I'm so happy this channel exist, because... When I was 12 or so (around 2007), My teacher asked "Who do You want to be when You grow up?" and I responded with "Timothy Cain", and no one get that (which made my conviction only stronger). Now I work in retail (because life), but those videos are giving me strength and hope to keep trying, and I couldn't be more grateful. And now to the topic. Sometimes people don't believe in lie, but act like they do, because they would prefer that to be true. Then you just forget what was true.
The stories and advice I’ve gotten out of this channel since it’s started has really driven me to learn game development of some kind, I’ve always been the kinda person that has all these ideas and write them down but no way to actually turn them into something. You’ve done nothing but inspire and motivate Tim thank you
Throughout these videos I really believe Tim must have a been a great lead, he knows his stuff and he shows empathy and emotional understanding to interact woth different people. And I really apprecite the insight shared in these management/business side videos too. The only thing I notice that may come off wrong is the following: it's not the same when an empoyee lies vs employer or when an employee does something a little unethical vs the employer. There's a big power dynamic left unspoken here. This is people's livelihoods we are talking about there are MANY good reasons an employee may not feel comfortable disclosing they are considering leaving in 3 weeks for example.
@@philipchoo958Except that if they are truly blowing it off and wasting time, then they are wasting time. And their estimates will often be longer than necessary so they can waste time. If the lie is because they are swamped and working at 100% capacity on other things but they are certain they can get to that particular thing and get it done on time that's different. But then they should also just SAY THAT.
My experience in retail has taught me some interesting things about lying in the workplace. More specifically, they're afraid to say they're behind, or can't handle it. And there's a good reason for that- bad bosses. Whether you've worked under one yourself, or one of your close friends or coworkers, that fear is there, and it becomes habit. That when you go to discuss a problem in the workplace, it'll get put on you. There's a sort of skill to talking to bad bosses, and a lot of people don't ever get the chance to train it.
I love how this starts with such a heartwarming reminiscence about the joy of working with other people, then transitions to a hard lesson about life. Both are true, and both are important. Thank you.
Appreciate this video a lot Tim. I've worked in the indie scene for about 3 years now, worked on half a dozen teams internationally, and I've had a really hard time dealing with people lying. Lying about intentions, about who gets what credit, about what will be done and when, about pay, etc. My work has been used in ways I never authorized, I've seen co-workers get screwed over and not credited, and I've seen projects spiral into development limbo due to the spread of wrong information. I've been called naive a lot too. And I often blind myself to people's intentions with my passion for the craft. It breaks my heart to hear this issue is within the small, indie projects as well as in the big industry. But it does make me feel better I'm not alone and there is others who are in the industry purely for their love of games and love of creation, and not to just "get ahead" so to speak. Thank you again for another wonderful video! Your channel has just been a treasure trove of knowledge and insight for young designers like me in the industry!
It's just so wonderful seeing someone being truly passionate about their craft! I would imagine it would be hard not to get jaded in most industries as you experience more of them. I guess taking in and appreciating the process just as much, if not more, as the outcome is a good lesson from this story. Thank you Tim! Have a great day!😊
Thanks Tim for all the insight and advice you provide for juniors like me :) Been watching your vids for a little while now, great bit of digital mentorship!
I love that new episode of Dr. House :D Thank you Tim. There's such a thin line between bluntly believing people and just considering their lies without actually ruining relationship or loosing at what should be done. Because sometimes it is possible to subtly point lying person in the right direction to gain needed results without any significant loses. Although I prefer to keep a good faith and not suspect anyone of lie until it actually happens.
I love working in teams, though only when other people are collaborative. Normally when I want to not send something in an email and only in person, is because its sensitive information and I'd like to not have a track record in case someone abuses that information. The people lying about being ontop of things is the most common lie, and I found that I adjust people's lies on the spot, and I will budget the time and effort, in front of them and change their scope of timeline because I'd rather not be in a spot where I have this thing. Its easy when open the calendar, and I'm like, here's this long weekend coming up, that is one day of no work time, you didn't include QA, that's a few days, you were talking about your family visiting, you're not going to do a scope check in mid-week because I have a feeling you'll be overwhelmed with that lol. When it comes to "its in my head", even if it is, its the old the line of "half the job is doing the work, the other half is making sure someone knows you have don't it" and if you haven't done the latter than its not done, even if it is "done".
I mostly worked in community (grassroots) projects, where we are all amateurs in our own way, and it is clear that someone who pretends they are doing a task without daring to tell us the truth is a big liability to the team. That said, it did not happen often as my "world" was almost all volunteers or workers who made the choice to join a grassroot project out of principle.
