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I don't usually make requests, but speaking of Orly, there is a particular accident whose cause seems hopelessly muddled due, perhaps, to the official report never being translated into English. The crash of Air France flight 007 in 1962 has been alternately been blamed on malfunctioning elevator controls, and also in some versions, the pilot, for not recognizing he could still get the plane to take off. I've never felt there has been a definitive account of this crash. Thank you.
Kind of surprised you don't have a video on the crash of Partnair flight 394, or maybe you did/do have one but I just didn't see it. Either way keep up the awesome work, great content and excellent videos+research! Much love from Texas!
What if the passenger who "didn't follow flight crew instructions" wanted to join the Mile High Club and their companion was the one who smoked in the lavatory?
One of the points I find most disturbing is that the only passenger who survived did not listen to the crew's instructions... and all the other survivors were aircrew.
@@ninelaivz4334 Exactly what I was going to comment! If I'm in a place that is burning, I am not going to just sit there. I will readily stay calm and exit in an orderly fashion, but I will not just sit there or, as with Greenfell, I would not just stay in a burning building.
@@ZER0-- Although I can agree with you that situational awareness is key regarding an emergency evacuation, you have to remember that they weren’t exactly sure what caused the fire and/or where it originated. If the crew can’t assess the outside because of smoke, fire, debris etc, it could potentially escalate the danger by opening the exits and exposing the crew/passengers to even more peril. Fire needs oxygen to grow and by opening an exit, it could be comparable to spraying lighter fluid into an already burning campfire. Furthermore, the captain holds absolute responsibility to give the evacuation command to crew. If he ordered everyone to remain seated, the crew is supposed to trust and follow the ultimate authority on the aircraft. That passenger was super lucky to not follow instructions and save himself however, he could have put everyone in harms way much quicker had the source of the fire been on the exterior of the fuselage.
My Dad was flying 707s back then, & nearly a decade before this tragedy, had told me if a plane stops on the ground, Not at a gate or in a take-off line, to GET OUT, & ask questions later; you can always get back aboard, but you may not always have time to get out. Some decades after that, I was explaining to a city council member why only 90 seconds of foam in a new airport fire truck was sufficient, because if everyone was not out by then, they were already dead anyway, due to the highly toxic fumes from the interior contents of the burning plane. I told him it was a lesson I'd learned from a crash in Rome, Italy, which my Dad had witnessed as he was on approach there. Never wait for someone else to tell you to get out, & ALWAYS note where all exits are from your seat, including numbers of rows to each! People died on this Varig flight, & on that TWA flight in Rome, BECAUSE they waited! As noted, those who didn't wait survived. A fire on board in flight SHORTENS your time to get out, too, but 90 seconds is your max, in "best case" scenarios.
@@schwarzerritter5724 The report itself says the fire started melting the skin and the roof collapsed. That was from the fire inside that started in the lavatory. Experts who investigated this crash determined that. The fact that the plane stayed intact shows how survivable the crash itself was. The fire was the cause of so many deaths. Especially when passengers were kept on board.
@@alidapurdy Rewatching the video, it appears they did not have those inflatable sleds. So I guess the order to stay seated was given, so the passengers would not try to jump out the doors. But the fire brigade arrived later than the pilots hoped.
Some things must be said. I was Ricardo’s colleague at the engineering university of Petrópolis; my father was a Varig’s captain - that same night he flew to Paris with the entire board of directors of the company. Just 24 hour after the were at the crash site. 1. Ricardo was sit in the last row of the plane, he saw an ‘old lady’ coming out of the lavatory with ‘smoke’ (not fire) coming behind her. He didn’t think twice: he took his backpack and ran as fast as he could to the front of the plane - untill the cabin door, he also took a cloth, wet it, and put it on his face. 2. At this point there was no fire on board, but a thick black smoke. 3. Some crew member put a oxigen mask and went to the back in way to open a emergency door in way to suck the smoke out of the plane. But he just couldn’t find it. 4. When the plane touched the ground the oxigen sistem deployed automatically - and only then the fire started ! But is important to say that at this point all the passengers were already dead - because of the very toxic black smoke. There wasn’t even panic amongst the passengers - they were all in their seats with their seat belts buckled. 5. With the shock, Ricardo lost consciousness and only remembers waking up in the hospital. He was the first to be rescued by the firefighters. Is important to say that they focused their attention on the “black smoke” - and concluded that the material that coated plane’s fuselage was inadequate and caused the whole problem. When the smoke was on the lavatory, the crew used fire extinguishers - with no avail at all. They had to find a new material more resistent to fire to coat the plane’s fuselage.
Is it true that a year after the crash, he entered a Varig store and demanded the company give him a new plane ticket, since the plane crashed and he didn't get to London? É verdade que um ano dps do acidente, ele foi em uma loja da Varig e exigiu que eles dessem uma nova passagem pra ele, pq o avião caiu e ele cão chegou em Londres?
@@Mus1c1luv - Sorry, I don’t think that ‘fascinating’ is the adequate word for this tragedy - with so many lives lost. Only because a cigarette. Plane and cigarettes don’t go together. An enclosed environment, with thin air, surrounded by fuel all around. You know, in that same thip, when my dad was flying backto Brazil, it was a regular passenger flight. In the midle of the night he was walking thru the plane and caught a man sleeping with a lit cigarette almost falling out of his fingers in the aisle of the plane. You can imagine the scolding this jerk got from my father. rsrs. Those guys (smokers) are very irresponsible !
You can look it up online because I don't remember where it happened, but there is a story about a small commercial plane with less than like 30 people on board, where somebody brought an alligator and the alligator broke out into the back of the plane and the passengers all panicked and ran towards the front of the plane. It sent the plane into a nose dive that the pilot could not recover from because now I'll passengers were piled up in front. It would be like dropping a steel toe boot. The plane crash and everyone died. They found the alligator alive.
According to Google, one passenger survived (while a second survived but later died in hospital). And that makes sense, because otherwise the story of the crocodile would have never come out.
"It is necessary to give them receptacle so that disasters like this can never happen again." Sure, but also, it's necessary to give them a ride straight to prison right after the flight is over for consciously endangering the lives of everyone on board.
People have also tried to light incense, candles and Marijuana in the bathrooms -- they can't. It will set off a highly sensitive alarm. The ash trays are leftover from the older interior design (time to hire a new decorator.)
@@audreyandlinCompany Ash trays come from the factory in all commercial aircraft, including brand new types with brand new interiors. It's a mandatory item in the US, and aircraft cannot be dispatched with an inoperative ashtray.
@@beaufighter245 It's not that, IMO. There was a culture back then among smokers that it was perfectly ok to dispose of cigarette butts anywhere - in the trash, on the ground, on the carpet, wherever. The availability of ashtrays didn't matter. People flicked their butts anywhere.
I've heard of Varig Flight 967. It's one of the rare cases of plane disappearance with no trace found. Never would've thought that the Captain survived an earlier crash only to completely vanish from the face of the Earth in another.
'No trace found" or "didn't look hard enough" ? My guess is because it was only carrying cargo and crew they never bothered to go through the extreme hassle of searching the deep ocean. If that were a passenger carrying plane, something tells me that they could've and would've found that plane and investigated.
@@Tamaki742 To be fair with all of the wierdness surrounding 370, such as the faulty radar, unidentified entities on radar, the way it was still airborne and responding to sat coms for 6 hours after being lost from military radar despite the fact it was still in the radar coverage area after that point. And the way the US military radar track was never released. And the way they were so quick to term it a murder suicide with the US claiming that the captain had pre-flown the route in MSFSX but in reality the route they claimed was nothing like the actual accident route, and they recreated it from deleted data anyway. Anyway I could go on. But something screwey went on with that flight which is why it was and probably never will be found.
@@jimmydesouza4375 I'm still under the belief they were searching in the wrong place. It probably ended up in a hangar in Tibet, disassembled piece by piece.
This sounds silly but it genuinely worried me at the time. About 5 years back, I went on a flight from Glasgow to London and quite innocently took on board a big packet of cheese + onion crisps I'd bought in the cafe beforehand. Halfway through, went to eat them and found that the cabin pressure had expanded the bag to the size of a small balloon. Unwilling to open the bag in case it basically exploded and everyone thought it was a bomb (!) I briefly considered trying to find something sharp to puncture it but thought better of it. So summoned the stewardess who listened very patiently, took the bag of crisps away and opened it for me in the galley. She returned them to me untouched but accepted my offer of one from the open bag! Very professional of her as she probably thought I was a bit of a twit but all I could think of at the time was the bag of crisps exploding and everyone going into panic mode. I don't take crisps on board a plane now.
Thanks for the bag of Chips story but what does it have to do with this Varig tragedy. Oh btw once on Christmas Eve I was flying international on NWA and which was so cheap they did not provide free drinks so I planned ahead and brought my own cans of San Mig (beers) on board... After take off I popped the top of a still frosty can making a loud noise catching the attention of the of the GRanny Flight Attendant ... who then berated me breaking some made up rule that I couldnt bring my own ...and she actually confiscated it and dumped it.. I felt like a Hs kid being busted by the Scrooge principal... end of story . :)
@@tankthearc9875 Not ridiculous. They need to know how much you have drunk and not serve you too much lest you become one of those drunken assholes that causes problems. Out of curiosity have you been through puberty?
@@jasonseiple346 we were still international leaving Manila to GUM. So next ridiculous rule? Granny Scrooge sure didn't have the Christmas spirit. hahah.
@@tomservo56954 Research it. Passengers could not smoke on that flight...pilots could smoke in the cockpit which ended shortly after. Why do you think the passenger smoked in the shithouse if they could smoke in their passenger cabin seat.
My first trip to France was aboard this very plane, several years earlier. I recall well how every seat armrest had an astray built in, and that many passengers smoked on flights. Knowing the risks of having flames onboard, I am very glad that smoking is banned on flights the world over now. Fire onboard has to be one of the worst case scenarios to ever encounter.
Isn't that sick? Ashtrays in every armrest, yet this person had no problem tossing the butt in the trash. I remember those days and how smokers felt free (entitled) to toss their butts anywhere. "Cigarette-sucking buttheads." (I hate quoting Rush Limbaugh, but that's one that's worth quoting.)
The ashtrays in the armrests are still there for safety, in case a senile old person lights on up. The person on this flight probably knew they weren't allowed to smoke, which is why they nipped into the bathroom. There is one commercial airline in the middle east, I believe, that still allows smoking on board, but that could have changed
The main point of this incident is NOT smoking, but evacuation during the fire - a fire can be started by any means, electrical fault, etc. but it is what the crew does and how evacuation proceeds that's the point. The fact that the crew survived means that the landing was 100% survivable at the front of the plane. Most people could have escaped and survived given opportunity to evacuate immediate at the front and move to the front. "Be seated" instruction sealed their fate.
I knew that Aurigny was the first to ban smoking outright, as it’s listed in the onboard magazines, but it’s cool to hear my home’s airline being mentioned on the channel (and not for a bad reason thankfully). Awesome video as always.
Hey, my family can trace their roots on the channel islands back to the 1600s, or some equally ridiculous long long ago year. I bet we're related! (Feel like I have to point out, the 'us being related' bit was a joke)
@@tumslucks9781 well geez excuse me for getting excited. I come from a line of the family that moved to Australia a couple generations back, so I don't get a chance to talk to a lot of channel islanders. You have a super lovely day Tum.
