E116-7 - Ryne Stanek Ejected After Junior Valentine's Start-Stop Balk Call; Dusty Baker Tossed Too
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- Опубліковано 23 чер 2023
- 2B Umpire Junior Valentine ejected Astros pitcher Ryne Stanek and HP Umpire Manny Gonzalez ejected manager Dusty Baker for arguing a balk call leading to the Dodgers scoring a go-ahead run in LA. Was Stanek's motion on the mound a balk or was it legal? Report: www.closecallsports.com/2023/...
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Give Junior credit for the RBI: Run Balked In.
"there's some banging from the Astros dugout" oh that's nasty lol lol
They will forever be known as the Trashtros ;)
@@stevebabiak6997or the Asterisks
@@stevebabiak6997 hypocrisy at its finest from dodger fans.
@@Matthew-gp3wo - not a Dodgers fan. But the sentiment I expressed is widely known in the fan bases of all MLB teams. Their reputation for cheating even persists into videos such as this one.
And we now know you’re a Trashtros fan without having to explicitly tell us that.
"astros still trying to bang that old garbage pail apparently... someone tell them it doesnt work!"
Good explanation. Clearly a balk.
If anyone was to be upset at anything it would be how inconsistently the rule is applied.
The knee flinch is intended to deceive the runners?
@@freedbygsusHence OP's point
@@freedbygsus Doesn't matter whether the pitcher did anything to deceive the runner. That has nothing to do with the black and white literal rules. If a pitcher violates the balk rule, with runners on base, it's a balk whether he deceived the runner, intended to deceive the runner or did not intend to deceive the runner. Deception is irrelevant.
The Umpires Face. LOL
I’m an Astros fan and that’s been a balk for 150 years..
Staneks a bitch for throwing that baby fit, after already being given a chance to vent, and seemingly being past it. Dude really let that nagging voice/ego in the back of his head win. Fucking weak.
can the astros fan tell us how long stealing signs has been bush league for? probably longer
Stealing signs using electronic or optics has always been bush league. Stealing sign using your brain has always been part of the game
@@a_doggo Many teams were doing the same thing. How do you not know that by now? The Yankees were literally using the YES network to steal signs. This is common knowledge.
@@a_doggo and also yankees, dodgers, Red Sox among other fans that go around like their teams were saints.
As a recent convert to Baseball from the UK, this is the one rule I don't really get. Why does it exist? What is the point? It's not as if a pitcher is trying a fake pitch. It just seems a ridiculously severe penalty for, usually, a slight movement.
Good question. The balk rule gives baserunners a clear point beyond which the pitcher must go home. Without it, the game would look very different. Runners would be easy to pick off or throw out, and therefore would not take significant leads (and could not run at all until the ball was actually on the way to the catcher). Even when the violation looks minor, it still can freeze the runner - he should be able to run when, under the rule, the pitcher must go home, but cannot if the rule is not called strictly.
@@mulgrum Thanks for that, and that makes perfect sense now. As a TV baseball veiewer, one only sees the pitcher and the batter in the shot, and the base runners aren't in view, so that aspect of it, doesn't come across so clearly. Sadly only managed one game live, and wasn't really aware of this at that time. Thanks for the explanation.
To use cricket as an analogy, we encourage runner to leave their crease early (steal bases) and we encourage pitcher to mankading (pickoff throw). However, there is no popping crease in baseball that the runner can use to determine when the the bowler/pitched is commited and the runner can start moving, so the pitcher's action becomes the threshold instead.
The balk rule makes about as much sense to Brits as cricket does to Americans.
Initially, the balk was established so as not to deceive the runner. Over time, it's gotten very technical on movement versus intent to deceive.
I feel that if they show obvious intent to disengage from the mound, they're not trying to deceive the runner. There has to be some wiggle room for stop/start because of the human element. Imagine your cleats in a hole in front of a mound. You can't just slide your cleat back. You have to lift it and pull back giving the illusion of a pause.
