Nadeshot being more involved with pro CoD again is a W. It sucks we go from 4 teams to 3 but those games between the 3 gonna feel like major finals even during LAN matches
i agree but also look at it as the reg season games are gonna be good... like if teams arnt play 1 of the top 3, they are all going to be close and pretty unpredictable so it makes for better watching... just like watching the top 3 play eachother without the excitement. if that makes sense
for one of the majors you guys should try to get one big watch party. Like a faze optic and 100T watch party with everyone. It’ll be like the barstool guys when they watch football😂
Optic won champs. They have the ring. They are top of S for mw3. Why are we pretending pats optic hate is fair, when every other year EVER, the team with the ring is Top of S… Faze dropped out of champs top 6… and in any other year, would have broken up the trio. Weighting faze over them, regardless of the ewc, (a single elim bracket) or the 7-1 record is the worst example of recency bias I’ve ever seen on the flank. Optic won when it mattered the most…
Exactly and TWO teams had Faze's number last year to Optic's one. Idk why they're not mentioning that though. Not to mention Optic beat Faze and didn't lose to them in the last 3/5ths of the season.
A great episode! Good analysis all around and really interesting to hear everyone’s rationale and points of view. Definitely even further made me excited for the season and most importantly made the outside of the top 3 interesting because that was a big issue last year that outside the top 4 was lacklustre and just felt neither audience nor players cared too much. Thanks again
zooma love the flank, been watching about a year now. any chance you can try to make the timestamps at the complete accurate time, It usually doesn’t bother me but hearing ben j yap about “soccer and its success lonely success in the G leagues of sports” when trying to see the tier list kinda bothered me. (Love the flank and just kidding except for Penj yapping”
If you look at this from a variance perspective like they do in poker, if Optic and Faze are equal, there is still a decent chance that one could sweep the other for a whole year. The head to head record over an 8 or so match sample size doesn't necessarily mean one team is better than the other, especially if most of the games were close.
Man, its so dope to see nade really want to win and be back in cod. He did this shit himself 10+ years ago, he knows how to do this shit. shoutout nade, keep building cod man.
I guess I’m an old head now in cod, but the days of nadeshot and scump competing on who was starting stream first for the viewership was the peak of content. I’m hoping that the minimum salary being gone sparks some of that competitive streams. Havok took it serious and look what happened to him.
I need yall to figure out what the philosophy is for a tier list. Cause half of you wanna talk the past, half wanna talk the future. Atp you should each just make your own list and reveal them one tier at a time and debate that way 🤷♂️
"theres only one sport where the 2nd tier players arent struggling and thats soccer" "College footballers make bank tho" "Ok theres only 2 sports" Meanwhile, im over here thinking of atleast a dozen sports where the 2nd tier get paid plenty enough to live comfortably. Not Bens best take ever.
The league really needs stricter salary caps etc… if they limited each team to how much they could spend on a player like any other pro sport (NBA, NFL, etc..) it would prevent these super teams and allow for smaller teams to actually acquire t10 players
If the Vegas Falcons just waited for the off season to unfold, they could have the LA Thieves team. And with their money, they will have to LA Thieves team next year or the year after.
Mack on Surge was like Karma on Optic. He was the scapegoat when the worst player on his team in Vanguard was Lamar. It's been 3 years and I still know that if surge are playing Berlin SND. Lamar is sitting in that back spawn building in every life. Mack deserved more credit on that team.
Considering faze won champs (and ran the online circuit) the last treyarch game id say theyre the best team going into the year. Not to mention theyve been second place in everything since. Never leaving the top two power rankings in like 5 years. They dont get enough credit tbh. And im an optic fan
When Ben says “hold on” I lose it every time, please have a word Tom, its so hard to listen to. He’s the one we want to hear from the least but he talks the most
i usually dont care about pats takes but judging by last year optic and faze are even at number 1. both won two majors, faze was really disappöionting at champs, not as disappointing as optic in major 4 but its champs. lat is anew team so does not matter how the roster looks on paper they cant be above faze and optic. i think its pretty easy right now at this time to rank these three.
