Halberds - why were they that shape?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 1 чер 2024
- Great Courses Plus free month offer: ow.ly/O0ju303M5XS
Halberds were a major battle weapon of the late medieval world, and here I conjecture about how they were used.
Support me on Patreon: / lindybeige
Subscribe to my channel: ua-cam.com/users/lindybei...
More weapons and armour videos here: • Weapons and armour
A rather long video about halberds, this. This always seems to happen when I do these sponsored videos. I cleared a large space than usual in my sitting room so that I could move about a bit more and swing a big stick, but neglected to turn off the main ceiling light, which explains the strange warm light that keeps hitting my face.
Halberds vary in shape a lot, but a common form involves a long spike on top and an axe blade that is either straight or concave, and facing the user. The way they were shaped must surely reflect how they were used, and I draw some tentative conclusions.
Lindybeige: a channel of archaeology, ancient and medieval warfare, rants, swing dance, travelogues, evolution, and whatever else occurs to me to make.
▼ Follow me...
Twitter: / lindybeige I may have some drivel to contribute to the Twittersphere, plus you get notice of uploads.
Facebook: / lindybeige (it's a 'page' and now seems to be working).
Google+: "google.com/+lindybeige"
website: www.LloydianAspects.co.uk
/ user "Lindybeige"
Standard measurements: Inches, feet, yard, meter, centimeter, kilometer, mile
Lindybeige's measurements: *jumps* about this high
these medieval weapons guys always show up with swords, why don't they bring meter sticks to videos
Take the average of his jumps and use that
Instead of "banana fo scale" maybe we should Lindy's? Like just keep him around an archeological site and have him stand/lie down next to whatever you've dug up to use as a scale in pictures. Dig up an ancient sarissa and be like "Wow, that thing is nearly 6 Lindy's long!"
That's the British way. Speed limits - miles per hour, fuel litres.
Beer - pints, whisky 50ml
Heating pipes 1/2" BSP, water 15mm
Doors 2040mm, people 6'
Food kg, people stone & lbs
Madness I say 🤭
*"Close formation!"*
Ah crap, I'm behind that guy who always swings his halberd again
He's not gonna be on my Christmas list, that's for sure
Well... then shoot your musket or something, because is possible that you are in a spanish tercio
@KesselRunHero Then you are at the front now. Great.
*stab*
just the medieval/renaissance version of getting sat behind the 8 foot tall guy in the movie theather
Lindybeige:
-Needs to demonstrate height of a weapon.
-Is currently holding a long stick.
-Decides to use his hand and jump.
Never change.
Shoutout to the actual lizard on the corner of the wall lmao
Omg I didnt notice him, I love him!
Little geek lizzard, snuck in for a history lesson!
Shout out to the metaphorical lizard in the corner of your room right now
What a handsome boy
@@nikolakuzmanic3955 1u
Halberds suck, no pommel to end him rightly
stop
skallagrimz created a monster
That's not even clever. I watch nearly every scallagrim video, and even i think this is absurd.
BenBomb5 lmao That made my day, thank you
I admire how he does his videos in one go and doesn't have a single cut
now that you point that out, that actually is incredibly impressive considering how good the outcome is
Lecture skills 10/10 editing skills 3/10😂😂
That’s a hallmark of the thinking man’s entertainment; spurious levels of jump-cuts typically cater to low attention spans
perhaps he's a professional lecturer of sorts?
When you are passionate about the subjet, why not?
"Do you know how to use that?"
"The pointy end goes into the other man."
ZORRO
@@cuddlemuffin44 SUN ON A STICK
Preferably an enemy :P
I'm sorry, what goes into a man?
“Stick em with the pointy end”
I'm imagining Lloyd defending himself with that giant pencil of his. By far the most dangerous and versatile weapon in his home.
It's mightier than the swordcil, that's for sure
@@dansaunders1655 *stabs and thoroughly annotates the enemy*
Doodle-Bop has nothing on old Lindy
And when he wants to taunt he can just draw on the armour if the attacker Dont mind
His weapon is his pencil and he wears a coat of armour made out of notebooks
“I’m off that guy’s Christmas list straight away.”
That made me laugh lol
It's actually a false statement because since the guy died, he never had the chance to take him off his Christmas list.
@@RearAdmiralTootToot Nah, he saw you do that to the last guy, he poked you in the ear before he died and this gave him time to cross you off.
Doubt he would have a christmas list after a hook in his head
My wife asked "wtf are you laughing at" and I tried to explain this bit....
had to be there.....
Watch now "The Mundane Etruscans", from the same producers of "Vikings: Just A Regular Folk Actually" and the critically aclaimed "There's Nothing Really Special About the Katana".
And how can I get my hands on that "sword against fish" manual? I need it for reasons.
We must learn to protect ourselves from random fishmonger attacks.
***** Soooo... there's nothing really special about them.
***** Most swords look very nice.
Their next project: 'The mediocre MG42.'
(in case of an opponent with an actual sword, go straight for the fish majeure)
Halberd = an axey spear
Surely its an speary axe?
Don't forget the bashy bit.
halbert mean in turkish is axed spear
First Name Last Name not to be confused with the poleaxe
poleaxe = speary axe
A halberd= an Axey hammer spear.
Sword against fish is my preferred choice for armed combat. I'll take the sword, that fish doesnt stand a chance. Especially if I'm on land.
jordan hicks word
are you a worthy enough opponent for a swordfish tho
@@kentmichaelgalang686 perhaps a shark or orca?