One night in February 2018 I was on an Air Algérie plane from orly to Algiers, I went to the lavatory and smelled something that resembles plastic burning, I called the flight attendants who immediately reported it to the captain and started a thorough investigation of the nature of the smell, eventually, they found out half a cigarette still burning on a plastic part inside the lavatory. Thankfully if was discovered soon enough and no real danger came out of it. They ended up finding out the man who was smoking there and when we left the plane I saw him with the local police, a flight attendant informed me just before landing that he might be permanently banned from flying with the company. The weird stuff that stuck with me is when I told an old man sitting next to me about the incident, his reaction was very strange, he told me it's fine to smoke onboard, and that people used to smoke without problems in the 90s, and he also believed that banning smoking on airplanes was "nonsense"
That reaction seems pretty on brand for old goof, actually. He was probably a smoker himself. They don't have any consideration for their own health, why would they consider anyone else's? "Nonsense" is sucking on a cancer stick, inhaling lovely tar and poisons into your lungs, and puffing it out for all the folks around you to enjoy as well. "Nonsense" is doing that, but at 30,000 feet in a pressurized tube with no escape in the off chance you drop the stupid thing and start a fire 🙄
I agree that it is nonsense to smoke on an airplane, obviously. But what is actually wrong is all that "passive smoker" thing. There is not one single serious medical study (and will ever be) that proves "second hand smokers", at least in what refers to cancer, lung disease, etc.
An EgyptAir plane was brought down by the pilots smoking in 2016! The airline finally banned it after that. Smoking is still a common thing in Arab countries.
@@jaimepablomartinezdelgado9426 a simple search proves you wrong. However, I don’t need a research paper to tell me the dangers. You see both my parents smoked. I spent my entire childhood sick. By age 7 I had serious pneumonia. The doctors told my parents to quit. Dad did, cold turkey. Mom kept on. I developed life threatening asthma. I spent a decades with chronic bronchitis. I remember many times being in the back seat of the car as we were driving to the ER coughing so hard I was puking up bile and begging my Mom to open the car windows. I spent 15 years with blue lips! I am dependent on meds to keep me breathing. Cigarette smoke on a person I pass in the grocery store causes me to have an asthma attack. I can go nowhere without my breathing machine. Mom is now on oxygen 24/7. She gasps, can’t go up and down stairs, can’t grocery shop. She can barely dress herself. Mom quit nearly 4 years ago when her beloved baby sister died from lung failure caused by smoking. It was too late for mom. Her lungs are shot and she has heart disease.
I was working for Varig at Heathrow at the time and remember that soon after this sad and terrible crash we had to remove copies of a "magazine" from a LHR departure because it had several pages of glossy colour photographs of the wreckage which included photos of dead passengers still in their seats. It was a shock to everyone that the materials used in aircraft at that time was so dangerous.
Why would someone put pictures of dead and probably mutilated people in a magazine that's easily accessible to the public. Some kid could've picked it up and scarred themselves for life?
@@twistedyogert There was no rules or regulations in the 70's, you could send kids down mines to work 16hr a day so caring about what they read was the least of anyone's worries.
It's incredibly hard to believe there was once smoking allowed on planes. In our days, students in high schools were allowed to smoke outside between classes. I graduated in 1976 and smoked at school. In 1984 on our honeymoon to Florida I smoked on a plane. I don't smoke anymore but just thinking about all of this is just plane nuts by today's standards.
1988 was the last time I smoked on a plane. Glasgow to Rhodes. Must admit that, by then, I was thinking "this isn't a very sensible thing to do". I've quit now so it's not an issue any longer but, looking back, it is hard to believe it was acceptable.
Why is that hard to believe? The majority makes the rules and the majority smoked at that point in time. Its gone so far in the opposite direction that the idiotic idea of banning menthols is being entertained.
I know, I’m old enough to remember it. I I had to fly commercial a few times in the 1980s and hated it when people in the smoking section lit up, we could still smell it. Never made sense, absurd that a smoker can’t wait a few hours when flying.
I remember flying several long haul flights in 1984, Aus to Europe to USA. ALL had smoking and non smoking sections. I was 12 at the time. The worst flight was London- San Francisco, a British Airways flight half filled with a P&O cruise crew heading home after months at sea. They bribed the flight attendants to let them use their sleeping section and started a mile high club. 🤦♀️ At one stage I got up for a walk and returned to find a drunk guy asleep in my seat with a cigar still burning in his hand! ... and that was back in the days when people still got dressed up for plane flights! Lol! Things have changed s lot!
I remember the time when people got dressed up for a flight. Also when I was 11 I was on an Eastern flight from the Caribbean to Canada, as an unaccompanied minor. It was probably 1980 or so. Smoking was allowed on board and I’m allergic to cigarettes. That was the worst flight I’ve ever been on. My nose was completely blocked and I could barely breathe. So sorry for those innocent lives that were lost all because some selfish person couldn’t do without a cigarette.
I recall a flight to Hawaii, where I was in the non smoking area. The guy in the seat next to me lit a cigarette & I told him to put it out. He tried to laugh it off, but I told him that I was allergic to the smoke & WHEN I threw up, it wasn't going to be in My lap. He went to the back of the plane, and I never saw him again.
Reminds me a little of that ferry disaster in South Korea, where the crew told all the passengers,most of whom were school kids, to stay in their cabins. And then the crew made it off while all the kids drowned.
Yes, I thought the exact same thing watching this. That was horrific. So incredibly sad because it's in their culture to always trust and listen to adults.
a small note on that: the deck crew (captain, first mate, etc.) were among the first to be rescued from the MV sewol, but other crew members below deck stayed. in particular, three perished trying to save as many passengers as they could and steer them out while the 'remain in your cabins' alert was still blaring... very tragic indeed.
Have mercy that is just awful. Makes you think they just did not want the chaos small kids would surely exhibit in such a terrifying situation. They kept the exits open for themselves.
It wasn't the tobacco companies that resisted smoking bans on aeroplanes, it was passengers. Anyone who has been addicted to nicotine can instantly explain this. The biggest single contribution to the airline ban in smoking was the invention of smokeless nicotine delivery especially gum. This meant that airlines could ban smoking without causing smokers withdrawal effects. I recall being on a Turkish Airlines flight in the early naughties where the air Stewards offered nicotine gum to passengers.
The taste of nicotine gum was foul. I used it to try to quit smoking, to no avail. The only way I quit was when I got so sick I was almost in a coma for a weekand could not smok mot even a biyfive days, and when I came around I had no lingering nicotine withdrawalls, so I never lit up again. Whenever I got the urge I put my thumb between two fingers and took a deep breath of clean air, letting it out just as I would have released tobacco smoke. I got hooked at 15, thinking the Marlboro Man was just cool as heck, but it really was child abuse by Big Tobacco. They paid out billions from lawsuits, but no smoker got a dime of the money, just lawyers and do-gooder stop smoking facilities and governments printers making up pamphlets.
I think I hey mean to he tobacco companies have some rault because over the last 75 years they selectively bred tobacco to be more and more addictive. This came out in the late 1980s.
This is such a sad incident. The forced landing was an excellent feat of airmanship; the sad thing is that if the fuselage had broken apart, more people may have been able to escape. Chloe, have you ever considered making videos about nautical incidents? My husband (a nautical geek) and I always watch your videos on our TV while eating breakfast every Saturday (he loves your channel now, too!), and he would love to see videos about disasters involving sea-going vessels. I think it would be amazing as well! Thank you so much for your faithful uploads. You’ve had videos for us when you move, when you’re sick, and when production doesn’t go the way you thought it would. We all appreciate you so much!
I took my first flight at 3 months old, which I obviously don't remember, but by the time I was 4 yrs old I was an experienced enough flyer that my parents felt comfortable letting me fly alone on a 90 min flight to visit my grandparents (people who weren't flying were allowed to go through security and all the way to the gates in those days). I mention that because I'm old enough to remember when planes had smoking and non-smoking sections, and it's crazy to think that open flames and smoldering embers inside of airborne planes were considered completely normal just a few decades ago. And smoking on planes ultimately wasn't banned due to safety concerns, it was the public's health consciousness that motivated the change in policy. But given how many people smoked for so many years on so many planes, it's kind of a miracle that there weren't more mishaps like this.
I worked with Boeing for 19 years ... they were *good* years, both for Boeing and for me (1986-2005) but trouble was brewing -- Harry Stonecipher *really, REALLY* wanted to pwn Boeing and he succeeded eventually, but your video reminds me of how rapidly the industry (and the insanity of the passengers!) was changing in that time. Thanks for offering me yet another aviation-related channel that "sticks to the facts"!!
Sorry, but I think the insanity of Boeing was also getting worse. Maybe that was mostly after 2005, but at some point they cared less about safety and more about profit. It was like the Ford bean counters and their Pinto death machine. You were there for the 737/747 PCU cover-up. That was a growing sickness at Boeing.
Sadly, the careless passenger theory is very plausible, as there are far too many examples of fires started in the lavatory wastebins by carelessly discarded cigarettes, left by passengers using the lavatory for a (for very good reasons) illegal cigarette. Thankfully, most do not have endings like this, but some do. And I never seize to be infuriated by ppls willingness to risk not only their own lives, but selfishly also risk other ppls lives, just coz they cant wait another friggin ½ hour and cant even bother to be careful. I am, however, also shocked, that crew told passengers to stay in their seats, while the crew themselves were quick to leave the plane. The flight crew could do nothing from the cockpit, but the rest of them? Atrocious.
Excellent work Chloe, as always 👍🏼 Indeed, a very tragic crash. I was stunned by the fact you mentioned that the passengers where instructed to remain seated, but seeing one of the comments below that they were likely dead due to the smoke at the time the plane crash landed, I think it's possible. It would be nice to cover the disappearence of Varig 967 also Keep doing your great work!
This (and similar events) is the reason that now aircraft bathrooms have smoke detectors and have automatic fire extinguishers located in the same compartment as the waste bin. RIP to all who perished.
Smokers with audacity are just terrible. I lived with one growing up... On Thanksgiving, the year that Florida finally banned smoking indoors, we went to a restaurant and my step grandfather lit up a cigarette despite our entire table and several people from other tables telling him to put it out. He only did when someone who worked there told him they would remove him if he didn't put it out immediately. It was so friggin embarrassing. Here's a grown ass man who can't even control himself in public. My parents and grandparents ruined my lungs while I was growing up by chain smoking inside the house and never opening windows or ever changing an AC filter. Got my first asthma attack at 13 and I've NEVER been able to run even though I'm lithe and should be able to. Too many smokers suck.
@@Alaryicjude I feel like you simplify and generalize it. Not every smoker is a total ass, nor ruins everything for others. There are people who don’t smoke and yet pollute the world around them way more than if they’d just smoked. It’s different from person to person. I understand that you generally don’t like the fact that some people smoke. That’s ok. I don’t like the fact that some buy meat or generalize and throw others in the same big bag. We both have to live with this, I guess. Have a good day!
@@piotrtarkowski8595, I didn't ever say all smokers are asses. Also I don't argue with people who can't or don't read what I actually wrote. Sorry not sorry. Troll somewhere else.
Recently an accident report was published for Sriwijaya Air flight 182. I think it would make for a good video since is similar to Adam Air 574 and it highlights the ongoing systemic issues of Indonesian airline safety, which ranks as one of the worst in the world.
Indonesian here, i can speak that our safety hasn't always been good But hey, it was better than back then when it seems like every Indonesian aircraft was a plane crash waiting to happen
@@DisasterBreakdown Thank you for considering it! Trust me, the accident was frustratingly preventable so it will definitely make a great video. You make really good videos on this sort of stuff, so keep up the great work!
Speaking of Indonesian incidents I would love some more detail on the Yogyakarta runaway overrun in 2007(?), there is footage of the aftermath from a TV news cameraman who was onboard but only a handful of breakdowns on it on yt
I'm glad you cover more air crashes than Mayday Air Crash Investigations does. Sometimes it seems they are lacking for content (like when they create compilations of past episodes). But there are so many more crashes, like this, that they could cover. I guess it's probably a funding issue, but it would be nice if they covered more crashes like this one.
The air on an airliner is not recycled. At altitude, compressors pressurize the cabin with fresh outside air. The cabins are not air tight, the expelled air from the passengers is forced out under pressure and not recycled. You can see this on old airliners, whereas the nicotine has streaked parts of the fuselage where the air was expelled.
