I love how your mind works. You went from being my favorite AOE2 player to also being my favorite youtuber because you care about the right things and execute so well.
Doing +50 pop per extra player, maybe +75 would be better imo, the games were somewhat close before, so this feels like it'd turn them to a steamroll. Having 350 pop in this game would have been enough
Honestly, props to the beginners, i always thought that the only good strat playing against hera 1v4 is all in feudal and thats exactly what they went for. Even teal had a somewhat faster castle to follow but got completely obliterated. GG indeed.
I was keen to see this and it didn’t disappoint at all. Felt fair at all times. Pressure on multiple bases is something you need to do to win these games and obviously couldn’t before. Even with the extra 150 made such a difference to balance the late game. Keen to see more like this.
The UT healing is insane remember tatoh and daut did testing 40 vs 40 Units daut didnt lose a single unit because he had couple Warrior monks on no attack stance healing in the back 24/7
The population modification is an immensely fantastic change. Makes me more excited to watch more of these, now that it's more balanced in the direction of increased intensity compared to before.
This patch is a fantastic edition to the game. I can't imagine Malay in this custom map, or Huns, or goths. That is such an exciting improvement. Thanks DJ!
Wha?... pardon. The techs have equal cost. Technology cost doesn't multiply with teamates. By your logic, Hera has cheaper technologies, which is completely false.
tech have equel cost per player yeah. but each player of the team need to make the same upgrade so 4x time te res cost lol but of course they got 4x tc's and 4x the ressources around their bases. @@sutterhall8401
@@sutterhall8401 its not that its cheaper it just applys to more pop than the enemys. THat is the logic behind it. So technically its CHeaper because the value of the updates rises with population.
This was so much fun to watch! Maybe 500 is too much but it should be at least 400! And you had a good point at the end, the high pop is os perfect to show your skills which makes it even more interesting to watch!
The flow of the game was enjoyable to watch, the four of them being all over Hera's base with towers, scouts, archers, skirmishers, desperately trying to finish him off before it's too late. And then Hera clicks Imp and it's the perfect "my turn" moment. That said, the value Hera found with his initial archers/crossbows was huge and probably decided the game. If the four of them hadn't taken such big eco losses early they might have been able to continue the pressure for longer and stop the momentum shift. Really fun game.
Wow this was so much fun to watch, makes me want to retransition to aoe2. I'd consider +200 per extra opponent to be fair, although +100 seems to work just fine for you. Also, congrats on the NAC5 win. GGs.
Would love for a higher pop in Tournament play aswell, think it would make it even sicker to watch! Also! This lighting is not doing your hair a favor xD you're looking gray at the age of 20+ xDDDDDDDDDDDDD
I am a guitarist, sometimes I watch master guitarists and I'm just in awe of what they can do Watching Hera micromanage 2 or 3 different battles at the same time while also managing ego and thinking about long term strategy kinda has the same feeling
This is so insane, Hera needs to be nerfed with 1 vs 6 with this population possibilities. It gives me hope in humanity vs AI the way he plays this game. Please do more of this.
Great tweak for this series, honestly. Really well thought and executed. Warrior priests are decent, but they are much better when paired with composite bowmen. Also, for some weird reason, they don't heal when idle most of the times. I noticed I had to place them on stand ground or even passive so they would heal when standing idle. GG WP!
This was needed! Great game. I can’t wait to watch more intermediate players 3-4v1 you cause they’ll be able to multitask between eco and military more competently
Also the strat for the 1 player team (you) changes drastically of course too, going from having to force early aggression or else losing late game to now surviving to late game but really just macroing because there’s too much to control!! Love this!
Because you're so much better than them, I'd say it would be more fair if you get a bonus 50 pop per additional played you go against. It feels like bonus 100 pop per player gives you too much of an advantage. If you survive the early game, it's automatically over with the +100 pop per player. Great game though!!
