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Sorry, but Eldritch Knights are the worst. Pick another Fighter Subclass - preferable the Battle Master or the Rune Knight - and Multiclass. Warlock(3)+Divination Wizzard (2) and Shadow Sorcerer(3) give you pretty much the Same and add up their respective Class features for a hefty "Fuck You" towards the Eldritch Knight. You may even pick the Invocations so you can Longbow Eldritch Smites. There is no Way to make a worse decision than following down the Levelpath of a Eldritch Knight - Fluff or Crunchwise. And the Echo Knight has Abilitys Rulewise that pushes him above all others. First of all, your Echo is "an Ally" - so you have permanent Flanking Advantage. Also, whenever you Hit, you can Bonushit from the Echo - what gives you a +1 Attack Action for Free. Having "Protection" for Fighting Style, you can pose Disadvantage on Attacks on your (if GM is lenient) or your Echo. Also, every Attack on the Echo is an Attack not on you or your Allies - yay for Tanking Damage. You can do Opportunity Attacks from the Echo, literally doubling your Range on them - which brings the Polearm Master/Sentinel Combo to a new level. Oh, you like to rather play Eldritch knight you say? Because of the Spells you say? Well, fear not, little Apprentice of the Dark Arts, here you go with Shadow Sorcerer, allowing you to huddle in a Bobble of Darkness while doing that Shite plus getting an Shadowy Dog accompany your Echo. Doggy Tracks, Echo follows, you teleport. And, if you do want to annoy your GM totally, fight with a offhand Shadow Blade and get 3 Levels of Warlock in for the wonderful Relentless Hex you can put on your FindFamiliar that invisibly dwindles around and allows you more Teleporting for no Recource cost aside a upcast prolonged Hex while slicing others with 4 Attacks per Turn from Level 8 on - with a nice 47 Damage average Baseline - against AC19. Oh, and your Echo can do all attacks you can do - including a Grapple. Remember the "all directions"-thingy and that nasty Fall Damage you take when frappling something from the Sky?? Well, your Echo is taking that for you. Oh, and when Grappling, both get restrained, right? Wrong, Echo is immune to conditions. Echo Knight is the most UA-Style broken Class in terms of OP-ness and one of the few that can compete with a celestial Sordin.
@@Rabijeel That is quite the rant. That is dependent on optional rules for half of it. Off topic for a third. The information on grappling with the Echo Knight was a nice find though. Good catch.
Echo Knight S tier for sure, I would put Cavalier as an A tier though, flavor might be lacking a bit, but damn if you can't control the battlefield incredibly well!
@@pedrogarcia8706 agreed, The fighters primary role is as a tank and its battlefield control makes it the safest dependable options to do that. Arcane Archer fails and is terrible at what it promises. It literally is a baseline fighter with no subclass in most encounters, its literally what the D Tier is for. I want to like it but just can not lol.
A mounted Cavalier with a polearm, polearm master, great weapon master, and Mount Combat is really great. The lvl 18 special reaction on every turn for Opportunity Attacks shuts down enemies within 10ft reach, and lets you focus your main reaction on your other class abilities. Can hold back a horde in a choke point, using ADV to minimize the penalty for Great Weapon Master and the +10 damage on each of the many Opportunity Attack as the enemy enters or moves within your 10ft radius of death, which also stops their movement in their tracks.
@@Watcher40K9 Also you can protect your mount from melee attacks because of Unwavering Mark which definitely helps in the early levels if you don't have mounted combatant yet. If I wanted to play a sort of protector type of character and was starting at a higher level, I'd definitely choose the Cavalier.
Samurai's Strength Before Death ability says you only fall unconscious "if you still have 0 hit points"; a level or two in cleric, and you can heal yourself during your "extra turn" and essentially prevent your own death. I'd say that's pretty badass.
Personally I always take a single level in Forge Cleric. Get healing spells, get searing smite, and get a free +1 to armor or weapon. Its nice for a single level dip and thematic for a wandering Samurai style character, fixing and potentially forging their own gear.
@@LupineShadowOmega It also fits with the Japanese aesthetic. Since their culture is so full of rituals, it would make sense that a samurai, i.e., a nobleman, is pretty in touch with the divine.
Gotta say, playing a psi-warrior right now, love that none of my abilities can't be counter spelled, and Telekinetic Movement is super vague and OP for a 3rd lvl ability XD
@@neildoscher9536 psi warriors are definitely fun I've played a psi warrior and rune knight so I think rune knight edges out but psi warrior is an a tier for me.
It sounds like fun, but something tells me some DMs I've played with wouldn't allow most of the things I would try. It sounds like a very DM reliant subclass. Tbh, most of these subclasses probably live or die by how RAW a DM runs things.
Try removing spell slots. Switch to the spell point system and give a warlock two points at level one and 2 additional points every level to 11 then switch to 1 point per level to level 20. You end up with like 1/3 of the SP of actual casters but being able to control what level spell slot you use by how many sp you spend(which lets you increase and decrease your spell slots based on the power you use) improves things a lot. And you get sp back on short rest like with slots. It's an easy homebrew if your dm allows it.
I played a melee samurai for 3+ years in a campaign from level 3-17. Can honestly say it’s a blast and to see it get the love it deserves is amazing. Such a fun subclass!
@@natashasurvivallady8021 mine was primarily melee, rocked a great-sword for most of my campaign and the damage nova's I'd do later down the line, and with an action surge and advantage were peak. 👌
I'm about to play a dragonborn samurai in my upcoming campaign 👌🏼 it seems so damn good, and with the breath attack I feel it adds some extra damage that will help make a difference when that last little bit is needed to take down a few enemies at once haha
@@SpiritStoneWarrior94-yx3gs the way the dragonborn works now, being able to replace an attack with a breath weapon, especially with some of the extra attacks samurai fighters can have for-going advantage, if you take GWM, hasted actions, etc. you can really get some good damage. Plus who doesn't love temp hit points and advantage as a bonus action?
I love "Cowering behind full-cover 1000 ft away, like a hero." Because that's what heroes do. Also battle master is just the best subclass. Its moves are so natural and fulfilling that it feels like all martial classes should be able to do them. I'd like to see its maneuvers collapsed into the fundamentals of martial classes, but since that won't happen the battle master is king.
Yeah, it feels incredibly silly that there isn't a way for melee martials to learn maneuvers. Battlemasters could still exist as the subclass that is king at maneuvers and potentially even teaches the other martials how to use them, but it feels like maneuvers are the thing that many melee subclasses are missing. Doesn't make ANY sense that a melee martial wouldn't have picked up A SINGLE melee maneuver of some sort even by level 20. Plus melee martials are on average a bit weaker than spell casters, and don't have nearly the level of utility (which is more important in d&d than raw power most of the time). Plus, if you keep it as an optional side system, then noobs don't have to worry about messing with it.
@@TurtletheShell there are ways for melee martials to learn maneuvers. The Martial Adept and Fighting Initiate feats give maneuvers and can be stacked. Or you can multiclass into 3 levels of battlemaster.
@@MyNameIsNotPa Martial Adept does. Fighting initiate gives a fighting style (unless they just changed it, haven't kept up with one D&D, but that wouldn't have been announced at time of posting if it has changed). That's also a huge problem. Melee martials need constitution / tankiness more than ranged characters, so you typically will want to use more ASI on that. Giving up ASI for an optional feat compared to some of the other feats available to melee martial, especially a rather uninspiring one, is silly. Maneuvers should be available to all melee martials and just learned over time / handed out slowly by the DM, with battlemaster being particularly adept at them / the class that trains everyone else. Look online at all the threads saying that feat isn't quite strong enough and that it should just be trainable in game via other means. Melee martials are lacking for options to spice up their move set, and also for utility, and maneuvers fill in that slot as weak spells for martials, without overshadowing the doubtlessly stronger potential of spells.
@@TurtletheShell there’s a new fighting style that gives essentially the same benefit as Martial Adept, printed in Tasha’s Cauldron. That’s why I referred to Fighting Initiate.
@@MyNameIsNotPa Oh right I forget about that one. Yeah, but again would you rather use an entire feat on that or get your asi to max / pick up something like GWM? I don't min max builds and usually don't go for GWM, and even I haven't found much room in builds for those feats. Should you have to give up two or more ASI just to get a somewhat workable set of maneuvers by max level, if that then means your accuracy and / or con will be piss poor? I don't think so. Any legendary melee martial that reaches level 15+ would, realistically, have learned how to i.e. hamstring a foe or cleave through them decades ago. It's lacking in realism, fun, and lets down the roleplay.
I love the breakdown, thank you. One of the, nasty, uses of a Rune Knight is their Cloud Rune. You can redirect any one attack, within 30 feet of you, from it's target, to another target, within 30 of you, and the original roll applies. So, if an enemy crits against you, or an ally, you can redirect it to another enemy, and there is no save. It is, extremely powerful. Conversely, if your Paladin, "wastes" a crit on a low power monster, you can shift it to the larger enemy, if it's within range. Yeah, it's once per short rest, but transferring a critical hit to someone else with no save is powerful. Not to mention the fire rune, which can impose restrained on an enemy, and constant burn damage, until they break out. Not enough to make it S-Tier, but nothing to laugh at. Also, RAW, the giant's Might makes you large or huge "If you are not already large or huge. So you can use Giant's might, then use a potion of enlarge for an additional size boost. Combine that with a bugbear bear totem barbarian/Rune Knight fighter, and you can have 30+ foot tall bugbear hitting with reach, and is taller than most city walls...just as a, non-specific, example.
In my opinion each rune invocation is stronger than a single battlemaster maneuver. At level 3 you get 2 runes, but also 2 uses of giants might. Since most people don't have 3+ combats on a day that means rune knight has comparable power levels to battlemaster based on those resources. After this however, the dmg states that weapon dice scale with creature size (if the weapon fit their size). A large creature does 2 times the dice in damage. At this point rune knight is leaving even the battlemaster in the dust. After level 3, things only get worse. Battlemasters get more options and eventually higher dice, but this means that it barely scales as it gets levels. Rune knights, to the contrary, get access to EVEN STRONGER runes at level 7, get an additional rune to use at 7, 10 and 15, and get a pool of forcing rerolls on enemies. At even later levels, your giant might becomes even better (also with you becoming huge and extra range) and getting access to all runes twice per short rest. Also, after level 5 it becomes increasingly unlikely of your giant might uses to ever run out. So, after comparing like to like, do you still think the rune knight is not an S-tier?
I don't see why it's not S tier but battle master can be. Since as said here that's 2 amazing runes you could choose with also great passive abilities for added RP stuff where as battle master sure there's over 23 maneuvers so very customizable to your play style but a lot of them are pretty useless or not worth the superiority die to spend since you only get so many and they all are dependent on what you got on that roll as sure the max can go up from d8 to d12 so chance to be good no doubt but that's a lot of luck asking for those moments. Where as the cloud rune just be oh shit nat 20 for 70 damage! Nope your friend is taking that hit and it just happens then. Plus the more range of combat but outside combat abilities rune knight has and story points can have is way better and cooler then, you know how to battle well and know how to trip a guy and kinda can get a type of bio on the enemy? Of if there better or worse then you in something.
@@Olav_Hansen Pretty sure its already been ruled that a player DOES NOT get the same effects of oversized weapons as a monster does in regards to the rule you are referring to, which should be obvious since its in the "creating a monster" section of the DMG. A class ability needs to specify what effects it gives you, which it does, in this case as just an extra 1d6. I can find nothing referring to PCs getting to double their damage dice when enlarged.
@@cyanide7270 well it doesn't just say it works for monsters, it mentions it works for "creatures". Player characters are invariably creatures. And if the dm is still being difficult, if you fight like a giant and beat it, take his weapon. Fire giant for example uses that huge greatsword. You drop it before using giant might, then use free interaction to pick it up. That very section in the dmg says that if players use a weapon that is made for 1 size bigger it is disadvantage and 2 sizes bigger it can't be used. So as it is confirmed that you CAN use the weapons, if you are the correct size you will do so with a normal roll. Or third alternative you purposely task a blacksmith to make an oversized weapon. Might cost more, but as the dmg states weapons can be made for larger creatures, and you are able to use those.
@@Olav_Hansen Probably chalk it up to different interpretations. Ive always looked at it and heard that effects where monsters are concerned do not apply to PCs (as with this since its in the creating a monster section), and that PC class effects over rule other rulings unless otherwise specified, to which this fits. So yeah, if thats how you wanna run it go for it, just feels like another interpretation difference, like how there are also people that still believe Reverse Gravity works with Prismatic Wall. Which it doesnt.
Fighter?! I hardly know her! Thanks to everyone who voted for this video idea, and who added thier opinions and votes for the placement of every subclass! We'll run the next tier list video vote in a couple of days!
Out of curiosity, would a level 18 samurai just be able to use a healing potion or a healing hands from feats/racial effects when they get knocked to 0 hp?
Champion is one of those pecs people sleep on due to the lack of "flash" in their abilities, but the trade off is that you are never behind or ahead on your resources; when you go in for your long rest you aren't lamenting the spell slots you didn't use nor staring down a big fight and realizing you wasted spells being silly. And doubling your crit is *devestating* with the right loadout; a half orc fighter with a flametongue great sword is going to be looking at 10d6+str on a crit which is going to happen twice as often as anyone else.
Big fan of Echo Knight, I think its definitely S tier, but you should know that Sage Advice has clarified that the 1000ft scouting feature is supposed to be separate from the rest of the Echo features, so you can scout with it but can't teleport to it or attach through it.
As rules as intended it's only meant for scouting but from what I heard it got removed for some reason and never got added back in any re-release of the subclass so as rules as written you can definitely just hide in a place no one can get to and use the echo to solo a whole dungeon with a echo that keeps coming back.
@orcunkozaci840 Sir, we're under attack! "Who is it? The humans? The elves? The halflings?" Just one Shadow, but it keeps coming back no matter how many times we get rid of it! "Get the scouts ready to..." The scouts are all dead, sir. "OK, get the footsoldiers ready to..." They're dead, too. "The arechers?" There goes the last one. "The infantry?" Currently failing at holding it back. "The base is lost then, we have to..."
Typically, I’d change Arcane Archer to have a number of uses equal to their Intelligence modifier. Then they’d have more uses and more of a reason to dedicate the ASIs.
I was in a 1-shot where the DM gave it number of uses equal to PB per short rest and it worked fine. The shots aren't OP (except for the Banishing one vs Demons etc) and the low number of shots RAW is just dumb IMHO.
Sounds like a junk change. Just change it to PB number of times. You're still not going to dump points into int when you need dex and feats to make this work. In either case it's still higher dps then people think even without changes.
It is worth noting that arcane archer actually has a few work-arounds for their INT vs DEX issue. 1. If you build DEX, some of the arcane archer options dont care if your target makes the saving throw. 2. If you build INT, some of the arcane archer options dont require an attack roll, and you have the redirection for your normal attacks anyways. 3. As a fighter, you have extra ASIs, so building for both DEX and INT is quite reasonable.(What you wanted to pickup the lucky feat and fey-touched feat? what are you, a min-maxer?) Regardless, its fair to say the arcane archer is generally underrated, even as is. The real issue is they explicitly list shortbows and longbows in the original version of the feature, meaning crossbow expert becomes sorta stupid. That's quite a dumb restriction though, and jeremy crawford has gone on record to say it probably should allow crossbows(or possibly other ranged weapons).