In the days of smoking 100% bleed air from engine was fed into cabin through AC then vented out cabin through outflow valve maintaining about 6 psi cabin pressure but now the bleed air is mixed with 50% recycled air . Reason for this is bleed air from engines effects fuel consumption , but yes your correct cabins do leak and leave nicotine stains I have flown long haul wide body flights when they allowed smoking and it was awful experience you got off stinking of stale smoke , felt sorry for cabin staff having to work in these conditions
@@nounoufriend1442 Yep, some people have said that air quality on planes actually got WORSE when smoking was banned since the airlines now recycle a lot of air to save fuel.
I flew as an unaccompanied minor in the late 70s / early 80s. I remember thinking how sketchy it was that the airlines allowed a whole section of smokers in the back. Sketchy and nasty. Seems totally ridiculous now, because it was ridiculous them too!
From a smoker, I remember the ashtrays on the armrest 2024. I’ll grown up still smoking but so sad about the airplanes that crash because of fires in the bathroom.😢
Love your vids. Always sends a shiver down my spine for those planes and their crews and passengers that simply vanish. Rest in peace to the crew of Varig Flight 820 and passengers and crew of Flight 967.
As I recall, the rubbish bins were redesigned to contain and restrict air flow in the event of a similar fire. Procedures were also updated that help to give the passengers a better chance of getting off of the aircraft alive when there is a fire. And of course, smoking is prohibited on aircraft now. As a smoker, I really don't have a problem with that inconvenience. At all, as I loathe even my own secondhand smoke. But, to set down in an onion field and not have an upset, that's some spectacular piloting!
There were a LOT of alternatives in terms of clearing the in-cabin atmosphere…i.e. kick open the rear disembarkation doors. The plane was not pressurized at that time as they were below the 10,000 foot level. That and simply smashing out the passenger windows would have cleared the air.
Smoking on board aircraft had one positive. Being a pressure vessel, the smoke would escape wherever it could and this would highlight loose rivets and cracks in the external skins of the fuselage. The external area aft of the pressurization outflow valves often bore a three foot long stain of nicotine and smoke residue. Those residues imposed a maintenance burden as they would clog the operational parts of the valves. The biggest killer in the Varig accident cited was cyanide, not carbon monoxide. The cyanide was a byproduct of the burning plastics, foams and fabrics of the cabin interior. There is good news on the smoking on aircraft front however. Materials used in interiors is now flame resistant and in some places retardant. The materials also do not give off the same noxious fumes. Flammable thermal liners, a factor in the Swiss Air MD-11 fire have been removed. Lavatories now are equipped with smoke detectors that alert the crew and the trash receptacles are self smothering sealed units with passive fire extinguishers. A footnote not touched on in the video is that 707s landed unpressurized. Until approximately 500’ above the ground, smoke would have been flowing out the pressurization control valves. At 500’, the recirculating fans would have and in this case did, recirculate the smoke throughout the entire aircraft. Hence, moving the passengers forward initially may have protected them from the smoke flowing down and aft through the fuselage, at 500’, that mitigation was overcome by the reconfiguration of the systems. Aviation safety progress is paid for in blood. The last thing a pilot wants to be is an aviation safety pioneer.
In 1994 I was on my way back from Holland to Toronto and went into the lavatory and found smoke coming out of the trash in the wall so I splashed water into it and notified a flight attendant who seemed to maybe not understanding but I was quite sure I had it out but now seeing this holy crap
OH MY GOD I CAN'T BELIEVE MY SUGGESTION CAME TRUE! Much appreciation for making this video and telling the story! For this episode, I would say it is a very well done episode, but the story can be a bit more detailed. It's still a great video nonetheless. As my English are not that good, I can't really express my feelings right now aside from many thanks and much appreciation for you to make this video, wishes for your video can be seen by much more people and this channel growing bigger and bigger!
@@thomasmckendry8566 mind if I ask where your suggestion is? if it's on the comment section, then which video did you comment on? My suggestion was at the comment section of the lubeck airport crash that posted 3 weeks ago, which did mention this accident. If I can see or find your suggestion, I'll change my comment right away.
Harry Again I read somewhere that if an aircraft you are on ever comes to an unexpected stop on the ground, ignore all instructions and just get out ASAP. This sort of thing has happened on several occasions (ie passengers burned to death on the ground.) Also, sit by an exit and make sure you know how the door and escape chutes work. (There will be instructions.
That is VERY bad advice. Flight crew have for years been trained on plane evacuations and how to get everyone off a plane safely within 90 seconds. It's an FAA requirement. If everyone starts panicking and trying to push their way off, people will be trampled and injured and it will take longer to evacuate the plane and increase chances of death. People who do what you say should be arrested and charged with a crime if it endangers people.
For the record, air in pressurized aircraft is not constantly recycled, as people often think. The vast majority of the air is continuously routed overboard through outflow valves. The engines, through Air Cycle Machine that tap air from the engines and make it breathable, ensures that the air is fresh.
Varig is dearly missed here, and many people have theorized on why the plane crashed. Some Said the plane flew on soviet airspace and was shot down, with the government hiding all clues of the crash. Another, which i believe in the most, says a faulty cargo door broke off causing the cargo and pilots to get sucked out, eventually the plane broke apart and crashed into international waters.
So my question is, and please forgive my ignorance.... if the cabin is filling with deadly smoke and fumes, why not open the aft door or another door? Certainly cabin pressure isn't a problem at this altitude.
I can't believe we were ever allowed to smoke on aircraft. Besides second hand smoke just the thought of passengers allowed to create fire on board is ridiculous.
I'm from Australia but spent nearly 10 years working in Africa in the mining exploration industry, I've flown in and out dozens of African countries on local African airline's, many of the flights I've been on lots of people were smoking either in their seats or sometimes a flight attendant would tell you to go stand at the rear of the cabin to smoke, basically no rules at all are followed, this is was in the middle 2000's and 2010's.
Acording to Ricardo, he thinks the accident was caused by the cargo in the luggage department. This cargo was some military government equipment (an ejection seat) from the then president/military dictator Emílio Garrastazu Médici, to which Varig company owners were very close. This cargo was supposed to be delivered to France for maintenance. This ejection seat was not properly deactivated, and it automatically activates on a certain altitute. Acording to Ricardo, from the moment the old lady left the restroom, the smoke started to spread TOO fast for it to be originated from a cigarette butt. Recently, he gave an interview in a brazilian talk show. It's from 3 months ago. If you understand portuguese, i suggest you watch it.
I grew up in the 60's certainly remember the smoking and non smoking areas on a plane, seemed the norm at the time, cigarettes were everywhere, remember going to the cinema watching a film with a continous plume of smoke from the woman in front, all those bee-hives and hairspray, bloody deathtraps, ashtrays in the backs of seats🤣
As a passenger on AA a few years back, we did have someone go to the bathroom and smoke a cigarette while on flight… The Crew took action and they immediately isolated him to get arrested once we landed… now i know what could had happened after watching this video… Thank you 🙏.
I always knew mankind wouldn't be able to kick this wretched habit within my lifetime. I would like for there to be a count of those who lost their lives due to cigarettes.
One of the largest causes of unnatural death are automobile accidents. A lot more people would be alive if we had more viable alternatives to driving everywhere. Tobacco industry has blood on their hands, same with the automobile industry.
@@halinaqi2194 It's not the things we use that kill people, it's the stupid people that use them! And smoking tobacco is a personal choice; it's up to people not to smoke, if they value their health.
Just install a very sensitive, well hidden smoke alarm in the lavatory and when it goes off you grab this passenger, handcuff him/her, hand them over to police and ban them from flying on ALL airlines!
I'm a smoker and considering the potential danger, I'm amazed that smoking was still allowed on planes during my lifetime. My first flight, at 9, from Melbourne to Rome, we were in a non smoking section (my parents never smoked), I remember walking through the smoking section and the smell of cigarette smoke hit you like a brick! Thankfully, last time I made the same trip, I went via Kuala Lumpur, where there was a room in the airport where smokers could smoke - I appreciated it after about 10 hours and another 10 hours to come on the connecting flight. I've no idea if they still have that room but the thought of how absolutely dangerous fire is on a plane makes the "inconvenience" more than reasonable!
I remember growing up in the 80s and 90s, planes had a smoking and nonsmoking section. I would sit with my parents in the nonsmoking section and once in a while a passenger would light up a cigarette. Flight attendants would come and argue with them back and forth. It was similar to angry passengers not wearing masks during the Covid mandates. Great examination of this tragic incident. Well done.
@@alisonwilson9749 Nope. We've known since 1981 that masks don't protect you from viruses. I fly all through Covid and never wore one because I have asthma. Stick your masks and jabs where the sun don't shine!
There are fire suppression systems available to make commercial planes safer. Hermetically sealed bathrooms with Halon systems that evacuate the air after the fire is out. Same with cargo areas. We have these systems in our hospital and are safe when operating correctly. Better engine fire systems are also available. Wheel well fires should last like zero seconds. Aircraft systems tunnel ducts for electrical systems should be redesigned, during flight no air is necessary.
It is nothing but amazing that people were allowed to smoke on airplanes at all, let alone for so many decades. God bless that captain May he rest in peace.
I mean no one knows for sure if it happened because of that, it's just a theory, I personally would rather believe that it was more of a suicide thing where some psychopath intentionally set the plane on fire and got all those innocent people killed, for me that would make more sense than thinking that some dumbass couldn't just wait for like 5 hours without smoking, and went in there and lit up a cig and dropped it in a bin while it was still on fire without thinking for a second that it's a fatal thing to do, I just don't see where someone does that unintentionally.
@@Durcy A lot of people throw out cigarettes without thinking. Smokers, are, after all, often inconsiderate people. How many times have we heard about a fire because someone tossed a butt out the car window? "couldn't just wait for like 5 hours without smoking". No, they can't. I've known many of them.
The plane crashed because a passenger didn’t follow instructions. The only passenger to survive survived because they didn’t follow instructions. Reality has a sick sense of humor.
Banning smoking has, of course, greatly reduced the risk of fire, unfortunately it has done little to improve the air quality, as airlines have reduced the air filtration processes.
The biggest irony though is that with smoking banned the airlines took the opportunity to reduce air circulation on board which is probably as detrimental or even more so than second hand smoke. Really shows you their priorities.
@@DOUGL4S1 That plane had a depressurization a week earlier of this incident, because of some locks of the cargo door failing, only held by the bottom ones. VARIG CEO couldn't tell if the issue was solved on the maintenance, and probably got the same issue, but airborne on the middle of the sea...
@angelaclements1244 they weren't, it's mentioned in the video, that firefighters tried to rescue some passengers. It's impossible for most of the cabin crew to survive but all of the passengers, that followed instructions, to die except in case of cabin crew completely abandoning their duties, and sacrificing lives of passengers to save their sorry 🍑
As a smoker, I fully agree with banning smoking on aircraft. It’s been proven that cigarette smoke residue exacerbates corrosion in the airframe. I worked in aviation maintenance for more than 40 years.
Another great informative video. I appreciate the effort it takes to research and produce this content. It also is a good teaching tool. I can't believe how people can get so careless. I guess some get too busy or too lost in other thoughts to really consider what they're doing. You know those big ugly trash cans that have ashtrays on the top? I've seen a few of those go up because people chucked their cigarette into the bin instead of the ashtray. I watched more than one of those decorative little islands in a parking lot with bushes and mulch catch on fire. Don't park near those if you can help it. I've also watched numerous people lean against the cages in front of Lowe's smoking with about twenty full propane tanks behind them in the cage that's clearly labeled. Sometimes I laugh at warning signs and stickers thinking how it's common sense not to do the thing they're warning you not to do but then I see a mother pushing a shopping cart with a toddler laying on the bottom. I see a full grown man walk around a safety barrier to ask the employee running the forklift where something is ignoring the pallet of pavers that's 20ft in the air. I don't know where caution went but it left a long time ago.
