Tracklist: Autonomy Lost - 0:01 Imprint Of The Un-Saved - 1:40 Disenchantment - 3:16 The Paradoxical Spiral - 5:00 Re-Inanimate - 8:12 Entrapment - 9:16 Mind's Mirrors - 11:45 In Death - Is Life - 16:15 In Death - Is Death - 18:17 Shed - 31:39 Personae Non Gratae - 35:14 Dehumanization - 37:01 Sum - 39:57 Автор: закрепи комментарий или скопируй в описание видео для удобства, заранее спасибо! =)
I love how the most played part of the entire Catch-33 album is AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
"making future metal" damn right, this album sounds like it came out in 2126 but its older than me. such timeless music graces this earth once every blue moon. Meshuggah is truly a band to behold.
This is meshuggah's best album. There are many greats. The thrash perfection of contradictions collapse/none. The brutal insanity of chaosphere. The immaculate groove of nothing. The insane technicality of obzen. This has the best bits, wrapped up in its own theme. It is timeless.
Totally agree , for me this and I are my personal favourites , I'm a really big fan of nothing as well , got to confess I was a little disappointed with obzen and kollos . Immutable is brilliant though 👍
Na #1 destroy erase and improve #2 chaosohere #3 The violent sleep of reason #4 obzen #5 immutable #6 contradictions collapse #7 kolloss #8 catch 33 #9 nothing. I dig every album but nothing. That album is all noodling and vocals horrible. Jens was adjusting to slower more polished lower sounds . Most ppl put it # 1 I put it dead last.
I mean there's just no fucking way this came out in 2005. It feels like the world is spinning around me. How can something not age even just a tiny bit? The production quality and the haunted trance it puts you in is just invaluable. BANGER ALBUM
the heaviest Shuggah album, ridiculous grooves. I wish they'd do this experimental/Ambient stuff again, even if just for one more album. This whole album has an existential dread none if their other albums do
Estaba buscando este comentario. Este album en LSD es un viaje al Inframundo, hay tanto oculto en esta entrega que frente a la percepción no-estimulada pasa desapercibido.
Technically, over 20 yrs is the same as over 25 yrs. I definitely remember when chaosphere came out and the first time I heard new millennium. Ahh to be a metalhead kid in the 90's.
Only been a fan for 2 years, can't wait to get through the rest of they albums. So far this and DEI are my favourites without question Nothing aint far behind either
I graduated high school in 05. There were a lot of great albums around that time. I had never heard of Meshuggah at that time, but this album is a masterpiece that will continue to awe me for years to come. The djent genre has copied sounds from Meshuggah, but no one will replace their ability to operate outside the normas and sound so damn wonderful. People dissecting what an entire album's meaning is and not one is wrong.
@@thallduck Then it's... not 4/4, only the drums are usually. This is such a weird argument, "yeah it's all 4/4 bro except all the instruments that aren't in 4/4"
I've been listening to meshuggah for a few years now. I'm also starting to think this is probably their best album. It's slowly but surely growing on me and every time I listen to it I'm almost in disbelief for how obscure, poetic, violent this is❤
Agree totally. @@senseicorey9979 This is peak Meshuggah. 18 years into the band, this feels like the vision they worked up to. Then they created masterpieces since then, but no complete album that comes together so perfectly as this in every little detail. All sounds so organic, not forced in any way.
On the last tour they did Minds mirrors in death is life/is death right in the middle of the set. It was hauntingly perfect. Best show ever no one touches the mighty Meshuggah. 🤘🤘
I saw them in Riverside California for the immutable shows, and damn, when 22:13 kicked in, it actually made me cry. I've always loved this album the most out of all their work, and finally hearing that groove live, less than 10 feet away from Fredrik is a feeling I don't think I'll ever feel again
This album, is creepy, foreboding, but oddly beautiful all at once. It has a unique atmosphere compared to the rest of their albums, and the lyrics are as poetic as it gets for Meshuggah. And most of all, it was fun to headbang to. I might need to go a doctor now.
