Gun Registration Paper Trail!!! Here's the Deal: 4473!!!
Вставка
- Опубліковано 26 чер 2018
- Patreon: / kotaboy32
Email: kotaboy32@gmail.com
Kotaboy32 Facebook Page: / kotaboy32-14. .
Disclaimer: These videos are strictly for educational and entertainment purposes only. Imitation or the use of anything demonstrated in my videos is done AT YOUR OWN RISK. All work on firearms should be carried out by a licensed individual and all state and federal rules apply to such. We (including UA-cam) will not be held liable for any injury to yourself or damage to your firearms resulting from attempting anything shown in any our videos. I do not endorse any specific product and this video is not an attempt to sell you a good or service. I am not a gun shop and DO NOT sell or deal in Firearms. Such a practice is heavily regulated and subject to applicable laws. I DO NOT sell parts, magazines, or firearms. These videos are free to watch and if anyone attempts to charge for this video notify us immediately. By viewing or flagging this video you are acknowledging the above.
Fair Use: In the rare instance I include someone else’s footage it is covered in Fair Use for Documentary and Educational purposes with intention of driving commentary and allowing freedom of speech. - Розваги
I have lived in Central PA my entire life (almost 60)..... In PA a purchaser fills out a 4473 and a SP 4-113 (PA State Police Application/Record of Sale)..... the FFL makes one call to the "NICS" system for "clearance" and receives a transaction number that is written on the 4473 and the SP 4-113. While the 4473 is a single multi-page form that is retained by the FFL, the SP 4-113 is a one-page triplicate form.... one for the FFL, one for the purchaser, and one for the PA State Police! I have several friends who are LEO's.... one is a retired State Police Trooper who was fairly high up.... in his words.... those SP 4-113's that are supposed to be "destroyed".... they are "archived"! So "technically" in PA there is no "official" gun registry!!!! But there is an "archive" of all "legal" firearm purchases made in PA! When pressed on the issue.... the PA State Police can say "No, there is no gun registry in Pennsylvania!" (Wink Wink)! Correct me if I am wrong.
The government still has the information /ATF end story. ...
Not really; the NICS, (Feds) only see the buyer information, but some States, (like California), have systems in place that keep all on the information about the transfer, (gun AND buyer information).
@@oldgysgt in 2020 ATF are goin to ffl dealers taking pictures of 4473...
@@LoneWolfRedd; I seriously doubt that. I have over 4500 4473s myself. With 3 pages of buyer and firearm information each, that that would be 13,500 pictures. If they were able to do one 4473 per minute for 8 hours a day, it would take over 9 days to photograph all of my 4473s. With weekends off, that's almost 2 weeks, and I'm only a small dealer. There must be hundreds of millions of 4473s nationwide. The ATF doesn't have the time, money or personnel to inspect each Dealer every 3 years now, and when they do inspect they usually only look at 50 or so 4473s. And that's only to see if they are filled out properly. In fact it's been 7 years since I was last inspected. 90% of all the rumors you hear about the ATF are just that, rumors. Get back to me at the end of next December, and I will let you know if your information was true.
Well, in CA handguns and long guns are registered. DROS (dealer record of sale). And it’s searchable electronically by LEOs from their cars by serial number or name/date of birth.
In Commiefornia the NICS system is basically a digitalized trail. I've had a detective come to my door because he read the system wrong, thought a firearm I had previously owned, and sold legally thru an FFL dealer, that had turned up in a drug bust, was still REGISTERED to me....I called the NICS system, and the clerk who answered the phone listened to my story and said hold on, checked the system, and came back and told me he must have read it wrong, that firearm is no longer registered to you...
Spot on about the 4473s... I live in SC. next to Charlotte. I have a ccw so they don't even call for approval. On the flip side, my ffl told me that if I buy more than 1 AR receiver at a time it is reported to batfe. This seem to be so that they can keep track of people who are acting like dealers making money off of selling firearms without an ffl. Not sure how true this info is... I build, on average 1 AR a month an a half, (Yeah I have a bunch of them) have only sold a few to help pay for a different build. have given some to family members as presents. I'll buy a couple receivers at a time every few months. Never heard anything from the batfe about this.. I take pics of my builds including #s to keep track. People ask... how many ARs do you need? I just say.... all of them. Gotta slow down on doing that though, have no room left to keep anymore.
