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All of them :( Mami with her constant suffering which she keeps to herself. Homura with her extreme love and empathy which is interesting to see in it’s limits and colours. The same with the others each one had traits that were so real it hurts
Same here. I love when a character has some grey area to their reasoning. She helped someone else, but was it really for them? Details like that give them so much depth
its the only relatable character arc tbh, its simple enough for us mere humans to relate to: simply being below average. rest are like way too flashy and complicated and a bit unrealistic. thats wh i thikn atleast
@@ProfessorViral I think it's more about her being shown as a complex human being as we all are, not so much gray areas. She's not just the tomboy, or the love sick teenager, she's much more than that, and we get to see that play out over the series, even after she dies in the reality we are part of, and homura's telling of the other time lines, and the Wraiths time line. Sayaka is the cautionary tale that we all learn as we grow up, be careful what you wish for. I think that's what makes her best girl in my eyes. How many times have we growing up said that same lien; "I was stupid, so stupid."
I disagree that the boy is an unsympathetic character - he's so deeply isolated in his tragedy that he cannot be expected to show grace towards people around him, until his situation is miraculously changed and he's tasting back his life - with all the seemingly lost future rushing back to him. We shouldn't fault him for not being omniscient or a mind reader - even if the situation is tragic.
I personally am completely baffled as to how he can claim that he's an unlikable character. The most he even was for me was uninteresting, but his behavior makes complete sense given his situation and I can't really fault him for that.
Yeah I don't understand that either. Dude is depressed because he lost the ability to pursue his goal and passion in an accident. How is that unsympathetic?
Nigga was ungrateful to the ONLY person who showed him that she cared about him for him and not his talent,and also he immediately dropped her for for hitomi. Also FUCK Hitomi. If I were Sayaka I would've let her die when she fell under the witches influence
You know, in the Madoka Mágica Anthology Manga, there is a chapter? dedicated to Kyouske, where he actually recognizes and values Sayaka, but chooses Hitomi because he can see the latter as an equal. He feels he is unworthy of Sayaka, which honestly makes this all the more tragic. I don't think the Anthology has any canonicity, but I still want to point it out
Oh god, given he would have no idea of what happens to her based on that choice, it really does make it more tragic. I should check out the additional media for MM sometimes, I know I'll be checking out rebellion again sometime soon at least. I only saw it once years ago, so I forgot most of the specifics
I think that makes kyoskey a bit more human though in the show he doesnt even show up to her funeral which for a person who though so highly of her seems like such a off thing to do
While tragic I still see this as selfish. He is only thinking about what he feels, its obvious he knows how Sayaka feels but still decides for her by saying oh no no I don't deserve you so I'll go with Hitomi your friend
This video really is just how I feel huh. I’m a very empathetic person. I feel what others are feeling. So I don’t like people to be sad, because **i** don’t like to be sad. And I often struggle with the selfish part of me. I want to be liked. And I do things for other people to *be* liked. Not for them to be better but for my personal benefit. And I hate that part of myself. I feel guilty for feeling this way. It’s hard to believe I’m a good person when my thoughts are different from my actions. Everyone thinks I’m a good person because they don’t know my thoughts. They don’t know how selfish they are. This is why I love Sayaka. She’s the same age as me and has the same problems as me. We’re objectively good people, but deep down, we’re the most selfish people you’ll ever meet.
The series is 10 years old, and yet here we are, with new interpretations of the series and its characters. That's what you call a great series in almost every way.
Hi! In Rebellion, during the transformation into a witch, Homura says something to the effect of - "I cannot even remember anything, and all I can remember is overwhelming grief..." It makes sense then, that when Sayaka was turning into a witch, she would say that she does not remember what was ever worth fighting for in the first place. As a witch, you seem to gain amnesia, which would explain why Octavia was unable to be turned back into a human.
i get what ur saying but i dont think they completely forget their memories once they turn to witches. they might even still have consciousness based on rebellion where homura was still talking even as a witch (when she kept telling them to stop trying to save her)
In the manga, Kazumi magica. The Pleiades are attempting to turn their friend Michiru back to a human from a witch. And yet she keeps rejecting it. The only stable clone they had, was Kazumi. Who didn't have Michirus memories. And another peculiar thing is about how when Umika and Kaoru were close to witching, Michiru, who was a grief seed at the time, seemed to act up to get Kazumis attention so they could save their friends. Kazumi magica is filled with so much, I adore it.
Witches are transformed from Soul Gems, which would mean that they are the remnants of a Magical Girl's soul that became corrupted and blackened from negative emotions and trauma. When a Magical Girl becomes a Witch, they become an entirely different being. Hence, they are "reborn" in a sense and don't retain memories. They retain the essence of the Magical Girl that they were born from, but they don't have a sense of self or identity. They're a husk that causes pain and grief, but doesn't know or understand who or what they are.
I think part of the reason why she punishes herself and spirals is because she hates herself for having selfish desires and originally suppresses them, and then feels the need to hurt herself as punishment for mistakes she only blames herself for in the end. Which is partially what makes her so tragic. She wants to be this noble hero that in the real world doesn’t exist, but when she comes face to face with the cruelty of how the world really works, and the darkness inside her own self, she can’t handle it because her entire world view and personality is shattered in front of her. Being simply kind wasn’t enough. Which honestly, is completely understandable. It’s natural to want to be acknowledged for good action, to have rewards for good behavior, but she can’t stand when she realizes she wants this in herself, so she spirals in a fit of self destruction and rage. She hates herself and she hates the world for making her this way. She has no real self love or acceptance which is her ultimate weakness. She placed her entire value on what she could do for others, without acknowledging her own true feelings and broke when she realizes the ideals she believed in with every ounce of her being are fiction. So in the end, she goes to the grave mindlessly pursing her original goal even if it makes her utterly miserable because if she did anything else it would be a direct betrayal to what she once said she believed in... I also think in her relationship with Kyousuke, if she had the confidence to confess her feelings to him things could have turned out differently, but she felt ashamed of the fact she was a ‘zombie’ and did not feel that he could love her this way. She lets Kyousuke go, because it’s the ‘right thing to do’, again living by her altruistic ideals, and plays the part of the hero, but she does have selfish intentions. She does want to be with him, and she can’t stand that about herself. She hates herself for being jealous of Hitomi and having a thought of wishing she had let her die, because a hero isn’t supposed to think things like that, right? In the end, she destroys herself because she can’t stand who she’s become which is just so utterly sad. Her feelings were natural and normal and she crucified herself for simply being human.
In the PSP game, there's an alternate route where Homura convinces Sayaka to confess her feelings and becoming a magical girl to Kyosuke, it's really wholesome and she learns to accept her selfish desires rather than feel guilty over them. It's super wholesome and definitely recommend you check it out
I love Sayaka so much while many consider her the worst character of the main girls. Ironically I think it´s because she is the most human and most realistic, acting like a mirror in showing us the ugly truth we dont want to see. We all want to be strong and good and ideallistic but most would crumble just like her and things that seem silly and simple to outsiders like heartbreak feel like the end of the world to us. Really amazing video!
Thank you : D I'd agree she is the most human of them all, so a dislike of her can definitely be a rejection of that truth that is somewhat ugly. I guess for me, she's my favorite because I focus on those negative aspects, as a way to try and avoid them myself
being excuse doesnt excuse her actions or make it normal. You are right , its realistic because in real life you have people who act like that , who doesnt want to improve. yOU HAVE PEOPLE WHO are so stuck in their own desilussions that they make themselve miserables and other people miserable. She is a perfect exemple of some bad people and the character is great because its show you the path to not follow . You cant glorify this character
I kinda get why she's so unlikable. She's a teenager who doesn't quite understand how complicated and difficult things can be, especially when you're taking a situation out of someone else's hands. She acted selfishly and made a wish thinking that it would get her some kind of reward or happy ending, but in reality, it only brought her misery when she realized that in the end, she couldn't get what she wanted. Sayaka had good intentions, but rather bad understanding about what road those intentions would lead her down. Mami had warned her that she really needed to reflect on who Sayaka was really making a wish for: Herself, or for Kyousuke. She was making the wish for herself because she didn't want to see Kyousuke in pain, but she also thought that she would get her real wish: To be with him. However, she has a rather rigid mindset and doesn't realize that she would never be with Kyousuke because after becoming a magical girl, you basically die. You stop aging and your body and soul are separated. That's part of what really breaks Sayaka. Sayaka is my favorite character and I definitely understand having good intentions that ultimately lead you to hell. I think everyone can understand that.
I honestly see Sayakas story arch as a kin to the little mermaid.. It almost mirrors the story completely acceptance instead of sacrificing a voice she sacrificed her body
Sayaka’s arc can be interpreted in many ways I feel. It could be about the balance of karma, it could be about growing up, to me it’s about a downward spiral into depression. A spiral that feels so real and scary it’s actually a bit relatable, especially to someone like myself. Sayaka may have had good intentions but her true desire was a selfish one deep down, and to have it taken away from her, all she felt was anger, hatred, and despair. Taking it out on everyone she knew and most of all, herself. She wasn’t stupid... she was just a kid. That is why Sayaka Miki is my favorite character of all time... 😌 (Also, the writers confirmed that she didn’t kill the two men on the train. However she actually did in the manga adaptation)
The facts of her situation are definitely a near 1:1 for a spiral of depression. I think all the meanings of her story stem from that framing. It's showing us a sad story, and then giving the chance for us to think about how it became sad. I definitely relate too much to it as well. I think the fact they're so young is perfect here, because she is just a child, being punished as if she was an adult privy to the secrets of a world she doesn't even live in
One of the themes I see in Madoka is the inability to see how hardships can help you later on. Hardships teach us to avoid future failures, help us to learn lessons we can only learn through failing. Sayaka’s wish, and even Homura’s as well, were based on the inability to see a way to work THROUGH the hardship because it hurt too much in the moment. They’re basically looking for immediate and quick gratification, rather than being able to understand that holding out would make for a stronger character and will at the end of it
It's honestly a really true depiction of despair. I think it's a double play honestly. Like, a lot of kids will scream through their TV that there are other ways but those kids might feel just as hopeless as Homura and Sayaka and not see that in their own situations. It's like a "gotcha" for kids who might feel similar to work out. I mean some will get all Patrick Star about it, but others will have a "oh! Ya got me!" Moment.
Poor Sayaka. The show did an amazing job of portraying that devastating self hatred one feels when you realize most of your motivations are selfish in nature- and then the self destruction that tends to follow. This was a brilliant video essay!
Thank you : ) I think that deconstruction of selfishness is what drew me to Sayaka’s character, and I often frame my own actions as selfish, deserved or not, so I had to dig deeper into it in this anime
@@ProfessorViral totally agree! Each character in Madoka is so cruelly relatable. When I first watched this back in 2011 and was a young girl myself, this anime despite the magic felt so unbelievably relatable, especially Sayaka.
I think that's the intentional feeling. The way she naturally became sad, but then fed it with her own actions and denied it makes it very "grey" compared to what most anime would do
I think she gets hate "because" she's the most human. Humans fuck up, a lot, way more than an idealized fictional character tends to, and we often hate on each other because of that. So i think it makes sense people would hate the most "human" character.
I dislike the part when she was a real jerk to both madoka and homura. And in all timelines no matter what approach homura took sayaka was untrusting of her and even villianize her. Would you rather trust a talking animal or a time controlling magical girl. She already knows how much suffering being a magical girl is and yet tells madoka to either share her burden, do the fighting for her or piss off. Yeah no, that sounded so toxic its not something you can just say to someone you care about. She has these unreal standards she hold everyone to but even she herself couldn't keep to it. She would verbally lash out at homura who just saved everyone for taking Charlotte's grief seed. Then complain to kyuubey other magical girls just want to kill witches for grief seeds. Sayaka might be the combination of all the human qualities I don't want to see in a person. And that's why I dislike her. Exactly the kind of person I avoid making friends with.
Something that's caught my attention during this video is how similar Sayaka and Kyouske are in their suffering. We see only fragments of him as a character, and while he's not 'sympathetic', he's not the character we're supposed to sympathise with- but that doesn't make him beyond sympathy in of itself. If you just isolate Sayaka's behaviour at the very end of her arc, we'd probably have as much distaste for her actions towards others as we would with how Kyouske treats her. Her anger is unpleasant and directionless and it's hard to watch, but we've seen what she's been through, what she wanted (and what she really wanted) and we wanted that for her too, because she's our girl, and then we saw her lose it all and we grieved with her. But Kyouske doesn't have the same relevance to us. And I think that's just the message of their characters side by side-- grief and trauma is often ugly and unsightly and people deserve our understanding, even if we can't accept their behaviour.
I've always love the tragic story of Sayaka. A true sacrifice that didn't do anything more than bring pain to a lot of people and how, and, at the end, even when Madoka tried to gave her the opportunity to start again, she didn't regret her sacrifice, making her last sacrifice for Kiosuke, this time making it for his happines, not for her own. Amazing video as always, amazing analysis and writing. ¡Thank you so much!
