Wow - Jay, I remember many years ago you made an appeal for Muslims to confront this dilemma and evidence of the variants in the Quran. Looks like you have finally got through. Well done.
The Quran has and will always be the same. It was memorized since the time of Prophet Muhammad. Jay should thank Muslim scholars who memorized the Quran and were able to spot the few errors made in written Qurans. Transcribing a text is a patient task. Mistakes are common. But thanks to the original memorization throughout the ages the Quran has not changed. Jay is just envious that Christians did not memorize their gospels. They don't even have background knowledge about the authors of the four gospels who never met Jesus. The gospels, especially John, are the sad stories of a lie created by Paul the Son of the Devil.
@@rayali2861 Do you have a tape recorder from the 1100 AD with the Quran recitation at that time? If you do not have, then you can not prove the recitation have not changed.
@PfanderFilm glad to hear that Shabir Ally finaly admitted there are multiple arabic qurans in the world. Can not wait Shabir Ally’s second video about this.
@@jcxkzhgco3050 The Quran literally means The Recitation. It is meant to be spoken aloud. That is why there are different recitations for different dialects. Arabic is not your typical language. Writing is heavily influenced by the spoken language since it's VERY precise with it's pronunciations.
@@octavio8779if that is true... Then why are your Muslim apologists constantly proclaiming (very loudly) that the Koran is perfectly preserved? That not a stroke, not a dot has been changed from the original in heaven? That's the point of this video. Don't try to move the goalposts. What's the point of having an eternal book in heaven if the Koran is meant to be recited, then?
@@thetabletopskirmisherThere is Hadith on this, where the Prophet was asked about the Quran being recited with incorrect pronunciation because of the 7 different dialects and the Prophet responded that all the dialects are valid. Changing “you all”into ya’ll, or “hello” into howdy, it doesn’t effect the spiritual message of the Quran. This only happens because the Quran was passed down orally way before it was compiled as a book. The book itself was standardized in Quraysh dialect out of respect for the Prophet’s own spoken dialect. It can be said that the Quran exists in heaven as all 7 dialects, or it can be thought of as a living document that exists in continuous harmony with the speech of God. This is all theological discourse that has no bearing on our status as believers because there is no definitive answer or consensus on whether these beliefs are meant to interpreted literally or in a figurative way.
Sigh different diaclets not qurans just search it up and stop being so damn ignorant
4 роки тому
Puruan Langit The translation into different languages that you can understand that has been changed drastically. Take an example for a country like indonesia. In 2016, the islamic scholars of Lajnah Pentashihan Mushaf Al-Quran (LPMQ) 186 words of translation has been changed officially into standard Malay language of indonesia for easy understanding in order to fit into modernization of the citizen in that country. In other words it’s an act of imprudently to make fooled in order to control over the people.
The major mistakes with this video: 1.The idea that different arabic languages could somehow ''replace'' original arabic language wich prophet Muhammed came with. 2.The idea that ''closest translation'' should not exist because all languages are ''equally rich'' Answer: 1.Arabic language of by wich prophet Muhammed came with MUST COEXIST within arabic that is not the arabic langauge of prophet Muhammed, OTHERWISE THE QUR'AN WOULD BE LOST. AND as hard as it sounds i would agree on that video if that was the case. 2. Not every language is rich so trying to explain things is much more difficult to countries that lacks some of the words that desribe things that doesn't exist in their language.
catholicism is wrong,bible say to STAND FIRM and HOLD tradition,not distorted it just like what catholic church did,no catholic can debunk sola scriptura,Go away from idolatry Catholics
No he won't , because he already knows the problem with Islam, that's why he comes up with a way to sanitize it, it's source of his income, so he won't
I enjoyed this video, because it was very specifically examining the texts. Some videos sound like Jay is making generalizations and blowing hot air. This video is excellent, because he gets down to the nitty gritty of the text and explains the differences in detail.
So when I was a Muslim and I came across the Other Variations of the Qur’an (about 1.5 years into the religion), I refused to listen to those whom I would call “Anti-Muslims”. I thought this was the best approach so that I remain unbiased in my Assessment of the Veracity of Islam and the claim of Scriptural Authenticity. When I came to the Learned Muslims for Answers, I would get responses anywhere from “your faith is in jeopardy, pray to Allah for Guidance and Understanding” to things like “shut up and believe the main narrative like a Good Muslim”. After more of their hypocrisy, sneaking around, and refusal to answer or address questions piled up, I decided to return to Christ. Recently, because I began to doubt whether I am being manipulated by the devil or if Christ, indeed, is now calling me back to His Flock, I prayed to Jesus for Definite, Undeniable Proof that I was right to return to Him and Abandon Islam. I also asked that He gave me the Wisdom, the Intellect and the Understanding required to see the Sign and acknowledge The Truth. Then, I found a video about the Anniversary of Yasir Qadi’s interview where he got stuck with the Authenticity Narrative. That led me to this video. The Proof and the Sign, from Jesus Christ. Ave Christus Rex! Christos Pantokrator!
This is exactly the reason that many people born into the muslim faith are now leaving it; because they cannot get meaningful answers from their clerics about fundamental questions. They realise their clerics have lied to them. The entire religion is lies based on lies. And what is worse, the lies are used to hide what the texts say, and the texts are full of appalling commands of hate and violence.
Lol opposite is happening too and this guy has already been debunked our entire religion based on hate? Kid go read your own bible first @@toddbeamer6131
I find this hard to believe as any competent Sheikh or student of knowledge would tell you about the Qir'at of the Quran. Many people memorize many Qir'at
I believe after much research that the real quran has no punctuation marks just like the hebrew torah and hebrew bible it is one of the great miracles of the text that it has layers upon layers upon layers of meaning that reveal new things if anyone of you christians and i challenge all of you if you can show me that the skeleton text has been changed i will leave islam so who is willing to accept the challenge????come on lets see what you got
The Four Gospels are a lie. They refused to choose the Gospels of those who walked with Christ. Why did they ignore the Gospel of James who was Jesus brother? James knew more about his brother than four unknown men who never met Jesus. Read the Aramaic gospels. Jesus spoke Aramaic not Greek. Mark Matthew Luke and John are fakes. Jay Smith is a faker & liar according to the Gospel of James.
@Jasmin Brown Take a look at the history of Gods down the ages and it becomes a logical inference. The mountain Gods, the river Gods, the sun God, the totemic Gods and so on of our ancestors led to polytheistic cultures with Gods personified/anthropomorphised, such as the Greeks. Look, too, at the attributes of the ancient Gods, particularly the idea of dying and rising and even of exceptional conception/birth. From there, it was but a short step to monotheism (or the not-really monotheism of Christianity). The Gods compete with each other in our more modern times, (which almost takes us back to ancient Greece and Rome) in a sort of playground one-upmanship: "My God's the REAL God, yours is fake." "No, MY God's the REAL one; YOURS is the FAKE one." The only thing which could suggest that any of these God-existence claims is real, would be good, credible evidence for the existence of a God and I have never encountered any.