Another downside to PDKs is that the Battlemaster’s could also play a support fighter with its maneuvers. Extra attacks for allies, extra AC with Bait and switch, goading attacks, this subclass steals the limelight, because it can do PDKs job, but better.
Except it actually can't, and battlelosers are made obsolete just by having skill checks. I dont need to spend a cringe dice to push someone, I can just athletics check push them and achieve the same effect, but while having additional subclass bonuses.
@@youtubecensorship842 It is way more economical to knock someone prone and attack with extra damage at the same time than to sacrifice an attack for a shove action. Same with grappling strike, although it doesn't do the additional damage. Being able to grapple/shove without sacrificing two of your attacks, and indeed, dealing an extra d8 is obviously better. Losing one or two attacks with a greatsword is a massive loss. Shoving is obviously still a very useful tool for all fighters, especially once you have 3+ attacks or if you have multiple melee attackers in your party. Personally I think that Rune Knight is better for this kind of play as they get advantage on Strength checks and can shove or grapple creatures of sizes that battlemaster can only dream of. Battlemasters also get riposte, which is a very good use of your reaction (although other classes like Rune Knight also get excellent reaction options). Being able to do one thing that Battlemaster can with a skill check, and also arguably worse than they can, does not make them obsolete. Personally I think Battlemaster is a terribly designed subclass but there is no question that they are one of the most useful and versatile subclasses for fighter.
I think the reason why cavalier is so divisive in almost every ranking, is because of how much it relies on the style of game your DM runs. If it's a highly tactical game, the cavaliers shines and really comes into his own, but if the DM is a lot more theater of the mind combat's kind of mushy (and I'm not even talking about mild tactics, but like if you're DM doesn't use a battle grid with terrain and the like where pushing people 5 ft and things like that have very clear demonstrative effects) then a lot of the more important features for this class don't necessarily shine as brightly. On one level when I look at rankings people make, the way the cavalier is ranked with this scattered shot of rankings reminds me a lot of the wild magic sorcerer, who generally also has such a wide scattered variety of rankings. And again for the same reason, both classes really just depend on how is the DM going to actually run the game.
Ranking the Cavalier heavily depends on what level you’re playing at. Unlike most Fighter subclasses, it’s really backloaded. Using Treantmonk’s style of ranks, I would rank it around the middle of D for levels 1-9 and bottom of B for levels 10+.
I always have an issue with people just saying that cavalier is a “mounted fighter” because they have a single ribbon feature that helps with mounted combat. I think they’re great defenders and have a lot of potential, but in games like you’ve described they lose all of their traction
@@GamerTreeProductions Yeah I never actually got why people playing that it's just a class about mounted combat; I mean the title clearly indicates that they're going to be good at mounted combat, which they are, but even on my first read through when the book first came out, it's super obvious that the subclass features are universally useful (provided you're in a game that makes a lot of use of combat tactics).
There is a certain epoch of D&D afficionado for whom, when you hear the word 'Cavelier', it's immediately followed by 'Acrobat' Because whatever foibles of the Cav may be, token heroism is acceptable if the GM says so
Champion: “It’s kind of like you’re not even playing with a subclass with these guys” And that is exactly the appeal for me. They’re pure fighter with no distractions, a blank canvas for character painting with no wiggles to work around. Also, they’re my go to for any Friday night game because by the end of the week I’m brain dead and champion really speaks to that.
Here's three changes I'd make to improve Arcane Archer. 1. Instead of it being just 2 uses, tie it to proficiency bonus, so at levels 5, 9, 13, and 17, you get an additional use. 2. Give them a short-range teleport like Misty Step. 3. Tie their save to Con instead of Int.
One thing I’ve done with my players for Arcane Archer is tie uses to Intelligence modifier, that way it rewards characters who build around high intelligence instead of directly forcing it
Oh, I like the suggestion of using Con. I've suggested Dex but I can see the DC improving with your life force (i.e. Con). I would make the uses per day set at 4 like Battle Master. Create a feat that can bump it to 5 so BM's and AA's are opposite sides of the same coin. And non-AA's can gain one of the "trick shots" through the feat once per rest.
Tbf, the problem if Cavaliers were to lean too heavily into the mounted combat aspect, is that in circumstances where they can't use their mounts (like, say, in a dungeon), they would feel underpowered. So I think that was the right call by Wizards
I agree can’t always bring your mount into the dungeon and if it was tied to having to have a mount to use their effects it would be worse when you aren’t able to use your class features
I think they should have handled it like the Drake ranger and gave them a pet to use. Have it level with them and gain abilities. Have it be medium but you can mount it.
Yeah, don't know what he was going on about. Previous Cavaliers/Paladins leaned too much into the Mount aspect when the style of the game doesn't lean well towards having mounts. They gave them actually *useful* abilities.
My dm allowed me to make a katana that was basically a rapier that did slashing damage. We did a lvl 18 one shot and my elvish samari had elvish accuracy, mobile, sentinel, and lucky. There was so much carnage and so many crits it was amazing
Also, I believe that samurai have a feature that make you trade your attack with advantage into more attack. So basically instead of having 4 attack (5 if dual wield) with advantage, you go full beast mode with 8 attack (10 if dual wield) wich is insane comsidering this is even before the two action surge a fighter can use!
@@lordgino2006 It is one of the later abilities, yes. Mind you, as it's worded the free attack has no reason to not be at advantage itself So if you combine it with fighting spirit, the extra attack is entirely free
My issue with samurai is its basically the one gimmick creating advantage for yourself. since DND is a team game another player could generate advantage for you and the rest of your party or a battle master could use a combat maneuver to knock a target prone generating advantage for himself and their party. If you think in terms of "how scary is my character individually" then samurai is really good. But if you think in terms of "how scary is my dnd Party as a group" samurai is not as good as a different fighter subclass.
Champion does have that second fighting style which depending what's allowed at your table can allow for some interesting things. It really feels like a "I just wanna hit stuff and if I trigger a passive ability that's cool too"
The Champion instead of getting an extra fighting style at lv 10 should get an updated version of the fighting style they already have. For example with blind fighting it would increase to 30ft instead of just being 10ft. This is especially true due to the fact that u can get another fighting style just by multiclassing or taking fighting initiate feat. So it really makes getting another one in Champion really meh. Not only that but it would make Champions more unique but still keep them simple like they should be.
@@moxar2220 That could work on some but not others. I think it’s just better to give an updated version of it which is almost the same thing but not. Like how do u stack great weapon master for example?
@davidstratton5428 great weapon master is a feat. I think you mean great weapon fighting in which case you stack it by allowing another reroll rerolling twice and taking the highest
Cavalier + Ancestral Guardian barb to force everyone to 1v1 is a very, VERY fun combination. They have to deal with you, but you also hit them really hard no matter what. But this is just a tangent I'm writing during the Cavalier segment
As long twillight clerics exist i think thats a better multiclass option to make you target nr.1 But i dont know if i would rader go twillight+ barbarian or twillight+fighter or just all 3 cause why not xD
I have a Minotaur AG Barb i was looking into multiclassing, but Cavalier really didnt fit to me. Since i was looking at a 3/4 dip, alot of what it gives wouldnt have been useful since it was mostly stuff i could already do between Ancestral Protectors, Rage and Reckless Attacks. The only thing i wouldve gotten out of it was the Bonus Action attack, which even then wouldve been pointless since i already had a way of weaponizing my Bonus Action with Minos Hammering Horns. That only comes from how the games being played though, as the DM has ruled that since Hammering Horns is a Shove action, the target DOES fall prone even though the trait doesnt specify it, which in itself is already AMAZING, but we also have a Gnome Polearm Master fighter that tends to ride my shoulders, so as i shove he gets to make AoO at the same time. Mines probably a lot more of a niche example of how it doesnt work, but i think that there are plenty of ways to make a Bonus Action deal damage without stacking abilities as much as this does, so maybe this fits more of a primary Fighter, Barb dip?? If the extra attack however was a REACTION, thatd change things a LOT.
@@okgut2033 Very true. Honestly though, Twilight Cleric is something that I would say is due for a nerf in some capacity, so I dislike using it. Insanely good spell list, insanely good channel divinity. It basically turns you into a paladin that also is a full caster with the cleric's spell list that can also fly and give themselves half cover in the mid to late game.
But that relies on multi-classing. If you don't do that then it affects things. My favorite character I created, though haven't been able to find a group to play with in my area:( Is a Drow Feylost Death Domain Cleric. Who I don't think if I can find a group will multi-class, but if I do then I'm thinking Druid.
@@morrigankasa570 Yeah, I know, it's meant as a fun little multi-class build to force one-on-one fights that I thought of while listening Your character does sound fun, I've never played a Death Domain Cleric before so I hope you have fun.
Wish their was more of this series. Love how quick this was compared to other comparisons on UA-cam, which made it watchable & enjoyable. Even quicker through each subclass would be better.
I feel the Arcane Archer's Grasping Arrow Arcane Shot fills the niche of meshing very well with your forced movement party members (like a grappler or a repelling blast warlock)
AA's greatest weakness is the number of times you can use the "class defining feature." Bump that up to 4x per short rest like Battle Master and it becomes a lot better. Change the DC to 8 + Prof. + Dex and the class is perfect (IMO) but than really outshines Ranger 😅
@@jamesbaker2092 I have a whole rant against Rangers being mechanically bad (even with Tasha's). But that is another subject and this is about AA's in Fighter so I'll leave it at that.
The day I saw my party’s level 5 dwarf Battlemaster use trip attack on a javelin to knock an adult green dragon out of the sky and take out half its health in a single round was the day I realised Battlemasters are the greatest subclass of all time Edit: to all the people telling me that’s not how it works in the replies, just know that I have reread the rules and discussed with both my DM and the player who executed that attack, and we have all agreed that you may all cope, seethe and, perchance, mald.
Trip attack only works on size large or smaller so it shouldn't work, besides that the creature gets to use a strength saving throw and with legendary resistance the creature could choose to succeed it. Nonetheless, I bet it was a pretty cool moment and the dm may have allowed it for that reason!
You mean the day your DM sucked at following basic rules? Yeah, pretty cool, but now your entire game is defunct and worthless, as it will always be the game where rules are cherry picked, and reality bends for favoritism, so achievements are immediately invalidated.
One thing I really love about the samurai + sharpshooter combo is that it can be paired with another feat to be even more broken. Elven Accuracy. This feat allows you to roll 3 dice instead of 2 when you have advantage on a dexterity based weapon attack. Beautiful
@@SirKickz Additional attack that does an extra 1d8. If running the Surprise mechanic, thats a LOT of damage right there, unless your DM is a DICK, and rules that "Only the first arrow gets surprise", which is just completely stupid.
@@SirKickz it also give you invisibility in darkness vs creatures that use dark vision and grants you dark vision , so you don't need to always use your Fighting Spirit. Plus hunters mark / or Favored Foe as well as all the utility that 3 levels of ranger gives.
@@cyanide7270 Dread Ambusher says "If you take the Attack action on that turn, you can make one additional weapon attack as part of that action. If that attack hits, the target takes an extra 1d8 damage of the weapon's damage type." That reads to me like you only get the extra d8 on that one extra attack, not all of your attacks that turn. Was there a clarification on it that went the other way?
In a recent campaign, my character is a multiclass of a Soul Knife Rogue and a Samurai, and the ability to just have free Sneak Attack is so good. So good in fact since I have 5 levels of Rogue, that it's such a good trade-off for sacrificing my bonus action dagger attack for just big damage. It really is just neuron activation
I'm not gonna argue with the ranking of Eldritch Knight I just think they're incredibly fun. Sure you only get up to 4th level spells and a smattering of cantrips and you really only get abjuration and evocation spells, but you can't get disarmed and they cross class really well. It's just all around fun to cast a cantrip and then get a weapon attack as a bonus action.
In the same breath, Bladesingers have done Eldritch Knight dirty and honestly deserve to swap features with them. The fullcaster getting the better of the two variations just grinds a bit annoying when they get basically everything else.
Their real strength lies in the abjuration spells. Heavy armor plus Shield can pump your AC pretty high, especially if you take the defense fighting style. Absorb Elements can give them resistance to problematic damage types in a pinch and buff their damage as well. Protection from Evil and Good is super useful on fighters as well, as it prevents charm effects from the creature types that most commonly tend to have charms. Effects like that can shut a fighter out of combat indefinitely
Just dropping a comment to show some appreciation for your content. You're a genuine dude and bring crazy knowledge and entertainment to the world, and that's amazing. You handled the OGL debacle fantastically, and the fact you pointed out taking care of yourself before supporting UA-camrs just goes to show that you appreciate us too. So, slainte!
One cool thing about the Rune Knight that wasn’t mentioned is that you can stack Giants might with the Enlarge spell, so as long as you Giants might first and have a caster in the party that has Enlarge/Reduce, you can become huge sized by level 3 and the gargantuan sized at level 18. Plus the passive abilities are really great seeing that you end up getting all but 1 of the available runes by level 15, you can get advantage on up to 6 different skills, 120ft dark vision, can’t be surprised, and poison resistance plus advantage on poison saving throws. Really great all around characters outside of combat and they can really change up a fight between giants might and there runes active abilities.
Dude! Thank you for turning me onto Steinhardt's Guide to the Eldritch Hunt. My bestie and I went in on the "Deluxe" tier and oh boy are we getting a lot with this one. I wouldn't have known about it without you mentioning it in your previous video, thank you.
I want to clarify with Echo Knight: The echo going 1000 ft works differently with RAW and RAI due to an oversight/forgetfullnes while writing it. RAW: You control it completely as your other echo's, you just happen to see through it RAI: It is purely for scouting, it cannot be used to attack or anything at that distance.
Rune Knight is my favourite subclass in all of 5e. There's so much flavour to go along with it being related to giants, runes, and all of their individual abilities. Most subclasses focus on one gimmick and doing their thing well. Echo Knight having a clone, Eldritch having magic, Psi having their abilities. But Rune Knight has two different playstyle gimmicks between being able to go giant and being able to invoke runes at key moments for match changing moves. I'm a player who generally prefers consistency over risking for higher numbers so the cloud rune not requiring a roll to work is my dream defensive ability. I also think the storm rune has a lot of roleplay potential where yes it mechanically lets you impose advantage or disadvantage wherever you choose but the flavour text says you do this by glimpsing the future, so your ability to do this is coming from maybe seeing a vision of the enemies attack and either anticipating their move or warning another player by yelling something to them. it could work really well if your character is considered some kind of seer. the regular abilities of this subclass are so stacked that it has to actively nerf itself by making one of its level features just 'you grow 3d4 feet due to exposure from giant energy' this is hilarious because you could go from being the shortest of the party to the tallest.
Rune knights an incredible support though and has so many options for the reaction, casters love you being their friend with storm rune, forcing disadvantage on the enemies saves is lit. Plus hey prof mod forced rerolls with your aegis skill is lit.
Plus the Stone and Storm Rune can take out nearly every low level enemy for most part of the battle. :D ive frustrated my DM more then one time with these xD
@@Cpt.Str4ng3 oh i know, during this one halloween themed one shot our DM was hypin up this big villain who was kinda meant to be the vampire master's right hand monster. he approaches us and i used the stone rune and completely render him worthless as we slam him into the ground. this is why you give your big encounters minions. it was such a massacre that i actually feel bad about ruining a villain he was excited for and i now restrain myself when it comes to the stone rune in single enemy encounters. plus i just prefer the flavour of the other runes now so i usually take stone last.
