, his flesh eater core crystal wouldn't be able stay stable long enough for another treatements.
Those are just my guess anyway, feel free me to correct me in case I been misunderstanding certain elements that your video or the story explain. On those words, thank you for this great video!^^
Haze is weakening him in the Temperantia battle, but he's also not going 100% so who knows in that case. The only time in the game he's using his full power, actively trying to kill Rex and in peak condition is the Chapter 7 fight right after Pneuma ascends. He's not fatigued at all since he's just toying with the party for the first phase of the fight and he's shown as being able to safely go absolute zero at the time. My main issue is that there are things he could do that would require less energy than that (or even less than the Amalthus kill would've taken) while also being MUCH more effective, so he has to be written as being bad at using the powers he's had for 500 years in order to be beatable.
Luxin
Hmm, I see, the story does point out alot about how flesh eater body are unstable. Nia even saying that her body could stop working at any moment, while Jin show that flesh eater can live aslong as normal blade, Cole show how bad a flesh eater body can go. Though, then again, Cole was a failure among flesh eater from what I remember, so who know.
Still, if we ever get Jin as a blade for the party, I want him to be freaking broken. Like, in an creative way, the new blades we got have some really interesting gimmick despite being clone of existing weapon. If Jin get the same treatements somwhere in the line, I atleast hope that they will bring something unique with him, maybe able to switch to his true form in battle? Only the Heir to the Monado can tell at this point.
In any case, thank you for answering my question.^^
Technically, a blade gets their powers from the ether in the area. If ether is a physical cell or anything like that, there's only so much in the immediate area and there's only so much one can absorb before either overloading or depleting completely. If the core depletes all of it's energy, in theory it would either shatter or be unable to hold anymore energy, presumably permanently, similar to a battery which can also run completely dry. Therefore when Jin killed Amalthus, he died too. An Aegis however can live without a core, through which it absorbs ether, for much longer, presumably because it has both increased energy storage and direct access to the Conduit, which is another source of energy most blades can't draw upon.
You over looked their mistake with his power. Jin himself states that the particales used in Siren’s attack are “too heavy to truly reach light speed” however as far as the player can tell the particales used in that attack are photons which define what light is and therefore the speed at which they travel define what light speed is. In layman’s term what Jin actually said with that statement was “Light can’t travel at the speed of light” which is stupid. XD
Should mention you did address this but I have to say only Jin brings this up and there has been no reason to assume it’s not just photons. Also by the same logic Jin should be incapable of reaching light speed too since matter simply can’t reach this speed. Even with his power he can’t break this rule; Rexcan because he bends reality and at that point anything goes but Jin is not a reality bender.
This hurt listening. By "all elementary particles" he means all the ether abilities. Wind, Ice, Fire, Water, etc. This is also why he is the only boss with no elementary weakness. Because he can control the particles that make up his world, he can manipulate them to his favour, for example by moving at the speed of light (just like Rex and Pnuema can, since she can use all particles).
I honestly hope this video was a joke.
This was such a cool and interesting take on reality based video game physics. Loved it, thanks.
Great vid, I knew Jin was OP, but I just thought it was because we was The Flash with a sword, ice powers, and could deflect any attack. That being said, as utterly world breaking as he is, pneuma's power which Jin describes as "the power to manifest what you imagine" is the most OP thing in the history of anything ever. Want to talk about under utilized power? That's your #1 right there. With her power there wouldn't be conflict in the world, she can literally do anything she can imagine.
Well, well, well. When you started describing how you think his power should be changed/described to limit his potential poswer while preserving his displayed power, you literally described the ESPer power of Accelerator from the A Certain Magical Index series and it's spinoffs EXACTLY. toarumajutsunoindex.wikia.com/wiki/Accelerator
He can change the direction of anything he's directly touching. Something simple like instantly reversing the direction of any projectiles that hit him is so easy that he just doesn it passively, all the time, without noticing. But changing the direction of air movement (aka wind) to achieve specific effects is difficult enough and mentally intesive enough that he can't do it when the series begins, and even when he does learn to do it it's thwarted by even minor artificial changes in the wind speed that he hadn't accounted for.