One thing I have been thinking about is with there being 3 god teams compared to 4 does that mean every major one of the top 3 will have free road to winners final and other 2 will have to play each other for it compared to last year it not always but sometimes was just each side of winners having top 4 vs top 4 and winners match in winner finals
Optic Fan 1. Faze. 2. Optic 3. LA I look at it with the issue of each team. LA are untested so you cant say who is better until we see some games. Optic is 2 because of 3 issues, Slow stats, SnD, and Pred. Honestly I think all of these issues come back to Pred. Optic slow starts always to me come back to who is taking that initial engagement. Shotzzy to me is at his best when he can just get lost flip spawns and hit people from weird and sometimes ratty/nerdy angles. When this happens optic just loses that player that's just pushing front. Pred would slow his game down in times he just needs to push face and take fights. Honestly I feel a lot of optics issues revolves around Pred not playing like the player that they picked up. And Faze can have a similar issue where a lot of their issues are falls around cellium not playing with his team taking weird nerdy ratty spots and not getting the most out of the engagement he's getting. All three of these teams are 1, 2, 3 and the difference between them is going to be who figures out those issues the quickest and can maintain this level without falling back on those issues mid season.
@@PurpleWeasel1323 yeah but illey still played this past season and was Seattle's best player (granted he was faded). Mack hasnt touched the game for a full year.
@@legacys24how do we know Mack hasn’t touched the game? He could’ve easily been playing. Shotzzy has already leaked that Illey hasn’t been on COD in months. Completely different situations lmfao
I wish I would have made it to asked them what they think about BO6 being like BO4 now they updated it to the point everyone has stims and it just refills after u get kills or time goes on in said match 🙌🏾🐐
Dumb question but if 100t bought hydra out and another team offers him more does 100t get there money back on buy out and other team needs to pay the buy out?
I don't think it would ever be two separate deals. For example I don't think it's buyout, free agency, signing. I think it's buyout-signing, if that makes sense, there is no gap period in between where a team can swindle themselves in and steal the player. At least thats my understanding
Personally as nasty as LAT look, putting them in S tier is a insult to FaZe and OpTic considering they are both coming into this year with chips, LAT can very easily win everything this year but could also just as easily flop, would of made alot more sense having the 2 best teams from last year S tier and LAT A tier.
The whole "path to pro" debate was absolutely faded from Chris and Patt. It was simply full of non sequiturs. Just because it isn't the best system or there are better systems that players are starting to favor, it doesn't therefore follow that Challengers gets you no exposure and has no influence on getting you picked up by a pro team.
Bens point about the "All Tier 2 leagues in pro sports and esports" does he not realize the CDL isn't really succeeding. It's living on as a stable Tier 2 Esport but that doesn't mean its necessarily successful. If the foundation for the sport isn't popular (CDL Challengers) it just wont get the resources to improve or grow simple as that.
@zoomaa when aches was going IN on Priestahh, felt like you should have defended him a bit. You’ve been vocal on how Preston is a good player, should have had some debate with aches there u missed the opportunity
Ben saying that soccer is the only sport where they can develop players before they reach pro is such an L take. If any of you are baseball fans, especially Detroit Tigers, you can see that THIS year, we have the youngest baseball team in the major league with only one player on the current roster having past experience in the postseason. That is also stating the fact that the Tigers went on a 31-11 run the last two months after having a 0.02% chance to reach the postseason with a young squad. To say that soccer can only develop players before pro or even at the pro level, is so wrong and as well as being close minded. I usually don't comment at takes or opinions but that kind of threw me off and I thought I should say something. The Minor League system in baseball (depending on the org) can definitely develop prospects and get them to The Show in general.
It's up there in recent times, but confident theres been waaay longer in the past, can you imagine they did a 24 hour stream of The Flank, that would be insane lol, imagine the crash outs!
