Key Mechanics: Timers!
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- Опубліковано 13 гру 2015
- Never be boring! Press those players with limited time! Here's three types of timers and how to make 'em killer. NEVER let time amble by unless your players are exhausted... Hell, even then: push 'em! The chase, the swarm, and impending doom!
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#runehammer - Ігри
Two best things I've learned from Hankerin: Timers and Trap Theory. Everything else writes itself when you understand these concepts.
Hella rad video as usual!
I used your D4 suspense die for the first time in my last session and it went great. Players came across a farm being attacked by Quasits. There were stacks of hay near the house, one of which was on fire. My timer decided how many rounds before the fire jumped to the roof of the farmhouse, which had innocent people inside. Good times were had by all! Gonna try and implement the D4 regularly form now on.
+Black Magic Craft nice. oh snap I totally forgot your hotlink. I am a tyrant.
I'll just pretend you rolled a full on 4 for the hotlink timer.
The advice in this video drastically improved my campaign.
Love this. I wish more DMs did this, and I'll definitely use it in the future. :D
yo wasd20!!! you are the guy who got me into d&d!!!
"It will be Town for DAYS".... LOL
I agree fully, that time is a super scarce resource and should be highly valued by a DM.
I think of time in People Hours, 25 minutes is not JUST 25 minutes;
it is 25 X (# of people) or 150 people minutes for 1 DM + 5 Players
You owe it to everyone to be as entertaining as you can be!
Classic Runehammer. We need Hank in the spotlight more often.
*TOWN FOR DAYS* This video is straight up immortal. It served as a true awakening moment for me so many years ago. THANK YOU for bringing this radness into the world, u.r.a. goldang wizard.
I appreciate the spider spawning idea! The chase seems solid. I'm glad you addressed the idea of them knowing the timer.
as a rookie DM these videos are a treasure trove of awesome ideas that i find make the game just straight up better man. Thank you sir!
I'm currently running a AD&D 2e campaign that I wrote for WFRP 1st edition 20 years ago. I wanted to say thanks for the refresher course, new perspectives on what I have always viewed as "GM Instinct" and the great humor. Keep the vids coming like "A Big Ole Badass!!!"
I watch this and the perception vid once between sessions ( once a month ) It's like a pep talk! Lol
Er Ho I thought I was the only one!
oh and i used your timer mechanic from your previous vids in my last game. They thought it would be something generic like the lava rises to consume the bridges or more orc berserkers would spawn (they where bad enough!)...Nope I introduced "The Land Shark!" a warped human being turned into an unstoppable mass of flesh and teeth blocking off thier planned escape route. Man did they freak! I had the dwarven defender on deaths door (high AC ain't breaking MY game! lol!) and the rest of the party running like ninnies around the board until one of them thought of the keg of beer I had the dwarf chained to at the start of the session (they where rescuing the PC). He made a tough charisma check and offered the monster a sweet mug of the golden precious ale. The shark stopped his unstoppable rampage with a tear in his eye and curled up with the rogue and the keg (and more charisma checks) while the rest of the party dealt with the rest of the Orcs and a gelatinous cube. A little role-playing and humanity saved there asses. They freaked that it was too hard but it just goes to show that a little RP and using the environment can win the day. I loved it. I didn't think about CRs until I was done I just kept nailing them until they solved the room or fled. FYI I tallied it up at the end and 6 lv2 players ended up taking on a CR7 encounter! Timers are permanently in my game now. Thank you!
+logan holmberg awesome post! rock on!
Hells yeah! Jammin at the end....
"...but the legend of the rent was way hard core!!!" [wicked drum solo] - School of Rock
1st few seconds: "Woah, Walter White contemplating d4 crystal!"
Thank you so much for this video, Im a rookie DM started about 9 months ago, and my campaign im running has 7 to 9 players show up to play. and campaigns been long and hard. this video and all your others are very helpful. Instant Sub.
Thanks Hank for this video. I'm using the d4 of impending doom in the Call of Cthulhu module I'm writing at the moment.
Cthulhu does not conform to the schedules of humanity.
I run for 6-10 fairly frequently. Everyone goes home happy lol
Awesome! So glad I asked for this before, really changes the feel of the game and takes it to a whole new level. This vid covered really well how to revolutionize my dungeons, thanks man
You're the bee's knees.
+Kenneth Walton I disagree. I think he's the cat's pyjamas.
+JustOneAsbesto no, no he's dog's bollocks as we say in old blighty.
+David Martin win
great tips...been using the three T"s and my players love it..crafted my first board last month and haven't stopped..thank you for everything and we look forward to all your vids..
I'm done running man, BRING IT!
Here from Deficient Master. Cheers!
the swarm...so good with something like gnolls..