@Jasmin Brown It is kind of you to take so much trouble to write all this down, but it does not impress. On the contrary, "the lady doth protest too much, methinks". Basically, you do what just about every theist I ever encounter tries to do: You try to deny X, Y and Z rather than give good, credible evidence for YOUR claims. In other words, you deflect from what is uncomfortable and you focus on anything but what is asked of you. I look on from the outside - as an atheist - and I must admit I just laugh. The Jews - Jesus' own people - will tell you in great detail why the New Testament is a Paul-inspired, Roman-supported forgery. You assert that Islam is a "forgery", though Islamic scholars will provide you with "evidence" to the contrary. The Roman Catholics will tell Protestants that they are not the "true faith" and Protestants will pour vitriol on RCs. The church in YOUR town will tell you why the church in the next town is wrong ... Meanwhile, the Hindus don't give a damn about any of you and nor do the Buddhists. And you will ALL cite exactly the same "arguments" or "evidence" to demonstrate your particular claims. So, before you try to convince me of anything, first go and convince all your fellow Christians, the Jews, the Muslims, the Hindus etc that YOU are correct. After all, you have a head start with them because they are already prepared to believe in supernatural, super-powered men in the sky. Then, when you can all agree, come and present your evidence to those of us who don't buy any of it.
@Jasmin Brown So Islam is a mess, Hinduism is "a disaster" ... It sounds as if basically, you are right and everybody else must be wrong! But, in fact, had you been brought up in a Muslim or Hindu country and culture, you would likely be pointing out the errors of Christianity. Even in Christianity, I bet I can predict - in caricatured paraphrase - your answers: Roman Catholicism? Rubbish. Jehovah's Witnesses? Rubbish. Mormonism? Rubbish. And so on, excluding everything that is not your chosen flavour of God belief. I hope this is not a straw man, but the evidence so far would support what I say. In terms of "claims" about God, I make none. I only respond to those claims. So God is not "ruled out by default" any more than the existence of leprechauns or alien abductions are ruled out by default. It is simply that if somebody wants to persuade me that these things are real, they need to provide significant good, credible evidence. "... you detest the supernatural." - I don't think I said any such thing. I would need evidence of its existence before deciding on my attitude to it. I do not need to go into detail. My point was a very general - and I think uncontroversial - one, which is that Gods appear to have been part of the life of hominids almost as long as hominids themselves have existed. Yahweh and Allah are just recent manifestations of this phenomenon. You are not "so unsatisfactory for" me. It is simply that I do not understand what theists have to gain from BEGINNING the discussion with non-believers. And that is what I see so often, especially, but not exclusively, on UA-cam. Instead of recognising that they have mutually contradictory and exclusive God-existence claims and asking themselves questions about THAT, a great many theists think that arguing with atheists - and denying science, promoting their particular book as "the truth", asserting their personal experiences as "evidence" and so on - is a pathway to confirming their own beliefs. This is nonsense. Atheists are a tiny minority of those who do not believe what you believe. You might even say, unkindly, but correctly, that we are currently almost irrelevant. Which is why I say your first task is to persuade all God-believers to accept YOUR claims. If your claims are SO strong, SO well-evidenced, this should be a piece of cake. In the meantime, I look on with bemusement and await agreement. When that is achieved, it would be the time to come and present your collectively agreed evidence to atheists. Is that so unreasonable?
@Jasmin Brown You have just done EXACTLY what I predicted you would do! You have found reasons to dismiss everything that isn't YOUR chosen flavour of belief whilst telling yourself that YOUR beliefs are exceptional because ... reasons. Go tell it to the Jews/Muslims/Hindus etc! Go and have it out with them. They will write very lengthy messages like yours explaining why YOU are wrong and THEY are right. I am not interested until you can all agree on ONE story, with ONE clearly agreed line of evidence. And I don't think I asserted you were brought up as a Christian. Please read my messages again carefully. I take a lot of trouble over them.
First I have made it in life today🤣 Dr. Shabir Ally now understand that they're no longer in their safe bubbles in this age of information so it is better for him to say the truth before people discover it by themselves which will make many leave Islam.
“””Whatever is done in darkness will be brought out in to the light.”””How I love this century .And all its nosiness. I realised Mormons are doing the same thing recently. The pressure is overwhelming.🤗🤗
People need to realise that the 1924 Quran was introduced to make a teacher's life easier. The teachers didn't want the hassle of marking papers and books where students were quoting variant Quranic verses from their own Qurans. There is no theological reason the Cairo edition was chosen above the other 36 Qurans.
First uthman collected recitations of Mohammed(allegedly) from scraps ,,burned most and made his own version,,then along came al hajjaj ,,he also did the same as uthman...then the korans were collected and sunk in the Nile river ,,,the Cairo version is the result in 1924 ... hafs was regarded as a liar by Muslim scholars....🤔
Where do you people get your stories from. From Satan indeed. It’s exhausting the Quran is one! Try all you want you can’t come up with one verse like it! One god not three
@watluktwel which one there are 66 versions! when Jesus (PBU) returns he's going to ask all of you "show me where did I claim to be god" and your three gods will be so tongue tied. You guys are misled, read and educate yourselves, Islam simply means submitting your will to the one god, its liberating, your hate isn't going to get you anywhere, time is running out. listen to Quran recitation and see how your soul responds to it. Jesus prayed just like the Muslims did he is a Muslim (submitted his will to his creator). why do you think the media is bashing the religion so much ask yourselves. god sent 124000 prophets and messengers all said to worship one. 300 year after Jesus passed away they made up the trinity. So you READ; the Quran.
Here's an explanation on the issue of different Qiraat: m.ua-cam.com/video/LDSBOMK2M2g/v-deo.html For those looking for a book to read on the compilation of the Quran you can read 'The History of the Quranic Text from revelation to copilation' by Al-Azami. For those who just want to fuel their ignorance you can continue to listen to jay smith the Ultracrepidarian and his horse poop arguments.
Wow this has been the clearest video about this issue that I've watched so far. Jay's videos on this matter are great but unfortunately, they seem to fly over my head cause they are a more scholarly approach most of the time and the continuations of his videos are hard to find for me so I almost always ended up feeling like I couldn't even get a basic grasp of the problems in textual criticism of the Quran. But I'm glad for this video you made. I feel like I could finally fill those wholes and your argument finally came to live to me. May the Lord continue guiding you to help bring more Muslims into salvation through Christ.
As i muslim this makes me laugh all his claims are debunked the quran was not written down it came via speach and was remmebered by hearth an the beutiful recitation , when you change the words its wil not aline , like what this guy is saying come on open youre ayes how can you not know the difference between being good to parents and beuty to parents its obviously the good one if you change the recitation it would not be good and this is how we know not via text because a lot of the sahaba.s where also childeren and verry much people where iliterite sow they could not read or write but they could recite what they have heard from the prophet and it would touch there hearth and the quran is easy to remmember as god promised us , its funny how bad you guys want to destroy islam but it cannot and the truth wil reveal itself
His admission MASSIVE, and on its face commendably honest, but actually deceptively dishonest; seceding the existence of variants is small, but it does take away a problem in the perception of us plebs that don't necessarily get into the weeds. What matters would be the admission that there were actually substantive variations .