The sequence of the disaster is not correct. There was a book called Black Box about some Brazilian crashes including this one. First it was not an onion field, it was cabbage. The crew invaded the cockpit. All the survivors where standing inside the cockpit when landing, including the only survivor passenger. They were screaming to the pilots to land and that influenced the decision making of the captain. There was no problem with the aircraft and they could have landed in the airport. The pilots were criticized for not landing in the airport where the rescue was. People say that everyone was already dead but who knows really. Another thing, the crew tried to combat the fire but, theyve tried in the wrong toilet. More smoke was coming out of the lavatory where there was no fire.
Well done to the flight crew. Good landing. Even today, when a plane from any South American country lands, passengers ignore the flight attendants and captain, and rush to the front in a traffic jam to be the first out the doors. Been there 22 times. Sad outcome. RIP
Your comment about rules being learned and enforced through actions. It's true in a lot of fields. In trauma response, we are told "the lessons learned here are taught in blood". People have died so we can learn these things.
Same in workplace safety, sadly! 😔 It's interesting to see the contrast with air safety though, because in work safety, there generally tends to be more of a pendulum effect...? Necessary legislation is passed due to majordeaths/serious health impacts, and things steadily improve. But then things tend to start becoming overcomplicated, or a change of government happens & greedy corporate actors start pressuring for reduced constraints to cut cost-corners. If the government caves to this pressure, you then see a significant swing away from regulatory oversight... Until the next major tragedy occurs, at which point the public will start agitating for better rules again. (For a classic example of this cycle's outcomes, see New Zealand's Pike River mining disaster?) By comparison, it seems as an outside observer that the air industry has usually been better at over-all iterative safety change, without quite the same up/down politically-motivated swings...? Although we do see that same pattern repeated on a smaller scale within industry-associated companies (such as Boeing), as well similar ongoing challenges around whether investigative results from disasters are allowed to lead to real legislative change (eg the NTSB vs FAA issue).
This story doesn't mention any attempts to actually put out the fire with extinguishers etc... I feel like if smoke started coming from the door of the toilet, it would give plenty of time to open the door and use a fire extinguisher before it grew out of control.
The thing about Varig 967 is that there is very little content to discuss, all we know is that a 707 disappeared carrying a couple Million dollars worth of paintings, it hasn't been found and it's wreckage could lay thousands of feet deep in the Pacific. That's really it, we have no clues concerning the aircraft so it's litteraly just a stub. It could be explained in two minutes flat, and I'm pretty sure Chloe doesn't like to delve into theories which is why we haven't gotten an MH370 video yet. It's much preferred to stick to the facts and we know next to nothing on Varig 967.
I am working for Boeing in manufacturing. To my surprise once I had task to review installation plan of three ashtrays in Boeing 777 new aircraft cockpit. So they still have them in a cockpit just in case pilots would want to smoke cigarettes. Btw love this channel! Thanks for your work
Some(most) people are just carelessly selfish and dont care about the consequences of their actions. Unfortunately these are one of those moments where the careless behavior resulted in a major catastrophy that cannot be reversed.
I'm not going to lie, I facepalmed when it was said that the cigarette was placed in the trash. Also, as someone who didn't fly in the 1970s, for multiple reasons, weren't there ashtrays in the plane back then?
Ashtrays are required on all commercial planes today believed it or not. It’s so if some idiot tries to smoke in the lavatory, they’ll put it in the tray and not the waste bin.
So wait, all the passengers were seated up front, following the inst. of the crew. Then 1 guy came from the back, walked past the passengers seated up front. & sat in the fwd galley behind the cockpit?? Tryin' to paint a mental pic. Great vid as always 😉👍✌️.
I wonder if the flammability of the interior materials has a role in this? I remember a similar incident in the UK. After which they changed the rules on plane interiors.
Why would you not flush it? The toilet is made to handle massive dumps coming out of people, I don’t think a cigarette butt would have damaged anything.
A very interesting case for sure Very unfortunate for the victims of varig 820 and varig 967 and especially the captain. A question, were any of the flight controls damaged during the fire?
No flight controls were damaged during the fire, the crew decided to make a forced landing because they feared a structural break up of the aircraft and, also, the smoke became so dense in the cockpit, they couldn´t even see the instruments nor see through the windows, they depressurized the aircraft and opened the side windows to look outside.
In 1986 we flew from LAX to St Louis & the smoking area was in the back of the plane but it drifted all over the cabin. Its too bad it took a few passenger jets to crash from careless smokers before something was done.
In uk years ago smoking banned national express coach London to Edinburgh, I smelt burning and went into toilet where bin was on fire I put it out but pulled emergency cord, if I hadn't of smelt the fire and got yo out it out, most passengers were sleeping, so coukd of been very bad, all down to an idiot needing a smoke
There was a more recent incident where a passenger brought gasoline into his carry on and in the same overhead bin a lithium ion battery shorted out and caused a fire. I don't know if it crashed or if it landed.
Am I the only one here who finds it suspicious and significant that Filinto Müller - the most powerful politician in Brazil at the time - was on that plane? Müller was universally regarded as the most dangerous, most ruthless, and most despised man in Brazil. Before becoming President of Brazil's upper house, Müller had been the country's chief of police, and was notorious for his brutality. He is "credited" with being the originator of death squads. There could scarcely be a more likely candidate for assassination. His enemies had been trying to eliminate him for decades, but he had always been too well protected. As for the fire itself, I find the discarded cigarette theory highly improbable. It's not unheard of for fires to beak out in airplane toilet rubbish bins, but they are almost always discovered and extinguished before they cause any serious damage. Fire can spread quickly, of course, but in this case we're told that a woman exited the toilet with smoke billowing behind her, and that, despite the quick response of the crew, the fire could not be put out with a fire extinguisher. Fire doesn't spread *that* quickly. Unless, of course, it was ignited by an incendiary device. In my opinion the most likely explanation for this crash is that Filinto Müller's political enemies discovered that he was going to be on that plane and arranged for a fire bomb with a timer to be placed in the toilet rubbish bin. The device went off when the toilet was being used by a woman passenger (would she have gone into the toilet if the fire was already in progress?). The accelerant used in the device would explain the rapid or instantaneous escalation of the fire.
Thank you for yet another well done video, may all those people rest in peace. I always think of if the plane I am on were to go down what would I do. safe to say as a kid I have been on couple of really bad airplanes (broken seatbelt. tray not closing. AC broken) but I am glad I am still here
It makes you wonder what the cabin crew were doing when the first signs of smoke were seen? A few minutes with a fire extinguisher could have saved all those lives.
1. Correction: air in the cabin is not "constantly recycled." Just a part of it. Most of the air vents out, and fresh air comes in. 2. A significant factor in this tragedy was the flammable materials used inside aircraft at the time.
No words for how dumb this was. At the very least - soak your cigarette in running tap water before discarding or discard in the toilet so that it ends up in the waste tank. It's difficult to say where dumb ends and malicious begins.
Great video!! I was actually born in the souther part of Brazil, Rio Grande do Sul, hence the name VARIG (acronym for Viação Aérea RIo-Grandense, Rio Grandean Airways) ... in the 90's I flew from. Porto Alegre to Rio de Janeiro for family holidays! Young boy flying for the first and it was VARIG 🙂 Never heard its name since then...Airline want busted...it is a shame, it was a big at the time ...VARIG and VASP, Maybe you can also find something on VASP to make a good video! Thanks for bringing back those childhood memories with an amazing video covering this accident! cheers
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I don't usually make requests, but speaking of Orly, there is a particular accident whose cause seems hopelessly muddled due, perhaps, to the official report never being translated into English. The crash of Air France flight 007 in 1962 has been alternately been blamed on malfunctioning elevator controls, and also in some versions, the pilot, for not recognizing he could still get the plane to take off. I've never felt there has been a definitive account of this crash.
Thank you.
Kind of surprised you don't have a video on the crash of Partnair flight 394, or maybe you did/do have one but I just didn't see it. Either way keep up the awesome work, great content and excellent videos+research! Much love from Texas!
@@GeoffGorman08 The Partnair video is actually on its way, very soon!
❤new subscriber here!
Thank you 😊
What if the passenger who "didn't follow flight crew instructions" wanted to join the Mile High Club and their companion was the one who smoked in the lavatory?
One of the points I find most disturbing is that the only passenger who survived did not listen to the crew's instructions... and all the other survivors were aircrew.
Grenfell Tower, London, UK
He was also directly at a exit.
@@ninelaivz4334 Exactly what I was going to comment! If I'm in a place that is burning, I am not going to just sit there. I will readily stay calm and exit in an orderly fashion, but I will not just sit there or, as with Greenfell, I would not just stay in a burning building.
@@ZER0-- Although I can agree with you that situational awareness is key regarding an emergency evacuation, you have to remember that they weren’t exactly sure what caused the fire and/or where it originated. If the crew can’t assess the outside because of smoke, fire, debris etc, it could potentially escalate the danger by opening the exits and exposing the crew/passengers to even more peril. Fire needs oxygen to grow and by opening an exit, it could be comparable to spraying lighter fluid into an already burning campfire. Furthermore, the captain holds absolute responsibility to give the evacuation command to crew. If he ordered everyone to remain seated, the crew is supposed to trust and follow the ultimate authority on the aircraft.
That passenger was super lucky to not follow instructions and save himself however, he could have put everyone in harms way much quicker had the source of the fire been on the exterior of the fuselage.
My Dad was flying 707s back then, & nearly a decade before this tragedy, had told me if a plane stops on the ground, Not at a gate or in a take-off line, to GET OUT, & ask questions later; you can always get back aboard, but you may not always have time to get out. Some decades after that, I was explaining to a city council member why only 90 seconds of foam in a new airport fire truck was sufficient, because if everyone was not out by then, they were already dead anyway, due to the highly toxic fumes from the interior contents of the burning plane. I told him it was a lesson I'd learned from a crash in Rome, Italy, which my Dad had witnessed as he was on approach there. Never wait for someone else to tell you to get out, & ALWAYS note where all exits are from your seat, including numbers of rows to each! People died on this Varig flight, & on that TWA flight in Rome, BECAUSE they waited! As noted, those who didn't wait survived. A fire on board in flight SHORTENS your time to get out, too, but 90 seconds is your max, in "best case" scenarios.
The saddest part: That crash landing itself was completely survivable.
I don't think so. The lavatory fire was only dangerous because of the smoke. The actual fire must have come from the engines getting ripped off.
@@schwarzerritter5724 I mean it was clearly survivable… because multiple people survived
@@schwarzerritter5724 The report itself says the fire started melting the skin and the roof collapsed. That was from the fire inside that started in the lavatory. Experts who investigated this crash determined that. The fact that the plane stayed intact shows how survivable the crash itself was. The fire was the cause of so many deaths. Especially when passengers were kept on board.
Yeah, more people could have survived if they weren’t told to remain seated after the aircraft stopped
@@alidapurdy Rewatching the video, it appears they did not have those inflatable sleds. So I guess the order to stay seated was given, so the passengers would not try to jump out the doors. But the fire brigade arrived later than the pilots hoped.
Some things must be said. I was Ricardo’s colleague at the engineering university of Petrópolis; my father was a Varig’s captain - that same night he flew to Paris with the entire board of directors of the company. Just 24 hour after the were at the crash site.
1. Ricardo was sit in the last row of the plane, he saw an ‘old lady’ coming out of the lavatory with ‘smoke’ (not fire) coming behind her.
He didn’t think twice: he took his backpack and ran as fast as he could to the front of the plane - untill the cabin door, he also took a cloth, wet it, and put it on his face.
2. At this point there was no fire on board, but a thick black smoke.
3. Some crew member put a oxigen mask and went to the back in way to open a emergency door in way to suck the smoke out of the plane. But he just couldn’t find it.
4. When the plane touched the ground the oxigen sistem deployed automatically - and only then the fire started !
But is important to say that at this point all the passengers were already dead - because of the very toxic black smoke.
There wasn’t even panic amongst the passengers - they were all in their seats with their seat belts buckled.