Man, the "people lie straight to your face" thing is so absolutely accurate, and I also struggle with the exact same problem, and for the same reason as well. I just feel like I'm too optimistic and in a very specific and particular sense, trusting. I wouldn't say I'm like, gullible, or trusting in a way that would lead to physical danger type stuff, but when I befriend someone, I intend and hope that I stay solid friends with them for the rest of my life. As far as I'm concerned, we've made an unspoken pact, and I'll always be in your corner and have your back, period. That's just part of the package deal that comes with being a close friend of mine, I suppose. So I WANT to believe, that they'd simply have no reason to lie. That specific detail still confuses and bothers me, like.. why? What even is the point, to seemingly the vast majority of these lies? Potentially bit of a strange story to tell so nonchalantly, but I'm roughly 2 and a half years clean from heroin and fent addiction, and for a short period of time I was also dealing, to help offset the cost of my addiction since it became pretty goddamn costly. Well, I had a couple of very close "using buddies", that I legitimately took care of. If they ran out, or even were just nearing running out and not certain when they'd next get cash, I'd spot them. They didn't even have to ask, as I typically would be the one extending a hand to offer. There were two occasions when I actually chose to give the last of what I had, to a close friend, just to ensure they wouldn't get sick from withdrawal, despite condemning myself to it. The first time I almost instinctively did so without giving it any thought, which was interesting to think about afterward. But then when the opportunity arose for me to basically do it again, and I still made the conscious decision to prefer enduring suffering myself than have them endure it. So, getting to my point.. Despite being so generous and charitable, prob in the thousands of dollars in free drugs I gave away, because I basically just held them in such high regard, they were almost like an extension of myself, in a sense. Taking care of them was as close as possible to being on the same degree of priority as seeing myself be taken care of. Despite that degree of generosity.. And it also extended to things like giving them a place to stay when they were going to be homeless for the foreseeable future. They, or at least for certain one of them, STILL fucking stole from me, and lied through their fucking teeth, to my face about it, when I'd gotten it on camera. They even offered to HELP ME LOOK FOR IT. The same person would talk constant shit about the other close friend of mine, and then for some reason, went to them saying -I- was the one talking shit behind their back and such and so on. Like, I literally don't understand. What more could I possibly have offered or done, that they wouldn't feel the urge or need to do that kinda shit? At the very least, if you just assume a very black and white "A thief is always a thief" sort of thing. Okay. I would at the least, think that even a thief would stop themselves and go "Wait, I have such a beneficial situation going on. I better not do X to risk screwing this up." It literally couldn't have been about money, because I was giving them so much for free. The amount that was stolen was so inferior to the free ride they were being given. And even if it were somehow, some kind of kleptomania thing, then why wouldn't it be literally anything else? I'd have music equipment or games or USBs or whatever else go missing. This got stupidly out of my control lengthy, I sincerely apologize for that. To anyone intrigued enough to read this far, hey, you're a qt random internet stranger. I hope anyone reading this has a rad day. I'll prob edit this down later, or at the very least just delete the whole thing, but too sleep deprived to bother atm.
I just wanted to echo the sentiments of many others. These videos are a treasure. Thank you sincerely for sharing your insightful perspectives on this accursed industry, especially for us wretched souls striving to pursue it.
True, my previous manager lied to directly to my face. When I started to ask him questions, I was mildly amused by how he was dogging around my questions and saying things completely contridictory to his previous statements. And yes, I could tell it was not against me, it was him not believing in himself.
People lying never was surprising to me, but what took me until the last couple of years to learn was the motivations people have to lie. The only time I had something like a friend group it took me years to realize half the people were constantly playing a role to maintain their "status" in the group. I've since learned to identify such behavior and avoid such people, but it means I pretty much live as a hermit.
Would love to know your views on bosses and the difference between those who break you down and those who build you up? Also, are you distrustful of those who insist they are mentors?
Your bit about people lying to themselves. As someone with ADHD and rejection dysphoria I lied to myself a lot with my health. I also have Crohn's disease, I reacted very poorly to the diagnosis and symptoms. I neglected myself but told myself I was doing fine. I lost 28 pounds in 2 months, I'm fine. People noticed I was doing poorly. I told them no, I'm fine. I told myself I was fine. I was not fine. I was lying to myself. It wasn't until I almost died from an internal bleed that I finally accepted what was happening. In the hospital I lied there and finally accepted it. It was difficult to break a lie I'd been telling myself for years and it took collapsing in the street from blood loss and a 2 week hospital stay to get through the blankets of lies I'd wrapped around myself. If I can lie about my health when I'm clearly doing so poorly it doesn't surprise me that people will lie to themselves about their work or capability.
Collaboration is the key motivating factor when creating games I have also found. Sharing ideas and seeing them being implemented and enjoyed by others is an awesome feeling.
Hi. I'm a 35 years old game programmer. I'm currently considered quite successful in my career with a high position and a high salary. However, I'm feeling my competence is receding as I get older and older. I'm not as fast in learning new tech, in debugging stuff, also cannot overtime overnight as much as before, while the younger one now with proper education, they catch up so fast. Do you have any advice for me to stay competitive even when my mind is not sharp like I was before?
I'm 34 years old, I feel you. Here's what I did -> got myself into a position where I analyse things, I provide vision, I document, but I delegate technical details. I've essentially become a tech/team lead.
Are you sure its age related? Im slightly younger than you and I feel like Ive never been sharper than I am right now. Not saying age doesnt affect people but are still relatively young... Perhaps youve simply ended up in a position where you dont expand your mind in the same way that you used to?
You just don't want to move out from your comfort zone, has nothing to do with your age, which is totally fine. Youngers aren't better than you. The experiences/mistakes you had been through are far more important than the new technical skills, assuming you are not those fake experienced devs didn't learn anything but job hopping all the times.