I don't think Kyousuke is unsympathetic. Just like with everyone else's story lines there's a lot going on. You can actually kinda see him as a bit of a micro of Homura (and Sayaka). When you lose everything you get lost in that loss, when you can get that back you get lost in having it back. He didn't owe Sayaka a return on that emotion, but it's hinted he did return it. Hitomi even saw that and gave her an opening which, just like a grief seed, she refused. Kyousuke was not obligated to chase her and since she did not come for him when he was healed he did was most kids would do and assumed she had enough and he missed his chance. Instead of having to dwell in it though, Hitomi showed up 🤷🏾♂️
Perfectly worded. I don't get the hate for Kyosuke and Hitomi. Hitomi clearly cares about Sayaka, and Kyosuke does too. It's not necessarily that Kyosuke doesn't want to do anything for Sayaka, more so that he can't and Sayaka is incredibly stubborn.
The philosophy of when kindness and selflessness crosses into selfishness is the kind of stressful paradox thinking that always got under my skin, especially with my foster parents. It's this notion that it is impossible to not be selfish and greedy 24/7 and thus one is always a bad person, but then it makes you wonder when it's possible to be a good person or if selflessness is actually possible. I've been told by such people that my kind are incapable of it, so who knows for sure, I just know it's a philosophy that has always haunted me and that it's something Sayaka embodies and that maybe this is why I'm so iffy on her and why I wonder if Madoka's desire to do the right thing is in turn the most selfish act of them all.
I think you nailed with the last sentence. Overall, though, there is no good and evil. There are people with their own motivations and worldviews just living their lives. Some are more altruistic, some are less. It's all grey.
When I watch a show, sometimes I think “what would I have done if I was in that world?” And Sayaka’s character followed my thoughts eerily closely. Her dreams, hopes, and flaws were so real and so was her downfall. She holds a dear part in my heart.
At her age, and in her situation, I would have made the same wish. That's why I love her story so much, it's given me a medium to reflect on myself in a way only a story could make me think of
I watched Madoka Magica when it came out in 2011, I was 11, and just starting anime. I’m 21 now, about to turn 22, and no anime has ever held a greater spot in my heart than this one. Madoka Magica is criminally underrated and yet, I am happy it is seemingly a forgotten hidden gem. Sayaka and Kyoko have always been my favorites, and I also feel these two (alongside Mami) get overshadowed so much by Madoka and Homura. Obviously I understand why it’s the case, but I always appreciate those who also took the time to appreciate the importance and complexities of the other girls, who endured just as much pain and suffering - Sayaka especially. Wonderful video man.
Thank you; as someone who covers a lot of more niche things, I'm happy to see there are people out there who appreciate the same things : ) This was one of my first anime, making Sayaka one of my first favorite characters, so it's always held a soft spot for me as well
the saddest part in all of this is that sayaka was too focused in her ideals to see the reality of the world , because unlike the previous magical girl shows where girls like sayaka have the same ideals they get rewarded for it , but sayaka on the other hand got nothing in return , which is what made her fate tragic .
Same here, I always go back to watch clips while writing, double checking myself, and end up watching half an episode, just falling into its emotional pull
Her tragic end made me almost rage quit the show... I related to her so much and seeing her "friend" Hitomi just backstab her like that made my blood boil. Also Kyousuke... idc if he was sad and depressed, Sayaka was the only consistent support he had and he just forgot her?!?!
Except Hitomi didn't backstab Sayaka. In episode 7 she told Sayaka she had feelings for Kyousuke and said that Sayaka had the right to go after Kyousuke first because she had known the guy longer. It wasn't just sadness and depression; he had basically lost his entire future and not only would he never walk right again his hands would be messed up permanently. Also, he didn't forget her considering he literally said her name in the last episode.
@@animeman8203 still find it selfish fromboth parts... you see a friend pour her life and free time into caring for someone and the moment they are cured she swooped and and told her she was gonna fight for him??? She backstabbed her... And Kyousuke is extremely ungrateful to her, he only thought about his feelings I remember someone mention how he felt inferior to her so he decided to choose Hitomi as he sees her as an equal. He did that without regarding Sayaka's feeling thinking he knew better for BOTH of them.
@@animeman8203 Hitomi only pounced on the chance to go after Kyosuke after he got better and left the hospital, yet she wasn't around to support him at all when he was at his low point. I'd call that a major backstab.
You are too hard on Kyosuke honestly. Boy is going through the worst time of his life where the thing he loves doing more than anything is taken away from him and wont ever come back. It's so bad that his arm can't even feel any pain and the doctors stright up tell him to give up. Calling him a "brat who doesn't get what he wants" is so not fair to him, honestly I would lash out too if I was in his shoes and it's not fair to hold something like that against a human reaction. Especially since he apologized for his behavior afterwards.
One thing I find interesting is the parallel between Sayaka and Homura. Both girl's wishes are motivated by wating to save someone they love, both fall to despair at least in part because they can't be with that person, and both stories raise questions of whether they truly love that person or just want to possess them. Sayaka is aware that her motives may not have been purely altruistic, and that troubles her throughout the show. This is why she gets so angry when Kyoko suggests she force Kyosuke to love her. Contrast this with Homura, who never questions her own motives or methods. However, unlike Homura, Sayaka redeems herself when she accepts her death and reaffirms her wish. This shows that she genuinely wants her friends to be happy even if she can't be with them. Homura faces a similar these at the end of the Rebellion movie, but ultimatly places her desire to possess Madoka above Madoka's wishes. Fans can disagree over whether Homura's new world was "better" in a practical sense, but her reasons are unquestionably wrong, as even Homura admits. I really hope these parallels get explored further now that they're finally making the next movie and that Homura eventually gets a chance at redemption.
I disagree that the boy was unlikable. As someone who tends to lash out sometimes due to my own mental issues, I can tell you that neither of them were in a situation to understand what he was going through and how to approach it. So, the problem never gets brought up in a healthy way or addressed in a healthy way either. Hitomi crossed the line though, she's the unlikable one imo 🗿
He did genuinely love the music and was happy when they listened to it together. What you’re talking about is a moment where he couldn’t properly process his sheer frustration and anger at his situation and lashed out in anger at her because the music right that second was just a cruel reminder of his fate. Was what he did okay? No, but he’s a kid put in a very traumatic situation. He’s reacting in a very understandable way.
Maybe if he would have been a very angry or mean or spoiled kid from the start then you’d have every right to see him as unsympathetic, but we saw who he really is. When he lashed out it was shortly after PT, he just went through a really painful process where in his mind it was emphasized that he’d never be able to play his instrument again. He is a very hurt kid who doesn’t have the tools he needs to process that in a healthy way. But in one way you’re right. He’s likely very well off just like the main group, he likely never had to face a life changing tragedy before. The boy needs psychological therapy along with the physical therapy.
"He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche, "Beyond Good and Evil", 1886 Sayaka is literally this incarnated
I love Sayaka's character. She truly is the "best girl". I was at a identic situation to her's in the past, also at basicaly the same age, so I resonate a lot with her and kinda understand her struggle.
OK. While I mostly agree here? One huge thing that I think a lot of fans forget when it comes to koysuke is *he deliberately and intentionally hurts himself and openly lements how he's useless without the ability to play music.* He keeps hearing people talk about how he's a prodigy and was destined for greatness. Not to mention he comes from a rich family that likely had high expectations for him and his music carrer. Now he can't do that and probably feels like he's a failure and at something he loved to do. Listening isn't enough because it was something he loved doing and was really good at. It honestly wouldn't surprise me if he started more severe self-harm or requesting to have his hand amputated so he won't have to deal with an all but actual dead hand. *Sayaka was trying to prevent that*
If there's one mistake I've made that's become clear to me over time (from people rightful disagreeing) it's being too hard on Kyosuke here, because I was so focused on Sayaka. I still dislike him, but I would definitely write things less harsh now
@@ProfessorViral That's fair. I still venomitly loath Homura for her conscious choice to screw over all magical girls to get her happy ending but I can understand why they like her. There's a reason the quiet, mysterious, brooding, ect types are so popular
I'm surprised how many others there are who relate to Sayaka the same way I do. She always felt like a dark mirtor to me and her arc was one of the most impactful I have seen in any anime. Nice to see her analyzed
I really hate how Sayaka’s basically the punching bag for this series 😭😭 In the Walpursinacht(I think I spelled it wrong) Rising trailer, during the scene with her, Madoka, and Hitomi her neck was bandaged up, and also how in the trailer her face was almost fully bandaged up 😭😭
Regarding kyosuke i have to disagree. He doesnt owe Sayaka anything. She had a crush on him and decided to selflessly care for him while he was lost in his own grief and sorrow for a lost future. while dealing with all that you cant excpect him to be focused on anyone other than himself. She made the choice to be there "selflessly" at first but in reality she began to think that this sould eventually grant her some sort of rights over him. And that is how that selfless love and care becomes selfishness. She wanted him to be well again but eventually also expected that he would somehow see through the effort and be grateful to her when all he cared for was getting his life back. there is nothing wrong with that.
He owes her gratitude, he owes her to stand by her in the same way if she would wound up in the same situation, he owes her a whole lot, one thing he does NOT owe her is to fall in love with her.
@@StarDreamsStudios That is not how it works, he accepted Sayaka's effort and company. If someone cuts hours upon hours of their free time to make your life less miserable and you accept it, you are at an obligation to return that. The only other clean option would be to send Sayaka away much sooner. Accepting help, favours or efforts of others without at least an intent to reciprocate fully is a bad style.
@@michalsoukup1021 I was her choice to do that, anyd you dont get to expect anything in return, especially if you dont voice otr demand it loud to that person. H has to respect it, which he actually dioe and is grateful, but he dosnt owe her anything in return, especially if she doesnt demand it herself. He doesnt know and cant and is not responsible for her feelings. Did sayaka ttell him she loved him before, had they that kind of relationship? What he owed her and in his eyes he did other than one time really freaking out ove never abl to be able to play again. a very human moment, else he was ignorant of sayaka, because sayalka never voiced that things. Dunno he forgot telling her h is out of the hispital but thats likely not intentional. A unfair as it is, he owes her nothing thhan th gratitude he gave her already.
Even if the world is very magical and fictional, I think Sayaka was the most realistic character from them all. Her desires are very realistic and honestly I would've done the same things as her as a teenager
Sayaka the Human... She is probably the one most like myself in the pack, so she is also the one I can relate to most directly. She is the kind of character that makes you think that being human has a certain nobility to it, even when everything turns to ashes in your hands. I don't think I will ever forget her.
I feel like she just wanted Kyosuke to be happy but only with her and she thought giving him his hands back would make him love her but it was not true and once she realizes it was kind of selfish which is what mami warned her about she realizes that it wasn’t worth it and it feels wasted even thought she was always being a good person The comments gave me more insight thank you
I think that's why she became so distant from who she was at the end. She forces herself to keep fighting witches in a fully "just" way, trying to provide some evidence to herself that she's not a selfish person, now that she recognizes her wish
Thank you so much for this video. I hadn't considered the debate between Bentham and Kant and sort of missed just how deeply Sayaka actually fell not just on an emotional but also moral level. I hope more people see your content!
Thank you, I'm glad the video gave you some food for thought, that's always priority number one : D But, I hope we can grow the audience as well, however I'm always happy just to have what I do : )
Excellent video! I've always really loved Sayaka, always made me sad how a lot of people wrote her off as a terrible person. This is such a great character study that delves into why she is the way she is.
I love your video, but your analysis on Kyousuke a bit harsh. I honestly think everyone is too harsh on this boy. Yes, Sayaka was a great and kind person to Kyousuke, but he doesn't owe her his feelings. He listened to music with her a lot and was obviously appreciative to her actions/efforts. This poor boy lashed out ONCE. ONCE, that we see of. It probably hit him in the moment that he will NEVER be able to play music again. That he will NEVER be able to accomplish or continue his passion or goals. I swear, everyone acts like Kyousuke is a jerk. He's not. He, like Sayaka, like Homura, and Kyoko (sp?), was hurt and traumatized and lashed out. May I mention again, one time! Kyoko has a sad backstory and actively lets innocent people get hurt to get grief seeds and she's somehow more sympathetic than Kyousuke? Homura straight up prioritize Madoka in literally every situation and is willing to let others die, but she's more sympathetic than Kyousuke? Kyousuke was still in the hospital and was still healing. Physical therapy wasn't going well for him. He was coming to terms that he will never be able to play music again. And he lashed out. Again, Kyousuke doesn't owe Sayaka his feelings. She was a great and dear friend to him. Obviously, that wasn't enough for her but that isn't his fault.
Yeah as a disabled woman I now understand Kyosuke’s pain more than I ever did as an able bodied teenager. I understand what he was feeling now that I’ve lost my mobility, so with the knowledge that Sayaka never tells him what she did, how was he to even know there was something to be thankful for?
I genuinely can’t think about Sayaka’s character/story for more than a minute before I start to tear up. I already lost it a couple minutes the video when showing the clip of Sayaka getting upset over feeling undeserving of a wish because other people need it more, hearing those words is like a bullet through my heart..
Another amazing video as always. Also I forgot how crazy the production value on this anime was. It’s very subtle but the animation style complimented the various sceneries/color schemes we would see throughout.