I read this comment before getting to that part of the video and I assumed you were just a crazy person 😆
Have you seen Orcas coming up the beach ... You might think twice about fighting them with a sword !!!
(Admittedly, an Orca is a mammal though ... not a fish).
The kids at your school fought multi-person battles in formation? This explains so much.
I wasn't ready for this comment when I read it. I still have water up my nose and in my lungs.
Yours didn't?
And then there's that one kid who takes the bait and plows into enemy ranks like a doppelsöldner... I mean what? I didn't say anything about myself. What're you talking about?
That remembers a game where you are Napoleon in school and he organised a snow ball battle as a general XD
Yes it's a french game ^^
+ Warclam Funny but ehm. Yes We did play multi person battles. (not in formation though). You could chose quite the amount of hystorical well... units. (spartan soldier, roman soldier, templar knight, gladiator etc etc). and you had "abilities" like with the gladiator you could throw a net and there were others quite historicaly inaccurate.
Oh god it was so good. we played that for at least half a year every time on the schoolyard. The memories.
You have missed the most important part of Medieval battles, go for the legs! The reverse cut is effective at hamstringing the man in front of you. The skeletons at Visby show this technique was used by professional soldiers against poorly trained militia. Many of the skeletons have visible damage to the legs. Greaves were shin armour. the back of he leg was not protected well.
Also always thrust with the spike; if the spike misses, you have a hook to bring them, or their shield down. Thrust, pull, repeat. The bladed edge would not necessarily be for chopping, but meant as an extra deterrent from trying to grab the weapon...?
it can be used for chopping off penis and put a hole next to it. why chop off a leg when you can chop off a penis. two birds in one stone. physical damage + morale damage.
Maybe even two stones with one stone!
Very glad I saw this comment. A logical point backed by evidence, thank you.
You have a point there, they where used in that way, having the men behind you covering u with the pikes and using the axe head cutting in the opponent lying on the floor, its a unit opperating like a machine, flooring, chopping and defending at the same time
"Stab, stab, stab, stab, stab... He's very likely to be killed."
we need a Lindy out-of-context reel
"HEY! IT'S CHRISTMAS!"
Stabs fallen opponent...
Remind me not to drink with Mr Beige come yuletide...
i think i would love to experience that, but then again.. i am from finland, and Joulu(jul/Yule) is a dark time, and warrants white burning vodka in the system for better orientation...
I was looking for hey its Christmas comment lmao thanks
"Stab, stab, stab, stab, stab... He's very likely to be killed."
we need a Lindy out-of-context reel
"If I decide to swing my halberd about in big, sweeping movements..."
*Chivalry vanguard PTSD intensifies*
EHW2 Thought the same thing lol
the mason vanguard warcry is ringing in my head..
"ohhh he is smart like my shoe" always my favourite taunt
*Lu Bu flashback*
*quite sobbing*
Lmao
actually, the axe bit of haleberds were used in camp, to cut up the onions. The long shaft helped with the stinging eyes and crying - especially if the did it outside when it was blowing a fair bit.
Erik Granqvist wouldn't be surprised if it was actually the reason
That's great. can I steal that, or do you want quotes?
EverythingExpert it’s used to chop the body hip or shoulder when exposed like if the enemy bends over since you poke him in the legs or trip
Now I’m imagining a guy trying to cut onions from 8 ft away from the cutting board
And the hammer-bit is for mashed potatoes.. obviously.
Rewatching this again, 6 years later. Being "off that guy's christmas list" is something I've been saying for years after watching this video. It just sort of got stuck in my mind after hearing you say it. Cheers, Lloyd. You rock :)
I think your theory that halberds is spot on. Historically, the primary weapon is a spear like object in most scenarios, and makes sense for a halberd to actually be less axe and more spear. So if someone figured they needed to optimize the point bit of a spear to poke at armor, making it more nail like than blade like with extra mass behind it, it makes sense said someone could go "hold on, I can make the extra mass into a blade hook shape so it can still cut just in case, much more uself than a simple ball". It is basically the unholy love child of a bill, an axe and a spear all in one. It is not worth the extra effort and weight if you're not fighting too heavily armored people fighting in perhaps less professional manner, simple spear more than good enough, but when you add professional formations, cavalry and better gear, it makes it worth the changes.
I think the angle of the halberd axe head is part for what you say, and also just a natural improvement on regular axe heads. It is just a better angle for fighting really. Goes better around a shield or other obstacles, hooks better, and if my toilet sitting thinking is right it is also more forgiving with the lever mechanics of an axe.
"And perhaps fall forwards onto his face, then loads of you could thrust at him from all sides"
That's where I couldn't take all the thrusting anymore and finally burst into laughter. Relief, what a powerful emotion.
"They could reach around your waist and stab at him, and HEY it's Christmas"
It just keeps going.
Ah the classic lindybeige "I've digressed slightly " just past the halfway mark ...you sir are an exquisitely entertaining madman
You sir have earned my sub
Other channels like Skall don't really talk about battlefield scenarios that much. Imagining actually being one of the soldiers in these scenarios sounds absolutely terrifying.
Once saw some pontifical swiss guard men near the entrance of the teutonic cemetery in the vatican and holy shit their halberds are indeed huge
@PACOIMARACER probably for the aesthetic
Stick the pointy end into the other guy.
Repeat as needed.
or until impossible
perhaps with a twisting motion if the mood strikes
Remember to unscrew the pommel of the halberd so you can finish him rightly.
christosvoskresye lol
Last christmas my uncle yelled "It's christmas" and stabbed me with his fork. I still have mark on my arm.
if only you'd had a halberd
Strange, that happened to me too.
