Like with Easyjet and Ryanair, there will always be detractors and critics. Yet they always seem to fill the seats! I used Lumo from Edinburgh to LDN last month and was very impressed. Spot-on punctuality, clean pleasant interior, nicer seats than the same trains on LNER, charge points at every seat and limited stops. Easy to use booking system and the option of a refundable ticket without taking out a second mortgage. What's not to like? It's maybe a good example of what rail privatization should actually look like; competing companies operating on the same line, giving customers a real choice. (Didn't need to use the loo, so can't comment on that aspect).
Indeed. Lumo has found favour with the public and its load factor (maybe Edinburgh-Newcastle excepted) is high. It's the UK's equivalent of SNCF's Ouigo TGV.
I have done Lumo the once. I was delayed leaving Kings Cross but on time leaving Edinburgh. I wanted the toilet on the return journey but two were out of order. A great point you make about the toilets. I do wish grown adults would learn how to use a toilet in a respectful manner. My overall score with Lumo 5/10.
@@chriswilliamson590 toilets getting a makeover every hour would make all long distance services more acceptable. Mind you, no toilets at all in Elizabeth Line can require some planning - even for drivers as in a recent incident.
So in conclusion, most of the negative reviews are people who either didn't know about the luggage restrictions, or did know and chanced their luck - and perhaps when told what the restrictions were, thought staff were rude because they were told something they didn't want to hear. Lumo is incredibly popular, and while the luggage restrictions may force some people to travel with another operator, it seems to do a perfectly good job of being an ideal and affordable alternative to a slow coach, or paying more for LNER, or having to zig zag around on more regional train services with clever split ticketing tricks.
Yeah. I think maybe some people booked on Trainline. That would explain it anyway. If anybody booked on the Lumo website, the luggage thing is pretty much crystal clear.
Only taken one Lumo service, London to Edinburgh. Was about half the price of most other tickets I've gotten on that route, think it was about £50 which is a real bargain imo. Service was great, on time, zero complaints. Every other train I take to England from Edinburgh is delayed, or toilets are all out of order, so by British rail standards Lumo were exceptionally good
Thank you for not doing the ultra boring toilet tour like many creators seem to think is compulsory on trains and planes. Aye, if it's like the one in Trainspotting do it then but not for the bog standard 'all working' tour conclusion.
Well balanced report. My major problem with Lumo has been down to passengers with ridiculous amounts of luggage creating a scene and blocking the walkways. Always amazed at the coolness and civility of the staff. I do have an uneasy feeling that some of the staff are over-regimented with overly strict performance targets to counter tensions arising from the tougher rules and constraints surrounding a Lumo journey.
Lumo has asked the regulator to extend its Edinburgh service to Glasgow. It also wants to operate from the Greater Manchester area to London Euston. If the latter gains approval Lumo will need more rolling stock as its current fleet is fully utilised.
the lumo staff are also realy friendly to train spotters when i had a day out in newcastle there as lumo driver tests going on and the essesors wher kind to me and later on in the day a train came in 5 mins early so a driver had a chat with me before he departed
Never had a problem with Lumo and I endorse all your comments. We have always travelled NCL to KGX and back as my daughter is at Uni in NCL. On the other hand LNER seats can be excruciatingly uncomfortable and their prices are 2.5 times the cost of Lumos.
I cannot comment on the Lumo, but all the Great Western Hitachis suffer from bad ride quality. It is a combination of vibration, shaking, and rolling, plus heavy thumps at every set of points. This is exactly what would be expected of long vehicles with a lot of overhang from the bogies at each end, and unusually small wheels. These design parameters are a recipe for a rough riding train. Goodness knows what they are doing to the track. Like most other modern trains with airline style seating, I would assume that a lot of the "window" seats have no window next to them.
@robertp.wainman4094 They are as bad as they are due to civil service involvement. All the main parameters are the design are wrong. That said, there is nothing that could not be fixed by a visit to Sims Metals of Newport.
Not quite train related, but I checked your profile as your voice sounded Cumbrian and I was proved right. I used Avanti with work in September to go from Carlisle to Birmingham, again a company whose reputation has been poor, but is starting to get better. My main grripe was if work wasn't paying , the off peak return would have cost £116, which is a massive amount, but otherwise the trains were clean, punctual and staff pleasant.
