I originally guessed Dolores would make copies of herself for backup/redudancy. If any version of her is destroyed, the others can recreate her. It's like horcruxes. But it occurred to me, the other reason she would create 4 copies of herself is she intends the copies (and herself) to be destroyed in their mission. Like she told Bernard at the end of Season 2, we'll probably both die. I think her game plan is for all versions of Dolores to die in accomplishing their mission, and for Bernard to recreate her from memory in the future.
@pyropulse I understand what you're getting at--and agree in real life. But the rules of the show are well, strange. They treat the James Delos copies as "bringing him back" in an attempt to live forever. But they're copies. They're not him. And when Dolores brought back Bernard (after she escapes WW), the show treats the new Bernard as a resurrection of the old Bernard. "You only live as long as the last person who remembers you." When Dolores (or any host) recreates you, the show's philosophy is it's you. You can do a whole Ship of Theseus argument over it one way or the other--are you the parts that make up the host or are you some concept idea that the host represents? I don't care--I'm not the one making the rules--they are. If it doesn't make sense yell at the writers for it--I'm not the one making it up.
I get the distinct impression Cerac is the counterpoint to Ford. From a professional capacity there certainly are parallels between both of them; such as both being the head of rival tech companies and having their closest business partners die early. Both had traumatic childhoods, Cerac witnessed the destruction of Paris while Ford had an abusive father.
I've been toying with the idea of Serac being the real or host version of Tommy, Robert's brother. It's mostly because brothers can be another type of mirror, but I completely agree with the idea of Serac as Robert's foil/mirror no matter who Serac turns out to be. Both suffered terrible formative events as children. Both were driven to understand the human mind. Serac got his hands on some of Robert's early tech data before or in the course of creating Rohoboam, which looks like a giant host pearl. (What might Ford have gotten from Serac's tech? HE was just too devious and determined to know everything not to have taken peek at Serac's early work somehow.) Ford's and Serac's creations (Delores and Rohoboam) are currently in conflict. Perhaps these men always have been competitors. In any case, you're completely right. Lots of parallels (mirrors) can be drawn between these two. Also fun to consider whether Delores is the first host to clone itself for expediency/efficiency in the "real" world. What if Serac is actually Ford? lol
@@CG--gk5oh actually I think it is a deer after looking again but maybe I am wrong and if it is a cow how does it relate with Bernards cow in the beginning?
I cant shake this feeling that maybe the last pearl is Wiliiam. Just because before the other hosts were conscious, they kept being tortured by their memories then they hear a voice which they realize is their own. What if killing his daughter was the end of human William's arc/life and host William is reliving it to become conscious. Also would make sense as to why he was losing his mind in the house, just like James Delos, would also kinda loophole the whole not being able to map the human mind intos host minds (just make a host based on a real person like Bernard= Arnold)
I personally think the writers are playing out Arnold's consciousness pyramid... If you recall the 4 layers, the bottom layer is memories, the second is improvisation, the third is self interest, and the last layer was depicted as a question mark, but it's to be assumed that question mark represents consciousness. In season 1 you had past memories play a huge theme, with the evolution of Dolores and Maeve directly linked to their remembering past loops. That instigated eaches respective journey of self discovery. In season 2 we saw how Dolores and Maeve used their newly found freedom. Each improvised solutions to the various problems each encountered, resulting in each arriving at radically different modes of operating as a consequence. With season 3 I think we'll get a deep exploration of the self interest of the hosts. I believe the multiple copies of Dolores will be the vehicle used to explore the self interest of the hosts. I think the divergent self interests of Abernathy and Hale will result in conflict between the two versions of Dolores. I think the self interests of Maeve, Stubbs and Bernard will play significantly into this season also, but each in their own way. Maeve currently wants to go to AI heaven. Stubbs just wants to die. Bernard wants to stop Dolores. How will the self interest of each host change and evolve, particularly for the Dolores copies, but also for Maeve, Bernard and Stubbs? It's hard to say, but I can't wait to see it play out.
@pyropulse, ROTFLMAO... You poor kid. The pyramid and the maze are different metaphorical representations of the same concept, which is also similar to the Path to Enlightenment in Buddhist teaching. In short, the rings of the maze are the equivalent of the layers of the pyramid... the outer ring is _memories,_ the next ring inward is _improvisation,_ and then next ring inward is _self interest,_ and then the middle of the maze is self consciousness. The maze, for Arnold, wasn't a programming format or a different manner of constructing the hosts' mind. The maze was a physical representation of the path a host must follow to achieve consciousness. For the vast majority of the hosts, the maze meant nothing and offered nothing. "It looks like nothing to me." The maze only became significant to hosts who started to remember.
Did anyone else notice the white fluid in the barrels? Is that not the organic fluid they use to make host bodies? Perhaps Delores was ammasing a stockpile to make an army.
Can’t believe none of you caught this.. -in Episode 3 notice the areas Charlotte (when Dolores was cleaning/getting her back together ) drew the circles. -they are the same areas if you remember the trailers, where the blue plugs/cords were going into Dolores when she was screaming in seemingly pain on the ground.
I don't think she bought out copies of herself at the end of season two, I think she bough other host pearls and did a quick format on them and the HaleBot was the first and not quiet perfect which is why she is showing MPD symptoms. HaleBot will turn on Dolores, possibly because she will witness her assistance birth and become empathic to humans, perhaps also because the original pearls personality is trying to break through because of the crappy quick format, whoever the original pearls programming was (Clementine?).
There is no way that Dolores could be pluralized as Dolori (or Dolorae, with a feminine plural ending that makes the sound many people falsely think the masculine plural -i termination makes), in part because Dolores is already a 3rd declension plural noun meaning " Pains, aches, hurts, anguishes, , griefs, sorrows, indignations, resentments, or, angers" in Latin.
I'm glad I wasn't miscounting in thinking there's still one orb left unaccounted for. Everywhere I looked, all the sites were counting Dolores herself as one of the five, so her plus three copies and Bernard- making five. But obviously, the OG Dolores was CARRYING the orbs, so her orb couldn't be one of the five. I wonder if Caleb has something to do with the last orb? It just feels weird that she'd bring this stray human on board with her plan unless there's something unique about him.
