INSULATING STUD WALLS - Step 2 of 2
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- Опубліковано 31 лип 2024
- Second Layer Insulation and Vapour Barrier. This layer breaks the bridge the studs create and also by staggering joins makes sure none of the insulation joins carry all the way through. Whatever you insulate with whether it be a wool type, sprayed, loose or board, the importance of a vapour barrier shouldn't be underestimated. For the cost of a few rolls of tape or sheeting it's better to be safe than sorry.
In a higher spec reno or new build you would be using around double the thicknesses similar to how we did in the main house.
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Better insulated than most homes I've lived in 🙋🙋🙋
Great video thanks for sharing.
Great info just doing mine and was thinking do I really need to tape as very expensive, but now it makes sense👍🏻
Happy New Year!
its really good, my new build house just has 50mm insulated plasterboard, air gap, breeze block, air gap, membrane, brick skin. Yours looks much better..
Blimey, Gilbert O’Sullivan singing in the background, took me back a few years!😀
You are very good job
Really helpful series, thinking of splitting our garage to add a utility room.
Hi David did you ever do it? I’m just about to split mine to be an office.
Tim, you played No 9 didn’t you ? Great videos and lots of diy talent. Well done for all your work mate
Wouldn’t recommend dabbing to insulation but apart from that you’re knowledge is excellent for someone not in the trade. Let’s face it though, having followed you for a long while, you’re practically a tradie now, and a bloody good one! Love the videos mate, keep it up!
Thanks, I’ll stick to extreme diyer for now! I just use a bead of the gun grade board fix as a back up. Obviously it relies on the insulation being secured well but that’s done by the drywall screws too. 👍
Hi thanks for the video.
Do you always have to insulate in between the studs or can you insulate just over the top before your plasterboard?
I know you've done both but what are the pro's and cons?
I'm thinking of just insulating over the top (2 internal stud walls) to save a bit of money (less insulation wastage on these particular walls) AND I'm thinking it will be better for sound insulation as will have a gap in between the both sides (the wooden frame).
Any advice would be greatly appreciated as I top have an old house I'm doing up.
Hi tim do you have to put air brick in is it best floor level or high level if my garage is air tight no sure mate iv do the roof up to yet and the walls are just been painted and false floor and that will be insulation under it can you put me right please thanks
We did a very similar detail on the barn conversion but the one thing that I really wasn’t happy with after all the sealing and tape was fixing the plasterboard through what is the vapour barrier into the studs. Thats hundreds of penetrations and I know they are regarded as essentially self sealing but it just didn’t feel right. Love following your build and many thanks for sharing 👍
The way I've done it in the past (and about to do again) is to batten over the PIR board and then screw the plasterboard to the battens, that still leaves you with about 3-4 screws per batten.
To seal these holes I pre-drilled the battens and started the screws, then put a big blob of builders silicone over the hole and screw point. Then just put the batten on the wall and screw through. You have then sealed each hole with silicone. Its an added step, but only takes seconds if you were going to batten anyway. I was using battens to give a void for services (as Tim mentions in the vid).
James Marriott actually James that sounds like a much better solution sealing each penetration with silicone. As you say an extra step but I’m guessing once you are up to speed and into the rhythm of the thing, the extra step isn’t a big deal, thank you 👍
@@ThePhilandPam Indeed, the battens came in bundles 3x3, so I drilled 3 at a time, laid on a pair of tressels and ran in 27 screws in a batch and then blobbed on 27 dabs of silicone. About 5mins to do a bundle if you have the stuff to hand.
I give it about 20mins before a tradie pops up and tells me its not necessary and I don't know what I'm talking about. But I was happy with the result. :-)
James Marriott I like the sound of that, I’d feel a lot happier knowing my vapour barrier was actually vapour proof, that’s the way to go 👍
Just found your videos, you are incredibly good at explaining things in simple terms and don’t make me feel stupid! I’m planning on frame insulating and boarding on the inside of my garage door to try and insulate the garage to make it slightly more usable. Do you think the extra layer of insulation is always required ?
Depends if the added weight or width will affect the door opening and closing, (if still in use) if still being used as a garage I would suggest bonding the insulation directly to door if possible and draft proof the gaps with suitable seals.