Yep Glenn, I am Cumbrian. I can understand why people turn to Lumo on the East coast when other train companies are charging so much money for tickets. Thanks for watching, and also for the reply.
The Class 92 off the sleeper at the right probably the one which will take the Inverness/Fort William/Aberdeen forward to London that evening.I have only done the Lumo between Newcastle and Morpeth so can't really comment on the longer journey on them but the trains are only 5 carriages which generally means overcrowding but at least one isn't First Class like Cross Country and Trans Pennine effectively making it 4 carriages.
Just me; I travel Edinburgh To King's Cross quite often; twice on Lumo (as it was at a good time), mostly LNER Now, that is just me, with a backpack on, so it is pretty easy. Zero problems. Booking easy, train was there and left on time, into KGX on time. Staff fine. Toilet at the end a bit grotty but that is often the case with other carriers.
I would say the behaviour of some passengers from stupid to annoying is the worse thing about any form of public transport in Britain today not just the railways. All ages and all classes of people. You moan about delays? Try using the motorways or UK trunk roads! Toilets, Dr Beeching said one thing right on new carriage design in that it was to cater for the British public who were filthy. That was in 1964!
I have used Lumo a number of times and if the train is not too busy it has been a pleasant experience. During a very busy service it can feel very cramped annd and i like to be able to choose my seat and get a bit nauseous if i am sat with back to travel in an aisle seat. I prefer to travel with an operator that allows me to choose.
As a regular traveller between North East and London. I find Lumo alright… until things go wrong and that’s were the problems start. At least with LNER you just hop on the next train.
Great review ! My wife and I have travelled EDB - NCL a few times over the past couple of years an have always used LNER or TransPennine Express. We have never tried Lumo yet, as originally we used to travel with one large suitcase, but now we have two smaller cases, we may give them Lumo a chance. Regards from Whitlewy Bay
The problem with lumo is that because it's budget option and the gaps between the stations are large, it's full of people with luggage for a few days away and there's not enough space. I've not booked them since I had to sit Newcastle to London with my case at my feet Grand Central doesn't have the same issues as it has multiple stops in the North East. All modern trains seem to have disgusting toilets. Don't know if it's a design problem or if humans are just becoming worse
Recently got a Lumo from Edinburgh to Newcastle. Cheap, fast, comfortable and on time. I'm a seasoned and cynical train traveller, but was quite impressed. Trans Pennine, however... 💩
I suspect that aside from the luggage restrictions, the main cause of bad reviews will be disruption and the handling of that disruption. Unfortunately, major delay causing incidents on the East Coast Mainline route (rarely the fault of Lumo itself) are more frequent that they should be. I suspect that disrupted journeys are much more likely to make the passenger post a bad review (of any train operator), but as an "Open Access" operator, their cheaper tickets don't necessarily have the back up of being able to take the next train of another competing operator or travel via the West Coast Mainline instead during disruption, where these would be options for more flexible tickets. Finding onward taxis or coaches for up to 400 passengers when the line is blocked at Grantham or wherever is hard for any train operator and two or three members of train crew doesn't go very far when having to provide information and answer questions they don't necessarily have immediate or good answers to and that too can drive negative comments. Many passengers, like you will have had the journey they expected or at least hoped for and won't be motivated to review it.
I think this is a really thorough and well thought out reply. It's possible to buy a more flexible Lumo ticket. But it takes you into the price bracket of the other more established operators. I guess people buy a Lumo ticket and then hope for the best. I also think you made a great point regarding the motivation to post a poor review. Thanks for taking the time.
Try King's Cross to Newcastle as a better test of the route and service. Any service north of Newcastle is less crowded. I'm not sure many negative comments were from people going Edinburgh to Newcastle.
I guess what you'll find, Lumo will have thousands of 'satisfied' customers. People like them, once their journey is complete, that's their transaction done with Lumo. They provided what was advertised. I find with things as a "service" reviews will always have a negative slant. A good example of this is phone apps. A game for instance, if its a decent game will have a good seeding of reviews in the rating range, generally rating on positive. Service apps on the other hand, apps you have to download to make things work, banking apps, smart home apps and the like will have a negative review bias. The people who installed the app and are using the service no problem won't leave a review, they just accept they have to use the app, the people who can't get it to work, or doesn't work for them will review negatively.