Then you should tell Mark to get off your arm.
Poor Mark. :(
Fire on my mark!
19:00 Halberds (Hellebarden) also are very useful for tearing down the enemy shield, or even ripping it out of his hand!
Couple of things.....
With a halberd you don't need much of swing to generate an incredible amount of force. 45 degrees is excessive. 25 degrees is excessive. Putting your body into a move your can get incredible power from 5 degrees of motion or even less. More than enough to knock someone out of formation.
The angle of the blade also maximises the force especially when swung in small arcs.
I believe that halberds were used in combination with pikes. And against pikes. A blow coming down but slightly angled to the left of right with a slight twist as the bit of the axe contacts the shaft of a pike can take it off in one blow. I should do a video on that......
From my experence in recreating battles the guys in the front row tend to not be attacking but mostly defending. Its the ones in the second and third row that do the killing of the guys in the opposing front row. Much easier to snipe with a pointy halberd or pike from the safety of the second or third row.
It's *this* long. They're *that* long. The shaft was *this* tall...
Accuracy be damned, what history needs is enthusiasm!
Well, weapons at the time weren't exactly standardised to industrial precision. You can have as few masters of the craft working as closely with each other as you liked, there was always going to be considerable variation due to various factors. And usually by the time of the Renaissance you'd have standing armies whose weapons and equipment was purchased as needed to replace old ones or expand the army, so measuring things by 'roughly as long as a man is tall' or 'about as long as my arm, give or take a few finger-widths' is sort of inevitable.
At least, that's how I understand it.
James Burgess Trust me- look to the past... and you'll find plenty of enthusiasm. Enthusiastic slayers, warriors, executioners, torturers... lots of enthusiasm...
I'm very offended, your ancestors may not of been warring brutes but mine certainly were! I still do my best to carry on their traditions!
The same goes on in your bedroom surely.
I didn't get it I'm a stranger
I don't know why I love these videos but I've been here for 4 hours having never been interested in this type of stuff before 3 pm today.
Here's my uneducated gut impression:
Imagine having to design a polearm specifically to defeat full plate armor. Wouldn't you end up with something substantially similar to a halberd?
You've got a main spike which, everything else aside, makes it useful as a spear. But that, by itself, can only do so much against armor because you have to aim your thrusts precisely against moving targets. So you also want tools that work toward immobilizing the enemy.
The backward angled blade is good for trying to hamstring the enemy on the back step after a thrust, one of the few vulnerable areas of full plate. Might still trip him even if you don't sever a tendon.
The fluke on the other side being good for delivering a sharp concussion through armor. Might cause a shallow flesh wound, but most halberd flukes don't look long enough to pierce very deep. You might use this to stun the enemy if he's grounded but still mobile.
Then, there's a sort of fork that seems to exist between the top of the blade and the spike, which might be useful for helping to pin a grounded opponent. Drive the spike into the ground, hooking the blade over an arm or leg, and your fellows can finish him.
likewise if you got someone pinned to the ground your mates can rotate the Halberd front or rear and give a good chop either with a spike or axe head to Finnish off the poor fellow.
That’s what a pollaxe was for. A halberd was more spear+cavalry repellent.
Brilliant insight about the use of halberd. I would add something even i'm not sure about this : there's numerous examples in Renaissance of something called "half armour" that may have been used by professional foot soldiers, and that protect mainly the front body and not so much the rear. Because it's cheaper than full plate armour, and its quite relevant when you fight in tight formations where the enemy isn't supposed to attack from behind. In this case the "pulling strike" you describe after a missed thrust would have been especially effective, and make me think that halberds may have been developed at first as a mean of striking a foe from behind when you're standing in front of him.
Its a poke-in-the-eye-from-2-meters-away device
How very Quirmian of you.
Yes
Actually I did sit through a history class where medieval historians said it was to knock enemy to ground and penetrate armor with spike.
@Spark Zuckerbum I unfortunately was in the pool.
Warning, don't ever, ever drop one. My love is 2.3m, with main square section spike 0.33m (I just checked on the stairs), could be a little longer, but even a slight stroke across the brow would blind, due to blood flow, worth all the trouble, hostages alive, would pay for the blocks beer for a month, and then some back to the families.
Just one remark: most of the halberds and polearms had "quadratic" shafts, not rounded ones. That was to keep the cutting edge at the right angle, because rounded one might easier move in your hand to the sides while in combat. It was also useful when having a helmet, when your visibility is limited, and you can also check if your halberd is at the right angle just at looking your hand and seeing if you are holding the shaft in a right way. About great courses plus: I wanted to register, but my card wasn't accepted, so I sent them an email, and they said that currently international payments outside of the USA are not accepted and that they will fix it in the near future. Too bad because that portal seems very interesting and they offer such an interesting courses!
I believe the word you're looking for is "elliptical", and it appears that that shaft is meant to be cut down into the appropriate shape, seeing as the langets can't even go over it.
No, not elliptical. Take a look at the picture: vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/f/f4/Pole-arm-examples1.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20111006214647
Are you referring to a lengthwise bend? I assumed you meant the cross-section.
Yes, cross-section!
I remember an excellent discussion while watching Lord of the Rings where we decided that halberds are spears but sexy.