I love these! I use a screen, but it's not to hide my rolls - it's to hide my notes, and what minis I do&don't have ready to hop out at them :)
As far as making timers fit into the story, I feel using descriptions to reinforce the ticking clock is a nice fit. For instance with the swarm, each time the timer counts down describe the door getting more damaged as more enemies start making holes. If there's an enemy arriving in 3 rounds, describe war horns or a dust cloud on the horizon getting closer. We're badass gm's, we can definitely portray the encounter in such a way that the players' awareness of impending doom complements the Hero Sense that the characters should have, since in their world, they would DEFINITELY be able to pick up indications we at the table wouldn't think of. And when all else fails, Ethan Hunt on the phone realizing the Agency is DEFINITELY en route to grab him based on his professional expertise and intuition is a tried-and-true trope. M:I 5E
I've come up with a small chase rules during my last session it was a blast! I simply drew 10 squares on a sheet of paper and in some of them I drew a number. It looked something like that : ##1#2#345#
Character were pursued by too powerful foes so they had to outrun them.
The encounter starts after the PC had already ran for few rounds so that they need to make a CON check every round. If they failed, they would not move. If they succeeded, they would move 1 square on the "ladder" I drew.
After 3 rounds, the foes would appear. They would ALWAYS move 1 square, no check.
When a PC started his turn on a number, they had to face a certain challenge. One of them was deep snow (STR check), there was a rocky and steep river bed (atheletics), thick torn bushes (Dex check), a sudden drop ona cliff side and a stampede of fleeing animals.
And for sure, in the 'ol badass Hankerin philosophy, each challenge had its DC raised by 1 (10 for the first, then 11 for the second, 12, etc).
If a character started its round on the same space as the pursuing monsters, he took an hefty 4d8+8 dmg, no save, no attack check (the enemies are numerous, no point of making checks, statistically they will be hit, so the damage only reflects the average damage they'd get if you rolled for each of them... which you don't 'cuz you'r a big 'ol badass).
It was a blast!
Kudos to your contagious frantic way of playing RPGs!
+Addramyr Palinor oh man! awesome
Wonderful video sir, thankyou!!
Great ideas man!
Awesome ideas, and explanations.
Great vid as always. I love your common sense approach that still allows it to feel like a game. Games should have visual mechanics it adds to the fun. I am defiantly using the chase mechanic next time I run a game. I use to just run chases without a board and it did not really have a sense of suspense or movement. Now I am going to try this.....why did I not think of this? It is so easy lol.
This is perhaps the only subject area in all your vids that I would not happily try to incorporate into my game, but I still enjoyed watching you talk about it. Thanks for all your great videos.
+James Habermehl pourqay no?
Well, our group generally prefers D&D where the DM is more of a neutral referee than a proactive story-teller, and we're more of a deliberative body, i.e., a bunch of argumentarians! Occassional encounters like that are definitely worthwhile in order to keep the players on their toes and involved in the action. But I'm pretty sure if every encounter had game time limits or even real-time consequences, our group would get tired of that pretty quick. Our DM would probably experience some blow-back from running it so arbitrarily, with an open die roll set in front of everyone for controlling the pace. Of course, in our case a DM could keep the timer die roll secret instead. We just tend to want a high degree of realism in our fantasy, and would find timing set by one die roll to be a bit too... capricious? I am in no way attempting to judge anyone who does enjoy that style of play; I just suspect it's not what we'd prefer as a steady game-diet.
no idea is applied poorly when smarts are used. rock on your way!
Most of our group have been playing AD&D together since the '70s, so we're pretty old and crotchety, and maybe not as mentally flexible as we could be. ;-)
then crotchet hard!
My players convinced a Nothic to leave them alone briefly to loot, I rolled a 1d4+2 for the number of rounds it would be away. When they barely made it out on the last round it was super suspenseful and probably one of my favourite games so far!
lol love the Zaxxon reference!
Love you, man! Greetings from the vast bavarian wastelands!!!
+Freyveley Skol!
awesome vid! agreed. nowadays these young wipersnappers are so impatient... and... im sooo olllddd! haha
Amazing info once you get into it. :)
I like to use 2D3 and if the result is 5 or 6, the players is up for a particularly awful surprise. 25% chance of getting just one turn before the players are screwed (with a D4) is a bit TOO unfair most of the times, I think ;)
On like Squeaky Fromme!!!
great video definitely going to make the starter set and future home brews more interesting
also could I use the D4 time method for rests cause knowing my players they'll want straight to the point, not too much time spent travelling or resting.
basically more dungeon hunting and combat
I know as a DM (very new DM) I've got to make sure they're having fun but I don't want to just hand them back there hit points like they're invincible,
do I need to draw a line somewhere or will I just being too controlling
thanks for the vids as always
I've always got an encounter generator ready to go in the event stuff starts to drag. By the time I notice, it's been going for a while, so I like to set it to deadly
(We really like combat) Still like these ideas
Honestly, I love Alaskan Amber, at least as far as Ambers go. Though my favorite Alaskan Brewery beer is the Winter Ale, brewed with spruce tips, tastes like you're drinking a fermented Christmas tree!