His foots was is that his excuse? He lifted his heel. He’s paid six or seven figures, been coached for years. He flinched and that’s on him. He balked. Once again the asterisks want the league to let them cheat.
This video explanation is trash. The rule mentioned is for the FRONT foot as it signals coming set or starting the pitch. Moving your BACK leg clearly signals you are stepping off the rubber. If anything, his awkward motion to step off gave the runners more time to return to their base. It was not deceitful and this not a balk. Had he not stepped off after twitching his back foot, it would have been a balk. Umps missed this one and people with a low level understanding of balk rules are giving terrible explanations...
@@impitt28 The rule is explicitly intended to prevent deception. No one wants baseball to turn into balkapalooza anytime a pitcher flinches.
Absolutely right!
@@msheldon93 You get one movement to either come set, throw to a base or step off - not two movements. Has nothing to do with deception or trying to deceive a runner.
I'm not a fan of either team here but the problem I see is this shit happens all the time and never gets called. I see so many pitchers also continuously bounce their front leg and never get set, then pitch the ball. That's wrong and never gets called
AT what level are you talking about?
@robertbrown7470 what are you talking about what level, the majors
Yep. Even in the video she used as evidence for a throw set. The guy would have been called for balking 3 seconds before he threw it.
The pitcher is permitted to reset his non pivot foot as he comes set as long as he only stops once. What you are describing is not a balk.
Certainly looked like one to me. 🤷♀
Hey Lindsay/CCS, this post's close was clever. Your posts are great, clean tight editing and production skills, it takes a lot of work to produce even basic stuff. Good job again.
BALK....by rule, period. Not kinda/was barely noticeable...blah blah. BALK.
It’s why he stepped off, to try and hide it,
No he stepped off because lifting your back foot indicates that's what you are doing... Had he not stepped off, it would have been a balk for falsely signalling he was going to step off. No runners were deceived. He did not make any motion with his front foot indicating he was going to come set as this video wrongly explains.
The knee pops then there’s a pause and then He steps off, I’ll give you that it’s pretty quick in the timing but it was clearly obvious on the first look, also stepping off naturally requires no knee pop movement
@@msheldon93 The video explains it properly. You don't understand the balk rules. This is a clear balk.
I've been looking forward to your video since this happened. Thanks for elaborating.
Weak broadcast by FOX. "Oh my goodness." The uninformed announcers didn't explain it and hardly showed it. Only that the umpire called a balk and a run would score. Had to come here. Thank you @CloseCallSports.
That's a balk that no MLB pitcher should ever make. It looked like he decided to do one thing and then changed his mind. If I required my HS pitchers to know what they were going to do while on the rubber, the least an MLB pitcher whose taking a minimum 6 figure salary can do is the same as a HS pitcher.
"no mlb pitcher should ever make" sometimes it's on accident which is why he seemed so mad, lol
@@ccgb92 There is absolutely no reason he should be mad. He balked and he got called for it.
Balk
Balks always seem so subjective to me. The oddest rule in baseball to me.
That's a Balk all day long and 50 times on Sunday!
Terrible rule
Stating your opinion more confidently doesn't make it true. Rule 6.02(a) allows umpires to call anything a balk which is why the rule is supposed to be enforced only to prevent the pitcher from deliberately deceiving the runners.
@@kkint1821 Because you don't understand it or the reason for it does not make it a terrible rule.
Certainly was.
1:00 "How the fuck is that a balk?" I feel like JomBoy.
The rule was clearly stated. This channel is nothing like little boy jom.
Jom Yankee boy.
I saw the game and the 8th inning was a wild one. The umpire was right in making the call.
You thought the pitcher was deliberately deceiving the runners in that situation?
@@freedbygsus a balk is a balk even if its an accident
@freedbygsus please point to me where the balk rule says anything about intent. I'll wait..
@@keithcourvill1529 MLB definition: A balk occurs when a pitcher makes an illegal motion on the mound that the umpire deems to be deceitful to the runner(s)
@@Dasim6786 If the pitcher makes a motion that is illegal, it does not matter whether or not he is trying to deceive the runner. A violation of any of the 13 infractions listed is a balk.