Autonomy lost is such a fitting name for the beginning riffage It feels like all body control has ceased and you want to just drop - great for slow headbanging
The last time I listened to this was ~10 years ago, and I'm still impressed. The album is really tied together well, and I think the best way I can describe it is as a mural of sound.
@@mintgumornot It's good to understand that your opinion is not fact. Therefore, it is valid for anyone else to consider this album better than any other.
i love this album soooo fucking much. best meshuggah album, best metal album. the space it puts me in is like no other and to this day i haven't found anything close to it.
Man.. It's been about 6 months. I can only play my drumkit a few hours a week but I'm almost done learning the first trilogy of this album. What a pleasurable challenge
I heard Immutable today that would by my 2nd favorite album but this is still the first. Those dark atmospheric moments and voices used in this are a masterpiece.
Fuck yea bro! The mind games they play on us rhythmically seems impossible to execute. But they do it with devilish denial. It almost sounds like rhythms so random that they must have heard a child humming to himself, and just captured that and put it in a 4/4 format
A lie to maintain equilibrium, to hold me in this dead realm, this last ever dream I'm the thought that never crossed my mind. Disguised in the evident. Forever unredeemed A new level reached, where the absence of air lets me breathe I'm inverted electrical impulses. A malfunctioning death-code incomplete All things before me, at first unliving glimpse undeciphered Its semantics rid of logic. Nothing is all. All is contradiction Grinding, churning, the sweetest ever noises Decode me into their non-communication A soundtrack to my failure, one syllable, one vowel A stagnant of endings. Un-time unbound. Merging to from the multi-none A sickly dance of matter, malignantly benign. Greeting the chasm - unbearable, sublime
Wow, this is a great album!! I was binge listening Gojira when "Catch 33" was recommended by You Tube. I heard a couple of Meshuggah songs in the past, but nothing like this, I am now definitely a fan. The album was melodical with some parts eerily haunting. This album is a keeper!!!
I remember seeing them for the first time in Milan. They played Mind's mirrors and my brain just stopped. I was absolutely paralized, hypnotized and enchanted by those sounds. I couldn't believe what I had just listened to. Then In life is death started playing and the crowd started moshing but I couldn't move. They definetely wrecked my brain. As Bill Burr says: "It was a fuckin' life altering experience"
Okay so the part from 10:21- 12:14 is clearly just trolling, though the goofy-ass two-note solo is actually really clever, it signifies their defiance to completely repeat a bar or set of notes in the place where you'd expect it, like when the 4th measure comes back around. Then they just end with that super low distorted 3 note chug repeating for a solid minute because f**k you. Best album for sure.
this is their best album from start to finish imo. I love all of their music and all of their albums have great songs, but in terms of listening in its entirety from start to finish I think this is their greatest masterpiece. Along with the I EP, that one is another gem.
One track in 13 parts. I put the CD on in the car on a long-ish drive when I had just gotten it and couldn't believe how I was already into "track" 4 when I noticed the sound had changed somewhat. Now if I hear any subset of the whole thing, my mind craves the next section.
So imminently visible this cloaked innocent guilt sentenced to a lifetime a second of structured chaos trampled by the ferocious raging crowds of solitude I'm the soil, beneath me soaking up the sustenance of my own death extradited to the gods of chance the dieties of all things random alive, multicolored, twitching in their dead monochrome world....
You can clearly hear how Tesseract took this sound and ran away with it. Great band in their own right but Meshuggah pioneered this shit. Love the album, don't understand the hate it gets.
Tracklist:
Autonomy Lost - 0:01
Imprint Of The Un-Saved - 1:40
Disenchantment - 3:16
The Paradoxical Spiral - 5:00
Re-Inanimate - 8:12
Entrapment - 9:16
Mind's Mirrors - 11:45
In Death - Is Life - 16:15
In Death - Is Death - 18:17
Shed - 31:39
Personae Non Gratae - 35:14
Dehumanization - 37:01
Sum - 39:57
Автор: закрепи комментарий или скопируй в описание видео для удобства, заранее спасибо! =)
Сделал
@@Necromo7ph 😃🤝😃
The struggle to free myself from restraints
Becomes my very shackles
hardest lyrics of all time
They know what’s up
Coldest bar ever
Dear lord, who would’ve thought Meshuggah would have relatable lyrics?