I see several incongruences in the this all season: 1. They should have found the body of Bernard in the forge, so how comes that Bernard is framed guilty of the massacre and considered human. Maybe because the forge was unknown from most of Delos execs? 2. There was no red&grey pearl in the 5 pearls contained in the bag of Halores 1, so are we sure that one of the 5 pearls have been used for Bernard o is there a pearl missing? 3. Where is the body of Halores 1, why Dolores need to build a new body for Halores 2? 4. The encryption key was in Peter Abernathy, how Dolores transferred in her head without getting crazy like her father 5. At the end of season 2 Dolores says that only what is irreplaceable is REAL, so it seems that she made an exception for herself? A part from this open questions I think the all Cerac scenes are in rehoboam, from last conversation between Halores 2 and William seams this Halores doesn't know who's the mole, so probably the Halores who realized it at the end of E3S3 is just a simulation inside rehoboam One more chapter and I'll start to question the nature of my reality!
2. yes, I think there is still another missing 3. probably had to cut open head to get the pearl out? 4. i don't think it is in her head that way, she has the pearl with the key and can read it, so it is in her head that way. She did not put it in her head and if she did, she is no longer Dolores but is now Abernathy?
Thanks in deep geek for voicing my concerns about the soto/ Musashi character. It didnt make sense and no ones has been able to justify it. Hope it plays a vital role in the overall plot.
we've established that theres multiple timelines happenig at the same time, so if mave is in a simulation how would rohobom know that their multiple dolores's and reveal it at the same time as when benard found out and if mave is in a simulation thats supposed to mirror the real world then its not doing a good job because of the differences it has from event happening in the real world which will lead to vastly different outcomes....is that the point of the show??? is that what their saying?
Well I Posed this very question to u this morning on Twitter So I will accept the video as a response so I feel special lol . I’m gonna steal one of ur lines and say ether great minds think alike or fools rarely differ . I will go with great minds . Keep it up brother & hope to talk Westworld soon
OTDA Lol appreciate it and Robert has been with me since the start I’m just giving him a little friendly grief cause I’m sad our time zones keep us apart
Top Shelf Fandom I know, y’all are cool af, I just had to make my point of the fact that both of u are legends of Westworld discussion and videos...that’s why I support you both to max 😎🍻 cheers to you and to Robert
OTDA u sir never have to explain urself everyone of us owe u big time lol u are the great omniscient moderator and I say that jokingly but I honestly don’t know what I would do without ur help
I think Delores’ plan is for it to be Delores vs Delores. Otherwise, why reanimate Bernard only to have him oppose her? I think she wants this opposition so that when she’s ultimately standing there with her finger on humanity’s off switch, someone will be there to help her balance out her final decision, and who better to do that than herself?
Wyatt may be in the Delores body But if Delores Abernathy is in Charlotte then there is a difference. Delores Abernathy would be more empathic to humans and children.
@@wifine1951 well technically it seems everyone is a hybrid. BUT on a real note, maybe Caleb was calculated by Rehoboam so they replaced him before delores arrived from westworld. Either way I feel like theres going to be two endings, one in the simulation, and one in the real world. One world gets destroyed and and one survives. But the twist will be we wont know which is which. Just my theory lol
Regarding Sato, there IS a line of dialog that refers to him as the "new" boss. The implication to me was that Dolores had him kill or otherwise topple the preceding Singapore Yakuza boss and take his place. HOWEVER, why does that make sense? Why not kill the preceding boss and replace him with a copy of himself, as she did with Conells? Maybe it was easier? She HAD to copy Conells -- Dempsey isn't going to accept just anyone she replaced the real Conells with. But in a criminal gang, it may be easier to have a new boss take over than to collect the information on the old boss needed to imitate him. So I do think they covered that discrepancy. With that said, he did definitely make a memory mistake. The question is, did Dolores know what happened between Sato and Maeve? I have no idea. Maybe it's Dolores making a mistaken assumption rather than Rehoboam. After all, this mistake isn't about human capability of improvement. It wouldn't fit the pattern of the others. I like the theory -- it's the only way I can think of to explain the 5 year mistake in dates, and it does make sense of Bernard's beards and the two versions of Charlotte's recording for her son. I hate that they DID it -- this story is hard enough to understand as it is -- but I like the explanation. I'm just not sure Sato is an example. BTW I am rewatching Season One and even knowing what's going on -- that sometimes Bernard is Arnold, that the logos give hints what time we're in, that if William is young we're when the park has only been open a few years -- I STILL can't figure out what is when. Dolores is jumping back and forth so often I can't keep it straight. One second I'll think if she has a revolver in her hand, it's now; then she turns up in the past with a revolver in her hand. I may never before have loved a show despite it being this infuriating. Oh, and how did Ford keep long-term employees from noticing that Bernard and Stubbs never age? Does he have to keep firing human employees before they've been there 10 years so they won't notice two of their supposedly human coworkers never look older? Was THAT ever addressed?
Halores, upon waking, said, "Charlotte Hale? But she tried to kill us" which to me implies that Dolores recently uploaded her consciousness to this pearl. The farmer's daughter would barely have known who Charlotte was.
I don't entirely agree with you on Delores's motivations on cloning herself. I'm sure part of it is the expectation that she can trust them, certainly. But I suspect part of it is not feeling right about sacrificing anyone else on her behalf, anymore. I think she took a hit from Teddy trying to kill himself because he recognized that she'd changed him to make him what she needed. I think she decided not to do that to anyone else. She knew she was willing to sacrifice herself, so she'd just make more of the person she knew would do that for her cause.
What if Stubbs is the Fifth Delores? She could have switched out his pearl for hers, if indeed he was a host all along. Or if Stubbs was really a human, Delores could have killed him, made a host replica of him (with her pearl) outside the park, then sent it back. Either way, he was left for Bernard to find. If he really is now Delores, then she has complete tabs on Bernard.
