Beautiful signals. I've always loved scale cross-sections for signals and grade crossing lights, etc. The signal head sets this back east and a simple abs arrangement suits your layout perfectly.
That’s a really nicely detailed signal. I like that you could wire it locally. I would be interested in a video about the wiring and if he’s going to do that could he show how you could incorporate it into a larger system in the future if someone wanted to?
Thanks! We will do a further in depth description of this current set up. Although things have escalated with the planning and we will most likely be expanding the signal system. I’ll be sure to talk about it in a future video.
What you need is a little timming circuit, or a capacitor to keep the relay up for a delayed dropout. You could go as extravagant as a 555 timer, set it to say 15 seconds or what you fancy and you should be good. Of course you can buy "Time Off" or delayed off or delayed dropout relays, but a simple capacitor circuit will suffice.
I have a current sensing detector that not only provides a Clear and Occupied status, thus eliminating the relay altogether, it also includes a capacitor on the logic side for delayed release. This is especially important for people who want looooooong blocks and for operators who keep dirty tracks.
Big fan of the Showcase miniatures/Century Foundry Signal kits. I had got a bunch of the search light signals long while ago. I think this vid will push me over the edge for their "g" target signals as well.
They are really nice! I wish I had an excuse to do more lol definitely spend the extra money for the matching LED board for the G. Makes it very easy and lines up perfectly with the lenses.
They are simply using a current sensor to monitor and activate when there is draw in the particular zone. It's essentially a special transformer/ coil of wire with a track lead wrapped around it as you can see in the footage.
I have a detector that works in a similar manner, in that it uses current sensing detection. It also offers a clear and occupied status so the relay in this application is no longer necessary
Awesome signal John, I have most of Showcase miniatures product line and its all great stuff. Your set up is sharp and serves its intended purpose. Well done. I also subbed Dons channel to binge watch later. Relay chattering will shorten the lifespan of the relay eventually, I see this in higher voltages and the fix is usually a capacitor across the coil leads to smooth it out, but I am no electrical engineer by any means. I am sure someone else could add to this. Cheers Rob
My man Rob for the win! Tried a few different caps like you said and it totally works. I would say it has reduced the chatter by at least 95%. I’m only seeing it when moving very slow across the gap or on a locomotive with poor pickups / dirty wheels…. Thanks for checking out Dons channel. He is an amazing modeler and has an awesome layout built for operations. He has a FB page as well about his P&W layout.
@@RailserveJohn thats sweet news brotha, glad it worked out. I sure like the way that signal looks. All of the metal castings ive gotten from Showcase Miniatures are of great quality, I just wish their wig wag signals were operating instead of static models. Boomers Dioramas did a build of their tow truck and that model looks great,, I think its a late 70's early 80's truck but even today, it would look amazing in the weeds rusting away. I cant wait to see what you do next. Cheers Rob
Thank you! I’ll be shifting over to a more complex system as the layout is expanding. But I will explain more about this simple set up in a future video.
John...I'm not a expert but I believe those signals were used by Conrail especially when you say you saw them in NJ...video of signal mast install would be nice.
Yeah they are all over NJ. With the layout being modeled in old CR territory I thought it would be appropriate. I’ll be expanding into the office in the near future and will have to build another 5 signals. I’ll try to film some of the assembly. They are really nice models. Thanks for watching.
Very cool. Is the signal power coming from the track or another source? I am DC and this would be cool to use if it could be wired without constant track power. Maybe a follow up demonstration video showing the actual wiring of the signal, relays, etc might give more insight. Either way, this is a great addition to your railroad. Thank you for sharing.
Thanks Bob. We are going to make another video reviewing the logic and wiring. I’m not sure if DC would work or not. If so it would be a very simple option…
You would need a separate DC power supply . You could use the track power in theory but as soon as you lowered your track voltage your signal would go out. I am not sure if the NCE BD20 will actually work on DC track. Never tried it.
This system is based on the current flow across the rails (ie current draw of track power). If there is no track power (ie DC locomotive is stopped 0V) then no draw and thus no report to the signal that the track is occupied ("down") - the track will be reported "up" or clear. To bypass this you could look at implementing an AC track circuit monitor, some sort of computerized system, or more traditional optical/ photo/ beam/ weight sensor system. A timing circuit could also be implemented to help with gaps or issues arising from 'relay drop-out' as mentioned in the UA-cam upload.