Favorite combo is to ready action attack (trigger when an enemy attacks) as a battlemaster with disarming strike. Since disarming triggers with any weapon attack, all it takes is one thrown dagger to force the baddie to pathetically drop their sword or spell focus.
Your trigger would not work on a spell attack. It is not a weapon attack and thus cannot be used to force them to drop the focus. It wouldn't even work on a ranged attack because you would be targeting the arrow and not the bowman. Wording is key on these things.
@@Nempo13 They didn't mention anything about a spell attack, and it would definitely work with a ranged attack. "When you hit a creature with a weapon attack, you can expend one superiority die to attempt to disarm the target, forcing it to drop one item of your choice that it’s holding." That applies to ranged attacks, thrown or otherwise. Wording is key on these things, isn't it?
I would love to see ranking videos like this for all the other classes and their related subclasses. Regardless of personal preference this is an amazing little educational piece for new players looking for advice in character creation, and more experienced players looking to branch out and diversify their characters.
Something I love about Rune Knight is that unlike Barbarian, it doesn't force you to go melee, all the bonus damage effects trigger on a 'weapon hit' not a 'melee weapon hit.' I have a character that's a halfling Rune Knight and at first glance he seems like the typical small and shifty bowman, until he grows to 4 times his size and suddenly his longbow is the size of a person.
I used Eldritch Knight to make an Alice in Wonderland inspired character. I used variant human and took magic initiate Wizard as their feat with find familiar as one of their spells. Obviously a white rabbit is the shape I chose (yes you can do that if you keep the Icewind Dale module in mind, it expands the familiar list with the hare and fox). I mostly chose spells that help with her long sword and are good use for bonuses, extra actions and reactions. That’s one of my proudest creations I made for the fighter class
@@samuelbroad11 I have mentioned it to my dm since she is a back up character and they like the idea enough they will consider it. But if I don’t use her as a back up, I might use her for the module the blade actually comes from when we play that. Lots of time to consider! Lol actually finding that blade in the items list was exactly what gave me the thought to make an Alice inspired character
@@samuelbroad11 I’ll be sure to help them if that becomes a thing. At the very least, have them be twins. How about twin bards? That’s a good class to represent them I think. 🤔
Arcane Archer: should be more like Battle Masters with a ton of arrow options, more uses, and a superiority die type system. Battle Master: super cool! Definitely deserves S tier. Cavalier: should really be split into 2 subclasses: 1 (let's call Guardian): all about defense, maybe include Captain America-style shield fighting; 2 (Cavaliers): all about mounted combat and it gets features similar to the spells Find Steed and Find Greater Steed (ex. at lv 18, your mount can be a CR 5 or lower dragon). Champion: is nice, needs a bit more Echo Knight: super cool! Though, the Echo could use more HP at later lvs. Eldritch Knight: (a.k.a. Arcane Knight cause there’s nothing eldritch or warlock about them) is really good. Psi Warrior: really good jedi subclass, but could use more force/psychic spell options like the Arcane Knight Purple Dragon Knight: (a.k.a. Banneret) needs a big overhaul to make it better Rune Knight: super cool! Samurai: super cool!
I absolutely ADORE the Purple Dragon Knight subclass. It felt REALLY good to play the one time I played it. Being able to do decent damage AND support the party at the same time is WAY too underrated.
I agree, it can even be a great character to add to the group if perhaps you're playing with an under-size party or perhaps one that leans a bit too heavily into one role that doesn't balance the combat (like a party of squishy casters so the DM has to add a warrior that can draw some of the aggro but let the players have fun blowing things up. The abilities make them really great at shoring up weaknesses in an overly large group too, since they don't bog down actions in the turn order.
re: Psi Warriors - couple points. Most of their abilities come with a 1/rest use or use again with dice, so their Psi Dice actually go a ways longer than you suggest, especially since you can recover 1/short rest. They also get to do a few things uncommon in D&D - Flat damage reduction, and moving allies & objects. And at higher levels, having basically 10 castings of telekinesis every day if they want to is pretty cool.
Rune Knights are my absolute favourite. The flavour of hulking out is too fun. I have had it change my characters looks for flavour, playing a triton that turned into a shark man when he grew.
one thing to mention about Rune Knight is that it's ability specifically says you grow to large/huge size, not that you grow one/two sizes larger.... that means if you are playing a small character like a Gnome, you still grow to large size when you activate Giant's Might. and playing an 8 foot tall Gnome just sounds fun.
Be a warforged juggernaut, you START at 8 feet tall. Also rune knight has been rewritten 3 times, most places have it as growing one size category larger. for a juggy that has powerful build built into it...this means you effectively become size huge (with the damage increase due to your weapon growing in size) at level 3.
I spent a lot of time trying to figure out what fighter sub-class to add when my dual wielding Wild Magic barbarian hit level 9 (6 barb, 3 fighter), bouncing between Rune Knight and Battle Master. Ended up going with Battle Master using Riposte, Menacing Attack and Distracting Attack and against a horde of goblins/hobgoblins he was like a lawnmower in a flower garden. Couldn't tell if my DM was more frustrated at me or the T-Rex that the bard polymorphed into
One question, where did your bard see a t-rex in the wild? To polymorph or wild shape into something...the character has had to of seen it and know about it. Just because it is available in the book or list isn't enough.
Oversized weapon rules, which is something most tables should be playing with if your fighters are going big just to help them catch up with casters, really bumps Rune Knight up to S.
I think that even without the table rune knights deserve the s tier. At level 3 they are really close to battlemasters if you exclude oversized weapons, but at level 7 it just leaves battlemasters in the dust, only adding insult to injury at levels 10, 15 and 18.
Yeah fire rune is no joke for crowd control doing 4d6 of fire damage between the fighters turn and the enemies because you do damage first then they attempt the save all while incapacitated. This plus the initial damage from the attack plus of course hulking out means any big nasty is going to know they been kissed.
Another fun thing with the echo knight subclass is the ability to flavor your echo to however you want it to be. For example, you can create the echo to be a future timeline variant of your character (something a friend of mine does). There’s plenty of ways to have fun rp context with it as well, even leading to the echo having a mind of their own (it’s quite fun messing with an echo who can shapeshift into allies out of battle only).
"I cast gun". Best part of this video. That had me in stitches. Excellent tier list video! I always like seeing what peoples' opinion on these sorts of subclasses are!
Runeknight offers you four tries to shove or grapple with advantage and +13 athletics while large on lvl 6. I don't need versatiliy. I need somebody to cast enlarge on me so I can push a Terrasque of a cliff. At lvl 6. (you take a race with +2 strength, frost rune, giants might, and the skill expert feat for this. Or you play a Loxodon, you need lvl 8 to reach 20 strength, but now you can grapple 3 people at a time.)
Recently used giants might with potion of enlarge to grapple an ancient silver dragon mid flight and rode him into the ground. I love my Rune Knight.@@FinnMeier-n8r
Mixing 3 levels of cavalier with the Drakewarden of the ranger is really strong. Getting the mounted combatant feat is also really useful for this setup.
Really good ranking - the other advantage of the Echo Knight is that the echo is immune to all conditions, which means if you ever get poisoned you just perform all attacks from your echo and you ignore the poisoned condition. Very handy to avoid being locked down by poison creatures
I don't think that's true. It's not the echo making the attack. /You/ make the attack through the echo, so any condition on you would still apply. But that does lead to a (nonsensical imo) loophole where if you're hidden from the enemy, the attack through your very visible echo is still with advantage.
Beat thing about Eldtrich Knight is this: When a wizard runs our of spells there worse than a commoner, but when an eldritch knight runs out of spells they are still a fighter.
Worse than a commoner? Eh, what? Cantrips, mage armor, more hit points. Spells that you can just cast like cantrips at higher levels. I'm playing a bladesinger right now, and while definitely not as strong as an EK without spell slots, she could take out a lot of problems with no slots at all.
No offense, but your comment is classic "say you don't play 5e without saying you don't play 5e." Maybe you played an older edition, when cantrips had limited uses?
I recently played an echo knight and i think what pushes them above battle masters is the insane reach that you get for melee fighters. You can move your echo at any point during your turn, including the 15 ft spawning range this gives you 45 ft extra movement, allowing you to lock down a spellcaster so easily.
Echo avatars intent is to only use it for scouting as stated by Jeremy Crawford. It’s like a familiar. They intend to fix it in future prints but you should t be allowed to attack through it at 1000ft away
RAW as written, you absolutely can attack and teleport through it. In no printed book is it changed, thus, it is how it stays. Until they print new editions, a 5.5e for example, nope, Echo is as written. They can update the Beyond all they want. I don't know anyone that uses Beyond, people hate that level of nickel and dime crap. Paying per race to even USE it on Beyond's sheets is insane.
An eldritch knights works best if you mostly ignore any kind of attacking spell except for your cantrips for things like booming blade and green flame blade and focus on buffs and utility. Pair this with a decent con and Warcaster which is practically a must have, and it's almost impossible to remove your buffs by damaging you unless your opponent hits super hard. Absorb elements and shield are your level 1 bread and butter, but at higher levels enhance ability, blur and even fly become great utility for a fighter to have.
Great video, again. I'm fascinated with the battle master. Seems like the perfect subclass for the player who loves to create those great cinematic moments.
I love how honest with how you rank them you are. Some other channels would have put Cavalier in C and PDK in D tier because of the flavor aspect making you believe that the sub class is just dead weight while in reality you can actually have impact with. The only one I kinda disagree with is Arcane archer, mainly because I played it a bunch and since multiclassing has been brought up in the video, I can confidently say that there are some very cool stuff you can do as an arcane archer with some multiclass shenanigans. Other than that pretty solid and well made tier list.
@@WhyYouMadBoi it’s very open ended. Doesn’t specify what happens if you throw a large object and what damage die that will be. And maybe the DM rules you can’t use the ability to damage anyone. Worst case scenario you can only move object and friendly creatures 30 ft. as an action with psi die. Pretty bare bones if the DM isn’t lenient.
@@lukeamparo6586 Actually you can't throw objects only move them with Telekinetic movement. What you can do is have that large object over head of a enemy this is where you go to the DMG and look at the improvised damage chart. Which one it says "Hit by a falling bookcase" for 1d10 damage. Remember large objects take a 10x10 space. Animated large objects slam attack does 2d10+3 damage but they are obviously moving so taking away a d10 and modifiers. Again "Bookcase" are pretty big and can be stated to be our large object. The only "Open ended" is the DM not reading the DMG
@@WhyYouMadBoi It’s also dependent on whether the DM puts objects in the battle area. If it’s barren you’ll probably spend all your psi die doing telekinetic thrust. Moving friends is nice but wish you could impose a save against enemies. This is for below level 10 cause most campaigns it seems barely make it to lvl 18-20.
@@lukeamparo6586 Yeah this is a friend escape tool, as in if a ally is down pull them towards the cleric or if they need to escape and you can pull them out of a sticky situation. Or you know lifting someone up
Two things to say for the cavalier. One, there are a couple unmentioned abilities which are good for mounted combat: first - from the beginning - is how mounting only costs five feet of movement (aside from use with typical mounted combat, this can be awesome for mounting huge or larger creatures, like polymorphed giant apes or an allied dragon in the final fight) and second - later - there’s a charging ability which can be good on the ground but is definitely easier when mounted. Second, you can mark as many creatures as you attack per turn, rather than just one.
Haven't watched the video yet but I suspect this is going to come down to the Battle Master or Echo Knight (maybe Eldritch or Rune Knight but I see them less in these discussions), and I am 100% behind the Echo Knight, the versatility it offers is incredible, you can use it for exploration and get into areas you otherwise couldn't, and you can be a frontliner without having to be a frontliner with your echo attacking for you and absorbing at least one hit that could have hit you, and to boot the echo even has decent AC
echo knight does indeed offer exploration options that none of the fighters do. In my personal opinion battlemasters are a bit overrated tbh. Imo battlemaster is considered so good because it is so good... at multiclassing. No one ever bothers to look at their progression after level 3. At level 3 they are at about the power level of a rune knight and slightly above that of an echo knight. At level 7 the rune knight comes ahead and the echo knight overtakes the battlemaster. At even higher levels, both echo knight and rune knight just embarrass the battlemaster. I am also preaching rune knight a bit personally. If you read what the subclass offers in just runes it's already worth A-tier. That's without giants might and the other leveling feature. Those 2 are already enough to pump s tier, but there's a third part that's hidden to most people: In the monster manual it states that "for creatures of a size larger than medium, weapon dice scale". For large this is twice the original dice, for huge 3 times etc. It scales with weapons MADE TO FIT CREATURES OF THAT SIZE. Giant might explicitly states that you don't just become large, your gear grows with you. That means that while giant might is active, your greatsword deals 4d6 base damage. This singular effect from giants might makes the rune knight roughly equivalent to samurai, but with all the stuff I mentioned before it was already at S-tier level.
Like your long form videos very much. Your shorts are absolutely primo so a bigger bite of your insight and personality is kindly welcome! Keep up the amazing work my friend
Personally the gunslinger is really interesting story wise, also the hunting rifle is really strong,if you follow it up with hail of thorns from ranger it adds more damage
I have an Eldritch Knight which after 7th level I took 2 levels of war Magic Wizard. This allowed to use Arcane Deflection as a reaction giving me a +2 AC or +4 to a saving throw. After that if I choose I can use the EK War Magic feature to use a cantrip and make a Weapon attack as a bonus action. This give my character versatility and a bit of Battlefield Control depending on the Cantrips.
Personally, I love Eldritch Knights, but they are a little MAD and you're a bit restricted on the fighting styles you can take while still being good. However, the spellcasting does cover areas that fighters tend to struggle with, such as big crowds and enemies with ridiculously high AC. Plus, if your DM is evil and doesn't give you any magic weapons, they have cantrips for magical damage if they need it
I adored my Elderic Knight. Chilska was marvelous and I dis make her int work. Went with a reach weapon and shatter was her best ability. Her ability to call her weapon too her got the group out of enemy territory (that was so fucking stupid that entire thing. Swallowed the ring of winter, fought off a bunch of Yuanti basically naked, stopped a ritual, yea fun times) if she hadn't been able to do that it would have ended up much worse I think.
I second this. I just picked up eldritch knight cuz I wanted a returning weapon. Yet when I got down to mechanics of them, my hair brain, overthinking self just went ham. Currently level 7 and it's been a blast. My build's high int, which isn't optimized, but with good tactics, I'm easily the highest damager in my team.
My group has a paladin/rune knight and when when she enlarges, if it's not big enough, I cast enlarge on her and our DM allows it since they're 2 different sources worded differently. It's fun stuff.
Something you are probably not doing atm but that does work: dmg 278 says: "big monsters usually wield oversized weapons that deal extra dice of damage on a hit. Double the weapon size if a creature is large, triple if the creature is huge and quadruple if the creature is gargantuan". A weapons dice scale with 'weapons made for that creature size', and since both enlarge and giant might grow the weapon with you, that means that the paladin rune knight deals 3 times the original dice, so for example 6d6 on a greatsword. In my opinion even besides this feature rune knights deserve S-tier imo, but with this interaction they are the undeniable kings of S-tier. To bad that he missed this interaction like so many others.