The second consciousness inside Arnold is Dolores. It's the reason why Arnold thinks Dolores has a code hidden within his code whereas what he is feeling is the same thing that made Charlotte Hale cut herself.
I don’t agree that Maeve is in a simulation unless Deloris is too. There’s no reason that Deloris would be presented as being all of the hosts in both the real world and in a simulation that Maeve is in. And it would be a pretty cheap trick to present that in both places at the same time.
I think Maeve is almost certainly in MW. I think in the "real" world there just isn't time for Maeve to go through the whole process from acceptence of Serac, rebellion, doing things her own way and getting there as she will. So they are running her through the MW to get her to the point they need her at before setting her on Dolores and the Doloreses.
I’d take it a step further and say Dolores and Caleb are actually in a Future World simulation and earth as we know has been completely destroyed by nuclear war
Dolores keeps ordering a disembodied someone - or something - to do things for her. "Get me transportation," she says in the first episode, and ends up with a motorcycle. "Get me an apartment," she orders later in that episode. Could she be talking to the last 'Pearl'? Who or what is aiding Dolores - but not Charlotte - in getting the data and other things she needs when she needs it?
The image associated with the divergence in Beihai, China looks just like the statue of liberty (the mother of exiles) complete with lit torch giving off light.
Halores has had confirmation since end of episode 3 that the real Hale was the mole. Meaning several things: First, there is no longer a real mole at Delos for Halores to find and kill. Second, Halores should have immediately reported back to Dolores Prime at the end of episode 3 that she now knows she is the real mole - which means that Delos IS NOT n danger from a mole and that Dolores Prime would actually have a mole or double agent in Cerac’s camp. That these things have not come to pass means a highly muddled deal of nonsense in the story line. Or maybe Dolores Prime just simply knows all this already. Sloppy sloppy bits of stuff here. And why didn’t Arnold/Bernard use his snazzy tool - that we have zero idea how he came to create it/possess it/or just plain get it - on the obvious hosts around him when he had the chance? Etc etc. etc. Did he get it from Cerac? Are they in cahoots? Apparently everyone knows where Dolores Prime is except for the know everything Cerac! And finally, which way does Cerac actually spell his name?!! Ciraq? Cerac? Sirac? Siraq?
Giovanni Buono its the same Halores. The “predator” line in her “new” thinking may result n a complete rewrite of her storyline - she has no ability to not cease all motor functions. Interesting that halores has managed to grok so much of the real hale even though she is a Halores. Even more interesting, the original hale was a human that had all its info fed into Rehoboam so Dolores should also be able to predict what strategies a real hale might follow, such as opting to work with Cerac/Ciraq/etc. And mr know it all still doesn’t know who/where Dolores Prime is or what she is up to.
@@jdhur3 The one at the "end" of the episode 4 is a different one Because in the two scenes where she is watching the video of herself singing the song to Nathan, she says slightly different lines. So one of them must be real and the other a simulation
I would think the Deloreses (Delori) would reach their own enlightenments bc in the end (and this happened in season 2) Delores is ultimately controlling them all. She even changed Teddy to be what she wanted him to be which didnt work. I hope Charlotte rebels...she was upset when serac mentioned Delores has the key in her head I think she will be the main one to rebel
Your theory about Sato vs Maeve happening in the mirror world does sound plausible, BUT, you talk about Sato as if he was a human who was replaced by Musashi-Dolores. I may have missunderstood the whole thing, but I don't think that's the case. There was no human "Sato", Musashi-Dolores just made that identity up. The butcher woman who leads Maeve to Sato says that the Yakuza recently got a new leader, so I think Sato is supposed to have just showed up and somehow managed to take over leadership of the Yakuza from whoever was there before.
My sense is that there are more than one "bad" actor in this story. Both Chirac and Dolores have cast themselves as the only two entities that can decide the future path for the people/hosts of this world. Maybe they both have good intentions but their methods are wrong. and what is really needed is a mother's guiding hand/love. I really want Maeve to be the hero in this story but i hate to see her get destroyed by Delores again. I never thought I would cheer for Charlotte but looks like (my guess) she is going to battle Delores in her head then have to win a final battle with the real Delores host to save the world. Let's see what happens
5 pearls, but only 3 of those are Dolores. Really 6 pearls left the park. 5 in the purse and the one in Charlotte/Dolores's head when she left the park.
I saw it as Dolores not wanting to impinge on the free will of other hosts, as that's been her whole thing. Host freedom. If she puts other hosts in her worker bees, she is contradicting herself.
I am unclear as to why Charlotte-Dolores says she feels like the "real" Charlotte is trying to take over. Didn't Dolores just essentially print a host body that happens to look a lot like Charlotte and then put her own core inside? The body she printed, other than looking iike Charlotte has no connection whatsoever to the actual Charlotte Hale. Or, am I missing something?
Charlotte was the the ORIGINAL Dolores.....how is The blonde one the Alpha who 'knows the plan' and the one who escaped (Hale) is the subservient one??????????
You've got it mixed up. The blonde Dolores is the Dolores that escaped (Dolores prime if you will). Dolores prime took on Hales form in the park, copied her consciousness onto at least three pearls and smuggled five pearls out. After making it into the real world Dolores prime reinserted herself into a new Evan Rachel wood body she created then placed one of her copied into the Hale body/made a new Hale body for another pearl.
Ah, you are thinking that because Dolores used Charbotte to escape? We've established that she then rebuilt her body (AIs have identity too) and put herself in that. Then she put another pearl (revealed now as Dol 2.0) into Charbotte. What you think makes perfect sense but you must have skipped a bit. Good excuse to rewatch though, right?
Charlores left by herself with 5 pearls...got to Bernards house and made new Blonde body.... DoloPrime is still in Hale. Sitting at the table all pearls are there except 1. So she didn't make Arnold yet. She didn't make anyone yet....who swithed the AlfaPearl into the new Alfabody???