The style of the characters was somewhat distracting for me at times, but that's just because I haven't watched much true magical girl stuff, where it draws more of that style from. But, it is easy to overlook how gorgeous the anime can be; the soft warm glow while Sayaka ponders her love, the cold contrast when Kyosuke gets the benefits of her wish- they certainly used the color and style for an increased feel
To think that every time Homura creates a new timeline, a new sayaka is born to suffer the same unavoidable fate in each timeline. It really makes it sadder to think about. I’d like to elaborate, but I am sure those who understand time travel and who have seen the anime will get the idea.
I just finished PMMM today and I'm honestly shocked that people hated Sayaka, especially when she's sort of what sold me on watching the show in its entirety. For context, I started the anime about 10 years ago when my friends gave me the classic "just get to the fourth episode" spiel. After reaching this fabled moment that was supposed to set the whole show apart, all I could say was, "That's it? The best part of this anime is that they kill off a magical girl?" It was essentially being touted as "Sailor Moon but the girls die so it's totally dark and, like, for big kids and stuff." That selling point just sounded so hollow and fake-deep that I dropped the series right there. It was only a few days ago when I saw one of your videos briefly mention Sayaka's character arc that I was actually intrigued enough to give the show a proper second chance, and boy, am I glad I did. Suffice to say, it was leaps and bounds better than I'd previously imagined. And maybe I'm backwards for shrugging off what people loved about it and then loving what people shrugged off, but Sayaka genuinely stuck out to me as one of the most relatable, well-written, and thought-provoking side characters in the show, if not in anime as a whole. And since I know I'm not the only one in my friend group who dropped PMMM for the reasons I did, I'll definitely be citing Sayaka's story and your channel as big parts of what changed my mind the next time anime comes up. Thanks a bunch for convincing me!
"Is kindness a form of selfishness? [...] SHE couldn't handle HIS pain anymore. Is this selfless?" Supposedly, this is the problem with altruistic behavior in general: if you do it "for someone else's sake", then you shouldn't be doing it "because it makes you feel good," but then again even if you do it for someone else's sake you do feel good about it precisely because we see kindness as something good and admirable. So how can this be avoided? Ultimately, the fact that we do everything "selfishly" (= "because we feel good about doing it, or at least better than we would if we didn't do it") is not what matters to me when deciding if an action is good or bad, altruistic or selfish, kind or unkind; doing 'what makes us feel good' is simply what humans always do. Rather, what is it that makes us feel good about doing it -- is it the recognition of others? The prestige we'll gain? Or is it the fact that this person will actually be happier, better off in life, because of what we did? If the latter is what makes us feel good, then even though we're still doing it 'in order to feel good', I'd say this is a kind action done for selfless reasons. It's at least the best we humans, wired the way we are and with the brains and emotions we have, can do. So I don't think Sayaka is wrong in wanting to lessen Kyōsuke's pain 'because SHE couldn't handle his pain' (= 'she would feel better if he felt no pain'). I think whenever we decide we have found the right course of action, it is ultimately because it is the one we feel better following. It's... part of what it means to act as a human, to have a set of emotions in your heart that affects you. I think where she was wrong was the lack of acknowledgment of this fact. She herself thought that doing the right thing solely because it is the right thing -- my own personal feelings be damned -- was the true definition of ... nobility perhaps? Or ethical behavior? So she despised that in herself which felt good when she did the right thing, because it would make it seem like she is doing it ultimately for herself; and despising it, she pushed it aside, shoving it into her unconscious, where, as unconscious things are wont to do, it ended up slowly eroding her self-esteem, bit by bit. The logical ending of such a perception -- based on the belief that feeling good about it as at least part of the reason why we do the right thing kind of makes it all selfish and is thus 'wrong' -- is suicide, at least for humans with emotions. She would have to either accept feeling good about it as a valid reason, or then become a robot (like Kyūbē) and do the right thing without feeling anything about it, or... she'd end up killing herself. Noblesse oblige.
Incredible and thorough analysis. Love hearing you touch on aspects of the show people gloss over. Like how their characters contrast and effect the environment they live in.
"(Sayaka was lost) the moment selfishness bonded with selflessness in her contract." My impression is, as I've already said, that Sayaka's problem was not the bond of selfishness to selflessness (which is unavoidable for beings that have emotions and cherish happiness), but her mistaken view that purity was essential -- that there was no excuse for any element of selfishness in an "ally of Justice," so she had to repress her own less-than-pure motives behind the purer ones in order to be able to act... If she had seen the relation between selfishness and selflessness differently, she could have avoided her fate. Her obsession with ethical purity doomed her (to quote Madoka's mother, "yeah, this [kind of situation] happens all the time [...] it's like they stop thinking rationally"). But here, I'm curious. In the final Madoka-Sayaka scene, Madoka says, "[I brought you here] because I wanted to respect your wish. Because it is not meaningless, not worthless"... Why do you think she's saying that? If what's wrong with Sayaka's wish is that it contained selfishness (rather than Sayaka's belief that selfishness and selflessness can have nothing to do with each other, than only pure selflessness is worthy), then why would Madoka say that? Wasn't Sayaka's wish tainted from the start? Yet Madoka says it wasn't... (To me, it seemed that she was saying Sayaka's wish was perfectly fine, selfless and selfish parts alike; Sayaka only had to outgrow her fascination with purity, and accept the success of her wish -- Kyōsuke again making music -- as good, as worthy, purity or no purity. But what is your impression? I'm honestly curious.)
I feel like what you said around 6:44 kinda goes back to what Sayaka said about how her and Madoka are completely ignorant when it comes to any sort of suffering, because going by my own understanding of that point, she doesn't care how the result of her actions affect the people she loves, as long as she can erase her own pain, being selfish doing so. Also, similar to how Mami hated how imperfect she was as a person, Sayaka couldn't live with the weak person she was, leading her to make the wish to change someone's else fate(changing Kyosuke's suffering which would've never ended until his death into happiness while remaining just as he was before he was in the hospital) instead of trying to change herself by making a wish for her own benefit.
i’ve seen madoka twice already, but i really need to watch it again now that my brain is more developed. i think i would be able to see a lot more in the series than i did before.
Sayak Miki probably has the most sad arc. She destroyed herself over something as foolish as a teenage crush. She's actually very relateable though and that makes me enjoy her as a character.
She's exceptionally relatable. I remember being her age and thinking something like that, although more defined and serious, was the entire world. You start to imagine your entire life around it, so it kind of becomes the world to you
I mean you just devalued every relationship people have. Her pain and problems are very real and her arc shows her kind heart and the ultimate pain she deals with.
That's a very oversimplified look as to shat caused her to spiral in despair, as what truly started her downfall was the realization that deep down she is selfish and that she can't live up to her ideals.
Sayaka is probably my favorite character of all time, and i was avoiding watching your videos in general because i didn't wanna alter my feelings in any way towards her, i didn't wanna taint my feelings and mix them with someone else's opinion That being said, after i finally watched this video, i practically agree with everything you said and i also agree that sayaka vs elsa maria is the best scene in the show. It's in fact my favorite scene of all time in all media in general (Strangely enough, a lot of people don't extract the same feeling i do whenever watching it, probably watched 100x+ and still get goosebumps EVERYTIME, decretum is such an insaaaaaane song) I guess we share a lot of similarities in our taste in media Also i finally got around to watching it because im gonna tattoo her grief seed soon, so i stumbled upon the video (already have oktavia's name tattooed) Anyways, amazing video! Gonna be watching more of your analysis from now on!
Miki Sayaka kind of finds out the final secret of the soul gem herself, from her quote "For as much happiness as we wish on one person, we can't help but curse someone else". The meaning behind the words were imply her wishes for Kyosuke is "hope" but for him not for herself. After Kyosuke recovered, he accept Hitomi's confession and become lovers, this makes her filled with resentment and hatred. At the final moment she realize that is how magical girls works, that's why she calmed herself being stupid, stupid enough for falling this trap from QB. With a more realistic interpretation way is she regretted that didn't listen to Mami and her wish was not for herself, Sayaka always admire Mami for her purely justice, and want to follow her path, but she didn't see it clear enough that Mami and her were never the same, Mami wish for herself, she fulfilled the desire first, so that she can start given hopes to others, although Mami don't really have another choice when making the wish, but the point still stand, she wish for herself but Sayaka didn't.
As a representation of the "Karmic Balance" of the Madoka Magica world, there's nothing better than Sayaka's story. The refuse to realize, leading to acceptance, that she goes through with regards to it is downright amazing. And, with Mami it also gives us one of the best uses of a mentor's death, which is so often just a motivational trope
I'm still in the middle of the video (I love it so far btw), but I kinda wanted to tackle the whole Kyouske basically throwing Sayaka away once he's healthy. (Or Kyousuke in general, I guess?) So, in other media, namely Madoka Magica Portable, we can see that he didn't forget nor he stopped caring about her, as he visits her in one of Sayaka's Bad Ending, as well as there's a SPOILER (moment where Hitomi intends to confess, but once Madoka appears asking for Sayaka, visibly very worried they both put it on hold to help searching for her) END OF SPOILER And here I go, another SPOILER there is at some point a moment (unless it was in a differend PMMM game? It's been a while) where Kyousuke's about to commit unaliving which kinda gives you a bit more perspective regarding his state, aka it was already that bad END OF SPOILER Now, if I remember correctly he was also searching for her in The Different Story (manga), to give her at least a small gift for being with him through all this. I might be wrong about it happening in TDS, but I'm pretty confident it happened at least Somewhere. It took some time, because his life basically changed overnight, too, and it's understandable that he'd need some time to adjust first
This earned a sub, I haven't enjoyed such a deep dive into a character in a while; community discussion around her usually falls back to an echo chamber of people calling her stupid for falling the way she did or calling her a bad friend etc etc. This is the first time I feel like her actions were interpreted "correctly" (which I put in quotes because it is all a matter of opinion I guess). I'll be checking out your other vids on the MadoMagi cast for sure :)
He is not an unsympathetic character honestly. It is totally understandable that what happenned to him can make him lash out. When people are not ok, you cannot expect them to act normally. His life dream was ruined, and while he likes the old days they are also painful. He can feel a mix of good and bad emotions when he listens to that music and anything can happen during that time. And also... the crush.I mean hell, yes sayaka was always there for him but in the end, sayaka had to express her feelings, and she didn't. You can't expect someone to understand you are doing things like the fact you want a relationship out of them. I am running left and right to help people i know and love that are in pain but that doesn't mean i want to be in any romantic relationship with most of them. He appreciates the help but he just can't read that from a person that was there, and he doesn't know and will never know the sacrifice she made for him. The sacrifice she made now doesn't have any meaning, because she didn't try to get out of her shell for that. She just tried to help him. I don't remember if we see him in sayaka's funeral, but we don't know how he felt about that. He could have been devastated as well. He knew her a lot. Calling him unsympathetic because the kid had what basically amounts to SEVERE TRAUMA, and because he can't read minds, no, just... no
though it was a good video , just a little note that might just be me but I felt the text for each portion of the essay was hard to read against the background you chose. other wise still great video. in anime id like you to cover id go with either silver spoon or the garden of sinners
Yeah, that was definitely my mistake. I knew what the words were, so my brain didn't have to read them and figured it was fine, there definitely should have been some outline on the text. I will slightly defend myself because that transition is a copy of one in episode 9 where Sayaka turns into a witch, but I still added text that wasn't meant to be overtop of that background, so still on me. But, thank you, I appreciate the feedback and am happy to see you enjoyed the video outside of that : ) I haven't seen either of those, but a quick look on MAL confirms, that is in fact quite the contrast lol. I might give the Garden of Sinners a go sometime, it seems like something I may enjoy
@@ProfessorViral I recommended those two because despite the fact they are VERY different story wise , the theme of finding oneself and what to do after your have connects them both. also recency bias is playing HUGE part in the recommendation for garden of sinners and im going through it for the first time at the moment (through a translation of the original novels I later learned is hated by the fans of the anime somewhat, sure it definitely could have done with proofreading but otherwise fine for someone without knowledge of the story ,though I do have an understanding of the most of the rest of the fate portion of the nasuverse.) reading part 5 right now and stuff is going down. this however is not to disregard silver spoon entirely as I believe to be some of the best 22 episodes in anime at least for me trumping fma easily for me( with regards to brotherhood , 2003 is somehow always intrigued me more)sadly the manga for silver spoon was "slightly" rushed due external circumstances somewhat and thus in a comparison of both fma and 銀の匙’s manga versions fma will win out but if a-1 picks up 銀の匙 as an anime again and gives it some buffer and maybe input from arakawa it will easily trump both brotherhood and 03(03 ftw). looking forward to reread garden of sinners as soon as im done with it. then continue with my descent into the monogatari lns. any way thanks for taking in the criticism about the video. still great video
And this is why everyone should make sure their relationships are balanced lol. Or that you're being kind for the right reasons, and not because you want to get something out of it. Otherwise you'll just develop resentment when a relationship is one sided.
