The Master: "I'm going to prevent the signing of the Magna Carta!" The Doctor: "Why?" The Master: "...............Look! Behind you! " *The Master runs away*
This episode would be perfect for a Pitch Meeting video. "So in this story we're going to have The Master trying to prevent the signing of the Magna Carta" “But why?” “Because!” "Ok"
@@GeordieJoe1892 It's explained, if you listen (sorry if I sound grumpy; have had to explain this so often, which proves the execution of the story, but not the concept, is perhaps flawed). He's going to undermine all the key civilisations of the universe. Mankind will probably never reach the stars, and the Doctor's favourite planet will be stifled and destroyed. DOCTOR: You won't win, not ultimately. MASTER: You're mistaken. With Kamelion's unique ability at my command, it's only a matter of time before I undermine the key civilisations of the universe. Chaos will reign, and I shall be its emperor. DOCTOR: Earth is a primitive planet. You won't succeed so easily elsewhere. MASTER: Where I cannot win by stealth, I shall destroy. That way I cannot fail to win. also DOCTOR: The King turns the Barons solidly against him, he is killed in battle or deposed, possibly in favour of King Phillip of France. He cannot therefore offer Magna Carta. What do you think of it so far? MASTER: I couldn't do better myself. DOCTOR: Thus the foundations of parliamentary democracy will never be laid.
@@lucasdolding6924 I think that when they were mapping out season 20, the producer John-Nathan Turner, and his script editor Eric Saward, had pencilled in their 7 stories - six 4 part stories and one 2 part story. They knew that one particular 4 part story, with its particular subject matter, had to finish the season, so they had to decide where they were going to fit “The King’s Demons” into the running order? “The King’s Demons” only had two companions, so it couldn’t have been placed within The Black Guardian trilogy. It could only have been placed either 2nd behind “Arc of Infinity,” 3rd behind “Snakedance,” or where it was finally put, 6th after “Enlightenment.” As we all know, because of BBC strikes the final 4 part story couldn’t be filmed and had to be held over to season 21. By deciding to place “The King’s Demons” 6th in the running order, it meant that this weak story unfortunately ended the season on a bit of a damp squib! Does anybody know if, when planning the budget for season 20, if a) Nathan Turner and Saward had wanted to do a Special in the first place (or not?) or b) they wanted to do the Special and its budget was included in the season 20 budget or c) they wanted to do the Special but it wasn’t in the season 20 budget, so they had to go cap in hand to the BBC for additional funds to make it? If it was a), then the Special might not have been made, so the Master wouldn’t have been in it. By having him in “The King’s Demons,” it at least assured the fans they got one story with the Master in that season.
@@andrewroberts299 A chunk of extra money for the special came from ABC in Australia (where "Doctor Who" was very popular), as part of a co-production deal. I dunno how much of the 7th story's budget would have been left by the time it cancelled/postponed... Had actors been cast? Locations booked? Any sets or models bult, or even just designed...?
This was a prime opportunity for the Meddling Monk to return. Not only would he suit the historical time period and history-changing scheme but he'd fit the season's theme of bringing back old villains to celebrate the show's 20th anniversary. As you say, it all seems too small fry for The Master, not helped by the silly disguise, shorter runtime etc. Very excited for your upcoming reaction to the anniversary special but not as much as how your mind will be blown by all the creative ways they utilise a shapeshifting robot like Kamelion as a companion - it is unreal.
@@neilmcdonald9164 in big finish they had a few actors for the role which worked well Graeme garden, Rufus Hound and even a female actor to play the meddling nun by Gemma whelan And in s10 they planned an episode called how the monk got his habbit they planned matt berry to take the role of the monk So I think any of those 4 would be perfect choices I know Rufus is very protective of the role at big finish and I believe said he would be up for playing the monk on tv too (You might already know all this idk just wanted to info dump)
Trouble is by 1983 nobody would've remembered the meddling monk he was only in one early adventure after all, it had been twenty years since that, Generation X who were watching this show at this time wouldn't have had a clue so it wouldn't have meant much.
I do love that the Master chose to disguise himself as the French Taunter from Monty Python & the Holy Grail. "You insult ze king! Adric was a hamster, and the Doctor smells of Elderberries."
Talking about 2 parters🤔. So far we've had: The Edge of Destruction (stuck in the Tardis. 3rd ever serial) The Rescue (Vickis introduction) Sontaran Experiment (4th Doctors first season, Sarah and Harry on Earth after the Ark) Black Orchid (5 in 1925 with doppelganger Nyssa and murder at the manor) The King's Demons (Master altering Magna Carta with King John in 1215)
Others have probably already gone into this, but I can't stop myself, Kamelion is audio animatronic, he could be programmed to move his arms in a variety of ways and to move his mouth in synch with pre-recorded dialogue. Producer John Nathan Turner was eager to introduce Kamelion into the show as a companion, despite the skepticism of Peter Davison and script editor Eric Saward. Unfortunately, Kamelion's software programmer, Mike Power was killed in a boating accident shortly after this was filmed and no one else really knew how to make the thing work. Subsequently, we don't really see Kamelion going forward, though he's presumably in the TARDIS somewhere, until a story down the line where his story is wrapped up. He's a bit like the Chuck Cunningham of Doctor Who in that respect. To preserve the "surprise" of the Master's appearance, Anthony Ainley is credited in the episode as James Stoker, an anagram of Master's joke. His in story alias, Estram is an anagram of Master. Looking forward very much to your reaction to the next story. It should be a banger.
I believe around this point they started giving Janet an allowance to go shop for costumes personally, a distinct change from the Costumes with a Capital C approach of the start of the JNT era.
'What about Magna Carta? Did she die in vain?' - or words to that effect. The Master's grand plans seem to have fallen by the wayside here. Yes, it's significant in English history, but we've seen this kind of thing before. Both Linx and the Monk had a pop at subverting medieval times. On the other hand: Peter Davison sword fight.
Kamelion was definitely an idea that came before the technical practicalities of his inclusion were really thought out. The robot prop used for Kamelion was actually not custom-made for the series, but was a device discovered by producer John Nathan-Turner when he was searching for a possible successor to K9. The robot's creators wanted to use Doctor Who as a shop window for their invention, but oversold its capabilities to Nathan-Turner and the production team as it could not walk and was very prone to breaking down constantly, which led to some of the scenes featuring the robot being remounted because of the technical difficulties that occurred. Script editor Eric Saward and Peter Davison were extremely sceptical that the robot would work as an ongoing companion due to its frequent malfunctions. Davison had to keep constantly propping up the robot as it never stood up right.