5. With the shock, Ricardo lost consciousness and only remembers waking up in the hospital.
He was the first to be rescued by the firefighters.
Is important to say that they focused their attention on the “black smoke” - and concluded that the material that coated plane’s fuselage was inadequate and caused the whole problem.
When the smoke was on the lavatory, the crew used fire extinguishers - with no avail at all.
They had to find a new material more resistent to fire to coat the plane’s fuselage.
Fascinating and very sad. I saw on another video that the interior materials were always problematic. Thanks for the additional details.
Is it true that a year after the crash, he entered a Varig store and demanded the company give him a new plane ticket, since the plane crashed and he didn't get to London?
É verdade que um ano dps do acidente, ele foi em uma loja da Varig e exigiu que eles dessem uma nova passagem pra ele, pq o avião caiu e ele cão chegou em Londres?
@@DOUGL4S1 - This is a true story ! That was the least that Varig should do - and to put him in the first class (this I just don’t know)
@@Mus1c1luv - Sorry, I don’t think that ‘fascinating’ is the adequate word for this tragedy - with so many lives lost. Only because a cigarette.
Plane and cigarettes don’t go together. An enclosed environment, with thin air, surrounded by fuel all around.
You know, in that same thip, when my dad was flying backto Brazil, it was a regular passenger flight. In the midle of the night he was walking thru the plane and caught a man sleeping with a lit cigarette almost falling out of his fingers in the aisle of the plane. You can imagine the scolding this jerk got from my father. rsrs. Those guys (smokers) are very irresponsible !
I find it IMPOSSIBLE that the passengers weren’t in a panic….
You can look it up online because I don't remember where it happened, but there is a story about a small commercial plane with less than like 30 people on board, where somebody brought an alligator and the alligator broke out into the back of the plane and the passengers all panicked and ran towards the front of the plane. It sent the plane into a nose dive that the pilot could not recover from because now I'll passengers were piled up in front. It would be like dropping a steel toe boot. The plane crash and everyone died. They found the alligator alive.
Congrats, now theres a video about it
Yeah, the Filair Let L-410 2010 crash. It's such an absurd story, but unfortunately true.
Is this for real?
@@sy_dianne5224
Yes. Google it
According to Google, one passenger survived (while a second survived but later died in hospital). And that makes sense, because otherwise the story of the crocodile would have never come out.
"It is necessary to give them receptacle so that disasters like this can never happen again."
Sure, but also, it's necessary to give them a ride straight to prison right after the flight is over for consciously endangering the lives of everyone on board.
People have also tried to light incense, candles and Marijuana in the bathrooms -- they can't. It will set off a highly sensitive alarm. The ash trays are leftover from the older interior design (time to hire a new decorator.)
@@audreyandlinCompany Ash trays come from the factory in all commercial aircraft, including brand new types with brand new interiors. It's a mandatory item in the US, and aircraft cannot be dispatched with an inoperative ashtray.
Weak, selfish people that cannot do without a cigarette put others at risk. No self control.
@@beaufighter245 It's not that, IMO. There was a culture back then among smokers that it was perfectly ok to dispose of cigarette butts anywhere - in the trash, on the ground, on the carpet, wherever. The availability of ashtrays didn't matter. People flicked their butts anywhere.
@@beenaplumber8379 fair point.
I've heard of Varig Flight 967. It's one of the rare cases of plane disappearance with no trace found. Never would've thought that the Captain survived an earlier crash only to completely vanish from the face of the Earth in another.
'No trace found" or "didn't look hard enough" ?
My guess is because it was only carrying cargo and crew they never bothered to go through the extreme hassle of searching the deep ocean. If that were a passenger carrying plane, something tells me that they could've and would've found that plane and investigated.
They didn't vanish. The Pacific Ocean is fucking huge.
We still haven't found the crash site of MH370. And guess what? That one had passengers.
@@ArtCurator2020 Except they also haven't found the passenger plane MH370
@@Tamaki742 To be fair with all of the wierdness surrounding 370, such as the faulty radar, unidentified entities on radar, the way it was still airborne and responding to sat coms for 6 hours after being lost from military radar despite the fact it was still in the radar coverage area after that point. And the way the US military radar track was never released. And the way they were so quick to term it a murder suicide with the US claiming that the captain had pre-flown the route in MSFSX but in reality the route they claimed was nothing like the actual accident route, and they recreated it from deleted data anyway.
Anyway I could go on. But something screwey went on with that flight which is why it was and probably never will be found.
@@jimmydesouza4375 I'm still under the belief they were searching in the wrong place. It probably ended up in a hangar in Tibet, disassembled piece by piece.
This tragedy marked 50 years yesterday, since it happend (July 11, 2023). RIP to all victims. 🕊
The pilot who survived and went on to fly for another 5 years before crashing and never to be found. That's real Final Destination stuff!
Fake news
@@dixie2675 Fake human
He was suppose to die in the first crash?
@@dixie2675prove it. NOW.
@@dixie2675they're eating the dogs 😂😂😂
This sounds silly but it genuinely worried me at the time. About 5 years back, I went on a flight from Glasgow to London and quite innocently took on board a big packet of cheese + onion crisps I'd bought in the cafe beforehand. Halfway through, went to eat them and found that the cabin pressure had expanded the bag to the size of a small balloon. Unwilling to open the bag in case it basically exploded and everyone thought it was a bomb (!) I briefly considered trying to find something sharp to puncture it but thought better of it. So summoned the stewardess who listened very patiently, took the bag of crisps away and opened it for me in the galley. She returned them to me untouched but accepted my offer of one from the open bag! Very professional of her as she probably thought I was a bit of a twit but all I could think of at the time was the bag of crisps exploding and everyone going into panic mode. I don't take crisps on board a plane now.
Thanks for the bag of Chips story but what does it have to do with this Varig tragedy. Oh btw once on Christmas Eve I was flying international on NWA and which was so cheap they did not provide free drinks so I planned ahead and brought my own cans of San Mig (beers) on board... After take off I popped the top of a still frosty can making a loud noise catching the attention of the of the GRanny Flight Attendant ... who then berated me breaking some made up rule that I couldnt bring my own ...and she actually confiscated it and dumped it.. I felt like a Hs kid being busted by the Scrooge principal... end of story . :)
@@scottmoseley5122 Actually it is a US federal law that you cannot consume your own alcohol on board... has to be served by the flight crew.
lol ridiculous
@@tankthearc9875 Not ridiculous. They need to know how much you have drunk and not serve you too much lest you become one of those drunken assholes that causes problems.
Out of curiosity have you been through puberty?
@@jasonseiple346 we were still international leaving Manila to GUM. So next ridiculous rule? Granny Scrooge sure didn't have the Christmas spirit. hahah.
If someone is smoking in the shithouse, it baffles me why they wouldn't put the cig under sink water before throwing it in a bin with paper towels.
Or if you could smoke at your seat...why go to the lavatory?
@@tomservo56954 Passenger smoking was banned. That's why they went to the crapper.
@@ohioguy215 No, it was allowed then...
@@tomservo56954 Research it. Passengers could not smoke on that flight...pilots could smoke in the cockpit which ended shortly after. Why do you think the passenger smoked in the shithouse if they could smoke in their passenger cabin seat.
@@ohioguy215 I would have thought non-U.S. airlines were slower to ban in -cabin smoking.
My first trip to France was aboard this very plane, several years earlier. I recall well how every seat armrest had an astray built in, and that many passengers smoked on flights. Knowing the risks of having flames onboard, I am very glad that smoking is banned on flights the world over now. Fire onboard has to be one of the worst case scenarios to ever encounter.
Isn't that sick? Ashtrays in every armrest, yet this person had no problem tossing the butt in the trash. I remember those days and how smokers felt free (entitled) to toss their butts anywhere. "Cigarette-sucking buttheads." (I hate quoting Rush Limbaugh, but that's one that's worth quoting.)
The ashtrays in the armrests are still there for safety, in case a senile old person lights on up. The person on this flight probably knew they weren't allowed to smoke, which is why they nipped into the bathroom.
There is one commercial airline in the middle east, I believe, that still allows smoking on board, but that could have changed
@@SavageMinnow but those years smoking was still allowed
@@Palmstreet-u7x varig flight 820 had a smoking and a non-smoking section.
@@SavageMinnow that I understand, Boeing 747 in the 1970s one was allowed to smoke aboard
A delicate and informative video about an absolutely horrific disaster. Completely professional and worthy of applause.
Thanks!
Are you any kin to the Baton Rouge McDavefaces? Probably not as it's a quite common name, I realize, but they're my mother's family.
GOD IS WORTHY OF APPLAUSE
@@reckontonottobemoved can you relax
The main point of this incident is NOT smoking, but evacuation during the fire - a fire can be started by any means, electrical fault, etc. but it is what the crew does and how evacuation proceeds that's the point. The fact that the crew survived means that the landing was 100% survivable at the front of the plane. Most people could have escaped and survived given opportunity to evacuate immediate at the front and move to the front. "Be seated" instruction sealed their fate.
I knew that Aurigny was the first to ban smoking outright, as it’s listed in the onboard magazines, but it’s cool to hear my home’s airline being mentioned on the channel (and not for a bad reason thankfully). Awesome video as always.
Hey, my family can trace their roots on the channel islands back to the 1600s, or some equally ridiculous long long ago year. I bet we're related!
(Feel like I have to point out, the 'us being related' bit was a joke)
@@skunkrat01 What a tenuous link. You and Liam should find a (chat)room together!
@@tumslucks9781 well geez excuse me for getting excited. I come from a line of the family that moved to Australia a couple generations back, so I don't get a chance to talk to a lot of channel islanders.
You have a super lovely day Tum.
Ay, a fellow channel islander!
@@skunkrat01 HOlY shIOeT YoU ArE Fro9m thE SamEE planeT i BEt WerE RelAted
One night in February 2018 I was on an Air Algérie plane from orly to Algiers, I went to the lavatory and smelled something that resembles plastic burning, I called the flight attendants who immediately reported it to the captain and started a thorough investigation of the nature of the smell, eventually, they found out half a cigarette still burning on a plastic part inside the lavatory. Thankfully if was discovered soon enough and no real danger came out of it. They ended up finding out the man who was smoking there and when we left the plane I saw him with the local police, a flight attendant informed me just before landing that he might be permanently banned from flying with the company.
The weird stuff that stuck with me is when I told an old man sitting next to me about the incident, his reaction was very strange, he told me it's fine to smoke onboard, and that people used to smoke without problems in the 90s, and he also believed that banning smoking on airplanes was "nonsense"
That reaction seems pretty on brand for old goof, actually. He was probably a smoker himself. They don't have any consideration for their own health, why would they consider anyone else's? "Nonsense" is sucking on a cancer stick, inhaling lovely tar and poisons into your lungs, and puffing it out for all the folks around you to enjoy as well. "Nonsense" is doing that, but at 30,000 feet in a pressurized tube with no escape in the off chance you drop the stupid thing and start a fire 🙄
I agree that it is nonsense to smoke on an airplane, obviously. But what is actually wrong is all that "passive smoker" thing. There is not one single serious medical study (and will ever be) that proves "second hand smokers", at least in what refers to cancer, lung disease, etc.
An EgyptAir plane was brought down by the pilots smoking in 2016! The airline finally banned it after that. Smoking is still a common thing in Arab countries.
@Angela Exactly 👍
@@jaimepablomartinezdelgado9426 a simple search proves you wrong. However, I don’t need a research paper to tell me the dangers. You see both my parents smoked. I spent my entire childhood sick. By age 7 I had serious pneumonia. The doctors told my parents to quit. Dad did, cold turkey. Mom kept on. I developed life threatening asthma. I spent a decades with chronic bronchitis. I remember many times being in the back seat of the car as we were driving to the ER coughing so hard I was puking up bile and begging my Mom to open the car windows. I spent 15 years with blue lips! I am dependent on meds to keep me breathing. Cigarette smoke on a person I pass in the grocery store causes me to have an asthma attack. I can go nowhere without my breathing machine.