I believe after much research that the real quran has no punctuation marks just like the hebrew torah and hebrew bible it is one of the great miracles of the text that it has layers upon layers upon layers of meaning that reveal new things if anyone of you christians and i challenge all of you if you can show me that the skeleton text has been changed i will leave islam so who is willing to accept the challenge????come on lets see what you got
Here's an explanation on the issue of different Qiraat: m.ua-cam.com/video/LDSBOMK2M2g/v-deo.html For those looking for a book to read on the compilation of the Quran you can read 'The History of the Quranic Text from revelation to copilation' by Al-Azami. For those who just want to fuel their ignorance you can continue to listen to jay smith the Ultracrepidarian and his horse poop arguments.
@@maxter1334 that's the problem though, all but 6 different readings of the original quran is gibberish, complete and utter gibberish. Even in the hafs quran today, ~20% is gibberish with such unclear meaning that imams freely translate it however they wish
@@angrydragonslayer yea its just weird i feel theres an ancient science something behind all of this that all these fake religions were built on including islam
chukwu chukwu He is INDIAN 🇮🇳born ..thats why 25 years of his mission spent studying ISLAM and still looking for faults and flaws and and cant find conclusion at the age of 67 years.
Prophets "being killed" does make a difference to the very common Muslim position that God's prophets could/should not suffer , hence the gospel claim of Messiah dying an agonising death for our sins must show that the Injil has been changed.
You absolutely right it has been changed and we don't denied that. The Qurans we have today, which one is with your Allah? Be careful choosing the right one which is the word to word and carbon-copy with the one with Allah. Be careful not blasphemy and you know what Allah will do to you in the grave and the judgement day. Have you ever imagine if Allah had mistakenly gave his Quran to Muhammad and he decide to come for it now which one will you advise him to take?
In Islam, Qira'at, which means literally the readings, terminologically means the method of recitation. Traditionally, there are 10 recognized schools of qira'at, and each one derives its name from a famous reader of Quran recitation. Recitation should be done according to rules of pronunciation, intonation, and caesuras established by the prophet Muhammad, the most popular reading is that of Hafs on the authority of `Asim. Similarly, each melodic passage centers on a single tone level, but the melodic contour and melodic passages are largely shaped by the reading rules, creating passages of different lengths whose temporal expansion is defined through caesuras. Skilled readers may read professionally for mosques in cities. The first condition was that the recitation has an authentic chain of narration in which the chain of narrators was continuous; As for the narrations which did not even have an authentic chain of narration, they were classified as Baatil (false) and rejected totally. The second condition was that the variations in recitations match known Arabic grammatical constructions. Unusual constructions could be verified by their existence in passages of pre-Islamic prose or poetry. The third condition required the recitation to coincide with the script of the Quran . below one verse read in 7 recitations: ua-cam.com/video/OCzA6xR42zg/v-deo.html
Yeah the problem is that none of your modern day qira at match with your oldest 6 manuscripts in the slightest. You dont have any manuscrits from the time of "uthman" and therefore cant claim the quran was perfectly preserved when there is a ga of 50 years between uthmans standardization and the first manuscript, that contradicts todays quran and is doesnt even contain half of the quran you have today. You gotta understand that muslims have made the claim that not a single word or letter has been changed since uthman. Now every scholar knows thats not the case and the lies the muslim community was fed were easily swallowed and forgotten so now the argument went from "not a single letter is different" to, well yeah we have different recitations and they literally are changes in the words and letters as you can see in the video but they kinda mean the same thing (which they dont if you watched the video)" AND you have over 90.000 of those differences in all your qira at. How can you still be a muslim knowing that the main argument for the divinity of the quran has been a lie from the start? Now the quran has different words and recitations that dont mean the same thing? Which of those recitations is eternal then? Which one is in the um al Kitab?
So the Quran says that polytheists are innocent?! They worship idols! This the biggest offense in Islam! And why does Allah cast innocent people into hell?! This is a huge problem that Muslims need to be made aware of! Definitely shows that the Quran has been altered and it definitely changes the meaning.
You are only taking the meaning that suits your criticism. Cant you tell this youtuber among others are struggling to prove islam wrong. And this is all they could bring in their defence. But as the saying goes, truth will out. And its evident islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. Ask yourself why that is so despite all the criticism. Don't let youtubers define what the truth is for you as everyone would like to defend their religion above others. And this is both true among both muslims and Christians. None will speak ill of their religion. The most logical thing to do is to find out yourself. I assume you already know the bible if you are Christian. Find the Quran and read for yourself with intention of find the truth and not to criticize. And now decide for yourself the truth. These preachers are blinded from the truth because they only read to criticize. Will leave you in peace
yes.... first of all, the Quran has not been changed in anyway...during the prophet’s time , the alphabet were written without the shaddah. So the caliphs and other Islamic scholars made it easy by putting the shaddah and phatoha on the alphabets to make it easy to read. There are still evidence of the old Arabic text of the Quran still existing.
The second knowledge I can share with you is that, in ancient Arabic times, memorization was very important in religion and the Arabic culture. For most and all the part, the Quran is very very accurate, even without written text and all, there were a lot of people who memorized the Quran. Even with your arguments, I don’t know if you have pure knowledge of Arabic culture but different words can have the same meaning and the same word can have different meanings. If the main argument is about the way the text is written, then you definitely have gotten it wrong because people did that.
@@yakubukarima8554 the Birmingham manuscript is only 4 pages and what it dies have does not match up with newer ones. The Sa'ana and Topkapi vary from it and each other. All show thousands of alterations. Not just dots, but whole words, verses and the chapter sizes vary.
@Markus Tanbeck We will be getting to the Qur'an soon enough. I didn't want to say anything at this point, but then Shabir went and put up his video on the 19th, so I had to respond, and so it goes. Al Fadi won't publish anything until he has finished his PhD, and that will be a few years yet.
The Quran has been preserved in the minds of Muslims since the time of the prophet. THE MIRACLE OF MEMORIZATION is a LIVING Miracle. Who has memorized just ONE of the over 100 gospels that were in existence 2000 years ago?
@@rayali2861 If it has been preserved in the minds of Muslims since the time of the prophet, where are the verses about adult breast feeding that were eaten by a domestic animal? You are a liar like your false Prophet.
@@programminglanguagestutori9118 What!? Verses about adult breast feeding?! lol! you guys are funny! The oldest manuscript which is in Birmingham University, does it have any verses adult breast feeding!? lol!
I'm happy to see Dr. Jay Smith's relentless pursuit of truth which has forced these muslim scholars to finally accept their false claims about Quran. Now we need to make sure this news reaches all 1.7 billion Muslims around the world.
Captain planet Jay is trying very hard ..for the last 25 years studying ISLAM whilst ISLAM dominated major websites for the past 25 years.He is trying Islamic formula. 1.8 billion muslims worldwide....will listen to this 0??? That will be a present day MESSIAH trying to proof his false claims.
We (Muslims) still don't believe that Prophet Jesus (p.b.u.h) son of Mary'am (May Allah be please with her) is God or son of god. Holy Qur'an is the words of Allah (The Creator) & is the final revelation from Allah (GOD). That's still in effect.
@@pfanderfilms hey Jay, do you have access to enough information that show along a timeline how did the Hafs reading become dominant, and how other readings came to be much less used?
Actually I have to agree with Shabir ally. If those are the significant differences, they shouldn't seriously effect the believe nor the practice of muslims. However thank you for the video. I love them and I hope to see some more. :)
Since Arabic is a created language, what is the language of the eternal tablets? It cannot be anything like Arabic since nothing created can be like Allahs attributes. At best, the Quran which muslims possess is a translation. But can aanyyhing created be like the uncreated seech of Aallah? If yes, you just violated tawhid al asm'aa was sifaat. If no, your qur'an is a corruption.