How do you access the electric outlet boxes, the water pipes, ventilation, and temperature conditioning?
It seems super insulated, but how do you get fresh air, and how do you cool and heat the space?
Is this only a living or sleeping room?
If it were my build and I ran wiring after insulation I would use wall mounted conduit tubing and outlet boxes. same style you see in many brick schools and basements.
What type of tape is that your sealing the insulation with ?
I know you said that one of the walls was an internal one through to the next room and you weren't going to insulate it.
However, I would personally.
As you have done such a high grade job so far I would carry on.
When internal walls are insulated they can make it easier to keep certain rooms at different temperatures.
You may want some rooms to be warmer and others cooler and with insulated walls all round that room becomes easier to control temperature wise.
Just a thought from someone who enjoys your videos and has never had the opportunity to do what you are doing.
Hello Tim. Thanks for your videos. I have started insulating the loft. Living in the UK after living in the tropics for most of my life is interesting. Building in the tropics was a lot easier. You mentioned that you buy seconds of the insulation. Please could you tell me whom you buy from. Regards.
Seconds and Co.
Really enjoy the TRC videos! How did you tape the inside corners? I’ve used a straight-edge, short pieces and foul language. Wondering if there might be a better technique...
Just crease it first and then try and get the point in the corner before you stick the rest. Not that easy with the basic foil tape.
And what did you do so plasterboard installers can find their attachment points, be it studs or joists?
Bonding the boards together is a really great tip, i have loads of 50mm boards left from a previous project. I wanted to use 100mm between my studs, but I'll use up my 50mm boards first before ordering anymore! Without loosing ceiling height do you have any tips for installing down lights in a foil insulation roof? I was considering leaving a small void in the foil insulation, packing with some mineral wool and using a fire rated housing for the LED's.
If you have the height to allow for counter batons that is always the best way. You can then run all of your cables and lighting underneath the foil surface.
It's a little overkill. The kingspan can be replaced with a standard polyurethane insulation with no foil and then a final vapour barrier installation be it a tacked viscreen and plasterboard or a foil backed plasterboard.
I have an old house, where the external walls aren't insulated and I have high level of condensation on the windows in the morning. This is causing dampness on the lower level of the wall and the corners (second floor bedroom).
I'm looking at battening, insulating with PIR between then moreover with PIR sealing any joints etc, then lastly plasterboard. Would a vapour barrier or moisture barrier be required before the battening?
Thanks in advance.
We have an old solid wall un insulated house and the last thing I would do is use pir on the walls. The first thing would be to sort ventilation, then get walls breathable. You could then look at breathable insulation materials. I will be doing a video shortly on this as it’s a tricky topic. Very tempting to just stud out and insults however there are so many risks it’s not a quick decision. If you did do it with pir then yes a seamless perfect vapour barrier would be needed but that is very hard in a renovation scenario.
I'm turning my garage into a workshop, been planning (overthinking) for a while. For me, do you think I could just get away with insulating between studs only? And just OSB over instead.
Did you ever complete your garage conversion? How did it go with the insulation?
what happens when you screw the plasterboard into the studs? Don't you break the vapour barrier?
Thanks for explaining how the vapour barrier works, I’ve built a new shed, workshop, and I’m insulting it with 50mm polystyrene should I go over it with polythene do you think 🤔
Depends on how you heat it, what the finished walls are and also whether the gap beyond the eps is well vented. Might not be needed but eps is breathable.
The Restoration Couple thanks for your reply 👍
That's going to be the warmest room on the house haha
Or the coldest 😂
Maybe I'm overthinking this but how would you prevent thermal bridging through the joists if you put a warm roof on a single skin garage?
Great vids btw!
Thanks.
A self adhesive vapour barrier below the insulation. The only bridging is the screws for the top OSB board layer above the insulation. So osb above the joises, vapout barier insulation tape seams then osb and water proofing like owl lava or iko roof star. Don't cheap out on the vapour barrier or the water proofing.
Will you still get phone signal?
What are you doing to thermal seal the gaps at the bottom of the insulation? Some of the gaps looked pretty big.
Floor being raised with insulation so will join walls.