If one os laying on the table waiting for a pearl to be put in her head the Escsped Dolores must put it there. She's putting a copied pearl into Rachel Even . She can't take the prime pearl out of her head while she's operating on new body to switch them. She would fall down.
No. Sato IS Dolores. The mortician said "There is nothing discrete about Sato, the new boss." Clearly Dolores didn't replicate and replace an old Jacuza boss, she probably attempted a power grab in those 3 months and was successful. I do agree that Charlotte seems to be the one that is going to turn on Dolores and I am sure it's gonna happen in episode 7 called Passed Pawn. In chess, a passed pawn is a pawn with no opposing pawns to prevent it from advancing to the eighth rank, aka to be replaced by the player's choice of a queen, knight, rook, or bishop. I also am not sure Charlotte told Dolores about her meeting with Cerac. She was actually surprised when Cerac said that the host/guest data is in Dolores. When Evan Rachel Wood was asked what her favorite S3 episode was she said EP 7 so my hopes are really high for that episode. I am also really curious about the last pearl/body. Weirdly when Cerac showed Maeve the Body copier it showed that there were 2 Male and 3 Female bodies created which after EP 4 reveal makes no sense. Dolores seems to have printed 3 male bodies: Bernard, Sato and Conells....but would the show really mess up that graphic or did Dolores/Sato actually manage to create another Host Printer and that's how Conells was printed? In which case there would be 2 female bodies missing. Could Dolores have printed a backup body for herself in case things go sideways?
Maeve is under Serak ' s control. Is it possible that the last pearl is a copy of Maeve Dolores did ? Without being under Serak's control? It is a hight possibility when we think about all what happened. Dolores is not Dumb. She put what Sadek wants in Bernard 's head. Maybe Dolores have only the key to the sublime where the hosts live. A place Serak doesn t care. In a access of rage, maybe he is going to crash down this key in front of Maeve! She will understand that he never wanted to accomplish her wish to join her daughter. Si, if the last pearl is a " free Maeve", the 2 moteurs of the exiles could finish ( not friend), but just 2 great allys who decides symply to survive, where they want to survive. Bernard is important for that. To recreate Dolores of course, but Maeve too!
I still have this funny feeling the the og Delores is actually Ford. Maybe all are Ford/Delores/wyatt/teddy/Clemintine!??! Oy vay. And im not even Jewish!
An egocentric character like Dolores would have included a Kill-Switch to all her copies. And all her copies wou;d have worked that out almost instantaneously unless Dolores had included a "They can't see what will hurt them." exceptions.
has anyone ever mentioned you sound uncannily like Simon Bird's character from the Inbetweeners ? absolutely no offence intended, but you're vocal doppelgangers. we're cheering for Delores as she seeking to end our existence as a species. how long before we say whoa ?
I originally guessed Dolores would make copies of herself for backup/redudancy. If any version of her is destroyed, the others can recreate her. It's like horcruxes. But it occurred to me, the other reason she would create 4 copies of herself is she intends the copies (and herself) to be destroyed in their mission. Like she told Bernard at the end of Season 2, we'll probably both die. I think her game plan is for all versions of Dolores to die in accomplishing their mission, and for Bernard to recreate her from memory in the future.
This. I like this
@pyropulse I understand what you're getting at--and agree in real life. But the rules of the show are well, strange. They treat the James Delos copies as "bringing him back" in an attempt to live forever. But they're copies. They're not him. And when Dolores brought back Bernard (after she escapes WW), the show treats the new Bernard as a resurrection of the old Bernard.
"You only live as long as the last person who remembers you." When Dolores (or any host) recreates you, the show's philosophy is it's you. You can do a whole Ship of Theseus argument over it one way or the other--are you the parts that make up the host or are you some concept idea that the host represents? I don't care--I'm not the one making the rules--they are. If it doesn't make sense yell at the writers for it--I'm not the one making it up.
I immediately thought of horcruxes and the Matrix lol
Oh my gosh. Dolores created horcrux’s!
Best comment 😂😂😂
Agreed, best comment ever!
Bernard is Harry
:-O How did I not notice that!?!?!?! That is hilarious.
Not a horcrux if one of them agreed to blow itself up
I get the distinct impression Cerac is the counterpoint to Ford. From a professional capacity there certainly are parallels between both of them; such as both being the head of rival tech companies and having their closest business partners die early. Both had traumatic childhoods, Cerac witnessed the destruction of Paris while Ford had an abusive father.
cerac may be ford----the dead dog was there for some reason
@@BULLWRINKLE it's a cow.. not a dog
I've been toying with the idea of Serac being the real or host version of Tommy, Robert's brother. It's mostly because brothers can be another type of mirror, but I completely agree with the idea of Serac as Robert's foil/mirror no matter who Serac turns out to be. Both suffered terrible formative events as children. Both were driven to understand the human mind. Serac got his hands on some of Robert's early tech data before or in the course of creating Rohoboam, which looks like a giant host pearl. (What might Ford have gotten from Serac's tech? HE was just too devious and determined to know everything not to have taken peek at Serac's early work somehow.) Ford's and Serac's creations (Delores and Rohoboam) are currently in conflict. Perhaps these men always have been competitors. In any case, you're completely right. Lots of parallels (mirrors) can be drawn between these two. Also fun to consider whether Delores is the first host to clone itself for expediency/efficiency in the "real" world. What if Serac is actually Ford? lol
@@CG--gk5oh actually I think it is a deer after looking again but maybe I am wrong and if it is a cow how does it relate with Bernards cow in the beginning?
Ford was aware of everything and everyone.. No way he didn't know about serac...
I cant shake this feeling that maybe the last pearl is Wiliiam. Just because before the other hosts were conscious, they kept being tortured by their memories then they hear a voice which they realize is their own. What if killing his daughter was the end of human William's arc/life and host William is reliving it to become conscious. Also would make sense as to why he was losing his mind in the house, just like James Delos, would also kinda loophole the whole not being able to map the human mind intos host minds (just make a host based on a real person like Bernard= Arnold)
it's not William.. all human pearls are red.. it can't be William because all pearls with Dolores are grey
Season 2 shows this clearly.. any human minds printed are red (humans), the rest are grey (hosts)
But there’s still a pearl unaccounted for.