So in Jin's case, its possible, and in my opinion quite likely, that Jin is better at manipulating certain particles in certain ways - he might find it easy to stop particles in their tracks, or accelerate them once they've basically stopped (launching icicles, etc), but much harder to make them move, especially if he can't predict their current movement -which is made even harder, since those particles are invisible to the naked eye.
It's also possible that he deliberately overstated his abilities to Rex and the others. They'd have no way of knowing exactly what he's capable of, so by overstating his abilities he'd be better able to intimidate them.
This comment contains a fuckton of spoilers, you probably don't care, but I'm warning you anyway.
I actually thought jin was just bragging about the whole particles thing, after all we encounter enemies that can survive or even block hits from siren, we even fight robots that are capable of destroying one. Besides, if he wasn't kidding about that whole speed of light thing his very movement would have horrific consequences for any living thing within his direct vicinity. If I remember correctly I once read that something of his size even getting NEAR the speed of light would cause shockwaves comparable to nuclear warheads in the vicinity and the amount of force he could exert at that speed would be enough to crush him and anything else he tried to attack.
That's not even counting the energy that he would have to pull out of particles to get them to absolute zero, since it doesn't seem to go into his surroundings I assume he absorbed it which would take a lot of durability to do. Then again here's my other question, and this one is a bit more abstract. Does jin actually know what the speed of light is? Malos and Mythra would due to the whole supercomputer aegis thing. But would Jin be able to clock his own speed, or is he assuming that's how he's doing this and just used the biggest terms for 'fast' and 'cold' that he could think of.
Personally I feel anime rules apply and artistic licence-physics is in full swing. But it's kinda fun to think about the possibilities inherent in these powerful abilities.
6:40 its confirmed in the cliffs of morytha malos fight that blades are "made up of the same stuff as humans"
To those saying that “elementary particles” was referring to the elements, if that was the case, he probably would have said ether particles. He really only controls ice, but blocks other attacks (siren beam & amalthus’s dark beam)
Or maybe he didn’t kill Rex because he’s the main character
Plot armour
You’re forgetting his emotional state and motivations which aren’t exactly rock solid. So it is possible that the wavering heart within him prevented him from going all out.
This is high quality!
Way to go brother!
Mitsuda gave us The Power of Jin, and now Luxin gives us The Problem with Jin!
That's the thing tho. Jin has to have enough ether energy to actually pull off all of his abilities. We can reasonably assume he can use his power only a few times before it starts to take a toll on his body too. I can imagine that the amount of particle control would also have an effect on the amount of ether used. Hence why his core crystal started to chip during pneuma's awakening.
“Try adding random Xenoblade videos into the mix” then it became the whole cauldron.
10:20 Luxin: I'm gonna start throwing in random Xenoblade videos.
Me: And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how Luxin became the Xenoguy.
I still remember him saying that he changed the temperature to "absolute zero", my only reaction was... "t-that's not how that works"
I think by "Elementary Particles", they meant like the in game elements; fire, water, etc... Idk that's how I interpreted it
I had the same thoughts while playing through the first time. Control of all elementary particles? Well, alright, I guess that's the end of me. I assumed that he meant the eight "elements", which is still pretty busted, but is at least a more realistic interpretation.
But the light speed movement is physically impossible. And in the event that he can do it, and is able to destroy the Aegis sword the way he does at the end of Chapter 6, I have to wonder why he wouldn't attack the party in the same way in future battles. Obviously, in Chapter 6, he needed Rex and Pyra alive. But in Chapter 7, there's no reason not to do that.
And absolute zero? As soon as he said that, I laughed a little bit. Not because it's impossible, but because they're all sitting their like their teeth chattering is as bad as it would be at that temperature. But I chalked this one up to a missed translation.
I figured what held him back was his understanding of what elementary particles are. As mentioned an elementary particle is just something we don't know if its made of smaller things yet. So Jin could be correct in saying he manipulates elementary particles, just the world of Alrest, sans the Architect, has a different level of understanding of science at that scale.