John, that is a great feature for your layout. Do you need to have resistors for the wheel sets on all your cars? The signals look fantastic and help protect your "closet" track. I can't wait to see your layout in person.-Tom
Thanks Tom! Yes I will be adding resistors to the wheel sets. Maybe just one per car. It’s pretty neat and totally adds practical use for signals. U know how long I have been wanting some lol
Thanks bud. It works but is very basic. The blocks will not talk to each other like other systems but it works for one independent block. We will be working on another video going into ore depth.
Nice video, I have the same signal kit. However on mine the LED has the green on the upper left. I would prefer green on the upper right as yours is. Did you have to request that when you ordered? Thanks
Thanks Heath. No not yet. Now that we got it working I will start adding at least one on each car. The system works really well and does it’s job protecting the hidden track.
looking great but lol what kind of wiring are you using i like how it looks i have some little signals i like to mount by my double crossover but im not sure which way the lights are suppose to be facing and how many of the lights i need by it and im installing 4 tortoise machine to operate the crossover any advise would be nice
Hey Dwight, there is definitely a way to hook up signals to tortoise switch machines. It will switch lights depending on the switch indication. I personally have never done it but I have seen some diagrams online how to wire them directly to the tortoise. The club I belong to has several hooked up like that.
Essentially in controlled territory, every switch has a signal protecting it. If it's an isolated switch, it is protected from all directions (typically). In the case of a double crossover (as with single crossover) there would be four signals, in order to protect each track, approaching the switches (crossover) from each direction. These signals would point "out" from the switches, so that approaching movements could view them. However, it's your railway, so anything goes, and it's upto you to decide what makes the most sense for how you operate. Not every single switch (even on mainline) have a signal either! Tortoise switch machines offer simple signal logic; I would consider "cross" wiring the machines and signals so they actually act as a pair, such in the real world. You might have to add a couple relays to perfectly emulate my idea, but with a couple contacts on each switch you can get close. You can do normally closed (NC) for normal direction pair to activate the green lamp, and NO reverse direction for diagonal pairs to activate yellow lamp (for instance). If you wire the lamps in parallel with each other but series through either Tortoise machine contacts then they would only display green or yellow respectively when BOTH switches are properly lined. The only issue with this and only have two contacts is that you cannot request a red signal, the signal would simply go dark for unlined. Therefore you would need some relays, perhaps 4, but possibly 2. In which the Tortoise keeps the relay alive in order to display Green/ Yellow, if the relay falls then the signal displays Red. In the case of a misaligned/ moving switch.
Wow, you didn’t waste any time with installing those. Great job. Do you think you’ll trust them? I wouldn’t. Mind you, if you’re the only operator you know what trains are running. Lol.
Hahaha it works pretty well! It for sure shows if a loco is in the block and when I add resistors to the wheels on cars it will show those to. I guess time will tell if we have any “meets” lol
Beautiful signals. I've always loved scale cross-sections for signals and grade crossing lights, etc. The signal head sets this back east and a simple abs arrangement suits your layout perfectly.
Thanks! It does the job for now protecting “the closet line” lol
That is a very good looking signal mast John, you did well with the build. Even minimal signaling adds a lot of interest to the layout.
Thanks Art. It’s practical for the layout and adds another aspect to operating.
Love that hole in the wall. Way to expand. Nice signals.
Lol thanks Tom! 3 holes in 3 walls! Nothing like tearing up fresh drywall lol
every wall is the opportunity for a hole. every hole is the opportunity for a tunnel 😂😂
@@RailserveJohn My favorite expansion method!
Lovely signals, but are more impressed with the realistic speed of the train in the first few seconds!! Keep up the good work!
Thanks Erik!
Those signals look super detailed and your little setup looks perfect to protect track between the rooms. Thanks for sharing with us!
Thanks! I’m very happy with the outcome!
That's a sweet looking signal , the dwarf is cool but hard to see here. I like the detail of the kit. Thanks for showing this off . 👍👍
Thanks Jerry, the LEDs looks way different on video than in person. I wish I was able to add more lol
Very simple neat and easy signaling John ... Thanks fir sharing 👍 😎 Derail
Thanks Darrell! Simple and I get to look at pretty signals lol
That’s a really nicely detailed signal. I like that you could wire it locally. I would be interested in a video about the wiring and if he’s going to do that could he show how you could incorporate it into a larger system in the future if someone wanted to?
Thanks! We will do a further in depth description of this current set up. Although things have escalated with the planning and we will most likely be expanding the signal system. I’ll be sure to talk about it in a future video.