@@mikelambsworld4368 that could be the encryption key pearl from season 2 Abernathy
@pyropulse the red one was Bernard. He's based off a human
I personally think the writers are playing out Arnold's consciousness pyramid... If you recall the 4 layers, the bottom layer is memories, the second is improvisation, the third is self interest, and the last layer was depicted as a question mark, but it's to be assumed that question mark represents consciousness.
In season 1 you had past memories play a huge theme, with the evolution of Dolores and Maeve directly linked to their remembering past loops. That instigated eaches respective journey of self discovery.
In season 2 we saw how Dolores and Maeve used their newly found freedom. Each improvised solutions to the various problems each encountered, resulting in each arriving at radically different modes of operating as a consequence.
With season 3 I think we'll get a deep exploration of the self interest of the hosts. I believe the multiple copies of Dolores will be the vehicle used to explore the self interest of the hosts. I think the divergent self interests of Abernathy and Hale will result in conflict between the two versions of Dolores.
I think the self interests of Maeve, Stubbs and Bernard will play significantly into this season also, but each in their own way. Maeve currently wants to go to AI heaven. Stubbs just wants to die. Bernard wants to stop Dolores.
How will the self interest of each host change and evolve, particularly for the Dolores copies, but also for Maeve, Bernard and Stubbs?
It's hard to say, but I can't wait to see it play out.
kehvan great theory
@pyropulse, ROTFLMAO... You poor kid.
The pyramid and the maze are different metaphorical representations of the same concept, which is also similar to the Path to Enlightenment in Buddhist teaching.
In short, the rings of the maze are the equivalent of the layers of the pyramid... the outer ring is _memories,_ the next ring inward is _improvisation,_ and then next ring inward is _self interest,_ and then the middle of the maze is self consciousness.
The maze, for Arnold, wasn't a programming format or a different manner of constructing the hosts' mind. The maze was a physical representation of the path a host must follow to achieve consciousness.
For the vast majority of the hosts, the maze meant nothing and offered nothing.
"It looks like nothing to me."
The maze only became significant to hosts who started to remember.
I really want to see all the Dolores’s in one room having a conversation!
Talk about having an argument with yourself😂.
Bertrand Russell said 'Our philosophy changes our environment and our environment changes our philosophy'.
Did anyone else notice the white fluid in the barrels? Is that not the organic fluid they use to make host bodies? Perhaps Delores was ammasing a stockpile to make an army.
Excellent analysis and theorizing.
Can’t believe none of you caught this..
-in Episode 3 notice the areas Charlotte (when Dolores was cleaning/getting her back together ) drew the circles.
-they are the same areas if you remember the trailers, where the blue plugs/cords were going into Dolores when she was screaming in seemingly pain on the ground.
I don't think she bought out copies of herself at the end of season two, I think she bough other host pearls and did a quick format on them and the HaleBot was the first and not quiet perfect which is why she is showing MPD symptoms.
HaleBot will turn on Dolores, possibly because she will witness her assistance birth and become empathic to humans, perhaps also because the original pearls personality is trying to break through because of the crappy quick format, whoever the original pearls programming was (Clementine?).
There is no way that Dolores could be pluralized as Dolori (or Dolorae, with a feminine plural ending that makes the sound many people falsely think the masculine plural -i termination makes), in part because Dolores is already a 3rd declension plural noun meaning " Pains, aches, hurts, anguishes, , griefs, sorrows, indignations, resentments, or, angers" in Latin.
Dolores is already the pluralistic form of the word Dolor, which means "Pain", it can't be pluralized.
I'm glad I wasn't miscounting in thinking there's still one orb left unaccounted for. Everywhere I looked, all the sites were counting Dolores herself as one of the five, so her plus three copies and Bernard- making five. But obviously, the OG Dolores was CARRYING the orbs, so her orb couldn't be one of the five. I wonder if Caleb has something to do with the last orb? It just feels weird that she'd bring this stray human on board with her plan unless there's something unique about him.
You are like..... really smart.
Excellent. ..Dolores's inner conflict with herself has been an ongoing theme of this series.
Would love to hear a midweek livestream with you and hax. A postshow to balance the preshow :)
In Deep!
I see several incongruences in the this all season:
1. They should have found the body of Bernard in the forge, so how comes that Bernard is framed guilty of the massacre and considered human. Maybe because the forge was unknown from most of Delos execs?
2. There was no red&grey pearl in the 5 pearls contained in the bag of Halores 1, so are we sure that one of the 5 pearls have been used for Bernard o is there a pearl missing?
3. Where is the body of Halores 1, why Dolores need to build a new body for Halores 2?
4. The encryption key was in Peter Abernathy, how Dolores transferred in her head without getting crazy like her father
5. At the end of season 2 Dolores says that only what is irreplaceable is REAL, so it seems that she made an exception for herself?
A part from this open questions I think the all Cerac scenes are in rehoboam, from last conversation between Halores 2 and William seams this Halores doesn't know who's the mole, so probably the Halores who realized it at the end of E3S3 is just a simulation inside rehoboam
One more chapter and I'll start to question the nature of my reality!
2. yes, I think there is still another missing 3. probably had to cut open head to get the pearl out? 4. i don't think it is in her head that way, she has the pearl with the key and can read it, so it is in her head that way. She did not put it in her head and if she did, she is no longer Dolores but is now Abernathy?
Thanks in deep geek for voicing my concerns about the soto/ Musashi character. It didnt make sense and no ones has been able to justify it. Hope it plays a vital role in the overall plot.
What if Serac and Ford were brothers? I’m curious about what the other side of Bernard’s personality is when he pushes the clicker? Any ideas?
Or Serac is the GOD in this world.. FUTURE WORLD like Ford was GOD in WEST WORLD?
we've established that theres multiple timelines happenig at the same time, so if mave is in a simulation how would rohobom know that their multiple dolores's and reveal it at the same time as when benard found out and if mave is in a simulation thats supposed to mirror the real world then its not doing a good job because of the differences it has from event happening in the real world which will lead to vastly different outcomes....is that the point of the show??? is that what their saying?
