Why American Subways Are Some Of The World’s Most Expensive
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- Опубліковано 31 тра 2024
- Public transit can be extremely valuable for a city’s economy - in New York City 85% of the people who travel into the business district below 61st Street take some form of public transportation. In several major cities - New York, Boston, Washington, D.C., and San Francisco - the subway and other rapid rail systems are key contributors to the prosperity of the city. In NYC for example, more than $37 billion of the Metropolitan Transportation Authority’s $54 billion budget goes to subways. But building subways in the U.S. is very expensive. In fact, it’s the sixth most expensive country to build rail transit in the world. And even that is likely an understatement. High labor costs, overbuilt tracks and stations, and onerous regulations all jack up costs. NYC’s sheer population density makes it rather worth it - so many people ride the subway that the cost per rider is comparable to many European cities where total expenditures are substantially lower. However, the high costs hurt the case for public transit in less dense areas of the country. Lowering those costs could go a long way toward building affordable and accessible public transit for smaller cities around the country and reducing traffic congestion, pollution and traffic accidents.
Chapters:
00:00 - Introduction
01:39 - Second Avenue Subway
06:45 - A national problem
08:37 - Subway costs
15:31 - Solutions
Producer: Robert Ferris
Senior Managing Producer: Tala Hadavi
Edited by: Darren Geeter
Animation: Jason Reginato, Alexander Wood, Alex Kuzoian
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Why American Subways Are Some Of The World’s Most Expensive
The same people who complain about traffic will reject any effort to improve public transportation. Remember folks, you're not stuck in traffic, you are the traffic.
Lol
Meanwhile on the oppostie side of the world is Shanghai Metro- 500 miles of track and about 400 stations- most with glass platform doors. Their is also free wifi and 5g network.
On MTAs metro station in canal st NYC. There is a stair that leads down to the platform. If you fall down the stairs you could plunge into the tracks, their solution? They put a metal bar that prevents you from falling into the tracks. This metal bar only covers the width of the stairs.
If you envy a communist country so much with very limited individual liberty then by all means go live there!!
The US really needs to hire more French, Spanish, and East Asian consultants to help with these projects. The US needs good foreign help in developing these projects efficiently.
Especially the Japanese. They know how to build a damn good public transportation system.
Even if they fix the New york subway, ill avoid it because of riding with New yorkers.
Corrupt unions, mob kickbacks, greasy politicians
No matter where one builds, building subways specifically is very complex and very expensive. The Europeans and Japanese committed to transit financially and politically midway through the Twentieth Century. Here in the US, even before WW2 we committed to building freeways and highways due to the lobby of the big 3 automakers
Nope, what the government needs to do is apologize to the original architects of this nation being the former slave population (Freedmen/indigenous Black Americans, the Juneteenth heritage community), go into the inner cities to actively recruit and retrain U.S. freed slaves. We do NOT need anymore imperialists over here whose nation groups owe colonial damages in several other countries already, getting double the economic benefit and then taking U.S. citizen dollars to pump back into their nation's economies! Stop the avoidance!
Ive lived in the States for 4 years for college, it has by far the Worst public transit especially subway system in the developed world. While Japan, South Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore, etc got the best, cleanest, high tech systems in the world. And US always give reasons for not being the best
The US "public" transportation system materialized at the same time as Europe. Most of it was actually privately owned/managed. Even here in Southern California, trains, trams and buses were everywhere. After WW2, with the booming economy and urban sprawl, the "individualistic" car culture became more popular. GM also helped the demise of public transportation by buying them and slowly cutting their service.
@@dezafinado Yeah things fell to pieces when it was stolen by the government, what a surprise. Look at Japan, most of their systems are private.
@@dezafinado -- Well, both in Pittsburgh & DC, the private company was taken over by a government owned system. A fun thing was that in the process of going down, the private systems asked for a little help such as increased police protection which was denied.
@@dezafinado It didn't just "become" more popular. Car industry lobbied in order to get expensive car infrastructure done, while also buying public transport companies and disbanding them. You're talking like car culture is a natural phenomenon.
@@erikhartog5340 I don't think you read my post completely, where I mentioned GM's role in the demise of public transportation. As for individualism, you'll have hard time convincing a teenager old enough to drive that public transit is cool.
Having lived in Germany where public transit infrastructure is very good, most people still have cars. All of my colleagues have cars. They just have fewer cars per family. Two age groups that have low car ownership: teenage to college students and lower-class workers/retirees who can't afford to own a car. Public transit isn't cheap. It costs more for my co-worker (and spouse, 2 kids) to take the train from Munich to Hamburg (and back) than to drive their car. The German railway system earns only half of its revenue from ridership, the rest from cargo/logistics services. Public transit is much more complicated to sustain than most people think. Without public subsidies (tax), it is very expensive.
The #1 problem Americans have with spending money on infrastructure is efficiency. When we can watch an above ground road project take years and we never see more than five people working at a time we think to ourselves "why should we pay for them to stand around while we have to work our butts off 40+ hours a week?".
There's also the classic *one person in a hole digging while five people standing around watching*. We know the construction company owners are friends with the politicians who granted the contracts and there's zero accountability taking place. I've never even heard the most hardcore Republicans say "we don't need more bridges, roads or subways". They just don't want taken advantage of.
Nope usa too much focused on flights and cars and roads see the results
The youtube channel "practical engineering" has a video dedicated to this, along with frequent mentions of time & cost concerns when covering various construction methods.
A big reason to stand around doing nothing is letting the dirt settle before you build on it so you stuff doesn't get destroyed when the ground under it settles unevenly.
A reason to stand around "doing nothing" are invisble jobs like being a safety watch where its you job to sit down and pay attention to something dangerous like hot work. Not to mention when engineers, formen, and the client are having a conversation about something it looks identical to a group slacking off as you pass by at 30+mph in your car. Also humans aren't robots and require frequent breaks to maintain productivity.
And finally you have supply chain issues and waiting on others to finish. (Some of this is avoidable, some of this isn't)
PS: every job is atleast a 2man job for safety reasons (line of sight/ shouting range) because if you have an accident (pinch points, arc flash/blast, slips & falls, ect) having someone around to render aid or at minimum call 911 is the difference between life and death. (Being a "lifeguard" is a job even if it just looks like sitting)
Most folks seem to forget that back in the 70s, the Netherlands used to be rather car dependent until they realized the unsustainability of getting everywhere by car. Nowadays, they have some of the best public transit and bike routes in the world. The safety of their roads, even those that are frequented by cars, are very safe as well.
Edit: Wait where did all these likes and comments come from? I thought it would get completely buried lol
Edit 2: I would also like to bring attention to Salt Lake City, Utah. Although they are far from perfect, they have a surprisingly robust light rail system and seemingly much better walkability than most cities in North America. I’ve never been there myself so I cannot speak from personal experience.
Edit 3: I understand that comparing one of the largest nations in the world to the tiny little Netherlands isn’t the fairest comparison, but surely we could apply some of their lessons to a smaller scale. Say, the California Bay Area for instance! Lot’s of flat land, mild climate, access to plenty of sea routes, verrry economically powerful, etc. Heck the Netherlands is actually over 9,000 sq miles (or over 23,300 sq kilometers) larger!
San Jose alone could be improved massively with better zoning and more support for walkability and alternative transit options. I’d know because I live in the Bay Area, for better or for worse lol.
Most folks forget the US is 1000x bigger than European nations. I live 30 minutes from work. If I had to take a bus it would take hours and expose me to crazy people.
go move there...