@@MaMastoast I have to concur. I'm significantly older than 35 and I don't feel like I've slowed down at all or that I learn any less quickly (I've always been an insanely fast learner). I've wondered about this since I've heard people talk about decline due to age, but I expected that was some time older than I am. Hearing you talk about it at 35... I was actually a better/faster developer at 35 than I was at 25 because I had learned how to optimize myself. I will say if you aren't challenging yourself and putting yourself in situations where you have something to learn, that can feel like decline. I experienced that once, so I threw myself into something extremely complicated I had never done before and had no problem, turns out I just wasn't pushing myself and had gotten into a rut where I didn't have anything new to learn. So I got out of the rut...
It's funny how this story confirmed what I thought about you when listening to your other videos. That you are a naive person, who sees the best in people. In many of your stories you were hurt by people being... people (read as assholes). In others you were hurt because they betrayed you etc. Good to know you know that about yourself, too. But also making me smile, because you keep on relearning that lesson again and again. :D (I am the same in that regard, hence me noticing a pattern in your stories). You are a gem Timothy. Stay as blue eyed for all eternity. The world needs people like you.
I have lied knowingly, sometimes to spare someone's feelings, and sometimes because I was ordered to lie. I have worked hard to make sure that latter situation cannot happen again.
Hey Tim. I was wondering if you've ever had anything like stress or depression during your time as a game developer? And If so, then how did you deal with it? And if not, then what did you do to keep a healthy mindset? Thanks for another good video, really enjoying your content.
The worker using that last moment raise to get better paid somewhere else is fine. Its not like it affects the left company in any way how much he will be paid
"if someone wont send you something in a email, and will only tell you, they are probably lying". 1000% true in all business. If they wont document it, assume they are full of it.
I used to work in a grocery store and had a very vile woman who was a supervisor try to spread lies about me. Was one of the worst experiences of my life. Some people are just plain evil.
This is a topic I've seen come up every so often, and you mentioned it here as well. What do you think about crediting people who worked on a game? Do they have to have been on the project from start to finish? Do they have to be there when it comes out? Or is there some sort of percentage required? I feel that anyone who worked on a thing should be credited, but there have been stories of people being removed from the credits or especially entire teams being left out when a remaster comes out.
"Trust but verify" and people lying to themselves are great topics for analysis. These theories are also talked about in the military, especially the former. Another topic I think could be related is the difference between personal and professional opinions.
As simple as it may sound, I think that's a good lesson. But, it also makes me think of what I think is my greatest challenge, which is just finding a team in the first place. I don't think that's something even you can answer, though - but it means I can't fully appreciate the depth of the lesson.
I've heard about a lot of these practices happening at a friend's workplace - where employees take advantage of the system or when employers take advantage of employers or when CEOs take advantage of shareholders - and it seems like these practices are very common and often encouraged. My own workplace seems to lack employees and employers who do these kinds of tricks, which is why I've been working at the same place for the past several years. For us, it was our hiring criteria that seemed to weed these people out for the most part, and perhaps it was our leadership and the direction of our leadership that created a certain company culture that circumvented this sort of ... short-term advantage-taking. It also meant that the people being hired were for the most part competent and accountable and responsible, which meant that the creation process is fun and, in a pinch, they're all reliable. I think ultimately, it's hard to know what a workplace is like without spending some time in it, but try to find a place with a good leader with integrity and that will make a lot of difference.
Workers should not lie between themselves, they really shouldn't. And employers will tend to lie because that's what the system make them do for the bottom line, for the continual growth of companies. Mistakes won't be owned, they will be diverged. Maybe one day we will change this system, and make this happen way less, cuz it won't as needed. But damn, I feel the creation love, I have it too. To make something bigger, to help and be helped into adding more and more to a bigger whole. It's amazing, humanity can be awesome
I would love to work with you but i'm afraid that by the time i am worthy it will be too late, since i've only Just started on the game-development journey. Creating games for a living is 1 thing i want. Creativity is beautiful. Honesty & Teamwork are the other things i love. When you talked about shouting in the room coming up with ideas and hashing things out, i wanted to join in. I love the Indie Scene to death, it's where all the creativity is. I want to work together with people and make games, there's soo much creativity! No matter what happens, i am going to create games and work with creative people. it's only a matter of time.
Wow, this was a sad one. Well, bittersweet or sweet by the end. As always, awesome to hear your wisdom and your stories. Can you talk more specifically on level design? As a lead did you handle any of it or is it something that gets delegated? Either way, I'm sure you have some insights on the subject.
Yeah, I have sadder stories to tell. I’ll try to keep things mostly positive though. Anyway, this video is me taking about lessons in level design: ua-cam.com/video/MiAEBpXlelk/v-deo.htmlsi=J-CNei5CfNW21Rf_
Cannot overstate how true this video is. I think everyone's been guilty of the 'game dev lie' at some point. With the sheer volume of time and work that goes into games it's not uncommon to end up in a catch-22 where being honest about a lack of progress is just as intimidating as potentially being caught in a lie. I think it's the product of crunch culture and the volatile nature of careers in games.
Some people work really well doing research in their heads for long periods of time before implementation. It's not procrastination, but is indistinguishable from the outside. Also, it's ironic how many of your RPGs have been single player experiences given how much potential joy can be had from creative teamwork.
The lying issue does indeed cut deep with this industry. Even on the level of still just trying to break in, you'll hear various lies. The thing is, I don't think this is necessarily a matter of competitive industries in general. I don't know whether that would mean it's actually a matter of creative industries, passion industries, entertainment industries, or maybe even a matter of industries with recent explosions in growth, but I wish I could know what the difference would be from other competitive industries where reliability is given much more acute emphasis. Anyone here (Tim or otherwise) got any other guesses, beyond just "it's humans"?