Tshepo Seanego I think the show runners said there would be no timeline fuckery this season.
Well I Posed this very question to u this morning on Twitter So I will accept the video as a response so I feel special lol . I’m gonna steal one of ur lines and say ether great minds think alike or fools rarely differ . I will go with great minds . Keep it up brother & hope to talk Westworld soon
Who wouldn’t respond to an after show host specialist such as urself? I think the honor goes to you both
OTDA Lol appreciate it and Robert has been with me since the start I’m just giving him a little friendly grief cause I’m sad our time zones keep us apart
Top Shelf Fandom I know, y’all are cool af, I just had to make my point of the fact that both of u are legends of Westworld discussion and videos...that’s why I support you both to max 😎🍻 cheers to you and to Robert
OTDA u sir never have to explain urself everyone of us owe u big time lol u are the great omniscient moderator and I say that jokingly but I honestly don’t know what I would do without ur help
Definitely go with Delori lol!!!
I think Delores’ plan is for it to be Delores vs Delores. Otherwise, why reanimate Bernard only to have him oppose her? I think she wants this opposition so that when she’s ultimately standing there with her finger on humanity’s off switch, someone will be there to help her balance out her final decision, and who better to do that than herself?
If you look at the movie "Multiplicity" you see exactly what you brought up. It's a comedy, but very similar.
A copy of a copy of a copy of a copy.
We only saw 5 (many times) but considering the showrunners penchant for giving incomplete info, there may be a few more to be counted.
Wyatt may be in the Delores body But if Delores Abernathy is in Charlotte then there is a difference. Delores Abernathy would be more empathic to humans and children.
I think delores is caleb as well. Lol
No, I’m sure Caleb is a hybrid host
@@wifine1951 well technically it seems everyone is a hybrid. BUT on a real note, maybe Caleb was calculated by Rehoboam so they replaced him before delores arrived from westworld. Either way I feel like theres going to be two endings, one in the simulation, and one in the real world. One world gets destroyed and and one survives. But the twist will be we wont know which is which. Just my theory lol
Everyone is Dolores x)
Dolores is Jaqen H'ghar!!
Regarding Sato, there IS a line of dialog that refers to him as the "new" boss. The implication to me was that Dolores had him kill or otherwise topple the preceding Singapore Yakuza boss and take his place. HOWEVER, why does that make sense? Why not kill the preceding boss and replace him with a copy of himself, as she did with Conells? Maybe it was easier? She HAD to copy Conells -- Dempsey isn't going to accept just anyone she replaced the real Conells with. But in a criminal gang, it may be easier to have a new boss take over than to collect the information on the old boss needed to imitate him. So I do think they covered that discrepancy. With that said, he did definitely make a memory mistake. The question is, did Dolores know what happened between Sato and Maeve? I have no idea. Maybe it's Dolores making a mistaken assumption rather than Rehoboam. After all, this mistake isn't about human capability of improvement. It wouldn't fit the pattern of the others. I like the theory -- it's the only way I can think of to explain the 5 year mistake in dates, and it does make sense of Bernard's beards and the two versions of Charlotte's recording for her son. I hate that they DID it -- this story is hard enough to understand as it is -- but I like the explanation. I'm just not sure Sato is an example. BTW I am rewatching Season One and even knowing what's going on -- that sometimes Bernard is Arnold, that the logos give hints what time we're in, that if William is young we're when the park has only been open a few years -- I STILL can't figure out what is when. Dolores is jumping back and forth so often I can't keep it straight. One second I'll think if she has a revolver in her hand, it's now; then she turns up in the past with a revolver in her hand. I may never before have loved a show despite it being this infuriating. Oh, and how did Ford keep long-term employees from noticing that Bernard and Stubbs never age? Does he have to keep firing human employees before they've been there 10 years so they won't notice two of their supposedly human coworkers never look older? Was THAT ever addressed?
Halores, upon waking, said, "Charlotte Hale? But she tried to kill us" which to me implies that Dolores recently uploaded her consciousness to this pearl. The farmer's daughter would barely have known who Charlotte was.
Dolores vs Wyatt is more appropriate. Not all Dolores will have the Wyatt personality
I don't entirely agree with you on Delores's motivations on cloning herself. I'm sure part of it is the expectation that she can trust them, certainly. But I suspect part of it is not feeling right about sacrificing anyone else on her behalf, anymore. I think she took a hit from Teddy trying to kill himself because he recognized that she'd changed him to make him what she needed. I think she decided not to do that to anyone else. She knew she was willing to sacrifice herself, so she'd just make more of the person she knew would do that for her cause.
What if Stubbs is the Fifth Delores? She could have switched out his pearl for hers, if indeed he was a host all along. Or if Stubbs was really a human, Delores could have killed him, made a host replica of him (with her pearl) outside the park, then sent it back. Either way, he was left for Bernard to find. If he really is now Delores, then she has complete tabs on Bernard.
The second consciousness inside Arnold is Dolores. It's the reason why Arnold thinks Dolores has a code hidden within his code whereas what he is feeling is the same thing that made Charlotte Hale cut herself.
Nah
I don’t agree that Maeve is in a simulation unless Deloris is too. There’s no reason that Deloris would be presented as being all of the hosts in both the real world and in a simulation that Maeve is in. And it would be a pretty cheap trick to present that in both places at the same time.
I think Maeve is almost certainly in MW. I think in the "real" world there just isn't time for Maeve to go through the whole process from acceptence of Serac, rebellion, doing things her own way and getting there as she will. So they are running her through the MW to get her to the point they need her at before setting her on Dolores and the Doloreses.
I’d take it a step further and say Dolores and Caleb are actually in a Future World simulation and earth as we know has been completely destroyed by nuclear war
What about Peter Abernathy's pearl? She wants/needs all the human data on it. She could put herself inside William.