In Texas we just do a Bill of Sale. No background check necessary.
If criminals can break the law what makes you think the government won't ?
Even server pass through data is recorded (gate servers that are overused by the NSA). We see it all the time on our Google, UA-cam and social media history files. Also keep in mind, even if you own a firearm that was purchased privately your ammo purchases (scanned drivers license anyone?) are used as well to obtain data that will confirm the presence of a firearm in your possession. They do not look for what you own but how many. A red flagged home owner would be searched for XX number of firearms in the home by using such compiled data. All government servers are designed to encrypt and store all data associated with its network.
each time i have bought a firearm at a gun show.i had to wait about 30 minutes for the back ground check.that's how busy the system is.i also would go to the ATFE booth and get a firearms card so i can record my firearms on it.they are free and when i got home i would fill them out to have a personal record just in case(GOD forbid)E.T. abducts a gun instead of me.
THEY WANT YOUR GUNS --- LIKE IN TASMANIA AUSTRALIA THEY ARE USING A FALSE FLAGS AND THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA AS THEIR LACKEYS ---- TO TAKE OUR GUNS --- THE PATSY WAS SET UP --- MARTIN BRYANT WIKIPEDIA OR UA-cam --- LOOK IT UP --- THE CORONER SAID HE DID NOT DO IT --- AND SEVERAL EX COPS HAVE LABELLED JOHN HOWARD THE PRIME MINISTER AT THE TIME AS A WAR CRIMINAL.
Even if the gov deletes the search, the gun dealer is REQUIRED to keep all such forms. Before going out of business they are required to inform ATF and then ATF swoops in and grabs all that gun shops forms from time immemorial and reenters them into the database.
The FBI has a copy of the 4473. They are kept in West Virginia, but it would take them a couple years to actually track it down. That is why they go to the Gun Manufacturers then to the dealers.
Thank you for coherent good information 👍
Thanks. 👍
Dealers may be compelled to turn over the registry and you wouldn't even be notified.
Michigan keeps a record of every handgun sale even private ones. Also why do ATF agents take pictures of 4473 forms when they visit shops?
There are a lot of things that are required to not be entered into a database by law. Unless I see the software validation myself I simply don't trust the government to actually do that.Regarding selling to joe shmoe sales you're right, the criminal case wont go anywhere(in ohio) and that's been litigated with case law already, but the civil suitwill make your life a living hell. Many people here go through an FFL as a seller even though they could do a private sale just to protect themselves.Regarding the hard forms, Im interested in what happens when a store closes and where that form goes ... Im told ATF gets them when they close out the FFL ... which could end up on a national registry.I simply don't trust the government.
I work at a Gun shop and want to clarify two things. One is that the NICS check doesn’t have to be called in. There is also a website where it can be entered electronically and when the system is running correctly it’s almost instant. Second thing is that when the NICS check is run only the type of firearm is listed, ie. pistol, rifle, shotgun, receiver , other, etc. Brands and serial numbers are not entered. This info is of course on the 4473 and is retained at the Shop. I received a call from the ATF Monday doing a trace. They don’t tell you why due to the fact it is in ongoing investigation. But I had to fax them all the information as far as who it came from and where it went for that firearm.
As to making notes and having bill of sales for firearms you sale I can tell your personal story on that. I was a police investigator and received a call from another state law-enforcement agency that was trying to track down a firearm owner. One that I had personally owned some 20-25 years before. I knew I had owned it but I had no clue who I had sold it to. That firearm was used in a murder in that state. From that day on to this day every time I sell a firearm I must see their drivers license and I write down their name and address on the Bill of Sale and we both sign it and they get a copy. If they don’t want to go through that I do not sell them the gun.
Good information. Both buyer and seller have reason to record each other's ID. OTOH, they both have reasons (good or bad) to wish to remain anonymous.
Trading such info with total strangers makes me uncomfortable so if I ever decide to buy a gun :) I'll use an FFL, which entails another set of risks. Ya make your choices...
Great video! Thanks again!
