Where Did MoP Remix Go Wrong?
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- Опубліковано 17 лип 2024
- Where Did MoP Remix Go Wrong? There was a lot of things wrong when it first launched, but what could be fixed! Let's finalize this once and for all!
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I get why the cloak couldn’t give a new sub 70 alt the same stats as the most powerful main, but once that toon hit 70 the cloak should have the full stat bonuses earned on that account.
I agree - I also think that the exp bonus is stupid; I need the xp bonus the MOST at low levels, not 500% at capped level 70.
Yea I'm still back and forth on the 1:1 ratio on the cloak. It just makes sense when you think about it. Then someone will say something that pulls me the other direction...and then I go back to the 1:1 ratio thing. It's a battle for me. But yes, make the cloak match our main's cloak when our alts hit 70. No questions asked about that, just do it. THAT makes sense.
Hitting 476 and ~100k threads you feel like a God, no matter how many threads other people have. Retail feels so incredibly slow when you switch back, lol.
Yea for DPS, absolutely. When I went back for healing though, didn't notice it at all which was nice.
Imagine if there was a system in Mists of Pandaria Remix, where you could "Reforge" your cloak, and allocate stats to the points you need
THAT'S THE WORD I WAS LOOKING FOR! Reforge! I was filming and couldn't remember it. You hit is on the spot! That would be really fun to mess around with.
@@BDFProtector YES!!! 🙌
I think that would be a blast.
Remix has been some of the most fun I’ve har in WoW. Excited for the next one
Yea it's been a ton of fun and I put A LOT of hours into it. Definitely looking forward to the next one. Hopefully with some changes to improve the experience.
What went wrong?
1) Releasing it in a state with obvious, obvious imbalances
2) Sloppily "fixing" it over time. Idk what is so great about making the timeless isle and isle of thunder irrelevant and thunneling all players into raids. Their currency buffs made the games rarest mounts even more worthless now instead of actually tackling the problem of the gearing upgrade cost STRUCTURE.
3) Introudicng daily chores (daily quest and so on), Removed playtime = power and made it time gating = power. I had more fun in the early weeks when it was just: play and do whatever you want instead of: Do your daily quests, do your thunder vault, do the throne of thunder, log off after 1 hour.
4) Gear Bronze cost progression. First 5 levels are crazy expensive for the absolutely tiny power gains. Then for the very same costs the levels after it give huge, huge power gain. I think none of the people would have cried about upgrade costs if it started at 1k and went up to 6k instead of 4.5k bronze on every single level.
5) Alts suck. It feels horrible to play them if you don't get your cloak power. Why not make it so you start with a fraction of your cloak and unlock more and more while leveling up? On max lvl you get your full account wide cloak stats.
6) Scaling. Pretty much combines with number 5). My lvl 70chars are weaker than my lvl 10s except for my main who does 30 mil dps...
7) World bosses... Srsly. Just introduce a buff on them that reduces their damage taken by 90%. It ticks down by 1% every second. It makes it so they can be alive for atleast 10 seconds, without also making it harder to kill for less geared players. I said this 1 month a go and it's even more true to this day. On Nalak it's so bad that even as a max mastery DH you won't make it in time from the thone of thunder summoning stone. Boss dies within 2 seconds.
To me this event showed me 2 things:
A) Blizzard hasn't learned anything. The War Within is going to continue to be plagued with problems.
B) What's left of the community on retail is ridicolously toxic.
I've had a lot of fun and quickly maxed out the event but the crying on this event and the buffs and nerfs of blizzard really did a number on the joy I've had on this event, while the problems are so obvious and so easy to fix.
You've got some really good points. Number 5 hit me the hardest. Alts do suck. I don't want to play them because my time is invested in my main's cloak. Why can't my cloak match my main's when I hit 70? I would love to go into a raid with my new paladin that just max level, but that's not gonna happen.
Simple. Set a stop on certain threads once you've reached cap. Like, once you've already reached max level, stop awarding XP threads, or if Mastery is capped at 200%, stop awarding threads that give Mastery. But, there should be an uncapped thread(s) that continuously increases so you can still be rewarded for doing content. Maybe the primary stat, like Intellect, Strength, Agility. The gear set and bonus dmg/ability gems is also a great idea.