Is Lumo that bad. I thought it was really good. Or is Lumo more busier with students travelling up to Newcastle and Edinburgh where they go to University. I personally haven't been on Lumo yet but I still am going to try it. I have been on LNER to York and Edinburgh Waverley and their services are wonderful.
The only trouble I had was that, as Lumo trains are electric only, the one I was on cloudn't take the diversion and we had to use bus replacements after the start of the track works.
If the toilet got that bad between EDI and NEW, what would it have been like by the time it got to KGX? As far as I know, these trains run non stop to KGX after Durham.
I did an up and down to London from Morpeth on Lumo a few weeks back, both trains were full, the London return was over 30 minutes late leaving Kings X, they did claim a broken-down train was causing issues on the tracks into Kings X but no other services were affected and they had engineering staff working on one end of my carriage when I boarded so not sure about the excuse. I found it uncomfortable sitting for over 3 hours in the seats, I was hemmed in the window side with only a part window each way by the aisle passengers who both rather encroached on me, the trolley service made two appearances each way, toilets were unpleasant to put it mildly, overall I can understand the appeal for those on a budget, I can plan in advance for travel so will stick to LNER 1st Class, the extra price is far outweighed by the comfort and on board services of food and drink for me and being able to book in advance means I can get relatively cheap tickets, the LUMO cost was £70 in total and I could have gone LNER 1st for £120 total when I looked at the options originally, somebody else actually dictated that we use LUMO this time.
It looks like pretty much any other train service these days, no better, no worse. Considering the price I don't know what people are complaining about. And as for the state of the toilets maybe people should point the finger at the disgusting slobs who leave them in that condition rather than the train operators as it's not only Lumo trains where this happens
These people who complain regarding luggage, it's down to Trainline not putting the restrictions in. But these people have a low IQ, and they will make problems for any form of transport.
This is the"Easy jet Ryanair" of rail travel which in my past experience attracts the idiots of travellers paying for third class travel and expecting "First" class experience !!!!!
My biggest complaint with Lumo is that they rush people onto trains, store luggage on seats and the interior of their trains is like blindingly bright. They are the Ryanair of trains without Ryanair prices.
I think that's a fair point Ben. The platform wasn't announced until about 10 minutes before departure. It meant that everyone turned up at the same time.
Hiya. That's good news. I'm trying them for the 1st time next week. 😂 I'm based on the west coast, so I don't have cause to use LNER. I usually use Avanti.
No need to deal with security if taking hand luggage etc or pay extra for suitcases, if you're going between Edinburgh and Newcastle like Pete did don't think you could fly reasonably anyway. The time you'd take getting to the airport then needing to a take a train/tram afterwards anyway it's a lot more convenient and likely cheaper. No WiFi (I know train WiFi sucks but better than nothing or you could use your 4G/5G) on it too which you can't on the majority of airlines, especially domestically.
Like with Easyjet and Ryanair, there will always be detractors and critics. Yet they always seem to fill the seats! I used Lumo from Edinburgh to LDN last month and was very impressed. Spot-on punctuality, clean pleasant interior, nicer seats than the same trains on LNER, charge points at every seat and limited stops. Easy to use booking system and the option of a refundable ticket without taking out a second mortgage. What's not to like? It's maybe a good example of what rail privatization should actually look like; competing companies operating on the same line, giving customers a real choice. (Didn't need to use the loo, so can't comment on that aspect).
Indeed. Lumo has found favour with the public and its load factor (maybe Edinburgh-Newcastle excepted) is high. It's the UK's equivalent of SNCF's Ouigo TGV.
My girlfriend used Lumo, LKX to NCL and said they were fine; no delays, unlike LNER who also had cancellations that day!
I have done Lumo the once. I was delayed leaving Kings Cross but on time leaving Edinburgh. I wanted the toilet on the return journey but two were out of order. A great point you make about the toilets. I do wish grown adults would learn how to use a toilet in a respectful manner. My overall score with Lumo 5/10.
Thanks Chris. Yeah, the toilets were pretty grim even after 1.5 hours.
yeah, I never understood this either. Many places I've been I've had to close my eyes and hold my breath to use the toilet.
@@chriswilliamson590 toilets getting a makeover every hour would make all long distance services more acceptable. Mind you, no toilets at all in Elizabeth Line can require some planning - even for drivers as in a recent incident.
It's fellow passengers who mess up the toilets not Lumo!