@@Olav_Hansen my group doesn't do that simply because enlarge and the tune knight feature both have damage increases of their own, but we did consider it.
Personally I would have put Eldritch Knight at A Tier because of the utility it has, especially if you combine it with Stryxhaven Background and Magic Initiate Feat.
One thing people forget about battlemaster fighter is that most of the maneuvers don’t specify melee, and Menacing Attack + Hand Crossbow + xBow master feat results in so many attacks per round to nuke things down while also preventing them from moving closer to you. Add sharpshooter and that’s so much damage with Precision Attack guaranteeing hits.
Rune knight is an amazing tank character especially with heavy armorer master. Say the enemy hits for 14 damage with the hill rune it goes down to 7 and with heavy armor master it's only 4 damage. Especially with the new Goliath I can tank so many hits that would've one shot any of my teammates.
I agree with everything on the list except for Arcane Archer. I agree that they don’t get that many shots but I think it should bump up to B because Grasping Arrow, the best arcane shot, requires no saving throw and is a free lockdown or free damage depending on what the enemy does.
I thought aa deserved B as well. I might also bump eldritch knight to an A (shield+familiar is really good, and war caster is just amazing together with ek). But the single biggest mistake in my opinion is that the rune knight isn't at the top of S tier. It has so many 'obvious' abilities that already make it deserve S tier, but there's also 1 "hidden" feature that most people miss. Giant might, making you large, also makes your weapons large. Sounds logical, but a rule that many people forget is that a size increase means a dice increase. From medium to large the dice of the weapon become 2x, and at huge 3x (at gargantuan 4x but even you don't get that big). This means that just taking 18 levels in fighter means that you suddenly deal 6d6 with that greatsword when you use giant might. Then second turn use the rune giving you physical resist and you can most likely single handedly take down a terrasque. The size rules are so strong, that gwm isn't even worth it anymore for you. This means that you can prioritise getting 20's and the tough feat, enabling you to put even barbarians to shame as melee monsters. With 6d6+5, you deal an average of 26 damage per hit without using any additional resources (and accounting for the giant might d10)
That is 1 small ability that is surrounded by the other mediocre shots. It also does mainly poison damage which is the worst damage in the game. If that enemy is ever engaged with someone in melee the extra slashing damage doesn't do anything. So really its niche but strong.
@@Olav_Hansen That is at 18th level, near the end of the game, compare that with the at will when you get it Echo knight who gets a free 30 ft to 60 ft teleport. Able to negate 1 or more attacks, scouting and of course battlefield control from 2 places at once to 3 places at once allowing you to engage many enemies. I do agree that Rune knight should replace Battle Master although I believe battle master is low S if not A rank with samurai.
Honestly one of the best parts of the video was the Garo reference when talking about Champion fighters. It's such a niche series despite being so rich in terms of themes and visuals.
I had a player who played a Goblin Champion and the Goblin was getting choked by a Dragonborn. At DISADVANTAGE, the goblin got a 19, which critted the DB and knocking him out
I gotta say, in terms of damage I’d put Rune Knight Fighter in Low S Tier but only if you follow RAI Oversized Weapons. When you grow your weapon would grow as well, in which case that Greataxe becomes 2d12 at large, 3d12 at Huge. This isn’t including anything else, making your damage output a near equivalent to Sharpshooter Samurai
Come on man those are clearly rules in the DMG intended only for NPC monsters. If it was intended for Rune Knights to be given enormous damage boosts while enlarged it would have been listed in the sub class rules. 1d6 or 1d8 extra damage on one attack is all you get.
@@nicholaswalker2278 Actually not really, per the rules players are monsters. While I get what you mean it’s widely accepted that this can and does apply to characters. Plus every game is game by game basis so it’s up to you and your dm to decide if it’s fine to do. My DM allows it and I as a DM allow it Edit: Also this isn’t just for Rune Knight, any way you grow as long as your weapons grow you should be allowed this damage increase. Technically a player can pick up the weapons a oversized monster uses but you would likely have disadvantage because it’s not sized for you.
Why does it need to be as good with damage, rune knight is the strongest subclass in my opinion since it's the tankiest and arguably has the strongest/flexible abilities.
@@Ingimar16 I’m unaware of claiming it needs to be, as far as I and the people I play with are concerned, and as far as RAI Rune Knight has a higher Dmg output that stated in the video. That’s all that was being said. It’s not a debate or a flag being planted it’s just an observation
I'd love to see what you and the Council think about the Bard, and their best possible races, colleges, and multiclasses. Example: my Hellfire Tiefling College of Whispers HexBard. Gets Darkness as a free spell at lvl 5 from the race, and Devil's Sight at lvl 2 Warlock. Can now snipe with a crossbow at advantage from anywhere, dump Psychic Blade damage into every hit, and every attack is at disadvantage. Pick up a couple levels of Rogue to get that sweet sweet Sneak Attack damage as well.
Starting with 3 levels of Eldritch Knight is the most versatile of the fighter sub-classes. Dex based, 3 level dip before maining any of the full casters or rogue, 3 level dip into any full caster for spell slots as a fighter main, Str based, 3 level dip before maining Paladin (especially with a 1 level dip into a charisma caster). Eldritch Knight multiclass builds were the original martial spellcasters before it was trendy. Still the best.
Hahaha! I’m totally going to yell “MENACING ATTACK!” As I use that maneuver. Then if they make the save I yell, “HOW DID YOU DODGE MY ATTACK??” 🤯 😖😠😡🤬😡 😤 No matter. You will never be able to dodge my next one!😏 Then laugh maniacally!
Worth noting: psi warriors get psi dice equal to twice prof, which scales with character level, which means that if you multiclass 3 levels into them, they still get better as you level up, a 17 paladin 3 psi warrior has 12d6s worth of psi dice! Definitely a nice multiclass subclass
One of the saddest things in DnD 5e is that the Cavalier's main feature "Unwavering Mark" requires being within 5ft of the enemy which would cause disadvantage on any attacks from a player wielding a lance. Maybe I'm wrong, but being warrior, on a horse, with lance is the image that comes to my mind when I think cavalier, and it's almost unworkable with this subclass. 😮💨
I dont think the Lance is actually meant to be the mainstay weapon of choice though. I think this is more geared towards the Longsword + Board type of Knight. So maybe You charge in with a pair of Lances, pop off your first turns two attacks, then drop them and switch to sword n board once engaged?
@@cyanide7270 That's fair enough. That strategy does put in mind that maybe DnD is doing Lances wrong. Lances are supposed to be the ultimate weapon of the charge then shatter on impact. Maybe WotC should have upped the damage dice(not that d12 is bad dice), but trade off is that a successful hit breaks the weapon. Dropping 10gp for say 3d8+Str wouldn't be worth it when PC's are low level and fighting goblins, but when the PC's are flush with cash and fighting dragons at later levels... Could be worth?
I’m rollin a Rune Knight in Ravenloft right now. He’s a total blast! I love getting to help others out using my runes while totally tanking for the party.
Eldritch Knight is definitely A tier. A fighter that self buffs is amazing on the battlefield. I am gona say that if you are relying on offensive spells and the spell DC, you are doing Eldritch Knight wrong.
Any tips on how to run a low int EK? Currently playing and loving a high int one, mostly cuz I'm also running telekinetic feat, but I've been hearing a lot that you can run a low int EK and do better.
Indeed, EK is amazing, but many people fail to understand that it is best played as a tank, using most of its spells to enhance defense, instead of chugging fireballs from the frontline.
@@thetruegavinator Just don't use spells that have a Spell Attack Roll or Saving Throw. Booming and Green Flame Blade for example are fine, as you are doing weapon attacks. But it does fall off somewhat on later levels, given just how many attacks you can get with 1 attack action.
I recently tried playing Fighter for the first time. I took Battlemaster for my subclass and my god, it was so fun. I enjoyed being able to do things to either boost my DPR, reduce incoming damage, or do things like knock enemies prone (without a save I might add)
My main disagreement would be Samurai. I think the feature in isolation is a neat combo with the GWM or Sharpshooter ability, but the problem is number of uses as well as the requirement of a bonus action to activate. With 3 uses per long rest, it's about the number of uses of a 1/short rest feature. Battlemaster can basically replicate the same to hit bonus by just spamming precision attack, which they get 4 uses of per short rest at level 3 (and that stacks with actual advantage for even more accuracy since getting advantage is easier than bonus to atk roll). It does eventually refresh per initiative, making it eventually a 1/battle ability. It's still not that frequent, you don't really have that much control over when to spend your overall uses like that, and advantage isn't that hard to get with other sources. And then Fighting Spirit eats your bonus action, removing synergy with stuff like polearm master or other abilities that are bonus action related. Rapid strike also isn't that good with this combo as you lose the accuracy bonus needed to make the lost accuracy worth while for the extra attack. It's capstone is also very circumstantial and not under the player's control. Consider a comparison with Vengeance Paladin. 1/short rest advantage on all attacks against one target. Spell slots to pile on more damage as well as continued advantage round after round if your nova target isn't dead on your first turn. This can even be combined with a fighter dip for action surge to nova 2 electric boogaloo. Once Samurai finishes it's tiny usages of it's advantage (and you don't really want to spend it when action surge isn't available, making it close to a 1/short rest ability), they kind of have nothing going on. They no longer have a way to boost accuracy for their feat, so they struggle to use it and are just limp wristed and spent the rest of the fight. Main thing is, as an engine for nova damage, as a source of advantage, and as a GWM/Sharpshooter build, it's not the best. It's fine, but even it's main combo isn't that spectacular. That doesn't seem S worthy at all. I'd also say I think Rune knight is fine being lower than Echo and Battlemaster, but in no way is it worse than Samurai. It has a ton of frequently available utility. It gets pretty potent defensive options later, making it beefy near on par with a barbarian. Then it's an insane grappler. It's got one of the only ways to get huge without dipping into spellcasting or getting allied help and it turbocharges your grapple checks too. It's only real downfall is that it can't use it's utility in big bursts since they are short rest refresh and a lot compete for bonus action usage.
Rune knight beats Samurai easily. Go large, Use one attack on shove to get enemy prone, and all rest of your attacks also has advantage. Except now enemy is prone and your friends can also pummel them to the ground. Or you can also use Fire chains to keep the pain train going. Sure beats Samurai combo.
@@Mithguar Not just that, it's easy to get infinite advantage with just 2 level dip in Barbarian for reckless attack. Usually a slightly risky move due to the damage taken, but both Echo Knight and Rune Knight can handle it. Echo by using their echo as the fodder and Rune Knight with damage resistance. By alternating Rage and Hill Rune you can have damage resistance and advantage on all attacks most combats. That kinda beats the Samurai at their own game other that slightly delayed extra extra attacks.
Agree, I love that RK isn't a burst damage dealer, burst is so bad for combat! If you're a DM now you're forced balancing the enemy not dying in 1 round because that's boring or if it takes more then 1/2 rounds the burst classes have used up all their abilities and can't do cool stuff for the rest if the fight. RK is the perfect balance which makes longer fights (3+ rounds) enjoyable.
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The Osteomancer, Chiropractor from the Abyss!
Sorry, but Eldritch Knights are the worst.
Pick another Fighter Subclass - preferable the Battle Master or the Rune Knight - and Multiclass. Warlock(3)+Divination Wizzard (2) and Shadow Sorcerer(3) give you pretty much the Same and add up their respective Class features for a hefty "Fuck You" towards the Eldritch Knight.
You may even pick the Invocations so you can Longbow Eldritch Smites. There is no Way to make a worse decision than following down the Levelpath of a Eldritch Knight - Fluff or Crunchwise.
And the Echo Knight has Abilitys Rulewise that pushes him above all others.
First of all, your Echo is "an Ally" - so you have permanent Flanking Advantage.
Also, whenever you Hit, you can Bonushit from the Echo - what gives you a +1 Attack Action for Free.
Having "Protection" for Fighting Style, you can pose Disadvantage on Attacks on your (if GM is lenient) or your Echo.
Also, every Attack on the Echo is an Attack not on you or your Allies - yay for Tanking Damage.
You can do Opportunity Attacks from the Echo, literally doubling your Range on them - which brings the Polearm Master/Sentinel Combo to a new level.
Oh, you like to rather play Eldritch knight you say? Because of the Spells you say? Well, fear not, little Apprentice of the Dark Arts, here you go with Shadow Sorcerer, allowing you to huddle in a Bobble of Darkness while doing that Shite plus getting an Shadowy Dog accompany your Echo. Doggy Tracks, Echo follows, you teleport.
And, if you do want to annoy your GM totally, fight with a offhand Shadow Blade and get 3 Levels of Warlock in for the wonderful Relentless Hex you can put on your FindFamiliar that invisibly dwindles around and allows you more Teleporting for no Recource cost aside a upcast prolonged Hex while slicing others with 4 Attacks per Turn from Level 8 on - with a nice 47 Damage average Baseline - against AC19.
Oh, and your Echo can do all attacks you can do - including a Grapple. Remember the "all directions"-thingy and that nasty Fall Damage you take when frappling something from the Sky??
Well, your Echo is taking that for you.
Oh, and when Grappling, both get restrained, right? Wrong, Echo is immune to conditions.
Echo Knight is the most UA-Style broken Class in terms of OP-ness and one of the few that can compete with a celestial Sordin.
@@Rabijeel That is quite the rant. That is dependent on optional rules for half of it. Off topic for a third. The information on grappling with the Echo Knight was a nice find though. Good catch.
Are there currently any plans to do this kind of video for some of the other classes? Personally I'd love to see one on Bard's or artificers myself
Echo Knight S tier for sure, I would put Cavalier as an A tier though, flavor might be lacking a bit, but damn if you can't control the battlefield incredibly well!
Yeah I would bump Cavalier as well, and maybe drop arcane archer down. at least swap it with pdk in the same tier
@@pedrogarcia8706 agreed, The fighters primary role is as a tank and its battlefield control makes it the safest dependable options to do that. Arcane Archer fails and is terrible at what it promises. It literally is a baseline fighter with no subclass in most encounters, its literally what the D Tier is for. I want to like it but just can not lol.
Shame the echo knight isn't allowed in adventurer's league
A mounted Cavalier with a polearm, polearm master, great weapon master, and Mount Combat is really great. The lvl 18 special reaction on every turn for Opportunity Attacks shuts down enemies within 10ft reach, and lets you focus your main reaction on your other class abilities.
Can hold back a horde in a choke point, using ADV to minimize the penalty for Great Weapon Master and the +10 damage on each of the many Opportunity Attack as the enemy enters or moves within your 10ft radius of death, which also stops their movement in their tracks.
@@Watcher40K9 Also you can protect your mount from melee attacks because of Unwavering Mark which definitely helps in the early levels if you don't have mounted combatant yet.
If I wanted to play a sort of protector type of character and was starting at a higher level, I'd definitely choose the Cavalier.
Samurai's Strength Before Death ability says you only fall unconscious "if you still have 0 hit points"; a level or two in cleric, and you can heal yourself during your "extra turn" and essentially prevent your own death. I'd say that's pretty badass.
Or, since you get a full extra turn when it triggers, you can use your bonus action to Second Wind and heal yourself, no multiclass needed.
Personally I always take a single level in Forge Cleric. Get healing spells, get searing smite, and get a free +1 to armor or weapon. Its nice for a single level dip and thematic for a wandering Samurai style character, fixing and potentially forging their own gear.