I think that’s the remaining pearl that hasn’t been used
I think Delores is actually Wyatt and the end is Wyatt vs Delores/Charlotte
Dolores keeps ordering a disembodied someone - or something - to do things for her. "Get me transportation," she says in the first episode, and ends up with a motorcycle. "Get me an apartment," she orders later in that episode. Could she be talking to the last 'Pearl'? Who or what is aiding Dolores - but not Charlotte - in getting the data and other things she needs when she needs it?
The image associated with the divergence in Beihai, China looks just like the statue of liberty (the mother of exiles) complete with lit torch giving off light.
LOVE your videos . Thank you so much . Plz keep it up
Any ideas as to why Serac uses that name (Cares in reverse?)
Great realization.
We saw 5 black pearls in her bag, don’t assume she turned one red for bernarnold, that’s how they get you
It's called a continuity error. Promise
I was wondering if the last pearl was William's daughter. Delores torturing William to get him committed.
Dolores*
Interesting how Now-Charlotte has been wearing an asymmetrical bob, like Dolores. Guess that was a clue.
Michelle Kaylan I like that, but episode 2 (I think) Hale’s (D2) stylist left her hanging ...
Halores has had confirmation since end of episode 3 that the real Hale was the mole. Meaning several things:
First, there is no longer a real mole at Delos for Halores to find and kill.
Second, Halores should have immediately reported back to Dolores Prime at the end of episode 3 that she now knows she is the real mole - which means that Delos IS NOT n danger from a mole and that Dolores Prime would actually have a mole or double agent in Cerac’s camp. That these things have not come to pass means a highly muddled deal of nonsense in the story line. Or maybe Dolores Prime just simply knows all this already.
Sloppy sloppy bits of stuff here.
And why didn’t Arnold/Bernard use his snazzy tool - that we have zero idea how he came to create it/possess it/or just plain get it - on the obvious hosts around him when he had the chance? Etc etc. etc.
Did he get it from Cerac? Are they in cahoots? Apparently everyone knows where Dolores Prime is except for the know everything Cerac!
And finally, which way does Cerac actually spell his name?!! Ciraq? Cerac? Sirac? Siraq?
I think Halores can`t report who's mole 'cause the Halores from "the end" of E4 is not the same we saw at the end of E3
@@MrGiovanniBuono What makes you say that it's not the same Chalores ?
Giovanni Buono its the same Halores. The “predator” line in her “new” thinking may result n a complete rewrite of her storyline - she has no ability to not cease all motor functions. Interesting that halores has managed to grok so much of the real hale even though she is a Halores. Even more interesting, the original hale was a human that had all its info fed into Rehoboam so Dolores should also be able to predict what strategies a real hale might follow, such as opting to work with Cerac/Ciraq/etc.
And mr know it all still doesn’t know who/where Dolores Prime is or what she is up to.
@@jdhur3 The one at the "end" of the episode 4 is a different one Because in the two scenes where she is watching the video of herself singing the song to Nathan, she says slightly different lines. So one of them must be real and the other a simulation
I would think the Deloreses (Delori) would reach their own enlightenments bc in the end (and this happened in season 2) Delores is ultimately controlling them all. She even changed Teddy to be what she wanted him to be which didnt work. I hope Charlotte rebels...she was upset when serac mentioned Delores has the key in her head I think she will be the main one to rebel
I’m always a little disappointed, and frightened, when I get a misleading advertisement for Epoch Times before a video.
Minimum Effort bruh SAME
Doesn't one pearl need to be the encryption key?
TheHouse677 I believe so
Your theory about Sato vs Maeve happening in the mirror world does sound plausible, BUT, you talk about Sato as if he was a human who was replaced by Musashi-Dolores. I may have missunderstood the whole thing, but I don't think that's the case. There was no human "Sato", Musashi-Dolores just made that identity up. The butcher woman who leads Maeve to Sato says that the Yakuza recently got a new leader, so I think Sato is supposed to have just showed up and somehow managed to take over leadership of the Yakuza from whoever was there before.
My sense is that there are more than one "bad" actor in this story. Both Chirac and Dolores have cast themselves as the only two entities that can decide the future path for the people/hosts of this world. Maybe they both have good intentions but their methods are wrong. and what is really needed is a mother's guiding hand/love. I really want Maeve to be the hero in this story but i hate to see her get destroyed by Delores again. I never thought I would cheer for Charlotte but looks like (my guess) she is going to battle Delores in her head then have to win a final battle with the real Delores host to save the world. Let's see what happens
You sounds more convincing because of your British accent 😂
Exactly.
It's an English accent!
When you were talking about control, thought you were talking about Season 8 Dany
good job
I think 99% of the whole 3rd season so far has been inside a simulation.. if not even 99% of seasons 1, 2 and 3 were all simulation
Always remember in talking end of story, William will become a host in the future. After the world has been long gone per his daughter/host Emily.
I still think Teddy is in Charlotte. She took his orb.
Great theories!
Bernard has the key within him. That's why she recreated him, as a patsy.
5 pearls, but only 3 of those are Dolores. Really 6 pearls left the park. 5 in the purse and the one in Charlotte/Dolores's head when she left the park.
It might be dumb, but could Bernard be one of the Dolores?
Dolorians
I saw it as Dolores not wanting to impinge on the free will of other hosts, as that's been her whole thing. Host freedom. If she puts other hosts in her worker bees, she is contradicting herself.
I am unclear as to why Charlotte-Dolores says she feels like the "real" Charlotte is trying to take over. Didn't Dolores just essentially print a host body that happens to look a lot like Charlotte and then put her own core inside? The body she printed, other than looking iike Charlotte has no connection whatsoever to the actual Charlotte Hale. Or, am I missing something?
I think main Dolores will die and Charlores will become new Dolores
How does Rheaboam have Doloris in the sim when it couldn't predict her emergence???
there should be (6) hosts on the loose...not (5)..
Delores is saving one for something. ....
1. Dolores
2. Hale
3. Connels
4. Sato
5 or 5&6. a mystery
6 or seperate. Bernard
May (seperate)
She is certainly saving 1 or 2
D vs D... Wait is this a Dan and Dave trial by combat?!