Fantastic job Tim! Am interested in vapour control though when insulating between stud framework will be about 50mm off an external 140 year old rubble wall that was obviously intended to evaporate water internally when thoroughly wet from rain. I'm concerned that a vapour control barrier will trap this moisture ,that has passed through the solid wall, within the air gap. In many ways I'll be happy to lose some of the value of insulation by not having it too tightly sealed as maybe it would make sense to ensure the gap has some airflow through it? I'd be very interested in your thoughts Tim and thank you very much for the videos.
We decided not to insulate our main house solid walls for the same reason/risks. It is possible but can lead to other issues. If you don’t do a breathable internal insulation then a complete sealed option would be only option I would probably consider. That does however mean that you would need to insulate all walls including between joists where they meet wall as that can end up as a super cold spot/ condensation. That said we did stud off the stone wall in the garage conversion but vented the cavity behind. Safest option but more expensive would be breathable board and plaster. Remember whatever route you go you should go through building regs anyway for IWI so they will likely have own views.
@@TheRestorationCouple Thank you very much for your helpful thoughts on this Tim. I've long been tempted to go down the route of a breathable internal insulation, vent the cavity and maybe even drill a series of inconspicuous fine holes to enhance air flow in there. All seems a bit counter-intuitive I know. Anyway, good luck with the restoration your videos are tremendous.
I steped the insulation of the wall 2cm with studs and left air gaps top and bottom. It makes hanging the plasterboard fun but 2 years later all seams fine. Left an ispection hole to check now and again (a black socket!). @@jimmcdonald6465
With all the insulation how do you intend to keep ventilated from stale and damp air without heat loss? We may be taking on a house renovation soon and I am struggling to find a retrofit solution to an older house to solve the problem of removing damp air without heat loss.
Mvhr unit. Single unit is an easy install if not doing full time renovation.
The Restoration Couple do you recommend one or do you have a go-to one?
Vapour barrier that you have place outside is this just to prottect timber ? you have mentioned that foil is already vapour barrier from the factory. Or is vapour barrier outside is different from vapour barrier inside ? I will be converting horsebox, that is wooden , i will be using kingspan and then interior cladding, where do i need that barrier ? outside of kingspan , inside or both ? Can you also explain if they are different materials, i know what are they for, but aren't they the same ? cheers
The membrane on the outside is just like roofing membrane and breathable. It is just to keep timbers protected should moisture ever get in to cavity and during construction when they were exposed. I doubt they would be needed in your case.
I was planning on doing this to my garage but it looks like you lose a lot of space 🤔
I’m no expert but is that much insulation necessary?
A lil diff from what im use 2 seeing
Not heard off insulated backed plasterboard
Correct me if I’m wrong but when you are fixing the plasterboard to the studs with screws are you not piercing the vapour proof barrier?
A screw essentially self seals as it goes through the which is sufficient to retain its vapour tightness, especially when skimmed over after. Another way is to counter batten first however you will still not avoid some fixings penetrating.
@@TheRestorationCouple Thanks for replying, about to do my own garage conversion in the summer, thanks for sharing the knowledge
Taping up the insulation fixings and joins, but then penetrating the pir with a plaster board screw when hanging the gypsum? Is that a building regulations code or just had the time and tape so doesn't hurt to do? Hope you met your deadline and excited to see what happens next!!
I was an avid watcher of Holmes on Homes and always wondered the same thing. Mike would always bang on about warm, cold side and stopping air movement, then like you commented hang the drywall with a screw through the vapour barrier membrane. It always perplexed me (Jackie Chan meme face) how in Mike's case he was very pro/for stopping air movement but then put lots of holes in the thing that was stopping that air movement. Now granted I am no builder so what do I know, but it always struck me as a thing to be at odds with.
Taping the joints is the main barrier, screws or nails through the vcl are almost self sealing, certainly enough to not compromise it. I read some research on it a few years back when we did all the suspended floors and was reassured. Different story perhaps if you were going airtight. In the van conversion I battened over pir and then taped over that which solved it.
I can't see air or vapour getting through a screw in a wall
Where do you run you able in the insulated stud walls?
Either along cavity behind and come through, create a service void with battens over insulation before plasterboard or in the case of the garage conversion brought along conduit below floor level and up to sockets.
What's the make of the respirator you use, really need to buy one as just using a dust mask🙄
Think it’s called eclipse, found at screwfix and other places and filters replaceable. Good seal.