@ I agree. There are many grown adults who have not yet learnt how to use a toilet and apply basic hygiene standards.
So in conclusion, most of the negative reviews are people who either didn't know about the luggage restrictions, or did know and chanced their luck - and perhaps when told what the restrictions were, thought staff were rude because they were told something they didn't want to hear.
Lumo is incredibly popular, and while the luggage restrictions may force some people to travel with another operator, it seems to do a perfectly good job of being an ideal and affordable alternative to a slow coach, or paying more for LNER, or having to zig zag around on more regional train services with clever split ticketing tricks.
Yeah. I think maybe some people booked on Trainline. That would explain it anyway. If anybody booked on the Lumo website, the luggage thing is pretty much crystal clear.
Only taken one Lumo service, London to Edinburgh. Was about half the price of most other tickets I've gotten on that route, think it was about £50 which is a real bargain imo. Service was great, on time, zero complaints. Every other train I take to England from Edinburgh is delayed, or toilets are all out of order, so by British rail standards Lumo were exceptionally good
Thank you for not doing the ultra boring toilet tour like many creators seem to think is compulsory on trains and planes. Aye, if it's like the one in Trainspotting do it then but not for the bog standard 'all working' tour conclusion.
I honestly thought my camera lens might crack if I pointed it at the toilets 🤣
Well balanced report. My major problem with Lumo has been down to passengers with ridiculous amounts of luggage creating a scene and blocking the walkways. Always amazed at the coolness and civility of the staff. I do have an uneasy feeling that some of the staff are over-regimented with overly strict performance targets to counter tensions arising from the tougher rules and constraints surrounding a Lumo journey.
I have travelled with Lumo from Newcastle to London twice. Absolutely CANNOT fault them! I just wish they ran more services.
Hi Caitlin. I was really expecting the worst. But everything was great. Thanks for commenting.
Lumo has asked the regulator to extend its Edinburgh service to Glasgow. It also wants to operate from the Greater Manchester area to London Euston. If the latter gains approval Lumo will need more rolling stock as its current fleet is fully utilised.
the lumo staff are also realy friendly to train spotters when i had a day out in newcastle there as lumo driver tests going on and the essesors wher kind to me and later on in the day a train came in 5 mins early so a driver had a chat with me before he departed
Never had a problem with Lumo and I endorse all your comments. We have always travelled NCL to KGX and back as my daughter is at Uni in NCL. On the other hand LNER seats can be excruciatingly uncomfortable and their prices are 2.5 times the cost of Lumos.
I cannot comment on the Lumo, but all the Great Western Hitachis suffer from bad ride quality. It is a combination of vibration, shaking, and rolling, plus heavy thumps at every set of points.
This is exactly what would be expected of long vehicles with a lot of overhang from the bogies at each end, and unusually small wheels. These design parameters are a recipe for a rough riding train. Goodness knows what they are doing to the track.
Like most other modern trains with airline style seating, I would assume that a lot of the "window" seats have no window next to them.
These Hitachi units used by GWR, LNER, TPE and Lumo were specified by our DfT. However Lumo did fit better seating on its Hitachi units.
Absolutely - the Country that gave the world railways should be ashamed at assembling these imported kit trains.....basically they're 'crap'!
@robertp.wainman4094
They are as bad as they are due to civil service involvement. All the main parameters are the design are wrong. That said, there is nothing that could not be fixed by a visit to Sims Metals of Newport.
Alex. It's funny you should mention that. I was on a TPE from Carlisle today. The word "boneshaker" springs to mind.
Not quite train related, but I checked your profile as your voice sounded Cumbrian and I was proved right. I used Avanti with work in September to go from Carlisle to Birmingham, again a company whose reputation has been poor, but is starting to get better. My main grripe was if work wasn't paying , the off peak return would have cost £116, which is a massive amount, but otherwise the trains were clean, punctual and staff pleasant.
Yep Glenn, I am Cumbrian. I can understand why people turn to Lumo on the East coast when other train companies are charging so much money for tickets. Thanks for watching, and also for the reply.
@@peteonthemove The downside with Lumo is the trains are very basic, but they do save you a lot of money and journey times are similar to LNER.
The Class 92 off the sleeper at the right probably the one which will take the Inverness/Fort William/Aberdeen forward to London that evening.I have only done the Lumo between Newcastle and Morpeth so can't really comment on the longer journey on them but the trains are only 5 carriages which generally means overcrowding but at least one isn't First Class like Cross Country and Trans Pennine effectively making it 4 carriages.