Yea I'm really hoping the address this stuff on the next runaround. If not, we'll be complaining even more. It felt sloppy.
I hear many content creators talking about the 476 item level as if it were te cap but I see lts of players sporting 556 level gear and being basically gods: am I missing something?
Where have you seen 556 in Remix? I'm hearing rumors about higher ilvls than 476 and I would like to see pictures.
@@Quaylin maybe 476 is the average item level? I was referring to single items being 556, maybe that's where my confusion comes from.
I think the cloak sharing should have been percent-based among alts, based on how high an achievement like Infinite Power is and your highest thread count achieved. Example, IP1 shares x% of your cloaks threads, based on your highest amount achieved. IP2 shares 2x%, IP3 shares 3x%, and so on capping out at IP10. That way, any additional threads on your main still progresses alts.
Hopefully we'll see some changes the next time around.
Where it went wrong: Can’t enjoy the dungeons/raids when they get steamrolled in 5 seconds. Then lumping everything into bronze rewards. There’s no fun in hunting rares (that were actually somewhat rare in MoP) when they don’t drop the special items that they should. The power disparity (especially at the start) ruined the feel of remix and needed to be designed differently. I enjoyed the nostalgia of playing through all the quests (though they needed to put back the missing stuff), but outside of that remix felt like a mobile game.
I leveled 2 characters but couldn’t do another. There’s simply no enjoyment in the way instanced content plays in remix.
Yea I don't think the event was for everyone and they pitched it so well, but didn't deliver on what they pitched. Hopefully we'll get a better remix in the future.
I had a blast - once I had reached 476 all the bitterness about Froggers just went and the Bronze poured in (with help of some alts) & I got Everything you could buy. The only sticking point are the Remix Weapon Transmogs... Farmed a lot of them - had to make more Alts for some of them. I have however kept farming Bronze incase they eventually come to a Vendor.
Yea It's worth getting to 476 because you just have a ton of fun. The bronze flows, you feel OP, it's a great experience. Still, I would like to see some things changed next time around.
Historically Blizzard never reuses the same tokens twice, they'll either convert them into worthless gold or invent a higher teir of token. Haha you're tied in to FUTURE FOMO, Blizzard are like crack dealers lol
I'd be down for more gold. That would allow me to fund my Warcraft Rumble purchases with WoW tokens. That game is surprisingly awesome.
These are the most important issues for me atleast
Stat caps should just be unlocked for remix - important note, threads gained also need to be lowered to about what they were on release without frog farms, reaching current caps would be way slower without the massive boosts to thread gains.
Cloak should be 1:1 on account but just make it scale based on level, so that if you have 100% crit on your level 70s from cloak, you have (roughly) 100% crit on your fresh lvl 10 and not 20000% or whatever you would have if you had true lvl 70 stats on a lvl 10 - this would also mean thread values don't need to change as you level, you can farm up your cloak equally on a lvl 10 alt as playing your main 70.
Currencies should be split between upgrades and cosmetics
No rng drops (weapon skins) put it all on the shops
Gear upgrade discounts account wide
I like what you're putting down. Yea I go back and forth with the 1:1 ratio on the cloak to be honest. It's an internal battle of mine because I do think it could work, and then I think that everything is fine the way it is now, but then it's not. AHHHHHHH! It's rough for me sometimes. But yea, put it all in the shops and let us grind to currency to buy it all. Scaling the cloak for alts could be that fix we're looking for.
No need to upgrade gear above 430 - whether it's a raid or dungeon there will be one or two players blasting through the trash & two-shotting the bosses to the extent that all you're doing is looting the corpses.
True. You don't need to upgrade your gear any higher if you don't want to. But I will say it's hella fun at 476, and we're all here to have some fun.
One thing that went wrong was to not put weapon transmogs on a vendor
Yea that would have been nice.
I think the whole idea about remix was to test ability templates among the various classes, and see how that scales with playstyles
Interesting.