Nadeshot being more involved with pro CoD again is a W. It sucks we go from 4 teams to 3 but those games between the 3 gonna feel like major finals even during LAN matches
Top 3 is better than top 4. A top 4 would always have the same teams on sunday, but a top 3 will probably have a new 4th on sunday
i agree but also look at it as the reg season games are gonna be good... like if teams arnt play 1 of the top 3, they are all going to be close and pretty unpredictable so it makes for better watching... just like watching the top 3 play eachother without the excitement. if that makes sense
There will likely be a top 4 again once Falcons drops a bag for a team
@@jumpingilly732 not happening until next year tho
@@youafruitcupyeah most likely and idk who they even try to buy away from top 3 or whoever’s leftover
Pat is an S tier hater, gotta give it to him
He always plays his role correctly, in and out of game
He owned optic during his playing days, he’s a goat fella
@@alextv293 you'd think for a guy who had as much success against a team as he had, that team wouldn't live rent free in the guy's head lmfao
@ItsManana do you actually think pat cares. Its a fucking a esport for christ sake. Its optic fans with pat in their heads rent free.
@@ItsMananaBro is trolling delusional OpTic fans 🤣 He clearly knows they are a great team
- Someone makes a point
- Ben J “h-h-hold on, hold on”
CAN I FINISH MY POINT OR AM I GOING TO BE INTERRUPTED AGAIN
@@adamhachey8461 This is chalked. I can't make my point. 😂
Envoy has been on some the most stacked rosters.
Idk how he does this
@@SantosLPs talent
@@SantosLPs lol he’s just a great teammate so all those teams want him
@@ahasman1😂 grow up, he’s washed.
@@alextv293get some glasses fam, he ain't washed lmao
for one of the majors you guys should try to get one big watch party. Like a faze optic and 100T watch party with everyone. It’ll be like the barstool guys when they watch football😂
Love the content though guys, I appreciate everything you all do for the community
Watched the debate instead of the flank live like a paisan. Forgive me boss
You’re watching a yappathon either way bud
@@kunalgupta9713haven’t watched yet but that’s a sure bet lol
@@kunalgupta9713lmfaoao
Yap vs yap hmmm I choose yap
Understandable boss enjoy the show 🫡
Another W Flank
Joewo!
Stop using a CHRONUS Joe
Please don't run from Biffle on LAN ever again
Its the "movement king" that turns into a crab on lan.
U have walls when u play from home....You're a meme
Can we just agree that the Flank would be better if Ben stood as the behind the scene role ?
No we can’t buddy speak for yourself
@@kylegregory7530 that’s why it’s a question.
@@zMythx no thank you
@@kylegregory7530 you’re special
@@zMythx “can we all agree” that’s cute
Optic won champs. They have the ring. They are top of S for mw3. Why are we pretending pats optic hate is fair, when every other year EVER, the team with the ring is Top of S…
Faze dropped out of champs top 6… and in any other year, would have broken up the trio. Weighting faze over them, regardless of the ewc, (a single elim bracket) or the 7-1 record is the worst example of recency bias I’ve ever seen on the flank.
Optic won when it mattered the most…
If faze beating optic sways your opinion then put LAT at the top of S because Scrap cyberbullied faze all year
Exactly and TWO teams had Faze's number last year to Optic's one. Idk why they're not mentioning that though. Not to mention Optic beat Faze and didn't lose to them in the last 3/5ths of the season.
W Flank. Ben instantly roasted & nadeshot special guest. What an amazing episode
Need 3 hour long episodes more
"Can I finish my point, or are you going to keep interrupting" is a sentence that no adult man should ever say.