This video taught me a lot about myself, more than it did about Sayaka. I’ve always related very heavily to Sayaka, even to a delusional extent. I use her sorrows as analogs/examples to help navigate my own, I see my flaws reflected in her character, I see her in myself and I see myself in her. Your analysis of her magical girl mental gymnastics and cracked me open like a book and forced me to realize things about my own beliefs and motivations that I was afraid to confront on my own. Her ever spiraling view of justice, the paradox of her empathy and wish, her worldview becoming tainted as a result of her refusal to change, that all shook me to my core and opened my eyes further to the beauty of her characterization, as well as the uglier parts of my own mind. Each ‘movement’ impacted me in a very real way and I applaud you for that. This is one of the most jarring and realistic takes I’ve seen on this series so far, keep up the good work!
Thank you for the kind words, I'm glad the video was able to help in that way. Honestly, it has those qualities because it was the same thing for me. When I started looking at her character, I had to look at myself in all those same ways. I sometimes joke that the channel is me "working through my issues with anime," and this one was very much that
Madoka magica is my go to recommendation for new anime fans. It occupies a similar space in the pantheon of good anime, to me at least, as something like NGE. It's approachable, creative, gorgeous, and tells a human story. 10/10 perfect anime.
Rewatching this again because, I guess I enjoy putting myself through the trauma of bawling my eyes out as I re-live Sayaka's tragic story (cried about 4 times the first time I watched this btw, the mere sight of Sayaka during certain scenes is all it takes...) What I wanted to say though is regarding the statement around 6:40 "Is helping someone who's in pain because it also causes you pain, really for that person? Or because you want to feel better too?" My counter-argument would simply be "isn't that just the definition of empathy?". In other words, if we extend this idea of a selfless for selfish reasons beyond the example of Sayaka's wish, it starts to fall apart more. If I am an empathetic person, I might help someone in need because I feel really bad for them and the situation they're in. Am I selfish for helping them on the basis that I felt some of their pain? Or... are my actions just guided by my empathy? In my opinion, it's not about how thought out a person's _reasons_ are for helping another, or about how confident they are about the "true intentions" behind their acts of selflessness (I think Mami's warning about being certain of "true intentions" before wishing for another person, has erroneously caused a lot of focus to be placed on whether Sayaka herself was certain of her intentions or not before wishing, rather than looking more broadly at Sayaka's morals and beliefs throughout the show). In reality I believe it comes down to empathy itself- the simple presence of empathy indicates a deeply rooted and inherent trait of selflessness. The very definition of "empathy" is "the ability to feel/share other people's feelings, including pain". It's unlikely that a selfish person is going to dwell on trying to empathise with another's pain, given that the very implication of the word "selfish" is to place greater importance on your own wellbeing, pleasure, joy etc, than other people's. Essentially, the simple fact that Sayaka appears to be one of the biggest empaths in the entire show is indicative of profound selflessness. Hell, she gets full on revolted when questioning why SHE is the lucky one who gets a wish rather than any of the other millions of people who need it more than her, she's so upset and distraught by this fact alone. Idk about you, whoever reads this, but this to me sounds like someone is deeply empathetic and selfless. Getting angry and upset when you are presented with the ability to wish for _anything_ just because you feel others deserve it more? I can't think of any better way to demonstrate to an audience that "this character has a pure heart and lives to spread kindness". Last note: if anything, I think the huge deal Mami makes when giving Sayaka shit for even _asking_ about using a wish on someone else, probably did more to fuck with Sayaka's psyche than any good it could have done. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Sayaka's intentions were pure from the start when wanting to help Kyosuke, but Mami actually caused an avalanche of self-doubt and uncertainty to erupt within Sayaka, leading to her wish being marked and tarnished where it originally was spawned out of simple, pure and innocent, _empathy._
Dude, you did a phenomonal job on this video I've never watched any anime's in my life but recently I decided to look into Madoka Magica after one of my friends recommended it to me. I stumbled across this video and you have me hooked! This weekend I'll definitely watch this series. That aside, your editing and music choices compliment what your talking about so well, I can only dream of being able to make "video essays" like these. Great job on this video and I hope UA-cam takes you somewhere far in the future.
Thank you, seeing nice comments like these really does mean a lot : ) Sometimes making these is tough, but if you have something your passionate about, I always say to go for it. It's no guarantee, but doing it changed my life for the better, and I wouldn't trade that for much else
@@ProfessorViral the original story is pretty dark and really sad but sends a realistic message depending how you see the ending in 3 different ways. And I think that's why I find it fascinating bcuz it makes me think deeper while looking at the story really closely.
@@ProfessorViral Well, her story is nothing like the Disney version, but rather the original tale by Hans Christian Andersen, which can easily be found online. It's a fairly short story (it couldn't possibly take more than half an hour to read), so I recommend it. Considering that Sayaka's witch form is a mermaid, I'm pretty sure that the similarities are completely intentional.
I went into the show knowing all that there was to know about it (otherwise I wouldn't have watched it). And I expected her to be my favorite. In the end, I think Mami ended up being my favorite character. But doggone if this whole character arc isn't gonna haunt me. You raise a good point about relieving others' pain because you personally can't stand it. It's probably a more common motivation than a lot of people would expect. I'm certain I've fallen into that trap on more than one occasion. If we can call it a trap, it's perhaps too tangled in philosophy and interpretation to really say for sure. And going back to the show, that's probably why the tragedy is even more potent- she was wrong. But she was also right. It's all a big mess and she couldn't handle it.
I can definitely see it being a common motivation, at least more than people know. It's one of those things most people wouldn't question. I can't blame anyone for that, given usually it results in a positive outcome and helped someone else. It's like a curse with philosophical thought, that even kindness can come into question. But, there can be a resolution where someone acknowledges their kindness as selfish, and still does it anyway because it leads to a good result. But, I guess all this ramble really says is, it is very much tangled in philosophy and interpretation, so it is hard to say haha
@@IchibanOjousama So is every character besides Madoka, and you could even say that she is to some extent, wanting to relieve the pain of everyone else because it gave her the chance to do something good. That's the point of this series, showing us real people who make mistakes and have human motivations rather than seemingly perfect characters embodying love and friendship. You are right that Mami is selfish, she herself admits this, that Madoka needs a better role model. That is because like all of these girls, Mami is human. She is selfish and she is flawed. She does care about others, mostly continuing her lonely life protecting others due to the guilt she feels of using her wish to save herself, a fact that ironically protects her from suffering the fate most magical girls face, one of a witch, instead dying in combat due to her own over confidence. The biggest thing that makes Mami selfish of course is when she takes Madoka and Sayaka under her wing, attempting to make them magical girls even when she knows how easy it is to die, how the gripping lonelyness terrified her to her very core, something she would willingly inflict on girls younger than her in her selfish wish not to be alone. Mami is a person, one who is flawed and selfish, but she isn't a bad person.
Sayaka is my favorite character is madoka magica her personality to her choices and lore was done so well I applause gen urobuchi. She has one of the most memorable death of anime characters and definitely a magical girl. Well written believable outcome of her choices and that how life is sometimes you don't always get go back and tell people the moral to your. Sometimes it already too late and you realize you we,re stupid so stupid as your sum of life crashes down.
i hated sayaka but probably cause i was so much like her, but without a boy and magic. Im a bit of a religious person, since kid i learn about altruism and charity, i always felt like my time was running away and i needed to do good things to not atract bad karma, i always feared pain and i was horrifield with the possibility to go to ''hell'' and sufer forever cause i spent my life with nothing realy good, so i always tried to do good things and what was right, but inside there was a feeling of hate and revenge, the way people acted didn't make sense, they say something but did other, i was surrounded of hypocrisy before i even understand what it was, i always felt that i was the only one doing what i was told, following the rules, doing the right and sacrificing myself for others that treated me like trash, always letting things pass and suppressing the bad stuff inside, cause i thought something good would come for me, that for pretending so much the bad feelings would just go away, in a sense that I would just learn and become genuinely good inside like i pretended I was outside, and for it all i just didn't want to suffer, and that someone would like me, since my relationship with ppl were always terrible. That's the part where i feel most relatable to Sayaka, i acted good hopping ppl would like me, and always i sacrificed myself for someone just to watch them leave like i didn't exist i felt terrible, i felt that I sacrificed something for nothing and couldn't handle it, but i couldnt just stop acting like that cause not being nice was against the ''rules'', the price of being good was much more that i could handle, while all i wanted was to not suffer that was just what was happening, i feared hell and my life become one. took time to see why i was suffering, at some point i started doing ''good'' stuff for fear, for a need to have attention, to be loved, to feel i was right, but i felt i was giving a gold coin and receiving a slap on the face, if i gave everything to others cause someone said i should why couldnt this person just give me something too? i was just shoving the responsibilities for my actions and expectations to the others, ones that i cant control.
I wish the anime actually instilled the ideas in this video through Sayaka's own lines. What the anime seemed to be doing (on the surface at least) is push the "Oh no, I'm a zombie now, how will Kyosuke ever love me?" idea. And that made her seem quite immature and illogical. But the analysis here makes much more sense: Sayaka's despair-trigger is her realizing gradually that her wish might not have been such a good idea, constantly trying to find justification for being a magical girl and eventually finding less and less, until she stops trying. Knowing she'd become a witch once she gives up would hasten her process even more; maybe Kyubey should have just divulged it to her.
I would love to see a crossover featuring Sayaka Miki and Transformers: Prime post-Predacons Rising Megatron. They both made a deal that essentially sold their soul- Sayaka to Kyubey, Megatron to Dark Energon/Unicron-and both become essentially living, reanimated corpses. The difference being that Sayaka made a contract to help and save people. Megatron injected his Spark with Dark Energon to conquer a world and win a war. A suggestion for the fans!
I love all the characters in this show. But my god…I NEVER THOUGHT OF HER KILLING THOSE GUYS ON THE TRAIN!!! Because it cuts I thought she just told them off and fell deeper into despair…O_O That adds just, another layer to those scenes.
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Sayaka is probably the most relatable character of Madoka.
She always was for me, both when I first watched it years ago, and now
She is the Boromir of Madoka.
All of them :( Mami with her constant suffering which she keeps to herself. Homura with her extreme love and empathy which is interesting to see in it’s limits and colours. The same with the others each one had traits that were so real it hurts
Seriously
💯
Sayaka ended up becoming my favourite character in the anime. Her character arc is sad but also my favourite kind of character arc
Same here. I love when a character has some grey area to their reasoning. She helped someone else, but was it really for them? Details like that give them so much depth
its the only relatable character arc tbh, its simple enough for us mere humans to relate to: simply being below average. rest are like way too flashy and complicated and a bit unrealistic. thats wh i thikn atleast
indeed
@@ProfessorViral I think it's more about her being shown as a complex human being as we all are, not so much gray areas. She's not just the tomboy, or the love sick teenager, she's much more than that, and we get to see that play out over the series, even after she dies in the reality we are part of, and homura's telling of the other time lines, and the Wraiths time line. Sayaka is the cautionary tale that we all learn as we grow up, be careful what you wish for. I think that's what makes her best girl in my eyes. How many times have we growing up said that same lien; "I was stupid, so stupid."
I disagree that the boy is an unsympathetic character - he's so deeply isolated in his tragedy that he cannot be expected to show grace towards people around him, until his situation is miraculously changed and he's tasting back his life - with all the seemingly lost future rushing back to him.
We shouldn't fault him for not being omniscient or a mind reader - even if the situation is tragic.
I personally am completely baffled as to how he can claim that he's an unlikable character. The most he even was for me was uninteresting, but his behavior makes complete sense given his situation and I can't really fault him for that.
Yeah I don't understand that either. Dude is depressed because he lost the ability to pursue his goal and passion in an accident. How is that unsympathetic?
Nah fam he
Naw fuck kyosuke
Nigga was ungrateful to the ONLY person who showed him that she cared about him for him and not his talent,and also he immediately dropped her for for hitomi. Also FUCK Hitomi. If I were Sayaka I would've let her die when she fell under the witches influence
You know, in the Madoka Mágica Anthology Manga, there is a chapter? dedicated to Kyouske, where he actually recognizes and values Sayaka, but chooses Hitomi because he can see the latter as an equal.
He feels he is unworthy of Sayaka, which honestly makes this all the more tragic. I don't think the Anthology has any canonicity, but I still want to point it out
Oh god, given he would have no idea of what happens to her based on that choice, it really does make it more tragic. I should check out the additional media for MM sometimes, I know I'll be checking out rebellion again sometime soon at least. I only saw it once years ago, so I forgot most of the specifics
I think that makes kyoskey a bit more human though in the show he doesnt even show up to her funeral which for a person who though so highly of her seems like such a off thing to do
While tragic I still see this as selfish. He is only thinking about what he feels, its obvious he knows how Sayaka feels but still decides for her by saying oh no no I don't deserve you so I'll go with Hitomi your friend
@@nyx.2314 thats fucked yo. Like boss up then dude. Be one she deserves.
I want this to be canon it would make the guy actually tragic and makes Sayaka's decision even more sad
This video really is just how I feel huh.