My father now nearly 100 is Swiss and rode horses and he explained the shape as it was told to him by his father. The classic halberd has three distinct parts (point, hook, axe) each for a different purpose and used together by a team of foot soldiers against cavalry. While pikeman keep cavalry at bay. One or more soldiers uses the hook part to hook into the armor plate or chainmail of a mounted knight, then another uses the point/spear end to jab the horse typically in the flank so that it rears or bolts and in so doing the knight who is held by the guys who hooked him, is pulled from his horse. Once on the ground the axe portion on that 6+ foot shaft is swung down in a high arc down on the prone knight with enough resulting force due to the length to cleave through the knights armor usually at the head to kill him. The three parts are on each halberd so the soldiers can work in teams with a common weapon so any of them can do any of the three functions.
22 minutes of lloyd? YES PLEASE
Usually they charge 300$ an hour.
Me Lloyd you long time
fatsamcastle
Bless you
***** At least a few of us come for the rambling.
lloyds rambles are why we come
came for the halberd, stayed for the beige tie
22:05 - the bladed part of the halberd is for the short draw. The weight and leverage supply all the force necessary along the blade and the draw supplies the cut (as opposed to a much less effective chop). In the situation shown, all the halberd wielder has to do, to position the edge of the blade against your neck, is to twist the halberd. Padded or quilted armour will stop a chopping action but not a cutting action or draw - which would be done on contact. The position does open you up to attack from one of the men to the side while limiting your mobility and "pinning" your sword in a sustained block. What people forget about bladed weapons is how much more dangerous they are when drawn. One does not chop pieces off a roast when carving. One, instead, draws the blade to make the cleanest, most efficient cut. When swinging a bladed weapon, the secret to a deep cut is in the drawing of the blade or the speed at which one pulls the pommel back to oneself as the blade's momentum is absorbed by the target.
One really nasty thing about halberds and poleaxes is the hooked blade design - equally good for taking a knight off his horse or severing the spinal chord between the neck and the skull if an opponent is foolish enough to step inside the blade prematurely and either must backpedal when faced by a spike from the rank behind you or gets it in the back of the neck if your unit suddenly decides to fall back at just that moment. Of course, all that plate is about stopping bladed weapons but is vulnerable, via the chinks to a long thin spike. Quilted armour is good so stop a chop and, to some degree, a spike, but is vulnerable to a drawn cutting action, particularly from a properly stropped blade. In this context, the Halberd seems to be designed to exploit the weaknesses of both armour types.
But one thing always confuses me- aren't blades, especially cutting blades, ineffective against armour? The only reason warhammers became popular post the 15th century (also around the time halberds came into prominence) was due to the presence of hardened steel armour which made cutting through them near-impossible for swords and even axes. In the luckiest scenarios, an axe would cut through but get stuck, thereby locking your weapon and leaving your vulnerable. Warhammers could deliver concussive blows through the armour. So bladed weapons found it hard to deliver cuts on or through armour.
So my question, and this is an uninformed question since I'm not an expert, is that how can you draw cuts onto armour when armour existed to prevent that very movement? A heavy grade thrust _could_ penetrate armour, but cuts? From what I've read, you could seldom consistently cut through armour, especially not hardened steel.
@@arjun._.bbC6 some types of armour were very cut-resistant (e.g. hardened steel) and some not so much when an edge was drawn across it (layered fabric such as gambeson). So hammers or even the back of an axe definitely had their uses. Against plate armour, a halberd would be used to restrain or trap the target long enough for someone to slip a dirk or stiletto between the plates - or even the tip of another halberd if the target had lost his footing. The point I was making is that the chop is very inefficient compared with the drawn cut and a lot of materials which are resistant to a chop will part to a drawn cut. In the 19th century, a skilled swordsman cleaved a small tree (presumably a sapling - haven't seen the exhibit in the Tehran Museum, myself), a soldier and his musket clean through with a single stroke from a sabre. You'd never do that with a chopping motion even if the blade were folded steel and emery that was stropped to a razor edge. But it might be possible with a even a simple, honed sabre that was properly drawn through the cut.
@@Mercurio-Morat-Goes-Bughunting so basically, any non-metal fabric armour can handle "most" thrusts and arrows (this one's from Shadiversity's counter video to Game Theory) but would succumb to a well drawn cut?
Could the cut come from any kind of sword, be it cutting it thrusting? Or would cutting swords fair better here?
@@arjun._.bbC6 A well drawn cut will part a layer; more if the layers are quilted to prevent slippage and keep them "tidy". Where there is significant slippage between the layers deeper cutting will depend on the rigidity or stiffness of the layers because this is what will translate slippage into shear which, in turn, increases friction against the blade. Anything with a sufficiently long edge can cut but the profile shape of the blade also plays a role as do the materials and method of construction. A little slag folded into the steel will probably do wonders against suction. So blade design is very much geared towards the type of application and the engineering behind it is quite a bit more sophisticated than the modern mind might imagine. Remember, they mightn't have had silicon wafers and computers to play with back in those days but they still had no less intellect to apply to what they did have to work with. So one can expect to see the same level of design sophistication we put into modern CPU manufacture being poured into what was hammered out at the smithy or sewn together in a quiet room. It might not be as shiny as today's mass produced wares but there is no reason to conclude that there was any less analysis, care, and intellect applied to design and the employment of available manufacturing techniques. And that makes for a world of diverse designs tailored to diverse applications. Like the difference between a #1 Phillips head screwdriver and a #2 Phillips head screwdriver. That's less than a century old and all too many people have no clue as to the difference or intended applications.
Hmm, I think Lindybeige’s idea is better.
17:20 I keep imagining a bunch of chavs going "U wot m8?! Wot! Wot! Wot!"