Bottom line. That's a balk. If he's trying to step off, you don't slide your foot and catch a cleat. You lift and step back in a continuous motion. Causing the knee movement before he steps off the pitching rubber/ plate. There was NO intent to deceive. But that's what the balk call has developed into. A movement versus intent.
Pitchers aren't robots. Humans flinch and hesitate from time to time. If Stanek unintentionally bent his knee, then stepping off should be a way to remedy the situation without a called balk.
"Rule 6.02(a) Comment:
Umpires should bear in mind that the purpose of the balk rule is to prevent the pitcher from deliberately deceiving the base runner. If there is doubt in the umpire’s mind, the “intent” of the pitcher should govern."
You're wrong dude. There was no intent to deceive. No runners were deceived regardless of intent as they saw him move his back foot and knew he had to step off and safely returned to the base. Also he was trying to call time out. Clearly not attempting a sketchy pick off move. Which would never be done in this fashion as it gives the runners more time to return to the base safely.... terrible game changing call.
The point is it does deceive the runners into a secondary lead.. Intent does not matter..
@@msheldon93
Hello?.. There’s no such thing as a “sketchy” move to second or third?!.. lol.. You can do anything you want, except that!.. lol.. Or stepping to 2nd while throwing to 3rd, or vice versa..
It was a balk, the movement deceived the runners into a secondary lead..
@@msheldon93 there are other ways to balk that don't fall into the category of "deceiving the runner". For example, dropping the ball while engaged with the rubber is a balk, as is stepping off with the wrong foot when in the wind up. There is no rule that talks about "deceiving the runner". That is another myth.
It was a balk, but at the same time I’ve seen it not called a balk when pitchers have done far worse than that. Game 2 of the ALCS last year I believe when Wandy Peralta picked off a runner at first base is an example of that. Peralta stepped towards home and then threw to first. It was so obvious, but wasn’t called a balk.
Not only did the pitcher make the mistake that cost his team the game, he cost himself some money too by getting thrown out of the game for it. Nice job, Stanek.
Woopie 5 grand
I will give him a tiny bit of credit for avoiding the trifecta and finishing the inning before continuing the argument.
He makes more than a million a years money is probably the least of his worries
@@Youngstomatahe could spend some of the money he lost on getting a haircut and a personal trainer.
He looks like Axel Rose, circa 2005.
Emotional petulant child. Just own your error.
What is the point of such pointless rules ?
Typical player guilty of an infraction, taking no accountability for it and projectioning his emotional vomit onto an umpire.
Umpire abuse isn't justified even when the umpires do get it wrong.
I don't think that's a balk because he wasn't set in a pitching motion, he had both his hands down. That's like saying you adjust your foot before a pitch.
Yes by their rules pitcher can’t even turn and move to look to first without being set because that would be a balk.
Being in the set position has nothing to do with it. There are many ways to balk before coming set.
This game was lost by the Astro relievers, giving up multiple walks and runs in the later innings…Stanek’s balk puts an exclamation point on the team’s overall poor performance this season.
Eight Dodgers crosses the plate. Only three of those reached base by putting a ball in play. You simply cannot win a game where you give up free bases like that.
This is an example of what we are seeing more and more with the pitch clock and the disengagement rules…he balked and tried to quickly disguise it by stepping off…he got caught
Yeah the flinch before he stepped off. I didn't catch that at first
Such a clear balk and I agree he tried to cover it up
That's not the point of calling a balk. Umpires call a balk to prevent the pitcher from deceiving the baserunners or batters. No one is deceived by the pitcher flinching right as he steps off the rubber to use a timeout.
Finally someone who gets it! This video is trash and compares him flinching his back leg and stepping off to someone flinching their front leg and not delivering a pitch. One is deceitful to the runners and the other isn't...
Flinching before stepping off actually gives the runners more time to return to their base as they know you have to step off. Had he flinched his leg like that and then not stepped off it would have been deceitful and a justified balk.