I mean I think in a perfect scenario you'd only get the extra pop space every time an opponent reaches imperial age, because games like these where you just get to 350 pop before a single player gets to imp just feels like there isnt a lot of counterplay. Like the idea of adding it was because imp vs imp was unplayable for you, but now it feels like it might shift into a position where imp vs castle is unplayable for the opponents. But ill say that I havent watched all of these 1vX player games, so you'll prob know it better than me :D Either way its great content as always
+100 pop per opponent is quite strong, I would do +25 per opponent to give just a bit more flexibility to Hera without destroying late game too easily. Great game anyway.
I thought the same. I would do a 200, 250, 300 vs 2, 3 and 4, respectively. Doing so many units can overrun a side of the map because the opponents pop needs to be coordinated to defend that.
That eco! 🤯 Loved it, this feels a lot more fair. Warrior priest still feels very high elo unit, still feels like a weird unit imo. A monk that fights but is weak to light cav, idk, seems like it shouldn't work on paper, but could definitely see it at high elo healing low HP then going back in.
Feels like the problem is more that you can make too big of armies. What if instead your villagers cost half pop in imperial? Or a quarter? That way you could have a big economy but not an overwhelming army.
Why dont they make a tournament for Pro's where its 500 pop? It might help games that drag on because they both get pop capped, have way to many res, and literally cant get their units to die fast enough to keep up with how many production building they have.
I am 17 minutes in and I am impressed by the pressure his opponents are putting out. Yes their economies got hit hard.. but they are hitting him too! He has to spend time on defending actively instead of freely pursuing massive ecnonomy an building up in peace. And if everyone them takes a little damage but also deals a little damage to HEras economy, Hera will suffer worse. This is the most exciting game I have seen so far!
This was great, if only they had coordinated with the rams and pushed forward further with the towers (or cut them for more forward production) I think they could have been much tougher.
i like this for 1vX, i do believe however you need to get less of a buff cuz this makes you way too strong against lower players late-game 11 i would advise to play around and adjust the number of pop depending on enemy numbers and mostly elo (100pop for 1k- players seems excessive, but for 1k+ could seem fair, maybe just 50 pop for lower elo players, whatever threshhold that could be... really like the change this can bring to the series, and i do hope there will be a similar michi game again, but this time, they don't rush things 11 GG ps : have you played the gamemode whih starts post-imp before ? i'd really like to see you play that
I reckon this would be very difficult against 4 better players, as the 200+ pop advantage only comes into play in Imp/late Imp. 4 feudal/castle age aggressors would be tough to deal with.
Warrior priests are quite good (unless there's scouts) in Castle Age, but Ferreters Champs are better in Imp, though mixing in some halbs and WPs even then to boost the survivability of the army is a good strat in Imp, IMO Also, +100 per player is too much, maybe +75 or +50? GGWP, though, everyone did amazing in this game
I think that the concept of increasing pop is fine. You just need to find the right balance. I feel like +100 pop per player is a bit too much (at least that's what i am getting from watching this game). I don't know if you also considered reducing their pop instead of increasing yours? Maybe that would make mores sense
This was neat, but I think that +100 per additional player is too much and that +50/75would be better. Even at the end of this you were only at 380, and there was no way anyone could have matched you with that much room for army and eco. A huge part of the strategy of the game is the balance between eco and military pop space so having too much room means less meaningful choices for you. Like you said at the end with that much pop you can basically tech fully into everything and inevitably unless your civ is hard countered you will overwhelm them.
@@MrChiangching Well have you watched his previous videos ? Because some average players (around 1k, 1k1 elo) very much struggled to stop him from getting 200 pop and only swarmed him once he got pop capped.
“I’ve been playing recently for fun” meanwhile bro is #1 in the world right now fresh off a 9 win streak 😅
Рік тому
Although the pop cap change is insane cool, guys that were up against you would'a lost the game anyways due to the skill gap imo, lets see how it goes when ur against intermediate fellas again, that'd be cool to watch to see you actually forcing 500 pop cap to its limits
I wonder how, in the long run, having so many vils will affect the game's economics. Like, there isn't proportionally more gold / stone / wood, so eventually your 300 vils will run out of things to do besides farm, so the market prices will be all wonky, no? I guess that's just part of any long game though.