I wanna see a chav threaten a medeival peasant with his switchblade only for the peasant to pull out a seax
@Legitpenguins69 I see you have accepted gun jesus as your lord and savior. Ah, I see you are a man of culture as well.👌
What this part reminded me of:
ua-cam.com/video/WoudYNeVn5E/v-deo.html
xD lmfao "A man falls face first onto the ground in front of you - the guys to either side of you "Heyyy its Christmas" have a stab"
Justin Atnos _Stabby_ *Stabby*
O\u/O
"Another one for you here dave!"
Yo
is that what christmas is about? its what Jesus would want hahaha
You make that weapon sound so dangerous. I thought that the weapons of the common footmen were desinged to be ineffective so that sword-wielding heros could shine on the battle field and lay many enemies.
MrDUneven Well most of a Soldiers armament is bought by him for him, so he'd buy whatever he found deadliest
maybe in the dark ages and middle ages, but now we talk about the early renaissance
Seems rather silly. Why would anyone equip their men with ineffective weapons?
Why the fuck would lords want their footsoldiers to be useless
No one understood the great joke :/
-"Stop swinging your halberd please, you're getting in our way"
-"haha axehead goes swing swing"
I have wondered if Halberds were principally use against horses, not their riders.
If the blade or spike were used on the horses un-armoured belly or inside of legs is could unseat the rider.
Not nice, but war is war.
War...
War never changes.
When he demonstrates his point about the axe blade biased towards the user imagine a horse in front of him. Yeah the horse won't go far...
That would be my guess. They would be used against calvary.
Half the point of warfare in that era was about capturing warhorses. Kings and similarly high nobility would fight to expand their productive land, but knights and other lesser nobility where after valuable hostages and assets, like horses and armor sets.
I actually loled at that 'i'm right off his christmas list' remark. Earned my sub right there.
Maybe the axe part is to hook and pull people down? It is nice to get knights of their high horses...
WolfWhisky that's always what I assumed it was for. Hook um and stab um. Have a chopping blade on the hook for swinging.
No idea what convinced people halberds were dominantly long axes- I blame the lack of spears in pop culture.
If you stab and miss, hooking the guy you're fighting is a good consolation prize. Similarly, it would be useful for one of those 'tight-packed formations' Lindybeige used as an example to be able to cap horses knees if they do a "driveby". Similar practices are observable in the height of Chinese horse warfare, out of necessity.
Also note the possibility of evasive motions and the locomotion of the body. If both sides bring spears (they always do, really,) and your opponent is trying to stab into your group, they necessarily bend or posture forward, making them wonderful targets for hooking if you miss.
WolfWhisky kinda i think its more to hook the weapons of the enemy though.
go check out how the swiss defended their home cities against tons of nobles cavalry. heavy cavalry with lances. thats 15th/16th century warfare to you. plus cannons and muskets.
sorry got some stuff mixed up, the rise of the arquebus and cannons and landsknechte using them defeated the swiss mercenary pikemen.. etc.. still pikes really good against heavy cavalry charges
Lindybeige's jump: measurable? In inches probably not, in awesomeness? Also, probably not
Halberds were very high like this "AAAAARGH" okay totally clear now
Where can I read about sword vs fish duels?
I was just about to comment the same thing: I WANT these treatises!
Question is; what sort of fish?
Perhaps a swordfish...? ....or a pike maybe?
OlaftheFlashy The Knights of Ni would be impressed.
Could look into hammerhead sharks too. For example do they waste a lot of time looking for nailfish ?
Random1208 Of course, how could I forget - an Herring!
This isnt what dark souls taught me
Moishe Leiboshekelwitz I know this is a year later but dark souls 1 all it did was stab no chop
Suicidal Hyena try the R2
“Dragonrider Poleax” doesn’t sound quite as nice, though.
In dark souls 1 the halberd was a stab boy! And in the 3 the red hilted halberd (which is the closest to this kind) is also a stab weapon.
if you 2 hand the halberd it does swing 360 arcs
Watched this years ago, and so far, I never heard anybody else talking about that particular property of halberds.
I really like you reasoning about this like you do, and I really like the idea you came up with. Makes a lot of sense to me.
Yet I hope that I will find anybody giving actual evidence that your idea is correct.
Kinda frustrating that we can't verify it (or dismiss it).
"If I go 'aha!' Then... I'm off that guy's Christmas list straight away." 3rd time watching this particular video. Refreshing knowledge while getting the occasional unforced laugh is just what makes LindyBeige utterly superb.
Someone buy this guy a halberd!
Aaron Kurz yeah! That’s an amazing idea! Nobody will be arrested for sending weaponry to someone’s P.O. Box!
Generic Username Yeah. It would be a great idea, because you wouldn’t get arrested for it!
@Generic Username How would that be a problem? Is the halberd going to randomly start killing people? Halberds don't kill people on their own.
Exactly, isn't it much like buying an axe to chop wood?
@@CMKloser you dont live in the UK do you
Almost all swiss art of the period shows halberd cutting done in an overhead fashion, no need to bring it back further than vertical.
Art is notorious for being inaccurate, especially when it comes to details such as weapon use. Lindy has a video describing artistic displays of chain mail, and how terribly inaccurate even the best examples are. At the end of the day, they were artists, not historians.
It's the same thing with hollywood, we don't go to hollywood for learning about military tactics do we?
"Art is notorious for being inaccurate" - No, its not.
"especially when it comes to details such as weapon use." - Nope.
"Lindy has a video describing artistic displays of chain mail, and how terribly inaccurate even the best examples are." - Yes, because mail is very difficult to depict.