I agree and it would be nice to have their level of public tranit. The problem we have in the US is that it’s generally not safe. For whatever reason bus and tram stations here are a hotbed for drug addicts, mentally ill, homeless people, etc.
I rode the trolley in San Diego last month because i too like the idea of public transit. Every five seconds someone is yelling obscenities, balled over in the fetal position because theyre high as can be, and sprinkled amongst these people are the ones who have no choice but to ride the tram.
The fist problem we need to solve is how to keep the systems clean and safe. Then people will trust public transit
I would love to know how the dutch solved homelessness, drug use, and crime. That place is a genuine utopia.
@@brucenassar9077 Okay, but only as long as you stay in the US, okay?
Believe me, as a Dutch I know you will be much happier in your trailer near a garbage dump. And getting rid of garbage won't be any problem.
Public transportation needs to be safe, reliable, and affordable in order for people to use it. Otherwise, people will keep using cars
You forgot fast
I would say accessible is also important.
I can't imagine anyone prefering LA Traffic Jam to a working Subway or Train. But i am not from the US, so i am probably wrong.
@@smurfo-pax4423 for Americans time is money, and in 2023 commutes are 33% longer in NYC then they are in Los Angeles mostly due to public transportation
You can't convince a good amount of Americans that being car dependent isn't a good thing. They think it's "freedom". I've never seen a general public so stuck in their ways without any good solutions.
A big problem with this video is that it doesn't compare the cost per number of user over the lifetime of the rail to ROADS.
Absolutely no one addresses the ENORMOUS cost of maintaining road infrastructure, which, especially in big cities, tends to be INCREDIBLY, inefficient. Because of this rail often doesn't get the relatively meager funding it needs to maintain itself and costs balloon as things just break down
Where do you get the idea that rail maintenance is a low cost operation.
Yeah, they could also just get rid of highways and build rail lines instead. That would be cheaper.
@@PhilippBlum --Well, sport, you still need road (and transport means) from the railheads to the individual consumers. Moreover, when problems happen on the rails, it's the roads where the rescue usually comes.
Everything that gets to your local grocery store gets there by truck. A rail network is more costly than any highway network.
The video admits subways are more expensive than roads, but are far more efficient so it's worth it in high density places.
Half of these costs are in politician's pockets.
They just cant say it directly.
Union’s contract too
@@bigzclipz5104 This is the main problem
Are there articles and such on this? I want to look more into stuff like this, so could you link a source or something to this claim?
@@nickoli0101 nobody's brave enough to dig into political corruption. Something bad will eventually happen to them.
Trump campaigned on this slogan, drain the swamp. But once he went in, he became one of them.
@@bigzclipz5104 was gonna say, unions bloat their contracts & politicians don't really have a choice.
I think what should be highlighted is that even highway projects go over budget but no one bats an eye...
People complain about anything and everything going over budget. Maybe not to the extent that people do about rail or other public transport projects, sure. Roads are also used by almost everyone at least at some point. Roads also are used by alot of trucks with cargo which everyone is reliant on. Subways not so much.
As was pointed out there can be friction or complaining from people in upstate New York who feel like they have to fund rail projects they'll never use. People in the city that use the Subway may not use the roads like upstate New Yorkers, but people in the city still buy goods that are often transported via roads.
@@chickenfishhybrid44 this can help improve the economy and bring in more tax value to the state which can then also be invested into upstate New Yorks roads.
@@chickenfishhybrid44 Car dependency is one of those things Americans just truly are dense on.
@@chickenfishhybrid44 Roads are used by everyone because they don't have other choices for transport lmao, your survival depends on a car lmao, you'll be surprised how many people actually go out in places that have eliminated roads and turned it into pedestrianized areas, zoning laws are also ass.
Thats because transit projects get delayed or overbudget a lot higher than highways
There are over 25 million residents in Shanghai and their subway system moves over 10 - 15 million people per day. New York seems small in comparison
New York moves more than 7 million people per day so not that much of a difference. Not to mention NY only has a bit more than 8 million residents.
@@dmcr9525 You are being disingenous, that was just the highest single-day ridership established in October 29, 2015 never to be repeated again. The actual ridership is about 2.4 million a day. Perhaps you were hoping thatpeople will be amazed by your figure and won' fact check it. When you do your research, actually read the items and don't just use the highest figure you can find.
@@dmcr9525 you wrong
@@rap3208 First of all it is not that serious because you dont know what you are talking about. Second of all you are using 2021 numbers. I used to work for NYCT's forum and those numbers you see online are not accurate at all. This is 2023. You are using numbers from the pandemic era. And what I actually did was combine bus and subway with effortless thought because when I worked there both divisions were combined for passenger numbers. They were slightly higher in 2022, and I am going off 2023 numbers at the current point before the year is even over. And yes it will get back to pre pandemic levels overall one day. Who are you to day it wont we they are already at 65% of the level? A 35% increase is inevitable genius. Especially with second Avenue Subway and the BQX line still yet to come. I still work in the industry and now work for another agency so I keep a close watch on the number and actually do know what I am talking about. Do some REAL research, not just a Google search before you come to fact check my information. Good day.
@@dmcr9525Sadly US is 2 decades behind of china in building infrastructure, also china has overtaken US and West in 37 out of 44key emerging technologies 😢
At 1:39, what the NY MTA president said is false. There are plenty of subway projects in Europe and Asia that are just as complicated, or more complicated than NY 2nd Ave subway. The NY projects still costs 4 to 6 times higher per mile or km.
His job is to lie to American taxpayers.... Not to build a world class system.
UK has been as expensive as NYC but Spain certainly knows how to build for cheap
It’s gaslighting
I also think the argument that NYC is complex due to a lot of things being underground is rather strange. Here in a lot of places in Europe you can't dig 2 meters without finding some ancient Roman structures that need to need to be inspected by archeologists. It's one of the reasons the Neapolitan and Roman subway took so long to built.
@@jonkoops I think nowadays with the tunnel boring machine. It is relatively easy to make tunnel 20 to 30 meters below ground, thus bypassing all the possible man-made items or obstacles.
But Yea, N.Y. or USA subway cost is just insane, no matter how u analyze it.
Subways are not more efficient here than they are in Europe and in the United States it is common practice for the officials and contracted Crews to be pocketing more money then what is actually needed to do the job. That's why it's more expensive here than anywhere else
Sources?
@@pickelkilla Seeing workers sleeping on the job at MTA and rampant overtime fraud.
@@pickelkilla His source is "Just trust me bro."
Never believe someone on the internet about such complicated topics as civil infrastructure.
yeah then blame China India for co2 emissions
@@birdstwin1186 In terms of pocketing money they are correct the MTA / LIRR has had multiple cases for overtime fraud including federal charges. The contractor 3TC for the MTA just trying to reneg on their agreement to pave the streets for one project and attempt to pocket $70K the MTA paid them.
Excellent analytics as always. Good to see the majority of infrastructure package goes into public transport and not into highways as it used to be.
Well I've seen a ton of money going into projects but so many are poorly managed or have so many issues that... Signing it alone ssn't enough for me to get my hopes up.
I hope I am wrong but watch the money just been squandered like usual.
The one good thing about governments like China? The CCP doesn't care about your house.
So your house has been in your family for generations and grandma use to bake cookies for ya during the summer and your first kiss was just at McQuaids Diner with Amber... It needs to get torn down for some infrastructure for the good of the people and Uncle Sam will pay 10% above market price and not a penny more! That is how politicians should be about it.