Sticking an actor in a silver C-3PO costume would've been a lot cheaper and more reliable, but then JNT would've lost his beloved "We're using a genuine sophisticated robot" hook for the tabloids.
I never really took to Turlough. The idea of a companion working against the Doctor was interesting but I don't think it was executed that well. He's not bad, just not a favourite of mine. I also preferred the Nyssa and Tegan team up.
Christopher Villiers, who plays the son, also appears in the Capaldi story "Mummy on the Orient Express". He is a member of the old noble Villiers family which provided lovers to King James I and his grandson King Charles II. He is also a direct descendant of Oliver Cromwell.
Crazy how in an era that's often accused of its over reliance on continuity that The Doctor never mentions he met John's brother and sister back in The Crusade
Your face at 12.24 when you saw kamelion for the first time? Brilliant! Keep em coming sesska, your amazing! 😂 Looking forward to your next reaction. Earplugs are on standby.... 😊
I always loved the historical setting in this one. When it aired in 1983, I was quite into the medieval, so this was right up my street. I always wished they'd done more with it though. There's not a lot of story here and the ending is just too swift and abrupt. Quite an anti-climax. The idea of a shape-shifting robot companion really excited me at the time as I could see great possibilities for using that in storylines. It's a pity they weren't able to use the robot much, but the technology was in its infancy, and I expect it was also too difficult to have Kamelion always using disguises in stories.
Two parters we’ve had so far: The Edge of Destruction, The Rescue (with One), The Sontaran Experiment (with Four), and lately Black Orchid and The King’s Demons with Five. This isn’t the last one though.
The King Demons is such a cool little story to me, Kamelion is fascinating to me too. Not because he's a great character or something but just the idea of him and what happened to everything surrounding Kamelion outside of the show. I was incredibly ambitious to say the least.
When Kamelion turns up in part 2 it was a remains a jaw dropping moment as Sesskasays's reaction proves. An actual robot in Doctor Who. Sorry Peter Davison but Kamelion is beautiful, uncanny and brave. God bless JNT.
I thought the idea of King John been an android in disguise was quite a shock, and the way the french knight revealed himself as the Doctors Time Lord arch-enemy the Master was a shock and his TARDIS as an Iron Maiden was rather strange and possibly for one of the worst disguises ever .
This Master's voice is the biggest clue. Turlough is great sometimes, he's the Rory of the 80s, saying the things we're all thinking. As for 2 part stories, not counting the season when they went to 45 min episodes, classic who only had 5 stories of that length that I remember. Edge of Destruction, Sontaran Experiment, Black Orchid, King's Demons, and The Awakening. Not a huge sample size to compare.
@@robalexander8065 I forgot about the Rescue! Took me a minute to remember what other spoilery one you meant but it finally clicked: Season 23, gotcha.
I think this story is really fun and was a throwback to the 3rd Doctor's era. Once again it is the Doctor vs. the Master (for the 5th time in 15 stories), it has a setting similar to the Time Warrior, the Doctor and the Master have a sword fight like the Sea Devils, and the Doctor ends up with Kamelion, a shiny new gadget (every 3rd Doctor story ever). It's not a battle for the future of the Universe, but you can't have that every week. It's a battle of wits between the Doctor and the Master. The Master is hoping the Doctor will show up, just to try and prove he is the superior intelligence, and fails once again. This is a chance to see the 5th Doctor vs. his archenemy again, and the results are just what we expect, the Doctor outwitting (and out-dueling) the Master. A nice change of pace episode. Also the castle location is awesome!
We sign in praise of total WARRR! La lalalala la la la LA! For some reason I always loved that song. Chameleon is such a great idea. Pity they couldn’t use him more. As a kid I did make up a few stories where he was very useful to the tardis crew as an infiltrator. He had such great potential. But the tech was a bit too cutting edge for the time. He would’ve worked in new series much better I think. Can’t wait for the next one. :)
Tegan's knife throwing skills are never talked about. She was on point (pun intended). I'm fairly sure someone has mentioned it already, but "The King's Demons" brought Season 20 to a premature end. Originally, this story was to be followed by a 4-part Dalek tale, "Warhead". Strikes interrupted the recording of "Terminus" and the production time needed for "Warhead" was allocated to finishing "Terminus". Kamelion could have been an interesting companion. With producer John Nathan-Turner's habit of stunt casting, I've often noted that it's surprising he did not seize on the opportunity to employee different actors and actresses to play Kamelion given that the robot could transform into virtually anyone's appearance.
my problem is that i knew the master was in this, but can never remember who he is pretending to be. so it ends being a surprise in that sense. can't wait for next week. i think the next reaction is one we've all been waiting for.
It's a shame Kamelion didn't get many stories because I think it had great potential. I always thought it would have been interesting if it changed its appearance every episode to a guest actor, that would have prevented much use from the actual robot itself which I believed had many technical problems.
I do say Seska the Masters disguise in this story, was silly he was posing as a french knight called Sir Giles Estram and to me Estram looked when I first saw this story aged 14 well suspicious. I thought the disguise of his TARDIS as a medieval Iron Maiden was rather bizarre and some fans said to me when this story aired they thought it could be the Masters TARDIS in disguise and I also say the silver android Kamelion who can assume millions or even tens of millions of disguises is similar to androids seen in other sci-fi series and films too. I do recommend Seska watching classic sci-fi series, Blakes Seven from the late 70s to early 80s if you have not yet seen this awesome sci-fi series.
...It has been awhile since the Doctor & The Master have had a sword fight ... 3rd incarnation - "The Sea Devils", I think. I agree with you sbout the Master. He did a far better job disguised as "The Porteeve" in "Castrovalva".
As a child with fairly poor facial recognition skills, I was always totally fooled by the Master's disguises during this era. Looking back, most of them are rubbish. It's clearly Anthony Ainley in there!
After Lynda Baron in the last story, Gerald Flood as the imposter King John is another fun over-the-top villain performance. That and other things about this story were why I was a little surprised you thought that it wasn't a particular memorable one. I get your reasoning but it's amusing that you're so used to Doctor Who (and classic Who) that an story with elements like this one has could be considered unmemorable, relatively speaking. In recent months I've found myself often watching or rewatching stories you're coming up to in the following weeks and when I did this one I was surprised that I hadn't realised before how obvious it seems that 'Sir Gilles' is the Master and thought "Sesska will recognise him within seconds", especially given you eventually saw through his much better disguise in Castrovalva. It was a little surprising that it took a few scenes though as you said they made sure not to show him that clearly at first and the way you looked at the screen showed that you still had your suspicions. One of the big issues with Turlough as a character is that for a companion who had such a great concept they struggled to find a role for him once the Black Guardian trilogy was over. However it seems like that won't be a problem so much for you given how much you enjoyed how much he really got put through it in this one as I think that's pretty much his fate now (when they do anything with him at all).