"At the end of the day, they were artists, not historians." - Artists who *lived during that time*. I am pretty sure I could easily depict pistol or assault rifle usage, even though I personally never even saw an assault rifle in my life.
True, and all artistic impressions should be taken with a grain of salt, but disregarding them completely just because it's "art" and not entirely accurate doesn't mean we shouldn't take it seriously. In many cases it is the only thing we have from the period as evidence.
Yep. There is even at least one manual of their use that shows how to chop and use the hook etc.
they weren't spears.
But in the latter half of his vid he does discuss the chopping aspect.
Impressive you can record this long a video without apparent use of a script.
The way Lindy narrates history makes me want to watch the next video and the next regardless of whether I'm interested in the topic or not. Beautiful job my dear sir! 👏👏👏👏
Halberd's my anti-zombie weapon of choice.
Yes.
I have a folding model in the trunk of my car.
eh, too long and too easy to get tangled in ribs for my taste. I'd much rather use a cutlass/messer/falchion/sabre etc for zombies. If you really want reach a solid oak quarterstaff will get the job done just as well against a soft target like a zombie and is much handier.
Well my thinking is weight for knockdown power against easy to hit targets plus a wide blade for shoving targets back.
I think reach and control are key, plus a good heavy head for the killing blow.
Beretta249 I wouldn't want to be that close to a zombie ever, but a light katana or something could easily behead a zombie
Maybe not only this, but I'd want something like a boar spear: a shaft with a slender spearhead, and a perpendicular guard/quillon maybe 6 inches back from the point. Eye sockets or temples to kill, or Impale through torsos to control/redirect, and the cross guard would keep them at the end of the pole rather than allow them to still advance via overpenetration.
i'd rather not invest in retarded fantasies as my zombie weapon of choice.
Meanwhile in Dark Souls, people are spinning with halberds.
Spinning around, dual wielding halberds. At least that was my experience in Dark Souls 2.
Please. Have you never seen the smelter hammer?
+Poldovico
Yeah, but I've also seen hundreds of Carthus curved swords.
The Deer
And if you tell me the latter are more surreal than the former... get your eyes checked.
Poldovico
You missed the joke I was making on the Dark souls 3 meta.
Well done.
“Sword against fish” - classic Lindybeige. 😊
This guy's great, and another example of what a real UA-cam channel should be about: fun, informative and genuinely engaging. Cheers mate 👍🏴
I would watch an entire series of Lindy narrating over other documentaries and getting wayyy off topic occasionally, as he is one to do.
MrMrrome
Now I need even more money to clone more of him 🙁
You know what? I don't think Lindybeige uses a script for any of his videos. If so, his knowledge of these topics is impressively comprehensive
The Mighty Ryden He doesn't. It's scary.
He has mentioned he doesn't write scripts. Which is why he occasionally makes mistakes in his recollections of the materials he studied.
+Aaron Seet it also explains why he sometimes rambles.
If you know what you're talking about, you don't need a script.
it's because he's an eccentric man who is one of the most incredibly intelligent people i've ever heard speak.
I'm already impressed by how you're talking about a single topic 22 minutes straight without much repetition or script, then you hit the sponsor section at the exact middle of that. Damn.
UA-cam works in mysterious ways. I keep getting recommended your videos from 4-5-6 years ago and I like it.
You must really be looking forward to christmas.
"Hey! It's christmas."
Hey, Christmas! * stab stab stab *
DarkChaos110 i just imagined that poor guy laying there having the worst xmas ever :p
DarkChaos110 WHAT ABOUT THE WINTER SOLSTICE.
Mithrass
Halberds: Basically a more-advanced spear.
No, its more of a Axe and Spear hybrid
Bills and fauchards were also used
Kinda, although they are probably slower than spears
It’s an axe with a bayonet
Most spears have sharp edge on the side to cut with. Halberds just have a spike.
So more like an advanced paper trash picking pole.
I wish lindybeige was my uncle finally all the family meetings would be interesting.
I found your channel a few days ago and I am really enjoying it. Especially the on location bits, though the weapon laden living quarters videos do have their own charm.
maybe a point for a next video: why werent shields used anymore in the late medieval period?
Telsion if you're so hard to kill because of your armor, trading your shield for extra weapons power is a good tradeoff
+Jacob Thomas thinking about it like that... yep, indeed
This. Also a shield wouldn't even offer that much protection against weapons common to the period. Shields don't fare well against impact weapons, and it's easy to hook on to a shield with weapons like poleaxes and war hammers. Meanwhile, one-handed weapons have limited reach and leverage, which was what you needed in order to overcome armour.
They did use shields. But instead of holding it in front of their face, they just put it on their clothes and called it "armor".
Bucklers are technically shields. In Scotland they even used shields called 'targes' in the mid-18th century.
"I'm off that guys christmas list" I don't know why I found that so hilarious. I've never heard that before.
Jimmy Hypothermiac
It’s a british thing.
Tactical Chunder hear it all the time in America too
"I've got a theory, and I'm going to explain" is a strong contender for channel catchphrase.
Hi mate! I just love your delivery ! extremely watchable chap! Cheers and thank you for your work! All the best!
Do all Englishmen say ah ha when sword fighting? (like in Monty python and the Holy Grail)
Yes, yes we do.
We very much do.
Have at you!
I've been an Englishman my entire life, and we absolutely do.
It's actually a directive issued by the Queen. Failure to do so is punishable by death.
I imagine the halberd to be derived from the billhook, if you look at collections of polearms there is a bit of a progression from one to the other.
More likely the voulge - the voulge started to decline when halberds appeared, bills/guisarmes co-existed with halberds and appeared at more or less the same time.