When an FFL dealer calls the FBI for a NICS background check they don't tell the FBI what kind of firearm you're buying beyond whether it's a handgun or a long gun. You could be buying a single shot Thompson Center Contender/Encore pistol or a Glock that will take 33 round magazines. Same for rifles/shotguns. You could be buying a single shot trap gun or a scary black rifle. The FBI doesn't know. It's not part of the phone call. They don't even know how many firearms you're buying unless you exceed the reportable threshold. Even if they kept the records of the calls, all they have is your identity and that you purchased some kind of firearm. There are more firearms than people in the United States. Government fishing trips would take more resources than are available.
The FFL is required to keep the 4473s for as long as they're in business and they're turned over to the BATFE records center if they go out of business. Unless your state has a registry there isn't one. If you're buying a class 3 firearm, short rifle/shotgun/AOW, suppressor or destructive device the Feds do keep records on those items. The maker, model and serial number are on the form for those classes of firearms/devices.
I hear what you are saying about no digital records but I recently purchased a pistol from Academy Sports and Outdoors and they handed me a tablet to fill out the 4473. At the time it seemed convenient but after watching this video, I am wondering if that is the start of some form of digital record of the sale. Anyway, love your channel and thanks for getting the word out on new legislation concerning firearms. Take care.
And the government has the 4473s in storage. Harder to go through, but they are there.
Not in California. Since 2014 gun sales records are submitted to the state.
I've only sold one of my guns but I made sure and complete bill of sale was filled out and signed by the buyer. As you mentioned, I want to be able to show documented proof of that transaction if and when LEO show up at my door asking about it.
Agree any laws other than what is on the books is bad for the gun owners of America.
When the dealer turns over the records, from what i have been told, the atf is trying to digitize them. They supposedly have stacks and stacks of file boxes stored in halkways and everywhere because there is just so much.
Look up ATF's "Operation Forward Trace". ATF has gone into gun shops, photographed, scanned, or copied the "Bound Book" particlarly looking at people who bought "assault weapons".
the government never gives up information because information IS POWER
Sorry, the BATF does scan these documents that they receive from FFL's that send their paperwork to the BATF; when they close down shop. These documents are then scanned and stored digitally, and older forms where stored on Microfiche. The digital scans are not "indexed", so that could be considered non-searchable. ua-cam.com/video/1N118jYj2cA/v-deo.html at mark 2:50 the BATF states, "all these documents come in, and then they are scanned".
If there's no record of a purchase then how do most police departments maintain a data base of the homes where guns are kept?
Well, this information is correct as far as it goes, however, each State also has paper-work the FFL dealer must complete. As a California dealer I only know the California laws and appropriate California paper-work, so check with your local gun dealer for the laws in your State. In California the gun dealer MUST complete a DROS, (Dealer Record of Sale), for EVERY firearm that goes through his/her books. The DROS is put on the State Computer web site, and includes the buyer information, and all of the information about the firearm being transferred. So In California, although the 4473 is not digitized, the DROS is, so the firearm can be traced electronically by the California DOJ independent of the Federal 4473. As the man said, if you sell a firearm to ANYBODY, (individual or dealer), you need to keep a record of what firearm you sold, and to who you sold it too, because if that firearm is found at a crime scene, you could be in for BIG trouble if you have not protected your back-side by keeping proper records. This is NO JOKE, so protect yourself!
Kotaboy32 tactical , You are correct Sir! , I live in the "Peoples Republic of New Jersey" , other than the 4473 , we have another form with 5 copies FFL keeps one , I get one , State Police , County Police , Municipal Police , when they want to come for them , everyone knows.
RE: 4473's. My gun club/FFL dealer has the worst luck. In the 13 years I've been doing business with them, they have been broken into 3 times. Stolen F350 driven thru front doors, bull dozer bashed thru wall, iron burglar bars over glass frontage cut with ACE torch. Guns, safes, and locked files (containing paperwork) stolen. After they made the paperwork safes unmovable, a fourth break-in, they set off magnesium igniters, and burned the non-public areas to dust. Even the contents of the fire-proof safes were lost. Guess I got a few dozen AR's, AK's, hunting rifles, and [semi-]automatic "firearms" that have no traceable 4473's. Of course I have both paper AND electronic records (name, model, description, acquisition/dispossession/loss/sale dates, cost, etc.) on all of them, to cover my butt, in case any are ever lost, stolen, or used in a crime by other than myself. (Note: I use the term "firearm", because some items are NOT categorized as Gun, SBR, Rifle, etc., by the ATF, FBI, etc. They're just legally or technically defined as "firearms". Example, Charles Daly Honcho in .410 bore).