Aside from the physicality. Sir Gilles surname being Estram is another obvious aspect of his ID. You know how 80s Who (and indeed RTD) loves an anagram.
The sheer irony of John Nathan Turner wanting rid of K-9 (a notoriously unreliable prop, which even Tom Baker derided as 'a blasted hard thing to work with') - only to bring on board Kamelion - is off the scale. The machine can barely move. But that's what happens when people get certain ideas in their head and, worse, believe what they're told. The stupid thing is that there is a built-in excuse in the narrative NOT to use the prop.
This was a standard mid season story that wasn't helped by the fact that it ended up being the season finale for reasons beyond its control. The season ended up finishing on a damp squib which resulted in "The King's Demons" getting a more harsh appraisal than it would otherwise have received. Overall it's a harmless bit of frippery compared to the stronger Davison stories but has some nice moments.
I do wish they managed to make the Master look less like the Master. They should have given him a prosthetic nose and a huge beard. Even then, Anthony Ainley has quite a distinctive voice.
Kamelion is a character shrouded in tragedy behind the scenes. Mike Power, the designer of the robot, was the only one who truly understood the inner workings and mechanics of the prop. Sadly, he passed away in a boating accident shortly after this story's production. No one could understand the programming like him so the character does not in the special, nor the majority of Season 21. There's also the matter of supposed curse surrounding the character as the voice actor, Gerald Flood, as well as any writers who penned stories that featured him, later died within a few years.
All I'm going to say is that I'm really excited for the next episode. Do not skip the titles, just don't look at the rest of the titles after the Doctor Who Logo is off screen. Do not read the name, just don't read anything.
Best of the Davison two parters I think, not as bad as everyone thinks, I like the scenes with the Master and the Doctor in this, best for this version of the Master so far for sure
Poorest imho. I like them all to a degree but the actual plot is a bit sleight in King's Demons and part two wraps up a little too quickly. Prefer Black Orchid of the two Jess has watched.
Turlough is rather wasted in this story...and,yes,this is the Master's worst disguise-most reactors guess correctly before the reveal (the iffy French accent doesn't help)🎩
He looks like the Master, he sounds like the Master, his surname is an anagram of... MASTER. Hmm, I wonder who it could be... That's a tough one. He is such a Master of Disguise, he'd never use a disguise as lame as that... would he?
The Doctor had 2 shape changing companions, Kamelion is . . . one of them. The better one was in the Doctor Who Monthly strip, Frobisher!! He was beyond the technology of the time, a tough talking former P.I. who's favorite form was a PENGUIN!! He is in a couple of Big Finish stories, but if he ever made it to live action!!! Tegan's dress from here on out is my favorite! This was the 2nd time the Doctor and Master had a duel, not quite as fun as the first! For his return after Timeflight, He should have had something better.
This was an okay episode. Had a good plot for the Master and having to convince everyone the king was an imposter was executed decently. It's a good introduction for Kamelion as a companion but there's some problems which are well known by the fanbase.
This story gets a lot of flack from the fans but I’ve always been fond of it. I’m a sucker for a medieval setting so it’s got me there but I am also thankful it’s only a two parter. Also for some reason I missed this one on its first broadcast on my local PBS (NJN) and had to wait quite a long while before it came on again, so that when I finally saw it it felt like a real treat.
If you did not like Turlough or thought he was a villain, it was OK if he got stuck in plot B with dumb humans capturing him. Some writers know what to do with plot B. (And other plot streams as you will see.)
I agree with you while it's entertainingly watchable for the dramatics it's not considered one of the best stories of fandom it's as other commenters have said a damp squid the only best memorable thing in this whole story is the first appearance of Kamelion.
After the brilliance of Enlightenment the last two weeks, we get this damp squib of a story. Thank God it's only two parts and we can be done with it in one week! It seems the fifth Doctor's era is cursed to follow up a great penultimate story with an awful season finale....
@@BernardJKD I'd say that the Pertwee era in particular was very fond of finale-esque stories as their final story. I get what you're trying to say that "Classic Who doesn't have finales" in terms of the typical culmination we associate with that term, but I think Classic Who has a fair few seasons which feel like it has a proper finale. 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 15, 16, 18 are very finale-like. And I think you can make an argument for 13, 14, and 17 if you count Shada as well, just from the fact that it's the only 6 parter in the season. Even season 12 could be viewed as finale-like on further reflection actually, as they finally get back to the Ark, which it has taken them all season to do.
If only this story had been set on the Sabbath, what with Master being dressed in black... (I'm sure one of those non-lethal sword moves the Doctor used is a Spinal Tap. =;o} )
A classic two parter, for me is the equivalent of a nu-who standalone episode. Its why, for the most part, I dont like the current Doctor Who format. 4 episodes can be a stretch, but allows much more time for build up and characterisation. 2 parts (or 45 minutes), are too disposable - i'm rarely invested enough in the story or characters to care. There are exceptions of course (Midnight or Blink, for example), but i'd rank any bog standard classic 4 parter ahead of any new single episode story for that reason.
For me, this might be my least favourite episode of Doctor Who. While others may have more controversial choices or tonal issues, they are at least interesting to discuss even for negative reasons. King's Demons is both boring and lazy, especially how it handles Turlough, there was plenty of compelling material to explore now he's been outed but is just locked up for the entire story.
Ah yeah - another episode that falls under my category of "that was certainly an episode of TV" Bit harsh tbh - Lets see... Ainsley is delightful as always, the robot idea was interesting (didnt work out but hey) and overall this story is at least not dragged over 4 episodes. Pretty strong case of mid-who though at the end of the day
13:05 As recorded in article "High Learning Potential ?" on the school critical s1te Lib Ed. The year before this came out, in real life, in a downmarket unposh populist, and short lived flash in the pan, private school in Wales, Balfour House, whose head teacher David Newman ran it terrorising us with nerve damagingly sudden massively loud maniacal bellows and was fanatical for homework. He added a boy to the roll of homework offenders to have their books checked by him every morning, and did it in front of us possibly as a warning hint to me at a time of exam failing crisis from pushing too hard, and he opened with: "TAKE YOUR HANDS OUT OF YOUR POCKETS, YOU SNIVELLING LITTLE WRETCH, I HAVE THE POWER TO MAKE YOUR LIFE MISERY. " He was never brought to any justice for treating kids like that, and though an unusually young head teacher then only aged 36, he is now dead. But he did see, and was seen to see, his practices destroy his own dreams. The breakdown I was then tipping into, and that scene helped tip me further, wrecked his propaganda about giftedness and streaming. It helped decisively, along with its own consistently bad results, to tip Balfour from fast growth into an initially fast then tapering decline, that went all the way to its closure 10 years later, shrunk to 60 kids and utterly discredited. He had run it for 16 years out of the 27 it existed for, only in his time having a post-16 level.