Chlorate
That or the bailardfeuil.
Weapons development weren't tied to a single geopolitical location.
The Billhook is more of an agricultural instrument. At least that's how I used one when helping out at a friend's farm as a teenager. We used it during hedge-laying for precise cutting into thin branches.
I think your an excellent instructor not boring at all.All your videos are well thought out and it shows.
During my time travels, I was told that the halberd was mostly used against cavalry. Also, with the point being quite long and usually flattened, you can imagine this like a sword, the point is best used with the blade vertical. If a horse runs in to an angled horizontal blade, it would probably shatter the blade. So keeping it vertically is important.
The axe blade part is nothing but a counterweight that helps keeping the blade oriented vertical. If not by gravity then by helping the wearer see the orientation.
Finally I can comment on the video & halberd fighting with a little practical experience as I am currently studying and practicing Joachim Meyer's 1570/60 treatises.
Btw: Halberd rocks!! :-)
He bases the use of the halberd ("Hellepart") on his recommended style of the quarterstaff ("Halbe Stangen") which here is used mainly for thrusting (& beforehand knocking the opponent's weapon out of center).
The spike is used for "fierce" :-) thrusting moves towards the face and other unarmoured parts.
Hook and blade of the halberd are used for hooking (uh?!) and slashing limbs and neck/face (in the latter case the spike will probably hit your foes ear - you can still withdraw and stab his face though) The upper joint between spike and blade is used to catch and guide the opponent's point out of its path. The hook in particular is used for nasty hacking/piercing blows from an upper guard, the blade then follows from the resulting lower guard.
Group fights/halberd and later pike formation fighting would naturally result in what you described in this video. Stabbing, pushing/drawing the oncoming halberds out of line(/the wielders hands), hooking and drawing the opponent towards your line, so he could be stabbed by your neighbours (oh hey, it's Christmas!)
And please do not forget the use of halberds against cavalry attacks!
Meyer and others do not describe such things as wearing the wooden shaft with the blade.
From my point of view, you clearly would not care about the strength of your foes weapon but concentrate on not getting stabbed in your face/stab him faster ;-)
Exactly!!! The curved inner edge of the axe blade also means that attacking weak joints like the opponents wrist (of the hand holding the weapon), elbow, throat and horses legs all become viable options
I have a firm belief that halberd is a more effective than any other polearm
What do you do when the spear/axe heads cross but your are still not in range of the enemy?
@@JungleEd17 then it comes down to shear force. Or you break the lock and Dodge their counter attack and initiate one yourself
Damn straight! The halberd is one of the most brutal medieval weapons out there.
Watching Lloyd talk about pointy things for 22 minutes? Sign me up!
This was truly fascinating, and I had wondered similar points too! Thank you for sharing your insights!
And the xmas list comment cracked me up! :)
Addendum: and the guide to fighting with fish concept.
Love hearing about groups of tightly packed guys thrusting and having a go at each others' weapons.
:'D
Hm, myes
That sounds so wrong
@@jayman4569 Sounds pretty right to me.
@@asmodeon (ಠ_ಠ)
I kept waiting for the verb "rake" in regard to the use of the angled/concave axe heads on halberds. Had this been my video, I would have said "raked" all the time. Contextually.
So the early Renaisanse was a Rake culture?
Alright you all earned it.Good job lads.
Gilmaris When the move first came into use and proved effective it was called "The Rake's Progress." Later when it was used by Irishmen it inspired the old tune "The Rakes of Kildare."
Why are you "chopping" in such an odd way? While pretending you're in a line, lift it straight up and then chop, don't bring it down flat behind you. Sure a 180 degree swing can provide more grunt, but that in no way means a 90 degree swing won't provide any power. Then you could go crazy and try for a 120 degree swing, or 110, or 125, or 105, etc. But chopping with the ax does not require a full 180 degree swing every single time.
Yep, I bet even Lindy himself has talked how swinging your weapon all the way over your back is:
1. Dangerous to your allies.
2. Telegraphs your moves too much.
3. Leaves you open for attacks.
4. Doesn't add much power to the blow.
Lifting your weapon 90 degrees from horizontal is more than enough to get a powerful blow, 180 degrees is just stupid.
It would also take you a pretty long time to swing such a long weapon 180 degrees.
He is exaggerating for the people that might think halberds where used like that.
In reality you would go straight up and let the poleweapon basically just fall on the enemy. Much less exhausting then lifting it, moving above the highest point and then, for the actuall attack, have to reverse that whole motion, basically double down on the lifting you have to do compared to pointing it straight up.
Which by the way is a reason why you always have something on the other side of any large chopping weapon as counterweight.
But as Lloyd pointed out that's more of a use for the poleaxe.
As far as I can tell he is right about the use of the Halberd. They are basically lances with the addition of hooks and blades, which are only relevant if you miss your initial target. Any chopping movement would be countered just by the fact that you are fighting in tight formations.
But as both sides use such formations any advantage to get an enemy singled out is a huge advantage.
My comment was only on his examples of "chopping" and nothing more. You seem to of not noticed I didn't say anything about which way it was most likely used, or really anything else.
Instead it was just on how that was an insane way to do a chop/swing. And he did it every time too.
It's a pole arm, stabbing being its main use isn't a new idea or even a controversial usage scenario.
No , Surely youd just hold it with its end anchored to the gound an let the enemy "fall on *it* " .........Then start hacking.
And My God 15 twirls on the mouse to get to a post that actually talks about the topic .