The balk rule is 100% about whether runners were deceived and in this situation they were certainly not. Terrible call and poorly explained/incorrect explanation in this video...
@@msheldon93 flinching the back leg might not be deceiving to the hitter but it's absolutely deceiving to the runner. pick off moves start from the back leg disengaging from the rubber. The alternatives to this being illegal are: no back leg movements are illegal, which then makes flinching the back leg a strategic move that runners have to look out for (which is dumb and also wastes time); or you force a judgment call on the refs about "was the intent of this leg move to deceive", which is just gonna lead to even worse situations of it being selectively enforced and inserts unnecessary subjectivity. This type of balk is pretty cut and dry, is called pretty consistently (as opposed to other types of balks), and is easy enough to avoid as a pitcher. There's a reason the rule is the way it is and this is enforced the way it is
Caught this one just at the right time. Stanek made an absolute idiot of himself.
watch any balk compilation on youtube. they're literally filled with movements identical to this being called. no room to complain whasoever.
Balk or not, what is up with the umps being so trigger happy to eject players and managers this year? Is it because there is a new crop of them and they are over reacting? It’s sad for baseball.
This isn’t a trigger happy ejection. The pitcher balked, got called for it, asked for an explanation and got one. He would have been fine if he didn’t go back for round two of the argument.
The fact that Dusty Baker didn’t come out of the dugout to argue says a lot about how he felt about the call. If he didn’t think it was a balk he would’ve been in the ump’s face.
I think it was a balk but Dusty definitely wouldn’t have come out. He doesn’t do much fighting for his team anymore
Why did he get thrown out then?
Dusty doesn't come out for any reason lol
@@deangelop697it’s a good game plan though. Unless you challenge or ask for a review for something coming out to argue is just asking to be ejected
It's one of the worst calls to argue - a judgment call that won't get overturned 99 times out of 100... I think Dusty's upset that Stanek is making the bullpen work far harder than they had planned for. That's what I'd be thinking. MLB umpires don't miss to the positive on stop-start balks - they miss by not calling them, if they ever miss at all. Some crews have multiple guys who've never missed a start-stop balk from B/C position.
Great video. A real contribution!
Definitely a balk. BUT - with the pitch clock now so they can't dance around forever doing stupid motions - I'd get rid of the balk rule! How's that for a crazy idea?
It is indeed crazy, and about as useful as tits on a boar.
That was a balk. Anyway, that runner would have scored had Outman's hit not been a grounds rule double. But whatevs. Context means nothing to the Houston Astros.
I’ve given up trying to understand balks but isn’t that knee movement from him stepping off? You do have to move a knee to step off of the rubber after all.
This one is straightforward. When the pitcher is standing on the rubber and starts to move he has to either step off the rubber, get set, or make the pitch. Stanek moved a tiny bit stopped then stepped off. As soon as he stopped moving even though he didn’t move far it was a balk.
See a balk, call a balk!
Not even close, rigged
@@jgz79bwahahahahahah
Balk rule is dumb to begin with. Pitchers should be allowed to juke the runners and hitters.
In real time, I didn't pick up on the balk, but by the rulebook, it's the correct call to make
one part that confuses me with the call is Stanek appears to be calling time and trying to step backwards off the mound (which he claims was his goal). What should he have done differently if he really was stepping off the rubber in order to avoid a balk call?
It was a bad call. He intended to step off the rubber with his back foot and did so. This video explanation is trash and wrongly compared twitching your back foot to twitching your front foot.
In fact, if he had twitched his back foot and then NOT stepped off, it would have been a balk. The umpire fucked this one up.
Rule 6.02(a) gives umpires the discretion to call a balk on any motion the pitcher makes that isn't part of his legal pitch delivery so long as the umpire is calling the balk to prevent the pitcher from deliberately deceiving the runners.
@@freedbygsus there were no runners to deceive is the weirdest part of this
@@Dasim6786 there were runners on second and third.