Major cities like NYC need a public transportation system. It's illogical to apply that logic to the rest of the country when our cities are just so different to each other. For example, Phoenix AZ makes no sense because the cost per passenger would be so extremely high since the entire city was built flat essentially and not vertically like NYC.
@@noahstuart3025 building public transit in Phoenix will cause the land values by the lines and stops to increase and value so you build dense mixed used development projects around those transit stops.
Highways are public transit. The problem is people in the big cities dont understand the people in towns and villages and vice verse. What works and has to work in New York city and other majors does not work in cities and towns with populations under 150,000 people. In Dayton Ohio our city buses very seldom get used yet they drive around empty, makes very little sense for environment and cost
@@toddweaver2704 Its not that they can't work, it's that the cities are so sprawled out and designed around the car that other transportation modes can't really work. A good middle ground can be found.
i know a guy who worked for a contractor. got sent to ny city to do 3 days work . fri , sat sun. got paid 6k because of the wage rules there. it's that kind of thing all up and down the entire chain including management and outside consultants etc. everyone involved has there hand out .
6K for 3 days work?
Pretty sure that's more than an MD makes per week.
do not be stupid. the main issue is american elites and government spend money on wars and stealing money and make up excuses like this stupid video to brainwash the masses...who controls the media? how do they have money to send to Ukraine and never ending wars but never have money for healthcare or education or public transportation and the list goes on and on......
Our train network sucks... China built a national high speed rail network in 7 years. It will take us 700 years to do the same thing.
Didn't have to be this way. But this is what Americans get for being asleep at the wheel of their own country for so long and shoving politics into the "can't talk about this in polite company" box.
China started planning for that in the 1990s 1988 is when they started planning their HSR. The build out if after approval
There is not necessarily a need for high speed network. Making the existing network up to date and targeted increase on that network will do fine. The Chinese have built some of the bullet trains which are loss-making as there was no need for such in that zone. High-speed trains are very good for two business hubs. Not to distant desert or places where normal freight rail can suffice.
Does this guy not think other cities have things below ground? European cities have the potential of hitting archeologically significant ruins every time they dig. And every city has sewers, water, and power underground. Get out of New York for once in your life, dude.
This was a pretty solid video though. I think they hit most of the issues on this problem.
I saw that also. Super weird and strange excuse for the high costs. 🤔
It's the excuse that most members of the American public believe for New York's high construction costs even though it actually doesn't make sense
From other things ive read/heard/been told about with inspection and infrastructure, the US is pretty abysmal relative to a lot of Europe at actually keeping records or plan for a lot of stuff that's underground+an issue the video mentions of refusing to use standards, meaning you have to get more money and manpower towards it to make sure you wont accidentally explode a sewer, i didn't get the impression he was complaining it was only a problem in NY but to him its probably the perfect example of his exasperations
@@Brian-tn4cd There's oodles of undocumented infrastructure below Manhattan. I've looked at track maps of subway tunnels (not route maps, but actual tracks, switches, interchanges/junctions, etc) and parts of the island resemble swiss cheese below ground.
One proposal to connect the PATH subway to the Lexington Ave line (east side IRT) went nowhere in part because there were too many crisscrossing tunnels on too many different levels to thread another one through from the WTC complex to the Brooklyn Bridge terminus (the trains are similar in dimensions, but institutional barriers (PANYNJ vs MTA) were the real deal-breaker.
@@keikoyoshikawa9316 they did, and the point still stands that US construction is slower and more expensive than Asia's or Europe. Paris is one of the most densest cities in the cities in the world and they still manage better avoiding their catacombs
Brazil has beautiful subways. You could eat off the marble floors, they are so clean. The trains are spotless too, no graffiti. Why? Because they are so beautiful that the people are very proud of them and so they take care of them, they don't litter, no gum on the ground or under a seat. Walking down the stairs from the street to the subway in Sao Paulo, was an amazing experience. New York & London don't compare to Brazilian subways - Sao Paulo (the 4th most populous city in the world) and Rio de Janeiro, beautiful subways.
Yes but brazil is a shithole where you will get robbed in no time
I haven't seen many subways (I can recall Prague, Seoul and NY), but one below Manhattan is super ugly and very old, it feels like it was build 120 years ago (which is likely true) using only conrete, i-beams and white tiles with some pig iron columns perhaps. And then it never seen any kind of maintenance. Well, fluorescent or LED lights are not from 1900, so there are some exceptions. But ceiling is basically dark cave with I-beams, cables, pipes, air ducts ... sometimes ceiling is concrete with some protective paint which is peeling off etc.
Well, that's all very nice. But it's easy for a failing government to make ONE thing look good.
@@pavelperina7629 -- For a time in lived in New York in the "village" and commuted to a job in NJ. From my sublet I would take the subway to the Port Authority and take a bus to my work. There were only about 10 passengers on the bus but otherwise it would have been a dead head. Yeah, the stations were old but there were FOUR tracks. If you look a "local" the stations were only a few blocks apart if you consider that the stations typically were about a block long. I only took the express train on weekends and the local stations seemed to fly by.
Personally, I feel that America needs to move on from the 1950s idealistic “build more highways” approach and catch up with European and Asian countries by focusing and investing more on both urban and intercity rail transit.
Ah yes the "tack everything on to 1950s culture because that decade is the most backwards in every regard relating to modern society." Grow up. Eu and Asian countries are smaller and more dense, making rail projects more desirable. You simply do not understand the distance between US cities, and you don't take into account population density of areas such as the midwest. Massive countries should not build rail as the population isnt there, only if you have 1 billion citizens like China and you have a massive country does it make sense.
I agree 100%! I lived in Chiba prefecture Japan for 6 years (98/99 2005-2010) , it's about 12 minutes from Tokyo station on the local JR Leito line. I got to not only get around Tokyo on aboveground train, underground metro but also private train in some parts of the city. I also got to see the country by shinkansen. Never had to or needed to drive a car and yes, I did have to carry drum gear with me from time to time going to gigs and shows. I also rode the metro or train in Cairo Egypt, in Bangkok Thailand, in Seoul S. Korea, in Madrid Spain and in Medellín Colombia... Get with it America
No, we're a car country. Invest more in highways!
A better case can be made for building more & more highways. The population has more than doubled since the present Interstate highway system was laid out. Moreover, proportionally more Americans own and drive cars. At the minimum an entire NEW interstate system (perhaps with a new name just was the present interstate system had different names from the old federal highways (I-95 v. US-1) would be built. Entirely NEW routes rather than just adding lanes to existing highways. The new system would have more tunnels and bridges to establish more direct routes, as an example.
Regardless of what happens with EV, Telsa has laid the groundwork for self-driving cars for the people. Perhaps the new highways would be exclusively for self-driving cars. No more human error accidents on these roads.
@@r-uu2qihope you're being sarcastic... Such as a sad mindset
I was ready to make a lengthy comment, but just watch the whole video. CNBC does a good job covering the topic in detail.
Europe boasts great public transportation, numerous parks and cultural offerings, clean streets, and a relatively low homeless population. However, it would be inaccurate to say that the US is built for its people.
