Who is the Halfback GOAT | Thurston vs. Johns | The Fan
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- Опубліковано 20 сер 2024
- Current NRL stars discuss who they believe deserves the title of Greatest Halfback of All-Time on the Fan. Andrew Johns or Johnathan Thurston? Who would you pick?
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Most who pick j.t are the newer guys but nobody is touching joey John's! He's the most complete player of all time
Iam a Queenslander through and through and I love JT but Jowey is the guy why I watched NRL .. All the way from PNG ..
haha "queenslander through and through" but you're from PNG? OK
@@auzziguy449he confused me with that statement
I remember when Brett Kimmorley was getting picked ahead of John's for rep footy because his club coach, Chris Anderson, was also the Australian coach. Ludicrous.
Anderson coached the "Flat style" play which won the Storm their fist premiership in their second yr in the comp (1999) and Kimmorley/Hill combo epitomized it! That style of play was mesmerising but countered by Alfie and the broncs in 2000 then put to bed by Joey and his band of Novocastrians in 2001
@@aximusroh6453 Great comment. They were fantastic to watch in '99. I forget about Scott Hill when I think about the great players of the NRL era. He was excellent.
Right on! It frustrated me because I knew Joey was so much better.
I agree, Johns should've played 7, but Kimorley was class for Australia during that time.
The guy who picked Johnathon Thurston never played with Andrew Johns or if he did it would have been just before he retired. Andrew Johns also played in a much tougher era. Thurston never played against Wally Lewis, Ricky Stuart, Allan Langer, Geoff Toovy, Brad Clyde, Paul Harrigon, Paul Siranin, Andrew Edingshouson, Brad Fitler, Bret Mullins, Laurie Daily, Mal Meningah, Anthony Mundine, Sunny Bill Williams (if he did it was short lived as he went to Rugby Union along with Loti Takiri) Wendell Sailer, Steve Renough, Rod Wishard, Steve Menzies, Nathan Brown etc etc. In Thurston’s era Brath Anaster and Robbie Farah were stars in Origin and made the Australian team. There’s no way they would have made the origin or Austrian team in Andrew John’s era. Maybe not even on the bench.
Joey, Sterlo, Alf, JT, Duncan Thompson, Sticky are all incredible. A case to be made for all of them
No Cronk???
@@parahakaire6554 no. No one who knows footy puts Cronk in that stays he’s was great student toiler classy etc but not in goat convo calm down
@@jenspenz9419 tell me whose done more than cooper cronk hahha its laughable
@@parahakaire6554 mate look at the teams Cronk had around him. JT and Joey(more so) would carry a team.
Nathan Cleary is the best
1. Joey Johns
2. Johnathan Thurston
3. Ricky Sturart
4. Stacy Jones
5. Sterlo
Joey john's for me all round gun attack defence and making plays all day. No disrespect to JT but Joey's ability to bring others into the game was extraordinary.
I love JT but Joey dragged an average team to grand finals by sheer will.
Jonathan Thurston modelled his game off Johns and Lockyer - that says it all.
Johns and Lockyer the greatest halves combo of all time
Johns because he had a better understanding of the game and his role in each game. He never played the same game every time. He was able to adapt his attack depending on how teams defended and how they were targeting him. One game he would play a simple half back role and just be that general and let others into the game to take the pressure off him all game such as gidley and Ben Kennedy, and the next week he would play alot closer to the ruck and be a bit more daring and take the line on and subdue the opposition with his kicking game.
Not many could read the game and oppostion 5 steps ahead like joey did and that's why he is the GOAT.
Joey could do everything Thurston could plus he tackled like a forward.. No comparison really… Thurston is a great though.
John's was a forward.
Johns and his forward passes
Alfie Langer for me 🐴
I can only assume it’s the younger audience or Qlders picking Thurston. The guy probably has a career winning record of 45%. Thurston was great but Joey is probably the GOAT, I only think Cameron Smith can challenge that title.