I’m a very empathetic person. I feel what others are feeling. So I don’t like people to be sad, because **i** don’t like to be sad. And I often struggle with the selfish part of me.
I want to be liked. And I do things for other people to *be* liked. Not for them to be better but for my personal benefit. And I hate that part of myself. I feel guilty for feeling this way. It’s hard to believe I’m a good person when my thoughts are different from my actions. Everyone thinks I’m a good person because they don’t know my thoughts. They don’t know how selfish they are.
This is why I love Sayaka. She’s the same age as me and has the same problems as me. We’re objectively good people, but deep down, we’re the most selfish people you’ll ever meet.
The series is 10 years old, and yet here we are, with new interpretations of the series and its characters. That's what you call a great series in almost every way.
1000%. As someone who's successful on the back of other's stories, I'm eternally grateful that series like this exist haha
@@ProfessorViral yours is a good analysis of the characters. Positive, but not at the point of fanboyism.
Hi! In Rebellion, during the transformation into a witch, Homura says something to the effect of - "I cannot even remember anything, and all I can remember is overwhelming grief..."
It makes sense then, that when Sayaka was turning into a witch, she would say that she does not remember what was ever worth fighting for in the first place.
As a witch, you seem to gain amnesia, which would explain why Octavia was unable to be turned back into a human.
i get what ur saying but i dont think they completely forget their memories once they turn to witches. they might even still have consciousness based on rebellion where homura was still talking even as a witch (when she kept telling them to stop trying to save her)
@@BJZRE bro this show got me on shit
In the manga, Kazumi magica. The Pleiades are attempting to turn their friend Michiru back to a human from a witch. And yet she keeps rejecting it. The only stable clone they had, was Kazumi. Who didn't have Michirus memories. And another peculiar thing is about how when Umika and Kaoru were close to witching, Michiru, who was a grief seed at the time, seemed to act up to get Kazumis attention so they could save their friends.
Kazumi magica is filled with so much, I adore it.
Witches are transformed from Soul Gems, which would mean that they are the remnants of a Magical Girl's soul that became corrupted and blackened from negative emotions and trauma.
When a Magical Girl becomes a Witch, they become an entirely different being. Hence, they are "reborn" in a sense and don't retain memories. They retain the essence of the Magical Girl that they were born from, but they don't have a sense of self or identity. They're a husk that causes pain and grief, but doesn't know or understand who or what they are.
A contradiction is that we see sayaka's memories on full display in Octavia's labyrinth when madoka and kyoki re enter
I think part of the reason why she punishes herself and spirals is because she hates herself for having selfish desires and originally suppresses them, and then feels the need to hurt herself as punishment for mistakes she only blames herself for in the end. Which is partially what makes her so tragic. She wants to be this noble hero that in the real world doesn’t exist, but when she comes face to face with the cruelty of how the world really works, and the darkness inside her own self, she can’t handle it because her entire world view and personality is shattered in front of her. Being simply kind wasn’t enough. Which honestly, is completely understandable. It’s natural to want to be acknowledged for good action, to have rewards for good behavior, but she can’t stand when she realizes she wants this in herself, so she spirals in a fit of self destruction and rage. She hates herself and she hates the world for making her this way. She has no real self love or acceptance which is her ultimate weakness. She placed her entire value on what she could do for others, without acknowledging her own true feelings and broke when she realizes the ideals she believed in with every ounce of her being are fiction. So in the end, she goes to the grave mindlessly pursing her original goal even if it makes her utterly miserable because if she did anything else it would be a direct betrayal to what she once said she believed in...
I also think in her relationship with Kyousuke, if she had the confidence to confess her feelings to him things could have turned out differently, but she felt ashamed of the fact she was a ‘zombie’ and did not feel that he could love her this way. She lets Kyousuke go, because it’s the ‘right thing to do’, again living by her altruistic ideals, and plays the part of the hero, but she does have selfish intentions. She does want to be with him, and she can’t stand that about herself. She hates herself for being jealous of Hitomi and having a thought of wishing she had let her die, because a hero isn’t supposed to think things like that, right? In the end, she destroys herself because she can’t stand who she’s become which is just so utterly sad. Her feelings were natural and normal and she crucified herself for simply being human.
In the PSP game, there's an alternate route where Homura convinces Sayaka to confess her feelings and becoming a magical girl to Kyosuke, it's really wholesome and she learns to accept her selfish desires rather than feel guilty over them. It's super wholesome and definitely recommend you check it out
I love Sayaka so much while many consider her the worst character of the main girls. Ironically I think it´s because she is the most human and most realistic, acting like a mirror in showing us the ugly truth we dont want to see. We all want to be strong and good and ideallistic but most would crumble just like her and things that seem silly and simple to outsiders like heartbreak feel like the end of the world to us. Really amazing video!
Thank you : D I'd agree she is the most human of them all, so a dislike of her can definitely be a rejection of that truth that is somewhat ugly. I guess for me, she's my favorite because I focus on those negative aspects, as a way to try and avoid them myself
I don't get the idiots who hate on Sayaka
being excuse doesnt excuse her actions or make it normal. You are right , its realistic because in real life you have people who act like that , who doesnt want to improve. yOU HAVE PEOPLE WHO are so stuck in their own desilussions that they make themselve miserables and other people miserable. She is a perfect exemple of some bad people and the character is great because its show you the path to not follow . You cant glorify this character
I kinda get why she's so unlikable. She's a teenager who doesn't quite understand how complicated and difficult things can be, especially when you're taking a situation out of someone else's hands.
She acted selfishly and made a wish thinking that it would get her some kind of reward or happy ending, but in reality, it only brought her misery when she realized that in the end, she couldn't get what she wanted.
Sayaka had good intentions, but rather bad understanding about what road those intentions would lead her down.
Mami had warned her that she really needed to reflect on who Sayaka was really making a wish for: Herself, or for Kyousuke.
She was making the wish for herself because she didn't want to see Kyousuke in pain, but she also thought that she would get her real wish: To be with him.
However, she has a rather rigid mindset and doesn't realize that she would never be with Kyousuke because after becoming a magical girl, you basically die. You stop aging and your body and soul are separated.
That's part of what really breaks Sayaka.
Sayaka is my favorite character and I definitely understand having good intentions that ultimately lead you to hell. I think everyone can understand that.
Lmfao if I’m anything I’d say I’m that evil cat 😂
I honestly see Sayakas story arch as a kin to the little mermaid.. It almost mirrors the story completely acceptance instead of sacrificing a voice she sacrificed her body
Seeing as how Sayaka's witch form is a mermaid, this ain't a coincidence
@@TheWickedWizardOfOz1 true that, tbh I didn't notice the mermaid tail till this and other youtube videos, I couldn't see it on my screen
Sayaka’s arc can be interpreted in many ways I feel. It could be about the balance of karma, it could be about growing up, to me it’s about a downward spiral into depression. A spiral that feels so real and scary it’s actually a bit relatable, especially to someone like myself.
Sayaka may have had good intentions but her true desire was a selfish one deep down, and to have it taken away from her, all she felt was anger, hatred, and despair. Taking it out on everyone she knew and most of all, herself. She wasn’t stupid... she was just a kid.
That is why Sayaka Miki is my favorite character of all time... 😌
(Also, the writers confirmed that she didn’t kill the two men on the train. However she actually did in the manga adaptation)
The facts of her situation are definitely a near 1:1 for a spiral of depression. I think all the meanings of her story stem from that framing. It's showing us a sad story, and then giving the chance for us to think about how it became sad. I definitely relate too much to it as well. I think the fact they're so young is perfect here, because she is just a child, being punished as if she was an adult privy to the secrets of a world she doesn't even live in
One of the themes I see in Madoka is the inability to see how hardships can help you later on. Hardships teach us to avoid future failures, help us to learn lessons we can only learn through failing. Sayaka’s wish, and even Homura’s as well, were based on the inability to see a way to work THROUGH the hardship because it hurt too much in the moment. They’re basically looking for immediate and quick gratification, rather than being able to understand that holding out would make for a stronger character and will at the end of it
It's honestly a really true depiction of despair.
I think it's a double play honestly. Like, a lot of kids will scream through their TV that there are other ways but those kids might feel just as hopeless as Homura and Sayaka and not see that in their own situations. It's like a "gotcha" for kids who might feel similar to work out. I mean some will get all Patrick Star about it, but others will have a "oh! Ya got me!" Moment.
@@BlackWizardClub precisely, hindsight is 20/20
Poor Sayaka. The show did an amazing job of portraying that devastating self hatred one feels when you realize most of your motivations are selfish in nature- and then the self destruction that tends to follow. This was a brilliant video essay!
Thank you : ) I think that deconstruction of selfishness is what drew me to Sayaka’s character, and I often frame my own actions as selfish, deserved or not, so I had to dig deeper into it in this anime
@@ProfessorViral totally agree! Each character in Madoka is so cruelly relatable. When I first watched this back in 2011 and was a young girl myself, this anime despite the magic felt so unbelievably relatable, especially Sayaka.
Sayaka's story is really the one that hurts the most imo, her death really gave me chills and her descent to inhumanity
Her death/transformation into a witch is one of the scenes I could watch 100 times and still enjoy
Her character and this show in general made me feel a type of "dirty" sadness. It felt murky, tainted, stained, and dull. Idk why though :/
I think that's the intentional feeling. The way she naturally became sad, but then fed it with her own actions and denied it makes it very "grey" compared to what most anime would do
i dont really get why sayaka gets hate ,shes one of the most human characters in anime. shes definitely my favourite
I always see her ranked behind the others, but she's my favorite for sure. I guess it just shows how strong of an anime it is!
@@ProfessorViral WOW! thanks for the response!! i totally agreee with you !
And one we got to follow till the end of the road, while Mami's road was cut well short of the final destination
I think she gets hate "because" she's the most human. Humans fuck up, a lot, way more than an idealized fictional character tends to, and we often hate on each other because of that. So i think it makes sense people would hate the most "human" character.
I dislike the part when she was a real jerk to both madoka and homura. And in all timelines no matter what approach homura took sayaka was untrusting of her and even villianize her. Would you rather trust a talking animal or a time controlling magical girl.
She already knows how much suffering being a magical girl is and yet tells madoka to either share her burden, do the fighting for her or piss off. Yeah no, that sounded so toxic its not something you can just say to someone you care about.
She has these unreal standards she hold everyone to but even she herself couldn't keep to it. She would verbally lash out at homura who just saved everyone for taking Charlotte's grief seed. Then complain to kyuubey other magical girls just want to kill witches for grief seeds.
Sayaka might be the combination of all the human qualities I don't want to see in a person. And that's why I dislike her. Exactly the kind of person I avoid making friends with.
I relate to Sayaka in a very scary and frustrating way.
I had a span of 3 years where I related to her hard. That's also when I watched the anime, so it probably helped her to be my favorite
Something that's caught my attention during this video is how similar Sayaka and Kyouske are in their suffering. We see only fragments of him as a character, and while he's not 'sympathetic', he's not the character we're supposed to sympathise with- but that doesn't make him beyond sympathy in of itself. If you just isolate Sayaka's behaviour at the very end of her arc, we'd probably have as much distaste for her actions towards others as we would with how Kyouske treats her. Her anger is unpleasant and directionless and it's hard to watch, but we've seen what she's been through, what she wanted (and what she really wanted) and we wanted that for her too, because she's our girl, and then we saw her lose it all and we grieved with her. But Kyouske doesn't have the same relevance to us. And I think that's just the message of their characters side by side-- grief and trauma is often ugly and unsightly and people deserve our understanding, even if we can't accept their behaviour.
When sayaka beats her self up for not living up to the ideal image mami sets... I felt that .
I've always love the tragic story of Sayaka. A true sacrifice that didn't do anything more than bring pain to a lot of people and how, and, at the end, even when Madoka tried to gave her the opportunity to start again, she didn't regret her sacrifice, making her last sacrifice for Kiosuke, this time making it for his happines, not for her own.
Amazing video as always, amazing analysis and writing.
¡Thank you so much!
I don't think Kyousuke is unsympathetic. Just like with everyone else's story lines there's a lot going on. You can actually kinda see him as a bit of a micro of Homura (and Sayaka). When you lose everything you get lost in that loss, when you can get that back you get lost in having it back.
He didn't owe Sayaka a return on that emotion, but it's hinted he did return it. Hitomi even saw that and gave her an opening which, just like a grief seed, she refused. Kyousuke was not obligated to chase her and since she did not come for him when he was healed he did was most kids would do and assumed she had enough and he missed his chance. Instead of having to dwell in it though, Hitomi showed up 🤷🏾♂️
Perfectly worded. I don't get the hate for Kyosuke and Hitomi. Hitomi clearly cares about Sayaka, and Kyosuke does too. It's not necessarily that Kyosuke doesn't want to do anything for Sayaka, more so that he can't and Sayaka is incredibly stubborn.
The philosophy of when kindness and selflessness crosses into selfishness is the kind of stressful paradox thinking that always got under my skin, especially with my foster parents. It's this notion that it is impossible to not be selfish and greedy 24/7 and thus one is always a bad person, but then it makes you wonder when it's possible to be a good person or if selflessness is actually possible. I've been told by such people that my kind are incapable of it, so who knows for sure, I just know it's a philosophy that has always haunted me and that it's something Sayaka embodies and that maybe this is why I'm so iffy on her and why I wonder if Madoka's desire to do the right thing is in turn the most selfish act of them all.