What you need is a little timming circuit, or a capacitor to keep the relay up for a delayed dropout. You could go as extravagant as a 555 timer, set it to say 15 seconds or what you fancy and you should be good. Of course you can buy "Time Off" or delayed off or delayed dropout relays, but a simple capacitor circuit will suffice.
Thanks! I seemed to have it smoothed out. You sure know your electronics!
I have a current sensing detector that not only provides a Clear and Occupied status, thus eliminating the relay altogether, it also includes a capacitor on the logic side for delayed release. This is especially important for people who want looooooong blocks and for operators who keep dirty tracks.
Big fan of the Showcase miniatures/Century Foundry Signal kits. I had got a bunch of the search light signals long while ago. I think this vid will push me over the edge for their "g" target signals as well.
They are really nice! I wish I had an excuse to do more lol definitely spend the extra money for the matching LED board for the G. Makes it very easy and lines up perfectly with the lenses.
yes I would like to try to make my signals the same way so please convince him to come up with a video step by step
We will work on that
They are simply using a current sensor to monitor and activate when there is draw in the particular zone. It's essentially a special transformer/ coil of wire with a track lead wrapped around it as you can see in the footage.
I have a detector that works in a similar manner, in that it uses current sensing detection. It also offers a clear and occupied status so the relay in this application is no longer necessary
That is cool John! Looks like a good way to get started with signals, knowing how the wiring is done would be nice.
Thanks JD. We are going to work on another video describing the logic and wiring
I remember BA RS video on those signals. they look excellent! nice vid John :)
Thanks John!
Yeah, that is a very nice setup. Thanks for sharing John
Thanks Matt!
Looks fantastic, simple system, in time I will reach out for more info, great job John
Thanks James! Let me know
Awesome video man! The signals look great. Excited to see what's next for this layout! 👍👍
Thanks for tuning in!
Awesome signal John, I have most of Showcase miniatures product line and its all great stuff. Your set up is sharp and serves its intended purpose. Well done. I also subbed Dons channel to binge watch later. Relay chattering will shorten the lifespan of the relay eventually, I see this in higher voltages and the fix is usually a capacitor across the coil leads to smooth it out, but I am no electrical engineer by any means. I am sure someone else could add to this. Cheers Rob
My man Rob for the win! Tried a few different caps like you said and it totally works. I would say it has reduced the chatter by at least 95%. I’m only seeing it when moving very slow across the gap or on a locomotive with poor pickups / dirty wheels….
Thanks for checking out Dons channel. He is an amazing modeler and has an awesome layout built for operations. He has a FB page as well about his P&W layout.
@@RailserveJohn thats sweet news brotha, glad it worked out. I sure like the way that signal looks. All of the metal castings ive gotten from Showcase Miniatures are of great quality, I just wish their wig wag signals were operating instead of static models. Boomers Dioramas did a build of their tow truck and that model looks great,, I think its a late 70's early 80's truck but even today, it would look amazing in the weeds rusting away. I cant wait to see what you do next. Cheers Rob
Very cool, nice easy solution and very effective. Ben.
Thanks Ben! It does the job!
Great work , enjoyed your podcast interview on Around the Layout. Have you supplied a wiring diagram , many thanks and enjoy the updates.
Thank you! I’ll be shifting over to a more complex system as the layout is expanding. But I will explain more about this simple set up in a future video.
Awesome job,signal looks great:)
Thanks!
John...I'm not a expert but I believe those signals were used by Conrail especially when you say you saw them in NJ...video of signal mast install would be nice.
Yeah they are all over NJ. With the layout being modeled in old CR territory I thought it would be appropriate. I’ll be expanding into the office in the near future and will have to build another 5 signals. I’ll try to film some of the assembly. They are really nice models. Thanks for watching.
Very nice signals
Thanks! Wish I could install more lol
Thank you for sharing. Very nice.👍👀
Thank you!
Very cool. Is the signal power coming from the track or another source? I am DC and this would be cool to use if it could be wired without constant track power. Maybe a follow up demonstration video showing the actual wiring of the signal, relays, etc might give more insight. Either way, this is a great addition to your railroad. Thank you for sharing.
Thanks Bob. We are going to make another video reviewing the logic and wiring. I’m not sure if DC would work or not. If so it would be a very simple option…
You would need a separate DC power supply . You could use the track power in theory but as soon as you lowered your track voltage your signal would go out. I am not sure if the NCE BD20 will actually work on DC track. Never tried it.