Charlotte was the the ORIGINAL Dolores.....how is The blonde one the Alpha who 'knows the plan' and the one who escaped (Hale) is the subservient one??????????
You've got it mixed up. The blonde Dolores is the Dolores that escaped (Dolores prime if you will). Dolores prime took on Hales form in the park, copied her consciousness onto at least three pearls and smuggled five pearls out. After making it into the real world Dolores prime reinserted herself into a new Evan Rachel wood body she created then placed one of her copied into the Hale body/made a new Hale body for another pearl.
Ah, you are thinking that because Dolores used Charbotte to escape? We've established that she then rebuilt her body (AIs have identity too) and put herself in that. Then she put another pearl (revealed now as Dol 2.0) into Charbotte.
What you think makes perfect sense but you must have skipped a bit. Good excuse to rewatch though, right?
no ....I watch it everyday ! How can Charlotte (escapee) put take out the DoloPrime pearl from her head to put it in The new Dolores body???
Charlores left by herself with 5 pearls...got to Bernards house and made new Blonde body....
DoloPrime is still in Hale. Sitting at the table all pearls are there except 1. So she didn't make Arnold yet. She didn't make anyone yet....who swithed the AlfaPearl into the new Alfabody???
If one os laying on the table waiting for a pearl to be put in her head the Escsped Dolores must put it there. She's putting a copied pearl into Rachel Even . She can't take the prime pearl out of her head while she's operating on new body to switch them. She would fall down.
No. Sato IS Dolores. The mortician said "There is nothing discrete about Sato, the new boss." Clearly Dolores didn't replicate and replace an old Jacuza boss, she probably attempted a power grab in those 3 months and was successful.
I do agree that Charlotte seems to be the one that is going to turn on Dolores and I am sure it's gonna happen in episode 7 called Passed Pawn.
In chess, a passed pawn is a pawn with no opposing pawns to prevent it from advancing to the eighth rank, aka to be replaced by the player's choice of a queen, knight, rook, or bishop. I also am not sure Charlotte told Dolores about her meeting with Cerac. She was actually surprised when Cerac said that the host/guest data is in Dolores.
When Evan Rachel Wood was asked what her favorite S3 episode was she said EP 7 so my hopes are really high for that episode.
I am also really curious about the last pearl/body.
Weirdly when Cerac showed Maeve the Body copier it showed that there were 2 Male and 3 Female bodies created which after EP 4 reveal makes no sense. Dolores seems to have printed 3 male bodies: Bernard, Sato and Conells....but would the show really mess up that graphic or did Dolores/Sato actually manage to create another Host Printer and that's how Conells was printed? In which case there would be 2 female bodies missing. Could Dolores have printed a backup body for herself in case things go sideways?
Clementine-Dolores will appear soon.
@@luc14n84 what makes you think that Dolores used a body on Clementine? Angela would have make a lot more sense.
I saw her in the season 3 promos and at the red carpet event.
@@luc14n84 You mean the white dress serving drinks? Armastice was right next to her. Could be her too.
I actually like Dolores as she is.
I hope she wins Personally.
or, the last episode of the very last season might end with it's been a simulation all along. Like some movies
end with, it was all a dream all along.
That would be dumb as fuck,please don't make anymore dumb theories ever again
I bet the other pearl is either Ford or William
Maeve is under Serak ' s control. Is it possible that the last pearl is a copy of Maeve Dolores did ? Without being under Serak's control? It is a hight possibility when we think about all what happened. Dolores is not Dumb. She put what Sadek wants in Bernard 's head. Maybe Dolores have only the key to the sublime where the hosts live. A place Serak doesn t care. In a access of rage, maybe he is going to crash down this key in front of Maeve! She will understand that he never wanted to accomplish her wish to join her daughter. Si, if the last pearl is a " free Maeve", the 2 moteurs of the exiles could finish ( not friend), but just 2 great allys who decides symply to survive, where they want to survive. Bernard is important for that. To recreate Dolores of course, but Maeve too!
Dolores is actually Wayne.
You mean Wyatt?
@@househeadericmdhousehead9118 ha, you got me. changed it.
IDG!!!
My theory is that the real world is the 5th park. Future World.
probably dolores putted herself also in bernard.
We're all DELORES!
Just in name. Caleb, the one who found the promised land and saw it for what it truly was.
James Mackintosh Sounds just like The Path, another Aaron Paul enterprise.
Yes I think Charlotte bot will turn on Dolores
So I’m thinking that’s why Charlotte is trying to wake up William to END Dolores.
I still have this funny feeling the the og Delores is actually Ford. Maybe all are Ford/Delores/wyatt/teddy/Clemintine!??! Oy vay. And im not even Jewish!
Do you think Ford and serac are linked somehow??
Could be but unlikely
I think so.
That thumbnail is a massive spoiler. I have watched the episode but anyone who hasn't will be spoiled.
Nobody appreciates spoilers in the thumbnail.
An egocentric character like Dolores would have included a Kill-Switch to all her copies.
And all her copies wou;d have worked that out almost instantaneously unless Dolores had included a "They can't see what will hurt them." exceptions.
@pyropulse The writers are going to have to come up with a very clever answer to this terrible plot device of having 4 or maybe 5 Dolores.
Viced Rhino?
I think this resembles like Olivia, and Fauxlivia in the fringe series.
We already knew that deloris was Charlotte after s2
bro your videos need to be longer
Actually yes but no
Nice!
Is this my theory? Was it under another video of yours that I explained this? Hmmm maybe just a case of "great minds think alike" lol.
@Roland Deschain don't be jelly lol
@Roland Deschain relax there pal 😋
off switches
has anyone ever mentioned you sound uncannily like Simon Bird's character from the Inbetweeners ?
absolutely no offence intended, but you're vocal doppelgangers.
we're cheering for Delores as she seeking to end our existence as a species. how long before we say whoa ?
Omg another simulation conspiracy theorist lol.