To anyone not biased for Houston, that's a blatant balk. EASY call to make when I saw it live. Stanek should issue an apology to baseball.
The balk definition has always needed some work from the MLB. It’s definitely not clear enough to understand. It should read once pitcher is set and not in the stretch. Once committed forward for the pitch you must commit to pitch.
U2 Valentine is standing right there looking for such a thing, then it happens.
Seeing that damn bullpen gate again just gives me nightmares.
Right call was made.
If you have to slow it down to see him stop, did he really stop? It's like how two things are never really touching if you zoom in and see the electrons repelling each other.
Umpire called it live, without reviewing and slowing down. That was done for the viewer to see it more clearly. Real time I saw it as did anyone who's umpired for some time. BALK!!
@@ednovy4925 lol okay
hilarious. thank you, thats the only time i got to see it.
Of course it was, no question about it.
It WAS a balk. No doubt let's be realistic here now 😂. I bet that guy feeling the love in Houston 🎉 congratulations
Break out the trash cans 🥫
I bet he goes back and watches the replay and than apologizes for being a dummy
Nah he classes he won’t apologize
It's really not as straightforward a call as the video makes it seem.
How many ballplayers do that, really?
The rule as you presented it says that it be "any motion naturally associated with their pitch". I doubt any motion by the right leg at the time he was called for a balk could be "naturally associated with their pitch" as he has yet to come set, which means making a pitch from that point would also be a balk. There be further clarifications/notes to the rule that were not covered but from the position he was in when he had the start/stop it did not seem to be part of the pitch but just in the movement of coming to a set position.
Coming set must be smooth and continuous. It’s not just about delivering a pitch as was clearly stated in the teaching video
@@rayray4192 But the cite for coming set is in 5.07(a)(2). 6.02(a)(1) applies after the set when a pitcher would start to pitch and stop. The proper cite is 5.079a)(2) which is another "start and stop" balk for not complying with this:
"Preparatory to coming to a set position, the pitcher shall have one hand on his side; from this position he shall go to his set position as defined in Rule 5.07(a)(2) without interruption and in one continuous motion."
The kicker is that 5.07(a)(2) does not have any penalty for it's being violated. But it's been balked for many years as "common practice" per Jim Evans. You also might call it a feint move without a step.
@@jamesmurray3948 nice post. Thanks! Love me some Jim Evans. Pitchers must be smooth and continuous
I worked high school in 4 states and college in 2 states. It was pretty much agreed everywhere that if the old lady beyond center field watering her flowers sees the balk - then ah.... call it. Otherwise . . . So where does this one fall?
CORRECT. This is incredible and succinct analysis. Well done CloseCallSports.
A bit ticky-tack.. but per the rules... a balk.. I know some of the lower levels don't want that level of ticky-tack until they come set.. .but the ump has rule support here...
Any called balk is a balk by the rules. Rule 6.02(a) is really broad.
Man, I’m glad it’s not my job to call balks.
It was a balk, but really? At least the umpire made Dodger fans happy.
Super obvious call, not sure what Stanek is whining about here.
Hard to sell but it looked like he stepped off the rubber
Players and fans want umpires to apologize for bad calls. Players need to own when they are wrong too.
Pity this group didn't do the E112-114 twins game. Maybe they would of called the set-move-set-move pitch delivery as a balk.
That’s a balk, son.
Thank you for the explanation.
Aww, do the Astros feel cheated?
Absolutely this was a balk. And he was wrong for making any motion towards the umpire after the third out and was rightfully ejected.
A balk is like driving over the speed limit. If a cop wants, he could technically pull everyone over on the highway for driving over the speed limit. A balk could be called on all pitchers in a given situation - it just depends on how egregious it is.
Not me. I never exceed the max speed limit.
@@rayray4192 You must be one of those folks who annoyingly slow down traffic for everyone. LOL. Just like an umpire could be right but still be a jerk.
@@egroegny the ubiquitous lol from a little boy masquerading like a man.