This was really cool to watch, I like this kind of creativity in aoe2! This pop adjustment makes It more balanced for your late game, and in fact if they were trading gold with each other and actually mass producing units (even if it's just trash mobs) they could've made it a lot more difficult on you to break out. They didn't do that which let you steamroll easy. Trying to imagine if this type of gameplay could also be done versus other pros or semi-pro players? 1v2 or something, but giving you 500 pop versus their 400 pop for example. Basically rewarding you with more army mass late game if they fail to rush/micro you down early game. I think this might be an interesting idea. Also, not being pedantic but using the "select all idle military units" hotkey, I think that'd save you some macro time with those kind of high military unit numbers. :P
So I think that if you're going to do 500 pop, you need to up the threshold on player elo. The problem with newer/lower elo players is that you will win almost every time if you get ahead in the early game, which you usually will. To use another game as a reference, it's like being against that 20/0 carry in league, except that now they get 12 items instead of being gated in scaling at 6. it's just insurmountable for lower level players. Fun game though, well played.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
This is a FANTASTIC way to improve the 1vX games. I've been looking forward to this video for weeks and it delivered.
Definitely agree! Makes the 1v4 a lot more interesting if the game is closer
Yeah!
Same!
When you’re still playing a game after 10 years it’s a timeless classic, like chess or hide and seek
I’ve been playing soccer for the last 20 years, I don’t understand why I’m not better than Rinaldo 😢
it isn't just a game... AOE2 is a way of life
Chess has been around for 200 years tho lol
@@nicojarrin3646 haha i think longer
@@narrowpath9491 yeah much longer haha
I love how your mind works. You went from being my favorite AOE2 player to also being my favorite youtuber because you care about the right things and execute so well.
Thanks dj. He’s done a lot of other stuff for the community too, such as aoe pulse to track civ and opening stats
Excited with this new format!!
Doing +50 pop per extra player, maybe +75 would be better imo, the games were somewhat close before, so this feels like it'd turn them to a steamroll. Having 350 pop in this game would have been enough
Let's remember these were beginners and getting to 200 is pretty difficult as is
this game was not about pop unfortunetly. Hera would be able to win even with 200 ı guess. Players were just couldnt have done anything.
50 pop per player but hera gets a neutral market in his corner
He at max got 373
kind of depends on how good the opponents are, right? For this game even 200 pop would have been enough for Hera to win probably.
The ramble about a kid not caring about a boar or where it is because they don’t even spend real time efficiently was hilarious 😂
Honestly, props to the beginners, i always thought that the only good strat playing against hera 1v4 is all in feudal and thats exactly what they went for. Even teal had a somewhat faster castle to follow but got completely obliterated. GG indeed.
Pssst... coordinated fast castle ->castle drop ->chase economy is the only win condition in these games
I think if they don't do tower rushes, they probably will do much better. Mass army and coordinate attack in waves.
I was keen to see this and it didn’t disappoint at all. Felt fair at all times. Pressure on multiple bases is something you need to do to win these games and obviously couldn’t before. Even with the extra 150 made such a difference to balance the late game. Keen to see more like this.
I feel with 500pop you need to go against higher elos, or make 50+pop per player, with +100 you are unstoppable
well technically he only had about +50 pop here
The UT healing is insane remember tatoh and daut did testing 40 vs 40 Units daut didnt lose a single unit because he had couple Warrior monks on no attack stance healing in the back 24/7
Absolutely awesome! Games are gonna be so much more entertaining and surprising from now on!
The population modification is an immensely fantastic change.
Makes me more excited to watch more of these, now that it's more balanced in the direction of increased intensity compared to before.
Like seeing adding 100 pop per opponent. Please make more of these. Very well done!!!
This patch is a fantastic edition to the game. I can't imagine Malay in this custom map, or Huns, or goths. That is such an exciting improvement.
Thanks DJ!
Keep in mind that when it's 1vs4, their upgrades are in some sense 4 times more expensive, while your upgrades apply to all your pop.
And also they start with 4x more vil and 4x more tcs..
Wha?... pardon. The techs have equal cost. Technology cost doesn't multiply with teamates. By your logic, Hera has cheaper technologies, which is completely false.