I can see why you would split the next one, but it's a mistake. It wasn't made to be watched in two parts, any more than a 90-minute film is made to be watched in two parts....
@@sesskasays Okay, that makes more sense. Wouldn't want you to ruin the experience... (I can say that without spoilers now.) Looking forward to seeing what point you turned into a cliffhanger. :)
Yeah unfortunately at the time of recording it, there was no way to squeeze in a 90 minute special and edit it for just one week. I was already overwhelmed and certainly do not want to push out a rushed product for a special. Plus it was recorded exactly as I do every other typical 4 part story for Classic Who with a relatively similar runtime. Trust me I think both parts have a lot of great moments :) I'm excited for everyone to see it!
@@sesskasays I've been waiting for this one for a while. I'm also curious, now I have you attention (heh), if you're planning on doing Nu Who again, now you have the fuller context of the full history to see hw different you respond to the big returns, etc. Example, how differently you'd respond to Tegan in Power of the Doctor once you've watched all of her original run.
I love the fith doctors era but even i find The Kings Demons pretty meh! Instantly forgettable if I'm honest. Loved your reaction again though Jess. You're the best!! 😊
in the next story, don't skip the titles. Press play and don't skip the titles. Hide your eyes so you don't see the titles if you do not know the name. This way it won't sopil it for you.
@@andrewgwilliam4831 I think my point is that I don't understand why fans demand that reactors experience the stories with a lack of foreknowledge that nobody else watching the story would share.
In a year or two after this season a Doctor Who Role Playing Game was released (before the novels or Big Finish Audios were a thing). For their bio for the Master, the Monk (from the First Doctor era) and the War Chief (from The War Games) we’re both included as earlier incarnations of the Master. Though this theory has never been addressed in the show, one way or the other, The King’s Demons does show the Master taking part in some Meddling Monk shenanigans. ...Perhaps the Master was feeling nostalgic, this story? 🤔😉
This story is nothing special to be honest. But this story introduces Kamelion. But don’t get used to him because Kamelion was a technical nightmare to work with for the production team. Because the machine itself kept breaking down, it couldn’t walk other than stand. It’s movements were stiff and the voice wasn’t synced up on queue with the actors. Which is abit of shame because I like Kamelion, im just sorry It didn’t work out how JNT wanted to be.
That's a bit of a spoiler comment. Jess doesn't like any info at all about future episodes or how much or little characters will feature. It's not a huge spoiler, but we have to be careful in the comments.
A horrible excuse of two episodes. It’s one of the incongruities of this era that it could so effortlessly go from near genius (Enlightenment) to utter tedium in one week. And it happens quite regularly in this period
@@BernardJKDEarthshock to Timeflight, kinda following Four To Doomsday. And there’s one in particular next season which I’m sure you, and everyone else, are aware of where it goes from utterly magnificent to utterly awful in a week
Easily the weakest of the five two parters we have seen so far. Some interesting moments, though, especially the iron maiden being the Master's TARDIS.
If ya'll wear headphones in the next two reactions, that's your problem not mine.
Hahaha!! I'm expecting it all Jess! Can't wait!!
Sweet Christmas,I cannot wait.
Oh ready for the 20th anniversary special definitely
I'm expecting multiple screams throughout the special 😂
I wonder why that could be?
I’m looking forward to the special, it’s one of my favourites.
The Master: "I'm going to prevent the signing of the Magna Carta!"
The Doctor: "Why?"
The Master: "...............Look! Behind you! " *The Master runs away*
This episode would be perfect for a Pitch Meeting video.
"So in this story we're going to have The Master trying to prevent the signing of the Magna Carta"
“But why?”
“Because!”
"Ok"
@@GeordieJoe1892 It's explained, if you listen (sorry if I sound grumpy; have had to explain this so often, which proves the execution of the story, but not the concept, is perhaps flawed). He's going to undermine all the key civilisations of the universe. Mankind will probably never reach the stars, and the Doctor's favourite planet will be stifled and destroyed. DOCTOR: You won't win, not ultimately.
MASTER: You're mistaken. With Kamelion's unique ability at my command, it's only a matter of time before I undermine the key civilisations of the universe. Chaos will reign, and I shall be its emperor.
DOCTOR: Earth is a primitive planet. You won't succeed so easily elsewhere.
MASTER: Where I cannot win by stealth, I shall destroy. That way I cannot fail to win. also DOCTOR: The King turns the Barons solidly against him, he is killed in battle or deposed, possibly in favour of King Phillip of France. He cannot therefore offer Magna Carta. What do you think of it so far?
MASTER: I couldn't do better myself.
DOCTOR: Thus the foundations of parliamentary democracy will never be laid.
Feels like this story would've worked a lot better with the Monk, especially since we get the Master next story anyway
@@lucasdolding6924 I think that when they were mapping out season 20, the producer John-Nathan Turner, and his script editor Eric Saward, had pencilled in their 7 stories - six 4 part stories and one 2 part story. They knew that one particular 4 part story, with its particular subject matter, had to finish the season, so they had to decide where they were going to fit “The King’s Demons” into the running order?
“The King’s Demons” only had two companions, so it couldn’t have been placed within The Black Guardian trilogy. It could only have been placed either 2nd behind “Arc of Infinity,” 3rd behind “Snakedance,” or where it was finally put, 6th after “Enlightenment.” As we all know, because of BBC strikes the final 4 part story couldn’t be filmed and had to be held over to season 21. By deciding to place “The King’s Demons” 6th in the running order, it meant that this weak story unfortunately ended the season on a bit of a damp squib!
Does anybody know if, when planning the budget for season 20, if a) Nathan Turner and Saward had wanted to do a Special in the first place (or not?) or b) they wanted to do the Special and its budget was included in the season 20 budget or c) they wanted to do the Special but it wasn’t in the season 20 budget, so they had to go cap in hand to the BBC for additional funds to make it? If it was a), then the Special might not have been made, so the Master wouldn’t have been in it. By having him in “The King’s Demons,” it at least assured the fans they got one story with the Master in that season.
@@andrewroberts299 A chunk of extra money for the special came from ABC in Australia (where "Doctor Who" was very popular), as part of a co-production deal.
I dunno how much of the 7th story's budget would have been left by the time it cancelled/postponed... Had actors been cast? Locations booked? Any sets or models bult, or even just designed...?