@@TheRestorationCouple I've found it cheers 👌
Where do you run the electrics and fit Lights and back box ?
Future video. Either inside a service void if you counter batten over insulation or in this case it was run along floor and up in conduit.
The Restoration Couple look forward to next video. Thanks for reply
what about lights and power? all surface?
Conduit along and up. The floor will be raised. It’s in the next video. Lighting will be dropped through as a central fitting but waiting until I’ve designed it. 👍
Hi Tim, I have a timber framed building/utility room on the side of my house I built and have insulated between the studs like you, but was then was going to put plater board up, I didn’t know you had to have a second layer of insulation?
On the outside it had a breathable membrane then rendered, inside there is a 25mm air gap then the insulation between the studs, then I was going to plasterboard and have plastered, is that not right?
Usually, insulated plasterboard or a layer of insulation is needed to get to the required u value. It can be done without but a vapour barrier is still vital and you will have some potential cold bridging.
Hi nice video but, Where does all the vapor goes after all this insulation ?
Do you have a ventilation system ?
Just passive ventilation through vents to outside. A larger more airtight build would be best suited with MVHR.
Was the garage single brick
Yes, block and brick.
What happens to the Vapour barrier when you screw your screws through the batons in
preparation for the plasterboard is the Vapour barrier not compromised?
Regards Robert
I think he covered this one in the loft conversion series, think what he said was the screws are sharp and so only make a tiny penetration. I have not heard of problems from this anyway.
Have you looked at using a triso super 10 quilted insulation. We use this on our projects now and tend to stay away from pir board.
It's neater,tidyer and also saves a lot of money.
In the video when the insulation was delivered, Tim mentioned that the panels were reclaimed (one of the advantages of rigid foam board insulation).
Just curious, why do you try to avoid PIR? Besides having one of the highest R/U values for a given thickness, PIR is usually faced on both sides, one usually foil that's a great vapor retarder, and it's hydrophobic. As a thermoset plastic, PIR can't be melted. As such, it chars over in the presence of flame. Additionally, the blowing agents used in the manufacture of PIR aren't harmful to the environment.
@@ARepublicIfYouCanKeepIt .yeah I did hear that, but the performance of the triso far outperforms pir board.for instance I use 30mm pir board then cross line it with triso,tape the joints then cross batton and plaster board.this equates to the equivalent 150mm of pir.
The saving is substantial and the quality of the job (in my opinion) is far superior.most of my local building inspectors now recommended this,also due to it being a quilt it makes it far easier to line a roof,hips awkward angles etc and makes for a far more airtight seal and would take me literally half the time of pir board.
Looked at using it on the loft but at the time bco were sceptical. Seems like it’s a good option in some scenarios though so may look again. For this project it made sense to get a whole bulk load of boards as they were needed for floating floors and ufh setup in another room anyway so just did it all the same.
@@TheRestorationCouple absolutely,I wasn't criticising how you did it as it's exactly how I did for the last 10 years. Since I've switched to multi layer quilt insulation I'd never move back. I tend to get less wastage and mess as well,when I've finished a job I just roll it back up for the next project!
When it comes to insulation and preventing water penetration, there is no such thing as overkill.
If the outside wall is metal, what should go next to it?
Why is my shed leaking?
Do you not think this is a bit extreme.. how warm does it need to be ?
It’s not how warm it needs to be but how much heating it needs to be a comfortable temp. For reference this is the minimum legally required for UK regs so not much choice anyway. 👍
Where’s the link for kingspan
Can't say for certain who Tim used, but I'd bet a small sum its Seconds & Co. We used these on our project and found them to be excellent. They have an ebay store too. www.secondsandco.co.uk/
I must admit i costed for my extension with these for all my insulation and didnt find it much different to online stores
Wonder if your mobile works? You have made a faraday cage in effect. Good to stop eve dropping and Aliens but not so much for WiFi and mobile signs
All seems fine, even with thick stone walls between router in house and out there.
that's some kill room
Was really interested in this but the backround music was annoying so i gave up 😐
love the channel. Has anyone ever said that you kinda look and sound like bear grills?
Balding and English? 😂
Nice videos. I could do without the distracting radio in the background though.
Had to keep myself company out there at 1am, usually try and turn it off when filming though. 👍