You literally found the only thing that's worse for 4 players 😂
tech have equel cost per player yeah. but each player of the team need to make the same upgrade so 4x time te res cost lol but of course they got 4x tc's and 4x the ressources around their bases. @@sutterhall8401
@@sutterhall8401 its not that its cheaper it just applys to more pop than the enemys. THat is the logic behind it. So technically its CHeaper because the value of the updates rises with population.
This was so much fun to watch! Maybe 500 is too much but it should be at least 400! And you had a good point at the end, the high pop is os perfect to show your skills which makes it even more interesting to watch!
Love it! Keep up the great work. Good luck at NAC!!!
That castle right in middle of all those towers was EPIC!
The flow of the game was enjoyable to watch, the four of them being all over Hera's base with towers, scouts, archers, skirmishers, desperately trying to finish him off before it's too late. And then Hera clicks Imp and it's the perfect "my turn" moment.
That said, the value Hera found with his initial archers/crossbows was huge and probably decided the game. If the four of them hadn't taken such big eco losses early they might have been able to continue the pressure for longer and stop the momentum shift. Really fun game.
Now that is super fun to watch! Brutality! Definitely do more of these!
Wow this was so much fun to watch, makes me want to retransition to aoe2. I'd consider +200 per extra opponent to be fair, although +100 seems to work just fine for you.
Also, congrats on the NAC5 win. GGs.
Epic! Yup, very fun to watch… can’t wait for the 1v4 against 1300-1600.
Awesome stuff. 100+ pop is a bit much. Maybe make 50.
Would love for a higher pop in Tournament play aswell, think it would make it even sicker to watch!
Also! This lighting is not doing your hair a favor xD you're looking gray at the age of 20+ xDDDDDDDDDDDDD
I am a guitarist, sometimes I watch master guitarists and I'm just in awe of what they can do
Watching Hera micromanage 2 or 3 different battles at the same time while also managing ego and thinking about long term strategy kinda has the same feeling
This is so insane, Hera needs to be nerfed with 1 vs 6 with this population possibilities. It gives me hope in humanity vs AI the way he plays this game. Please do more of this.
Great tweak for this series, honestly. Really well thought and executed. Warrior priests are decent, but they are much better when paired with composite bowmen. Also, for some weird reason, they don't heal when idle most of the times. I noticed I had to place them on stand ground or even passive so they would heal when standing idle. GG WP!
Super cool to see the boosted pop. really been waiting for this for a while. great content.
This was needed! Great game. I can’t wait to watch more intermediate players 3-4v1 you cause they’ll be able to multitask between eco and military more competently
Also the strat for the 1 player team (you) changes drastically of course too, going from having to force early aggression or else losing late game to now surviving to late game but really just macroing because there’s too much to control!! Love this!
I really like the idea of the additional pop space for you but I think 100 per player is too much. I guess 50 would be fair.
Because you're so much better than them, I'd say it would be more fair if you get a bonus 50 pop per additional played you go against. It feels like bonus 100 pop per player gives you too much of an advantage.
If you survive the early game, it's automatically over with the +100 pop per player.
Great game though!!
I love this idea
Should do this but also have like a 9vill start for you, would give you a more competitive advantage in early game incase they all feudal rushed you
Looking foward to 1 v 7's for the lols.
Iron Man? Looked like Dr Manhattan out there, giant, big stick swinging, Hera crushing his opponents.
I mean I think in a perfect scenario you'd only get the extra pop space every time an opponent reaches imperial age, because games like these where you just get to 350 pop before a single player gets to imp just feels like there isnt a lot of counterplay. Like the idea of adding it was because imp vs imp was unplayable for you, but now it feels like it might shift into a position where imp vs castle is unplayable for the opponents.
But ill say that I havent watched all of these 1vX player games, so you'll prob know it better than me :D
Either way its great content as always
Im hyped for the 1v2 experienced player 300 pop!
Makes me so happy to hear that this game is still fun for you even tho it’s a job now
+100 pop per opponent is quite strong, I would do +25 per opponent to give just a bit more flexibility to Hera without destroying late game too easily. Great game anyway.