I think Smith is the GOAT, Joey is the Goat halfback & Thurston the Goat Five-eight
@CMooVe disagree, but lockyer is a great, I see him as a fullback tho
Cameron smith us a bum refs won him he's games when he would cry to the refs and get away with cheating that's why they were stripped of their Premierships
@@narelleweatherall2571 if you think that then you have no idea, Smith is the goat
Mostly recency bias is why people pick Thurston over johns
I reckon Cooper Cronk has to be in this conversation. 9 Grand Finals in his career, won premierships at both clubs he played at. Made the Roosters a proper contender within one season and the first guy to win three in a row in the modern game. Also the only guy to make 9 GF’s in the modern game.
Nope
It's so disrespectful that he isn't even mentioned. He's not a highlights-reel player, but he is the most technically proficient halfback in history, and if there's one man who I want to have his hands on the ball 2 minutes before full-time, no matter what the score board, it's Cooper Cronk.
@@pepeesq.7966 nope
@@germanicbarbarian3473 Good point, mate. You're really articulate and provide well-thought opinions.
@@pepeesq.7966 lol
Andrew Johns
Complete Player.
Both were so good, but you have got to also include Ricky Stuart and Allan Langer in the conversation. We have had some top Halfbacks that's for sure
Ricky Stuart was good but not on the same echelon of talent in my opinion.. Cronk was better than both of them... Especially in clutch moments
@@parahakaire6554 Cronk was awesome! Top player
Alfie Langer for me 🐴
Calm down. You a right about great halves tho
@@parahakaire6554 Cronk wasn’t better than Alfie lol not even Stuart Stuart changed the game with his spiral pass and kicking game and Alf was just a torment. Cronk was a robot compared to them who played with great players around him always.
John is the best..a complete player
Joey is the most complete player ever. JT superb also and Ricky, Alf, Sterlo.
Kenny
@@jenspenz9419 Kenny played the Challenge Cup final back in 1985. Peter Sterling for Hull and Brett Kenny for Wigan. If you watch this video you'll see just a glimpse of him. One of the best halves I have ever seen.
ua-cam.com/video/0TEZo1eJsQQ/v-deo.html
Johns could tackle better than most forwards where they hid JT in defence. JT is also one of the best players ever.
John's played Hooker
@@deevita7459 what?
@@Wonkayy John's played a lot of games at hooker that's why his defence was better.
@@deevita7459 defending in the middle is different to defending on an edge.
Jt had chronic shoulder issues throughout his career tho, which effected his tackling as he got older. He was there to make a tackle when he was needed tho
I remember getting to the 2nd Test Ashes (2001) at Bolton early so we could watch the Kangaroos in warm up. They were doing line defense work (hitting pads) and out of that insanely talented group, you know who hit the pads the hardest? Andrew Johns! It was like a shotgun going off when he make contact!
Yep! Awesome defender
Johns followed by daylight followed by JT & Ricky Stuart, people sleep on how incredible Ricky was
Replace daylight with Langer and you might be right
Completely agree
He was THE genius. Until he broke his leg sadly. Raiders would of won that year in a canter had he not broke his leg he was that good back then,they struggled to win a a game after he did that
Johns overrated...and had issues
It's so difficult to split them. Joey was a better defender, JT a much more consistent goal kicker. Thurston played in the greatest QLD team/s ever in that period of dominance which elevated his standing. Joey had one of the greatest origin series' (2005) for an individual player ever. I couldn't choose between them really. Thurston was faster and his dummy was awesome. Joey had his excellent sidestep and I would argue his overall kicking game (during play) was slightly better. As that little girl said in the Mexican food ad "Why not both?" 😂
No offence to Thurston he a ledgend but Andrew John's all-day
Even tho Thurston played halfback most of his career, I seen him more as a five-eight and he us the greatest five-eight of all time
@@WTC-1990 Better than Wally and Brett Kenny?
@@Australiana yes
@@WTC-1990 Ah ok you don’t know who they are.. All good!
@@WTC-1990 end of the day he had seven on his back bro. We all seen that. I like your comment thou man..
Johns for sure because he brought everyone together. His combo with any halves partner was good and he could tackle hard thats why his the GOAT. Well balanced and was more cool headed and calm. Capital C control overall. Unlike JT who messes up when opposition gets under his skin. Both have good attacks and style however Joey had variation of style. JT had a good dummy and acceleration and his ability to show up consistantly was outstanding. Both won a finals and state of origin matches and Rep football. However Joey went further to England and showed everyone he is the best in a team, new environment, new coach, new setting and ofcourse he did it in his first game.