Just me; I travel Edinburgh To King's Cross quite often; twice on Lumo (as it was at a good time), mostly LNER
Now, that is just me, with a backpack on, so it is pretty easy.
Zero problems. Booking easy, train was there and left on time, into KGX on time. Staff fine.
Toilet at the end a bit grotty but that is often the case with other carriers.
I would say the behaviour of some passengers from stupid to annoying is the worse thing about any form of public transport in Britain today not just the railways. All ages and all classes of people. You moan about delays? Try using the motorways or UK trunk roads! Toilets, Dr Beeching said one thing right on new carriage design in that it was to cater for the British public who were filthy. That was in 1964!
I have used Lumo a number of times and if the train is not too busy it has been a pleasant experience. During a very busy service it can feel very cramped annd and i like to be able to choose my seat and get a bit nauseous if i am sat with back to travel in an aisle seat. I prefer to travel with an operator that allows me to choose.
The phrase you were looking for is: "leave the toilets as you would wish to find them".
As a regular traveller between North East and London. I find Lumo alright… until things go wrong and that’s were the problems start. At least with LNER you just hop on the next train.
Great review !
My wife and I have travelled EDB - NCL a few times over the past couple of years an have always used LNER or TransPennine Express. We have never tried Lumo yet, as originally we used to travel with one large suitcase, but now we have two smaller cases, we may give them Lumo a chance.
Regards from Whitlewy Bay
Thanks Brian. Much appreciated
I have used Lumo on many many occasions from KHX TO NCL. Staff were fantastic tickets costs are great.
The problem with lumo is that because it's budget option and the gaps between the stations are large, it's full of people with luggage for a few days away and there's not enough space. I've not booked them since I had to sit Newcastle to London with my case at my feet
Grand Central doesn't have the same issues as it has multiple stops in the North East.
All modern trains seem to have disgusting toilets. Don't know if it's a design problem or if humans are just becoming worse
Recently got a Lumo from Edinburgh to Newcastle. Cheap, fast, comfortable and on time. I'm a seasoned and cynical train traveller, but was quite impressed. Trans Pennine, however... 💩
Thanks Chris. Funny you should say that actually. I'm doing a TransPennine review this week. Wish me luck !
I suspect that aside from the luggage restrictions, the main cause of bad reviews will be disruption and the handling of that disruption. Unfortunately, major delay causing incidents on the East Coast Mainline route (rarely the fault of Lumo itself) are more frequent that they should be. I suspect that disrupted journeys are much more likely to make the passenger post a bad review (of any train operator), but as an "Open Access" operator, their cheaper tickets don't necessarily have the back up of being able to take the next train of another competing operator or travel via the West Coast Mainline instead during disruption, where these would be options for more flexible tickets.
Finding onward taxis or coaches for up to 400 passengers when the line is blocked at Grantham or wherever is hard for any train operator and two or three members of train crew doesn't go very far when having to provide information and answer questions they don't necessarily have immediate or good answers to and that too can drive negative comments. Many passengers, like you will have had the journey they expected or at least hoped for and won't be motivated to review it.
I think this is a really thorough and well thought out reply. It's possible to buy a more flexible Lumo ticket. But it takes you into the price bracket of the other more established operators. I guess people buy a Lumo ticket and then hope for the best. I also think you made a great point regarding the motivation to post a poor review. Thanks for taking the time.
I've them loads of times never had a problem, always had great service
Try King's Cross to Newcastle as a better test of the route and service. Any service north of Newcastle is less crowded. I'm not sure many negative comments were from people going Edinburgh to Newcastle.
Not strictly true. The train I was on was pretty much full (according to train staff) at the start point in Edinburgh.
I guess what you'll find, Lumo will have thousands of 'satisfied' customers. People like them, once their journey is complete, that's their transaction done with Lumo. They provided what was advertised. I find with things as a "service" reviews will always have a negative slant.
A good example of this is phone apps. A game for instance, if its a decent game will have a good seeding of reviews in the rating range, generally rating on positive. Service apps on the other hand, apps you have to download to make things work, banking apps, smart home apps and the like will have a negative review bias. The people who installed the app and are using the service no problem won't leave a review, they just accept they have to use the app, the people who can't get it to work, or doesn't work for them will review negatively.