I told this to a detective with PA state police about 10 years ago. He responded by reading me a list of all my gun purchases. Not trying to argue anything just relaying a personal experience, take from it what you will
I had sold a gun to an ffl dealer who then sold it illegally. When it was used in a crime I got a call from the the state police saying my firearm was used in a crime. I fortunately had a record of selling it to a gun dealer. I was glad I kept it.
the actual 4473 is kept for ever, they are stored in WV. it would be easy for them to get it digitized with some time n money
The current system (pre-Toomey) is actually pretty brilliant. They have to have a firearm and probable cause to search the firearm. They can’t do fishing expeditions or search individuals they want to target.
Great video. thank you.
In Oregon the state police enter the info into a computer for the NICS check and charge a fee (tax). They keep the records despite State law. I talked to a couple LEO's (one state and one federal) who confirmed they traced guns years after the BG check. It sucks.
NJ has a quasi registration already....you have to buy pistol permits from the local police for each handgun purchase. One copy you keep at purchase. One copy is kept by the dealer. The other goes to the state police...and some towns have been sued because they required a copy to go to the local PD as well.
Sadly a lot of Dealers are putting copies of 4473's ON their own Computers.
Soooo... the local firearms store seems to burn down every eight years or so. I thought they were careless, but now I understand... 🤔 I support them!
If the government wanted that info on everyone all they'd have to do is send out a letter to all FFLs stating that they are to send in a digital copy of those records and they can be scanned quite quickly. So the 4473 form doesn't tell me anything I didn't already know or suspect. Also, in Ohio you MUST fill out the 4473 when you buy ANY firearm. It's just a given.
Little Shepherd. Only idiots comply with such illegal demands.
Patrick EH: If you read my comment carefully you'll see that I didn't say whether myself or anyone else would submit to that if it's pushed. I merely showed how easy it would be for them to do it if they wanted to. And given what we know about people like RB Ginsberg and others it's clear that their agenda is someday going to call for the re-writing of the American Constitution. After all, RB Ginsberg went on live TV a few years back and said as much herself. So, again...if they wanted to do that it would be quite easy for them to accomlish that task.
I haven't ever kept the names of people I've sold things to and I'm not going to start ...especially with Firearms. If I sell then it none of anyone's business who I sell to.
When my dealer calls NICS to get the go ahead he also tells them the make, model, serial number whether it is a handgun, rifle, or other/firearm lower receiver etc. if they were just looking to see that I was OK to sell-possess a firearm they would not need or require the additional information about the weapon. The shop I currently use posts the information from the form 4473 via a computer connection to the government and can get the go-no go almost immediately. Since I hold a CNL in my state I no longer need to wait and be checked, but the 4473 information still contains all the data from the sale and is placed via the computer to whom ever is reviewing/storing for later use that information along with my personal license number. Periodically BATFE does inspections/audits of the FFL establishments and can "ding" them for not properly keeping records, I once forgot to date a form 4473 at the time of purchase and the inspector caught the mistake and gave my dealer grief. It was an honest mistake, and nothing of importance happened to him but they do care, and they do inspect, and they do keep records and if you don't believe it that's on you. But I am very sure that they know about all but the private sales in my collection.
Exactly what does information about the firearm(s) have to do with whether or not the buyer is a prohibited person? Nothing! This is the biggest issue I have with so-called "universal background checks". I have no issue with having my background checked. What I take issue with is having a paper trail of exactly what firearms I own, whether it's searchable or not, whether it's digital or not. If it can be used to find out what I own, it is a registry. They don't need to know anything at all about the gun in order to determine whether or not I can lawfully own it.
if the FFL goes out of business he has to send all those records to the ATF and then they scan it into their national gun registration system, i have seen this happening
so in the long run you are being registered. the ATF are scanning all those documents.
Very good information.
Even IF the Feds deleated the form the state does keep records. Police keep databases on homes with guns.