If you put andrew johns in his prime, against jt in his prime, i got andrew johns all day, he came back from retirement against the maroons past his prime, in 2005 game 2 and 3. And won the series against jt.
And Joey bent people in half in defense.
He never came back from retirement, and by your argument of him beating JT in an origin series langer and johns went head to head at halfback in origin Langer won 3 Drew 1 and lost 2 so out of 6 games langer has the wins and series wins on his count.
@@troystaunton254 he worded that poorly but johns was the better player. Greater array of skills, better defender. Zero weaknesses.
@@troystaunton254 No, Queensland won.
Cause he was on cocaine the druggie
Joey is a hundred times better than Thurston. I wouldn't even pick Thurston ahead of Cronk. Joey does everything in the game and he's a better defender than Thurston who camps on the wing because he can't tackle. Joey is the GOAT
I think JT is a 6 The only reason he played halfback was because for most of those years North Queensland had someone who could play 6 but not 7 I think Thurston his greatest attribute was vision so in my opinion these two are the greatest six and seven to even play Rugby league
Andrew Johns 20 meter spiral passes were sublime.
Ricky Stuart’s were better.
@@troystaunton254 Sticky would do the harbour bridge passes , where Joey's was more flat. Johns had more power in his pass.nothing against Sticky , as he was a great player!
In Andrew Johns' early career the question was.
Who was better Johns or Langer?
Later on it was.
Who is better, Johns or Lockyer?
At the end of his career it was.
Who is better, Johns or Thurston?
So what's the common denominator?
LOckyer was a 5/8 and full back
Joey is the best because he was a complete halfback. He was creative, his kicking improved as time went on, and he was tough. He tackled and took on the line at times
JT was more of a modern day Laurie daley at 5/8th.
Stacey Jones
😂 nah mate the 8th
@@jordo1654 defs in front of thrusty lol I reckon joey an im a queenzlander lol
Gary freeman
Yes the little general 👍
#1 joey #2 JT #3 smith #4 locky #5 Freddy my top five greatest players
You can’t leave a valid comment about this unless you were there at the beginning of both halfbacks.
I say John’s.
Joey always, even though I am a Queensland supporter I really love watching Joey play💪
Joey hands down he changed thmodern halfbacks gsme!! Complete player in defense attack and kicking.
JT
Langer
Johns
Stacey Jones
Cooper Cronk
I dont care about what skills you have. Its about who contributes most to wins and how often they do so.
JT in my opinion. His ability to be clutch in big moments and almost singlehandedly bring a premiership to North Queensland is just unbeatable in my eyes. I don’t know any other player that could have transformed a club the way he did. They have not been nearly as good since losing him either which shows his influence on the game
His winning in origin too is absolutely unmatched! He is the only player to have played in all 24 games of Queensland’s 8 year winning streak. He also has the most points in state of origin history. The accolades speak for themselves
As much as I respect Thurston, as a Doggies supporter and thank him for 2004. Was it Thurston or Sonny Bill that gave their grand final ring to Steve Price? Either way, massive respect for that too. But I've said it many times, Joey didn't even have to play good, simply being named in the Knight's team would put a rocket in their ass and make the average Newcastle Knights team look like finals contenders. Like, Danny Buderus and Kurt Gidley were GREAT players, loved 'em both, but they didn't hold that presence that Joey had. I just wish we got to see more of the Matty/Andrew Johns combination, they could've created some of Rugby Leagues greatest moments
If Johns was so good, why were the Knights so bad so often
@@user-yj5os4uw2n Why haven't the Warriors won a grand final despite generally being a pretty damn good team?
Joey had the complete game and no weaknesses, one thing he always did better than J.T. was tackling and Joey never hid out on the wings he always played in there with the forwards and tackled like one.
He had No Fear !! Because he was on the GEAR !!
You think he's the only player that was or is😂🤣😅😂🤣😅
@@bigpronger ecstasy is not a performance enhancing drug 🤦♂️ if he was playing while he was on ecstasy then that truly shows how great he was haha
@@nswblues3146 Ok mate ... He was a great player because he was on the gear ... Got ya
@@bigpronger I think it’s clearly obvious that he was not on drugs while he was playing.
johns and daylight second i think jt would probably agree too. joey was so dominant he should of won 6 or 7 daly ms. we were robbed of some prime joey due to injury. he was a 9.5/10 in every facet of the game
1. Cooper Cronk. 2. Andrew Johns. 3. Jonathan Thurston
Am I the only one that thinks Thurston is underneath Cronk as top halfbacks? JTs form and defense dipped esp late in his career where Cronk was more consistent
Yes you are the only one.