...
In a good way.
I would just like to say that, I am new to D&D... and can't understand why I didn't start earlier lol... but Mr Hankerin...sir, your system is the ducks nuts man, and I have already started to use it in my first adventure. So a big thank you and please keep up the vids man, 👍🏻
I'm writing an adventure for D&D 5e and it will include timers 😉
Bad Ass, as always.
Everyone loves trinities; how do you feel about having your countdown _always_ be three turns? This way you can plan in advance what will happen in each phase, and the players also start to internalize how long they have to mess around. Another possibility is to have the doom come after three failures of some kind. This dovetails nicely into "three before three" simplified (or perhaps generalized) skill challenges.
+Jared Hayter Nope..."planning" is the doom of surprise! Also, any 'rule' gets old so fast...the dice are kings of keeping it surprising...
0:19 "town for days" is a reference to the "Story Mindfreak Session" in which the Drunkens & Dragons guy says "fuck town," so check that one out yo ... 1:43 "you cannot let your session drag" and that is what this one is about...Talking about one of the three big Ts he always talks about (timer, threat, treat) that hasta be in your room if you wanna play D&D like a big old badass... If you don't want to to that, then this video is NOT for you -- go watch people do their taxes... 2:48 set the tempo at the beginning of the game... that's the first timer when you recap and start... 4:19 now he's starting -- there are many kinds of timers, he will show three kinds here: (1) Chase Room, (2) Swarm Timer, and (3) Imminent Doom. 6:06 Timers push the game... so DO IT NOW! 6:55 The tools you need to push time -- 1d4 ("suspense dice" -- lets you know something is going to happen in a few rounds), ... 10:11 use a coaster for your drink... back to the tools, or just some sort of Boggle timer or something (maybe a Candy Land spinner?... 10:37 IMPENDING DOOM TIMER -- put a bunch of yucky stuff in the room and then make it worse with some sort of unbeatable threat that is on the way in a d4 number of rounds and then lock them in the room with it so it really sucks... 13:27 SWARM TIMER -- barricade the people in a room with some disgusting swarm freakshow on the way and will get there in d4 rounds...expose them to the stuff (no screen) so they will have nightmares later on and will cry...once the swarm starts, it's a never-ending spawn... 15:47 CHASE TIMER -- like the Out of the Abyss (alright, my rogue character in this is like "let's get the fuck out outta jail" while everyone else is kinda going slow, so i hear ya)... make the enemy freaking fast so he keeps catching up, then they go to another board with yet another obstacle or slowy down things like webs and difficult terrain... you might even cut time dice in half (1 & 2 = 1, 3 & 4 = 2, or maybe just use the Chutes & Ladders spinner)... rogues shine like crazy because of the big moves... these are harder to run than the other two...you should practice them first and then you don't need a lot of notes either... 22:25 DM needs to be on the ball yo! He's got to come online and go double duty live gonzo so that the game flows faster than a bored turtle... So get out your Chutes& Ladders spinner because timers can help you do it...
+Violet Deliriums holy. shi.
+Drunkens & Dragons: Play D&D Like a Badass wha?
10:40 Timer type 1 -- Immanent Dooooooooooooooooooom!!! -- you have so much time to finish yo biz before you diiiiiiiiiiiiiiieeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
13:26 Timer type 2 -- The Swarm -- You have a little bit of time before the axe comes through the door and the drunkens & dragons guy goes "Here's Johnny" -- then the fight is on whether you like it or not. (Unlike doom where the fate is immediate, you will have chance to fight after some crazy ass threat arrives.)
15:48 Time type 3 -- The Chase -- Basically you have a fast foe after you and have to get around all the obstacles and get away. Think Offspring: "I'm getting edgy all the time, there's someone around me just a step behind. It's kinda scary, the shape I'm in. The walls are shakin' and they're closing in. Too fast or a bit too slow. I'm paranoid of people and it's starting to show. There's one guy that I can't shake over my shoulder is a big mistake. Sitting on the bed or lying wide awake, there's demons in my head and it's more than I can take. I think I'm on a roll, but I think it's kinda weak. Saying all I know is I gotta get away from me."
Ehhhmm... what do you do if the group does not get out of the "Impending Doom" room before the timer runs out? Will the "unfightable foe" suddenly turn fightable? Or are they all dead and have to roll up new characters?
depends largely on THEIR narrative...if they give off cues of being doomed, or that its over...I roll with it. If they insist on finding some way to survive, I stay fexible
Perhaps set it up so that the "impending doom" will leave them alive but captured?
Maybe they wake up, cocooned in the insect queen's chamber and must escape their bonds before nearby larva consume them?