Ummer Farooq - God doesn’t have a prime language. Language is for creatures to communicate. Language is basically just a sound. If a Chinese person sat next to you and spoke Mandarin, if you don’t know Mandarin, all you will hear are just sounds. If you need to understand a sound, attach meaning to the sounds and then what you have is called language.
Shabir martials the same defence that I do when we defend the Bible at speakers corner... lol so er…. the divine text now needs the same defence as my 'corrupt bible'....
I'm love to join you, Mr Jay..... History indeed telling the truth in order to understand the actual roof if founder Islam or Christianity.... And to compare it.
The defense that it doesn't change doctrine or practice is a defense available to us but not available to them. We have never claimed the eternity of the Bible or its perfect preservation.
You got to Shabir, schooling him on his own religion! Sadly, his pride has not given you the credit for the guidance you offered in last debate. Glory to God!
1. When they can’t even re-write it correctly how before Osman caliph they memorize it😳😳 2. I don’t know about Arabs but many muslim just read the Quran without undrestanding it, Even if there is one Quran still is a horrible book
Hypota68 Hypota ....i give you 68 chances...get hold of a FREE copy of this book as you described and read it. Its the only book thats MEMORIZED by millions of CHOSEN MUSLIMS WORLDWIDE.Its a living MIRACLE. NO other faiths has these miraculous powers.
@@riteshkumarsingh6473 Thats genuine rks ..no doubt...1.bILLION followers of that belief..unlike other beliefs taking cow as their worship.Even the dung they will eat it.
@Grilled BBQ I dont understand what you explaining really...Get hold of a BIBLE..a TORAH or even a GHAGVAD GITA..and tell 10 persons each who can by heart..to tryand memorize these books from starting chapter and verse till end chapter and read it out by heart exactly as per chapters .......it will be impossible impossible my bru...i haven't seen this MIRACLE...but KORAN...it's a LIVING MIRACLE and reciters can read all together...it will be same recitation by memory...i challenge you if any of the above faiths can do this miraculous recitation...go and check with if you follow a particular belief..follow up with them and let me know.
My conclusion is that the Hafs transmission is the authentic one to adopt, being the one that makes sense and consistency of all its parts. 1354 differences between the Hafs and the Warsh. It's not like any of the differences vary about things such as the significance of Ramadan, the inheritance rights of women, the need for modest dress, or the conditions for continuing war or accepting treaty of peace, or the degree of respect for Christian (innocent) creatures.
I hopeim wrong but I believe regardless if they knew there religion was completely false they still wouldn't denounce it due to getting funded as well as pride, again I pray I'm wrong, come to the Savior brothers 🙏🙏
As someone with Arabic as his first language, I can confidently tell you that in Arabic, more so than probably any other alphabetical language, the way you read the same written word can make all the difference in meaning. And it's not just the different grammatical states of the verb or whether it becomes a noun or adjective derivatives of the same verb, it can also make it a completely different word with a completely different verb root.
It is only because they claim infallibility of the TEXT, not the infallibility of inspiration. (This isthe same mistake that Bart Ehrman makes about the Bible.)
Related to the reliability of the gospel do you think that it's trustworthy because there is a video on UA-cam about 10 changes made to the bible do you think it has something that may question the reliability of the gospel because i really want it to be reliable respect from a muslim and do watch that video so i can get an honest reply
Research by Dr Turhan Fursun in 1952,Languange Arab is always change every 200 Years,for 71 tradition and 16 dialect change too,and for that Dr Turhan Dursun create 7decade from 1900 to era 570-633.
About Mohamad is form from Univercity Moscow research Chabal Jews write Mem,ham,mem,daled,=siwa,brahma,wisnu,ruhudra rape goddes woman Durga and all sign square 1970.
Mokmin in Islam/qur'an call Hajj,but in Tybia Solomon/Sulayman religion in call by name Voodoo Islamakandal practice simple have 8 book just dzikir mokmin 6X /day,most stranger among all is howcome from (Voodoo Islamakandal mean the live most danger and sorrow from dead)
15:00 this would contradict the passage in chapter 3 where it says that the Torah and the Gospels are true, that would make jews & Christians innocent and not burning in Hell
I only see one of those variations that was significant. The one that has the creatures and innocents change. The rest really seem to be more slight translational variations.
Incidently 1924 Egypt was a british semicolony, with strong french influence (and italian fascism making inroads). Raises the Question of possible political manipulation (not just of the Hafs).
Notice that Shabir says they don't affect beliefs and practises in any significant way . Or don't major impact on muslim practises. But that doesn't mean it doesn't affect practises! e.g. there could be minor impacts on muslim practises. Bernie Powers mentioned one in his discussion with you(about a singular and plural, and a difference between islammic schools of thought about practise regarding giving charity, and the difference is based on whether it's singular or plural). At 0:48 you understate what Shabir said.. Shabir didn't say it doesn't change any practise. If you look carefully at Shabir's wording, he subtly acknowledged that it might affect practise! Fantastic that you included that video from Shabir though. I recall seeing one somewhere, maybe from you or david wood(using some stuff from anthony rogers) or islamcritiqued, where shabir's religious daughter asked him about the qiraat.
@A Proud Believer Putting aside that I am a non-believer that can simply see that islam is the worst and most irrational "religion".. I don't know if you noticed, but the subject is the quran. And if you don't like the bible then that's a problem for islam because you believe that moses and jesus etc received a book, but that book even going back to the oldest records, clearly doesn't match with islam so you have to believe in books you have never seen that you imagine match islam.
Dr.Jay, From the way you speak and your overall body language speaks a lot about your lack of confidence in proving the Qur'an wrong. You are really giving yourself a tough time which unfortunately will be a fruitless unyielding effort on your part until you find yourself in the grave. May you be guided
The major mistakes with this video: 1.The idea that different arabic languages could somehow ''replace'' original arabic language wich prophet Muhammed came with. 2.The idea that ''closest translation'' should not exist because all languages are ''equally rich'' Answer: 1.Arabic language of by wich prophet Muhammed came with MUST COEXIST within arabic that is not the arabic langauge of prophet Muhammed, OTHERWISE THE QUR'AN WOULD BE LOST. AND as hard as it sounds i would agree on that video if that was the case. 2. Not every language is rich so trying to explain things is much more difficult to countries that lacks some of the words that desribe things that doesn't exist in their language.
Even if there are errors with the dots and vowels, the Quran is still the same because it was protected by memorization unlike the Bible. Muslims don't depend on the physical written words in the Quran. Millions of Muslims have the original recitation as taught by the prophet in their minds. Can your Bible say the same?
Thank you Dr. Jay Smith for your ministries. Now Muslim no longer able to dismissed the evidence against their supposed claim of "perfect" quran preservation. Even Shabir ally has conceded defeat on that front. All glory to Lord Jesus Christ.