I 110% agree, Cronk won way more and was far more consistent. Could actually defend as well.
JT is clutch. He’s made us all NSW fans frustrated for 8 damn years 😂
Johns and it isn’t close.
Firstly for me Thurston was more of a five-eight, but Johns played in an era where the halves still got belted constantly. When Thurston reached his prime, the league really stamped out hits that John’s took every game. Thurston definitely improved his defence over time, where as Johns was a rock on that side of the game in comparison.
I've been watching the game for over 40 years, and Johns is the best halfback I've seen in that time ....... I'd also query whether Peter Sterling and Allan Langer shouldn't be in the conversation for 2nd place.
I'm 54, Sterling was the best 7 I'd seen until Johns came along. Thurston was a great player, but Andrew Johns is an immortal imo
There’s a goat for every Era Joey, J.T Now Cleary
Fucking Cleary calm down
haha Cleary, over rated, O'sullivan replaced him for 5 games, Penrith never missed him.
Cam Smith is the GOAT....
Johns by a mile. Johns was brilliant in every aspect including defence. I’ve also never seen a player make other average players look good (and get them into Australian or Origin teams). Johns also revolutionised on field kicking, ahead of his time
It's harsh but true.... And N.S.W best years, when alot of Knights player's were selected.... Let's pray they follow suit with Penrith player's this year. Nate Cleary is on point. Feeling for the Panthers, with half a squad up for origin selection....there goes the win streak
ever heard of cameron smith he brough players like tim glasby into origin like he literally told the coach i want him in the team and they went on the win the series, seems like everything at melourne being involved with smith and bellamy could turn to the gold
Why cz he missed one less tackle a game and made the same amount of tackles. That isn't a great deal better if you ask me people exaggerate johns defense. And thurston was clearly a better offensive player which is the Halfbacks primary role in the side lmao
Gidley, Buderus & Tahu were not average players!! The man was running around with the big 3 of his generation. Stop...
@@aidanskelton5057 I disagree, I think Bellamy is the reason for Queensland’s dominance during that 13 year period. Cronk was originally a benched second rower and Bellamy turned him into one of the greatest halfbacks of all time. Along with Slater, Inglis and Smith. I honestly don’t think there will ever be a coach greater then Bellamy. I believe if Smith never went to Melbourne then he wouldn’t have become the player he turned into.
Langer,Johns,Thurston and Cronk.
Allan langer
GOAT
😂😂😂
John’s won state of origins, by himself. John’s for me
So much respect for Thurston in all honesty who looked up to Joey
Cooper Cronk the most under rated HB and should be considered in GOAT talks due to his success which tops both JT and Johns
Farrkkkk offffff
One is the 8th and one is not NUFF SAID
Sterling was better than both. Both of them had 2 premierships while Sterling had 4 and played in 5 Grand Finals.
To say Sterling wasn't a superstar is BS. Sterling is the first player to receive a 10 in Rugby League week and that was against Brisbane in a losing side.
Johns wasn't even halfback for NSW and Australia on most occasions
Qlder here. Joey is the 🐐
I admire Thurston the way he plays the game and wins in big moments for cowboys and QLD. But I think Joey is the most complete player to ever play the game. The best half back of all time
Complete player, nah, only Greg Inglis fits that mould. John's was slow, that's why he passed a lot. Don't forget his nickname was barge-ass
Cam Smith is the most complete player to play...his winning record is incredible
1. Thurston
2.Johns
3.Stuart
4. Langer
5.Cooper Cronk
It’s Johns! And it’s not close!
Thurston was a competitor but far from the best.. Cronk was better then him! Cronk is hugely underated.. what was it like 9 Grand Finals? Thurston was just what everyone inspires to be, small bloke and gets in there but skill he wasn't even top 8 of his era.