If the Feds did not keep the records they would NOT need information on the firearm such as a serial number. It has nothing to do with the gun, just if the buyer has permission to buy one.
In Australia you can't sell your guns without a dealer and the person buying it has to have paperwork from the firearms registry to even transfer it Wich takes about 2 weeks. it's a fucked up thing gun registration they know who has what and where all the time...
Some states highway patrols have access to databases of CCW holders from other states. Pennsylvania and NJ do and they run plates on interstate 95 looking for out of state concealed carry licensees so that they get a chance to arrest then for illegal possession. There are a number of documented cases referencing this. Letting your guard down regarding this illegal behavior on the behalf of state and federal government is a big mistake.
Jerry Canne ... Exactly. Even our own state and local LEOs know we have CCLs at traffic stops. And the state CCL law says they CANNNOT. Its flagged on our DL records, cross checked to car tags, and probably coded on our pocket DL card too. I've been stopped here and in other states and they knew I had a CCL when they got to my window.
HotRodRay hey what state are you in Hot Rod? I'm wondering how widespread cops using these secondary databases is.
If I was somebody from New Jersey and New York Massachusetts or Connecticut I would be moving out of that state as soon as possible. Once your gun rights have been stripped away completely (whatever is left of them)You won’t be able to defend yourself. And if the shit hits the fan,You won’t even have a chance.
Thanks for explaining that whole 4473 stuff. You are awesome Kotaboy32, keep up the great videos.
Of course, if you do write down all your firearms in a personal log for insurance purposes you may not want to include those you bought from a private seller, esp. if you`ve hidden them. If they come to confiscate your firearms, you`ll just have given them proof of ownership of a gun they didn`t even know you had.
I had 4 guns stolen and the cops acted pissed off and surprised I had the serial numbers even on my tv. They got my tv back and found the name of who pawned it.....they never even went after them. thanks Greensboro PD, the same department that put me in a rubber room for kicking my own door in bc my wife locked me out without my wallet, had no crime so they threw me in the rubber room bc I told them to mind their own biz
M Blake Jr ... Where I used to live I was robbed ,not guns. Caught the guys, written confessions. Cops refused to pursue, said the judge would just turn them loose anyway. Fact.
The ATF just uses the FFL for the registry. Instead of it taking 5 minutes to see who owns the gun, it takes 14 minutes. 5 minutes to call the manufacturer to see what FFL they shipped it to. Then they call the FFL and in about 8 minutes they know who's gun it is.
Just because it's not digital doesn't mean it's not a registry. They can still track you if they want to.
There is something called the Automated Firearms System and after 1993 all hand guns you bought are there and also after 2014 all long guns are there. This system knows the serial number and what type of firearm you purchased.
You answered a question I had about if a gun dealer goes out of business what happens to the background check paperwork ? My son and I bought a couple of new guns from such a dealer about 5 or 6 years ago. I've often kind of wondered what happened to that paper work when he went out of business, if it got sent to the ATF or what ? I know through the grapevine I had heard that a few people that had firearms left with this guy never got those guns back. He was a gunsmith, gun dealer, and also done consignment sales.
Oh by the way, the last two guns my son and I purchased through a gun dealer was not actual written paperwork, they used like a tablet and you did a electronic signature at the end after answering the questions. I guess that would be easier for the ATF instead of searching through files of paperwork.
The ATF 4473 is basically a de facto gun registration. If not, then the seller would hand you the form after you passed the check as evidence that the government wouldn't keep the paperwork on you. The ATF is not suppose to build a record of gun owners from these 4473s, but the corruption within our federal government does not lead me to have confidence that they will follow the law. If the dealer goes out of business, the records go to another dealer or the ATF. If you sell a gun it is a good idea to sell only to a buyer who can present a carry permit. This proves that he is not a felon.
Thanks to the NRA we have 4473.....GOA dose not agree with this!
Good advice for Americans!
A private owner is not required by law to keep any record of personal firearm sales. Period. If a weapon you previously owned was used in a crime it does not mean you are guilty. Let them do the police work. Just because you owned it at one time does not mean you are the guilty party.
Idk about other states but, California registers weapons when you fill out a 4473. I can look up your firearms by serial numbers and I can ask dispatch if there are weapons registered at an address.