Western Europe* offers those things. And most American cities also offer those things as well…lots of parks, cultural offerings and clean streets (depends on the city, just like in Europe. Cities like Paris are NOT clean). Many cities in the US have some of the world’s best parks and the US is literally world-famous for it’s state and national park system. In regards to cultural offerings, New York City is literally the most ethnically and linguistically diverse city on the entire planet & other cities like SF and LA have a bunch of cultural offerings that compare to the very best of Europe… Europe does a lot of things right, but to say the things you said about America is simply not true. The country welcomes the most immigrants in the world, by a very wide margin. And over 3x Western Europeans move to the US than the other way around - and that number is even higher with Eastern Europe. Aside from the propaganda that makes people idolize Europe & hate on America, there’s a pretty strong reason for those immigration numbers…
Your forgot public health-care, and the 3 year gap in life expectancy…
@@KrishnaAdettiwar not to mention the extreme violence and crime rates in US society, unimaginable in Europe. Because of that, I would prefer to live in the European Union than the USA. Definitely, I wouldn't want my kids to go to a school where there are armed guards because of the risk of shootings or other people carrying guns into the school. It is madness, and what is worst is that many Americans seem to think that is normal and that happens everywhere. They don't know there is a better life out there. Europeans in the European Union have in general no interest to emigrate to the US because in general, the quality of life in the US is worst than in the EU. Of course, there are specialized workers from the UE that choose to go to the USA, as well as Americans (and the number is rapidly growing) choosing to move to the EU. But in relation to the populations of the US and UE, these numbers are negligible.
@@KrishnaAdettiwar There are multiple lists of the most liveable cities in the world, many of them created by anglo-saxon institutions, yet generally, there is no US city in the top 10 (the exception is the Deutsche Bank one).
Well the U54 have different priorities when it comes to budget. Just like other big countries around the world, they need to spend at least a certain percentage of their GDP on the military to keep developing W34P0N5 and systems to protect and serve the country. I am surprised not all European states that have strong commercial ties with North America spend a similar amount of their GDP on the military, but it may change in the near future though. It all depends on the type of economy we will have to abide by, whether it is a conflict economy or a commercial economy
As an American I believe that most of the transportation in the United States has struggled thru the years changes and talking about politics and restrictions this is the mayor cause of all. however we need to establish rules to focus on success for the economy of the transport
Nope usa too much focused on flights and cars and roads see the results
There are NO miles in China!! The us using it's own antiquated and in efficient system is also part of the problem
The problem is somewhat complex, but essentially boils down to the greed/selfish culture in the U.S. Everyone in the process, and out, are out for themselves, especially the politicians. And I mean EVERYONE, including the media and academics who make money in the process of reporting and offering analysis. I know this from personal experience, Mr. Goldwyn is an example, where he says one thing in one report, then the opposite in another, all depending upon the situation. On a paper critiquing a project in Boston, he pointed a finger to the fact that the project was being managed internally by the public transit agency, and would have been better if more 'professionals' (i.e. consultants) had been used, to which I scoffed upon reading. He now changes his tune on the New York City project, saying that the MTA has relied too much on consultants to run the project, and this and other projects should be more managed by the public transit agency. He has also remained silent on revelations of poor transit planning in Boston, that wasted over a Billion public dollars, perhaps for fear of embarrassing academics in that city.
Yup could have summed up the video in 30 seconds. US is so expensive regarding public transit, healthcare etc cuz everyone is on the take. I wonder how much a project would cost with just engineers figuring it out and keeping the blood suckers away.
@@joe-zj8js engineers would be blood suckers too. I think the only way around it is to have almost everything run by the government but with every finances being 100% transparent. Basically. every transaction should be visible to everyone. Even that is not super efficient since political groups will critique each transaction even if it's the best transaction, but I can't see a better solution
@@marspark6351 Nah, private transit companies.
Greed is killing America. People want more money but not willing to work harder or faster. In the end the consumer and taxpayers pay for these higher wages and costs.
@@joe-zj8js Sorry to tell you, but they are just as much to blame. I've had an MBTA (Mass. Bay Trans. Auth.) engineer obfuscate on my attempt to show how a few train berths and platforms could be added to South Station in Boston, without the highly expensive need to tear down a massive USPS facility. It's complicated as to how it could be done, but essentially, I saw how the station was built at a time when trains were the only means of long distance travel (on land), and were thus very long. The station yard was long and the platforms were long, where as the chief use today is for much shorter commuter trains. I figured out a way, even with all of the impediments the MassDOT had put in the way over the years, to use that length to add berths/platforms in a linear fashion, with a below ground concourse created extending out from the headhouse (which already had an unused lower level) to access the outer berths/platforms; necessary because the impediments added didn't allow inner berths to be rail accessed from immediately adjacent tracks (like I said, complicated; have to see it). Access had to come from a track on the other side of the platform, which passengers could not reach the outer berths as the platforms were cut through. It is when I realized that problem that I conceived of the lower level concourse, which in fact turned out to be a big bonus benefit, as it gave passengers an indoor area to descend into quickly, which is nice in Boston's winter. I found a way to fit escalators on the 16' wide platforms, added a moving walkway in the concourse, and it had even another bonus, as it allowed passengers to go directly through the lower head house to the Red Line/Silver Line Metro stations. I did a layout of the whole thing, escalators, elevators, every inch of track, and platform, plenty of tolerances considered, all the existing infrastructure considered. And oddly enough, there really were other ways to address what is a highly skeptical claim of over crowding at South Station. How do you have train overcrowding when if you give Amtrak 3 berths, that leaves 10, and there are only 8 commuter lines which use the station. Trains should be coming and going on a commuter line with more than enough headway between trains to create empty berth on each train arrival.
But, this was part of my education. It is when I started to see how cronyism was playing such a role in our high cost of transit here in the U.S.
Fact is that land developers in Boston have been salivating over that USPS property adjacent to South Station for a very long time. It sits along Fort Point Channel, a very nice waterfront exposure. They can't push the USPS off the property, and would rather not have to pay a high price for it even if they could. IDEA . . . Have the MBTA say they need the property for South Station, expand on it, and then get the air-rights, which are a bargain. This is what goes on behind the scenes. Just like Harvard's deal after buying what seemed like worthless land two decades back, they get the DOT to 'suddenly' decide that a hwy viaduct needs to be replaced (in fact, not really) and oh btw we should straighten out the hwy segment right before the viaduct, which would then make that land quite valuable, taking it out from between the hwy and rail corridor. First off the viaduct is fine with occasional maintenance, and secondly why 'straighten out' a slightly curved segment, when such curves prove safer for highway travelers in urban areas than straight-aways. So many ripoffs right under the tax payers' noses.
i think it’s a problem that our bureaucracy sees these issues with building transit as end all be all, but when a highway interchange or expansion has the same type of issues and ends up only creating more traffic, they continue to throw more money.
After living in Beijing for seven years, going back to any other city without a highly developed subway transit or high speed rail system just doesn't seem worth it. I really hope the US gets its act together and find the money to build everything out and catch up with Asia in that regard.
And Spain
The USA maintains hundreds of military bases around the world, a dozen large ones, and the rest are small installations. On paper the US spends over $800 billion per year to not only maintain these bases (soldiers' salaries, fuel, maintenance, supplies etc....) plus research and development of newer weapons systems. I suspect the actual expenditure is much more than $800 billion. Plus every year, the US gov't has to deficit spend, why? And keep raising the debt limit. Why? Where are they going to get the money to Build Back Better? Plus the USA has a lot of corruption, not to mention a bloated Bureaucracy.
@@_Wai_Wai_ how much does USA spend to help ships sail the African horn? How much spent to defend Philippines fishing rights?