Remix has ruined me for alts, lol. My remix main is a paladin, and playing him versus my paladin alt on retail is a HUGE difference - he’s speedy, nigh invincible, and most things that touch him just die without any effort on his part. When remix ends he’s gonna feel soooo slow & weak. Even my casual remix alts are gonna feel nerfed.
Like, I loved the experience, I think it worked well and I hope they do it again for other expansions, but I hope people are ready for the end 😂
I'm worried about this too. So, I went back to season 4 and I'm healing (Holy Paladin) and it's not bad because I'm not doing dmg. But I can only imagine the remix people coming back and doing dps like before. They must be thinking "oh no...no no no no no...I feel so weak now." But as for healing, It's alllllllll good.
In my mind, the cape should have been 1:1, cumulative, and the exponetial growth of power should have been related to the cape rather than the gear. The reason to it is really two things. First, there are multiple target audiences playing this content. Ther are people who wanted to play alts without needing to do dailies that could have benefited from an account wide cape that is shared among all of their alts. There are raiders who would benefit from the cape's growth by doing their daily runs on a single character and continuing to get those rewards. There are some players who may log in to do dailies and open world stuff on one or many characters who would have also benefited from the increase in power the cape provided. In essence, the cape provided the perfect vehicle for anyone and everyone to becomes extremely powerful in a variety of different play styles.
The second reason is bronze. Having bronze be both for cosmetics and gear upgrades which ultimately locked people out of content because gear scores aren't high enough isn't great. Had they gone with the cape suggestion above, every player has the ability to get powerful enough to solo content or get into various groups just by the nature of having a high level cape. If a person really wanted to go hard, then upgrading the gear should have been the next step but not the first. The marketing made is abundant clear that the cape was one of the primary selling points for remix until blizzard seemingly forgot their own marketing.
My mind goes back and forth sometimes when I read comments like this. I wish that the cloak had been a 1:1 ratio, then someone says something that changes my mind, then I get convinced that it should be a 1:1 ratio. It's a personal battle of mine. You have some REALLY good points. Yes, the cloak should have been the main focus and it wasn't. Hopefully they learn from this and make the next one more focused on the item and not the gear.
@@Quaylin I hope they do. The idea that to get bronze or upgrade gear the only real path was to run mythic dungeons discounts a significant portion of the community who doesn't want to do that. It could also be people who want to solo ti but can't. I wanted to get the gear from garosh but given other games that are out and the gear upgrades needed, I couldn't put that time into it since I would give up on the rewards that I wanted in the time I had.
I decided to forgo some of those rewards and get the things I actually wanted in the time I had without upgrading my gear. There should have been another path though especially since I have 7 alts I got to 70 so far. That should have counted for something but because of the cloak it doesn't.
Yea the need more end game content and different paths to do just...stuff.
What went wrong? Nothing, I'm having a blast lol
I did too. But there are some things that were wrong and could be fixed. But also, there were a lot of things right.
I would love some sort of catch-up for alts in terms of threads gained. If it's not shared between chars.
I go almost all in on my main, but would love to try some of my alts with the same amount of power. But before I am done with my daily routine, I am either exhausted or heading to bed.
My daily routine is: Trove of the thunder king > World bosses > timeless isle daily > daily dungeons / scenarios > MSV/HOF/TOES/TOT/SOO HC > and I do LFR if I bother.
I wouldn't have time to do that on an alt, I barely have the time to do all the HC raids.
Yea I would have played my alts more if they had some sort of catch up to my main's progression. It made alts boring and I didn't want to play them.
Bc remix hype. Warglaives for everyone( different colors) , nether drakes, rays. Even a DST trink even, All that!
Hopefully we'll see it in the future! I think a WoD and then Legion remix would be sick too!
Remix was great. Just start the next one with the same info they gathered by the 3rd week of this one. Yea us people that started day 1 got a bit janked over if we didn't "exploit early. exploit often" But ive been done for 3 or 4 weeks. have the maxed out guy that did mythic soo and all the cosmetics/mounts.