Wow 😮 you take geeking out to a whole new level! Love it 😊
It’s possible that Jin doesn’t have that level of control.
Having power isn’t the same as knowing how to use it.
Or that expending that amount of power on doing so was too taxing on his body, considering how many times he uses the device in the Monoceros to recover after using such abilities.
Or both.
Or perhaps by elementary particles he meant the elements present in game.
It could have been an ambiguous translation.
Also in regards to Nia’s Blade Eater ability I think it’s a kind of high speed cellular regeneration.
Which is why when she weaponises it on Malos, it’s basically like a hyper-fast cancer due to the cells regenerating out of control.
I think they meant ether which would make sense after obtaining pneuma as she doesn’t draw power from ether but rather straight from the conduit
Honestly having “elementary particles” mean “elemental” particles, the whole context of his still op power makes a lot more sense
That was an interesting video, even if I wasn't familiar with the science stuff. I love videos like this.
So basically Jin can effortlessly blow you to obliteratory submatter
I'm pretty sure he just meant the 8 elements in the game but uhh good vid
QualityMeme that is what I thought he had meant too
He needed elementary particle control to TELEPORT BEHIND PEOPLE
In the hierarchy of power within comic books matter manipulation is just below the highest level of powers possible; Reality Warping. That's how stupidly powerful that ability is it's literally the second strongest ability in the most stupidly strong medium in world; comic books. Your main enemy should never ever start at such a high power level unless he's literally fighting people like Superman or fucking Franklin Richards who can literally warp all of his reality to his liking.
I was not expecting that in a video like this but I loved it 😂
Suddenly, Mythra/Addams level 4 special's name being Hadron Impact makes a lot more sense.
Rex in master driver mode probably has special protections against having his matter altered.
Well if he really that powerful or at least smarter than that he could just blow up all alrest in a single move. There probably a limitation to his power or something or else nothing make a sense anymore. Malos is the same he have the ability to destroy anything but weirdly enough he need an artifice to do the job for him.
I mean, he wanted to die. Makes sense that he wouldn't kill his only key to salvation
Imagine if in new game+ you could have jin as a driver.
Just imagine a move that performs an entire driver combo in a single attack
Pneuma(the ascended form)is stated by the game to have the power to make anything she imagines into reality, plus the aegis core crystal has all the info contained in all other core crystals, so she would be able to do everything Jin does and even stop him from doing it, she would also be able to protect Rex from Jin’s powers, since she would be able to see it coming with foresight, so Rex would be able to beat full power Jin with Pnuema. Pyra and Mythra with Rex still get beat bad though, for the reasons stated in the video. Nice video dude, found it very interesting.
The problem with Jin is he's actually Cloud Strife's evil twin cousin. (end of joke)
I think it just goes with Jin's personality, he isn't really evil enough to just instantly kill everyone on the team, if Malos had the same power he would have used it much more
Damn, I never thought about this (even with my A-Level [late highschool? I don't know the American equivalent] tier knowledge in Physics). Thought provoking video on what is probably an unintentionally terrifying power.
I 100% agree!! This was the biggest "Meh meh meh" in the game!
So the other point to take away from this video aside from Jin underutilizing his abilities, is the fact that the laws of physics in the Xenoblade Universe can bend like a rubber ruler.
Correction moving mass at the speed of light wouldn't create a black hole rather a super nova at every atom it touched.
They found the wrong words for powers. He does not "control" THE particles but rather he can manipulate the SPEED matter is moving. This ability aligns with his Ice Typing.
Great video.
The only part I disagree with you is where you mention you didn't think even the ascended form of the Aegis (Pneuma) could match his true power.
Rex's power using Pneuma aka the conduit is so ridiculous that we can just totally ignore all the other stuff he can literally wish to do and just focus on him having the same power as Jin, which would be enough to overpower him. That's why I don't find it that annoying, if we go full powerlevel, Rex is already at the top with Pneuma.