I think the root of a lot of lying in the game industry is insecurity. Game dev requires a lot of creativity at a rapid pace. No one likes to think "I am not good at this task" or "this bad result is my fault" or even "I am a bad person", so they deflect it to someone else, anyone else, that they can. Co-worker, boss, someone who works for them...anyone.
Man, this was hard to swallow. I've been telling people that I'm going to be a game dev, even commented once on this channel. But I haven't made something meaningful for the career and rather got certificates that were generally acceptable for job applications in our country. Cuz I wasn't sure of it, and when the rationalization ends, there r just me who still has no background that can be presented to employers.
100% agree, the people who work in game dev are some of ghe most interesting people...both good and bad, but mostly good. That and not having to be embarrassed when Im at work and making laser noises to myself as i model a weapon. 😂
Yeah, btw, something that I always tell people - being a programmer, not just in game dev - isn't that much about working with code as it is working with people.
The most important thing my dad taught me is that, if a man's word is no good, he is no good. The one I figured out myself is, the worst lies we tell are to ourselves.
"Yup I'm well along"=I am pretty sure I have not procrastinated so badly that if I work much harder in the future than I have in the past it might still be finishable
Would you be interested developing a board game? I would really be interested in seeing your take on a board game with an original IP. Thanks and happy (well-deserved) semi-retirement!
Oh god i had to deal with this "i did research/investigations those days" thing before. Then I asked the person to write me a document until next day with their findings. Next day I ask and they tell me that they found a docu on confluence that already documents everything they found. I am like okay this can happen, can you add everything ADDITIONAL you found out and edit it into the page? No, there is nothing additional they found, it is all there. WELL there i was a bit annoyed and then I asked for daily reports of what the person worked on on that day and to tell me if they have any blockers because wtf. Being a team lead sucks
The reason everyone lies in the gaming industry is because none of them actually know what a game is. None of them know how to design a real game. Anyone who doesn't believe this, just try asking a game designer, "What is a game?" They can't answer.
Tim do you think developers get to play a lot of games when they are working in the industry, I just get the feeling that a lot of them are always so involved in a project with hectic schedule, long hours and pressure that makes me wonder if they still get to actually devote time to enjoy the product of their craft.
I do have to wonder if Tim means "most people lie" since "everybody" suggests he does as well, in which case I wonder how he feels about including himself.
Dang the AAA industry sounds stressful as hell. Losing your livelihood just because some rich dude doesn't care to take a moment to realize what you actually do must be devastating. I'm glad I'm indie.
Hey Tim, Say you have a game design or a lore problem. Neither you nor your team can find a satisfying solution, what do you do? Any special rituals or meditations, do you know someone who knows the answer to everything?
In that case, I usually add something functional with an eye towards coming back and replacing it if someone has a better idea later. That’s usually easier to do for lore than system mechanics, at least before voice acting has been recorded.
Tim I don’t know if you’re reading this but you’re videos are all gems from your vault of wise experience and knowledge.
Couldn't have said it better myself 💪
Awesome pun!
This channel just keeps on giving great - and nuanced - information.
Good comment - you're a hero!
I try to tell as many people as possible:
"Beware of pretend agreements and understand that your workplace does NOT care about you."
Only trust in written documentation. Oral agreements are worthless in the workplace.
I'm so happy this channel exist, because...
When I was 12 or so (around 2007), My teacher asked "Who do You want to be when You grow up?" and I responded with "Timothy Cain", and no one get that (which made my conviction only stronger). Now I work in retail (because life), but those videos are giving me strength and hope to keep trying, and I couldn't be more grateful.
And now to the topic.
Sometimes people don't believe in lie, but act like they do, because they would prefer that to be true. Then you just forget what was true.
The stories and advice I’ve gotten out of this channel since it’s started has really driven me to learn game development of some kind, I’ve always been the kinda person that has all these ideas and write them down but no way to actually turn them into something. You’ve done nothing but inspire and motivate Tim thank you
Learn programming. Nobody will take you seriously as just yet another "ideas guy".
Out of curiosity, what are you interested in doing as far as game-development goes?
His talks are quite motivating for me too.
Throughout these videos I really believe Tim must have a been a great lead, he knows his stuff and he shows empathy and emotional understanding to interact woth different people. And I really apprecite the insight shared in these management/business side videos too. The only thing I notice that may come off wrong is the following: it's not the same when an empoyee lies vs employer or when an employee does something a little unethical vs the employer. There's a big power dynamic left unspoken here. This is people's livelihoods we are talking about there are MANY good reasons an employee may not feel comfortable disclosing they are considering leaving in 3 weeks for example.
I am sure this "I'm on top of it" lie is true in every field. Certainly in every field I've worked in, from IT to building work and more.
Honestly I think this isn't so bad... as long as the person saying can actually get the work done on time.
@@philipchoo958Except that if they are truly blowing it off and wasting time, then they are wasting time. And their estimates will often be longer than necessary so they can waste time. If the lie is because they are swamped and working at 100% capacity on other things but they are certain they can get to that particular thing and get it done on time that's different. But then they should also just SAY THAT.
My experience in retail has taught me some interesting things about lying in the workplace.