Didn't take very long. Was actually fun**. My only suggestion would be make it a 1 month event. double the bronze.
No one wants to run SoO 100+ times in a month. It just is what it is.
** - fun at first. by the time you're max geared and running that M SoO you desperately want to never touch MoP for a long time.
Yea I started to get burned out too. I only have two achievements left to do and I don't think I'll get them done. But yea, it was fun, but they could change a lot for the next time.
New Pets toys and armor. Blizz did great adding all the new mounts but only 2 new pets and no toys or new armor sets is disappointing.
Yea for those who played a lot of MoP I can see it as "eh". For us that missed it it's kinda nice.
I must share one thing, today i met a player who had his trinkets on 502 and and one finger on 392. his Ilvl was 520, When i asked him HOW this was possible, all he answer was :0
I had to take a photo if this cause im still confused. At first i thought they hade made some changes but they have not, or have they ?
Have you looked more into this? Got pictures you can show in discord? Would like to see more of this.
@@Quaylin I can show you in discord for sure.
I loved it … I finally created the alt army I have wanted a long time but was to lazy to
Level up chars to even be able to farm old content
Plus
Got all the bronze goodies and in retrospect it may not be popular but it really wasn’t that painful I don’t think
At first I didn’t like either
But like a lot of your ideas
Great video
I only made one super powerful char out of the 30 level 70’s I made because didn’t want to farm bronze again for gear btw and didn’t see point in having another when I could just make alts for retail in my time
Yea Remix was a lot of fun. I do think they could change a ton to make it a better experience for sure.
i want BFA remix, i didnt get to experiens bfa back in the day
That would be awesome.
I absolutely loved remix and getting all the appearances and mounts though I would have liked to see more pets. You're right about the player base not having to shame on each other we should just help each other where and when we can and create a positive atmosphere.
Yea we could all be a little nicer to each other for sure. Remix was a fun though. Hoping that they fix a lot for the next one.
What exactly do you mean with "go wrong"? I've analyzed it quite a bit, and the basic functions of mop remix, or the idea of it, was to make people feel a certain degree of FOMO, which is a very powerful method to make people do things they don't really want to do. We perceive what we do as valuable, though in reality that's most definitely not the case for the majority of people when it comes to MoP Remix. But I'm getting into a very nuanced and complicated subject, it's annoying to find the words to describe it correctly, but to summarize it I would say it like this: Retail=cash grab, FOMO, unhealthy attachment, a false sense of coming value even though that never comes, whilst sacrificing fun in the moment (leveling, gearing, etc), and MoP Remix is the same, it's basically a way to manipulate people's brains. Did you have fun leveling in MoP Remix...are you sure? and did you have fun grinding hard...are you sure? and did you end up finding the items you got worth the time-cost investment? are you sure? are you sure those items were worth grinding for when everybody can get them, and when they require 0 skill, talent or real effort to aquire? I know the answer to this, but I don't think the majority of people do, then again...most people don't have the genes that makes them analyze things, avoid confirmation bias, bias in general, and to think based on evidence as opposed to personal experience or feelings. MoP Remix was always a cash grab made to manipulate less intelligent people, and the same goes for retail post-mop/wod...and I say that because those were the last expansions with gameplay that was fun in the moment regardless of the outcome :), quality>quantity. PS: I'm not trying to be rude, I don't really have much emotions when it comes to objective subjects, as it's irrational, hopefully you don't get offended by this message, as it's meant to argue for a scientific viewpoint more or less.
I think it's important to remember that what people declare is fun is VERY subjective. For example, I find acting in theater on a stage fun, while many others find that terrifying and the complete opposite of fun. Your comment seems to support the idea that WoW is 100% not fun and that people are wasting their time. But the fact is that some people are having fun. There are a lot of things that went wrong with MoP Remix, but there are a lot of things that went right. I'm not gonna say the second part in my title because that's not gonna grab anyone's attention on UA-cam. Plain and simple. When you start making videos, you have to have attention grabbers. Some people don't like that, but as long as I keep the subject of the title focused on the main meat of the video, then everything is ok. But, all in all, MoP Remix was fun because I didn't have to think. That was nice to play my favorite game, be OP, and just not have to think while I watch a movie.