Today I am listening just for that line. 4:20
I love how the most played part of the entire Catch-33 album is AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Sum
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
the beginning of the suite called "Shed" is literally that
ČOKOLÁDOVÉ MUFFINY S POUŽÍVATEĽOM
RW°
This album sounds like a H.R. Giger painting converted into audio waves... mechanical, twisted, dark and eerily human.
Yeah man. Just like what has been done for "They move below" video. Spectacular job
"making future metal" damn right, this album sounds like it came out in 2126 but its older than me. such timeless music graces this earth once every blue moon. Meshuggah is truly a band to behold.
This is meshuggah's best album. There are many greats. The thrash perfection of contradictions collapse/none. The brutal insanity of chaosphere. The immaculate groove of nothing. The insane technicality of obzen. This has the best bits, wrapped up in its own theme. It is timeless.
You mean theres a one Huge great or theres 3 parts of a masterpiece? :3
Best album indeed
Totally agree , for me this and I are my personal favourites , I'm a really big fan of nothing as well , got to confess I was a little disappointed with obzen and kollos . Immutable is brilliant though 👍
Na #1 destroy erase and improve #2 chaosohere #3 The violent sleep of reason #4 obzen #5 immutable #6 contradictions collapse #7 kolloss #8 catch 33 #9 nothing. I dig every album but nothing. That album is all noodling and vocals horrible. Jens was adjusting to slower more polished lower sounds . Most ppl put it # 1 I put it dead last.
@@tonybell7267 lol nothing is my least favorite. #1 Destroy erase and improve #2 chaosohere #3 violent sleep of reason......all raw non digital. #4 obzen #5 contradictions collapse #6 immutable #7 kolloss # 8 catch 33 # 9 nothing.
THE STRUGGLE
TO FREE MYSELF FROM RESTRAINTS
BECOMES
MY VERY SHACKLES
Perhaps their best album
To me, it is.
Most definitely
Perhaps
It's a masterpiece.
yes!
I mean there's just no fucking way this came out in 2005. It feels like the world is spinning around me. How can something not age even just a tiny bit? The production quality and the haunted trance it puts you in is just invaluable. BANGER ALBUM
It's pretty insane how timeless this album is, man.
Sounds like they found their way with this one!
When you make art that is not trying to copy whatever is currently popular, your art will age waayyy slower than others.
exactly
for more *extremely ahead of its time* music, check out 'sol niger within' it's a side project from the guitarist from 1997.
What a fucking MASTERPIECE this record makes me question reality …my jaw dropped when first heard that album as a teenager…
the heaviest Shuggah album, ridiculous grooves. I wish they'd do this experimental/Ambient stuff again, even if just for one more album. This whole album has an existential dread none if their other albums do
Idk man Koloss might be heavier
@@rustyshackleford9452 In an aesthetically minded way, maybe.
... 🤘 🇸🇪
all three of you are wrong. immutable is their heaviest record
@@RedCap-vz1dw koloss*
Im my opinion this may be the single best piece of music ever recorded
Try Sol Niger Within and then come back.
this album on LSD is probably not very healthy
but I found it to be quite the wholesome experience
staring down the abyss of organic dreams and all~
What was it like?
Estaba buscando este comentario. Este album en LSD es un viaje al Inframundo, hay tanto oculto en esta entrega que frente a la percepción no-estimulada pasa desapercibido.
so glad to be a fan of this band more than 20 years,
this album is just INSANE
Oh yeah? I’m so glad to be a fan of this band for over 25 years!
@@vogelvogeltjeno one cares
@@robbledot7290I'm happy to be a fan of this band for over 153 years ago back in 1870
Technically, over 20 yrs is the same as over 25 yrs. I definitely remember when chaosphere came out and the first time I heard new millennium. Ahh to be a metalhead kid in the 90's.