More specifically, they're afraid to say they're behind, or can't handle it. And there's a good reason for that- bad bosses. Whether you've worked under one yourself, or one of your close friends or coworkers, that fear is there, and it becomes habit. That when you go to discuss a problem in the workplace, it'll get put on you.
There's a sort of skill to talking to bad bosses, and a lot of people don't ever get the chance to train it.
Sometimes though you cannot avoid having to lie; those bosses may never give you half the chance and all you end up getting is the boot
@@AlFasGD exactly. Retail is a very unpleasant experience for most people, but that teaches you quite a bit about how to deal with difficult people.
I love how this starts with such a heartwarming reminiscence about the joy of working with other people, then transitions to a hard lesson about life. Both are true, and both are important. Thank you.
Appreciate this video a lot Tim. I've worked in the indie scene for about 3 years now, worked on half a dozen teams internationally, and I've had a really hard time dealing with people lying. Lying about intentions, about who gets what credit, about what will be done and when, about pay, etc. My work has been used in ways I never authorized, I've seen co-workers get screwed over and not credited, and I've seen projects spiral into development limbo due to the spread of wrong information. I've been called naive a lot too. And I often blind myself to people's intentions with my passion for the craft. It breaks my heart to hear this issue is within the small, indie projects as well as in the big industry. But it does make me feel better I'm not alone and there is others who are in the industry purely for their love of games and love of creation, and not to just "get ahead" so to speak.
Thank you again for another wonderful video! Your channel has just been a treasure trove of knowledge and insight for young designers like me in the industry!
It's just so wonderful seeing someone being truly passionate about their craft!
I would imagine it would be hard not to get jaded in most industries as you experience more of them.
I guess taking in and appreciating the process just as much, if not more, as the outcome is a good lesson from this story.
Thank you Tim! Have a great day!😊
Confirmation bias is a huge thing in professional settings. People tend to think like lawyers and not like scientists
I really appreciate your videos Tim, they help me self reflect about my work and life everyday!
The whole-cloth creation feeling is probably why I like concept art so much. Imagining all the things that could be
Thanks Tim for all the insight and advice you provide for juniors like me :) Been watching your vids for a little while now, great bit of digital mentorship!
I love that new episode of Dr. House :D Thank you Tim. There's such a thin line between bluntly believing people and just considering their lies without actually ruining relationship or loosing at what should be done. Because sometimes it is possible to subtly point lying person in the right direction to gain needed results without any significant loses. Although I prefer to keep a good faith and not suspect anyone of lie until it actually happens.
"someone won't tell you in writing but they will tell you verbally" is just a good red flag to look out for in life
I love working in teams, though only when other people are collaborative. Normally when I want to not send something in an email and only in person, is because its sensitive information and I'd like to not have a track record in case someone abuses that information.
The people lying about being ontop of things is the most common lie, and I found that I adjust people's lies on the spot, and I will budget the time and effort, in front of them and change their scope of timeline because I'd rather not be in a spot where I have this thing.
Its easy when open the calendar, and I'm like, here's this long weekend coming up, that is one day of no work time, you didn't include QA, that's a few days, you were talking about your family visiting, you're not going to do a scope check in mid-week because I have a feeling you'll be overwhelmed with that lol.
When it comes to "its in my head", even if it is, its the old the line of "half the job is doing the work, the other half is making sure someone knows you have don't it" and if you haven't done the latter than its not done, even if it is "done".
I mostly worked in community (grassroots) projects, where we are all amateurs in our own way, and it is clear that someone who pretends they are doing a task without daring to tell us the truth is a big liability to the team. That said, it did not happen often as my "world" was almost all volunteers or workers who made the choice to join a grassroot project out of principle.
Tim, hearing your experience is really helping me in my current struggles in management.
Your videos are a lot of fun Tim... I miss working with you man
I love these videos. I often listen to them when drawing or watch them when eating.
Thanks Tim
been really enjoying listening to these daily videos. Your candor, attitude, and experience shine through and are a joy to witness
Tim, you have no idea how valuable this knowledge is! Thank you! :)
i LOVE your channel! thank you so much for sharing these stories
"Hi everyone, it's me, Tim" is the best way to start my day. Thank you for these video!
Tim's channel is a bless, thank you Tim!
Man, the "people lie straight to your face" thing is so absolutely accurate, and I also struggle with the exact same problem, and for the same reason as well. I just feel like I'm too optimistic and in a very specific and particular sense, trusting. I wouldn't say I'm like, gullible, or trusting in a way that would lead to physical danger type stuff, but when I befriend someone, I intend and hope that I stay solid friends with them for the rest of my life. As far as I'm concerned, we've made an unspoken pact, and I'll always be in your corner and have your back, period. That's just part of the package deal that comes with being a close friend of mine, I suppose.
So I WANT to believe, that they'd simply have no reason to lie. That specific detail still confuses and bothers me, like.. why? What even is the point, to seemingly the vast majority of these lies?
Potentially bit of a strange story to tell so nonchalantly, but I'm roughly 2 and a half years clean from heroin and fent addiction, and for a short period of time I was also dealing, to help offset the cost of my addiction since it became pretty goddamn costly.