Dope having guests back on the flank!! Reminds me of the old days
20 minutes in , haggy and sam haven’t said a word 😭 free em
tbf the floor is set for nade
Well you obviously aren’t paying attention
They where talking to nade duh and tbh I like haggy but he rants forever sometimes
Haha. Haggy for sure made up for it after it though
A great episode! Good analysis all around and really interesting to hear everyone’s rationale and points of view. Definitely even further made me excited for the season and most importantly made the outside of the top 3 interesting because that was a big issue last year that outside the top 4 was lacklustre and just felt neither audience nor players cared too much. Thanks again
You gotta tip pat for the faze glaze that boy sweet like an orange peel
Haven’t heard this one before
zooma love the flank, been watching about a year now. any chance you can try to make the timestamps at the complete accurate time, It usually doesn’t bother me but hearing ben j yap about “soccer and its success lonely success in the G leagues of sports” when trying to see the tier list kinda bothered me. (Love the flank and just kidding except for Penj yapping”
They’re there now
That nadeshot vs. Aches thumbnail is comedy, I probably watched that video like 10 yrs ago 😂😂 holy shit time flies
Love Ben J being Ben J within 30 seconds of starting. The man has no social etiquette haha
Pat: "Faze is obviously S tier because they just won a championship"
Pat about the team that just won champs: "I think they're A tier"
29:50 “That’s nice Matt, thank you for sharing 😊” 😂
“Path to my ass” was fuckin hilarious Haggy😂😂😂😂😂
Did octane say what I think he said at 29:52?? Wtf is wrong with this guy
death penalty i fear
I can’t believe Nade let that slide wtf … who says shit like that
I’d lose my shit tbh, octane needs to be checked
Bro I thought I was the only one who heard that
@@kyleadams3610 he might have said pet. Idk
The optic disrespect is crazy it was there first year together and the won champs
If you look at this from a variance perspective like they do in poker, if Optic and Faze are equal, there is still a decent chance that one could sweep the other for a whole year. The head to head record over an 8 or so match sample size doesn't necessarily mean one team is better than the other, especially if most of the games were close.
Man, its so dope to see nade really want to win and be back in cod. He did this shit himself 10+ years ago, he knows how to do this shit. shoutout nade, keep building cod man.
I guess I’m an old head now in cod, but the days of nadeshot and scump competing on who was starting stream first for the viewership was the peak of content. I’m hoping that the minimum salary being gone sparks some of that competitive streams. Havok took it serious and look what happened to him.
Nadeshot & Aches on a pod in 2024. 🔥
Lmfao I love ACHES he’s the man also FAZE TF UP
I need yall to figure out what the philosophy is for a tier list. Cause half of you wanna talk the past, half wanna talk the future. Atp you should each just make your own list and reveal them one tier at a time and debate that way 🤷♂️
Zoomaa paying Aches for the flank is hilarious
here for the LAT hype
I think overall these teams are more balanced than they were for MW3. Even with the LAT super team I feel like there will be more upsets
"theres only one sport where the 2nd tier players arent struggling and thats soccer"
"College footballers make bank tho"
"Ok theres only 2 sports"
Meanwhile, im over here thinking of atleast a dozen sports where the 2nd tier get paid plenty enough to live comfortably. Not Bens best take ever.
Something about throwing on the flank while at work keeps me sane im so hype for this upcoming season 🙏
Deadest opinions coming from aches as always
Hes speaking facts tho
Ben J Rizzim is worse imo
guys just salty at everything cos xdefiant my be the worst fps made
@@rxlphie6742 you optic guys just salty cause hes spitting facts lmao 🤣 😂
@@juannito6318 not an optic fan his opinions are just shit. How’s that sib team not better than legion last year 💀
Benjamin beans is gonna be a breakout AR, he has exactly what he needs to perform well
Happy that you guys are realistic and put optic first ! They won the biggest tournament of the year plus earned the most money this year !
Parasite ring checking that fraud was comedy. One of the greatest and smartest to ever do it
Can't wait for the new cdl season!
The league really needs stricter salary caps etc… if they limited each team to how much they could spend on a player like any other pro sport (NBA, NFL, etc..) it would prevent these super teams and allow for smaller teams to actually acquire t10 players
Gentlemates are basically NYSL lower case
Twitch chat makes me lose brain cells. Half these dopes don’t know much outside of L1 and R1.
If the Vegas Falcons just waited for the off season to unfold, they could have the LA Thieves team. And with their money, they will have to LA Thieves team next year or the year after.