Only been a fan for 2 years, can't wait to get through the rest of they albums. So far this and DEI are my favourites without question Nothing aint far behind either
I graduated high school in 05. There were a lot of great albums around that time. I had never heard of Meshuggah at that time, but this album is a masterpiece that will continue to awe me for years to come. The djent genre has copied sounds from Meshuggah, but no one will replace their ability to operate outside the normas and sound so damn wonderful. People dissecting what an entire album's meaning is and not one is wrong.
That outro is mesmerising
This whole album is such a groove. It's like a movie in song form. And it's a damn good one.
why did I not listen to these guys earlier
but you made it nonetheless
I remember meshuggah from like 1998-1999??
I was just asking myself the same question
I'm just here for my yearly dose of Catch 33. I know we all love the whole album, but right now I'm so deep into 09:49 and onwards
The solo is out of this world
ive thought about this song for something like at least once a day
theres no way in hell i'd wait for a year to pass before revisiting
I love how this album is like one big song all together. Excellent \m/
... 🤘 🇸🇪
Yeah, to me it feels weird to skip into the middle of it or whatever.
I gotta listen to it from start to finish unlike their other stuff.
@@woobi4739 same. dont wanna skip a beat
always felt like 3 songs to me
0:00 Autonomy Onward
11:47 Minds Mirrors Onward
35:16 Personae Non Gratae til the end
@@pentexsucks43 3 parts... 33... Catch 33.
Bobbing just your head, or tapping just your foot isn’t enough for Meshuggah.
It’s a whole body affair to vibe along with that time signature 🤘
try learning this stuff on guitar, it's so much fun to jam at the top of my volume knobs.
... 🤘 🇸🇪
... MESHUGGAH 🇸🇪 from Sweden, Scandinavian excellence ... 🤘 🇸🇪
it's actually just 4/4, but the polyrhythms and polymeters make it seem like it's a whole different time signature
@@thallduck Then it's... not 4/4, only the drums are usually. This is such a weird argument, "yeah it's all 4/4 bro except all the instruments that aren't in 4/4"
I've been listening to meshuggah for a few years now. I'm also starting to think this is probably their best album. It's slowly but surely growing on me and every time I listen to it I'm almost in disbelief for how obscure, poetic, violent this is❤
As a long time fan, this is the Opus
Agree totally. @@senseicorey9979
This is peak Meshuggah. 18 years into the band, this feels like the vision they worked up to. Then they created masterpieces since then, but no complete album that comes together so perfectly as this in every little detail. All sounds so organic, not forced in any way.
hands down their best album
It is truely a mindful experience.
Yeah. Meshuggah at their best.
... 🤘 🇸🇪
On the last tour they did Minds mirrors in death is life/is death right in the middle of the set. It was hauntingly perfect. Best show ever no one touches the mighty Meshuggah. 🤘🤘
Tht sht was fking awesome
I saw them in Riverside California for the immutable shows, and damn, when 22:13 kicked in, it actually made me cry. I've always loved this album the most out of all their work, and finally hearing that groove live, less than 10 feet away from Fredrik is a feeling I don't think I'll ever feel again
They did it again two days ago in Milan, it was astonishing
This album, is creepy, foreboding, but oddly beautiful all at once. It has a unique atmosphere compared to the rest of their albums, and the lyrics are as poetic as it gets for Meshuggah.
And most of all, it was fun to headbang to. I might need to go a doctor now.
Autonomy lost is such a fitting name for the beginning riffage
It feels like all body control has ceased and you want to just drop - great for slow headbanging
Yes and sum is such a fitting name for the finale.
It feels like the world crumbling
the BEST album from meshuggah...
My favorite album of all time
The last time I listened to this was ~10 years ago, and I'm still impressed. The album is really tied together well, and I think the best way I can describe it is as a mural of sound.