This was a prime opportunity for the Meddling Monk to return. Not only would he suit the historical time period and history-changing scheme but he'd fit the season's theme of bringing back old villains to celebrate the show's 20th anniversary. As you say, it all seems too small fry for The Master, not helped by the silly disguise, shorter runtime etc. Very excited for your upcoming reaction to the anniversary special but not as much as how your mind will be blown by all the creative ways they utilise a shapeshifting robot like Kamelion as a companion - it is unreal.
As a monk Stan I completely agree the monk is an icon
lol
They've bought back Sutekh...so why not the Monk? (Though who'd succeed the late,great Peter Butterworth?)👍🤔🎩
@@neilmcdonald9164 in big finish they had a few actors for the role which worked well Graeme garden, Rufus Hound and even a female actor to play the meddling nun by Gemma whelan
And in s10 they planned an episode called how the monk got his habbit they planned matt berry to take the role of the monk
So I think any of those 4 would be perfect choices I know Rufus is very protective of the role at big finish and I believe said he would be up for playing the monk on tv too
(You might already know all this idk just wanted to info dump)
Trouble is by 1983 nobody would've remembered the meddling monk he was only in one early adventure after all, it had been twenty years since that, Generation X who were watching this show at this time wouldn't have had a clue so it wouldn't have meant much.
"Turlough stopped to look at something" - THIS CAN ONLY END IN TEARS
I do love that the Master chose to disguise himself as the French Taunter from Monty Python & the Holy Grail.
"You insult ze king! Adric was a hamster, and the Doctor smells of Elderberries."
I mean, how else could you tell he was French, unless he spoke in an outrageous accent?
@paulhammond6978 at least he wasn't wearing a string of onions
Talking about 2 parters🤔. So far we've had:
The Edge of Destruction (stuck in the Tardis. 3rd ever serial)
The Rescue (Vickis introduction)
Sontaran Experiment (4th Doctors first season, Sarah and Harry on Earth after the Ark)
Black Orchid (5 in 1925 with doppelganger Nyssa and murder at the manor)
The King's Demons (Master altering Magna Carta with King John in 1215)
Others have probably already gone into this, but I can't stop myself, Kamelion is audio animatronic, he could be programmed to move his arms in a variety of ways and to move his mouth in synch with pre-recorded dialogue. Producer John Nathan Turner was eager to introduce Kamelion into the show as a companion, despite the skepticism of Peter Davison and script editor Eric Saward. Unfortunately, Kamelion's software programmer, Mike Power was killed in a boating accident shortly after this was filmed and no one else really knew how to make the thing work. Subsequently, we don't really see Kamelion going forward, though he's presumably in the TARDIS somewhere, until a story down the line where his story is wrapped up. He's a bit like the Chuck Cunningham of Doctor Who in that respect.
To preserve the "surprise" of the Master's appearance, Anthony Ainley is credited in the episode as James Stoker, an anagram of Master's joke. His in story alias, Estram is an anagram of Master.
Looking forward very much to your reaction to the next story. It should be a banger.
Master quickly recognized!
"How did you identify me with my outrageous French accent?"
Tegan’s costumes got increasingly 80s from here on, though her final look was the coolest thing ever when I was 12-13.
It’s not bad at 40, either.
I believe around this point they started giving Janet an allowance to go shop for costumes personally, a distinct change from the Costumes with a Capital C approach of the start of the JNT era.
'What about Magna Carta? Did she die in vain?' - or words to that effect. The Master's grand plans seem to have fallen by the wayside here. Yes, it's significant in English history, but we've seen this kind of thing before. Both Linx and the Monk had a pop at subverting medieval times. On the other hand: Peter Davison sword fight.
Tony Hancock.
FUN FACT: A great drinking game - every time Turlough says, "There's nothing we can do!" take a shot.
We had better prepare for a *LOOOOOOOOOOOONG* night….
Karma, karma, karma, karma, karma Kamelion 😅
Very much looking forward to your next reaction.
Boy George…
Kamelion was definitely an idea that came before the technical practicalities of his inclusion were really thought out. The robot prop used for Kamelion was actually not custom-made for the series, but was a device discovered by producer John Nathan-Turner when he was searching for a possible successor to K9. The robot's creators wanted to use Doctor Who as a shop window for their invention, but oversold its capabilities to Nathan-Turner and the production team as it could not walk and was very prone to breaking down constantly, which led to some of the scenes featuring the robot being remounted because of the technical difficulties that occurred. Script editor Eric Saward and Peter Davison were extremely sceptical that the robot would work as an ongoing companion due to its frequent malfunctions. Davison had to keep constantly propping up the robot as it never stood up right.
There was also some software issues. Mainly the guy in charge of the software dying in a boating accident. Curse of Kamelion
They couldn't have used a man in an outfit?
Sticking an actor in a silver C-3PO costume would've been a lot cheaper and more reliable, but then JNT would've lost his beloved "We're using a genuine sophisticated robot" hook for the tabloids.
@@dngillikin In the end its a shame really. Having a shapeshifting android for a companion sounds a lot more cool than it turned out.
If next week is what I think it is, you and I are going to be so happy.
Turlough is such an underrated companion, but he's one of my favorite male companions. Plus, he looks great in that suit!
I never really took to Turlough. The idea of a companion working against the Doctor was interesting but I don't think it was executed that well. He's not bad, just not a favourite of mine. I also preferred the Nyssa and Tegan team up.
Christopher Villiers, who plays the son, also appears in the Capaldi story "Mummy on the Orient Express". He is a member of the old noble Villiers family which provided lovers to King James I and his grandson King Charles II. He is also a direct descendant of Oliver Cromwell.
Crazy how in an era that's often accused of its over reliance on continuity that The Doctor never mentions he met John's brother and sister back in The Crusade
Yay! She's finally at this episode! I can finally talk about this one! The King's Demons!
Go on then...
Your face at 12.24 when you saw kamelion for the first time? Brilliant! Keep em coming sesska, your amazing! 😂
Looking forward to your next reaction. Earplugs are on standby.... 😊
I always loved the historical setting in this one. When it aired in 1983, I was quite into the medieval, so this was right up my street. I always wished they'd done more with it though. There's not a lot of story here and the ending is just too swift and abrupt. Quite an anti-climax.
The idea of a shape-shifting robot companion really excited me at the time as I could see great possibilities for using that in storylines. It's a pity they weren't able to use the robot much, but the technology was in its infancy, and I expect it was also too difficult to have Kamelion always using disguises in stories.
It excited the crew originally.
But couldn't work with it.