Mom is now on oxygen 24/7. She gasps, can’t go up and down stairs, can’t grocery shop. She can barely dress herself. Mom quit nearly 4 years ago when her beloved baby sister died from lung failure caused by smoking. It was too late for mom. Her lungs are shot and she has heart disease.
I was working for Varig at Heathrow at the time and remember that soon after this sad and terrible crash we had to remove copies of a "magazine" from a LHR departure because it had several pages of glossy colour photographs of the wreckage which included photos of dead passengers still in their seats. It was a shock to everyone that the materials used in aircraft at that time was so dangerous.
even today people don't really think about fire safety the way they should.
How considerate of the publishers
Why would someone put pictures of dead and probably mutilated people in a magazine that's easily accessible to the public. Some kid could've picked it up and scarred themselves for life?
The crash it wasn't,the crash didn't kill them the carbohydrate did
@@twistedyogert There was no rules or regulations in the 70's, you could send kids down mines to work 16hr a day so caring about what they read was the least of anyone's worries.
It's incredibly hard to believe there was once smoking allowed on planes. In our days, students in high schools were allowed to smoke outside between classes. I graduated in 1976 and smoked at school. In 1984 on our honeymoon to Florida I smoked on a plane. I don't smoke anymore but just thinking about all of this is just plane nuts by today's standards.
1988 was the last time I smoked on a plane. Glasgow to Rhodes. Must admit that, by then, I was thinking "this isn't a very sensible thing to do". I've quit now so it's not an issue any longer but, looking back, it is hard to believe it was acceptable.
Fun pun
Why is that hard to believe? The majority makes the rules and the majority smoked at that point in time. Its gone so far in the opposite direction that the idiotic idea of banning menthols is being entertained.
I know, I’m old enough to remember it. I I had to fly commercial a few times in the 1980s and hated it when people in the smoking section lit up, we could still smell it. Never made sense, absurd that a smoker can’t wait a few hours when flying.
Everybody smoked everywhere. It helped keep people relaxed and relieved tension.
I remember flying several long haul flights in 1984, Aus to Europe to USA. ALL had smoking and non smoking sections.
I was 12 at the time. The worst flight was London- San Francisco, a British Airways flight half filled with a P&O cruise crew heading home after months at sea. They bribed the flight attendants to let them use their sleeping section and started a mile high club. 🤦♀️ At one stage I got up for a walk and returned to find a drunk guy asleep in my seat with a cigar still burning in his hand!
... and that was back in the days when people still got dressed up for plane flights! Lol! Things have changed s lot!
I remember the time when people got dressed up for a flight. Also when I was 11 I was on an Eastern flight from the Caribbean to Canada, as an unaccompanied minor. It was probably 1980 or so. Smoking was allowed on board and I’m allergic to cigarettes. That was the worst flight I’ve ever been on. My nose was completely blocked and I could barely breathe.
So sorry for those innocent lives that were lost all because some selfish person couldn’t do without a cigarette.
I recall a flight to Hawaii, where I was in the non smoking area. The guy in the seat next to me lit a cigarette & I told him to put it out. He tried to laugh it off, but I told him that I was allergic to the smoke & WHEN I threw up, it wasn't going to be in My lap. He went to the back of the plane, and I never saw him again.
Reminds me a little of that ferry disaster in South Korea, where the crew told all the passengers,most of whom were school kids, to stay in their cabins. And then the crew made it off while all the kids drowned.
Yup that was sick.
Yes, I thought the exact same thing watching this. That was horrific. So incredibly sad because it's in their culture to always trust and listen to adults.
a small note on that: the deck crew (captain, first mate, etc.) were among the first to be rescued from the MV sewol, but other crew members below deck stayed. in particular, three perished trying to save as many passengers as they could and steer them out while the 'remain in your cabins' alert was still blaring... very tragic indeed.
That is so true. They should not have told the students to stay in their cabins. Just horrifying. This video is horrific as well.
Have mercy that is just awful. Makes you think they just did not want the chaos small kids would surely exhibit in such a terrifying situation. They kept the exits open for themselves.
It wasn't the tobacco companies that resisted smoking bans on aeroplanes, it was passengers. Anyone who has been addicted to nicotine can instantly explain this. The biggest single contribution to the airline ban in smoking was the invention of smokeless nicotine delivery especially gum. This meant that airlines could ban smoking without causing smokers withdrawal effects. I recall being on a Turkish Airlines flight in the early naughties where the air Stewards offered nicotine gum to passengers.
I remember the days of buying a “non-smoking” seat to find the row in front was the smoking area… oh, joy!
The taste of nicotine gum was foul. I used it to try to quit smoking, to no avail. The only way I quit was when I got so sick I was almost in a coma for a weekand could not smok mot even a biyfive days, and when I came around I had no lingering nicotine withdrawalls, so I never lit up again. Whenever I got the urge I put my thumb between two fingers and took a deep breath of clean air, letting it out just as I would have released tobacco smoke. I got hooked at 15, thinking the Marlboro Man was just cool as heck, but it really was child abuse by Big Tobacco. They paid out billions from lawsuits, but no smoker got a dime of the money, just lawyers and do-gooder stop smoking facilities and governments printers making up pamphlets.
I think I hey mean to
he tobacco companies have some rault because over the last 75 years they selectively bred tobacco to be more and more addictive. This came out in the late 1980s.
This is such a sad incident. The forced landing was an excellent feat of airmanship; the sad thing is that if the fuselage had broken apart, more people may have been able to escape.
Chloe, have you ever considered making videos about nautical incidents? My husband (a nautical geek) and I always watch your videos on our TV while eating breakfast every Saturday (he loves your channel now, too!), and he would love to see videos about disasters involving sea-going vessels. I think it would be amazing as well!
Thank you so much for your faithful uploads. You’ve had videos for us when you move, when you’re sick, and when production doesn’t go the way you thought it would. We all appreciate you so much!
i would love to see a DB of the el faro
I dunno if Chloe has any maritime disaster episodes planned, but in the meantime Brick Immortar does occasional ship disasters.
there's also the channel "maritime horrors" that i think handles things quite well!
Wait, his name is Chloe?? I didn’t know men could have that name.
@@okjeffy6581 Oh Dear.
I took my first flight at 3 months old, which I obviously don't remember, but by the time I was 4 yrs old I was an experienced enough flyer that my parents felt comfortable letting me fly alone on a 90 min flight to visit my grandparents (people who weren't flying were allowed to go through security and all the way to the gates in those days). I mention that because I'm old enough to remember when planes had smoking and non-smoking sections, and it's crazy to think that open flames and smoldering embers inside of airborne planes were considered completely normal just a few decades ago. And smoking on planes ultimately wasn't banned due to safety concerns, it was the public's health consciousness that motivated the change in policy. But given how many people smoked for so many years on so many planes, it's kind of a miracle that there weren't more mishaps like this.
Trusting an airline with your 4 year old seems way crazier.
I worked with Boeing for 19 years ... they were *good* years, both for Boeing and for me (1986-2005) but trouble was brewing -- Harry Stonecipher *really, REALLY* wanted to pwn Boeing and he succeeded eventually, but your video reminds me of how rapidly the industry (and the insanity of the passengers!) was changing in that time. Thanks for offering me yet another aviation-related channel that "sticks to the facts"!!
Sorry, but I think the insanity of Boeing was also getting worse. Maybe that was mostly after 2005, but at some point they cared less about safety and more about profit. It was like the Ford bean counters and their Pinto death machine. You were there for the 737/747 PCU cover-up. That was a growing sickness at Boeing.
Sadly, the careless passenger theory is very plausible, as there are far too many examples of fires started in the lavatory wastebins by carelessly discarded cigarettes, left by passengers using the lavatory for a (for very good reasons) illegal cigarette. Thankfully, most do not have endings like this, but some do.
And I never seize to be infuriated by ppls willingness to risk not only their own lives, but selfishly also risk other ppls lives, just coz they cant wait another friggin ½ hour and cant even bother to be careful.
I am, however, also shocked, that crew told passengers to stay in their seats, while the crew themselves were quick to leave the plane. The flight crew could do nothing from the cockpit, but the rest of them? Atrocious.
I've seen people smoking when off the plane, around fuel trucks/tanks/pipes.
People really are that careless.
Perhaps it was deliberate. Not everyone is a perfect law abiding conscientious person.
Illegal cigarette lol.
I heard this in a brieffing: "Guests are not allowed to tamper with the smoke detectors or the flight attendants in the toilets."
11:02 The most ridiculous partis that even today tobacco, vapes and firelighting devices are allowed, instead of forcing them to put in check in.
Excellent work Chloe, as always 👍🏼
Indeed, a very tragic crash. I was stunned by the fact you mentioned that the passengers where instructed to remain seated, but seeing one of the comments below that they were likely dead due to the smoke at the time the plane crash landed, I think it's possible.
It would be nice to cover the disappearence of Varig 967 also
Keep doing your great work!
Hard to believe that is his name. Didn’t catch it when I started the video.
@@okjeffy6581 Or her name, we live in a brave new world.
@@krashd I didn’t think men could have the name “Chloe”.
@@krashd A new world, maybe. Not sure about the "brave" bit though.
@@patagualianmostly7437 i think people in general are pretty brave nowadays! always have been, really
I honestly love it that you're adding the name of the tracklist that you're using in every video hope to see more of that in future videos
This (and similar events) is the reason that now aircraft bathrooms have smoke detectors and have automatic fire extinguishers located in the same compartment as the waste bin.
RIP to all who perished.
Smokers with audacity are just terrible. I lived with one growing up...
On Thanksgiving, the year that Florida finally banned smoking indoors, we went to a restaurant and my step grandfather lit up a cigarette despite our entire table and several people from other tables telling him to put it out. He only did when someone who worked there told him they would remove him if he didn't put it out immediately. It was so friggin embarrassing. Here's a grown ass man who can't even control himself in public.
My parents and grandparents ruined my lungs while I was growing up by chain smoking inside the house and never opening windows or ever changing an AC filter. Got my first asthma attack at 13 and I've NEVER been able to run even though I'm lithe and should be able to.
Too many smokers suck.
Smokers don't care about others !!!
@@stuartgmk they are people. some dont care, others do.
@@piotrtarkowski8595, par for the course for people to have the few ruin things for the rest of them and everyone who doesn't smoke as well.
@@Alaryicjude I feel like you simplify and generalize it. Not every smoker is a total ass, nor ruins everything for others. There are people who don’t smoke and yet pollute the world around them way more than if they’d just smoked. It’s different from person to person. I understand that you generally don’t like the fact that some people smoke. That’s ok. I don’t like the fact that some buy meat or generalize and throw others in the same big bag. We both have to live with this, I guess. Have a good day!
@@piotrtarkowski8595, I didn't ever say all smokers are asses. Also I don't argue with people who can't or don't read what I actually wrote. Sorry not sorry. Troll somewhere else.
Recently an accident report was published for Sriwijaya Air flight 182. I think it would make for a good video since is similar to Adam Air 574 and it highlights the ongoing systemic issues of Indonesian airline safety, which ranks as one of the worst in the world.
Yes I'll probably look into that one in the new year. I haven't read any of the report yet.
Indonesian here, i can speak that our safety hasn't always been good
But hey, it was better than back then when it seems like every Indonesian aircraft was a plane crash waiting to happen
@@DisasterBreakdown Thank you for considering it! Trust me, the accident was frustratingly preventable so it will definitely make a great video. You make really good videos on this sort of stuff, so keep up the great work!
@@derincattelane43 brilliant idea mate
Speaking of Indonesian incidents I would love some more detail on the Yogyakarta runaway overrun in 2007(?), there is footage of the aftermath from a TV news cameraman who was onboard but only a handful of breakdowns on it on yt
I'm glad you cover more air crashes than Mayday Air Crash Investigations does. Sometimes it seems they are lacking for content (like when they create compilations of past episodes). But there are so many more crashes, like this, that they could cover. I guess it's probably a funding issue, but it would be nice if they covered more crashes like this one.