@@egroegny Junior Valentine is a jerk because he went to umpire school; worked his ass off through the minors, was hired by MLB, assigned a game in Los Angeles, and saw an infraction and called the infraction, supported by the MLB rule book? A balk is an actual rule. Petulant children break rules and then consider mommy unfair when they are disciplined.
@@rayray4192 I guess you drive like a jerk and you communicate like a jerk.
Wait until he sees the video of himself. lol.. that was a balk. Good call.
I think the balk rule is just dumb to begin with. Why not let em start and stop if they want? Trick the runners throw em out.
Any movement with your leg must be continuous. If he's just coming set, he can't buckle his knee, stop and then start again to do whatever it was he was doing. Hard to tell from the replay. Almost looked like he stepped off with his pivot foot but not sure. But he definitely moved his knee and stopped and then moved his knee again. He started and stopped. It's a balk. Has nothing to do with whether he deceived the runner, forget about that statement in the rule book. The balk is only based on the pitching rules regarding what the pitcher can and can't do, whether it deceived the runner or not has nothing to do with calling a balk.
Had it been his front foot (as with the balk this video is discussing and shows an example of) then you'd be right.
It was his back foot. He clearly indicated he was stepping off and committed to doing so. Had he not stepped off it would have been a balk. No runners were deceived by this though and that's the point everyone is missing.
@@msheldon93 I watched this a number of times. He moved twice. He moved his knee. Then he moved his knee and stepped off. That is started and stopped, if I'm correct. I am talking about his back foot, not his free foot. Deception doesn't enter into any balk calls. They are pretty black and white rules - either the pitcher violated one of the balk rules or he didn't.
The intent of the pick-off is to deceive the runner without violating any of the balk rules. If the pitcher succeeds, then he has an out.
@@msheldon93 At most lower levels of ball, this wouldn't have been called a balk, higher levles, if the umpires are watching closely, it would most likely be called a balk. Once your pivot foot is in contact with the rubber you can't start and stop anything, you must either go set in one continuous motion or step off in one continuous motion. No stopping inbetween.
@@msheldon93 Don't understand your comment about his free foot or front foot?
@@robertbrown7470 >Deception doesn't enter into any balk calls.
Well okay then lets see how MLB defines a balk.
Balk (BK) Definition
A balk occurs when a pitcher makes an illegal motion on the mound that the umpire deems to be deceitful to the runner(s).
*that the umpire deems to be **_deceitful_** to the runner(s).*
Rule 8.05 Comment: Umpires should bear in mind that the purpose of the balk rule is to prevent the pitcher from *_deliberately deceiving_** the base runner.*
I don't watch a lot of games but that was a fun one to watch. Didn't really care who won but good entertainment and essentially isn't that what this is?
Can we get video of this type of balk EVER being called before please? Where a RHP twitches their right knee milliseconds before stepping off the rubber before they have even attempted to come set yet?
There are lots of videos showing a start-stop balk. One only needs to take a little self-initiative and go find them. This is a common balk, and the correct call.
@@teebob21 But the experts who run this channel (and I do mean that complimentarily) chose an example start-stop balk video where the pitcher started and stopped moving their FRONT leg, not their back. I've played and watched a lot of baseball, and I just haven't seen it called this way before.
@@Sharker2400 As hobbyists, Lin and Tmac may not have a perfectly extensive video library of readily available clips for which they have the rights to republish that would have satisfied your wishes for an identical example. Allow me to apologize to you on their behalf for not accommodating you with an exact duplicate of the situation, and instead using a clip which was a different method of violating the same rule.
@@teebob21 Kind of an odd duck, aren't you?
@@Sharker2400 No, not really.
It’s still a balk regardless. His right leg pivoted
Dude balked!!!
Man that is so slight, but yup, that’s a balk all day long.
The home plate umpire wasn't in position or even watching for the pitch?
There was no pitch. U-2 called the balk
There is no pitch on a balk. It's common when a balk is called by a base umpire, for the home plate umpire to mirror that call. I can't think of a time where that didn't happen, at least not in the major leagues.