@@ThePWMRR thank you for responding. I will investigate more.
@@RailserveJohn looking forward to the follow up video.
This system is based on the current flow across the rails (ie current draw of track power). If there is no track power (ie DC locomotive is stopped 0V) then no draw and thus no report to the signal that the track is occupied ("down") - the track will be reported "up" or clear.
To bypass this you could look at implementing an AC track circuit monitor, some sort of computerized system, or more traditional optical/ photo/ beam/ weight sensor system. A timing circuit could also be implemented to help with gaps or issues arising from 'relay drop-out' as mentioned in the UA-cam upload.
John, that is a great feature for your layout. Do you need to have resistors for the wheel sets on all your cars? The signals look fantastic and help protect your "closet" track. I can't wait to see your layout in person.-Tom
Thanks Tom! Yes I will be adding resistors to the wheel sets. Maybe just one per car. It’s pretty neat and totally adds practical use for signals. U know how long I have been wanting some lol
I would Like to know how to make my signals analog. Looks great .I want do it.
Thanks bud. It works but is very basic. The blocks will not talk to each other like other systems but it works for one independent block. We will be working on another video going into ore depth.
@@RailserveJohn understood! Simple is what I'm looking for to finish my tiny loop.
They look awesome those signals very nice. John 2618👍🏻🚂
Thanks Mike!
Nice video, I have the same signal kit. However on mine the LED has the green on the upper left. I would prefer green on the upper right as yours is. Did you have to request that when you ordered? Thanks
Interesting … no I just ordered the standard LED set up for this signal through Showcase miniatures
Very nice!!
Thanks Dave!
Nice simple setup and really good looking signal.
Do you have resisters on all your wheelsets?
Thanks Heath. No not yet. Now that we got it working I will start adding at least one on each car. The system works really well and does it’s job protecting the hidden track.
John, who's the maker of the white tank cars ? Snazzy tank car. Like the signal's too.
Thanks! The ones with the brown bands are Athearn Genesis acid cars. I just gave them a light weathering.
@@RailserveJohn Thank you.
looking great but lol what kind of wiring are you using i like how it looks i have some little signals i like to mount by my double crossover but im not sure which way the lights are suppose to be facing and how many of the lights i need by it and im installing 4 tortoise machine to operate the crossover any advise would be nice
Hey Dwight, there is definitely a way to hook up signals to tortoise switch machines. It will switch lights depending on the switch indication. I personally have never done it but I have seen some diagrams online how to wire them directly to the tortoise. The club I belong to has several hooked up like that.
Essentially in controlled territory, every switch has a signal protecting it. If it's an isolated switch, it is protected from all directions (typically). In the case of a double crossover (as with single crossover) there would be four signals, in order to protect each track, approaching the switches (crossover) from each direction. These signals would point "out" from the switches, so that approaching movements could view them.
However, it's your railway, so anything goes, and it's upto you to decide what makes the most sense for how you operate. Not every single switch (even on mainline) have a signal either!
Tortoise switch machines offer simple signal logic; I would consider "cross" wiring the machines and signals so they actually act as a pair, such in the real world. You might have to add a couple relays to perfectly emulate my idea, but with a couple contacts on each switch you can get close. You can do normally closed (NC) for normal direction pair to activate the green lamp, and NO reverse direction for diagonal pairs to activate yellow lamp (for instance). If you wire the lamps in parallel with each other but series through either Tortoise machine contacts then they would only display green or yellow respectively when BOTH switches are properly lined. The only issue with this and only have two contacts is that you cannot request a red signal, the signal would simply go dark for unlined.
Therefore you would need some relays, perhaps 4, but possibly 2. In which the Tortoise keeps the relay alive in order to display Green/ Yellow, if the relay falls then the signal displays Red. In the case of a misaligned/ moving switch.
Yes I can help out if needed
Wow, you didn’t waste any time with installing those. Great job. Do you think you’ll trust them? I wouldn’t. Mind you, if you’re the only operator you know what trains are running. Lol.
Hahaha it works pretty well! It for sure shows if a loco is in the block and when I add resistors to the wheels on cars it will show those to. I guess time will tell if we have any “meets” lol
Once the train goes into the yard, through the wall, does the G light always stay red until the train comes back out?
Once the trains clears the hidden track block it will return to Yellow. It only goes Red when a train is in the hidden section