Book recommendations:- 1.Translation of the Holy Qur'an by Abdul haleem or Clear Qur'an by Musthafa Khattab 2.The Sealed Nectar - Biography of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH). 3.The Divine Reality by Hamza Tzortzis 4.God and Logic in Islam by John Walbridge 5.Islam and secularism by Sayyid Muhammad Naquib Al- Attas 6.The History of the Qur'anic Text: From Revelation to Compilation : a Comparative Study with the Old and New Testaments by Muhammad Mustafa Azmi 7.Discovering the Quran by Neil Robinson 8.Structure and Quranic interpretation by Raymond Farrin 9.On Schacht's Origins of Muhammadan Jurisprudence by Muhammad Mustafa Azmi 10.Misquoting Muhammad by Jonathan A. C Brown 11.Purification of the heart by Hamza Yusuf 12.Inner dimensions of the prayer by Ibn Qayyim al jawziyya 13.Reclaim your heart by Yasmin mogahed 14.Women and the transmission of religious knowledge in Islam by Professor Asma sayeed 15.Sexual ethics and Islam by Kecia Ali 16. The Bible, the Qur'an, and Science by Maurice Bucaille 17.The text of the new testament its transmission, corruption and restoration by Bruce metzger, Bart ehrman
1. We must train ourselves Not to kill 2. We must train ourselves , Not to steal 3. We must train ourselves , Not to commit adultery any harmful sexual misconduct. 4. We must train ourselves , Do not lie avoid slander speech, nonsense talk, harmful, harsh speech. 5. We must train ourselves , not taking intoxicants of any kind that Cloud the mind
![MHMD [18] Here's all you need to know about Islam's "MHMD" in ONE VIDEO!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/CBT3VNH4DQw/mqdefault.jpg)
Wow - Jay, I remember many years ago you made an appeal for Muslims to confront this dilemma and evidence of the variants in the Quran. Looks like you have finally got through. Well done.
The Quran has and will always be the same. It was memorized since the time of Prophet Muhammad. Jay should thank Muslim scholars who memorized the Quran and were able to spot the few errors made in written Qurans. Transcribing a text is a patient task. Mistakes are common. But thanks to the original memorization throughout the ages the Quran has not changed. Jay is just envious that Christians did not memorize their gospels. They don't even have background knowledge about the authors of the four gospels who never met Jesus. The gospels, especially John, are the sad stories of a lie created by Paul the Son of the Devil.
@@rayali2861 Do you have a tape recorder from the 1100 AD with the Quran recitation at that time? If you do not have, then you can not prove the recitation have not changed.
@@LuisSalazar-vu4jd but more importantly for the muslim fanatics: it cannot be disproven if there is no evidence from that time
How can you deceive yourself and spread lies! descendants of those who refused the truth?
Thank you Jay for pushing for the Truth, everyone has to be informed with the Truth so they can make and unformed decision
@PfanderFilm glad to hear that Shabir Ally finaly admitted there are multiple arabic qurans in the world. Can not wait Shabir Ally’s second video about this.
guillotine 481 Wtf? quran written in a Quranic dialect not dialect of those countries. Dialects are for spoken. Stop tryna decieve
@@jcxkzhgco3050 The Quran literally means The Recitation. It is meant to be spoken aloud. That is why there are different recitations for different dialects. Arabic is not your typical language. Writing is heavily influenced by the spoken language since it's VERY precise with it's pronunciations.
@@octavio8779if that is true... Then why are your Muslim apologists constantly proclaiming (very loudly) that the Koran is perfectly preserved? That not a stroke, not a dot has been changed from the original in heaven?
That's the point of this video. Don't try to move the goalposts.
What's the point of having an eternal book in heaven if the Koran is meant to be recited, then?
@@thetabletopskirmisherThere is Hadith on this, where the Prophet was asked about the Quran being recited with incorrect pronunciation because of the 7 different dialects and the Prophet responded that all the dialects are valid. Changing “you all”into ya’ll, or “hello” into howdy, it doesn’t effect the spiritual
message of the Quran. This only happens because the Quran was passed down orally way before it was compiled as a book. The book itself was standardized in Quraysh dialect out of respect for the Prophet’s own spoken dialect. It can be said that the Quran exists in heaven as all 7 dialects, or it can be thought of as a living document that exists in continuous harmony with the speech of God. This is all theological discourse that has no bearing on our status as believers because there is no definitive answer or consensus on whether these beliefs are meant to interpreted literally or in a figurative way.
God bless you dear Jay Smith. I am trying to help as much as i can with all of my knowledge about islam.
The different definitely contradict their claim : "Quran never change".
Sigh different diaclets not qurans just search it up and stop being so damn ignorant
Puruan Langit The translation into different languages that you can understand that has been changed drastically. Take an example for a country like indonesia. In 2016, the islamic scholars of Lajnah Pentashihan Mushaf Al-Quran (LPMQ) 186 words of translation has been changed officially into standard Malay language of indonesia for easy understanding in order to fit into modernization of the citizen in that country. In other words it’s an act of imprudently to make fooled in order to control over the people.
The major mistakes with this video:
1.The idea that different arabic languages could somehow ''replace'' original arabic language wich prophet Muhammed came with.
2.The idea that ''closest translation'' should not exist because all languages are ''equally rich''
Answer:
1.Arabic language of by wich prophet Muhammed came with MUST COEXIST within arabic that is not the arabic langauge of prophet Muhammed, OTHERWISE THE QUR'AN WOULD BE LOST. AND as hard as it sounds i would agree on that video if that was the case.
2. Not every language is rich so trying to explain things is much more difficult to countries that lacks some of the words that desribe things that doesn't exist in their language.
The thing that never changes is change..... So, maaaaaaybe they got something?? Yeah??
Okay, I'm stretching it. They got nothing.
catholicism is wrong,bible say to STAND FIRM and HOLD tradition,not distorted it just like what catholic church did,no catholic can debunk sola scriptura,Go away from idolatry Catholics
I truly believe Shabir Ali will be born again some day. In Jesus name!
No he won't , because he already knows the problem with Islam, that's why he comes up with a way to sanitize it, it's source of his income, so he won't
@@Think_pls It's not about income. It's about digging in his heels on an incorrect tradition.
@@clarekuehn4372 doubt it if ever he leaves Islam, with his intelligence I think he will be an agnostic
He might, i surely hope so. Imagine the impact he could have on many muslims, leading them to jesus, would be so cool!
Yeap, he might come around.
Thank you for showing your research so clearly... there is no deception on your part ❤️🙏🏽
I enjoyed this video, because it was very specifically examining the texts. Some videos sound like Jay is making generalizations and blowing hot air. This video is excellent, because he gets down to the nitty gritty of the text and explains the differences in detail.
So when I was a Muslim and I came across the Other Variations of the Qur’an (about 1.5 years into the religion), I refused to listen to those whom I would call “Anti-Muslims”. I thought this was the best approach so that I remain unbiased in my Assessment of the Veracity of Islam and the claim of Scriptural Authenticity.
When I came to the Learned Muslims for Answers, I would get responses anywhere from “your faith is in jeopardy, pray to Allah for Guidance and Understanding” to things like “shut up and believe the main narrative like a Good Muslim”.
After more of their hypocrisy, sneaking around, and refusal to answer or address questions piled up, I decided to return to Christ.
Recently, because I began to doubt whether I am being manipulated by the devil or if Christ, indeed, is now calling me back to His Flock, I prayed to Jesus for Definite, Undeniable Proof that I was right to return to Him and Abandon Islam. I also asked that He gave me the Wisdom, the Intellect and the Understanding required to see the Sign and acknowledge The Truth.