Finally someone gets me
@@craigpeoples9883 You aren't alone. It sucks and I hope it isn't something that causes you too much distres sin your life lol.
@@jilliancrawford7577Nah I got over it
I think you nailed with the last sentence. Overall, though, there is no good and evil. There are people with their own motivations and worldviews just living their lives. Some are more altruistic, some are less. It's all grey.
I'm so glad that someone else sees that Sayaka is a good and likeable character.
Hey, I'm happy to make the case haha
When I watch a show, sometimes I think “what would I have done if I was in that world?” And Sayaka’s character followed my thoughts eerily closely. Her dreams, hopes, and flaws were so real and so was her downfall.
She holds a dear part in my heart.
At her age, and in her situation, I would have made the same wish. That's why I love her story so much, it's given me a medium to reflect on myself in a way only a story could make me think of
I watched Madoka Magica when it came out in 2011, I was 11, and just starting anime. I’m 21 now, about to turn 22, and no anime has ever held a greater spot in my heart than this one. Madoka Magica is criminally underrated and yet, I am happy it is seemingly a forgotten hidden gem. Sayaka and Kyoko have always been my favorites, and I also feel these two (alongside Mami) get overshadowed so much by Madoka and Homura. Obviously I understand why it’s the case, but I always appreciate those who also took the time to appreciate the importance and complexities of the other girls, who endured just as much pain and suffering - Sayaka especially. Wonderful video man.
Thank you; as someone who covers a lot of more niche things, I'm happy to see there are people out there who appreciate the same things : ) This was one of my first anime, making Sayaka one of my first favorite characters, so it's always held a soft spot for me as well
the saddest part in all of this is that sayaka was too focused in her ideals to see the reality of the world , because unlike the previous magical girl shows where girls like sayaka have the same ideals they get rewarded for it , but sayaka on the other hand got nothing in return , which is what made her fate tragic .
Madoka Magika still breaks me everytime I rewatch it, even 11 years later
Same here, I always go back to watch clips while writing, double checking myself, and end up watching half an episode, just falling into its emotional pull
Her tragic end made me almost rage quit the show... I related to her so much and seeing her "friend" Hitomi just backstab her like that made my blood boil.
Also Kyousuke... idc if he was sad and depressed, Sayaka was the only consistent support he had and he just forgot her?!?!
Except Hitomi didn't backstab Sayaka. In episode 7 she told Sayaka she had feelings for Kyousuke and said that Sayaka had the right to go after Kyousuke first because she had known the guy longer. It wasn't just sadness and depression; he had basically lost his entire future and not only would he never walk right again his hands would be messed up permanently. Also, he didn't forget her considering he literally said her name in the last episode.
@@animeman8203 still find it selfish fromboth parts... you see a friend pour her life and free time into caring for someone and the moment they are cured she swooped and and told her she was gonna fight for him??? She backstabbed her...
And Kyousuke is extremely ungrateful to her, he only thought about his feelings I remember someone mention how he felt inferior to her so he decided to choose Hitomi as he sees her as an equal. He did that without regarding Sayaka's feeling thinking he knew better for BOTH of them.
People are bitches like Midori so that much is realistic. Also Kyousuke's ungratefulness
@@animeman8203 yes she is
@@animeman8203 Hitomi only pounced on the chance to go after Kyosuke after he got better and left the hospital, yet she wasn't around to support him at all when he was at his low point. I'd call that a major backstab.
You are too hard on Kyosuke honestly. Boy is going through the worst time of his life where the thing he loves doing more than anything is taken away from him and wont ever come back.
It's so bad that his arm can't even feel any pain and the doctors stright up tell him to give up.
Calling him a "brat who doesn't get what he wants" is so not fair to him, honestly I would lash out too if I was in his shoes and it's not fair to hold something like that against a human reaction.
Especially since he apologized for his behavior afterwards.
One thing I find interesting is the parallel between Sayaka and Homura. Both girl's wishes are motivated by wating to save someone they love, both fall to despair at least in part because they can't be with that person, and both stories raise questions of whether they truly love that person or just want to possess them.
Sayaka is aware that her motives may not have been purely altruistic, and that troubles her throughout the show. This is why she gets so angry when Kyoko suggests she force Kyosuke to love her. Contrast this with Homura, who never questions her own motives or methods. However, unlike Homura, Sayaka redeems herself when she accepts her death and reaffirms her wish. This shows that she genuinely wants her friends to be happy even if she can't be with them.
Homura faces a similar these at the end of the Rebellion movie, but ultimatly places her desire to possess Madoka above Madoka's wishes. Fans can disagree over whether Homura's new world was "better" in a practical sense, but her reasons are unquestionably wrong, as even Homura admits.
I really hope these parallels get explored further now that they're finally making the next movie and that Homura eventually gets a chance at redemption.
I disagree that the boy was unlikable. As someone who tends to lash out sometimes due to my own mental issues, I can tell you that neither of them were in a situation to understand what he was going through and how to approach it. So, the problem never gets brought up in a healthy way or addressed in a healthy way either. Hitomi crossed the line though, she's the unlikable one imo 🗿
He did genuinely love the music and was happy when they listened to it together. What you’re talking about is a moment where he couldn’t properly process his sheer frustration and anger at his situation and lashed out in anger at her because the music right that second was just a cruel reminder of his fate.
Was what he did okay? No, but he’s a kid put in a very traumatic situation. He’s reacting in a very understandable way.
Maybe if he would have been a very angry or mean or spoiled kid from the start then you’d have every right to see him as unsympathetic, but we saw who he really is. When he lashed out it was shortly after PT, he just went through a really painful process where in his mind it was emphasized that he’d never be able to play his instrument again. He is a very hurt kid who doesn’t have the tools he needs to process that in a healthy way. But in one way you’re right. He’s likely very well off just like the main group, he likely never had to face a life changing tragedy before.
The boy needs psychological therapy along with the physical therapy.
"He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you."
- Friedrich Nietzsche, "Beyond Good and Evil", 1886
Sayaka is literally this incarnated
I love Sayaka's character. She truly is the "best girl". I was at a identic situation to her's in the past, also at basicaly the same age, so I resonate a lot with her and kinda understand her struggle.
OK. While I mostly agree here? One huge thing that I think a lot of fans forget when it comes to koysuke is *he deliberately and intentionally hurts himself and openly lements how he's useless without the ability to play music.*
He keeps hearing people talk about how he's a prodigy and was destined for greatness. Not to mention he comes from a rich family that likely had high expectations for him and his music carrer. Now he can't do that and probably feels like he's a failure and at something he loved to do. Listening isn't enough because it was something he loved doing and was really good at.
It honestly wouldn't surprise me if he started more severe self-harm or requesting to have his hand amputated so he won't have to deal with an all but actual dead hand. *Sayaka was trying to prevent that*
If there's one mistake I've made that's become clear to me over time (from people rightful disagreeing) it's being too hard on Kyosuke here, because I was so focused on Sayaka. I still dislike him, but I would definitely write things less harsh now
@@ProfessorViral
That's fair. I still venomitly loath Homura for her conscious choice to screw over all magical girls to get her happy ending but I can understand why they like her. There's a reason the quiet, mysterious, brooding, ect types are so popular
Sayaka showing everyone the power of love isn’t always a good thing.
I'm surprised how many others there are who relate to Sayaka the same way I do. She always felt like a dark mirtor to me and her arc was one of the most impactful I have seen in any anime. Nice to see her analyzed
I really hate how Sayaka’s basically the punching bag for this series 😭😭
In the Walpursinacht(I think I spelled it wrong) Rising trailer, during the scene with her, Madoka, and Hitomi her neck was bandaged up, and also how in the trailer her face was almost fully bandaged up 😭😭
Regarding kyosuke i have to disagree. He doesnt owe Sayaka anything. She had a crush on him and decided to selflessly care for him while he was lost in his own grief and sorrow for a lost future. while dealing with all that you cant excpect him to be focused on anyone other than himself. She made the choice to be there "selflessly" at first but in reality she began to think that this sould eventually grant her some sort of rights over him. And that is how that selfless love and care becomes selfishness. She wanted him to be well again but eventually also expected that he would somehow see through the effort and be grateful to her when all he cared for was getting his life back. there is nothing wrong with that.
He owes her gratitude, he owes her to stand by her in the same way if she would wound up in the same situation, he owes her a whole lot, one thing he does NOT owe her is to fall in love with her.
@@michalsoukup1021 Not really no he doesn’t. She did a selfless act he doesn’t owe her anything for doing that act.
@@StarDreamsStudios That is not how it works, he accepted Sayaka's effort and company. If someone cuts hours upon hours of their free time to make your life less miserable and you accept it, you are at an obligation to return that.
The only other clean option would be to send Sayaka away much sooner. Accepting help, favours or efforts of others without at least an intent to reciprocate fully is a bad style.
@@michalsoukup1021 I was her choice to do that, anyd you dont get to expect anything in return, especially if you dont voice otr demand it loud to that person.
H has to respect it, which he actually dioe and is grateful, but he dosnt owe her anything in return, especially if she doesnt demand it herself. He doesnt know and cant and is not responsible for her feelings. Did sayaka ttell him she loved him before, had they that kind of relationship?
What he owed her and in his eyes he did other than one time really freaking out ove never abl to be able to play again. a very human moment, else he was ignorant of sayaka, because sayalka never voiced that things. Dunno he forgot telling her h is out of the hispital but thats likely not intentional. A unfair as it is, he owes her nothing thhan th gratitude he gave her already.
Yes he owes her
Even if the world is very magical and fictional, I think Sayaka was the most realistic character from them all. Her desires are very realistic and honestly I would've done the same things as her as a teenager
Sayaka the Human... She is probably the one most like myself in the pack, so she is also the one I can relate to most directly. She is the kind of character that makes you think that being human has a certain nobility to it, even when everything turns to ashes in your hands. I don't think I will ever forget her.
I feel like she just wanted Kyosuke to be happy but only with her and she thought giving him his hands back would make him love her but it was not true and once she realizes it was kind of selfish which is what mami warned her about she realizes that it wasn’t worth it and it feels wasted even thought she was always being a good person
The comments gave me more insight thank you
I think that's why she became so distant from who she was at the end. She forces herself to keep fighting witches in a fully "just" way, trying to provide some evidence to herself that she's not a selfish person, now that she recognizes her wish
@@ProfessorViral that may also be part of why she refused any grief seeds
Thank you so much for this video. I hadn't considered the debate between Bentham and Kant and sort of missed just how deeply Sayaka actually fell not just on an emotional but also moral level. I hope more people see your content!
Thank you, I'm glad the video gave you some food for thought, that's always priority number one : D But, I hope we can grow the audience as well, however I'm always happy just to have what I do : )
Excellent video! I've always really loved Sayaka, always made me sad how a lot of people wrote her off as a terrible person. This is such a great character study that delves into why she is the way she is.
Thank you! I had to do her character some justice 😁
I love your video, but your analysis on Kyousuke a bit harsh. I honestly think everyone is too harsh on this boy. Yes, Sayaka was a great and kind person to Kyousuke, but he doesn't owe her his feelings. He listened to music with her a lot and was obviously appreciative to her actions/efforts. This poor boy lashed out ONCE. ONCE, that we see of. It probably hit him in the moment that he will NEVER be able to play music again. That he will NEVER be able to accomplish or continue his passion or goals.
I swear, everyone acts like Kyousuke is a jerk. He's not. He, like Sayaka, like Homura, and Kyoko (sp?), was hurt and traumatized and lashed out. May I mention again, one time! Kyoko has a sad backstory and actively lets innocent people get hurt to get grief seeds and she's somehow more sympathetic than Kyousuke? Homura straight up prioritize Madoka in literally every situation and is willing to let others die, but she's more sympathetic than Kyousuke?
Kyousuke was still in the hospital and was still healing. Physical therapy wasn't going well for him. He was coming to terms that he will never be able to play music again. And he lashed out. Again, Kyousuke doesn't owe Sayaka his feelings. She was a great and dear friend to him. Obviously, that wasn't enough for her but that isn't his fault.
YES EXACTLY
Yeah as a disabled woman I now understand Kyosuke’s pain more than I ever did as an able bodied teenager. I understand what he was feeling now that I’ve lost my mobility, so with the knowledge that Sayaka never tells him what she did, how was he to even know there was something to be thankful for?
THANK YOU SO MUCH everyone defends Homura til the cows come home but like broooohhh
He doesn't owe her any feelings but he was acting horrible to possibly one of the only people who was there for her
@@no-cp6rx How so? He lashed out to Sayaka once that we know of. Outside of that, how was Kyousuke being horrible to her?
Mercy implies the existence of Justice. If Justice were a lie, mercy would be as well.
mercy stops justice
@@JohnSmith-zk8xp Not necessarily
@@JohnSmith-zk8xp They are at odds, Mercy is to do good by people whether they deserve it or not.