Shoutout to Nade man, yapped for 30 minutes straight (no water breaks) so inspirational!
How does OpTic win champs and move down a tier. Pat is a pure hater 💀
Mack on Surge was like Karma on Optic. He was the scapegoat when the worst player on his team in Vanguard was Lamar. It's been 3 years and I still know that if surge are playing Berlin SND. Lamar is sitting in that back spawn building in every life. Mack deserved more credit on that team.
Considering faze won champs (and ran the online circuit) the last treyarch game id say theyre the best team going into the year. Not to mention theyve been second place in everything since. Never leaving the top two power rankings in like 5 years. They dont get enough credit tbh. And im an optic fan
A minute in and Ben is already tweaking. Get em outta here lol
😂😂😂😂😂 Ben's knew he did it way to early 😂😂😂
Man I really hope Envoy has a good season.
Envoy back at thieves is my favorite part of the whole thing
W youtube promo nade im tuning into the watch parties
People forget how unstoppable simp/abezy are in treyarch games
GentleMates really got a Paco from Temu/Alibaba and called it a day
When Ben says “hold on” I lose it every time, please have a word Tom, its so hard to listen to. He’s the one we want to hear from the least but he talks the most
LMAOOOO I'm crying guy in chat " dip in challengers duarte"
Optic winning champs again going back to back
i usually dont care about pats takes but judging by last year optic and faze are even at number 1. both won two majors, faze was really disappöionting at champs, not as disappointing as optic in major 4 but its champs. lat is anew team so does not matter how the roster looks on paper they cant be above faze and optic. i think its pretty easy right now at this time to rank these three.
Damn Adam Adamou broke GA's... No scrims for month
One thing I have been thinking about is with there being 3 god teams compared to 4 does that mean every major one of the top 3 will have free road to winners final and other 2 will have to play each other for it compared to last year it not always but sometimes was just each side of winners having top 4 vs top 4 and winners match in winner finals
WHAT did Octane say at 29:56??
A 2 hour flank I wonder why?? (Nadeshot probably)
No. Read the timestamps
King of yappin but we love him
I might be the only one in this, but I feel like a lot of orgs built good teams this season and could be very competitive (praying it’s true 🙏🏾)
The Flank Tier List
S: Zoomaa, Octane
A: Parasite
B:
C: Ben J
D: Aches
S: Aches
A: ZooMaa, Parasite, Octane
B:
C:
D:
HELL: Ben
Optic Fan
1. Faze. 2. Optic 3. LA
I look at it with the issue of each team. LA are untested so you cant say who is better until we see some games. Optic is 2 because of 3 issues, Slow stats, SnD, and Pred. Honestly I think all of these issues come back to Pred. Optic slow starts always to me come back to who is taking that initial engagement. Shotzzy to me is at his best when he can just get lost flip spawns and hit people from weird and sometimes ratty/nerdy angles. When this happens optic just loses that player that's just pushing front. Pred would slow his game down in times he just needs to push face and take fights. Honestly I feel a lot of optics issues revolves around Pred not playing like the player that they picked up. And Faze can have a similar issue where a lot of their issues are falls around cellium not playing with his team taking weird nerdy ratty spots and not getting the most out of the engagement he's getting.
All three of these teams are 1, 2, 3 and the difference between them is going to be who figures out those issues the quickest and can maintain this level without falling back on those issues mid season.
Does zooma not play competitive nomore ?
I like the Attach and Sib duo
I mean, teams looked at the challengers system last year and now Lynz, Gwin, Gio, Reall, Abuzah, Estreal, Kremp are in the league
40:06 that point zoomaa made about Mack made no sense when the last episode they literally used the argument that illey hasn’t played.
mack hasnt played in a year out of game stuff, illey hasn't played a full season in years f
@@PurpleWeasel1323 yeah but illey still played this past season and was Seattle's best player (granted he was faded). Mack hasnt touched the game for a full year.