Lucky no one takes your opinion seriously
Have a good day
@@andrewkeepa2215 Mate every time Cronk was injured in Origin Thurston was found wanting.. also have a nice day
Cronk had a fantastic career and was a gr8 player but not quite up there with JT or Joey in my opinion
Cronk couldn't even crack origin in the halves until lockyer retired.
@CMooVeIf JT stayed 7 no way cronk would have been 7 for Queensland.
You really can't compare eras, every generation has one or two players that standout from the rest.
80s Sterlo
Late 80s early 90s Langer Stuart
Late 90s2000s Joey
Late 2000s 2010s Thurston Cronk
Last 5 years Cleary
Andrew johns after I just watched his highlights, never watched him much growing up
Johns by far the more complete footy player. Could do everything in attack that JT did but would always show up in defence whereas JT would always be hidden on the edges next to a big forward to help him out.
I'd say Langer would be a better complete footy player than JT.
Johnsy footy brain is better than jt, but johnsy needed confidence to be able to do it, so he turned to drugs to spark that within his brain. Thurston did it without yet learned off johnsys brain. Jt is the better half, mentally and physically
Nobody stamped the game like joey.
I've seen both play a lot. Johns wins on tackling and JT wins on competitiveness. Everyone keeps mentioning JT hiding in defence, but the guy had chronic shoulder issues. Its the only way he could have a career. He was always there when he needed to make a tackle too. Its hard to argue either side so ill leave it there but they're both clutch players who did great things in the game.
George Williams, Could learn how loyalty makes you a great player. Would always win by a nose
They are both legends....but different players
Lol not the person who made the spelling error on the thumbnail surely 🤣😂🤣
You have one job
JT, has been dominant and competitive for a long time
Hard to separate the 2 greats. Joey was my all time favourite but JT was a freak. Cooper Cronk was good as well but JT and Joey can also play eyes up footy when structures not going to plan which made them both dangerous.
Would be my halves picked any time of the day
Unlike JT, Johns was a complete player. JT was a turnstile in defence his entire career.
Johns passed better
Created holes in the defence better
Kicking in general play was better
Did drugs better, had more injuries, and was fatter too.
STERLO - daylight second...4 premierships, Origin, and 2 undefeated Kangaroo tours...should be an immortal
Amazingly Johns only won 4 origin series, played 23 and won only 13 games. Stats speak louder, he was hardly dominant.
Cleary is dominating NRL and yet people are saying he has to dominate state of origin to be considered the best.
Johns is overrated...
People saying Cronk pushed Thurston to 6 at origin are delusional, they forget that Locky retired and there was no better 6 in game for rep gams as Cronk was a Systematic and structural play half back could not play 6. so Thurston had to fill Lockys shoes. Cronk was still playing and storm team dominated NRL but yet was not picked for Kangaroos or origin when Locky was still playing.
How the hell did langer get left out pfft plz or Ricky
I would say Johns GOAT
Piri weepu🙌
No.. Arnold Schwarzenegger was better
🤣
YesSiRr!! Mate.. the Blokes the Eighth Immortal!! Thankz for sharing!!
Andrew Johns 💯🐐
Defence is why joey was better than Thurston, both great players. but joey put guys on their ass whilst thurston at times was a bit of a speed bump(no disrespect intended)
Thurston...but they were both great....Thurston had a longer period at the top...
So many greats but joey johns is the greatest of all time
Hard to split them, jt could win you the game with just the little things he did, where joey could do the same with his defence. Cronks gotta be up there as well
JT had a much better career and was more consistent. Johns was better in defence. 2005 origin john's was unstoppable but JT had a much better individual origin career maybe never as good as 2005 john's but was almost as good many times
I am from Queensland but it's no question. It was Andrew Johns and Alfie Langer or maybe Sterlo. JT copied Johns style and just wasn't as good. He was alright but not in the same league.
johns allllllll dayyyyyy mate all day
As many people have said Joey had no weaknesses in terms of skills as a player. A big let down for JT is his defence (although his final tackle of his career on Ryan James was a beauty) which on paper you would say makes Joey the better halfback. However Chad Townsend brings up an important point about JT is his ability to rise to the occasion in clutch moments. So really for me if you want to win as many games as possible Joey will get you the results you’ll need.
If you want to win in key games like a grand final with everything on the line then JT is your man.