Well, I had a couple of very close "using buddies", that I legitimately took care of. If they ran out, or even were just nearing running out and not certain when they'd next get cash, I'd spot them. They didn't even have to ask, as I typically would be the one extending a hand to offer. There were two occasions when I actually chose to give the last of what I had, to a close friend, just to ensure they wouldn't get sick from withdrawal, despite condemning myself to it. The first time I almost instinctively did so without giving it any thought, which was interesting to think about afterward. But then when the opportunity arose for me to basically do it again, and I still made the conscious decision to prefer enduring suffering myself than have them endure it.
So, getting to my point.. Despite being so generous and charitable, prob in the thousands of dollars in free drugs I gave away, because I basically just held them in such high regard, they were almost like an extension of myself, in a sense. Taking care of them was as close as possible to being on the same degree of priority as seeing myself be taken care of.
Despite that degree of generosity.. And it also extended to things like giving them a place to stay when they were going to be homeless for the foreseeable future.
They, or at least for certain one of them, STILL fucking stole from me, and lied through their fucking teeth, to my face about it, when I'd gotten it on camera. They even offered to HELP ME LOOK FOR IT.
The same person would talk constant shit about the other close friend of mine, and then for some reason, went to them saying -I- was the one talking shit behind their back and such and so on. Like, I literally don't understand. What more could I possibly have offered or done, that they wouldn't feel the urge or need to do that kinda shit? At the very least, if you just assume a very black and white "A thief is always a thief" sort of thing. Okay. I would at the least, think that even a thief would stop themselves and go "Wait, I have such a beneficial situation going on. I better not do X to risk screwing this up."
It literally couldn't have been about money, because I was giving them so much for free. The amount that was stolen was so inferior to the free ride they were being given.
And even if it were somehow, some kind of kleptomania thing, then why wouldn't it be literally anything else? I'd have music equipment or games or USBs or whatever else go missing.
This got stupidly out of my control lengthy, I sincerely apologize for that. To anyone intrigued enough to read this far, hey, you're a qt random internet stranger. I hope anyone reading this has a rad day. I'll prob edit this down later, or at the very least just delete the whole thing, but too sleep deprived to bother atm.
I just wanted to echo the sentiments of many others. These videos are a treasure. Thank you sincerely for sharing your insightful perspectives on this accursed industry, especially for us wretched souls striving to pursue it.
True, my previous manager lied to directly to my face. When I started to ask him questions, I was mildly amused by how he was dogging around my questions and saying things completely contridictory to his previous statements.
And yes, I could tell it was not against me, it was him not believing in himself.
Thank you for all the great videos!
Thanks for this video Tim, its wonderful and insightful.
People lying never was surprising to me, but what took me until the last couple of years to learn was the motivations people have to lie. The only time I had something like a friend group it took me years to realize half the people were constantly playing a role to maintain their "status" in the group. I've since learned to identify such behavior and avoid such people, but it means I pretty much live as a hermit.
What behaviors/traits identify such people?
Minimal social life is heavily underrated, in my opinion. Sounds like you made the right choice.
same
Would love to know your views on bosses and the difference between those who break you down and those who build you up?
Also, are you distrustful of those who insist they are mentors?
Your bit about people lying to themselves. As someone with ADHD and rejection dysphoria I lied to myself a lot with my health.
I also have Crohn's disease, I reacted very poorly to the diagnosis and symptoms. I neglected myself but told myself I was doing fine. I lost 28 pounds in 2 months, I'm fine. People noticed I was doing poorly. I told them no, I'm fine. I told myself I was fine.
I was not fine. I was lying to myself. It wasn't until I almost died from an internal bleed that I finally accepted what was happening. In the hospital I lied there and finally accepted it. It was difficult to break a lie I'd been telling myself for years and it took collapsing in the street from blood loss and a 2 week hospital stay to get through the blankets of lies I'd wrapped around myself.
If I can lie about my health when I'm clearly doing so poorly it doesn't surprise me that people will lie to themselves about their work or capability.
Collaboration is the key motivating factor when creating games I have also found. Sharing ideas and seeing them being implemented and enjoyed by others is an awesome feeling.
This is very informative Tim, great content as always.
Hi. I'm a 35 years old game programmer. I'm currently considered quite successful in my career with a high position and a high salary. However, I'm feeling my competence is receding as I get older and older. I'm not as fast in learning new tech, in debugging stuff, also cannot overtime overnight as much as before, while the younger one now with proper education, they catch up so fast. Do you have any advice for me to stay competitive even when my mind is not sharp like I was before?
I'm 34 years old, I feel you. Here's what I did -> got myself into a position where I analyse things, I provide vision, I document, but I delegate technical details. I've essentially become a tech/team lead.
Are you sure its age related? Im slightly younger than you and I feel like Ive never been sharper than I am right now. Not saying age doesnt affect people but are still relatively young... Perhaps youve simply ended up in a position where you dont expand your mind in the same way that you used to?
Sounds more like burnout than age to me tbh
You just don't want to move out from your comfort zone, has nothing to do with your age, which is totally fine.
Youngers aren't better than you. The experiences/mistakes you had been through are far more important than the new technical skills, assuming you are not those fake experienced devs didn't learn anything but job hopping all the times.