@@vincentwendt720 a balk can be hit for a grand slam if the pitch is delivered. If batter/ runner and all runners advance at least one base the balk is ignored.
@@vincentwendt720 if a pitch is delivered on a balk and batter and all runners do not advance one base it’s a no pitch.
The pitcher had not yet come set. There was no reason for the plate umpire to waste energy by setting in his stance for a pitch that wasn't coming.
Do you often critique the mechanics and operational procedures of vocations with which you have zero first-hand experience? Why do you think that the plate umpire should have been in a set position at the time the balk was called by U2?
that's def not intentional, looks like a twitch. however, doesn't mean it can't be called a balk. good eye on that ump
There was no attempt to deceive. Maybe a balk technically, but not why the balk rule is there.
@@sonnyjames8922 doesn't matter if you deceive or not, it's still a balk
@johnmiller619 Ron Luciano said he never called a balk in his life, that he didn't understand the rule. He was an MLB umpire for 10 years. It's intent is don't deceive the runner. It's morphed into a game of gotcha . . . catching pitchers on unintentional technicalities. MLB is enforcing balks more in 2023. They should relax the rule and allow knee buckling when stepping off the mound.
@@sonnyjames8922 well, in this case, he knee buckled more after he got called out to prob make it seem like he was stepping off to protect his twitch, lol
that's a balk 100%
THANK. YOU. APPRECIATE THE WORK.
Great info ⚾️
Not an Astros fan, but always glad to see the Dodgers and Yankees lose...but it was the right call. Pretty funny to hear some defend Stanek and say, "Well, he only moved his knee a LITTLE." That's a balk.
So who is your team
Check out rule 6.02(a). Nearly anything can be a balk which is why the umpire is supposed to go with the pitcher's intent if there's any doubt in the umpire's mind.
Who has 27 championships and 40 pennants. Yankees own the Trashtros
100% a balk. I saw it before you even did the breakdown. In professional baseball standards that is without a doubt a balk. And the pitcher knew it too because he tried to hide it by stepping off, which in the history of balks you will see pitchers try to do almost every single time when it comes to this type of balk. Now I would never call this in a high school game, especially with this situation, but I would tell them, hey you can't do that. On top of that, I would probably be the only one that would see it so I could get away with using it at as a teaching moment. But for MLB great call Junior.
Watch her video ago she wrongly compared his back leg to the front leg of another balk call. No runners were deceived in this play. He indicated by lifting his back foot he was going to step off and as awkward as it was he stepped off. He never made a motion to come set. Only to step off. Had he not continued to step off it would have been a balk for falsely signalling he was going to step off...
FYI I can't stand the Astros, stl fan here. Agreed here... Exactly, I am not sure if this happened at the pitching change or not but I went back the the fox coverage from the time pitcher entered the game. And as far as I could tell the pitcher never stepped off till this pitch. It seems to me the umpire was waiting/wanting the pitcher to step off to make this call.
I agree it can be a bulk if it's not his normal motion to step off from stretch. If this is the case your saying the very motion of his stepping off is a bulk!
I don't care how good or bad an umpire you are! You don't make this call unless your tipped off to see it. Tipping the umpire of something and not informing both teams is CHEATING OR BUSH LEAGUES AT BEST!
Even in this video you have to slow it down to prove it! If you have to slow it down to prove it, you have to be looking for it or expecting it to see it! PERIOD! THIS DOES NOT GET CALLED/CAUGHT IN LIVE Speed unless the umpire is expecting its about to happen! Then ask yourself why he's expecting this when he steps off and it's not called until he steps off!
Since he didn't step off the entire time till this instance, we have no idea what his normal step off from stretch movement is!!!
Care to provide proof this is not in his normal motion to step off from the stretch before going to set? Anyone!
Rule 6.02(a)(1) and 6.02(a)(7) can be taken together to mean that anytime a pitcher is moving without legally pitching the ball, it's a balk. The limited step-offs even make stepping off a balk at a certain point. Unless umpires should enforce the smallest infraction without consideration for the spirit of the rule, then this shouldn't be a balk unless it's obvious the pitcher's motion is deliberately deceiving the batter or runners.