@@legacys24how do we know Mack hasn’t touched the game? He could’ve easily been playing. Shotzzy has already leaked that Illey hasn’t been on COD in months. Completely different situations lmfao
@@jnewb true
@@legacys24out of game shit bro
I wish I would have made it to asked them what they think about BO6 being like BO4 now they updated it to the point everyone has stims and it just refills after u get kills or time goes on in said match 🙌🏾🐐
Gunless to Rokkr for the main AR feels like a must
Bro everything Tom said at the start of that top 3 debate was incorrect 😂
Dumb question but if 100t bought hydra out and another team offers him more does 100t get there money back on buy out and other team needs to pay the buy out?
I don't think it would ever be two separate deals. For example I don't think it's buyout, free agency, signing. I think it's buyout-signing, if that makes sense, there is no gap period in between where a team can swindle themselves in and steal the player. At least thats my understanding
Chris had a TON to say this episode. Madone.
Mack is gonna play sub? I could be wrong but I feel like he only played sub in the first MW, maybe it’s just the break he took.
I feel like lat could have a year like cold war faze and playing from Texas I feel there online games will be nuts also
this is the most ads ive ever seen on a flank yt upload. please don't continue this
Cobra and mythix hello @loony, stack talent with that trio
Personally as nasty as LAT look, putting them in S tier is a insult to FaZe and OpTic considering they are both coming into this year with chips, LAT can very easily win everything this year but could also just as easily flop, would of made alot more sense having the 2 best teams from last year S tier and LAT A tier.
Ben is right, the league is full of Challenger players who proved themselves. Aches crashes out and chatters just clap like walruses lmao.
The whole "path to pro" debate was absolutely faded from Chris and Patt. It was simply full of non sequiturs. Just because it isn't the best system or there are better systems that players are starting to favor, it doesn't therefore follow that Challengers gets you no exposure and has no influence on getting you picked up by a pro team.
I think Lynz will turn up this year watch
Slasher might could make a t16 challenger team better lowkey
Gio estreal and Huke might be the 4th team for top 4 they are gonna be flying
hell no
Tom was so use to optic smoking faze the past 2 years is crazy
PTSD hit him hard
Bens point about the "All Tier 2 leagues in pro sports and esports" does he not realize the CDL isn't really succeeding. It's living on as a stable Tier 2 Esport but that doesn't mean its necessarily successful. If the foundation for the sport isn't popular (CDL Challengers) it just wont get the resources to improve or grow simple as that.
@zoomaa when aches was going IN on Priestahh, felt like you should have defended him a bit. You’ve been vocal on how Preston is a good player, should have had some debate with aches there u missed the opportunity
Ben saying that soccer is the only sport where they can develop players before they reach pro is such an L take. If any of you are baseball fans, especially Detroit Tigers, you can see that THIS year, we have the youngest baseball team in the major league with only one player on the current roster having past experience in the postseason. That is also stating the fact that the Tigers went on a 31-11 run the last two months after having a 0.02% chance to reach the postseason with a young squad. To say that soccer can only develop players before pro or even at the pro level, is so wrong and as well as being close minded. I usually don't comment at takes or opinions but that kind of threw me off and I thought I should say something. The Minor League system in baseball (depending on the org) can definitely develop prospects and get them to The Show in general.
I love how when optic was running Faze pockets in vanguard/mw2 they still had faze on top but now it’s the other way around Faze is still better 😂
Aches when is Toronto Ultra gonna win champs ? 2027 or 2028 ?
pat the nanlite pavotube lights are a little cheaper.
The flank would undeniably be the best cod podcast Ever if benj didn’t talk as much
GET NADE ON THE WATCHPARTY PLEEEEEEAAAAASSSSSSSEEEEE
Is this not the longest Flank show?
It's up there in recent times, but confident theres been waaay longer in the past, can you imagine they did a 24 hour stream of The Flank, that would be insane lol, imagine the crash outs!
yo pat is comedy lmao
Looking for players for ranked in November
Disappointed with chat 4:49 No said Big stretch for my dog in the back😢
No Ben you cannot 1:13:40
I like c9 but i believe a mack nero duo would be better than kremp