@@MaMastoast I have to concur. I'm significantly older than 35 and I don't feel like I've slowed down at all or that I learn any less quickly (I've always been an insanely fast learner). I've wondered about this since I've heard people talk about decline due to age, but I expected that was some time older than I am. Hearing you talk about it at 35... I was actually a better/faster developer at 35 than I was at 25 because I had learned how to optimize myself. I will say if you aren't challenging yourself and putting yourself in situations where you have something to learn, that can feel like decline. I experienced that once, so I threw myself into something extremely complicated I had never done before and had no problem, turns out I just wasn't pushing myself and had gotten into a rut where I didn't have anything new to learn. So I got out of the rut...
It's funny how this story confirmed what I thought about you when listening to your other videos. That you are a naive person, who sees the best in people. In many of your stories you were hurt by people being... people (read as assholes). In others you were hurt because they betrayed you etc. Good to know you know that about yourself, too. But also making me smile, because you keep on relearning that lesson again and again. :D (I am the same in that regard, hence me noticing a pattern in your stories). You are a gem Timothy. Stay as blue eyed for all eternity. The world needs people like you.
These are very useful insights, thank you for sharing :)
So, Tim, have you ever lied knowingly? If everybody lies then there's a story here somewhere.
I have lied knowingly, sometimes to spare someone's feelings, and sometimes because I was ordered to lie. I have worked hard to make sure that latter situation cannot happen again.
You are inspiration Tim, thank you!
Hey Tim. I was wondering if you've ever had anything like stress or depression during your time as a game developer? And If so, then how did you deal with it? And if not, then what did you do to keep a healthy mindset?
Thanks for another good video, really enjoying your content.
Love hearing ya Tim, thanks
Satisfactory exhale. Sigh of relief. I relate to this and I'm going through it.
Love that channel, keep it up like that!
The worker using that last moment raise to get better paid somewhere else is fine. Its not like it affects the left company in any way how much he will be paid
I love your videos and your insight. Please don’t ever stop!
Thanks for your work on fallout and the games works of art and thanks for your coworkers work on those games to.
"if someone wont send you something in a email, and will only tell you, they are probably lying". 1000% true in all business. If they wont document it, assume they are full of it.
I used to work in a grocery store and had a very vile woman who was a supervisor try to spread lies about me. Was one of the worst experiences of my life. Some people are just plain evil.
You touched on one of my favorite sayings: if you lie to yourself you cannot help but lie to others.
"I believe every word that man just said because it's exactly what I wanted to hear" Space Ghost Coast to Coast
Great content Tim !
This is a topic I've seen come up every so often, and you mentioned it here as well. What do you think about crediting people who worked on a game? Do they have to have been on the project from start to finish? Do they have to be there when it comes out? Or is there some sort of percentage required? I feel that anyone who worked on a thing should be credited, but there have been stories of people being removed from the credits or especially entire teams being left out when a remaster comes out.
I have talked about credits here: ua-cam.com/video/JOVgSfjWeVI/v-deo.html
"Trust but verify" and people lying to themselves are great topics for analysis. These theories are also talked about in the military, especially the former. Another topic I think could be related is the difference between personal and professional opinions.
Tyranny was an absolut blast. Thanks Tim.
Tim Cain is disgustingly smart and brilliant, and he makes me want to be a better engineer and programmer every time I listen to him.
As simple as it may sound, I think that's a good lesson. But, it also makes me think of what I think is my greatest challenge, which is just finding a team in the first place. I don't think that's something even you can answer, though - but it means I can't fully appreciate the depth of the lesson.
Thanks for this. I'm a similar person, I'm often TOO trustful.
I've heard about a lot of these practices happening at a friend's workplace - where employees take advantage of the system or when employers take advantage of employers or when CEOs take advantage of shareholders - and it seems like these practices are very common and often encouraged. My own workplace seems to lack employees and employers who do these kinds of tricks, which is why I've been working at the same place for the past several years. For us, it was our hiring criteria that seemed to weed these people out for the most part, and perhaps it was our leadership and the direction of our leadership that created a certain company culture that circumvented this sort of ... short-term advantage-taking. It also meant that the people being hired were for the most part competent and accountable and responsible, which meant that the creation process is fun and, in a pinch, they're all reliable. I think ultimately, it's hard to know what a workplace is like without spending some time in it, but try to find a place with a good leader with integrity and that will make a lot of difference.
Workers should not lie between themselves, they really shouldn't. And employers will tend to lie because that's what the system make them do for the bottom line, for the continual growth of companies. Mistakes won't be owned, they will be diverged.
Maybe one day we will change this system, and make this happen way less, cuz it won't as needed.
But damn, I feel the creation love, I have it too. To make something bigger, to help and be helped into adding more and more to a bigger whole. It's amazing, humanity can be awesome
Ok I just realised I need notifications for each video that comes out
I would love to work with you but i'm afraid that by the time i am worthy it will be too late, since i've only Just started on the game-development journey.
Creating games for a living is 1 thing i want. Creativity is beautiful.
Honesty & Teamwork are the other things i love.
When you talked about shouting in the room coming up with ideas and hashing things out, i wanted to join in.
I love the Indie Scene to death, it's where all the creativity is.
I want to work together with people and make games, there's soo much creativity!
No matter what happens, i am going to create games and work with creative people. it's only a matter of time.
1 - "People lie"
2 - "Trust but verify"
Very well said.
I like to think that I don't lie, but I have never been in a situation when my (or someone's) financial or career future depended on my being honest.
love your videos tim
thank you for sharing with us 🪲
Wow, this was a sad one. Well, bittersweet or sweet by the end. As always, awesome to hear your wisdom and your stories.