Although easy way around it would be having guests every series.
Two parters we’ve had so far: The Edge of Destruction, The Rescue (with One), The Sontaran Experiment (with Four), and lately Black Orchid and The King’s Demons with Five. This isn’t the last one though.
A bit of a short and quickly wrapped-up story.
It was fun to see The Master heavily disguised as The Master.😉
The King Demons is such a cool little story to me, Kamelion is fascinating to me too. Not because he's a great character or something but just the idea of him and what happened to everything surrounding Kamelion outside of the show. I was incredibly ambitious to say the least.
When Kamelion turns up in part 2 it was a remains a jaw dropping moment as Sesskasays's reaction proves. An actual robot in Doctor Who. Sorry Peter Davison but Kamelion is beautiful, uncanny and brave.
God bless JNT.
I love Tegan in this episode.
She basically saves the day
Ah. Kameleon. There's a fun story behind that prop. The thing was absolutely cursed.
"We sing in praise of total WUAAAAAAAAH"
We haven’t had a good sword fight between the Doctor and the Master in a while.
I thought the idea of King John been an android in disguise was quite a shock, and the way the french knight revealed himself as the Doctors Time Lord arch-enemy the Master was a shock and his TARDIS as an Iron Maiden was rather strange and possibly for one of the worst disguises ever .
This Master's voice is the biggest clue.
Turlough is great sometimes, he's the Rory of the 80s, saying the things we're all thinking.
As for 2 part stories, not counting the season when they went to 45 min episodes, classic who only had 5 stories of that length that I remember. Edge of Destruction, Sontaran Experiment, Black Orchid, King's Demons, and The Awakening. Not a huge sample size to compare.
The Rescue and one other but that would be a spoiler (you have already mentioned one serial Jess has yet to view.)
@@robalexander8065 I forgot about the Rescue! Took me a minute to remember what other spoilery one you meant but it finally clicked: Season 23, gotcha.
Welcome Kamelion to the TARDIS team!
I think this story is really fun and was a throwback to the 3rd Doctor's era. Once again it is the Doctor vs. the Master (for the 5th time in 15 stories), it has a setting similar to the Time Warrior, the Doctor and the Master have a sword fight like the Sea Devils, and the Doctor ends up with Kamelion, a shiny new gadget (every 3rd Doctor story ever). It's not a battle for the future of the Universe, but you can't have that every week. It's a battle of wits between the Doctor and the Master. The Master is hoping the Doctor will show up, just to try and prove he is the superior intelligence, and fails once again. This is a chance to see the 5th Doctor vs. his archenemy again, and the results are just what we expect, the Doctor outwitting (and out-dueling) the Master. A nice change of pace episode. Also the castle location is awesome!
Pity the Third had so few historicals. The sword fight was definitely a nod to Delgado and Pertwee in The Sea Devils.
We sign in praise of total WARRR!
La lalalala la la la LA!
For some reason I always loved that song.
Chameleon is such a great idea. Pity they couldn’t use him more. As a kid I did make up a few stories where he was very useful to the tardis crew as an infiltrator. He had such great potential. But the tech was a bit too cutting edge for the time. He would’ve worked in new series much better I think.
Can’t wait for the next one. :)
Am living for the next reaction!
Tegan's knife throwing skills are never talked about. She was on point (pun intended). I'm fairly sure someone has mentioned it already, but "The King's Demons" brought Season 20 to a premature end. Originally, this story was to be followed by a 4-part Dalek tale, "Warhead". Strikes interrupted the recording of "Terminus" and the production time needed for "Warhead" was allocated to finishing "Terminus". Kamelion could have been an interesting companion. With producer John Nathan-Turner's habit of stunt casting, I've often noted that it's surprising he did not seize on the opportunity to employee different actors and actresses to play Kamelion given that the robot could transform into virtually anyone's appearance.
my problem is that i knew the master was in this, but can never remember who he is pretending to be. so it ends being a surprise in that sense. can't wait for next week. i think the next reaction is one we've all been waiting for.
This a great historical! short and sweet too like Black Orchid!
OMg..next week....we are gOnna hear so much SQUEE-ING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A historical but far from great.
It's a shame Kamelion didn't get many stories because I think it had great potential. I always thought it would have been interesting if it changed its appearance every episode to a guest actor, that would have prevented much use from the actual robot itself which I believed had many technical problems.
Shhhh spoilers! Don’t let Jess see this
Or just use a man in an outfit.
I do say Seska the Masters disguise in this story, was silly he was posing as a french knight called Sir Giles Estram and to me Estram looked when I first saw this story aged 14 well suspicious. I thought the disguise of his TARDIS as a medieval Iron Maiden was rather bizarre and some fans said to me when this story aired they thought it could be the Masters TARDIS in disguise and I also say the silver android Kamelion who can assume millions or even tens of millions of disguises is similar to androids seen in other sci-fi series and films too. I do recommend Seska watching classic sci-fi series, Blakes Seven from the late 70s to early 80s if you have not yet seen this awesome sci-fi series.
I suspect the next two reactions will just be followers sitting watching with a grin from ear to ear.
That was great
Been looking to your next reaction for the longest time too (as it’s a special and everything)
...It has been awhile since the Doctor & The Master have had a sword fight ... 3rd incarnation - "The Sea Devils", I think. I agree with you sbout the Master. He did a far better job disguised as "The Porteeve" in "Castrovalva".
As a child with fairly poor facial recognition skills, I was always totally fooled by the Master's disguises during this era. Looking back, most of them are rubbish. It's clearly Anthony Ainley in there!
More obvious than the elderly Portreeve in Castrovalva and the "snotty" magician Kalid in Time-Flight.
After Lynda Baron in the last story, Gerald Flood as the imposter King John is another fun over-the-top villain performance. That and other things about this story were why I was a little surprised you thought that it wasn't a particular memorable one. I get your reasoning but it's amusing that you're so used to Doctor Who (and classic Who) that an story with elements like this one has could be considered unmemorable, relatively speaking.
In recent months I've found myself often watching or rewatching stories you're coming up to in the following weeks and when I did this one I was surprised that I hadn't realised before how obvious it seems that 'Sir Gilles' is the Master and thought "Sesska will recognise him within seconds", especially given you eventually saw through his much better disguise in Castrovalva. It was a little surprising that it took a few scenes though as you said they made sure not to show him that clearly at first and the way you looked at the screen showed that you still had your suspicions.
One of the big issues with Turlough as a character is that for a companion who had such a great concept they struggled to find a role for him once the Black Guardian trilogy was over. However it seems like that won't be a problem so much for you given how much you enjoyed how much he really got put through it in this one as I think that's pretty much his fate now (when they do anything with him at all).