Yeah I agree
I thought the same. I would do a 200, 250, 300 vs 2, 3 and 4, respectively. Doing so many units can overrun a side of the map because the opponents pop needs to be coordinated to defend that.
Yeah, still experimenting to get a fair/fun balance.
Yes! been waiting for this one!
LOVE it! These 500pops so fun to watch!
Very entertaining, great work
That eco! 🤯
Loved it, this feels a lot more fair.
Warrior priest still feels very high elo unit, still feels like a weird unit imo. A monk that fights but is weak to light cav, idk, seems like it shouldn't work on paper, but could definitely see it at high elo healing low HP then going back in.
ekstra pop is really the balancing tip for these games, continue doing that gg
Feels like the problem is more that you can make too big of armies. What if instead your villagers cost half pop in imperial? Or a quarter? That way you could have a big economy but not an overwhelming army.
How many churches you want?
Hera: Yes
Fun to watch, keep up the good work! GG
Why dont they make a tournament for Pro's where its 500 pop? It might help games that drag on because they both get pop capped, have way to many res, and literally cant get their units to die fast enough to keep up with how many production building they have.
Hey man, I really enjoyed this video, looking forward to more.
Gg insane hold while your entire army was gone raiding 11
That was awesome, love the 500 pop
This was fun to watch. Great 1v4.
can you play against some decent players like 1300-1500 with handicap on your side
50 pop per extra player seems more fair for the noobies
Your cam quality is looking good my dude
I am 17 minutes in and I am impressed by the pressure his opponents are putting out. Yes their economies got hit hard.. but they are hitting him too! He has to spend time on defending actively instead of freely pursuing massive ecnonomy an building up in peace. And if everyone them takes a little damage but also deals a little damage to HEras economy, Hera will suffer worse. This is the most exciting game I have seen so far!
Congrats on number #1 HERA!
Just started the watching the video and special respect to Hera for giving credit to guy who made the 500pop map
I think he would immediately be screwed if only 2 of them sent villagers forward at the start.
You have to go 500 pop Flimish Revelotion!
Very nice. Do you think it was smoother because you can continue creating vills after reaching ~120-150?
Gread vid, commenting for the algorithm xd
these are fun to watch
I was thinking 300 pop would be fair, 500 is just insane
Excuse me my lord, I hate to do this but, I need more of this!!!
Interesting stuff. I feel like champions should be better late game because they are way less dependable on gold and no scout counter.
Hera with 500 pop is going to be doing Faker level multi-tasking, will be amazing
This was great, if only they had coordinated with the rams and pushed forward further with the towers (or cut them for more forward production) I think they could have been much tougher.
When orange was raiding with light cav I was hoping for you to make castle age halbs. I suppose you just thought it wasn't necessary.
The 500 pop is great as it makes late game play viable for you.
okay, someone with money read this, pay the 150 to play hera and somehow pay viper 150 to use your steam account and play him 1v1...
i like this for 1vX, i do believe however you need to get less of a buff cuz this makes you way too strong against lower players late-game 11
i would advise to play around and adjust the number of pop depending on enemy numbers and mostly elo (100pop for 1k- players seems excessive, but for 1k+ could seem fair, maybe just 50 pop for lower elo players, whatever threshhold that could be... really like the change this can bring to the series, and i do hope there will be a similar michi game again, but this time, they don't rush things 11 GG
ps : have you played the gamemode whih starts post-imp before ? i'd really like to see you play that
I reckon this would be very difficult against 4 better players, as the 200+ pop advantage only comes into play in Imp/late Imp. 4 feudal/castle age aggressors would be tough to deal with.
Seems like you need to go Huns so you don’t get housed. 11
Also 50 pop per opponent seems like more fair, since you are unstoppable
Thoughts on handicap for this kind of games?
+100 Pop per extra player is probably too much. I would think +50 would work well ... remember, we like to see you struggle! 😉
this mule cart can be converted and used by other civs??
Dang, could watch this at half speed and still don't know what's going on! How the hell do you keep track of all that!