I moved to a new county. Went down to the court house to check CPL rules for this county. Clerk there said she can tell me every firearms I ever bought and owned. Asked me if I would like a look. So the statements in this video are not true on a state level. . At least in my state.
Did you get to look? Let me know the county because they are in direct violation of Federal Law and this needs to be handles asap. Now if you're in a state like california your carry firearms are listed on your conceal carry permit.
aft can go to any gun shop and get the paper work on the guns they sold.
Nice explanation. I have a number of friends that do not understand this.
If the government called the manufacturer, which then calls the distributor, which calls the FFL, how is that not registration? A paper copy is the same as a digital copy.
I never show my license to anybody but a cop that pulls me over.
Your juvenile records are SUPPOSED to be sealed...until they aren't.
I was just thinking about this yesterday. Good job explaining this process.
Big box stores like Bass Pro Shop use the computerized FAST system that uses a computerized 4473. The computers are logged on with the FBI 24/7. Simply turn it on and you are at the FAST site. The computer has the 4473 and some questions for the salesperson. It assigns a number to the 4473, which you must print out for the buyer to sign, but what guarantee is there that the information on that 4473 isn't still in the computer?
he is correct they do not track guns unless it has been in police evidence
I would like to talk to you about that. Because when bought a new gun online and had it sent to my friend, he called it in and they asked what the gun is, the name of the caliber and a lot more questions. I thought they didn't ask any of that but the funny thing is they did. Why would they need to if they are just doing a background check on me?
canada had registration, shortly there after they rounded them up. by by guns
“By law!!!!!!” You really believe that?????? Me???? I bought my first gun in 1972 and I believe they still have that form!!!! No, I am not a glass half full guy!!!! With the government I am a glass empty guy!!!! Great videos nevertheless!!!!!!!!
Walmart keeps a hard copy
Can someone give me a realistic scenario, where the government takes our guns? Why are people so concerned?
Are they going to send squads to every gun owners house, one at a time and search/seize? This would take years and years, and lots of money.
How do other people see this playing out? I don’t understand why people are worried.
All they need to know is weather a person is a felon or prohibited from owning a firearm. AND IS OF AGE.The criminal back ground check does that.
THEY DON'T NEED NOTHING ELSE.
If that were true and actually the proceedure by the fed, how come everyone in California with serialed. AR 15 lowers got a leter about their fire arm being banned and yadayada?? Proves they have a convieniently handy digitized list.😕😕 Aye??
Private sales are the way to go.
You say we have a gun registration by the 4473. I whole heartedly disagree. It is a record, not a registration. The 4473 is not designed to regulate firearms. It is a point of sale record. A registration would follow all owners of that firearm, from the dealer to civilian, from civilian to other civilian, from family member to family member. Currently in a state like TX, this is not the case. We already do not have a national gun registration and TX does not have it at the state level either. You cannot have a " gun registration " that only follows one and the original owner and only from an ffl. That in of itself infringes, discriminates and segregates people on a mass scale. Therefore it cannot be a gun registration 4473 form.
It is a record just like when purchasing a car. Name, dob, vin, social all that shit. However you must register the car separately and the mere purchasing of a car at the dealer is NOT car registration. I know you like to think that the 4473 is a form of registration because it gets sent to the fbi but by law and gun registry definition it cannot be a registration form. It is merely a form that initiates a process and is kept for record like most things are. If I keep a receipt from that gun dealer does that make me the gun registry? I think not. You can't say that " you're basically registering you're guns with that 4473, not so " and then say " we already have a gun registry " as you said in your video. Can you see how you completely contradicted yourself there?
It's either the 4473 IS the national and state level gun registry or it's not. If you go to a pawn shop and purchase a radio and commit a murder with that radio by bashing someones head in, the radio has a serial number and the cops link it back to the pawn shop. Is that a radio registry designed to regulate radios? You can't have both sides brother, pick one.
it does disappears, meaning it is archived.
My understanding, is after 20 years or if the FFL goes out of business, the 4473's go up to somewhere in DC with the ATF to a warehouse. I was told this by an ATF agent at a gun show......?????