Dude, the average American thinks you are stupid, uncivilized and without morals as they were taught form day one. The Average American will say 'that's a fake photo' when looking at a nice early evening photo of Singapore or Tokyo.
For them is Disneyland the ultimate architecture that can not be improved.
@@redzzon First - not much more then every other party involved(and there are a lot of them), whose combined military budgets are less then of the US alone. Second - not a cent, since the operations near China, have nothing to do with someone elses fishing rights. Not even as pretext. So yeah, 800 billions per year could be spent way better, US would still remain the mightiest military power in the world even with fraction of spending - thats how much more it does spend on it. China is rapidly growing, but even they dont come anywhere near that sum.
finally someone presented a deeper look into the high cost.
they forgot to mention china I wonder why They built over 40000 high speed rail 250km/h
@@sarkermahmud because labour cost is so less in China thats why even iphones and semiconductors are manufactured there
@@gnanasabaapatirg7376 labor cost is just one factor. The truth is no Americans want to work in the factories and American working mentality can’t compete with Chinese labors’. This is the result of the last 70 years of comfortable life style that Americans enjoyed…..
@@gnanasabaapatirg7376 Its not the labor costs, most of the funding goes into the pockets of the contractors
They do it legally buy buying a chair that costs $2000, and a pen costs $100 these minor things adds up very quickly
The true costs are only fraction of the budget
@@pranaym3859 You think a private company that builds transit could be more cost efficient?
People should look at Translink's solutions for building a fast, efficient, and affordable metro system. The Canada Line is 20km long, fully automated, comes every 3-6 minutes, connects downtown with the airport within 20 minutes, and was built in 3 years for 1.9 billion Canadian dollars (
*million per km - We'd be bankrupt if it were that expansive!
There's a lot of grift going on in American govt. Politicians constantly give out construction project jobs to those that gave them campaign money. You'd also have to content with endless bureaucracy, lobbyists, people/companies suing you from acquiring the land to build the transport.
The unions in the MTA won't allow automated trains because then it will get rid of the jobs of the conductor. Excess labor is also the result of the union demands. To top it off, the labor costs are high but the quality of the work is even inferior compared to other metro systems in the world.
Lol. OP is proof the idiot who posted it didnt bother listening to the first minute and a half of this short ass video
At least there are real roads, freight rail, pipelines, etc. all over the U.S.
Meanwhile, ONE failure in the single road connecting Canada from west to east severs the country in two - and it’s happened before.
4:07 A subway project such as 2nd ave can SIMULTANEOUSLY be worth it at $16 billion (4/5/6 are the most heavily used urban rail line in America and it SHOWS) AND still be outrageously overpriced in how much. it SHOULD cost. Spending more on transit nets you less transit, budgets are finite
Most of money will be spent on environmental and other studies and consultants and end up running out of money to build anything. If something gets built, will take 20 years. When done..., will be too expensive to use. I just visited South Korea. Subway was clean, simple to use, goes everywhere and cheap. Ride was 1250 won, which is less than a dollar. Even better was if you catch another ride within 30 minutes, it's free.
South Korea does far more environmental studies per project than the US on average though...
A lot of public transportation is cheap to use because it's subsidized... meaning tax is deducted from the citizens paychecks and paid to the cost of operating and maintaining the system.
@@dezafinado Just about all the public transportation in the world is subsidized. And ours won't be? I must have missed who is paying for this infrastructure...
@@jacksevert3099 That I have no idea on that. But my point is they have really good working system and we will never have any close to them. Look at California highspeed train. So many years have passed, spent all the money yet nothing..., Not even half done. Maybe they will finish half and call it a day and we will have useless highspeed train that really goes nowhere.
The problem is that US system hasn't function well for over 50 years. You are spending so much because even to do something, you are fighting against every private entities that doesn't want to do it. Every country spent money on environmental studies because it's a must, even not climate related. You don't want to build in places that can't hold the constructions in the long term. Up till a decade ago, your country is still debating whether there are environmental problem. Everything is a political fight, where the mentality of 'government shouldn't do anything, government is bad' are almost instinctive for conservatives. If you can get the democrats (who are largely center right anyway) to want to build something, the conservatives will do something to it the moment they have enough power.
Whereas in most other country, even the conservatives understood that things needs to be build, stuff needs to be done. The other closest conservative/libertarian type party in the West, is the Tories in the UK. And as some of them put it, the Tories has been in power for 13 years, and they have broken everything. Nothing works anymore. And the US is largely far-right to center-right being politically dominate for half-a-century.
We need more metro systems
Not possible. Most American cities lack the population density required to justify a metro system.
@@thomaslanders2073 Not possible? Yeah most states dont but even the states with the required population, excluding the crumbling metro system of NY, DONT have ANY public transportation system or have a pathetic one.
@@thomaslanders2073 Even if we don't have the density, we do have the population and could build systems that bring people for the excerpts to the city center and connect suburbs to suburbs
US metro system is such a bad experience. It feels unsafe and unhygenic
We cant even propose metro systems in this country, what makes you think there's any political will for that.
Woah! This was definitely a cool deep dive into the complexities of the US rail system. I certainly agree with Eric's point that more bodies (white & blue collar workers) aren't adding much value in many instances, I mean as a Brooklynite for 25 years, you see it time & time again, ever saw Verizon or Con-ed crew do a job in your area? Now, I don't claim to know how to do that kind of work, but I do know when someone sits around texting on their phone in their truck, or on someone's stairs while one person is up on a cherry picker and 9 of his buddies are just standing around doing jack. That doesn't take a genius to put together, definitely start there...
Alot of this spending is going towards people and in places alligned with political influence, that is why when people complain about who is in power, I just roll my eyes. I miss the days when I just worked and didn't care about politics. Politics is designed to make people mad who have too much time on their hands and isn't helpful except for the people selling influence. I remember when they installed fiber optic in my city and that was thirty years ago - such a big deal - and we still don't have it out in my county. Influence peddling is alive and needs to be exposed for what it is. Not helping anyone, just certain places. And hearing people complain and destroy for four years because they don't get their way is called being a brat.
and greed will have them discarded by god. just wait for it... Greed is one of the deadliest faults. money cant make you happy, and money cant save them from the thief that kills them when they dont give it to them. For all of them are blessed to a stay in total darkness for all eternity. this is what you people refer to as "Hell" but uh, god was first and he didn't create a punisahment specific to humans,, think of "hell" as an eternity of by yourself, in total darkness, and theres nothing you can do there.. go insane? nope his will .. they WILL suffer
there's a lot of things you may not know, that are going on. like the phones are company phones, and instructions are given via this communication. No one appreciate's the fact that 99.9% of the time you hit a light switch, the lights come on. that's not the norm around the world. many utility workers get hurt, and even lose there lives to provide a service, site safety is of the utmost importance, and having seen many men burned to death in manholes, electrocuted on power lines,and lose limbs in accidents. I have a great respect for the risk they take.
Some of that is just waiting around to specialized heave equipment to do something. The equipment rental costs often dwarf the cost of people. It's either machinery waits for people or people wait for machinery.
Lies again? UEFA SW Ezlink Card
8:20 Hey I caught an editing mistake the editor overlooked. Oops
NYC needs to put this towards modernizing the 400+ subway stations we already have. We don’t need 10 more at $1,000,000,000 a piece.
We need both. But this is America, so rampant corruption means everything first and foremost benefits the billionaires before the normies that pay for it ever see any results.
It's hilarious how easy it is for nature to overflood those subway stations.