Masterpiece, my favourite metal album
... 🤘 🇸🇪
Try Koloss or Obzen...or even nothing. Compared to this? Yeah this is a D maybe C-
@@mintgumornot 🤣 ..... as if i didn't knew their discography...... believe it or not.....it's a matter of preference.......
@@dieheiligenhallen5184 and let me guess: Ænema is your favorite tool album? Lol
@@mintgumornot It's good to understand that your opinion is not fact. Therefore, it is valid for anyone else to consider this album better than any other.
41:06 - 42:36 holy fuck
This album is genius
17:17 best riff in the history of the universe.
Amazing piece of art
i love this album soooo fucking much. best meshuggah album, best metal album. the space it puts me in is like no other and to this day i haven't found anything close to it.
... 🤘 🇸🇪
Listening to sum is like witnessing the end of the world
Better than obzen? Ooooook....
indeed
yup@@mintgumornot
39:01-39:26 Their Best Breakdown.
Meshuggah is the greatest band on the planet.
For me they come at number 3 of my favourites behind Necrophagist and Opeth
meshuggah never released a bad album IMO \m/
\m/
How bout now?
@@krispykreme Still no.
@@krispykreme lmao just wanting to hate everything new
@@dedompler lol you know nothing about me I listen to new music all the time
Man.. It's been about 6 months. I can only play my drumkit a few hours a week but I'm almost done learning the first trilogy of this album. What a pleasurable challenge
This is my favorite album
I heard Immutable today that would by my 2nd favorite album but this is still the first. Those dark atmospheric moments and voices used in this are a masterpiece.
Seems like this album isn't nearly as loved as their others but I personally think it's fantastic.
20:34 - 21:05 and then 21:06 - 22:14 are two awesome sections, and I love how the 2nd section leads right back into a heavier sounding groove, so sick
@@micko12345678 so jealous, that's sick
Shed - I cry every time
Fuck yea bro! The mind games they play on us rhythmically seems impossible to execute. But they do it with devilish denial. It almost sounds like rhythms so random that they must have heard a child humming to himself, and just captured that and put it in a 4/4 format
cant get over the fact that the album recorded with Line 6 Pod Pro
Misha Mansoor had to be a tryhard and mess simple things up. Lol
The struggle to free myself from restraints become my very shackles.
A lie to maintain equilibrium, to hold me in this dead realm, this last ever dream
I'm the thought that never crossed my mind. Disguised in the evident. Forever unredeemed
A new level reached, where the absence of air lets me breathe
I'm inverted electrical impulses. A malfunctioning death-code incomplete
All things before me, at first unliving glimpse undeciphered
Its semantics rid of logic. Nothing is all. All is contradiction
Grinding, churning, the sweetest ever noises
Decode me into their non-communication
A soundtrack to my failure, one syllable, one vowel
A stagnant of endings. Un-time unbound. Merging to from the multi-none
A sickly dance of matter, malignantly benign. Greeting the chasm - unbearable, sublime
Vision will blind.
Severance ties.
Median am I.
True are all lies.
True are all lies?!?......fucking MESHUGGAH in top form, melting my brain, love it
Catch 33 is the best album on earth.
That riff at 16:17 is just so savage man.
Really love that riff butt i think it need something more
Truer words were spoken, two mins of sheer badassery 🤙😡🤘
they reuse it in Obzen album.
Always my favorite part of this album
@@rizkyadiyanto7922 where
just total music masterpiece. best meshuggah work,
The best meshuggah song.
great music for concentration
the build up from 31:56 through till the end of the album is amazing. Gives me energy!!
40:13 is the catch 33 gspot
Wow, this is a great album!! I was binge listening Gojira when "Catch 33" was recommended by You Tube. I heard a couple of Meshuggah songs in the past, but nothing like this, I am now definitely a fan. The album was melodical with some parts eerily haunting. This album is a keeper!!!
I remember seeing them for the first time in Milan. They played Mind's mirrors and my brain just stopped. I was absolutely paralized, hypnotized and enchanted by those sounds. I couldn't believe what I had just listened to. Then In life is death started playing and the crowd started moshing but I couldn't move. They definetely wrecked my brain.