If they go out of business Denis. Not every 20 years
Thank your for educating us on a form 4473. I am sure glad that is is not digitized!!!
Even if you don’t register your guns with the state or feds, chances are that you already “registered” them. When you buy a gun and fill out the warranty info and send it to the manufacturer, you “registered” your gun. The manufacturer now knows your name, address, what type of gun you bought, and the serial number. If the state or feds start gun confiscations, one of the first things they will do is get a warrant, subpoena, or whatever legal paperwork needed and demand the manufacturer turn over all their records and they will have no choice but to comply. Okay, so you don’t fill out the warranty paperwork for this reason. Well, I bought a Springfield Armory XDM. I did not fill out any warranty info for this reason. However, SA had a promotion where I could get three free magazines and a case with the purchase of my XDM. Guess what, I had to provide my name, type of gun, and serial number to them. I have now “registered” my gun. Say you buy an Ruger AR-15. You don’t fill out the warranty info for this reason. However, you go the Ruger website and buy AR-15 mags and a sling. Nine months later you buy some AR-15 parts and accessories. Then a couple months later you buy some 5.56 ammo at some other online website. Guess what. The feds can get all this info from these gun merchants with subpoenas and show up at your door and say, “Hey, you bought all these AR-15 parts and accessories and AR-15 ammo on line from various places, so you must have an AR-15 and we want it.” So, you are constantly registering your gun every time you make a purchase on line or with a credit card. You would have to buy your gun, not fill out the warranty, and buy all ammo and accessories locally with cash and you MAY have a chance of not getting caught by the state or feds. Of course, they’ll demand the records from UA-cam and see who’s watching all these gun videos and while that doesn’t mean you own a gun, you’ll still be on their radar.
That sounds reassuring but I don't believe it, the reason being they always read the make/model/Serial# of the weapon to the Feds during that phone call.
Check this out online. FM3-39.40 - Military Field Manual, Internment and Resettlement Operations.
I used to be an FFL holder and I remember during the "Son of Sam" investigation all FFL holders were requested to inform the FBI of any purchasers of Charter Arms 44 handgun sales, as SoS was verified as using a Charter Arms 44 cal Bulldog pistol. The only such request I ever received for any information by the FBI and I hel 2 FFLs for 22 years.
@Johnny Rep Between 10 and fifteen years ago, when California r4ules and regs became self contradictory and impossible to follow, mailed all of my records to ATF and never received notification that they ever received them. Seems par for the course to me.
Great video, so many people have no idea what really happens when you purchase a firearm. My FFL is a local deputy sheriff and he said in 15 years he has only had the police/FBI ask for those files due to a crime. He did tell me that if there is ever a gun grab or law passed to register guns that rest assured there would be a fire in his store.
If you buy from an individual you dont have to worry about any of that.
Gun owners are not law makers, the law does not require a private individual to have records of private sales.....
Nice info, good to know. It makes me feel better that records are on paper vs computer.
I totally agree with the papertrail thing on firearms even with private sales. I always do a receipt for private gun sales and a few times the person looked at my funny and gave me grief about not signing for a receipt on a gun purchase. I instantly tell em where the exit door is. Don't let the door hit your ass REAL HARD on the way out!
I got pulled for a routine traffic stop, as soon as the officer checked my license, it notified him I had a concealed carry permit. I think things go deeper than you realize.
That's standard practice. When you got your CCW they should've informed you of that. Be careful going through states that don't reciprocate because that's where you may have some trouble. State Troopers, run your out of State tag and will pull you just to check..... total bs
Kotaboy32 Tactical Oh yea, they told me it was on the license database, maybe I conform too easy, but would rather have my info out there and available, after 4 yrs in the Marines, not too worried about it, the more open and honest you are about stuff the better you look if wrongly accused of something. I caught 3 cops lying to me in me own front yard once, asked them what they were smoking. They didn't like that one bit, but they knew I was right. I told them they needed to get in the car and leave.
Great video and infos
They still have access to the maker and dealers records which is another way of saying a registry. All they have to do is grab all ffl sales records and go and pick them up.
Great explanation, thank you!
No digital copies - except the massive NSA data farms.
Kotaboy32 what you have in the video is what was explained to me a number of years ago. Your explanation matched what I was told... Good video...