I always wondered why they never had all the phoenix mounts to buy.
Oh snap, I'm not familiar with these. I quit WoW for many years right after Cata launched so I missed the majority of MoP.
@@Quaylin yeah you can actually see them at the Mogu’shan palace outside the lorewalkers area in the Vale of Eternal Blossom. Vender is there and all the mounts flapping away but no actual option to buy them.
@@LC-lw4vy Interesting!
i think that was just too many time 90+ days, for a event so easy, most player in less 20 days make everything there... to me i need just 13 chars to put in the 70, and be exalted with celestial, too complete, and im to lazy to lvl up that chars... i think the next remix need to more hard to get strong or have less days maybe 30 to 45 days
It was a bit long. But, there are a lot of people still playing if you log on.
I would be down for a cloak-less raid. 👍
I tried! Maybe on the next stream if people jump on we can get one going. But it's gonna have to be a lot of people because just doing a PUG doesn't work. Nobody online wants to do it. They just want their bronze and then to get out.
having multiple currencies makes it a more complex system and it restrict player's freedom. You could just have one inflated currency and you choose hos to spend it. Some people don't care about transmogs or about armor's stats, so for those people they will be receiving a currency and never use it. While if you have a single currency you have the freedom to choose how/where to spend it.
A better and simple system is better than having many complicated systems in place.
This is my opinion at least
I hear ya. I don't think that they'll ever have a remix edition that satisfies everyone's wishes.
Finally.... Are the slowest boys in the class starting to see that mmorpgs and seasonality is just a huge fucking waste of time?
They announced it to work like your main boosting it and your alts using it. So bind to account. First letdown. 2nd. was all the frog og Goat farmers exploiting the game and Blizzard was so passive for so lomg. Its like they just dont care at Microsoft Blizzard headquarters. So in all they did poor job at maintaining the experience just like with Plunderstorm who forced you to do things in WoW you didnt like. It felt brute forced. Remix is at the same point now. They need to put som love and attention into it and lower the Cost of all gear and upgrades.
Yea or make bronze account wide at least. I liked your first point because I TOTALLY AGREE! They pitched this as if your cloak was the end all be all thing...and it's not. Let's hope for something better in the future.
i will tell you wants wrong: caps, nerfs, and trying to keep us down.
Right? Let us loose!
@@Quaylin i want my monk to have 150% run speed. i want mastery at 1000% i want to breath on things and then leech to max
Yea I want the TRUE Diablo/WoW mix. More Speed please.
The froggers really ruined it for me.
Can you go a bit more into detail on this? Here to hear you out.
@@Quaylin early on people farmed frogs in groups to rapid boost their cloaks. Created a massive disparity in player base. Couldn't get invited to raids without cloaks uber powerful. Blizz decided to nerf frogs and everyone stopped farming but the ones who did it early had a massive advantage. Blizz later nerfed the frogger cloaks but also nerfed alot of cloaks of people who had only farmed frogs very little. The frog farm was in Mists of Panderia and was never considered a cheat. Blizz decided to treat it as such well after remix was launched. Obviously blizz should have nerfed the frog farm before launch or left it alone.
@@alwoodel9551 Thanks. I’m aware of frog farmers. I made a video about it actually. I meant to phrase my reply as “tell me why the frog farmers bother you.” Because at this point people have caught up in gear ilvl and frog farmers are an “eh” subject.
@Quaylin yea sure. I farmed what im assuming is the intended way they wanted you too. All my dailies focusing on all the remix achievements and doing every raid daily. I had a really decent cloak. I hit 476 before I even had an epic item and it wasn't by design it was because I couldn't get into Heroics because I didn't have a frog cloak. Then when I finally did all the grinding I did didn't matter because a frog cloak in 346 gear made all my damge useless and just really took the fun out of it for me.
Once they balanced cloaks it wasn't so bad but before they nerfed the frog cloaks it was just not fun
In their panda theme they went wrong
How so? I liked it and I think it has the best soundtrack.