Well he probably meant the elements the blades use but he might be able to manipulate regular particles as well. Though every time he does the effect seems to come from his body so potentially he has to be in physical contact in order to manipulate the particles. Everything he uses his ability it's either on himself or it comes from the air around him.
By elementary particles i thought he meant all the elements in the game lol
7:06 Rex does it by completely rewriting physical rules, which is only possible because of the Conduit. I have no idea how the hell Jin is able to do it, 'cause he DOESN'T have access to the Conduit.
To be honest, I think he knows that he can kill Rex in an instant, and the reason he doesn't do that in the final fight is because he still had questions for Rex that he wanted answers for, and maybe even wanted to try to dissuade him without having to kill him. And when he got the answers he was trying to get, he decided "maybe it's for the best that he keeps pushing on".
Born 300 years after Galileo's death and dead on Einstein's birthday. Man, I don't know where to go after this.
When Jin joins the party in morytha and an enemy copies his element they become ice element. That proves that even his standard form is ice.
Maybe he was just holding back because Rex and then grew on him? I got nothin
That’s what I think. He also isn’t really on a bloodlust he just wants to get to Elysium as well.and if he was to kill Rex mythra/pyra would have killed themselves which would destroy their plan
Nah, they’re misinterpreting the word. He can control all the elements of the game. If you play the game, you know there are 8 of them: Fire, water, earth, ice, wind, electric, dark and light. He didn’t mean literal elements, because in this game’s world the people are not at the intellectual understanding of real world humans
I don't need to watch this to know the answer. Traveling at the speed of light requires infinite energy or zero mass, the only particles we have found with zero mass, are of course light particles themselves.
Also other attack options include using matter anti matter annihilation or nuclear fusion. Being able to control photons is way too powerful as they are essentially energy materialized. They power every energy system.
Not to mention that light rules our realm. Everything operates at a frequency of light, to control light is to control the material universe.
'Um, actually' - Luxin 2018
If Jin used all the potential power he has, he would literaly has Thanos' power to snap everyone.
When I heard the the villain monologue about Jin's power I truly freaked out
I know I’m super late with this but bare with me. First of all, I loved how you put what we understand in our universe into this one and really showed us what Jin is capable of, however, this is a complete different universe with different rules altogether. Remember the architect? Half of his body was in a different place, this is already defying the “law” of physics you’re going on about. Secondly, and probably THE MOST important thing that I haven’t seen anyone comment about, is Jin’s mental and emotional states. How do we know if Jin even knows how to use his powers the way we are all thinking? He’s probably been alive as nearly as long as 500 years, lost his driver (which by the way had froze, and you have to question why he kept the body of his driver there. If that’s not crying out for mental health issues, I don’t what is), and highly depressed as you seen the bags under his eyes. I’ve believe Jin on a emotional level was so far unstable that part of him wanted to be stopped and defeated, kind of like Thanos in infinity wars.
In end, just looking at the physicality of Jin is only looking at half of why and what Jin choses and does, because even in the end he sacrificed himself, why? Because he wasn’t a bad guy to begins, just depressed and lonely cause he lost his driver and purpose in life, which was to protect. Something Rex reminded him of. And to be a good story teller you have to have a good back story for a character, sure, the game shows up where is came from but there is parts of him that we don’t get to see. This can be true as to many actors in the world that create backstories to correctly portray the decisions the made up characters make.
The problem with Jin...
Has the same JPN voices as Cloud of FF7
They both lost their love one during the game.
Except Jin is badass while Cloud is Emo badass
I don't think that's what he meant by elementary particles. I'm pretty sure he was referring to the different element based ether particles in the air such as "light, dark, fire, water, earth, air" Either way, I agree that he's op for little to no actual reason and it makes no sense in universe
i think the criticism for the power he shows in chapter 6 is justified, but one possibility that no one considers that i think is correct is actually really simple, which was that he was just bluffing to scare the party, and everything he said was just a lie. The tornan members either went with it or didn't know he was lying (more likely the 2nd one).
Fucking awesome video, thx my dude