@@LupineShadowOmega It also fits with the Japanese aesthetic. Since their culture is so full of rituals, it would make sense that a samurai, i.e., a nobleman, is pretty in touch with the divine.
How about a second wind?
Or second wind
Gotta say, playing a psi-warrior right now, love that none of my abilities can't be counter spelled, and Telekinetic Movement is super vague and OP for a 3rd lvl ability XD
I concur
Psy Warrior is best fighter subclass and one of the best designed subclasses in 5e imo. Surprised it isn't ranked higher
@@neildoscher9536 I wouldn't say the best but I would definitely put it in A. It does kind of feel like a worse battlemaster at times.
@@neildoscher9536 psi warriors are definitely fun I've played a psi warrior and rune knight so I think rune knight edges out but psi warrior is an a tier for me.
It sounds like fun, but something tells me some DMs I've played with wouldn't allow most of the things I would try. It sounds like a very DM reliant subclass. Tbh, most of these subclasses probably live or die by how RAW a DM runs things.
"You can only use 2 shots per short rest. That's not enough"
Cries in Warlock
Eldritch blast may have barely less utility but it can be used infinitely
I may confirm we do that
Try removing spell slots. Switch to the spell point system and give a warlock two points at level one and 2 additional points every level to 11 then switch to 1 point per level to level 20. You end up with like 1/3 of the SP of actual casters but being able to control what level spell slot you use by how many sp you spend(which lets you increase and decrease your spell slots based on the power you use) improves things a lot. And you get sp back on short rest like with slots. It's an easy homebrew if your dm allows it.
@@markcarpenter6020 but then it's not really a warlock anymore
@@hollow9414 what I said is pretty much dnd's alternative rules for warlock using the spell point system instead of spell slots.
I played a melee samurai for 3+ years in a campaign from level 3-17. Can honestly say it’s a blast and to see it get the love it deserves is amazing. Such a fun subclass!
It really is so good, and I love that it's good for both ranged and melee combat
@@natashasurvivallady8021 mine was primarily melee, rocked a great-sword for most of my campaign and the damage nova's I'd do later down the line, and with an action surge and advantage were peak. 👌
Samurai Is a boss.
I'm about to play a dragonborn samurai in my upcoming campaign 👌🏼 it seems so damn good, and with the breath attack I feel it adds some extra damage that will help make a difference when that last little bit is needed to take down a few enemies at once haha
@@SpiritStoneWarrior94-yx3gs the way the dragonborn works now, being able to replace an attack with a breath weapon, especially with some of the extra attacks samurai fighters can have for-going advantage, if you take GWM, hasted actions, etc. you can really get some good damage. Plus who doesn't love temp hit points and advantage as a bonus action?
I love "Cowering behind full-cover 1000 ft away, like a hero."
Because that's what heroes do.
Also battle master is just the best subclass. Its moves are so natural and fulfilling that it feels like all martial classes should be able to do them. I'd like to see its maneuvers collapsed into the fundamentals of martial classes, but since that won't happen the battle master is king.
Yeah, it feels incredibly silly that there isn't a way for melee martials to learn maneuvers. Battlemasters could still exist as the subclass that is king at maneuvers and potentially even teaches the other martials how to use them, but it feels like maneuvers are the thing that many melee subclasses are missing. Doesn't make ANY sense that a melee martial wouldn't have picked up A SINGLE melee maneuver of some sort even by level 20. Plus melee martials are on average a bit weaker than spell casters, and don't have nearly the level of utility (which is more important in d&d than raw power most of the time). Plus, if you keep it as an optional side system, then noobs don't have to worry about messing with it.
@@TurtletheShell there are ways for melee martials to learn maneuvers. The Martial Adept and Fighting Initiate feats give maneuvers and can be stacked. Or you can multiclass into 3 levels of battlemaster.
@@MyNameIsNotPa Martial Adept does. Fighting initiate gives a fighting style (unless they just changed it, haven't kept up with one D&D, but that wouldn't have been announced at time of posting if it has changed). That's also a huge problem. Melee martials need constitution / tankiness more than ranged characters, so you typically will want to use more ASI on that. Giving up ASI for an optional feat compared to some of the other feats available to melee martial, especially a rather uninspiring one, is silly. Maneuvers should be available to all melee martials and just learned over time / handed out slowly by the DM, with battlemaster being particularly adept at them / the class that trains everyone else. Look online at all the threads saying that feat isn't quite strong enough and that it should just be trainable in game via other means. Melee martials are lacking for options to spice up their move set, and also for utility, and maneuvers fill in that slot as weak spells for martials, without overshadowing the doubtlessly stronger potential of spells.
@@TurtletheShell there’s a new fighting style that gives essentially the same benefit as Martial Adept, printed in Tasha’s Cauldron. That’s why I referred to Fighting Initiate.
@@MyNameIsNotPa Oh right I forget about that one. Yeah, but again would you rather use an entire feat on that or get your asi to max / pick up something like GWM? I don't min max builds and usually don't go for GWM, and even I haven't found much room in builds for those feats. Should you have to give up two or more ASI just to get a somewhat workable set of maneuvers by max level, if that then means your accuracy and / or con will be piss poor? I don't think so. Any legendary melee martial that reaches level 15+ would, realistically, have learned how to i.e. hamstring a foe or cleave through them decades ago. It's lacking in realism, fun, and lets down the roleplay.
The "oh fuck that was an actual nat 20" sent me into orbit
That feeling will never change. Lol
I love the breakdown, thank you. One of the, nasty, uses of a Rune Knight is their Cloud Rune. You can redirect any one attack, within 30 feet of you, from it's target, to another target, within 30 of you, and the original roll applies. So, if an enemy crits against you, or an ally, you can redirect it to another enemy, and there is no save. It is, extremely powerful. Conversely, if your Paladin, "wastes" a crit on a low power monster, you can shift it to the larger enemy, if it's within range. Yeah, it's once per short rest, but transferring a critical hit to someone else with no save is powerful. Not to mention the fire rune, which can impose restrained on an enemy, and constant burn damage, until they break out.
Not enough to make it S-Tier, but nothing to laugh at. Also, RAW, the giant's Might makes you large or huge "If you are not already large or huge. So you can use Giant's might, then use a potion of enlarge for an additional size boost. Combine that with a bugbear bear totem barbarian/Rune Knight fighter, and you can have 30+ foot tall bugbear hitting with reach, and is taller than most city walls...just as a, non-specific, example.
In my opinion each rune invocation is stronger than a single battlemaster maneuver. At level 3 you get 2 runes, but also 2 uses of giants might. Since most people don't have 3+ combats on a day that means rune knight has comparable power levels to battlemaster based on those resources.
After this however, the dmg states that weapon dice scale with creature size (if the weapon fit their size). A large creature does 2 times the dice in damage. At this point rune knight is leaving even the battlemaster in the dust.
After level 3, things only get worse. Battlemasters get more options and eventually higher dice, but this means that it barely scales as it gets levels.
Rune knights, to the contrary, get access to EVEN STRONGER runes at level 7, get an additional rune to use at 7, 10 and 15, and get a pool of forcing rerolls on enemies.
At even later levels, your giant might becomes even better (also with you becoming huge and extra range) and getting access to all runes twice per short rest. Also, after level 5 it becomes increasingly unlikely of your giant might uses to ever run out.
So, after comparing like to like, do you still think the rune knight is not an S-tier?
I don't see why it's not S tier but battle master can be. Since as said here that's 2 amazing runes you could choose with also great passive abilities for added RP stuff where as battle master sure there's over 23 maneuvers so very customizable to your play style but a lot of them are pretty useless or not worth the superiority die to spend since you only get so many and they all are dependent on what you got on that roll as sure the max can go up from d8 to d12 so chance to be good no doubt but that's a lot of luck asking for those moments. Where as the cloud rune just be oh shit nat 20 for 70 damage! Nope your friend is taking that hit and it just happens then. Plus the more range of combat but outside combat abilities rune knight has and story points can have is way better and cooler then, you know how to battle well and know how to trip a guy and kinda can get a type of bio on the enemy? Of if there better or worse then you in something.
@@Olav_Hansen Pretty sure its already been ruled that a player DOES NOT get the same effects of oversized weapons as a monster does in regards to the rule you are referring to, which should be obvious since its in the "creating a monster" section of the DMG. A class ability needs to specify what effects it gives you, which it does, in this case as just an extra 1d6. I can find nothing referring to PCs getting to double their damage dice when enlarged.
@@cyanide7270 well it doesn't just say it works for monsters, it mentions it works for "creatures". Player characters are invariably creatures. And if the dm is still being difficult, if you fight like a giant and beat it, take his weapon. Fire giant for example uses that huge greatsword.
You drop it before using giant might, then use free interaction to pick it up. That very section in the dmg says that if players use a weapon that is made for 1 size bigger it is disadvantage and 2 sizes bigger it can't be used. So as it is confirmed that you CAN use the weapons, if you are the correct size you will do so with a normal roll.
Or third alternative you purposely task a blacksmith to make an oversized weapon. Might cost more, but as the dmg states weapons can be made for larger creatures, and you are able to use those.
@@Olav_Hansen Probably chalk it up to different interpretations. Ive always looked at it and heard that effects where monsters are concerned do not apply to PCs (as with this since its in the creating a monster section), and that PC class effects over rule other rulings unless otherwise specified, to which this fits. So yeah, if thats how you wanna run it go for it, just feels like another interpretation difference, like how there are also people that still believe Reverse Gravity works with Prismatic Wall. Which it doesnt.
Fighter?! I hardly know her!
Thanks to everyone who voted for this video idea, and who added thier opinions and votes for the placement of every subclass! We'll run the next tier list video vote in a couple of days!
Doesn't she work down the chippy on the high street? ;)
Out of curiosity, would a level 18 samurai just be able to use a healing potion or a healing hands from feats/racial effects when they get knocked to 0 hp?
Champion is one of those pecs people sleep on due to the lack of "flash" in their abilities, but the trade off is that you are never behind or ahead on your resources; when you go in for your long rest you aren't lamenting the spell slots you didn't use nor staring down a big fight and realizing you wasted spells being silly.
And doubling your crit is *devestating* with the right loadout; a half orc fighter with a flametongue great sword is going to be looking at 10d6+str on a crit which is going to happen twice as often as anyone else.
Where would you put the Gunslinger?
I know one thing that destroys the game with arcane archer that no dm would ever allow. Rules as interpreted Arcane shot specifically Grasping Arrow
Big fan of Echo Knight, I think its definitely S tier, but you should know that Sage Advice has clarified that the 1000ft scouting feature is supposed to be separate from the rest of the Echo features, so you can scout with it but can't teleport to it or attach through it.
I am reading the DnDBeyond "Sage Advise Compendium" and do not see this listed. Can you provide a source for this into please?
@@mikekinney5247 I know Jeremy Crawford tweeted about it but not sure if it was officially written down anywhere yet.
As rules as intended it's only meant for scouting but from what I heard it got removed for some reason and never got added back in any re-release of the subclass so as rules as written you can definitely just hide in a place no one can get to and use the echo to solo a whole dungeon with a echo that keeps coming back.
@orcunkozaci840 Sir, we're under attack!
"Who is it? The humans? The elves? The halflings?"
Just one Shadow, but it keeps coming back no matter how many times we get rid of it!
"Get the scouts ready to..."
The scouts are all dead, sir.
"OK, get the footsoldiers ready to..."
They're dead, too.
"The arechers?"
There goes the last one.
"The infantry?"
Currently failing at holding it back.
"The base is lost then, we have to..."
Typically, I’d change Arcane Archer to have a number of uses equal to their Intelligence modifier. Then they’d have more uses and more of a reason to dedicate the ASIs.
I was in a 1-shot where the DM gave it number of uses equal to PB per short rest and it worked fine. The shots aren't OP (except for the Banishing one vs Demons etc) and the low number of shots RAW is just dumb IMHO.
Sounds like a junk change. Just change it to PB number of times. You're still not going to dump points into int when you need dex and feats to make this work.
In either case it's still higher dps then people think even without changes.
@@Comicsluvr Banishing is until the end of that creature's next turn, and doesn't perma-banish.
Great idea.
It is worth noting that arcane archer actually has a few work-arounds for their INT vs DEX issue.
1. If you build DEX, some of the arcane archer options dont care if your target makes the saving throw.
2. If you build INT, some of the arcane archer options dont require an attack roll, and you have the redirection for your normal attacks anyways.
3. As a fighter, you have extra ASIs, so building for both DEX and INT is quite reasonable.(What you wanted to pickup the lucky feat and fey-touched feat? what are you, a min-maxer?)
Regardless, its fair to say the arcane archer is generally underrated, even as is. The real issue is they explicitly list shortbows and longbows in the original version of the feature, meaning crossbow expert becomes sorta stupid. That's quite a dumb restriction though, and jeremy crawford has gone on record to say it probably should allow crossbows(or possibly other ranged weapons).
Another downside to PDKs is that the Battlemaster’s could also play a support fighter with its maneuvers. Extra attacks for allies, extra AC with Bait and switch, goading attacks, this subclass steals the limelight, because it can do PDKs job, but better.
Except it actually can't, and battlelosers are made obsolete just by having skill checks.
I dont need to spend a cringe dice to push someone, I can just athletics check push them and achieve the same effect, but while having additional subclass bonuses.
@@youtubecensorship842 while dealing 0 damage tho. Battlemasters are masters for a reason, and they dont need to loose an attack to prone someone
@@youtubecensorship842 It is way more economical to knock someone prone and attack with extra damage at the same time than to sacrifice an attack for a shove action. Same with grappling strike, although it doesn't do the additional damage. Being able to grapple/shove without sacrificing two of your attacks, and indeed, dealing an extra d8 is obviously better. Losing one or two attacks with a greatsword is a massive loss.
Shoving is obviously still a very useful tool for all fighters, especially once you have 3+ attacks or if you have multiple melee attackers in your party. Personally I think that Rune Knight is better for this kind of play as they get advantage on Strength checks and can shove or grapple creatures of sizes that battlemaster can only dream of.
Battlemasters also get riposte, which is a very good use of your reaction (although other classes like Rune Knight also get excellent reaction options). Being able to do one thing that Battlemaster can with a skill check, and also arguably worse than they can, does not make them obsolete.
Personally I think Battlemaster is a terribly designed subclass but there is no question that they are one of the most useful and versatile subclasses for fighter.
I think the reason why cavalier is so divisive in almost every ranking, is because of how much it relies on the style of game your DM runs. If it's a highly tactical game, the cavaliers shines and really comes into his own, but if the DM is a lot more theater of the mind combat's kind of mushy (and I'm not even talking about mild tactics, but like if you're DM doesn't use a battle grid with terrain and the like where pushing people 5 ft and things like that have very clear demonstrative effects) then a lot of the more important features for this class don't necessarily shine as brightly.
On one level when I look at rankings people make, the way the cavalier is ranked with this scattered shot of rankings reminds me a lot of the wild magic sorcerer, who generally also has such a wide scattered variety of rankings. And again for the same reason, both classes really just depend on how is the DM going to actually run the game.
I had a similar problem with battle master. Fortunately the DM let me change maneuvers.
Ranking the Cavalier heavily depends on what level you’re playing at. Unlike most Fighter subclasses, it’s really backloaded. Using Treantmonk’s style of ranks, I would rank it around the middle of D for levels 1-9 and bottom of B for levels 10+.