I genuinely can’t think about Sayaka’s character/story for more than a minute before I start to tear up. I already lost it a couple minutes the video when showing the clip of Sayaka getting upset over feeling undeserving of a wish because other people need it more, hearing those words is like a bullet through my heart..
Another amazing video as always. Also I forgot how crazy the production value on this anime was. It’s very subtle but the animation style complimented the various sceneries/color schemes we would see throughout.
The style of the characters was somewhat distracting for me at times, but that's just because I haven't watched much true magical girl stuff, where it draws more of that style from. But, it is easy to overlook how gorgeous the anime can be; the soft warm glow while Sayaka ponders her love, the cold contrast when Kyosuke gets the benefits of her wish- they certainly used the color and style for an increased feel
To think that every time Homura creates a new timeline, a new sayaka is born to suffer the same unavoidable fate in each timeline. It really makes it sadder to think about. I’d like to elaborate, but I am sure those who understand time travel and who have seen the anime will get the idea.
I just finished PMMM today and I'm honestly shocked that people hated Sayaka, especially when she's sort of what sold me on watching the show in its entirety. For context, I started the anime about 10 years ago when my friends gave me the classic "just get to the fourth episode" spiel. After reaching this fabled moment that was supposed to set the whole show apart, all I could say was, "That's it? The best part of this anime is that they kill off a magical girl?" It was essentially being touted as "Sailor Moon but the girls die so it's totally dark and, like, for big kids and stuff." That selling point just sounded so hollow and fake-deep that I dropped the series right there.
It was only a few days ago when I saw one of your videos briefly mention Sayaka's character arc that I was actually intrigued enough to give the show a proper second chance, and boy, am I glad I did. Suffice to say, it was leaps and bounds better than I'd previously imagined. And maybe I'm backwards for shrugging off what people loved about it and then loving what people shrugged off, but Sayaka genuinely stuck out to me as one of the most relatable, well-written, and thought-provoking side characters in the show, if not in anime as a whole. And since I know I'm not the only one in my friend group who dropped PMMM for the reasons I did, I'll definitely be citing Sayaka's story and your channel as big parts of what changed my mind the next time anime comes up. Thanks a bunch for convincing me!
"Is kindness a form of selfishness? [...] SHE couldn't handle HIS pain anymore. Is this selfless?" Supposedly, this is the problem with altruistic behavior in general: if you do it "for someone else's sake", then you shouldn't be doing it "because it makes you feel good," but then again even if you do it for someone else's sake you do feel good about it precisely because we see kindness as something good and admirable. So how can this be avoided? Ultimately, the fact that we do everything "selfishly" (= "because we feel good about doing it, or at least better than we would if we didn't do it") is not what matters to me when deciding if an action is good or bad, altruistic or selfish, kind or unkind; doing 'what makes us feel good' is simply what humans always do. Rather, what is it that makes us feel good about doing it -- is it the recognition of others? The prestige we'll gain? Or is it the fact that this person will actually be happier, better off in life, because of what we did? If the latter is what makes us feel good, then even though we're still doing it 'in order to feel good', I'd say this is a kind action done for selfless reasons. It's at least the best we humans, wired the way we are and with the brains and emotions we have, can do.
So I don't think Sayaka is wrong in wanting to lessen Kyōsuke's pain 'because SHE couldn't handle his pain' (= 'she would feel better if he felt no pain'). I think whenever we decide we have found the right course of action, it is ultimately because it is the one we feel better following. It's... part of what it means to act as a human, to have a set of emotions in your heart that affects you. I think where she was wrong was the lack of acknowledgment of this fact. She herself thought that doing the right thing solely because it is the right thing -- my own personal feelings be damned -- was the true definition of ... nobility perhaps? Or ethical behavior? So she despised that in herself which felt good when she did the right thing, because it would make it seem like she is doing it ultimately for herself; and despising it, she pushed it aside, shoving it into her unconscious, where, as unconscious things are wont to do, it ended up slowly eroding her self-esteem, bit by bit. The logical ending of such a perception -- based on the belief that feeling good about it as at least part of the reason why we do the right thing kind of makes it all selfish and is thus 'wrong' -- is suicide, at least for humans with emotions. She would have to either accept feeling good about it as a valid reason, or then become a robot (like Kyūbē) and do the right thing without feeling anything about it, or... she'd end up killing herself. Noblesse oblige.
Incredible and thorough analysis. Love hearing you touch on aspects of the show people gloss over. Like how their characters contrast and effect the environment they live in.
Thank you, glad to see you enjoyed it : D
"(Sayaka was lost) the moment selfishness bonded with selflessness in her contract." My impression is, as I've already said, that Sayaka's problem was not the bond of selfishness to selflessness (which is unavoidable for beings that have emotions and cherish happiness), but her mistaken view that purity was essential -- that there was no excuse for any element of selfishness in an "ally of Justice," so she had to repress her own less-than-pure motives behind the purer ones in order to be able to act... If she had seen the relation between selfishness and selflessness differently, she could have avoided her fate. Her obsession with ethical purity doomed her (to quote Madoka's mother, "yeah, this [kind of situation] happens all the time [...] it's like they stop thinking rationally").
But here, I'm curious. In the final Madoka-Sayaka scene, Madoka says, "[I brought you here] because I wanted to respect your wish. Because it is not meaningless, not worthless"... Why do you think she's saying that? If what's wrong with Sayaka's wish is that it contained selfishness (rather than Sayaka's belief that selfishness and selflessness can have nothing to do with each other, than only pure selflessness is worthy), then why would Madoka say that? Wasn't Sayaka's wish tainted from the start? Yet Madoka says it wasn't... (To me, it seemed that she was saying Sayaka's wish was perfectly fine, selfless and selfish parts alike; Sayaka only had to outgrow her fascination with purity, and accept the success of her wish -- Kyōsuke again making music -- as good, as worthy, purity or no purity. But what is your impression? I'm honestly curious.)
I had to be in a certain mood to watch this, and I'm so glad I did.
I feel like what you said around 6:44 kinda goes back to what Sayaka said about how her and Madoka are completely ignorant when it comes to any sort of suffering, because going by my own understanding of that point, she doesn't care how the result of her actions affect the people she loves, as long as she can erase her own pain, being selfish doing so. Also, similar to how Mami hated how imperfect she was as a person, Sayaka couldn't live with the weak person she was, leading her to make the wish to change someone's else fate(changing Kyosuke's suffering which would've never ended until his death into happiness while remaining just as he was before he was in the hospital) instead of trying to change herself by making a wish for her own benefit.
Literally sayaka is the most miserable character I’ve ever seen on TV 😭
I never understood why Sayaka was so hated, I adored her from the start.
Same, when I first saw it she was what stuck me to the show
People call her a bully lol
Wait she was hated
@@IchibanOjousama Honestly I don't see how she's a bully. If ANYONE is a bully it's clearly Kyubey.
i’ve seen madoka twice already, but i really need to watch it again now that my brain is more developed. i think i would be able to see a lot more in the series than i did before.
Thats why I had to watch it again, once I was older I knew it would hit a lot different
Sayak Miki probably has the most sad arc. She destroyed herself over something as foolish as a teenage crush. She's actually very relateable though and that makes me enjoy her as a character.
She's exceptionally relatable. I remember being her age and thinking something like that, although more defined and serious, was the entire world. You start to imagine your entire life around it, so it kind of becomes the world to you
I mean you just devalued every relationship people have. Her pain and problems are very real and her arc shows her kind heart and the ultimate pain she deals with.
That's a very oversimplified look as to shat caused her to spiral in despair, as what truly started her downfall was the realization that deep down she is selfish and that she can't live up to her ideals.
My favorite character. Always thought she seemed wise for her age
that Sayaka quote is the most important line in the entire series. Glad you shed light on it!
Sayaka is the most compelling character for me
Homura, Sayaka and Kyoko are my favs.
My favorite character
Poor girl just wanted to do good, be kind
Only to lose herself and bring on madness, depression.
Pretty much. In a kind world, what she did could have worked. But her world wasn't kind, and it forced out the worst in her
Sayaka was my favorite character in the series. The story of her rapid downward spiral moved me the most.
Sayaka is probably my favorite character of all time, and i was avoiding watching your videos in general because i didn't wanna alter my feelings in any way towards her, i didn't wanna taint my feelings and mix them with someone else's opinion
That being said, after i finally watched this video, i practically agree with everything you said and i also agree that sayaka vs elsa maria is the best scene in the show. It's in fact my favorite scene of all time in all media in general (Strangely enough, a lot of people don't extract the same feeling i do whenever watching it, probably watched 100x+ and still get goosebumps EVERYTIME, decretum is such an insaaaaaane song)
I guess we share a lot of similarities in our taste in media
Also i finally got around to watching it because im gonna tattoo her grief seed soon, so i stumbled upon the video (already have oktavia's name tattooed)
Anyways, amazing video! Gonna be watching more of your analysis from now on!
Miki Sayaka kind of finds out the final secret of the soul gem herself, from her quote "For as much happiness as we wish on one person, we can't help but curse someone else". The meaning behind the words were imply her wishes for Kyosuke is "hope" but for him not for herself. After Kyosuke recovered, he accept Hitomi's confession and become lovers, this makes her filled with resentment and hatred. At the final moment she realize that is how magical girls works, that's why she calmed herself being stupid, stupid enough for falling this trap from QB.
With a more realistic interpretation way is she regretted that didn't listen to Mami and her wish was not for herself, Sayaka always admire Mami for her purely justice, and want to follow her path, but she didn't see it clear enough that Mami and her were never the same, Mami wish for herself, she fulfilled the desire first, so that she can start given hopes to others, although Mami don't really have another choice when making the wish, but the point still stand, she wish for herself but Sayaka didn't.
As a representation of the "Karmic Balance" of the Madoka Magica world, there's nothing better than Sayaka's story. The refuse to realize, leading to acceptance, that she goes through with regards to it is downright amazing. And, with Mami it also gives us one of the best uses of a mentor's death, which is so often just a motivational trope
Sayaka: You won't even give up your humanity out of pity for a friend!
Madoka, from the Different Story manga: Hold my ribbons
Currently writing my thesis on Madoka Magica, specifically on Sayaka. thank u for this vid, was definitely part of my inspiration :-)
I'm still in the middle of the video (I love it so far btw), but I kinda wanted to tackle the whole Kyouske basically throwing Sayaka away once he's healthy. (Or Kyousuke in general, I guess?) So, in other media, namely Madoka Magica Portable, we can see that he didn't forget nor he stopped caring about her, as he visits her in one of Sayaka's Bad Ending, as well as there's a SPOILER
(moment where Hitomi intends to confess, but once Madoka appears asking for Sayaka, visibly very worried they both put it on hold to help searching for her)
END OF SPOILER
And here I go, another SPOILER there is at some point a moment (unless it was in a differend PMMM game? It's been a while) where Kyousuke's about to commit unaliving which kinda gives you a bit more perspective regarding his state, aka it was already that bad END OF SPOILER
Now, if I remember correctly he was also searching for her in The Different Story (manga), to give her at least a small gift for being with him through all this. I might be wrong about it happening in TDS, but I'm pretty confident it happened at least Somewhere. It took some time, because his life basically changed overnight, too, and it's understandable that he'd need some time to adjust first
This earned a sub, I haven't enjoyed such a deep dive into a character in a while; community discussion around her usually falls back to an echo chamber of people calling her stupid for falling the way she did or calling her a bad friend etc etc. This is the first time I feel like her actions were interpreted "correctly" (which I put in quotes because it is all a matter of opinion I guess). I'll be checking out your other vids on the MadoMagi cast for sure :)
Thank you for sticking around, I'm glad I was able to do her justice 😁
She's so underrated
For sure, everyone focuses on the others, who are equally amazing, but Sayaka was always the crucial piece for me
Beautifully done, Sayaka is a very tragic character (i mean they all are) but I found her most relatable myself
15:04 I find what sayaka said to be so ironic because of what madoka ends up doing at the end of the anime
He is not an unsympathetic character honestly. It is totally understandable that what happenned to him can make him lash out. When people are not ok, you cannot expect them to act normally. His life dream was ruined, and while he likes the old days they are also painful. He can feel a mix of good and bad emotions when he listens to that music and anything can happen during that time. And also... the crush.I mean hell, yes sayaka was always there for him but in the end, sayaka had to express her feelings, and she didn't. You can't expect someone to understand you are doing things like the fact you want a relationship out of them. I am running left and right to help people i know and love that are in pain but that doesn't mean i want to be in any romantic relationship with most of them. He appreciates the help but he just can't read that from a person that was there, and he doesn't know and will never know the sacrifice she made for him. The sacrifice she made now doesn't have any meaning, because she didn't try to get out of her shell for that. She just tried to help him. I don't remember if we see him in sayaka's funeral, but we don't know how he felt about that. He could have been devastated as well. He knew her a lot. Calling him unsympathetic because the kid had what basically amounts to SEVERE TRAUMA, and because he can't read minds, no, just... no
Great video! :D I LOVE Madoka Magica!!! :)
Thank you! : D
@@ProfessorViral You're welcome! :)
great video, I feel like Sayaka is really relatable in a way
Very much. When I was younger I related to her situation. Growing older, I find myself relating more to her weakness
though it was a good video , just a little note that might just be me but I felt the text for each portion of the essay was hard to read against the background you chose. other wise still great video. in anime id like you to cover id go with either silver spoon or the garden of sinners
Hah
Wow
What a contrast XD
Yeah, that was definitely my mistake. I knew what the words were, so my brain didn't have to read them and figured it was fine, there definitely should have been some outline on the text. I will slightly defend myself because that transition is a copy of one in episode 9 where Sayaka turns into a witch, but I still added text that wasn't meant to be overtop of that background, so still on me. But, thank you, I appreciate the feedback and am happy to see you enjoyed the video outside of that : ) I haven't seen either of those, but a quick look on MAL confirms, that is in fact quite the contrast lol. I might give the Garden of Sinners a go sometime, it seems like something I may enjoy
@@ProfessorViral I recommended those two because despite the fact they are VERY different story wise , the theme of finding oneself and what to do after your have connects them both. also recency bias is playing HUGE part in the recommendation for garden of sinners and im going through it for the first time at the moment (through a translation of the original novels I later learned is hated by the fans of the anime somewhat, sure it definitely could have done with proofreading but otherwise fine for someone without knowledge of the story ,though I do have an understanding of the most of the rest of the fate portion of the nasuverse.) reading part 5 right now and stuff is going down. this however is not to disregard silver spoon entirely as I believe to be some of the best 22 episodes in anime at least for me trumping fma easily for me( with regards to brotherhood , 2003 is somehow always intrigued me more)sadly the manga for silver spoon was "slightly" rushed due external circumstances somewhat and thus in a comparison of both fma and 銀の匙’s manga versions fma will win out but if a-1 picks up 銀の匙 as an anime again and gives it some buffer and maybe input from arakawa it will easily trump both brotherhood and 03(03 ftw).