Another factor is some of the investigators for certain incidents maybe unavailable for whatever reason.
@@xlinkkaisaintsrow2365 I hadn't thought of that, but it makes sense. 🙂
The air on an airliner is not recycled. At altitude, compressors pressurize the cabin with fresh outside air. The cabins are not air tight, the expelled air from the passengers is forced out under pressure and not recycled. You can see this on old airliners, whereas the nicotine has streaked parts of the fuselage where the air was expelled.
In the days of smoking 100% bleed air from engine was fed into cabin through AC then vented out cabin through outflow valve maintaining about 6 psi cabin pressure but now the bleed air is mixed with 50% recycled air . Reason for this is bleed air from engines effects fuel consumption , but yes your correct cabins do leak and leave nicotine stains
I have flown long haul wide body flights when they allowed smoking and it was awful experience you got off stinking of stale smoke , felt sorry for cabin staff having to work in these conditions
@@nounoufriend1442 Yep, some people have said that air quality on planes actually got WORSE when smoking was banned since the airlines now recycle a lot of air to save fuel.
I flew as an unaccompanied minor in the late 70s / early 80s. I remember thinking how sketchy it was that the airlines allowed a whole section of smokers in the back. Sketchy and nasty. Seems totally ridiculous now, because it was ridiculous them too!
In 1994, Canada became the first country to ban smoking on all flights, both domestic and international.
From a smoker, I remember the ashtrays on the armrest 2024. I’ll grown up still smoking but so sad about the airplanes that crash because of fires in the bathroom.😢
Love your vids. Always sends a shiver down my spine for those planes and their crews and passengers that simply vanish.
Rest in peace to the crew of Varig Flight 820 and passengers and crew of Flight 967.
As I recall, the rubbish bins were redesigned to contain and restrict air flow in the event of a similar fire. Procedures were also updated that help to give the passengers a better chance of getting off of the aircraft alive when there is a fire.
And of course, smoking is prohibited on aircraft now. As a smoker, I really don't have a problem with that inconvenience. At all, as I loathe even my own secondhand smoke.
But, to set down in an onion field and not have an upset, that's some spectacular piloting!
There were a LOT of alternatives in terms of clearing the in-cabin atmosphere…i.e. kick open the rear disembarkation doors. The plane was not pressurized at that time as they were below the 10,000 foot level. That and simply smashing out the passenger windows would have cleared the air.
Smoking on board aircraft had one positive. Being a pressure vessel, the smoke would escape wherever it could and this would highlight loose rivets and cracks in the external skins of the fuselage. The external area aft of the pressurization outflow valves often bore a three foot long stain of nicotine and smoke residue. Those residues imposed a maintenance burden as they would clog the operational parts of the valves.
The biggest killer in the Varig accident cited was cyanide, not carbon monoxide. The cyanide was a byproduct of the burning plastics, foams and fabrics of the cabin interior. There is good news on the smoking on aircraft front however. Materials used in interiors is now flame resistant and in some places retardant. The materials also do not give off the same noxious fumes. Flammable thermal liners, a factor in the Swiss Air MD-11 fire have been removed. Lavatories now are equipped with smoke detectors that alert the crew and the trash receptacles are self smothering sealed units with passive fire extinguishers.
A footnote not touched on in the video is that 707s landed unpressurized. Until approximately 500’ above the ground, smoke would have been flowing out the pressurization control valves. At 500’, the recirculating fans would have and in this case did, recirculate the smoke throughout the entire aircraft. Hence, moving the passengers forward initially may have protected them from the smoke flowing down and aft through the fuselage, at 500’, that mitigation was overcome by the reconfiguration of the systems.
Aviation safety progress is paid for in blood. The last thing a pilot wants to be is an aviation safety pioneer.
In 1994 I was on my way back from Holland to Toronto and went into the lavatory and found smoke coming out of the trash in the wall so I splashed water into it and notified a flight attendant who seemed to maybe not understanding but I was quite sure I had it out but now seeing this holy crap
Did the plane crash into two skyscra-
Ha Ha JK no that was tasteless my apologies
✈ 🏙
OH MY GOD I CAN'T BELIEVE MY SUGGESTION CAME TRUE! Much appreciation for making this video and telling the story!
For this episode, I would say it is a very well done episode, but the story can be a bit more detailed. It's still a great video nonetheless.
As my English are not that good, I can't really express my feelings right now aside from many thanks and much appreciation for you to make this video, wishes for your video can be seen by much more people and this channel growing bigger and bigger!
You're very welcome. It was a very interesting disaster to cover.
It was my suggestion not yours
@@thomasmckendry8566 mind if I ask where your suggestion is? if it's on the comment section, then which video did you comment on?
My suggestion was at the comment section of the lubeck airport crash that posted 3 weeks ago, which did mention this accident. If I can see or find your suggestion, I'll change my comment right away.
@@洪梓恩-p7z it's possible both of you suggested it independently of each other. Also, your English is very good.
@@thomasmckendry8566 no one cares
Harry Again
I read somewhere that if an aircraft you are on ever comes to an unexpected stop on the ground, ignore all instructions and just get out ASAP. This sort of thing has happened on several occasions (ie passengers burned to death on the ground.)
Also, sit by an exit and make sure you know how the door and escape chutes work. (There will be instructions.
That is VERY bad advice. Flight crew have for years been trained on plane evacuations and how to get everyone off a plane safely within 90 seconds. It's an FAA requirement. If everyone starts panicking and trying to push their way off, people will be trampled and injured and it will take longer to evacuate the plane and increase chances of death. People who do what you say should be arrested and charged with a crime if it endangers people.
For the record, air in pressurized aircraft is not constantly recycled, as people often think. The vast majority of the air is continuously routed overboard through outflow valves. The engines, through Air Cycle Machine that tap air from the engines and make it breathable, ensures that the air is fresh.
Varig is dearly missed here, and many people have theorized on why the plane crashed. Some Said the plane flew on soviet airspace and was shot down, with the government hiding all clues of the crash. Another, which i believe in the most, says a faulty cargo door broke off causing the cargo and pilots to get sucked out, eventually the plane broke apart and crashed into international waters.
So my question is, and please forgive my ignorance.... if the cabin is filling with deadly smoke and fumes, why not open the aft door or another door? Certainly cabin pressure isn't a problem at this altitude.
1:58 "A convertible variant of the plane" gave me a slightly different mental image.
I can't believe we were ever allowed to smoke on aircraft. Besides second hand smoke just the thought of passengers allowed to create fire on board is ridiculous.
I'm from Australia but spent nearly 10 years working in Africa in the mining exploration industry, I've flown in and out dozens of African countries on local African airline's, many of the flights I've been on lots of people were smoking either in their seats or sometimes a flight attendant would tell you to go stand at the rear of the cabin to smoke, basically no rules at all are followed, this is was in the middle 2000's and 2010's.
I remember flying on a few DC-9s with ash trays built into the arm rest...different times.
Acording to Ricardo, he thinks the accident was caused by the cargo in the luggage department. This cargo was some military government equipment (an ejection seat) from the then president/military dictator Emílio Garrastazu Médici, to which Varig company owners were very close. This cargo was supposed to be delivered to France for maintenance. This ejection seat was not properly deactivated, and it automatically activates on a certain altitute. Acording to Ricardo, from the moment the old lady left the restroom, the smoke started to spread TOO fast for it to be originated from a cigarette butt.
Recently, he gave an interview in a brazilian talk show. It's from 3 months ago. If you understand portuguese, i suggest you watch it.
And why would he push that theory if he saw smoke coming from the bathroom (and, no one heard any explosion, including him)? Weird
I grew up in the 60's certainly remember the smoking and non smoking areas on a plane, seemed the norm at the time, cigarettes were everywhere, remember going to the cinema watching a film with a continous plume of smoke from the woman in front, all those bee-hives and hairspray, bloody deathtraps, ashtrays in the backs of seats🤣
As a passenger on AA a few years back, we did have someone go to the bathroom and smoke a cigarette while on flight… The Crew took action and they immediately isolated him to get arrested once we landed… now i know what could had happened after watching this video… Thank you 🙏.
I thought they banned lighters and matches etc for carry on for this reason.
I always knew mankind wouldn't be able to kick this wretched habit within my lifetime. I would like for there to be a count of those who lost their lives due to cigarettes.
Masuda Harris
The tobacco industry would not like that!
One of the largest causes of unnatural death are automobile accidents. A lot more people would be alive if we had more viable alternatives to driving everywhere. Tobacco industry has blood on their hands, same with the automobile industry.
@@halinaqi2194
It's not the things we use that kill people, it's the stupid people that use them! And smoking tobacco is a personal choice; it's up to people not to smoke, if they value their health.
I’m so glad I found your videos. Thank you for all your time and research.
Just install a very sensitive, well hidden smoke alarm in the lavatory and when it goes off you grab this passenger, handcuff him/her, hand them over to police and ban them from flying on ALL airlines!
Brilliant coverage, as always, Chloe. What a horrible tragedy!
I'm a smoker and considering the potential danger, I'm amazed that smoking was still allowed on planes during my lifetime. My first flight, at 9, from Melbourne to Rome, we were in a non smoking section (my parents never smoked), I remember walking through the smoking section and the smell of cigarette smoke hit you like a brick!
Thankfully, last time I made the same trip, I went via Kuala Lumpur, where there was a room in the airport where smokers could smoke - I appreciated it after about 10 hours and another 10 hours to come on the connecting flight. I've no idea if they still have that room but the thought of how absolutely dangerous fire is on a plane makes the "inconvenience" more than reasonable!
I remember growing up in the 80s and 90s, planes had a smoking and nonsmoking section. I would sit with my parents in the nonsmoking section and once in a while a passenger would light up a cigarette. Flight attendants would come and argue with them back and forth. It was similar to angry passengers not wearing masks during the Covid mandates.
Great examination of this tragic incident. Well done.
Bad comparison.
@@sanniepstein4835 not really. Shows you that times change but moron smooth brains persevere Darwin be damned.
Hardly comparable. Seriously!
@@sanniepstein4835 I'd say it was a good comparison. Morons endangering others and breaking rules in the process.
@@alisonwilson9749 Nope. We've known since 1981 that masks don't protect you from viruses. I fly all through Covid and never wore one because I have asthma. Stick your masks and jabs where the sun don't shine!
There are fire suppression systems available to make commercial planes safer. Hermetically sealed bathrooms with Halon systems that evacuate the air after the fire is out. Same with cargo areas. We have these systems in our hospital and are safe when operating correctly. Better engine fire systems are also available. Wheel well fires should last like zero seconds. Aircraft systems tunnel ducts for electrical systems should be redesigned, during flight no air is necessary.
It is nothing but amazing that people were allowed to smoke on airplanes at all, let alone for so many decades. God bless that captain May he rest in peace.
Yeah, thousands of planes went down because of smokers
I mean no one knows for sure if it happened because of that, it's just a theory, I personally would rather believe that it was more of a suicide thing where some psychopath intentionally set the plane on fire and got all those innocent people killed, for me that would make more sense than thinking that some dumbass couldn't just wait for like 5 hours without smoking, and went in there and lit up a cig and dropped it in a bin while it was still on fire without thinking for a second that it's a fatal thing to do, I just don't see where someone does that unintentionally.
Smokers are the worst, always totally inconsiderate of everyone around them.
@@OryAlle Completely agreed!
@@Durcy A lot of people throw out cigarettes without thinking. Smokers, are, after all, often inconsiderate people. How many times have we heard about a fire because someone tossed a butt out the car window? "couldn't just wait for like 5 hours without smoking". No, they can't. I've known many of them.
The plane crashed because a passenger didn’t follow instructions. The only passenger to survive survived because they didn’t follow instructions.
Reality has a sick sense of humor.
Banning smoking has, of course, greatly reduced the risk of fire, unfortunately it has done little to improve the air quality, as airlines have reduced the air filtration processes.