I always have an issue with people just saying that cavalier is a “mounted fighter” because they have a single ribbon feature that helps with mounted combat. I think they’re great defenders and have a lot of potential, but in games like you’ve described they lose all of their traction
@@GamerTreeProductions
Yeah I never actually got why people playing that it's just a class about mounted combat; I mean the title clearly indicates that they're going to be good at mounted combat, which they are, but even on my first read through when the book first came out, it's super obvious that the subclass features are universally useful (provided you're in a game that makes a lot of use of combat tactics).
There is a certain epoch of D&D afficionado for whom, when you hear the word 'Cavelier', it's immediately followed by 'Acrobat'
Because whatever foibles of the Cav may be, token heroism is acceptable if the GM says so
Champion: “It’s kind of like you’re not even playing with a subclass with these guys” And that is exactly the appeal for me. They’re pure fighter with no distractions, a blank canvas for character painting with no wiggles to work around. Also, they’re my go to for any Friday night game because by the end of the week I’m brain dead and champion really speaks to that.
Here's three changes I'd make to improve Arcane Archer.
1. Instead of it being just 2 uses, tie it to proficiency bonus, so at levels 5, 9, 13, and 17, you get an additional use.
2. Give them a short-range teleport like Misty Step.
3. Tie their save to Con instead of Int.
One thing I’ve done with my players for Arcane Archer is tie uses to Intelligence modifier, that way it rewards characters who build around high intelligence instead of directly forcing it
Oh, I like the suggestion of using Con. I've suggested Dex but I can see the DC improving with your life force (i.e. Con).
I would make the uses per day set at 4 like Battle Master. Create a feat that can bump it to 5 so BM's and AA's are opposite sides of the same coin. And non-AA's can gain one of the "trick shots" through the feat once per rest.
Have to comment on the order you put the levels in.
I don't know enough but now that I'm looking at it, maybe 7 should be 17.
I also like the idea of tying the DC to CON. The Rune Knight does this as well, so it wouldn't be that different.
@@dashvash5440 Thanks, my one key didn't work in that instance.
Tbf, the problem if Cavaliers were to lean too heavily into the mounted combat aspect, is that in circumstances where they can't use their mounts (like, say, in a dungeon), they would feel underpowered. So I think that was the right call by Wizards
I agree can’t always bring your mount into the dungeon and if it was tied to having to have a mount to use their effects it would be worse when you aren’t able to use your class features
It's the cavalier from the D&D cartoon series.
I think they should have handled it like the Drake ranger and gave them a pet to use. Have it level with them and gain abilities. Have it be medium but you can mount it.
Yeah, don't know what he was going on about. Previous Cavaliers/Paladins leaned too much into the Mount aspect when the style of the game doesn't lean well towards having mounts. They gave them actually *useful* abilities.
@@lluewhyn it's a flavor fail
After years of seeing my baby Samurai repeatedly undiscussed and considered Mid
I'm glad someone respects it
My dm allowed me to make a katana that was basically a rapier that did slashing damage. We did a lvl 18 one shot and my elvish samari had elvish accuracy, mobile, sentinel, and lucky. There was so much carnage and so many crits it was amazing
Also, I believe that samurai have a feature that make you trade your attack with advantage into more attack. So basically instead of having 4 attack (5 if dual wield) with advantage, you go full beast mode with 8 attack (10 if dual wield) wich is insane comsidering this is even before the two action surge a fighter can use!
@@lordgino2006 while that ability is definitely powerful, you can only use it on one attack per turn
@@lordgino2006 It is one of the later abilities, yes.
Mind you, as it's worded the free attack has no reason to not be at advantage itself
So if you combine it with fighting spirit, the extra attack is entirely free
My issue with samurai is its basically the one gimmick creating advantage for yourself. since DND is a team game another player could generate advantage for you and the rest of your party or a battle master could use a combat maneuver to knock a target prone generating advantage for himself and their party. If you think in terms of "how scary is my character individually" then samurai is really good. But if you think in terms of "how scary is my dnd Party as a group" samurai is not as good as a different fighter subclass.
Champion does have that second fighting style which depending what's allowed at your table can allow for some interesting things. It really feels like a "I just wanna hit stuff and if I trigger a passive ability that's cool too"
TBH to me the champion just feels almost like a subclassless fighter. Which sucks because it could have had so much potential.
The Champion instead of getting an extra fighting style at lv 10 should get an updated version of the fighting style they already have. For example with blind fighting it would increase to 30ft instead of just being 10ft. This is especially true due to the fact that u can get another fighting style just by multiclassing or taking fighting initiate feat. So it really makes getting another one in Champion really meh. Not only that but it would make Champions more unique but still keep them simple like they should be.
@@davidstratton696 what about letting fighting styles stack?
@@moxar2220 That could work on some but not others. I think it’s just better to give an updated version of it which is almost the same thing but not. Like how do u stack great weapon master for example?
@davidstratton5428 great weapon master is a feat. I think you mean great weapon fighting in which case you stack it by allowing another reroll rerolling twice and taking the highest
Cavalier + Ancestral Guardian barb to force everyone to 1v1 is a very, VERY fun combination. They have to deal with you, but you also hit them really hard no matter what. But this is just a tangent I'm writing during the Cavalier segment
As long twillight clerics exist i think thats a better multiclass option to make you target nr.1
But i dont know if i would rader go twillight+ barbarian or twillight+fighter or just all 3 cause why not xD
I have a Minotaur AG Barb i was looking into multiclassing, but Cavalier really didnt fit to me. Since i was looking at a 3/4 dip, alot of what it gives wouldnt have been useful since it was mostly stuff i could already do between Ancestral Protectors, Rage and Reckless Attacks. The only thing i wouldve gotten out of it was the Bonus Action attack, which even then wouldve been pointless since i already had a way of weaponizing my Bonus Action with Minos Hammering Horns. That only comes from how the games being played though, as the DM has ruled that since Hammering Horns is a Shove action, the target DOES fall prone even though the trait doesnt specify it, which in itself is already AMAZING, but we also have a Gnome Polearm Master fighter that tends to ride my shoulders, so as i shove he gets to make AoO at the same time.
Mines probably a lot more of a niche example of how it doesnt work, but i think that there are plenty of ways to make a Bonus Action deal damage without stacking abilities as much as this does, so maybe this fits more of a primary Fighter, Barb dip?? If the extra attack however was a REACTION, thatd change things a LOT.
@@okgut2033 Very true. Honestly though, Twilight Cleric is something that I would say is due for a nerf in some capacity, so I dislike using it. Insanely good spell list, insanely good channel divinity. It basically turns you into a paladin that also is a full caster with the cleric's spell list that can also fly and give themselves half cover in the mid to late game.
But that relies on multi-classing. If you don't do that then it affects things.
My favorite character I created, though haven't been able to find a group to play with in my area:(
Is a Drow Feylost Death Domain Cleric.
Who I don't think if I can find a group will multi-class, but if I do then I'm thinking Druid.
@@morrigankasa570 Yeah, I know, it's meant as a fun little multi-class build to force one-on-one fights that I thought of while listening
Your character does sound fun, I've never played a Death Domain Cleric before so I hope you have fun.
Video timestamps:
0:27 Arcane Archer
2:33 Battle Master
4:20 Cavalier
7:42 Champion
9:05 Echo Knight
10:53 Eldritch Knight
12:14 Psy Warrior
13:45 Purple Dragon Knight Fighter
Oh man!!! Do more of this style! Please!
I got u fam, the council are working on it!
@@DnDShorts Awesome!!
@@DnDShorts Yes please!!! This Ranking Video with detail is awesome!!!
Wish their was more of this series. Love how quick this was compared to other comparisons on UA-cam, which made it watchable & enjoyable. Even quicker through each subclass would be better.
I feel the Arcane Archer's Grasping Arrow Arcane Shot fills the niche of meshing very well with your forced movement party members (like a grappler or a repelling blast warlock)
AA's greatest weakness is the number of times you can use the "class defining feature." Bump that up to 4x per short rest like Battle Master and it becomes a lot better. Change the DC to 8 + Prof. + Dex and the class is perfect (IMO) but than really outshines Ranger 😅
The problem isn't even the abilities. It's the fact that you cannot realistically use them due to how few uses they have
@@peterwhitcomb8315 I don't think so, goodberry and spike growth, conjure animals, ect keeps rangers on par
@@jamesbaker2092
I have a whole rant against Rangers being mechanically bad (even with Tasha's). But that is another subject and this is about AA's in Fighter so I'll leave it at that.
@@peterwhitcomb8315 I'm ready to hear it, I'm happy to discuss why I think ranger is criminally underrated
The day I saw my party’s level 5 dwarf Battlemaster use trip attack on a javelin to knock an adult green dragon out of the sky and take out half its health in a single round was the day I realised Battlemasters are the greatest subclass of all time
Edit: to all the people telling me that’s not how it works in the replies, just know that I have reread the rules and discussed with both my DM and the player who executed that attack, and we have all agreed that you may all cope, seethe and, perchance, mald.
Trip attack only works on size large or smaller so it shouldn't work, besides that the creature gets to use a strength saving throw and with legendary resistance the creature could choose to succeed it. Nonetheless, I bet it was a pretty cool moment and the dm may have allowed it for that reason!
@@2222lex wait Santa isn't real?
Anything can be a good subclass if the dm lets it do things it's not able to do and doesn't use their legendary resistances lmao
You mean the day your DM sucked at following basic rules?
Yeah, pretty cool, but now your entire game is defunct and worthless, as it will always be the game where rules are cherry picked, and reality bends for favoritism, so achievements are immediately invalidated.
@@youtubecensorship842 jeez man he had a cool moment in a game because of slightly bending the rules what's your problem
One thing I really love about the samurai + sharpshooter combo is that it can be paired with another feat to be even more broken. Elven Accuracy. This feat allows you to roll 3 dice instead of 2 when you have advantage on a dexterity based weapon attack. Beautiful
Do a three level dip into gloomstalker and it becomes ridiculous.
@@NPC-rq6vn What does gloomstalker give you that makes it so good? The extra attack on your first turn?
@@SirKickz Additional attack that does an extra 1d8. If running the Surprise mechanic, thats a LOT of damage right there, unless your DM is a DICK, and rules that "Only the first arrow gets surprise", which is just completely stupid.
@@SirKickz it also give you invisibility in darkness vs creatures that use dark vision and grants you dark vision
, so you don't need to always use your Fighting Spirit. Plus hunters mark / or Favored Foe as well as all the utility that 3 levels of ranger gives.
@@cyanide7270 Dread Ambusher says "If you take the Attack action on that turn, you can make one additional weapon attack as part of that action. If that attack hits, the target takes an extra 1d8 damage of the weapon's damage type."
That reads to me like you only get the extra d8 on that one extra attack, not all of your attacks that turn. Was there a clarification on it that went the other way?
In a recent campaign, my character is a multiclass of a Soul Knife Rogue and a Samurai, and the ability to just have free Sneak Attack is so good. So good in fact since I have 5 levels of Rogue, that it's such a good trade-off for sacrificing my bonus action dagger attack for just big damage. It really is just neuron activation
I'm not gonna argue with the ranking of Eldritch Knight I just think they're incredibly fun. Sure you only get up to 4th level spells and a smattering of cantrips and you really only get abjuration and evocation spells, but you can't get disarmed and they cross class really well. It's just all around fun to cast a cantrip and then get a weapon attack as a bonus action.
In the same breath, Bladesingers have done Eldritch Knight dirty and honestly deserve to swap features with them.
The fullcaster getting the better of the two variations just grinds a bit annoying when they get basically everything else.
War Magic is super fun 😊👍
the only build I have ever done that managed to use true strike as written to any good effect was an eldritch knight. had fun, but would not do again.
Their real strength lies in the abjuration spells. Heavy armor plus Shield can pump your AC pretty high, especially if you take the defense fighting style. Absorb Elements can give them resistance to problematic damage types in a pinch and buff their damage as well. Protection from Evil and Good is super useful on fighters as well, as it prevents charm effects from the creature types that most commonly tend to have charms. Effects like that can shut a fighter out of combat indefinitely
I had a eldritch knight-bladesinger multiclass build, some of the most fun I’ve had playing dnd, getting the best of both worlds was awesome.
Just dropping a comment to show some appreciation for your content. You're a genuine dude and bring crazy knowledge and entertainment to the world, and that's amazing. You handled the OGL debacle fantastically, and the fact you pointed out taking care of yourself before supporting UA-camrs just goes to show that you appreciate us too. So, slainte!
One cool thing about the Rune Knight that wasn’t mentioned is that you can stack Giants might with the Enlarge spell, so as long as you Giants might first and have a caster in the party that has Enlarge/Reduce, you can become huge sized by level 3 and the gargantuan sized at level 18. Plus the passive abilities are really great seeing that you end up getting all but 1 of the available runes by level 15, you can get advantage on up to 6 different skills, 120ft dark vision, can’t be surprised, and poison resistance plus advantage on poison saving throws. Really great all around characters outside of combat and they can really change up a fight between giants might and there runes active abilities.
So a Duergar Rune Knight would go crazy?
Also play a race with powerful build like a loxodon, so you count as one size larger when determining what you carry, lift, push, and drag.
Yeah, and they just feel so cool. Nothing feels better than facing giant monsters and turning just as big as them
Dude! Thank you for turning me onto Steinhardt's Guide to the Eldritch Hunt. My bestie and I went in on the "Deluxe" tier and oh boy are we getting a lot with this one. I wouldn't have known about it without you mentioning it in your previous video, thank you.
I want to clarify with Echo Knight: The echo going 1000 ft works differently with RAW and RAI due to an oversight/forgetfullnes while writing it.
RAW: You control it completely as your other echo's, you just happen to see through it
RAI: It is purely for scouting, it cannot be used to attack or anything at that distance.
Not going to lie you’ve quickly turned into one of the more enjoyable channels that randomly pop up on my feed
Rune Knight is my favourite subclass in all of 5e. There's so much flavour to go along with it being related to giants, runes, and all of their individual abilities.
Most subclasses focus on one gimmick and doing their thing well. Echo Knight having a clone, Eldritch having magic, Psi having their abilities. But Rune Knight has two different playstyle gimmicks between being able to go giant and being able to invoke runes at key moments for match changing moves.
I'm a player who generally prefers consistency over risking for higher numbers so the cloud rune not requiring a roll to work is my dream defensive ability. I also think the storm rune has a lot of roleplay potential where yes it mechanically lets you impose advantage or disadvantage wherever you choose but the flavour text says you do this by glimpsing the future, so your ability to do this is coming from maybe seeing a vision of the enemies attack and either anticipating their move or warning another player by yelling something to them. it could work really well if your character is considered some kind of seer.
the regular abilities of this subclass are so stacked that it has to actively nerf itself by making one of its level features just 'you grow 3d4 feet due to exposure from giant energy' this is hilarious because you could go from being the shortest of the party to the tallest.
Rune knights an incredible support though and has so many options for the reaction, casters love you being their friend with storm rune, forcing disadvantage on the enemies saves is lit. Plus hey prof mod forced rerolls with your aegis skill is lit.