I disagree.The second ave subway line is needed. We need better putter borough subway service. That would many people and reduce car traffic.
@@SwiftySanders It's such a joke that there are no subway connections between Queens and the Bronx. There could easily be two outer half loops connecting Bronx-Queens-Brooklyn. A subway from Bronx Park to Jamaica replacing the the Q44 bus would be fantastic.
@@eriklakeland3857 Well, the concern is alleviating crowding and safety concerns on the Lexington Avenue Line and the M15-SBS.
Surely if it's the 6th most expensive place to build/extend subways lines then there are other cities in the world that have a similar amount of existing infrastructure (not to mention archaeological remains); for example London or Tokyo.
16:20 "In the US, we tend to make our stations a bit more grand than the austere stations of other countries." Wut? I seriously wonder what stations he's been to in the US and abroad that would make him think this. Most US stations are either falling apart because they're 100+ years old, or they're covered in filth from vagrancy and lack of cleaning. And none of them strikes me as something built to impress. I can only think of a handful of US metro stations I'd rather be in than a random European or Asian station.
Well, the new 2nd Avenue lines are certainly much bigger than your typical European station. The mezzanine sections are just beyond enormous (which is to say, a waste of space and money), which is apparently one of the reasons why they were so expensive to build.
Yeah, that sounded weird, the NY stations I have been in are rat holes. Granted, it was a few years since I was there.
He's talking about the new transit stations in the US, not our legacy ones that we don't take care of
Enormous shoutout to Alon Levy over at Pedestrian Observations. Great blog.
Perfect example of expensive doesnt always mean good.
Public transportation is a good thing in general, it just happens to be expensive.
@@nicholasdeal7015 It could be way less expensive though, as many countries around the world demonstrate.
My go-to example is California High Speed Rail compared to Germany.
The latest section of HSR that opened in Germany (the 60km from Wendlingen to Ulm) cost about 3.3 billion €. Converted that's about 95 million US$ per mile.
In contrast California HSR is now projected to cost 200 million US$ per mile.
And the story doesn't end there: California HSR is mostly on flat land, without any major natural obstacles, whereas the Wendlingen-Ulm line is literally 50% in tunnels, which is of course way more expensive to build.
I struggle to find any reason why it should be ~3x more expensive to build the same thing in the US than in Germany. It can't be because of the cost of workers (Germany has way better worker protection laws than the US) or environmental costs (environmental protection laws in Germany are more strict than in the US), building materials are basically the same so the rising prices in this area affect both countries the same, ... so where does the money go?
Note: I even picked a somewhat "favorable" comparison with Germany. Countries like Spain or Turkey do it even cheaper than that.
The same is often true for smaller projects. Even simple things like streetcar lines often cost an obscene amount of money (and sometimes are of very limited use).
One big factor could be that the US don't build as much public transit as other countries, so there is little expertise on how to do it (and if you look at how inefficient many of the new projects actually are that really shows). Also, the current agenda of "USA first" legislation often actively prevents the import of foreign experts, which naturally drives up cost even more.
Corruption and inefficiency that's why. I'm sure there lots of hard workers, but there's also overpaid contractors and supervisors that take home tons of money without lifting a finger.
Crazy thing it's actually expensive to ride the subway in USA. During my trip in Argentina subway rides were .10 cents each. Talking about in 2,023. I uploaded some videos on it and the cost of living.
Plus subways here are impeccable in comparison and spread all over Buenos Aires. I'm sure the government spends a lot less.
There's a ton of corruption in the local Argentine government as well. Politics are sickening all over the world. But the subways in Buenos Aires are amazing compared to those in USA
This is the U.S. in general. Expensive and terrible go in hand in hand.
Maybe for your area, plenty of other cities that are cheap and have good quality infrastructure.
Yep CONservative ideas are 2x more expensive while being 2x worse.
Canada has universal healthcare but literally spends 2x LESS per person. CONservatives literally are defunding it then saying "SEE WE NEED TO PRIVATIZE." 700-900 BILLION A YEAR of healthcare spending in Murica doesn't go to healthcare (it goes to megacorps and bribing Cons).
If CONservatives didn't exist, taxes could literally be 5% and surgeries wouldn't have to cost $4 million. Cons likely wasted 200 TRILLION so far in Muricas history lmao
The only way that changes is if we try again and resolve to do better. Otherwise, those involved in the last project either take their experience and lessons elsewhere, or retire without a chance to pass them on. Our problem has more to do with this nation's total lack of ability to accept failure as a learning experience as anything else.
Great analysis
I’m still trying to figure out when we are going to start building back better?
Did you not watch the video before commenting lol
About the grand paris express, it is worth mentionning that it is 200+ km (125 miles) of fast, driverless metro, equiped with plateform screen doors. The size of the subway network is going to double that of what we have now by 2030. Therefore comparing the cost per rider is a bit wierd since the benefits of such a project seem a lot bigger than the 2nd avenue project (it will add almost a milion people to the network every day). Also the Grand Paris Express is even more than just this, since it is transforming entire neighbourhood by adding new flats and offices above or near the stations.
Well it shows how crazy it is that the second avenue subway cost half that of the GPA.
Exactly. It's transit oriented development. Here in the US you'll have a gazillion of people protesting against apartment buildings near transit station "devaluating my single family home". Happens right now in Long Island.
@@PascalGienger I have difficulty believing being close to a transit station devaluates a house, even when the station comes with apartment complexes. Then it also comes with shops etc...
Grand Paris Express cost per rider is likely hurt by the inclusion of lines through more sparse areas (especially Line 18). I'd like to see the fantastic Line 15, which is the exact project US cities should be emulating, compared to the 2nd Ave Subway on cost per rider.
To me the worst is line 17 rather than the 18, since it basically have no interest. Whereas the part of the line 18 from Orly to Saclay through Massy is much needed, given how it is booming around here. It is the rest of the line that looks overbuilt. Also IDFM plans on expanding the line to Nanterre and to the east of Orly to connect it with nearby cities. I think that the first looks over built when the latter looks interesting. The true test will be the number of riders...
Honestly if it weren’t for all those damn NIMBY’s, a majority of America’s major cities would have a bustling metro system by now.
Boston, New York, Chicago, and Philadelphia built their first subway lines prior to WW2, while DC, Baltimore, San Francisco, Los Angeles, and Miami built theirs in the latter-half of the 20th Century. The newest one being Los Angeles in the early 90’s (And no, San Juan doesn’t count because Puerto Rico isn’t a state… yet). And that’s just counting the heavy rail-based metro systems.
I know that Honolulu is getting a metro system soon, but progress has been rather slow, and that the public has been pretty skeptical about it. But I’m sure by the time phase 1 is complete, it’ll be a crowning achievement. The first American metro system of the 21st Century (again, NOT counting San Juan), and it is in Hawaii of all states.
China can do it with 1/10 of money and 1/10 of time
Chins don't have Luigi and the wiseguys to contend with.
Spain does it even better
@@starventure or the level of corruption
@@qjtvaddict Spain has good subway system rivals china’s newest systems. Was impressed when I traveled ti shenzhen, guangzhou, China a few years ago
Most of China cities were built/built up from 1980 all there stuff is “new” while American cities in the northeast are well over 100 y.o plus China population is more than 4X US what’s the comparison ?
The fact America has a huge car centric issue, astronomical bureaucracy, real estate costs and much more, It's no wonder is so expensive to have public transit! We need easier green lights and less red tape for transit projects. It's always insane to me how much money is thrown at the interstate system and its fairly easy it's approved. We need to look at public transport for what it is, a public utility. It shouldn't always be focused on profit either...