Then, I found a video about the Anniversary of Yasir Qadi’s interview where he got stuck with the Authenticity Narrative. That led me to this video. The Proof and the Sign, from Jesus Christ.
Ave Christus Rex! Christos Pantokrator!
This is exactly the reason that many people born into the muslim faith are now leaving it; because they cannot get meaningful answers from their clerics about fundamental questions. They realise their clerics have lied to them. The entire religion is lies based on lies. And what is worse, the lies are used to hide what the texts say, and the texts are full of appalling commands of hate and violence.
Lol opposite is happening too and this guy has already been debunked our entire religion based on hate? Kid go read your own bible first @@toddbeamer6131
I find this hard to believe as any competent Sheikh or student of knowledge would tell you about the Qir'at of the Quran. Many people memorize many Qir'at
My simpleton mind appreciates real research. Thank you.
GOD BLESS you BROTHER Dr. Jay Smith, we admire your hard work and your ministry
🙏♥️♥️♥️🙏💒
Loved seeing Jay in Hyde Park last year! What a voice, a tremendous, fearless presence - By God's grace.
I believe after much research that the real quran has no punctuation marks just like the hebrew torah and hebrew bible it is one of the great miracles of the text that it has layers upon layers upon layers of meaning that reveal new things if anyone of you christians and i challenge all of you if you can show me that the skeleton text has been changed i will leave islam so who is willing to accept the challenge????come on lets see what you got
The Four Gospels are a lie. They refused to choose the Gospels of those who walked with Christ. Why did they ignore the Gospel of James who was Jesus brother? James knew more about his brother than four unknown men who never met Jesus. Read the Aramaic gospels. Jesus spoke Aramaic not Greek. Mark Matthew Luke and John are fakes. Jay Smith is a faker & liar according to the Gospel of James.
this is the age of revelations brothers, with time things will come to light and in the and The Truth will be appear....
Bokor: And the truth will be ... that all these Gods are super-powered, superheroes dreamed up in the inventive human imagination.
@Jasmin Brown Take a look at the history of Gods down the ages and it becomes a logical inference. The mountain Gods, the river Gods, the sun God, the totemic Gods and so on of our ancestors led to polytheistic cultures with Gods personified/anthropomorphised, such as the Greeks. Look, too, at the attributes of the ancient Gods, particularly the idea of dying and rising and even of exceptional conception/birth. From there, it was but a short step to monotheism (or the not-really monotheism of Christianity). The Gods compete with each other in our more modern times, (which almost takes us back to ancient Greece and Rome) in a sort of playground one-upmanship: "My God's the REAL God, yours is fake." "No, MY God's the REAL one; YOURS is the FAKE one."
The only thing which could suggest that any of these God-existence claims is real, would be good, credible evidence for the existence of a God and I have never encountered any.
@Jasmin Brown It is kind of you to take so much trouble to write all this down, but it does not impress.
On the contrary, "the lady doth protest too much, methinks". Basically, you do what just about every theist I ever encounter tries to do: You try to deny X, Y and Z rather than give good, credible evidence for YOUR claims. In other words, you deflect from what is uncomfortable and you focus on anything but what is asked of you.
I look on from the outside - as an atheist - and I must admit I just laugh. The Jews - Jesus' own people - will tell you in great detail why the New Testament is a Paul-inspired, Roman-supported forgery. You assert that Islam is a "forgery", though Islamic scholars will provide you with "evidence" to the contrary. The Roman Catholics will tell Protestants that they are not the "true faith" and Protestants will pour vitriol on RCs. The church in YOUR town will tell you why the church in the next town is wrong ... Meanwhile, the Hindus don't give a damn about any of you and nor do the Buddhists. And you will ALL cite exactly the same "arguments" or "evidence" to demonstrate your particular claims.
So, before you try to convince me of anything, first go and convince all your fellow Christians, the Jews, the Muslims, the Hindus etc that YOU are correct. After all, you have a head start with them because they are already prepared to believe in supernatural, super-powered men in the sky. Then, when you can all agree, come and present your evidence to those of us who don't buy any of it.
@Jasmin Brown So Islam is a mess, Hinduism is "a disaster" ... It sounds as if basically, you are right and everybody else must be wrong! But, in fact, had you been brought up in a Muslim or Hindu country and culture, you would likely be pointing out the errors of Christianity. Even in Christianity, I bet I can predict - in caricatured paraphrase - your answers:
Roman Catholicism? Rubbish.
Jehovah's Witnesses? Rubbish.
Mormonism? Rubbish.
And so on, excluding everything that is not your chosen flavour of God belief. I hope this is not a straw man, but the evidence so far would support what I say.
In terms of "claims" about God, I make none. I only respond to those claims. So God is not "ruled out by default" any more than the existence of leprechauns or alien abductions are ruled out by default. It is simply that if somebody wants to persuade me that these things are real, they need to provide significant good, credible evidence.
"... you detest the supernatural." - I don't think I said any such thing. I would need evidence of its existence before deciding on my attitude to it.
I do not need to go into detail. My point was a very general - and I think uncontroversial - one, which is that Gods appear to have been part of the life of hominids almost as long as hominids themselves have existed. Yahweh and Allah are just recent manifestations of this phenomenon.
You are not "so unsatisfactory for" me. It is simply that I do not understand what theists have to gain from BEGINNING the discussion with non-believers. And that is what I see so often, especially, but not exclusively, on UA-cam. Instead of recognising that they have mutually contradictory and exclusive God-existence claims and asking themselves questions about THAT, a great many theists think that arguing with atheists - and denying science, promoting their particular book as "the truth", asserting their personal experiences as "evidence" and so on - is a pathway to confirming their own beliefs. This is nonsense. Atheists are a tiny minority of those who do not believe what you believe. You might even say, unkindly, but correctly, that we are currently almost irrelevant. Which is why I say your first task is to persuade all God-believers to accept YOUR claims. If your claims are SO strong, SO well-evidenced, this should be a piece of cake. In the meantime, I look on with bemusement and await agreement. When that is achieved, it would be the time to come and present your collectively agreed evidence to atheists. Is that so unreasonable?
@Jasmin Brown You have just done EXACTLY what I predicted you would do! You have found reasons to dismiss everything that isn't YOUR chosen flavour of belief whilst telling yourself that YOUR beliefs are exceptional because ... reasons. Go tell it to the Jews/Muslims/Hindus etc! Go and have it out with them. They will write very lengthy messages like yours explaining why YOU are wrong and THEY are right. I am not interested until you can all agree on ONE story, with ONE clearly agreed line of evidence.
And I don't think I asserted you were brought up as a Christian. Please read my messages again carefully. I take a lot of trouble over them.
God Bless You Jay 👍
Love your work ❤
First
I have made it in life today🤣
Dr. Shabir Ally now understand that they're no longer in their safe bubbles in this age of information so it is better for him to say the truth before people discover it by themselves which will make many leave Islam.
remember the first will be the last ;-)
@@michielvdvlies3315 oops!
You just ruined it again but that won't be my portion by the Grace of our Lord...