Plus the Stone and Storm Rune can take out nearly every low level enemy for most part of the battle. :D ive frustrated my DM more then one time with these xD
@@Cpt.Str4ng3 oh i know, during this one halloween themed one shot our DM was hypin up this big villain who was kinda meant to be the vampire master's right hand monster. he approaches us and i used the stone rune and completely render him worthless as we slam him into the ground. this is why you give your big encounters minions.
it was such a massacre that i actually feel bad about ruining a villain he was excited for and i now restrain myself when it comes to the stone rune in single enemy encounters. plus i just prefer the flavour of the other runes now so i usually take stone last.
I agree. I am playing one right now and the Fire Rune is so much fun with a hand axe. And knowing Giant is very interesting.
@@logandurham2979 remember to activate your storm rune to give enemies disadvantage on that fire rune save all on the same turn!
Favorite combo is to ready action attack (trigger when an enemy attacks) as a battlemaster with disarming strike. Since disarming triggers with any weapon attack, all it takes is one thrown dagger to force the baddie to pathetically drop their sword or spell focus.
Your trigger would not work on a spell attack. It is not a weapon attack and thus cannot be used to force them to drop the focus. It wouldn't even work on a ranged attack because you would be targeting the arrow and not the bowman. Wording is key on these things.
@@Nempo13Yes, spells arent attacks
@@Nempo13 They didn't mention anything about a spell attack, and it would definitely work with a ranged attack. "When you hit a creature with a weapon attack, you can expend one superiority die to attempt to disarm the target, forcing it to drop one item of your choice that it’s holding." That applies to ranged attacks, thrown or otherwise. Wording is key on these things, isn't it?
I would love to see ranking videos like this for all the other classes and their related subclasses. Regardless of personal preference this is an amazing little educational piece for new players looking for advice in character creation, and more experienced players looking to branch out and diversify their characters.
I love how the tag of his beanie flows seamlessly with his eyebrow
Something I love about Rune Knight is that unlike Barbarian, it doesn't force you to go melee, all the bonus damage effects trigger on a 'weapon hit' not a 'melee weapon hit.'
I have a character that's a halfling Rune Knight and at first glance he seems like the typical small and shifty bowman, until he grows to 4 times his size and suddenly his longbow is the size of a person.
I used Eldritch Knight to make an Alice in Wonderland inspired character. I used variant human and took magic initiate Wizard as their feat with find familiar as one of their spells. Obviously a white rabbit is the shape I chose (yes you can do that if you keep the Icewind Dale module in mind, it expands the familiar list with the hare and fox). I mostly chose spells that help with her long sword and are good use for bonuses, extra actions and reactions. That’s one of my proudest creations I made for the fighter class
you need a Vorpal sword: snicker snack!
@@samuelbroad11 I have mentioned it to my dm since she is a back up character and they like the idea enough they will consider it. But if I don’t use her as a back up, I might use her for the module the blade actually comes from when we play that. Lots of time to consider! Lol actually finding that blade in the items list was exactly what gave me the thought to make an Alice inspired character
@@mentalrebllion1270 convince two other players to play tweedletwins!
@@samuelbroad11 I’ll be sure to help them if that becomes a thing. At the very least, have them be twins. How about twin bards? That’s a good class to represent them I think. 🤔
@@mentalrebllion1270 one warlock with fey patron, the other a bard, make sure they have enlarge reduce, polymorph and animate objects!
Arcane Archer: should be more like Battle Masters with a ton of arrow options, more uses, and a superiority die type system.
Battle Master: super cool! Definitely deserves S tier.
Cavalier: should really be split into 2 subclasses: 1 (let's call Guardian): all about defense, maybe include Captain America-style shield fighting; 2 (Cavaliers): all about mounted combat and it gets features similar to the spells Find Steed and Find Greater Steed (ex. at lv 18, your mount can be a CR 5 or lower dragon).
Champion: is nice, needs a bit more
Echo Knight: super cool! Though, the Echo could use more HP at later lvs.
Eldritch Knight: (a.k.a. Arcane Knight cause there’s nothing eldritch or warlock about them) is really good.
Psi Warrior: really good jedi subclass, but could use more force/psychic spell options like the Arcane Knight
Purple Dragon Knight: (a.k.a. Banneret) needs a big overhaul to make it better
Rune Knight: super cool!
Samurai: super cool!
The official short (and more importantly non-campaign setting specific) name for the Purple Dragon Knight is the Banneret.
@@watcher314159 Thanks, made the change.
Thank you, I feel like I’ve been singing the praises of Samurai into a void. The class is strong as hell
I absolutely ADORE the Purple Dragon Knight subclass. It felt REALLY good to play the one time I played it. Being able to do decent damage AND support the party at the same time is WAY too underrated.
I agree, it can even be a great character to add to the group if perhaps you're playing with an under-size party or perhaps one that leans a bit too heavily into one role that doesn't balance the combat (like a party of squishy casters so the DM has to add a warrior that can draw some of the aggro but let the players have fun blowing things up.
The abilities make them really great at shoring up weaknesses in an overly large group too, since they don't bog down actions in the turn order.
For any convenience
0:27 - Arcane Archers
2:34 - Battle Masters
4:20 - Cavalier
6:37 - Steinhardt Guide To the Eldritch Hunt (I also love this but right here 6:54 - 6:57)
7:43 - Champion
9:06 - Echo Knight
10:53 - Eldritch Knight
12:15 - Psi Warrior
13:45 - Purple Dragon Knight
15:58 - Rune Knight
17:29 - Samurai
re: Psi Warriors - couple points. Most of their abilities come with a 1/rest use or use again with dice, so their Psi Dice actually go a ways longer than you suggest, especially since you can recover 1/short rest. They also get to do a few things uncommon in D&D - Flat damage reduction, and moving allies & objects. And at higher levels, having basically 10 castings of telekinesis every day if they want to is pretty cool.
Rune Knights are my absolute favourite. The flavour of hulking out is too fun. I have had it change my characters looks for flavour, playing a triton that turned into a shark man when he grew.
one thing to mention about Rune Knight is that it's ability specifically says you grow to large/huge size, not that you grow one/two sizes larger.... that means if you are playing a small character like a Gnome, you still grow to large size when you activate Giant's Might.
and playing an 8 foot tall Gnome just sounds fun.
Be a warforged juggernaut, you START at 8 feet tall. Also rune knight has been rewritten 3 times, most places have it as growing one size category larger. for a juggy that has powerful build built into it...this means you effectively become size huge (with the damage increase due to your weapon growing in size) at level 3.
I spent a lot of time trying to figure out what fighter sub-class to add when my dual wielding Wild Magic barbarian hit level 9 (6 barb, 3 fighter), bouncing between Rune Knight and Battle Master. Ended up going with Battle Master using Riposte, Menacing Attack and Distracting Attack and against a horde of goblins/hobgoblins he was like a lawnmower in a flower garden. Couldn't tell if my DM was more frustrated at me or the T-Rex that the bard polymorphed into
One question, where did your bard see a t-rex in the wild? To polymorph or wild shape into something...the character has had to of seen it and know about it. Just because it is available in the book or list isn't enough.
Oversized weapon rules, which is something most tables should be playing with if your fighters are going big just to help them catch up with casters, really bumps Rune Knight up to S.
I think that even without the table rune knights deserve the s tier. At level 3 they are really close to battlemasters if you exclude oversized weapons, but at level 7 it just leaves battlemasters in the dust, only adding insult to injury at levels 10, 15 and 18.
Yeah fire rune is no joke for crowd control doing 4d6 of fire damage between the fighters turn and the enemies because you do damage first then they attempt the save all while incapacitated. This plus the initial damage from the attack plus of course hulking out means any big nasty is going to know they been kissed.
Another fun thing with the echo knight subclass is the ability to flavor your echo to however you want it to be. For example, you can create the echo to be a future timeline variant of your character (something a friend of mine does). There’s plenty of ways to have fun rp context with it as well, even leading to the echo having a mind of their own (it’s quite fun messing with an echo who can shapeshift into allies out of battle only).
PLEEAAAASE DO MORE LIKE THIS I LOVE THESE SO MUCH ITS GREAT TO HEAR YOUR OPINION ON THESE THINGS
Agreed. Dude has a nice vibe
"I cast gun". Best part of this video. That had me in stitches. Excellent tier list video! I always like seeing what peoples' opinion on these sorts of subclasses are!
Rune knight is an extremely versatile sub class that offers decent damage and the ability to have proficiency and advantage in a bunch of things.
Runeknight offers you four tries to shove or grapple with advantage and +13 athletics while large on lvl 6. I don't need versatiliy.
I need somebody to cast enlarge on me so I can push a Terrasque of a cliff. At lvl 6.
(you take a race with +2 strength, frost rune, giants might, and the skill expert feat for this. Or you play a Loxodon, you need lvl 8 to reach 20 strength, but now you can grapple 3 people at a time.)
Recently used giants might with potion of enlarge to grapple an ancient silver dragon mid flight and rode him into the ground. I love my Rune Knight.@@FinnMeier-n8r
Mixing 3 levels of cavalier with the Drakewarden of the ranger is really strong. Getting the mounted combatant feat is also really useful for this setup.
Really good ranking - the other advantage of the Echo Knight is that the echo is immune to all conditions, which means if you ever get poisoned you just perform all attacks from your echo and you ignore the poisoned condition. Very handy to avoid being locked down by poison creatures
I don't think that's true. It's not the echo making the attack. /You/ make the attack through the echo, so any condition on you would still apply. But that does lead to a (nonsensical imo) loophole where if you're hidden from the enemy, the attack through your very visible echo is still with advantage.
I'm agreeing with Melody on this. Echoes are effects, not second player-characters.
Beat thing about Eldtrich Knight is this: When a wizard runs our of spells there worse than a commoner, but when an eldritch knight runs out of spells they are still a fighter.
Worse than a commoner? Eh, what? Cantrips, mage armor, more hit points. Spells that you can just cast like cantrips at higher levels. I'm playing a bladesinger right now, and while definitely not as strong as an EK without spell slots, she could take out a lot of problems with no slots at all.
No offense, but your comment is classic "say you don't play 5e without saying you don't play 5e."
Maybe you played an older edition, when cantrips had limited uses?
@@timmartin6885Calm down.
@@Lardo137You too.
I recently played an echo knight and i think what pushes them above battle masters is the insane reach that you get for melee fighters. You can move your echo at any point during your turn, including the 15 ft spawning range this gives you 45 ft extra movement, allowing you to lock down a spellcaster so easily.
The Echo Knights Clone does not threaten and therefore has no business dealing AoOs.
Echo avatars intent is to only use it for scouting as stated by Jeremy Crawford. It’s like a familiar. They intend to fix it in future prints but you should t be allowed to attack through it at 1000ft away
Yeah everyone seems to miss this when reviewing echo knight.
Just because Jeremy Crawford said so doesn't mean you HAVE to play it that way.
RAW as written, you absolutely can attack and teleport through it.
In no printed book is it changed, thus, it is how it stays. Until they print new editions, a 5.5e for example, nope, Echo is as written. They can update the Beyond all they want. I don't know anyone that uses Beyond, people hate that level of nickel and dime crap. Paying per race to even USE it on Beyond's sheets is insane.
An eldritch knights works best if you mostly ignore any kind of attacking spell except for your cantrips for things like booming blade and green flame blade and focus on buffs and utility. Pair this with a decent con and Warcaster which is practically a must have, and it's almost impossible to remove your buffs by damaging you unless your opponent hits super hard. Absorb elements and shield are your level 1 bread and butter, but at higher levels enhance ability, blur and even fly become great utility for a fighter to have.
Love this video, definitely would love to see more Tier list for other subclasses in the future.
Great video, again. I'm fascinated with the battle master. Seems like the perfect subclass for the player who loves to create those great cinematic moments.
This was really fun and I would loooove to see one done for Paladin, love the content!
I love how honest with how you rank them you are. Some other channels would have put Cavalier in C and PDK in D tier because of the flavor aspect making you believe that the sub class is just dead weight while in reality you can actually have impact with.
The only one I kinda disagree with is Arcane archer, mainly because I played it a bunch and since multiclassing has been brought up in the video, I can confidently say that there are some very cool stuff you can do as an arcane archer with some multiclass shenanigans. Other than that pretty solid and well made tier list.
I feel like Psi Warrior’s Telekinetic Movement got glossed over. While it’s DM dependent it should bump it to low A tier.
What even there for the DM to be dependent about? Its a sound ability
@@WhyYouMadBoi it’s very open ended. Doesn’t specify what happens if you throw a large object and what damage die that will be. And maybe the DM rules you can’t use the ability to damage anyone.
Worst case scenario you can only move object and friendly creatures 30 ft. as an action with psi die.
Pretty bare bones if the DM isn’t lenient.
@@lukeamparo6586 Actually you can't throw objects only move them with Telekinetic movement. What you can do is have that large object over head of a enemy this is where you go to the DMG and look at the improvised damage chart. Which one it says "Hit by a falling bookcase" for 1d10 damage. Remember large objects take a 10x10 space. Animated large objects slam attack does 2d10+3 damage but they are obviously moving so taking away a d10 and modifiers.
Again "Bookcase" are pretty big and can be stated to be our large object. The only "Open ended" is the DM not reading the DMG
@@WhyYouMadBoi It’s also dependent on whether the DM puts objects in the battle area. If it’s barren you’ll probably spend all your psi die doing telekinetic thrust. Moving friends is nice but wish you could impose a save against enemies.
This is for below level 10 cause most campaigns it seems barely make it to lvl 18-20.
@@lukeamparo6586 Yeah this is a friend escape tool, as in if a ally is down pull them towards the cleric or if they need to escape and you can pull them out of a sticky situation. Or you know lifting someone up
Two things to say for the cavalier. One, there are a couple unmentioned abilities which are good for mounted combat: first - from the beginning - is how mounting only costs five feet of movement (aside from use with typical mounted combat, this can be awesome for mounting huge or larger creatures, like polymorphed giant apes or an allied dragon in the final fight) and second - later - there’s a charging ability which can be good on the ground but is definitely easier when mounted. Second, you can mark as many creatures as you attack per turn, rather than just one.
Haven't watched the video yet but I suspect this is going to come down to the Battle Master or Echo Knight (maybe Eldritch or Rune Knight but I see them less in these discussions), and I am 100% behind the Echo Knight, the versatility it offers is incredible, you can use it for exploration and get into areas you otherwise couldn't, and you can be a frontliner without having to be a frontliner with your echo attacking for you and absorbing at least one hit that could have hit you, and to boot the echo even has decent AC
echo knight does indeed offer exploration options that none of the fighters do. In my personal opinion battlemasters are a bit overrated tbh.
Imo battlemaster is considered so good because it is so good... at multiclassing. No one ever bothers to look at their progression after level 3. At level 3 they are at about the power level of a rune knight and slightly above that of an echo knight. At level 7 the rune knight comes ahead and the echo knight overtakes the battlemaster. At even higher levels, both echo knight and rune knight just embarrass the battlemaster.
I am also preaching rune knight a bit personally. If you read what the subclass offers in just runes it's already worth A-tier. That's without giants might and the other leveling feature. Those 2 are already enough to pump s tier, but there's a third part that's hidden to most people:
In the monster manual it states that "for creatures of a size larger than medium, weapon dice scale". For large this is twice the original dice, for huge 3 times etc.
It scales with weapons MADE TO FIT CREATURES OF THAT SIZE. Giant might explicitly states that you don't just become large, your gear grows with you. That means that while giant might is active, your greatsword deals 4d6 base damage. This singular effect from giants might makes the rune knight roughly equivalent to samurai, but with all the stuff I mentioned before it was already at S-tier level.