Maybe the "impending doom" is something the dungeon boss allows to inhabit that area of the dungeon because he can then sweep up intruders more easily. In that case, they'll be prisoners and need to escape.
Another idea: set it up so the "impending doom" doesn't kill them, but does lasting damage that they can't heal with rest or magic. They'll need to defeat the dungeon boss to get the cure. Except, now that they're impaired by the curse/infection, it'll be a tougher fight.
Another idea: if you're running a game with horror factor (Hank did a video about this idea, the Duke of Herald I think), instead of the "impending doom" causing lasting physical harm, it causes lasting psychological harm.
I love playing my games like this, but players always panic and die.
How do you get that almost felt look to your green board? It doesn't "shine" like a paint would.
Where is the funny series "The Quest" that you were referring to in the last four minutes of the video? Can anyone link it or point me in the right direction? I looked for it but it was too vague of a reference...
mmm courage...liquid courage...
In pathfinder D.master guide theres an very nice rule for chases
Hank, do you tell them what the timer is for exactly, or just let them guess. Or like the impending doom example, give a small hint as to what is to come?
both...depends if its obvious, they just know, or if i have hideous secrets..
Great video!
Question: what amount of checks or "actions" can characters make in 25 minutes? I know that it should make narrative sense, but I'm looking at something concrete since the time mechanic is a concrete number of rounds. Thanks!
depends on player speed, table talk etc.. my guess? about 3 minutes per turn... so 4 players play 2 rounds in 25 minutes
Thanks for the help!
Noticing your shirt, you from WA?
in the chase, shouldnt it make sense that the players can get away if they succeed a couple times? if they are forced to confront the enemy then mechanically, there was never a point in running away was there?
well... 'fleeing' isnt something I usually see players do...like ever... but theoretically, YES!
I'm trying to figure out how a DM might approach the chase scene in a way that suggests to the players that running is the best option, and the only thing I can think of is to do several timer situations in a row to prime them towards running. Perhaps even after a failed impending doom stripping of all weapons where it's either run or die?
P.I.C.K. your battles:
Plagiarize
Improvise
Compromise
Keep moving
What’s is your opinion on co dming for larger groups
larger groups..i just cant...the turn wait for players is just too mean :p
How would you do timers in a game like Dungeon World which does not feature rounds?
+Kastenbrot Hack in turns! You don't need detailed combat time mechanics to just go clockwise at your table, and count rounds. Total sequence chaos feels like a formula for more shy players to disappear from the action.
Yeah, that's actually pretty straightforward. Thanks!
I have that warhammer too. its a good one.
22:32 so as long as we DM faster than William Shatner sings, we should be in the clear XD
+Wax Vedrodski red bull
Shatner has many fast paced songs. He even does a punk song with Henry Rollins. -Only Shatner Fanboy In the Chat
On the bottom left corner, there is a kind of modern/brand new warhammer. Care to tell us more about ?
+Le Chat Vert part of my 'city guard' armory I use for renn faire!
Drunkens & Dragons: Play D&D Like a Badass Cheers, that looks nice. What else is in you "city guard armory" ?
plate mail and barbute, arming jacking, pantaloons, boots, bastard sword, long sword, pike, wooden shield, parade colors, and great belt
so your players know exactly what will happen when the time's up? or they just know something bad is about to happen?
a little of both...
:D :D :D no words
what would you recommend for a dc 12 room with 5 players 4 lvl 1s and 1 lvl 2?
what about possibly a 1d6 swarm would that work mabey as it would be like road to royalty starter map
well, double their number with half their hp.. so 10 baddies, 8 hp each, doing 1d6 damage or so... tune from there
Thx but I just got done with the game about 1 hour ago.................... the whole party got killed. They were not being smart at all along with horrible rolls on their part (around 5's and 6's) and me the dm rolling great like 18's and 19's. So yay I get to dm a whole new campaign
Drunkens & Dragons: Play D&D Like a Badass I just made a video on a timer that you should watch
link?
Love your vids! Keep them coming! Yer relighting the fire on some of us old timers! Another timer mechanic can be imminent danger to someone or something important to them (....even Capt. Kirk). Nothing better than the self inflicted need for speed, risk taking and suspense than a rescue. Maybe they succeed (yay!) maybe they fail (guilt trip). Having to pass up juicy treats for lack of time doesn't hurt either. Whatever the results are they can then drive episode 2.
redjak.com/blog2
+Jeffery Schutt amen!
cant you just use a dash action in the chase?
sure, but never attack?
Runehammer I would try to build up some space, so i have some time to prepare for a battle with advantage for me (getting high ground, improvised barricades, etc.)
I'd pay to play in a game you DM tbh
My problem with the chase timer is, my players NEVER run away
scorchedtoad YOU must teach them fear
But, I like arbitrary danger