Can you talk more specifically on level design? As a lead did you handle any of it or is it something that gets delegated? Either way, I'm sure you have some insights on the subject.
Yeah, I have sadder stories to tell. I’ll try to keep things mostly positive though.
Anyway, this video is me taking about lessons in level design: ua-cam.com/video/MiAEBpXlelk/v-deo.htmlsi=J-CNei5CfNW21Rf_
Not everyone lie! I've literally never ever lied in my entire life, so there.
I work in an office environment, nothing to do with games. And this all rings true
We even lie to ourselves.
One persons confidence is another person's lie.
New dawn, new coffee, new Tim video 😀 All is well.
Cannot overstate how true this video is. I think everyone's been guilty of the 'game dev lie' at some point. With the sheer volume of time and work that goes into games it's not uncommon to end up in a catch-22 where being honest about a lack of progress is just as intimidating as potentially being caught in a lie. I think it's the product of crunch culture and the volatile nature of careers in games.
Bless your optimism in an increasingly pessimistic world
Some people work really well doing research in their heads for long periods of time before implementation. It's not procrastination, but is indistinguishable from the outside.
Also, it's ironic how many of your RPGs have been single player experiences given how much potential joy can be had from creative teamwork.
The lying issue does indeed cut deep with this industry. Even on the level of still just trying to break in, you'll hear various lies. The thing is, I don't think this is necessarily a matter of competitive industries in general. I don't know whether that would mean it's actually a matter of creative industries, passion industries, entertainment industries, or maybe even a matter of industries with recent explosions in growth, but I wish I could know what the difference would be from other competitive industries where reliability is given much more acute emphasis. Anyone here (Tim or otherwise) got any other guesses, beyond just "it's humans"?
I think the root of a lot of lying in the game industry is insecurity. Game dev requires a lot of creativity at a rapid pace. No one likes to think "I am not good at this task" or "this bad result is my fault" or even "I am a bad person", so they deflect it to someone else, anyone else, that they can. Co-worker, boss, someone who works for them...anyone.
Yo, today's episode is a banger
Man, this was hard to swallow. I've been telling people that I'm going to be a game dev, even commented once on this channel. But I haven't made something meaningful for the career and rather got certificates that were generally acceptable for job applications in our country. Cuz I wasn't sure of it, and when the rationalization ends, there r just me who still has no background that can be presented to employers.
Godot, unity or unreal engine 5..
Build a game.
You can add it to your portfolio
Cain is the new Michael
100% agree, the people who work in game dev are some of ghe most interesting people...both good and bad, but mostly good. That and not having to be embarrassed when Im at work and making laser noises to myself as i model a weapon. 😂
9:50 © House M.D. :)
Yeah, btw, something that I always tell people - being a programmer, not just in game dev - isn't that much about working with code as it is working with people.
The most important thing my dad taught me is that, if a man's word is no good, he is no good. The one I figured out myself is, the worst lies we tell are to ourselves.
"Yup I'm well along"=I am pretty sure I have not procrastinated so badly that if I work much harder in the future than I have in the past it might still be finishable
Would you be interested developing a board game? I would really be interested in seeing your take on a board game with an original IP. Thanks and happy (well-deserved) semi-retirement!
Oh god i had to deal with this "i did research/investigations those days" thing before. Then I asked the person to write me a document until next day with their findings. Next day I ask and they tell me that they found a docu on confluence that already documents everything they found. I am like okay this can happen, can you add everything ADDITIONAL you found out and edit it into the page? No, there is nothing additional they found, it is all there. WELL there i was a bit annoyed and then I asked for daily reports of what the person worked on on that day and to tell me if they have any blockers because wtf. Being a team lead sucks
Good morning Tim 🙂
The reason everyone lies in the gaming industry is because none of them actually know what a game is.
None of them know how to design a real game.
Anyone who doesn't believe this, just try asking a game designer, "What is a game?" They can't answer.
I would prefer to believe that people are basically honest and of course this means that I am deceived again and again.
Tim do you think developers get to play a lot of games when they are working in the industry, I just get the feeling that a lot of them are always so involved in a project with hectic schedule, long hours and pressure that makes me wonder if they still get to actually devote time to enjoy the product of their craft.
Tim attributing to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. There's the actual lesson.
Everybody lies
-Dr House
I do have to wonder if Tim means "most people lie" since "everybody" suggests he does as well, in which case I wonder how he feels about including himself.
Dang the AAA industry sounds stressful as hell. Losing your livelihood just because some rich dude doesn't care to take a moment to realize what you actually do must be devastating. I'm glad I'm indie.
Hey Tim, are you participating in the development of The Outer Worlds 2? I recently bought the 2023 remaster of the original and it's awesome.
Yes he is, he's said before that he cant say much about it.
I'm pretty sure he said he's working as a freelancer on it, not in a huge role but still.
@@booradley6832 Sadge :(
@@zafelrede4884 Well, at least it's something..
❤
Hey Tim,
Say you have a game design or a lore problem. Neither you nor your team can find a satisfying solution, what do you do? Any special rituals or meditations, do you know someone who knows the answer to everything?
In that case, I usually add something functional with an eye towards coming back and replacing it if someone has a better idea later. That’s usually easier to do for lore than system mechanics, at least before voice acting has been recorded.