Actually, I think what Lindybeige meant here is a "draw cut" rather than an actual chop.
Amazing video! I’m considering getting the great courses plus after hearing about the massive amounts of content!
The shape of the chopping part also helps keep calvary from running all the way down the spear, a kind of stopper to help hold the line
There is a belief by some historians that the axe was mostly used for hooking shields to clear the way for other soldiers and possibly to unhorse opposing cavalry.
Much like you I believe the Halberd was primarily a spear or pike that had additional utility that a trained unit could utilize well.
i don't think that at all. their is evidence that the halberd was in fact intended to be used as it seams, as an axe, pike and spike/sword/glave. for one thing if its intended to be a pike its just a heavy awkward pike.
Wait, there is a treatise on how to fight with a sword against someone wielding a fish? Is it at least a swordfish?
No, its for herrings, though they are more commonly used to chop down trees than as weapons.
Lord Inquisitor
I thought he had to get a Shrubbery
Lord Inquisitor Ni!
David Bodor only if it a herring being used in the absence of an axe.
Makes me think that the treatise for sword-against-polearm could be useful to reverse-engineer polearm-against-sword.
My father has purchased at least a dozen Great Course videos. While I haven't watched them all, or even most of them, those that I have seen are very well produced and informative.
have not done great courses/// but your histy vids draw me back again all the time
My favorite melee weapon, thank you for making this. Halberds and pikes are totally underappreciated in modern times as the amazing weapons they were, all you see are swords, axes, bows, and maybe a simple spear if you're watching something depicting the bronze age.
I always thought the halberd was mainly an anti-heavy-cavalry weapon for infantry. Hook for grabbing armor, spike for stabbing the horse, axe for close range finishing blow. That is why the formations for Halberdier are much looser than Pikeman formations.
"Heavily armoured cavalry could punch through the array of pikes and get into melee with the pikemen, Pikes
wouldn't work so well in melee combat against well armoured cavalrymen, they could try to thrust at the exposed belly of the horse, but this would be rather difficult in melee combat with an armoured horseman hacking down at them. A Halberdier can easily pull the horseman down with one of the hooks of the halberd where he would be more easily dispatched."
Your argument on the swinging of the axe bit is flawed I think, because you're imagining halberdiers fighting in pike formations. Pikes were used in large packed formations, where halberds were used in much smaller and looser formations. Halberdiers don't use tight formations because their role isn't to stop charges, it's to dismount riders and engage in CQC.
Also, many times, especially the Swiss, mixed formations of pikes and halberds. They would stop a charge with the pikes, dismount them with the halberds, then both finish them off with the spike. It also depended on the terrain, as pikes are more effective on plains where halberds are more effective in hills/mountains.
There are not so many movies about the 15/16 century
Lindy Beige has clearly never played as Guan Yu.
He's not carrying a halberd. It's a Guan Dao, closer to a glaive if anything.
Guan Yu uses a Naginata or Glaive
he does not fight in formation
Cavalry is a completely other story
nowvlubu on the other hand uses a ji which is similar to a halberd.
since we're talking Chinese. I reckon a dagger axe probably has a similar style of fighting to a halberd except for against lesser armoured opponents.
Guan Yu's default weapon is a Halberd, you have to earn the Blue Moon Dragon.
@
Lindybeige , I believe the striking is done from top to down, not back to front. This means, there would be no hitting someone behind. The length of the pole acts like leverage, increasing the force of the axehead even if only half way swung. So I believe they'd hold the halberd only in the straight upward position, if my words are enough to picture that.
Very informative video. I always used to think that's the point of having and Axe head and a Hook on a spear like weapon which is used primarily for stabbing. But as you explained that their shape was a assymetric concave hook like used for Draw-cuts and hooking the enemy, now it totally makes sense.
I think it's hilarious that everything about Lindybeige is very traditional and medieval yet the wall art behind him is blatantly modern in style. It almost seems like it's there on purpose for the sake of irony/contrast.
Jake Is it Mormont at the bottom? Wonder why?
@@TheDarthMushroom There's a video about that.
PintoRagazzo which one
@@TheDarthMushroom he was a 'historical advisor' on a film with the actor who played mormont
I don't see much point to the pencil though.
A 22 minute video about Halberds? Are you trying to seduce me? It's working.
I hadn't considered the chopping back thing. But it makes a lot of sense.
It also explains some of features on some halberds I've seen.
Hello Lindybeige, I just found your channel and I must say thank you for making great content.
Gotta check out that sword versus fish manual he spoke of.
Hi Lloyd,
Thank you for your recommendation for the great courses plus. I signed up a month ago and have watched about a dozen courses, often having it on in the background. Great fun. Then today there were a few issues with my account and the lovely people at TGC+ got back to me with:
"Thank you for contacting The Great Courses Plus!
Currently we are unable to process transactions with billing addresses outside of North America. We are working on resolving this and should be able accept international transactions during the first few months of 2017
Your Great Courses Plus Customer Care Team.''.
The bit I find funny is that I live on the coast by Newcastle, and given that you've mentioned local landmarks (the Baltic, Beamish etc...) I take it you live here too. So the service you're sponsoring isn't actually available outside of North America... or even where you live.
Funny old world innit.
Lindybeige you look like Graham Chapman from Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Brilliant.
Josh Ua he’s not the messiah , he’s a very naughty boy
@@gerardmurphy8278 "Life of Brian". Well done! Thot you might quote Chapman, "I"m Arthur, King of the Britons!" "King of the who?"
the leaves on that philodendron behind u are wowing - looks like a gloriosum