It's hard to say, but the 'secretive' contracts are a huge state level exercise in corruption. Hence why so much overstaffing, 'overtime', soft charges and overcharging.
Valuable info!
The amount of taxes I pay in NY I shouldn’t be charged a penny to get on. Ridiculous
One word: CORRUPTION!
It's always this simple.
Look at Russian highway costs 😅
In the last 10 years, the whole USA have built 24 miles of subway lines. That's less than Panáma City in the same period. From those 24 miles, only 3 underground miles. The majority is the silver line in DC/Virginia. NY had 3 miles from those 24.
Boston hasn't expanded its heavy rail subway since the 1980s. It is a polycentric city uniquely suited to transit among US cities. Sad.
Trying to build any kind infrastructure project in USA seems like a complete nightmare.
But give trillion dollar for military industries is not problem for politicians
It’s really is here in Raleigh weee building a rail it’s just a fight.
The higher costs can only be attributed to incompetence at every level in NY/NJ government agencies. The agencies like MTA and PA of NY and NJ have more administrative people than the actual workers. Give the contract to the Chinese, they will get it done in record time and way below the budgeted cost.
But the workers would be slaves.
i agree, just hire another country, theyll get significantly more than their country while we still pay less. Our stupid unions keep asking for more money while wanting too work less what a joke...
I personally like Jimmy John's more than subway.
I never tried Jimmy.
Jersey?
Subway is the bottom of the barrel amongst sandwich chains but you can do better than Jimmy Johns.
Interesting video!
As a European living in the US. My observation is that all public construction projects take longer than similar projects in Europe.
However building a house is faster. That is down to cheaper wooden materials and building techniques.
subway should be built before cities, its an investment. Maintain roadways is also expensive over time with repaving and stuff!
I think problem is using a lot of contractors and stopping and starting these mega infrastructure projects. NYT did article on this and with unions you need people that do nothing but watch what others doing.
Having good outside audits helps. Governments can get pretty sneaky with their accounting.
it's not just union feather dusting the contractors have the incentive to burn cash too since they make a portion of costs back as compensation and then we have overpriced consultants running the show since we gutted the internal design team for capital projects over at the MTA. Consultants are good for quick spot checks for technical knowledge, not for running ur show for you the whole time... that is if you care about cost
Most contractors and construction workers are dishonest and do whatever they can to collect overtime pay. Most workers in other countries are honest hardworking people.
"people that do nothing but watch what others are doing" so you mean the lifeguard and firewatch who respective make sure nobody dies and watch an area of "hot work" (like welding structural steel) to catch any fires that start before they become a problem. (Including having to stay 4hrs after everyone else leaves because the area is still dangerously hot)
Worker's protections are a good thing and exist for a reason. We pay for lifeguards to protect us at the beach, so why not at construction sites that are way more dangerous than the beach, or pool?
I love how the MTA guy is telling us New York is more dense and historic than Beijing, Tokyo, London, Paris
When I see so many comments, I often feel that my comment will never be read or appreciated. I’ve been to Hamburg twice specifically to visit the Miniatur Wunderland, and I would like to visit again soon to see their recent expansion. After visiting one day, I decided to explore the S-Babn and took it north. I was amazed by some of the interchanges. We also went to the botanical gardens and enjoyed seeing the rideable miniature train circle the gardens.
Meanwhile China puts up high speed rail in no time. It takes us so long to marvel at our own work that it's never finished.
I may disagree with Communism and totalitarianism, but I gotta admit that China has a surprisingly good rail network. Russia has a pretty solid metro network that doubles as the world's largest fallout shelter believe it or not. I guess it boils down to: Mr. Dictator wants a lot of trains, so there WILL be trains, lest you want to suffer our supreme leader's wrath.
After traveled to many countries and used their public transport systems, it seems obvious that NYC’s subway system is just hopeless.
loveeeeeeeeeeee your video
Wow, an American news outlet using kolometres 😍 Amazing!
US federal government can’t fund for whole project to build public transportation but they can fund for Wars that costs trillions. While US waging wars around the world China was busy been building high speed train system. Last two decade China build more train lines than rest of the worlds train lines combined. This video is a good analysis of why it’s expensive but noticed they never mentioned China once. It’s now worth to mention their public transportation system when to analyze any others counties system just to know why they’re so successful in building good public transportation system. US need to except the fact and need to correct their mistake instead of polishing their failed system.
Switzerland is probably the best example of this. They have stayed neutral in many wars, and they have some of the best transit in the world.
I've ridden 17 different subways systems around the world.
By no means is NYC the fastest , prettiest or most comfortable. Still, all things considered, NYC subways are pretty amazing.
AMEN. Damn, the 4 tracks mainline for most of NY island are hard to beat.
@@GilmerJohn Most cities use regional rail for that role in the transportation hierarchy, but NYC's regional rail is very disconnected and underutilized compared to the RER in Paris.
haven't been to China right?
You must not have traveled to the good Asian cities.
There is a visual error in this, there are 3 frames of registration bars at 08:25.
Nice video. However, I don't think I agree with the gentleman saying transit stations in the US are not utilitarian. I'm European and have ridden both older subway networks like the NYC, Chicago and Boston ones and newer ones like the Washington one and BART - what I noticed is that most stations were quite plain and similar in design, and some were in poor condition (especially in the older networks).
They are also one of the World's Most dirtiest Subways.
Along with India's, the nastiest one, when it comes to being oxidize, the number one with 0 doubts lol
@@CristianmirabalWuno What metro-rail network in India are you talking about? I was in New Delhi six or so months ago and found their system to be really clean. Unfortunately, leagues better than the L I’m used to here in Chicago.
Wish we had some high speed bullet trains like some of the other countries. Japan. They had it for years maybe a decade and only improving.
Decade? Try over half a century. The first Shinkansen opened on October 1st *1964* almost six decades ago.
Of course, we'll never do it. It's too foreign and pointless, and it's not like every other country isn't doing it. We'll just continue building these half-assed five mile stretches of crappy light rail, red tape it to death and make the whole thing as crappy as possible and go, "SEE! I told you those damn commie trains don't work. Now get in your freedom truck!"
😂😂 they have bullet trains since the 60s in Japan, and 80s in Europe, it's ok, give it another few decades for USA to catch up, the American technology is far from being advanced.😊
I understand your sentiment but it's off by a few decades. Otherwise totally agree with you. 👍🤣
Can't believe The Boring Company project in Las Vegas wasn't mentioned???
It's in the best interest of the workers to work as slowly as they can, which increases the cost. Americans are good at this.
I hope one day America stops being a car-centric country 🙏🏻
I was amused by European public transportation systems. Their cities with trams😍😍 Amsterdam, Oslo, Paris and so on 🔥🔥
I fell in love with Moscow Underground! Very efficient, clean and convenient 👍🏻
And of course I wish America had bus system like we have in Korea❤
US is a great country but there is still a room to grow (especially for the city developing)
Korean buses 🔥
Korean bus drivers 😎
So Biden is investing in electric cars cars all while trying to limit cars with high speed rail too lol
@@RajbirSingh-ul1mw
Ofc I'm talking about moving around the city
@@RajbirSingh-ul1mw
But actually in Korea public transport system is so developed. You can go to rural areas by it, and it will be even faster than by a car
@@RajbirSingh-ul1mw
That's what Europeans do. They use public transport to get around the city and cars to go out of the city.