Michiel vd Vlies 🤣🤣🤣🤣
“””Whatever is done in darkness will be brought out in to the light.”””How I love this century .And all its nosiness. I realised Mormons are doing the same thing recently. The pressure is overwhelming.🤗🤗
@@thepalmofdeborah2110 amen i love it too😊😊😊😊😊GLORY TO JESUS😊😊😊😊😊😊😊
People need to realise that the 1924 Quran was introduced to make a teacher's life easier. The teachers didn't want the hassle of marking papers and books where students were quoting variant Quranic verses from their own Qurans. There is no theological reason the Cairo edition was chosen above the other 36 Qurans.
First uthman collected recitations of Mohammed(allegedly) from scraps ,,burned most and made his own version,,then along came al hajjaj ,,he also did the same as uthman...then the korans were collected and sunk in the Nile river ,,,the Cairo version is the result in 1924 ... hafs was regarded as a liar by Muslim scholars....🤔
Where do you people get your stories from. From Satan indeed. It’s exhausting the Quran is one! Try all you want you can’t come up with one verse like it! One god not three
@watluktwel which one there are 66 versions! when Jesus (PBU) returns he's going to ask all of you "show me where did I claim to be god" and your three gods will be so tongue tied. You guys are misled, read and educate yourselves, Islam simply means submitting your will to the one god, its liberating, your hate isn't going to get you anywhere, time is running out. listen to Quran recitation and see how your soul responds to it. Jesus prayed just like the Muslims did he is a Muslim (submitted his will to his creator). why do you think the media is bashing the religion so much ask yourselves. god sent 124000 prophets and messengers all said to worship one. 300 year after Jesus passed away they made up the trinity. So you READ; the Quran.
@@AwakeWeStand lol if you were so smart you would run away from Islam
Here's an explanation on the issue of different Qiraat:
m.ua-cam.com/video/LDSBOMK2M2g/v-deo.html
For those looking for a book to read on the compilation of the Quran you can read 'The History of the Quranic Text from revelation to copilation' by Al-Azami.
For those who just want to fuel their ignorance you can continue to listen to jay smith the Ultracrepidarian and his horse poop arguments.
Wow this has been the clearest video about this issue that I've watched so far. Jay's videos on this matter are great but unfortunately, they seem to fly over my head cause they are a more scholarly approach most of the time and the continuations of his videos are hard to find for me so I almost always ended up feeling like I couldn't even get a basic grasp of the problems in textual criticism of the Quran. But I'm glad for this video you made. I feel like I could finally fill those wholes and your argument finally came to live to me. May the Lord continue guiding you to help bring more Muslims into salvation through Christ.
As i muslim this makes me laugh all his claims are debunked the quran was not written down it came via speach and was remmebered by hearth an the beutiful recitation , when you change the words its wil not aline , like what this guy is saying come on open youre ayes how can you not know the difference between being good to parents and beuty to parents its obviously the good one if you change the recitation it would not be good and this is how we know not via text because a lot of the sahaba.s where also childeren and verry much people where iliterite sow they could not read or write but they could recite what they have heard from the prophet and it would touch there hearth and the quran is easy to remmember as god promised us , its funny how bad you guys want to destroy islam but it cannot and the truth wil reveal itself
His admission MASSIVE, and on its face commendably honest, but actually deceptively dishonest; seceding the existence of variants is small, but it does take away a problem in the perception of us plebs that don't necessarily get into the weeds.
What matters would be the admission that there were actually substantive variations .
He went as far as he could... without running a risk of getting killed.
I believe after much research that the real quran has no punctuation marks just like the hebrew torah and hebrew bible it is one of the great miracles of the text that it has layers upon layers upon layers of meaning that reveal new things if anyone of you christians and i challenge all of you if you can show me that the skeleton text has been changed i will leave islam so who is willing to accept the challenge????come on lets see what you got
Here's an explanation on the issue of different Qiraat:
m.ua-cam.com/video/LDSBOMK2M2g/v-deo.html
For those looking for a book to read on the compilation of the Quran you can read 'The History of the Quranic Text from revelation to copilation' by Al-Azami.
For those who just want to fuel their ignorance you can continue to listen to jay smith the Ultracrepidarian and his horse poop arguments.
@@maxter1334 that's the problem though, all but 6 different readings of the original quran is gibberish, complete and utter gibberish.
Even in the hafs quran today, ~20% is gibberish with such unclear meaning that imams freely translate it however they wish
@@angrydragonslayer yea its just weird i feel theres an ancient science something behind all of this that all these fake religions were built on including islam
It's great to see Christians expose Islam an Muslims with they own surahs, hadith an sunna.
JAY......what a wonderful man u are.
chukwu chukwu
He is INDIAN 🇮🇳born ..thats why 25 years of his mission spent studying ISLAM and still looking for faults and flaws and and cant find conclusion at the age of 67 years.
@@mahamediqbalharoun8366 he have given 93000 difference dont admit itss upon you peace and knowledge upon you
@@mahamediqbalharoun8366 Nice try. 32 Qurans... Just saying...
@@mahamediqbalharoun8366
...I'm going to conclude that you have not watched any of his videos☠️
Thanks for your relentless faithfulness, Jay. You are a hero in kingdom.
But he's a trinitarian
Trinity is from genesis to revelation
Prophets "being killed" does make a difference to the very common Muslim position that God's prophets could/should not suffer , hence the gospel claim of Messiah dying an agonising death for our sins must show that the Injil has been changed.
The Koran says that Allah replaced JESUS with someone else....
Most of the prophets in the old testament were killed.....
You absolutely right it has been changed and we don't denied that.
The Qurans we have today, which one is with your Allah?
Be careful choosing the right one which is the word to word and carbon-copy with the one with Allah. Be careful not blasphemy and you know what Allah will do to you in the grave and the judgement day.
Have you ever imagine if Allah had mistakenly gave his Quran to Muhammad and he decide to come for it now which one will you advise him to take?
What about their prophet Mo who died an agonising death through food poisoning? Do they think?
Great job. This is the biggest crack in the foundation to date. Ouch! This hurts. Peace be upon Grinch!
In Islam, Qira'at, which means literally the readings, terminologically means the method of recitation. Traditionally, there are 10 recognized schools of qira'at, and each one derives its name from a famous reader of Quran recitation.
Recitation should be done according to rules of pronunciation, intonation, and caesuras established by the prophet Muhammad, the most popular reading is that of Hafs on the authority of `Asim.
Similarly, each melodic passage centers on a single tone level, but the melodic contour and melodic passages are largely shaped by the reading rules, creating passages of different lengths whose temporal expansion is defined through caesuras.
Skilled readers may read professionally for mosques in cities.
The first condition was that the recitation has an authentic chain of narration in which the chain of narrators was continuous; As for the narrations which did not even have an authentic chain of narration, they were classified as Baatil (false) and rejected totally.
The second condition was that the variations in recitations match known Arabic grammatical constructions. Unusual constructions could be verified by their existence in passages of pre-Islamic prose or poetry.
The third condition required the recitation to coincide with the script of the Quran .
below one verse read in 7 recitations:
ua-cam.com/video/OCzA6xR42zg/v-deo.html
No punctuation mark
Yeah the problem is that none of your modern day qira at match with your oldest 6 manuscripts in the slightest. You dont have any manuscrits from the time of "uthman" and therefore cant claim the quran was perfectly preserved when there is a ga of 50 years between uthmans standardization and the first manuscript, that contradicts todays quran and is doesnt even contain half of the quran you have today.