Maybe you could re visit some of the 1v4's? With pop cap to 500 would be nice to see how that would go this time.😎😎
Warrior priests are quite good (unless there's scouts) in Castle Age, but Ferreters Champs are better in Imp, though mixing in some halbs and WPs even then to boost the survivability of the army is a good strat in Imp, IMO
Also, +100 per player is too much, maybe +75 or +50?
GGWP, though, everyone did amazing in this game
im wondering should i buy this dlc, i didnt buy the rome one, i have everything else. should i wait to get discount to get this dlc or just skip hmm
I think that the concept of increasing pop is fine. You just need to find the right balance. I feel like +100 pop per player is a bit too much (at least that's what i am getting from watching this game). I don't know if you also considered reducing their pop instead of increasing yours? Maybe that would make mores sense
This was neat, but I think that +100 per additional player is too much and that +50/75would be better. Even at the end of this you were only at 380, and there was no way anyone could have matched you with that much room for army and eco.
A huge part of the strategy of the game is the balance between eco and military pop space so having too much room means less meaningful choices for you. Like you said at the end with that much pop you can basically tech fully into everything and inevitably unless your civ is hard countered you will overwhelm them.
Can't wait to see this against stronger opponents
Stronger opponents won't allow him to get anywhere close to 500 pop
Well that's my point @@MrChiangching. but since it was okayish easy for him here, there has to be a sweet spot of balance :)
@HermesGO3 Any 4x1 above noobs who uses teamwork will destroy him before hits >200.
@@MrChiangching Well have you watched his previous videos ? Because some average players (around 1k, 1k1 elo) very much struggled to stop him from getting 200 pop and only swarmed him once he got pop capped.
@@HermesGO3 That's because they didn't hit him early and play as a team.
“I’ve been playing recently for fun” meanwhile bro is #1 in the world right now fresh off a 9 win streak 😅
Although the pop cap change is insane cool, guys that were up against you would'a lost the game anyways due to the skill gap imo, lets see how it goes when ur against intermediate fellas again, that'd be cool to watch to see you actually forcing 500 pop cap to its limits
Why warrior priest at home instead of like 2-3 knights. Feel like that clears almost everything up.
Awesome, best video yet
I wonder how, in the long run, having so many vils will affect the game's economics. Like, there isn't proportionally more gold / stone / wood, so eventually your 300 vils will run out of things to do besides farm, so the market prices will be all wonky, no? I guess that's just part of any long game though.
Pop pop pop, makes a lot of snowballs that will make the enemies pop
I would agree that warrior priest is fine, but not great. I think 500 pop is a good idea though I certainly hope your wrist stays strong.
How do you have 80 vills on gold near the end? Surely there isn't that much gold on the map? I dont follow whats going on there
Imagine flemish revolution with 500 vills 🤣
great game and seriously good gameplay, nice one
Does anyone else appreciate the absolute "Baaahhh" fest the first 2 minutes of a game is. 🤣
This was really cool to watch, I like this kind of creativity in aoe2! This pop adjustment makes It more balanced for your late game, and in fact if they were trading gold with each other and actually mass producing units (even if it's just trash mobs) they could've made it a lot more difficult on you to break out. They didn't do that which let you steamroll easy.
Trying to imagine if this type of gameplay could also be done versus other pros or semi-pro players? 1v2 or something, but giving you 500 pop versus their 400 pop for example. Basically rewarding you with more army mass late game if they fail to rush/micro you down early game. I think this might be an interesting idea.
Also, not being pedantic but using the "select all idle military units" hotkey, I think that'd save you some macro time with those kind of high military unit numbers. :P
hera would get absolutely dumpstered in a 1v2 against other pros, lol. it would be the most boring video ever and last
@@gregdardis1747 Maybe if Hera starts with 2 tcs and double the starting vills it could be somewhat balanced.
So I think that if you're going to do 500 pop, you need to up the threshold on player elo. The problem with newer/lower elo players is that you will win almost every time if you get ahead in the early game, which you usually will. To use another game as a reference, it's like being against that 20/0 carry in league, except that now they get 12 items instead of being gated in scaling at 6. it's just insurmountable for lower level players. Fun game though, well played.
Hera can you drop the name of their workplace, I gotta give them my CV if the benefits are "Playing aoe vs Hera"
LOVE THIS.