There’ll always be a debate on these two but we really should appreciate that we got to see both of these legends play
JT vs Johns
Team awards🏵
Rugby league World Cups: Johns wins
JT: 1
Johns: 2
NRL Championships: draw
JT: 2
Johns: 2
NRL minor championships: draw
JT: 0
Johns: 0
World club challenge championships: JT wins
JT: 1
Johns:
State of Origin shields: JT wins
JT: 11
Johns: 5
Individual awards🎗
Clive Churchill medal: draw
JT: 1
Johns: 1
Dally Ms awards: JT wins
JT: 4
Johns: 3
Golden boots awards: JT wins
JT: 3
Johns: 2
Dally M halfback of the year awards: draw
JT: 4
Johns: 4
I will rather go with JT.
John, ALWAYS, CREATOR
Cronk is the best modern day Halfback
i want whatever you're sniffin
You are 100%
Johns is the best, no doubt, but it's amazing how many people who are commenting on this have obviously never heard of Alex Murphy.
How about we ask Jamie Goddard to settle the question? My thought is Johns is over rated, sure he could tackle hardish occasionally but so could JT but he lacked consistency and intensity and he never shared his drugs with me. Plus he is from NSW and I am looking forward to Origin - Queenslander!!!
Nathan Cleary now …..: no question whatsoever
Andrew John the greatest 7 of all time in my book
JT all the way,hands down
JT... his accolades and awards surpassed Johns. The game in Thurston's era was much faster, tougher, complex, modernised and evolved around team work rather than slower one man centred game in John's era. I don't think this kind of comparison can be made because the eras were different
You must be young. Joey wiped the floor with thurston, smith and slater at origin level.
Joey was a better defender.
Thurston was the better athlete, Joey could spiral pass the footy much better than Thurston, they both read the game and steered their team around the park equally, both were fierce brave competitors and defenders with great kicking games. BUT no player ever would have pushed Joey out of the NSW number 7 spot like JT was pushed to the number 6 spot by Cronk for Queensland, so I believe that makes Joey the GOAT.
JT was pushed to 6. He filled the role after Lockyer and still retained his attacking edge. Johns couldn't get a run at 7 for some time and was pushed to 9. Ask Jamie Goddard.
@@davidclarke9835 Jamie WHO??
Some of these comments are laughable, this is an easy one! JT and it ain’t close, complete footy player does everything well and just knows how to win. Joey had a lot of good players at the knights which kept his job a lot easier. JT willed a cowboys team too a premiership and that beats any other premiership for me. JT GOAT BY A FAR BIT
He had a lot of help during that season, a lot of those cowboys were in their primes during that season. Taumalolo, Gavin Cooper, Tamou, Matt Scott, Antonio Winterstein, Justin Oneill were all origin/international level players in their primes at that time.
JT also couldn’t defend to save himself, whereas joey could. I even rate Cronk over JT, way more accolades and far more clinical.
@@izzy031096 You lost me at Antonio Winterstein and Justin O'Neill hahaha that is laughable! jog on buddy. Cowboys preimership is the greatest premiership ever!
@@Dagoat2000 Joey took the knights to more finals series than Thurston. Cowboys made a grand final without Thurston! Plus Jt didn’t deserve the Clive Churchill medal in 2015. He was like the 4th best player on the field. So overrated
To make a fair opinion & conclusion , you would have to be old enough to watch both players , during their careers. Highlights of Joey doesn't really show how he could control a game. He was the best I've ever seen!
Has to be Andrew the killer Johns love from New Zealand who happens to support QLD and the mighty Raiders
Langer was a game changer
Langer was hopeless without Lewis at origin level
Thurston played a lot at 5/8. It's Andrew Johns easily.
It’s about preference really.
Joey was a wizard, way ahead of his time. His only weakness (as far as I could tell) was his speed. His explosiveness really died after he was like 29 (due to a few very very serious injuries that are not talked about anymore but would’ve ended the careers of most modern players). Otherwise, he was a creative genius. Watching him perform live each night was was literally something you looked forward to for six days.
Thurston was an extremely good football player. He was clutch, he had speed, he could kick, he was reliable, he could pass, and he was consistent.
Ain’t much difference in skill. Joey wins in creativity. Take your pick really- I will obviously pick Joey, but I loved watching jt run around he had great skill and heart.