Aside from the physicality. Sir Gilles surname being Estram is another obvious aspect of his ID. You know how 80s Who (and indeed RTD) loves an anagram.
The sheer irony of John Nathan Turner wanting rid of K-9 (a notoriously unreliable prop, which even Tom Baker derided as 'a blasted hard thing to work with') - only to bring on board Kamelion - is off the scale. The machine can barely move. But that's what happens when people get certain ideas in their head and, worse, believe what they're told. The stupid thing is that there is a built-in excuse in the narrative NOT to use the prop.
He would have been justified had the thing worked properly. Kamelion's ability to assume other identity was arguably more useful than K9.
This was a standard mid season story that wasn't helped by the fact that it ended up being the season finale for reasons beyond its control. The season ended up finishing on a damp squib which resulted in "The King's Demons" getting a more harsh appraisal than it would otherwise have received. Overall it's a harmless bit of frippery compared to the stronger Davison stories but has some nice moments.
I do wish they managed to make the Master look less like the Master. They should have given him a prosthetic nose and a huge beard. Even then, Anthony Ainley has quite a distinctive voice.
Kamelion is a character shrouded in tragedy behind the scenes. Mike Power, the designer of the robot, was the only one who truly understood the inner workings and mechanics of the prop. Sadly, he passed away in a boating accident shortly after this story's production. No one could understand the programming like him so the character does not in the special, nor the majority of Season 21. There's also the matter of supposed curse surrounding the character as the voice actor, Gerald Flood, as well as any writers who penned stories that featured him, later died within a few years.
Spoilers!
We're happy you have a soft spot for Turlough most of us find him annoying and a complete troublemaker.
Shock horror,it’s the Master.
Christopher Villiers (Hugh) later starred in the comedy film, TOP SECRET!.
All I'm going to say is that I'm really excited for the next episode. Do not skip the titles, just don't look at the rest of the titles after the Doctor Who Logo is off screen. Do not read the name, just don't read anything.
She's already reacted to it on her patreon
Best of the Davison two parters I think, not as bad as everyone thinks, I like the scenes with the Master and the Doctor in this, best for this version of the Master so far for sure
Poorest imho. I like them all to a degree but the actual plot is a bit sleight in King's Demons and part two wraps up a little too quickly. Prefer Black Orchid of the two Jess has watched.
Turlough is rather wasted in this story...and,yes,this is the Master's worst disguise-most reactors guess correctly before the reveal (the iffy French accent doesn't help)🎩
He looks like the Master, he sounds like the Master, his surname is an anagram of... MASTER. Hmm, I wonder who it could be... That's a tough one. He is such a Master of Disguise, he'd never use a disguise as lame as that... would he?
Is Estram's surname even used on screen in part 1 though?
@@BernardJKDIn the credits. It was devised mainly for the billing in Radio Times.
Yeah,about Kamelion...🎩
The Doctor had 2 shape changing companions, Kamelion is . . . one of them. The better one was in the Doctor Who Monthly strip, Frobisher!! He was beyond the technology of the time, a tough talking former P.I. who's favorite form was a PENGUIN!! He is in a couple of Big Finish stories, but if he ever made it to live action!!! Tegan's dress from here on out is my favorite!
This was the 2nd time the Doctor and Master had a duel, not quite as fun as the first! For his return after Timeflight, He should have had something better.
Tegan actually changes in the next story but returns to this outfit in the following one.
I think I speak for everyone in that we can foresee how you will be reacting to the next story😊
This was an okay episode. Had a good plot for the Master and having to convince everyone the king was an imposter was executed decently. It's a good introduction for Kamelion as a companion but there's some problems which are well known by the fanbase.
They should pull a timey wimey thing and get Kamelian back on the modern show now that we have the technology to actually make it work.
He is a robot. There could be dozens of them
Agree with you that this was not the best of disguises for the Master
This story gets a lot of flack from the fans but I’ve always been fond of it. I’m a sucker for a medieval setting so it’s got me there but I am also thankful it’s only a two parter. Also for some reason I missed this one on its first broadcast on my local PBS (NJN) and had to wait quite a long while before it came on again, so that when I finally saw it it felt like a real treat.
There's no pulling the wool over your eyes.
If you did not like Turlough or thought he was a villain, it was OK if he got stuck in plot B with dumb humans capturing him. Some writers know what to do with plot B. (And other plot streams as you will see.)
I agree with you while it's entertainingly watchable for the dramatics it's not considered one of the best stories of fandom it's as other commenters have said a damp squid the only best memorable thing in this whole story is the first appearance of Kamelion.
I thought you would know by now the tardis never goes where they plan...
Unless they want to in the plot.
After the brilliance of Enlightenment the last two weeks, we get this damp squib of a story. Thank God it's only two parts and we can be done with it in one week! It seems the fifth Doctor's era is cursed to follow up a great penultimate story with an awful season finale....
Though this wasn't intended to be the finale, that was a 4-part story which got cancelled due to industrial action.
It's not a finale. Classic Who doesn't have finales.
@@BernardJKD It's the final story of the season, which quite literally makes it a finale.
@@BernardJKD I'd say that the Pertwee era in particular was very fond of finale-esque stories as their final story. I get what you're trying to say that "Classic Who doesn't have finales" in terms of the typical culmination we associate with that term, but I think Classic Who has a fair few seasons which feel like it has a proper finale.
6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 15, 16, 18 are very finale-like. And I think you can make an argument for 13, 14, and 17 if you count Shada as well, just from the fact that it's the only 6 parter in the season. Even season 12 could be viewed as finale-like on further reflection actually, as they finally get back to the Ark, which it has taken them all season to do.
@@Mrazmatmahmood It is the final serial but it wasn't intended to be. It isn't written like a finale. Certainly nothing like the nuWho finales.
IRON MAIDEN!!!!! IRON MAIDEN!!!
If only this story had been set on the Sabbath, what with Master being dressed in black... (I'm sure one of those non-lethal sword moves the Doctor used is a Spinal Tap. =;o} )
Excellent!!!
@@therealpbristow I saw Spinal Tap 'live" in 1994 -they were amazing - they ROCKED for real -and very funny!!
Then again, it is Classic Who, if one actor can appear twice in a Doctor's era, how won't the Doctor recognise them in their next incarnation?
Not a great story but really looking forward to your next one. Btw hope you enjoy kameleon as the new companion in the future
A classic two parter, for me is the equivalent of a nu-who standalone episode. Its why, for the most part, I dont like the current Doctor Who format. 4 episodes can be a stretch, but allows much more time for build up and characterisation. 2 parts (or 45 minutes), are too disposable - i'm rarely invested enough in the story or characters to care. There are exceptions of course (Midnight or Blink, for example), but i'd rank any bog standard classic 4 parter ahead of any new single episode story for that reason.