Like your long form videos very much. Your shorts are absolutely primo so a bigger bite of your insight and personality is kindly welcome! Keep up the amazing work my friend
Personally the gunslinger is really interesting story wise, also the hunting rifle is really strong,if you follow it up with hail of thorns from ranger it adds more damage
I have an Eldritch Knight which after 7th level I took 2 levels of war Magic Wizard. This allowed to use Arcane Deflection as a reaction giving me a +2 AC or +4 to a saving throw. After that if I choose I can use the EK War Magic feature to use a cantrip and make a Weapon attack as a bonus action. This give my character versatility and a bit of Battlefield Control depending on the Cantrips.
I built the same type of character. Question what level breakdown did you eventually go with and why?
Eldritch Knight can be very, very powerful, but it takes a lot of thought and preparation to unlock its full potential!
Personally, I love Eldritch Knights, but they are a little MAD and you're a bit restricted on the fighting styles you can take while still being good. However, the spellcasting does cover areas that fighters tend to struggle with, such as big crowds and enemies with ridiculously high AC. Plus, if your DM is evil and doesn't give you any magic weapons, they have cantrips for magical damage if they need it
I adored my Elderic Knight. Chilska was marvelous and I dis make her int work. Went with a reach weapon and shatter was her best ability.
Her ability to call her weapon too her got the group out of enemy territory (that was so fucking stupid that entire thing. Swallowed the ring of winter, fought off a bunch of Yuanti basically naked, stopped a ritual, yea fun times) if she hadn't been able to do that it would have ended up much worse I think.
I second this. I just picked up eldritch knight cuz I wanted a returning weapon. Yet when I got down to mechanics of them, my hair brain, overthinking self just went ham.
Currently level 7 and it's been a blast. My build's high int, which isn't optimized, but with good tactics, I'm easily the highest damager in my team.
Cant wait for vids on the rest of the classes, saves me spending hours reading all the subclasses to learn what they do and whats good
My group has a paladin/rune knight and when when she enlarges, if it's not big enough, I cast enlarge on her and our DM allows it since they're 2 different sources worded differently. It's fun stuff.
Something you are probably not doing atm but that does work: dmg 278 says: "big monsters usually wield oversized weapons that deal extra dice of damage on a hit. Double the weapon size if a creature is large, triple if the creature is huge and quadruple if the creature is gargantuan". A weapons dice scale with 'weapons made for that creature size', and since both enlarge and giant might grow the weapon with you, that means that the paladin rune knight deals 3 times the original dice, so for example 6d6 on a greatsword.
In my opinion even besides this feature rune knights deserve S-tier imo, but with this interaction they are the undeniable kings of S-tier. To bad that he missed this interaction like so many others.
@@Olav_Hansen my group doesn't do that simply because enlarge and the tune knight feature both have damage increases of their own, but we did consider it.
I'v just finished watching all of the dungeon dudes ranking of the subclasses and enjoyed that series and looking forward to this one.
Personally I would have put Eldritch Knight at A Tier because of the utility it has, especially if you combine it with Stryxhaven Background and Magic Initiate Feat.
That was a really good video. I would love to see more of these for each class
Goliath barbarian battlemaster is some of the most fun I've had playing dnd. So many ways to kill, it's a guaranteed thrill, to end fools.
That sounds like a fantastic character.
Can't wait for the next one! Also, something similar for the multiclass options (they are many...) would be amazing
I would like to see one of these for my favorite class, Sorcerer
One thing people forget about battlemaster fighter is that most of the maneuvers don’t specify melee, and Menacing Attack + Hand Crossbow + xBow master feat results in so many attacks per round to nuke things down while also preventing them from moving closer to you. Add sharpshooter and that’s so much damage with Precision Attack guaranteeing hits.
Rune knight is an amazing tank character especially with heavy armorer master. Say the enemy hits for 14 damage with the hill rune it goes down to 7 and with heavy armor master it's only 4 damage. Especially with the new Goliath I can tank so many hits that would've one shot any of my teammates.
I loved the whole bit of you doing a commercial in the middle. It was so funny.
I agree with everything on the list except for Arcane Archer. I agree that they don’t get that many shots but I think it should bump up to B because Grasping Arrow, the best arcane shot, requires no saving throw and is a free lockdown or free damage depending on what the enemy does.
I thought aa deserved B as well. I might also bump eldritch knight to an A (shield+familiar is really good, and war caster is just amazing together with ek).
But the single biggest mistake in my opinion is that the rune knight isn't at the top of S tier. It has so many 'obvious' abilities that already make it deserve S tier, but there's also 1 "hidden" feature that most people miss. Giant might, making you large, also makes your weapons large. Sounds logical, but a rule that many people forget is that a size increase means a dice increase. From medium to large the dice of the weapon become 2x, and at huge 3x (at gargantuan 4x but even you don't get that big). This means that just taking 18 levels in fighter means that you suddenly deal 6d6 with that greatsword when you use giant might. Then second turn use the rune giving you physical resist and you can most likely single handedly take down a terrasque.
The size rules are so strong, that gwm isn't even worth it anymore for you. This means that you can prioritise getting 20's and the tough feat, enabling you to put even barbarians to shame as melee monsters. With 6d6+5, you deal an average of 26 damage per hit without using any additional resources (and accounting for the giant might d10)
That is 1 small ability that is surrounded by the other mediocre shots. It also does mainly poison damage which is the worst damage in the game. If that enemy is ever engaged with someone in melee the extra slashing damage doesn't do anything.
So really its niche but strong.
@@Olav_Hansen That is at 18th level, near the end of the game, compare that with the at will when you get it Echo knight who gets a free 30 ft to 60 ft teleport. Able to negate 1 or more attacks, scouting and of course battlefield control from 2 places at once to 3 places at once allowing you to engage many enemies.
I do agree that Rune knight should replace Battle Master although I believe battle master is low S if not A rank with samurai.
Honestly one of the best parts of the video was the Garo reference when talking about Champion fighters. It's such a niche series despite being so rich in terms of themes and visuals.
I have a cavalier bear totem with mounted combatant feat.
He's tanky AF.
What is his mount?
I had a player who played a Goblin Champion and the Goblin was getting choked by a Dragonborn. At DISADVANTAGE, the goblin got a 19, which critted the DB and knocking him out
I gotta say, in terms of damage I’d put Rune Knight Fighter in Low S Tier but only if you follow RAI Oversized Weapons. When you grow your weapon would grow as well, in which case that Greataxe becomes 2d12 at large, 3d12 at Huge. This isn’t including anything else, making your damage output a near equivalent to Sharpshooter Samurai
Come on man those are clearly rules in the DMG intended only for NPC monsters. If it was intended for Rune Knights to be given enormous damage boosts while enlarged it would have been listed in the sub class rules. 1d6 or 1d8 extra damage on one attack is all you get.
@@nicholaswalker2278 Actually not really, per the rules players are monsters. While I get what you mean it’s widely accepted that this can and does apply to characters. Plus every game is game by game basis so it’s up to you and your dm to decide if it’s fine to do. My DM allows it and I as a DM allow it
Edit: Also this isn’t just for Rune Knight, any way you grow as long as your weapons grow you should be allowed this damage increase. Technically a player can pick up the weapons a oversized monster uses but you would likely have disadvantage because it’s not sized for you.
Why does it need to be as good with damage, rune knight is the strongest subclass in my opinion since it's the tankiest and arguably has the strongest/flexible abilities.
@@Ingimar16 I’m unaware of claiming it needs to be, as far as I and the people I play with are concerned, and as far as RAI Rune Knight has a higher Dmg output that stated in the video. That’s all that was being said. It’s not a debate or a flag being planted it’s just an observation
I'd love to see what you and the Council think about the Bard, and their best possible races, colleges, and multiclasses. Example: my Hellfire Tiefling College of Whispers HexBard. Gets Darkness as a free spell at lvl 5 from the race, and Devil's Sight at lvl 2 Warlock. Can now snipe with a crossbow at advantage from anywhere, dump Psychic Blade damage into every hit, and every attack is at disadvantage. Pick up a couple levels of Rogue to get that sweet sweet Sneak Attack damage as well.
I can't believe how low Eldritch Knight got placed . It's highly underated
Personally I think they're awful, only slightly better than PDK Fighter
@@pyron5277 nah spells are the best feature in the game and Ek gets some really good ones. It's in the top of not the best subclass
@@4500danny I mean yeah spells are good but EK gets so pitifully few of them that it's kind of not worth it compared to most other subclasses
Starting with 3 levels of Eldritch Knight is the most versatile of the fighter sub-classes. Dex based, 3 level dip before maining any of the full casters or rogue, 3 level dip into any full caster for spell slots as a fighter main, Str based, 3 level dip before maining Paladin (especially with a 1 level dip into a charisma caster).
Eldritch Knight multiclass builds were the original martial spellcasters before it was trendy. Still the best.
6:30 I would’ve ranked Cavalier F tier if the subclass only provided mounted bonuses. It would absolutely be the worst subclass I’ve ever imagined.
Hahaha! I’m totally going to yell “MENACING ATTACK!” As I use that maneuver. Then if they make the save I yell, “HOW DID YOU DODGE MY ATTACK??” 🤯
😖😠😡🤬😡
😤 No matter. You will never be able to dodge my next one!😏 Then laugh maniacally!
5:36 one of the best fight scenes! I freaking love Gangsta. This video is GOATed
Worth noting: psi warriors get psi dice equal to twice prof, which scales with character level, which means that if you multiclass 3 levels into them, they still get better as you level up, a 17 paladin 3 psi warrior has 12d6s worth of psi dice! Definitely a nice multiclass subclass
One of the saddest things in DnD 5e is that the Cavalier's main feature "Unwavering Mark" requires being within 5ft of the enemy which would cause disadvantage on any attacks from a player wielding a lance. Maybe I'm wrong, but being warrior, on a horse, with lance is the image that comes to my mind when I think cavalier, and it's almost unworkable with this subclass. 😮💨
I dont think the Lance is actually meant to be the mainstay weapon of choice though. I think this is more geared towards the Longsword + Board type of Knight. So maybe You charge in with a pair of Lances, pop off your first turns two attacks, then drop them and switch to sword n board once engaged?
@@cyanide7270 That's fair enough. That strategy does put in mind that maybe DnD is doing Lances wrong. Lances are supposed to be the ultimate weapon of the charge then shatter on impact. Maybe WotC should have upped the damage dice(not that d12 is bad dice), but trade off is that a successful hit breaks the weapon. Dropping 10gp for say 3d8+Str wouldn't be worth it when PC's are low level and fighting goblins, but when the PC's are flush with cash and fighting dragons at later levels... Could be worth?
I’m rollin a Rune Knight in Ravenloft right now. He’s a total blast! I love getting to help others out using my runes while totally tanking for the party.
Eldritch Knight is definitely A tier. A fighter that self buffs is amazing on the battlefield. I am gona say that if you are relying on offensive spells and the spell DC, you are doing Eldritch Knight wrong.
Any tips on how to run a low int EK?
Currently playing and loving a high int one, mostly cuz I'm also running telekinetic feat, but I've been hearing a lot that you can run a low int EK and do better.
Indeed, EK is amazing, but many people fail to understand that it is best played as a tank, using most of its spells to enhance defense, instead of chugging fireballs from the frontline.
@@VaregianEisselor true. Shield, absorb elements and blade ward + war magic makes my EK almost unkillable lol.
EK is an ok fighter, but a suboptimal gish :)
@@thetruegavinator Just don't use spells that have a Spell Attack Roll or Saving Throw.
Booming and Green Flame Blade for example are fine, as you are doing weapon attacks. But it does fall off somewhat on later levels, given just how many attacks you can get with 1 attack action.
6:55 lol, he didn't even cut out his genuine reaction. Almost made me fall out of my chair. 🤣🤣
I wouldn't mind seeing you do this for all the classes. I like seeing lists, its all great fun.
I recently tried playing Fighter for the first time. I took Battlemaster for my subclass and my god, it was so fun. I enjoyed being able to do things to either boost my DPR, reduce incoming damage, or do things like knock enemies prone (without a save I might add)
My main disagreement would be Samurai. I think the feature in isolation is a neat combo with the GWM or Sharpshooter ability, but the problem is number of uses as well as the requirement of a bonus action to activate. With 3 uses per long rest, it's about the number of uses of a 1/short rest feature. Battlemaster can basically replicate the same to hit bonus by just spamming precision attack, which they get 4 uses of per short rest at level 3 (and that stacks with actual advantage for even more accuracy since getting advantage is easier than bonus to atk roll). It does eventually refresh per initiative, making it eventually a 1/battle ability. It's still not that frequent, you don't really have that much control over when to spend your overall uses like that, and advantage isn't that hard to get with other sources. And then Fighting Spirit eats your bonus action, removing synergy with stuff like polearm master or other abilities that are bonus action related. Rapid strike also isn't that good with this combo as you lose the accuracy bonus needed to make the lost accuracy worth while for the extra attack. It's capstone is also very circumstantial and not under the player's control.
Consider a comparison with Vengeance Paladin. 1/short rest advantage on all attacks against one target. Spell slots to pile on more damage as well as continued advantage round after round if your nova target isn't dead on your first turn. This can even be combined with a fighter dip for action surge to nova 2 electric boogaloo. Once Samurai finishes it's tiny usages of it's advantage (and you don't really want to spend it when action surge isn't available, making it close to a 1/short rest ability), they kind of have nothing going on. They no longer have a way to boost accuracy for their feat, so they struggle to use it and are just limp wristed and spent the rest of the fight.
Main thing is, as an engine for nova damage, as a source of advantage, and as a GWM/Sharpshooter build, it's not the best. It's fine, but even it's main combo isn't that spectacular. That doesn't seem S worthy at all.
I'd also say I think Rune knight is fine being lower than Echo and Battlemaster, but in no way is it worse than Samurai. It has a ton of frequently available utility. It gets pretty potent defensive options later, making it beefy near on par with a barbarian. Then it's an insane grappler. It's got one of the only ways to get huge without dipping into spellcasting or getting allied help and it turbocharges your grapple checks too. It's only real downfall is that it can't use it's utility in big bursts since they are short rest refresh and a lot compete for bonus action usage.
Rune knight beats Samurai easily. Go large, Use one attack on shove to get enemy prone, and all rest of your attacks also has advantage. Except now enemy is prone and your friends can also pummel them to the ground. Or you can also use Fire chains to keep the pain train going. Sure beats Samurai combo.
@@Mithguar Not just that, it's easy to get infinite advantage with just 2 level dip in Barbarian for reckless attack. Usually a slightly risky move due to the damage taken, but both Echo Knight and Rune Knight can handle it. Echo by using their echo as the fodder and Rune Knight with damage resistance. By alternating Rage and Hill Rune you can have damage resistance and advantage on all attacks most combats. That kinda beats the Samurai at their own game other that slightly delayed extra extra attacks.
Agree, I love that RK isn't a burst damage dealer, burst is so bad for combat!
If you're a DM now you're forced balancing the enemy not dying in 1 round because that's boring or if it takes more then 1/2 rounds the burst classes have used up all their abilities and can't do cool stuff for the rest if the fight.
RK is the perfect balance which makes longer fights (3+ rounds) enjoyable.
The fight sences in the background where all so hype when you first saw them!!