The biggest irony though is that with smoking banned the airlines took the opportunity to reduce air circulation on board which is probably as detrimental or even more so than second hand smoke. Really shows you their priorities.
Yes and they do that so you go to sleep ASAP which really wrecks your body clock when your flight leaves at 6am!
Now you got me curious about Varig 967.
Well, that's essentially it. No wreck was ever found and no reason for the plane's disapearance could be discovered, so it's an unsolved mistery.
@@DOUGL4S1 That plane had a depressurization a week earlier of this incident, because of some locks of the cargo door failing, only held by the bottom ones. VARIG CEO couldn't tell if the issue was solved on the maintenance, and probably got the same issue, but airborne on the middle of the sea...
Chloe: "it was a convertible variant"
Me for a whole second: omg the roof could come off??
Did the accident report question why an immediate evacuation was not started when the plane came to a stop in the onion field?
Because they were already dead from toxic fumes.
@angelaclements1244 they weren't, it's mentioned in the video, that firefighters tried to rescue some passengers. It's impossible for most of the cabin crew to survive but all of the passengers, that followed instructions, to die except in case of cabin crew completely abandoning their duties, and sacrificing lives of passengers to save their sorry 🍑
As a smoker, I fully agree with banning smoking on aircraft. It’s been proven that cigarette smoke residue exacerbates corrosion in the airframe. I worked in aviation maintenance for more than 40 years.
Another great informative video. I appreciate the effort it takes to research and produce this content. It also is a good teaching tool.
I can't believe how people can get so careless. I guess some get too busy or too lost in other thoughts to really consider what they're doing. You know those big ugly trash cans that have ashtrays on the top? I've seen a few of those go up because people chucked their cigarette into the bin instead of the ashtray. I watched more than one of those decorative little islands in a parking lot with bushes and mulch catch on fire. Don't park near those if you can help it. I've also watched numerous people lean against the cages in front of Lowe's smoking with about twenty full propane tanks behind them in the cage that's clearly labeled. Sometimes I laugh at warning signs and stickers thinking how it's common sense not to do the thing they're warning you not to do but then I see a mother pushing a shopping cart with a toddler laying on the bottom. I see a full grown man walk around a safety barrier to ask the employee running the forklift where something is ignoring the pallet of pavers that's 20ft in the air. I don't know where caution went but it left a long time ago.
The sequence of the disaster is not correct. There was a book called Black Box about some Brazilian crashes including this one.
First it was not an onion field, it was cabbage. The crew invaded the cockpit. All the survivors where standing inside the cockpit when landing, including the only survivor passenger. They were screaming to the pilots to land and that influenced the decision making of the captain. There was no problem with the aircraft and they could have landed in the airport.
The pilots were criticized for not landing in the airport where the rescue was. People say that everyone was already dead but who knows really.
Another thing, the crew tried to combat the fire but, theyve tried in the wrong toilet. More smoke was coming out of the lavatory where there was no fire.
Well done to the flight crew. Good landing. Even today, when a plane from any South American country lands, passengers ignore the flight attendants and captain, and rush to the front in a traffic jam to be the first out the doors. Been there 22 times. Sad outcome. RIP
The flight crew basically killed the passengers with a screwed up evacuation. What well done?
Can you imagine smoking on a plane? It must have smelt disgusting the entire flight
Your comment about rules being learned and enforced through actions. It's true in a lot of fields. In trauma response, we are told "the lessons learned here are taught in blood". People have died so we can learn these things.
Same in workplace safety, sadly! 😔
It's interesting to see the contrast with air safety though, because in work safety, there generally tends to be more of a pendulum effect...? Necessary legislation is passed due to majordeaths/serious health impacts, and things steadily improve. But then things tend to start becoming overcomplicated, or a change of government happens & greedy corporate actors start pressuring for reduced constraints to cut cost-corners.
If the government caves to this pressure, you then see a significant swing away from regulatory oversight... Until the next major tragedy occurs, at which point the public will start agitating for better rules again. (For a classic example of this cycle's outcomes, see New Zealand's Pike River mining disaster?)
By comparison, it seems as an outside observer that the air industry has usually been better at over-all iterative safety change, without quite the same up/down politically-motivated swings...? Although we do see that same pattern repeated on a smaller scale within industry-associated companies (such as Boeing), as well similar ongoing challenges around whether investigative results from disasters are allowed to lead to real legislative change (eg the NTSB vs FAA issue).
You did so much research for this and every other video. I get so excited for your releases!
Amazing video to wake up to on a Saturday
Have a great day!
This story doesn't mention any attempts to actually put out the fire with extinguishers etc... I feel like if smoke started coming from the door of the toilet, it would give plenty of time to open the door and use a fire extinguisher before it grew out of control.
You Should do a video on Varig 967
That disappearance was really baffling, especially considering what was being carried
The thing about Varig 967 is that there is very little content to discuss, all we know is that a 707 disappeared carrying a couple Million dollars worth of paintings, it hasn't been found and it's wreckage could lay thousands of feet deep in the Pacific. That's really it, we have no clues concerning the aircraft so it's litteraly just a stub. It could be explained in two minutes flat, and I'm pretty sure Chloe doesn't like to delve into theories which is why we haven't gotten an MH370 video yet. It's much preferred to stick to the facts and we know next to nothing on Varig 967.
I am working for Boeing in manufacturing. To my surprise once I had task to review installation plan of three ashtrays in Boeing 777 new aircraft cockpit. So they still have them in a cockpit just in case pilots would want to smoke cigarettes.
Btw love this channel! Thanks for your work
Chloe, have you ever thought of doing Military related incidents like Black Hawk Down or B2 crash or even the UN DC-6 incidents
I would love to do a video about the B2. It's possible, I'll give it a look.
Also, criticism but why does the Varig livery seem off
@@senabecool7232 It isn't off, textures seem to be okay.
Some(most) people are just carelessly selfish and dont care about the consequences of their actions. Unfortunately these are one of those moments where the careless behavior resulted in a major catastrophy that cannot be reversed.
I'm not going to lie, I facepalmed when it was said that the cigarette was placed in the trash. Also, as someone who didn't fly in the 1970s, for multiple reasons, weren't there ashtrays in the plane back then?
Ashtrays are required on all commercial planes today believed it or not. It’s so if some idiot tries to smoke in the lavatory, they’ll put it in the tray and not the waste bin.
So wait, all the passengers were seated up front, following the inst. of the crew. Then 1 guy came from the back, walked past the passengers seated up front. & sat in the fwd galley behind the cockpit?? Tryin' to paint a mental pic. Great vid as always 😉👍✌️.
I wonder if the flammability of the interior materials has a role in this?
I remember a similar incident in the UK. After which they changed the rules on plane interiors.
Why would you not flush it? The toilet is made to handle massive dumps coming out of people, I don’t think a cigarette butt would have damaged anything.
fantastic video. keep up the great work
Thanks!
A very interesting case for sure
Very unfortunate for the victims of varig 820 and varig 967 and especially the captain.
A question, were any of the flight controls damaged during the fire?
No flight controls were damaged during the fire, the crew decided to make a forced landing because they feared a structural break up of the aircraft and, also, the smoke became so dense in the cockpit, they couldn´t even see the instruments nor see through the windows, they depressurized the aircraft and opened the side windows to look outside.
In 1986 we flew from LAX to St Louis & the smoking area was in the back of the plane but it drifted all over the cabin. Its too bad it took a few passenger jets to crash from careless smokers before something was done.
Ashtrays in the lavatory are a wise decision.
If you can't stop people from illegally smoking, you can at least make sure they do it safely.
Anyone who smokes on a plane should be charged with air piracy.
@@davidhoward4715 Are you going to put surveillance cameras in the toilets?
@@schwarzerritter5724 No need. You can smell a fuckin cigarette in a clean plane from the cockpit
In uk years ago smoking banned national express coach London to Edinburgh, I smelt burning and went into toilet where bin was on fire I put it out but pulled emergency cord, if I hadn't of smelt the fire and got yo out it out, most passengers were sleeping, so coukd of been very bad, all down to an idiot needing a smoke
The coach journey has several toilet, food, smoke breaks as well
So tragic that many passengers survived the crash but all but 1 died from the fire and smoke. RIP
There was a more recent incident where a passenger brought gasoline into his carry on and in the same overhead bin a lithium ion battery shorted out and caused a fire. I don't know if it crashed or if it landed.
People are allowed to bring gasoline?
@@schwarzerritter5724 no !
@@schwarzerritter5724 no. He put it in a cleaning chemicals bottle . It was innocent but still caused an issue
Unless it was a very small amount of gasoline, this must have been before significant amounts of liquid were banned from carry-on luggage.
Dang, what a twist ending. Imagine surviving this flight only to get into into another flight where the plane vanishes without a trace.
Am I the only one here who finds it suspicious and significant that Filinto Müller - the most powerful politician in Brazil at the time - was on that plane? Müller was universally regarded as the most dangerous, most ruthless, and most despised man in Brazil. Before becoming President of Brazil's upper house, Müller had been the country's chief of police, and was notorious for his brutality. He is "credited" with being the originator of death squads. There could scarcely be a more likely candidate for assassination. His enemies had been trying to eliminate him for decades, but he had always been too well protected.
As for the fire itself, I find the discarded cigarette theory highly improbable. It's not unheard of for fires to beak out in airplane toilet rubbish bins, but they are almost always discovered and extinguished before they cause any serious damage. Fire can spread quickly, of course, but in this case we're told that a woman exited the toilet with smoke billowing behind her, and that, despite the quick response of the crew, the fire could not be put out with a fire extinguisher. Fire doesn't spread *that* quickly. Unless, of course, it was ignited by an incendiary device.
In my opinion the most likely explanation for this crash is that Filinto Müller's political enemies discovered that he was going to be on that plane and arranged for a fire bomb with a timer to be placed in the toilet rubbish bin. The device went off when the toilet was being used by a woman passenger (would she have gone into the toilet if the fire was already in progress?). The accelerant used in the device would explain the rapid or instantaneous escalation of the fire.
Given that it was during the Cold War, it was possible
Thank you for yet another well done video, may all those people rest in peace. I always think of if the plane I am on were to go down what would I do. safe to say as a kid I have been on couple of really bad airplanes (broken seatbelt. tray not closing. AC broken) but I am glad I am still here
Great video Chloe! Are you planning to do a celebrity-related plane crashes?
Thanks!
Every time a plane crashes, the first thing investigators do is check where Tom Hanks was at the time.
My friend`s father, Mr. Carlos Diefenthaler, flight engineer, died trying to stop the fire. Still remember him well.
It makes you wonder what the cabin crew were doing when the first signs of smoke were seen? A few minutes with a fire extinguisher could have saved all those lives.
Probably looking for the source of smoke.
1. Correction: air in the cabin is not "constantly recycled." Just a part of it. Most of the air vents out, and fresh air comes in.
2. A significant factor in this tragedy was the flammable materials used inside aircraft at the time.
Swear to God, brazilians are some of the greatest contestants to the Darwin Awards in the world...
No words for how dumb this was. At the very least - soak your cigarette in running tap water before discarding or discard in the toilet so that it ends up in the waste tank. It's difficult to say where dumb ends and malicious begins.
Such a sad incident. Amazing video as usual.
Great video!! I was actually born in the souther part of Brazil, Rio Grande do Sul, hence the name VARIG (acronym for Viação Aérea RIo-Grandense, Rio Grandean Airways) ... in the 90's I flew from. Porto Alegre to Rio de Janeiro for family holidays! Young boy flying for the first and it was VARIG 🙂 Never heard its name since then...Airline want busted...it is a shame, it was a big at the time ...VARIG and VASP, Maybe you can also find something on VASP to make a good video! Thanks for bringing back those childhood memories with an amazing video covering this accident! cheers
55 seconds ago?! Nice vid!
You're early :)
I flew on Garuda in 2001 - there was a smoking section in the rear seats.