That's why European cities are so walkable.
I got rid of my car earlier this year and luckily the transit in Chicago (in my opinion) is efficient and reliable. I honestly don't feel like I need a car anymore. Sure, for roadtrips/trips to visit family would be nice however, I probably won't get another car until Im 100% debt free. METRA is also such a comfortable and affordable commute btw with phone chargers and bathrooms on the trains. I feel spoiled lol
Good for you. I, too, have gotten by without a car in my adult life for some periods of time. But most of the time, most adults want/need a car to at least for shopping and social visitations.
Here in San Francisco, the Central Subway project is a joke. It doesn't directly connect with the Market Street tunnel (where the rest of the Muni Metro runs through), so you have a very long walk from the Union Square station, which would be an issue for anyone with disabilities. It went way over budget and doesn't even serve North Beach, which would not only benefit locals commuting, but also tourists. I was told from a Muni employee that all they need to do is build the platforms and the North Beach station would be ready to go.
I just read Brent Flybjerg's book last week, and then you come out with this video!
Most of the cost issues is the contractors who contract other contractors who contract other contractors who contract other contractors
I hate to say it but that is a real thing that occurs here
Now let's do an analysis on connecting other communities with train transit rather than densifying an already HCOL (I. E. Manhattan and the east river waterfronts of Queens and Brooklyn). As remote work gains even more support and implementation, the neglected parts of NYC train transit are getter denser and needs more public transit capacity. Eastern Queens and Brooklyn will never get the service it deserves. I'm glad I don't have to take my 2 hr commutes just to go less than 8 miles into the city. Now I just drive from my place in NJ to my NJ office in 25 mins over 14 miles 😅
You're correct about the underserved parts of NYC. More transit in Eastern Queens and direct connections between Bronx-Queens-Brooklyn would be fantastic.
What. That garbage of a subway is worth 100 billion dollars??? Someone must be pocketing that money because they cant even keep it clean ffs.
(Edited)
& *DEADLIEST*
Nice timang on dis
in short:
BUREAUCRACY!
POLITICS!
How much do highways cost per mile?
2.6 b per mile.
Depends on exactly what you're building. From what I'm seeing it's $7-20 million per mile for an interstate highway depending on if it's urban or rural. But if you throw a major bridge in there or some freeway to freeway interchanges or you make the whole thing elevated then it gets much more expensive. Ordinary streets and country roads are under $1M/mile.
You should really mention PRC. Their transit construction costs are very low. It is labor costs but not what you think. They have a very low-cost capital goods industry so in a capital-intensive industry like transit construction they can push down the costs. And other the other factors you talked about politics, standardization etc etc are also factors.
"You all spend more time talking about trains then you do building a DAMN train"
-T.C. Gordon (One More Stop Please)
The construction cost has skyrocketed in the US. Even figuring in inflation, the construction cost today is at least 20x of that in mid-70's.
1:50 this is just nonsense, London and Paris build their metro at $250-$300 million a mile, why on earth are we costing $2 billion a mile? If we built at Western European peer rates we'd have enough money to fully fund 2nd ave AND probably take it back to the Bronx as per the original plans
The new Elizabeth line in London cost approx $30 billion therfore $500 million per mile.
Noticing the overcosts when watching RMTransit's videos.
@@running_lee That is misleading. The Elizabeth line trains run over 60 miles but mostly over pre-existing lines east and west of downtown. The new parallel tunnels connecting the two suburban networks are 21 km or 13 miles long, dug at a cost of $25 billion, therefore about $1923 million per mile.
Didn’t expect to see this kind of topic covered by something like CNBC. Neat.
8:23 that's a weird glitch right there
3:34 The SF Central Subway and LA Purple Line are both light rail, explaining a decent amount of why they are much cheaper than the heavy rail 2nd Ave subway in NY
The Purple (D) Line is heavy rail, along with LA Metro's B Line
At least NYC trains run on time, Boston's is so dilapidated and slow, that it's faster just to walk to your destination
yes as someone who escaped from Boston I can back you up here…I was constantly late to work because of delays
The Boston system should just shut down and rebuild the entire system from scratch
The T is saddled with so much of the debt from the Big Dig and it shouldn't be. This doesn't help them try to get things fixed and working in a timely manner. Plus being the oldest subway system in the country.
The only way we change this is by trying again, while all parties both resolve and come up with a plan to do better. Neither Asia nor Europe got to where they are today without a large number of mistakes and missteps along the way too - the original Shinkansen and TGV both ran years behind schedule and massively over-budget.
First and foremost, the American public needs to realize that transit is not just a novelty or political patronage project: it is something we need, and that even if it's late, expensive, and inefficient, it's better than nothing. Improvement will follow naturally from there.
A bigger threat to NYC transportation are the rapidly aging Hudson river tunnels, both rail and automobile.
I hope Biden build more public transport fast. I want to travel to usa and use clean and safe public transport
That $100 billions to Ukraine could have provided NYC with 6 additional subway lines.
This is getting more comical hearing about how we struggle to justify funding our own infrastructure but are more than willing to give away hundreds of billions of dollars to foreign countries with no oversite.
You missed the point. Better cost control = more transit per dollar. That's a good thing if you care about transit. 2nd Ave Subway is important but there are dozens of subway projects in NYC that are badly needed - better cost control helps us get a Utica Ave Subway, Bronx-Queens-Brooklyn connections, subways to Eastern Queens, crosstown subway in the Bronx.
For years I commuted from Rye to Grand Central Terminal many times yet having to take the subway to get to work only to turn around at night and do the whole thing in reverse.
When you say Sound Transit Lynnewood link is $50,000/rider, does the mean the capital construction cost for the capacity of a single person on that line? Because that doesn't seem like a big number. Say for example 50 people ride in that seat per day at say $1 per ride, ROI wouldn't even be 3 years for the CapEx.
I am assuming the per passenger costs states per subway line is measured over 40 years of the life of the subway route before it's in need of a major overhaul. Would be interesting to see the cost of the subway line compared to the cost of a major toll road highway expansion over 40 years.
The issue is that the cost of roads can often be external : pollution, less density leading to lower cost efficiency in further projects and longer commute times, fuel cost for the households necessity of a lot of parking spaces leading to even less density (and other issues tied with artificialisation like floods...). But these costs are not obvious.
Of course, such comparisons are useful. Highways can have steeper grades.
I think too many Americans truly don't realize that the rest of the world sees America as a developing country, except worse because it's DEVOLVING and part of its population keeps profiting off of the misery of the rest. I also think it's just too big and disjointed to be one country, it doesn't make any administrative sense. It's impossible to coordinate or come to an agreement on almost anything, yet opportunists can easily live in the gaps and thrive on the chaos. It's a disgrace, really. I live in Canada meaning I've been no more than a 25 miles from the border my whole life. Yet I've never had any desire whatsoever to live in the states. I feel like I'm in the fortunate side despite our own issues.
The NYC excuse of "there's so much stuff underground" is complete BS and has been disproven as a reason for exorbitant costs multiple times. Every old, developed city in the world has a bunch of stuff underground. The real reason is at 13:48... outsourcing every possible task to random outside agencies and contractors is the main reason why these projects are so expensive in the U.S. It's corruption, simple as. Everybody has to get their piece of the pie.
There is a lot of creative accounting in this report. A famous writer once said, 'There are lies, damned lies, and statistics.' I'm not convinced of any of the reasons outlined in the video.
Triple the cost and triple the duration…..even then, may never happen