I felt I should take the time to post a positive review. But yep, it's much more likely for someone to post a poor one if they had a bad experience.
Is Lumo that bad. I thought it was really good. Or is Lumo more busier with students travelling up to Newcastle and Edinburgh where they go to University. I personally haven't been on Lumo yet but I still am going to try it. I have been on LNER to York and Edinburgh Waverley and their services are wonderful.
The only trouble I had was that, as Lumo trains are electric only, the one I was on cloudn't take the diversion and we had to use bus replacements after the start of the track works.
If the toilet got that bad between EDI and NEW, what would it have been like by the time it got to KGX? As far as I know, these trains run non stop to KGX after Durham.
Hi. I think it's one more stop at Stevenage before KGX. I dread to think what they were like by then
As I don't live in Newcastle or London, I'll never know. At York you just see it sail by.
Very good review.
Thank you
I did an up and down to London from Morpeth on Lumo a few weeks back, both trains were full, the London return was over 30 minutes late leaving Kings X, they did claim a broken-down train was causing issues on the tracks into Kings X but no other services were affected and they had engineering staff working on one end of my carriage when I boarded so not sure about the excuse. I found it uncomfortable sitting for over 3 hours in the seats, I was hemmed in the window side with only a part window each way by the aisle passengers who both rather encroached on me, the trolley service made two appearances each way, toilets were unpleasant to put it mildly, overall I can understand the appeal for those on a budget, I can plan in advance for travel so will stick to LNER 1st Class, the extra price is far outweighed by the comfort and on board services of food and drink for me and being able to book in advance means I can get relatively cheap tickets, the LUMO cost was £70 in total and I could have gone LNER 1st for £120 total when I looked at the options originally, somebody else actually dictated that we use LUMO this time.
Hi. Thanks for the detailed comments. I'm doing an LNER 1st class trip next week to see what it's like.
It looks like pretty much any other train service these days, no better, no worse. Considering the price I don't know what people are complaining about. And as for the state of the toilets maybe people should point the finger at the disgusting slobs who leave them in that condition rather than the train operators as it's not only Lumo trains where this happens
Lumo are really good. Cannot fault them.
These people who complain regarding luggage, it's down to Trainline not putting the restrictions in. But these people have a low IQ, and they will make problems for any form of transport.
I guess they just buy the tickets on trainline, and not bother to look on the Lumo website.
This is the"Easy jet Ryanair" of rail travel which in my past experience attracts the idiots of travellers paying for third class travel and expecting "First" class experience !!!!!
My biggest complaint with Lumo is that they rush people onto trains, store luggage on seats and the interior of their trains is like blindingly bright. They are the Ryanair of trains without Ryanair prices.
I think that's a fair point Ben. The platform wasn't announced until about 10 minutes before departure. It meant that everyone turned up at the same time.
The blindingly bright interiors has always been an issue with the Hitachi 800 series ICTs, Just 2 many LED lights
Yes Lumo gained permission to compete with the incumbent because it operates like a budget airline. Lumo is a different product to LNER.
Why not use LNER then
Lumo ain't as bad as LNER they ARE TOTAL RIP OFF BAD SERVICE
Hiya. That's good news. I'm trying them for the 1st time next week. 😂 I'm based on the west coast, so I don't have cause to use LNER. I usually use Avanti.
It’s owned by FirstGroup. Of course they are gonna be shite
So is your spelling Go back to school and grow up.
travel lner for a better serivce
To be fair, they almost get as many 1 star reviews as Lumo.
Also better frequency...LNER runs every 30 mins London-Edinburgh on weekdays.
Just fly- what is the point in this torture?
No need to deal with security if taking hand luggage etc or pay extra for suitcases, if you're going between Edinburgh and Newcastle like Pete did don't think you could fly reasonably anyway. The time you'd take getting to the airport then needing to a take a train/tram afterwards anyway it's a lot more convenient and likely cheaper. No WiFi (I know train WiFi sucks but better than nothing or you could use your 4G/5G) on it too which you can't on the majority of airlines, especially domestically.
Fly? What, from Edinburgh to Newcastle? 😂😂😂
What part of it are you saying is torture?
@@CLWF3 proximity to the masses.....
@@hellfiregrowler hahaha if possible!!!!
YOU FORGET HALF THE COMMENTS ARE FAKE !! or for attention seeking