looking forward to reread garden of sinners as soon as im done with it. then continue with my descent into the monogatari lns.
any way thanks for taking in the criticism about the video.
still great video
And this is why everyone should make sure their relationships are balanced lol. Or that you're being kind for the right reasons, and not because you want to get something out of it. Otherwise you'll just develop resentment when a relationship is one sided.
Finally, thank you for this video. Sayaka is my favorite character of all time!!! I hope this shows more people how amazing she is
Hey, thanks for watching and for the kind comment! : D
This video taught me a lot about myself, more than it did about Sayaka.
I’ve always related very heavily to Sayaka, even to a delusional extent. I use her sorrows as analogs/examples to help navigate my own, I see my flaws reflected in her character, I see her in myself and I see myself in her. Your analysis of her magical girl mental gymnastics and cracked me open like a book and forced me to realize things about my own beliefs and motivations that I was afraid to confront on my own. Her ever spiraling view of justice, the paradox of her empathy and wish, her worldview becoming tainted as a result of her refusal to change, that all shook me to my core and opened my eyes further to the beauty of her characterization, as well as the uglier parts of my own mind. Each ‘movement’ impacted me in a very real way and I applaud you for that. This is one of the most jarring and realistic takes I’ve seen on this series so far, keep up the good work!
Thank you for the kind words, I'm glad the video was able to help in that way. Honestly, it has those qualities because it was the same thing for me. When I started looking at her character, I had to look at myself in all those same ways. I sometimes joke that the channel is me "working through my issues with anime," and this one was very much that
Madoka magica is my go to recommendation for new anime fans. It occupies a similar space in the pantheon of good anime, to me at least, as something like NGE. It's approachable, creative, gorgeous, and tells a human story. 10/10 perfect anime.
Rewatching this again because, I guess I enjoy putting myself through the trauma of bawling my eyes out as I re-live Sayaka's tragic story (cried about 4 times the first time I watched this btw, the mere sight of Sayaka during certain scenes is all it takes...)
What I wanted to say though is regarding the statement around 6:40 "Is helping someone who's in pain because it also causes you pain, really for that person? Or because you want to feel better too?"
My counter-argument would simply be "isn't that just the definition of empathy?". In other words, if we extend this idea of a selfless for selfish reasons beyond the example of Sayaka's wish, it starts to fall apart more. If I am an empathetic person, I might help someone in need because I feel really bad for them and the situation they're in. Am I selfish for helping them on the basis that I felt some of their pain? Or... are my actions just guided by my empathy?
In my opinion, it's not about how thought out a person's _reasons_ are for helping another, or about how confident they are about the "true intentions" behind their acts of selflessness (I think Mami's warning about being certain of "true intentions" before wishing for another person, has erroneously caused a lot of focus to be placed on whether Sayaka herself was certain of her intentions or not before wishing, rather than looking more broadly at Sayaka's morals and beliefs throughout the show). In reality I believe it comes down to empathy itself- the simple presence of empathy indicates a deeply rooted and inherent trait of selflessness. The very definition of "empathy" is "the ability to feel/share other people's feelings, including pain". It's unlikely that a selfish person is going to dwell on trying to empathise with another's pain, given that the very implication of the word "selfish" is to place greater importance on your own wellbeing, pleasure, joy etc, than other people's.
Essentially, the simple fact that Sayaka appears to be one of the biggest empaths in the entire show is indicative of profound selflessness. Hell, she gets full on revolted when questioning why SHE is the lucky one who gets a wish rather than any of the other millions of people who need it more than her, she's so upset and distraught by this fact alone. Idk about you, whoever reads this, but this to me sounds like someone is deeply empathetic and selfless. Getting angry and upset when you are presented with the ability to wish for _anything_ just because you feel others deserve it more? I can't think of any better way to demonstrate to an audience that "this character has a pure heart and lives to spread kindness".
Last note: if anything, I think the huge deal Mami makes when giving Sayaka shit for even _asking_ about using a wish on someone else, probably did more to fuck with Sayaka's psyche than any good it could have done. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Sayaka's intentions were pure from the start when wanting to help Kyosuke, but Mami actually caused an avalanche of self-doubt and uncertainty to erupt within Sayaka, leading to her wish being marked and tarnished where it originally was spawned out of simple, pure and innocent, _empathy._
Basically, the Shirou Emiya of Madoka Magica
My favourite character in all of fiction
sounds like someone might write an essay on this
Just remember she is only 14
People hate her yet defend Azula from the last Airbender
Definitely onr of the most tragic characters in this series. Loved the video
Dude, you did a phenomonal job on this video
I've never watched any anime's in my life but recently I decided to look into Madoka Magica after one of my friends recommended it to me. I stumbled across this video and you have me hooked! This weekend I'll definitely watch this series. That aside, your editing and music choices compliment what your talking about so well, I can only dream of being able to make "video essays" like these. Great job on this video and I hope UA-cam takes you somewhere far in the future.
Thank you, seeing nice comments like these really does mean a lot : ) Sometimes making these is tough, but if you have something your passionate about, I always say to go for it. It's no guarantee, but doing it changed my life for the better, and I wouldn't trade that for much else
Sakayka story was like the little mermaid.
I've actually never seen the little mermaid 🤣🤣
@@ProfessorViral the original story is pretty dark and really sad but sends a realistic message depending how you see the ending in 3 different ways. And I think that's why I find it fascinating bcuz it makes me think deeper while looking at the story really closely.
@@ProfessorViral Well, her story is nothing like the Disney version, but rather the original tale by Hans Christian Andersen, which can easily be found online. It's a fairly short story (it couldn't possibly take more than half an hour to read), so I recommend it. Considering that Sayaka's witch form is a mermaid, I'm pretty sure that the similarities are completely intentional.
I went into the show knowing all that there was to know about it (otherwise I wouldn't have watched it). And I expected her to be my favorite. In the end, I think Mami ended up being my favorite character. But doggone if this whole character arc isn't gonna haunt me.
You raise a good point about relieving others' pain because you personally can't stand it. It's probably a more common motivation than a lot of people would expect. I'm certain I've fallen into that trap on more than one occasion. If we can call it a trap, it's perhaps too tangled in philosophy and interpretation to really say for sure. And going back to the show, that's probably why the tragedy is even more potent- she was wrong. But she was also right. It's all a big mess and she couldn't handle it.
I can definitely see it being a common motivation, at least more than people know. It's one of those things most people wouldn't question. I can't blame anyone for that, given usually it results in a positive outcome and helped someone else. It's like a curse with philosophical thought, that even kindness can come into question. But, there can be a resolution where someone acknowledges their kindness as selfish, and still does it anyway because it leads to a good result. But, I guess all this ramble really says is, it is very much tangled in philosophy and interpretation, so it is hard to say haha
Why Mami, Mami is selfish
@@IchibanOjousama So is every character besides Madoka, and you could even say that she is to some extent, wanting to relieve the pain of everyone else because it gave her the chance to do something good. That's the point of this series, showing us real people who make mistakes and have human motivations rather than seemingly perfect characters embodying love and friendship. You are right that Mami is selfish, she herself admits this, that Madoka needs a better role model. That is because like all of these girls, Mami is human. She is selfish and she is flawed. She does care about others, mostly continuing her lonely life protecting others due to the guilt she feels of using her wish to save herself, a fact that ironically protects her from suffering the fate most magical girls face, one of a witch, instead dying in combat due to her own over confidence. The biggest thing that makes Mami selfish of course is when she takes Madoka and Sayaka under her wing, attempting to make them magical girls even when she knows how easy it is to die, how the gripping lonelyness terrified her to her very core, something she would willingly inflict on girls younger than her in her selfish wish not to be alone. Mami is a person, one who is flawed and selfish, but she isn't a bad person.
Sayaka is my favorite character is madoka magica her personality to her choices and lore was done so well I applause gen urobuchi. She has one of the most memorable death of anime characters and definitely a magical girl. Well written believable outcome of her choices and that how life is sometimes you don't always get go back and tell people the moral to your. Sometimes it already too late and you realize you we,re stupid so stupid as your sum of life crashes down.
Sayaka is my favourite character from these brillaint series
Same here, ever since the first watch
This was an amazing video, the writing and editing were great and I absolutely adore your analysis of Sayaka and her role in the story ✨
i hated sayaka but probably cause i was so much like her, but without a boy and magic. Im a bit of a religious person, since kid i learn about altruism and charity, i always felt like my time was running away and i needed to do good things to not atract bad karma, i always feared pain and i was horrifield with the possibility to go to ''hell'' and sufer forever cause i spent my life with nothing realy good, so i always tried to do good things and what was right, but inside there was a feeling of hate and revenge, the way people acted didn't make sense, they say something but did other, i was surrounded of hypocrisy before i even understand what it was, i always felt that i was the only one doing what i was told, following the rules, doing the right and sacrificing myself for others that treated me like trash, always letting things pass and suppressing the bad stuff inside, cause i thought something good would come for me, that for pretending so much the bad feelings would just go away, in a sense that I would just learn and become genuinely good inside like i pretended I was outside, and for it all i just didn't want to suffer, and that someone would like me, since my relationship with ppl were always terrible.
That's the part where i feel most relatable to Sayaka, i acted good hopping ppl would like me, and always i sacrificed myself for someone just to watch them leave like i didn't exist i felt terrible, i felt that I sacrificed something for nothing and couldn't handle it, but i couldnt just stop acting like that cause not being nice was against the ''rules'', the price of being good was much more that i could handle, while all i wanted was to not suffer that was just what was happening, i feared hell and my life become one.
took time to see why i was suffering, at some point i started doing ''good'' stuff for fear, for a need to have attention, to be loved, to feel i was right, but i felt i was giving a gold coin and receiving a slap on the face, if i gave everything to others cause someone said i should why couldnt this person just give me something too? i was just shoving the responsibilities for my actions and expectations to the others, ones that i cant control.
I wish the anime actually instilled the ideas in this video through Sayaka's own lines. What the anime seemed to be doing (on the surface at least) is push the "Oh no, I'm a zombie now, how will Kyosuke ever love me?" idea. And that made her seem quite immature and illogical.
But the analysis here makes much more sense: Sayaka's despair-trigger is her realizing gradually that her wish might not have been such a good idea, constantly trying to find justification for being a magical girl and eventually finding less and less, until she stops trying. Knowing she'd become a witch once she gives up would hasten her process even more; maybe Kyubey should have just divulged it to her.
“I Was Stupid, So Stupid.”
That one's in the same class of heartbreaking lines as "oh no, don't tell me your broken..."
I would love to see a crossover featuring Sayaka Miki and Transformers: Prime post-Predacons Rising Megatron. They both made a deal that essentially sold their soul- Sayaka to Kyubey, Megatron to Dark Energon/Unicron-and both become essentially living, reanimated corpses.
The difference being that Sayaka made a contract to help and save people. Megatron injected his Spark with Dark Energon to conquer a world and win a war.
A suggestion for the fans!
I love all the characters in this show.
But my god…I NEVER THOUGHT OF HER KILLING THOSE GUYS ON THE TRAIN!!! Because it cuts I thought she just told them off and fell deeper into despair…O_O
That adds just, another layer to those scenes.