Excellent explanation.
This is kind of rediculous imo. Like your knee is going to move when stepping off the mound. So essentially any time you step off is a bulk?
No. He twitched THEN stepped off. Two different motions. And it was a balk.
I took a look at the rulebook on the official MLB website, This is by definition NOT a balk. The pitcher has to be coming set or moving to that position, he was just standing up straight. his arms never came up to move into the set position and he never entered the set position. This was a bad call (one of many the umps made against the astros during that game) For a "Start/Stop" balk, there needs to be a "Start"
You are completely wrong. The pitcher has to step off in one continuous, uninterrupted motion either before coming set or after coming set. He cannot start to come set then decide to step off. Clearly a balk.
Unfortunately when a player commits any violation they are understandingly embarrassed and then blame the umpire to take the heat off themselves. That is my take on the ball after my 50 years in the game.
I’m not saying that’s not a ball, because it 100% is. The issue I have is that 99.9% of thats NEVER called and there’s been wayyy worse that’s been let go. I’m a Tigers fan (unfortunately lol) so I could care less. We need consistency
It was a balk, I'm just amazed the ump saw it since you needed slo mo and colored aids for most people to catch it. There's been much more obvious balk calls that haven't been called all season
The umpires are tasked with looking at different things depending on which position they are in. For example, in my old association we worked two man crews almost exclusively. In that system the base umpire was tasked with watching from the waist down and the plate man watched from the waist up. With a 4 man crew they can get even more specific.
If slo-mo and colored aids are needed for most people to see it (and I agree) it's kind of hard to believe that the ump thought that the intent was to trick R3 to steal home.
Good call by 2nd base. Good ejection.
Hou fans….‘that’s not balk!!’, …Everyone else…”Balk!”
It was a balk. Pretty obvious.
Balk all day.....
Yes most deffently a balk. A classic start stop balk.
Great call. Nice job picking that up.
That was definitely a balk, and the ejection was the right call as well
Definitely a balk…lol…if he hadn’t called it, that would’ve been a blown call.
By rule, it’s a balk. Should it be a balk, probably not. We hear the phrase “not in the spirit of the rule” a lot lately and I feel like this is one of those scenarios. Tight situation, adrenaline pumping, slight twitch. There was no intent to deceive the runner, which was the original intent for the rule.
Similar to when Jeff McNeil was called for a shift violation when covering a runner on second. He had one foot straddling the other side of the bag, as one normally does, and even moved off before the pitch. Still called, technically right, but should not have been called as his intent was just to cover the bag like he’s supposed to.
There’s too much left to interpretation with many of the MLBs rule and they need to take a look at their rule book and make some adjustments and start clearly defining violations. The MLB has a lot of “what constitutes a catch?” Going on with their rules.
Yet he wasn’t allowed to pitch yet because no eye contact with the pitch clock rule so how can it be a balk when he can’t legally pitch?
Just for my clarification, wasn’t the example you used a situation where the pitcher came set and twitched his front (left) leg? In this situation, Stanek wasn’t set and twitched his back leg. The difference seems to be important regarding deceiving the runner. I could be missing something, though.
I see them bob the front leg all the time.. It bothers me but it’s apparently legal.. Can’t stop and start with the back leg..
Did he step back off the pitching rubber with his pivot foot?
Neither leg can move once set….
@@jacobjones5269 You can bob all you want pre-pitch, as long as you come to a discernable stop before starting your windup.
@@robertbrown7470Yes, but after the start-stop. By then the balk has already been committed.
It was a balk.
Baseball is more entertaining now with more umpire/coach/player arguments again!
It's definitely a balk! Although Rob Manfred will likely not punish anyone for the argument afterwards, considering he lets the Astros get away with whatever they want including cheating. Wouldn't be surprised if he reversed the call & just gave them a trophy for their trouble.
oh you poor sweetie, does your vagina hurt?