As Bill Burr says: "It was a fuckin' life altering experience"
Okay so the part from 10:21- 12:14 is clearly just trolling, though the goofy-ass two-note solo is actually really clever, it signifies their defiance to completely repeat a bar or set of notes in the place where you'd expect it, like when the 4th measure comes back around. Then they just end with that super low distorted 3 note chug repeating for a solid minute because f**k you. Best album for sure.
It's kinda goofy, but goes stupid hard.
Best part is 0:00 - 47:30
This is with a floor Podfarm! Sounds amazing. Crazy tone. Buster from Vildhjarta brought me here.
All of their albums have a very unique tone and that certainly helps keep their sound fresh, especially since sticking with the same style since 2001
The best of the best
36:00 A LIEEEEEEEE
that scream was powerful as fuck
This entire album is an audio black hole ...
Great analogy
A horrifying exultation but not unheralded
this is their best album from start to finish imo. I love all of their music and all of their albums have great songs, but in terms of listening in its entirety from start to finish I think this is their greatest masterpiece. Along with the I EP, that one is another gem.
Would love to see them do this whole thing live!
Yea man, would pay so much money to see that happen
where is that cool guy in the comment section who posts timestamps for each song? you disappoint me guys
Nope, u just don't need it on this one.
No need, the albums is the song
'Song' 🤣
IDiLife & IDiDeath are just the bestest, especially live 🤟😑🤚
This album is like one, whole track.
One track in 13 parts.
I put the CD on in the car on a long-ish drive when I had just gotten it and couldn't believe how I was already into "track" 4 when I noticed the sound had changed somewhat. Now if I hear any subset of the whole thing, my mind craves the next section.
39:10 YESSSSSS
Damn i wish i could travel back in time to listen to this for the first Time ever
Insane!
the algorithm wanted to feed me good meshuggah
39:10. Fuck.
Nobody:
The baby in business class behind you:
Not even if I drink 2 Lts of Coke
@@nicolot4652 not even if I do 2g of Coke
@@schpleeb Yeah, also that lol
Longest song by these guys imo
Nice song!
Merci !!!
🦇
Disenchantment. 2nd line. Skein. you must be joking me Meshuggah. why are you teaching me English amongst your backdrop of Swedish metal perfection.
best album
Feels like just one giant song with occasional cuts in the audio. Wonder if there is a version without those gaps in the sound
Tomas’s snare hits when the singing starts. They are breaking the code of the matrix
40:21 guitar sounds like a fucking bee and its terrifying😂
That album is just one giant song, to me
well thats kind of the concept of the album lol
Hahahah
There’s no way to listen to any of these songs out of order
... MESHUGGAH 🇸🇪 from Sweden, Scandinavian excellence ... 🤘 🇸🇪
🔥🤘😘💨🇸🇪
16:45 that groove should go forever non stop loop repeat double back loop again it’s so sick
suspended in liminal space
The sountrack to my failure
Can someone please write all the lyrics of the whole album together here? Please
A ride past out solar system and back in 47:30!
WOW😮
5:32 - 8:30 headbang interval
So imminently visible
this cloaked innocent guilt
sentenced to a lifetime
a second of structured chaos
trampled by the ferocious
raging crowds of solitude
I'm the soil, beneath me
soaking up
the sustenance of my own death
extradited to the gods of chance
the dieties of all things random
alive, multicolored, twitching in their dead
monochrome world....
@31:40 Scared me a bit lol
You can clearly hear how Tesseract took this sound and ran away with it. Great band in their own right but Meshuggah pioneered this shit. Love the album, don't understand the hate it gets.
My nephew Has all their T ,shirts yo...
Este era el disco que se hizo con el EZdrummer?
39:12 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ARRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Serpents ,33, illuminati affiliated
It is common knowledge all cool bands are affiliated with Satan.
Give Them Tymor
Let's goooo
🖤🐍🖤
... 🤘 🇸🇪
Thrash is the Grandfather
Groove is the father
Djent is the son
Thall is the weird cousin