Welcome to the team: Robot that is instantly forgotten about.
They got rid of K9 for this?
Contrary to most opinions, I actually like this story, aside from the ending which is rushed and feels unfinished
Agreed
A neat little story spoilt a little by having to introduce Kamelion. Would have been a great pure historical
I actually don't know what you're on about. Is it really coming up to The five Doctor's already?
For me, this might be my least favourite episode of Doctor Who. While others may have more controversial choices or tonal issues, they are at least interesting to discuss even for negative reasons. King's Demons is both boring and lazy, especially how it handles Turlough, there was plenty of compelling material to explore now he's been outed but is just locked up for the entire story.
Ah yeah - another episode that falls under my category of "that was certainly an episode of TV"
Bit harsh tbh - Lets see... Ainsley is delightful as always, the robot idea was interesting (didnt work out but hey) and overall this story is at least not dragged over 4 episodes. Pretty strong case of mid-who though at the end of the day
Have fun watching The Five Doctors anniversary special next.
Spoilers for Sesska?
@@Paul_1971 Nah, she's already recorded it and loaded it on her patreon.
@@replimatreviews Ah ok - fair enough.
@@replimatreviews How long are they on Patreon before UA-cam?
@@Paul_1971 2 or 4 weeks depending on tier
13:05 As recorded in article "High Learning Potential ?" on the school critical s1te Lib Ed. The year before this came out, in real life, in a downmarket unposh populist, and short lived flash in the pan, private school in Wales, Balfour House, whose head teacher David Newman ran it terrorising us with nerve damagingly sudden massively loud maniacal bellows and was fanatical for homework. He added a boy to the roll of homework offenders to have their books checked by him every morning, and did it in front of us possibly as a warning hint to me at a time of exam failing crisis from pushing too hard, and he opened with: "TAKE YOUR HANDS OUT OF YOUR POCKETS, YOU SNIVELLING LITTLE WRETCH, I HAVE THE POWER TO MAKE YOUR LIFE MISERY. "
He was never brought to any justice for treating kids like that, and though an unusually young head teacher then only aged 36, he is now dead. But he did see, and was seen to see, his practices destroy his own dreams. The breakdown I was then tipping into, and that scene helped tip me further, wrecked his propaganda about giftedness and streaming. It helped decisively, along with its own consistently bad results, to tip Balfour from fast growth into an initially fast then tapering decline, that went all the way to its closure 10 years later, shrunk to 60 kids and utterly discredited. He had run it for 16 years out of the 27 it existed for, only in his time having a post-16 level.
I can see why you would split the next one, but it's a mistake. It wasn't made to be watched in two parts, any more than a 90-minute film is made to be watched in two parts....
To be fair, it was all watched in one sitting. The reaction videos will just be in two parts :)
@@sesskasays Okay, that makes more sense. Wouldn't want you to ruin the experience... (I can say that without spoilers now.) Looking forward to seeing what point you turned into a cliffhanger. :)
Yeah unfortunately at the time of recording it, there was no way to squeeze in a 90 minute special and edit it for just one week. I was already overwhelmed and certainly do not want to push out a rushed product for a special. Plus it was recorded exactly as I do every other typical 4 part story for Classic Who with a relatively similar runtime. Trust me I think both parts have a lot of great moments :) I'm excited for everyone to see it!
@@sesskasays I've been waiting for this one for a while. I'm also curious, now I have you attention (heh), if you're planning on doing Nu Who again, now you have the fuller context of the full history to see hw different you respond to the big returns, etc. Example, how differently you'd respond to Tegan in Power of the Doctor once you've watched all of her original run.
There was a four part version when it was shown 9 months later in August 1984.
Anthony Ainley had a very distinctive face so disguising it was always not going to work that well😁
I love the fith doctors era but even i find The Kings Demons pretty meh! Instantly forgettable if I'm honest.
Loved your reaction again though Jess. You're the best!! 😊
Alas Antony Ainley's disguises are getting a bit obvious now
in the next story, don't skip the titles. Press play and don't skip the titles. Hide your eyes so you don't see the titles if you do not know the name. This way it won't sopil it for you.
Already up on Patreon, and the title is blurred by Jess's editor.
This 'don't looks at the titles' thing is silly. Back then, viewers knew in advance what was coming from the Radio Times.
But I suppose the pre-credits scene already gives a huge hint to Sesska about what should happen in the story even without the titles.
@@matthewclarke4127 But she's not watching it back then.
@@andrewgwilliam4831 I think my point is that I don't understand why fans demand that reactors experience the stories with a lack of foreknowledge that nobody else watching the story would share.
In a year or two after this season a Doctor Who Role Playing Game was released (before the novels or Big Finish Audios were a thing).
For their bio for the Master, the Monk (from the First Doctor era) and the War Chief (from The War Games) we’re both included as earlier incarnations of the Master.
Though this theory has never been addressed in the show, one way or the other, The King’s Demons does show the Master taking part in some Meddling Monk shenanigans. ...Perhaps the Master was feeling nostalgic, this story? 🤔😉
kamelion is only 2 episode this one and other later episode
This story is nothing special to be honest. But this story introduces Kamelion. But don’t get used to him because Kamelion was a technical nightmare to work with for the production team. Because the machine itself kept breaking down, it couldn’t walk other than stand. It’s movements were stiff and the voice wasn’t synced up on queue with the actors. Which is abit of shame because I like Kamelion, im just sorry It didn’t work out how JNT wanted to be.
That's a bit of a spoiler comment. Jess doesn't like any info at all about future episodes or how much or little characters will feature. It's not a huge spoiler, but we have to be careful in the comments.
1…
This story is pure pantomime filler, but it does lead us on nicely to... Something I'm looking forward to seeing.
Ainley makes it work rather well. Thank God it wasn't the Monk.Super dull idea to use the Monk.
This story was messy and confusing in billions of ways.
Chameleon - the worse companion in Who history.
A horrible excuse of two episodes. It’s one of the incongruities of this era that it could so effortlessly go from near genius (Enlightenment) to utter tedium in one week.
And it happens quite regularly in this period
It really doesn't
@@BernardJKDEarthshock to Timeflight, kinda following Four To Doomsday. And there’s one in particular next season which I’m sure you, and everyone else, are aware of where it goes from utterly magnificent to utterly awful in a week
Easily the weakest of the five two parters we have seen so far.
Some interesting moments, though, especially the iron maiden being the Master's TARDIS.