You gotta understand that muslims have made the claim that not a single word or letter has been changed since uthman. Now every scholar knows thats not the case and the lies the muslim community was fed were easily swallowed and forgotten so now the argument went from "not a single letter is different" to, well yeah we have different recitations and they literally are changes in the words and letters as you can see in the video but they kinda mean the same thing (which they dont if you watched the video)"
AND you have over 90.000 of those differences in all your qira at. How can you still be a muslim knowing that the main argument for the divinity of the quran has been a lie from the start? Now the quran has different words and recitations that dont mean the same thing? Which of those recitations is eternal then? Which one is in the um al Kitab?
Amazing source I found today! So glad I found this video. Thanks a lot for your amazing work!
So the Quran says that polytheists are innocent?! They worship idols! This the biggest offense in Islam! And why does Allah cast innocent people into hell?! This is a huge problem that Muslims need to be made aware of! Definitely shows that the Quran has been altered and it definitely changes the meaning.
Islamisthecultofsin
Itcis...wena dooza ga lo inja.Gooloobear dooza ga lo mazimba.Izwele goondaan.Islam phambele wena mova.
You are only taking the meaning that suits your criticism. Cant you tell this youtuber among others are struggling to prove islam wrong. And this is all they could bring in their defence. But as the saying goes, truth will out. And its evident islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. Ask yourself why that is so despite all the criticism. Don't let youtubers define what the truth is for you as everyone would like to defend their religion above others. And this is both true among both muslims and Christians. None will speak ill of their religion. The most logical thing to do is to find out yourself. I assume you already know the bible if you are Christian. Find the Quran and read for yourself with intention of find the truth and not to criticize. And now decide for
yourself the truth. These preachers are blinded from the truth because they only read to criticize. Will leave you in peace
@@lukmanm5922 fastest breeding **
"Sightly different" contradicts their claim their book has "never changed" since inception.
May their eyes open for the Good News of the Gospel.
STOP STOP STOP I thought that the Quor'an was never altered and came directly from God. How can dogs , addition of change can take place?
yes.... first of all, the Quran has not been changed in anyway...during the prophet’s time , the alphabet were written without the shaddah. So the caliphs and other Islamic scholars made it easy by putting the shaddah and phatoha on the alphabets to make it easy to read. There are still evidence of the old Arabic text of the Quran still existing.
The second knowledge I can share with you is that, in ancient Arabic times, memorization was very important in religion and the Arabic culture. For most and all the part, the Quran is very very accurate, even without written text and all, there were a lot of people who memorized the Quran. Even with your arguments, I don’t know if you have pure knowledge of Arabic culture but different words can have the same meaning and the same word can have different meanings. If the main argument is about the way the text is written, then you definitely have gotten it wrong because people did that.
Aside that, it was an all oral text book before it became a written text.
@@yakubukarima8554 the Birmingham manuscript is only 4 pages and what it dies have does not match up with newer ones. The Sa'ana and Topkapi vary from it and each other. All show thousands of alterations. Not just dots, but whole words, verses and the chapter sizes vary.
Book of lies or the people of lies. The book was not made straight.. the pathway has may forks that lead to no where..
Truth will always triumph no matter how long it is hidden
He Jay, you had a haircut! Good for you. 1 question: When is there a sequel on the corrections in the early quran manuscripts of Daniel Alan Brubaker?
@Markus Tanbeck We will be getting to the Qur'an soon enough. I didn't want to say anything at this point, but then Shabir went and put up his video on the 19th, so I had to respond, and so it goes. Al Fadi won't publish anything until he has finished his PhD, and that will be a few years yet.
Excellent work. We appriciate your hard research you and your team has done 🙏🏾💜💒
“THE MIRACLE OF PRESERVATION” = dead 💀 and gone.
The Quran has been preserved in the minds of Muslims since the time of the prophet. THE MIRACLE OF MEMORIZATION is a LIVING Miracle. Who has memorized just ONE of the over 100 gospels that were in existence 2000 years ago?
@@rayali2861 If it has been preserved in the minds of Muslims since the time of the prophet, where are the verses about adult breast feeding that were eaten by a domestic animal? You are a liar like your false Prophet.
@@programminglanguagestutori9118 What!? Verses about adult breast feeding?! lol! you guys are funny! The oldest manuscript which is in Birmingham University, does it have any verses adult breast feeding!? lol!
@@rayali2861 your delusional if you think someone can memoriz a whole book 🤣
@@AmaRev first go study your cult before defending it blindly you know nothing about your cult.
Appreciate your hard work. God bless you Sr lots of love & respect.👍🙏💖
Less than 100k subscribers????
The whole world should hear this.
Dr Jay, you are awesome...pls do more videos and review.
> The team in London has already found over 93,000 of these changes between the various Qur'anic renditions.
Is this research available somewhere?
@watluktwel Interesting information. Did you mean to post it in response to me? Asking since it does not seem to be related to my comment.
God Bless.Jay Smith.
God Bless you,Thank you for sharing this video.
I'm happy to see Dr. Jay Smith's relentless pursuit of truth which has forced these muslim scholars to finally accept their false claims about Quran. Now we need to make sure this news reaches all 1.7 billion Muslims around the world.
Captain planet
Jay is trying very hard ..for the last 25 years studying ISLAM whilst ISLAM dominated major websites for the past 25 years.He is trying Islamic formula. 1.8 billion muslims worldwide....will listen to this 0??? That will be a present day MESSIAH trying to proof his false claims.
Captain planet
In Jays dream tunnel.
@@mahamediqbalharoun8366 😂🤣 without lies islam DIES.
@@obi7234
Islam...I shall love all mankind
@@mahamediqbalharoun8366 lol! Islam does not love itself nor its followers how then can it love the world?
Thank you ,jay from africa zambia
This blows apart their core belief that the Koran is perfectly preserved and does not differ. And this is Muhammad’s only miracle, too!
He is the miracle
@@219nes How is Muhammad the miracle? Please explain!
@@hdl135605 2023 fastest growing religion. Hahahha what else do you need to know ;-)
I respect your grind Jay God bless you protect you provide you preserve in Jesus Name...
Wait! Whaaaaat?! Now mislims claims there are variants. Let's see how this turns out
A book of magic = what
A book of math = what
A book of lies = what
Bart Battista
B B..stands for best book. Get hold of a FREE copy and read it after lockdown.
We (Muslims) still don't believe that Prophet Jesus (p.b.u.h) son of Mary'am (May Allah be please with her) is God or son of god.
Holy Qur'an is the words of Allah (The Creator) & is the final revelation from Allah (GOD). That's still in effect.
@@umarmujaahid1065 lies 🤣🤣
I'm so glad you covered this, but it would be more powerful if you made this video shorter. 😍 I suggest that you do a summary video!
Jay, what quran were muslims reading before 1924?
Nobody knows because All the manuscripts were sunk in the river Nile and this hafs version was introduced
Allah knows best! lol
@@zanjabil1789 About 37 different Qur'ans, all of which we now have in London.
Quran was lost when mohammad went to 7 heaven when he was bathing in the Nile river in the 7 heaven the Quran was drowned.
@@pfanderfilms hey Jay, do you have access to enough information that show along a timeline how did the Hafs reading become dominant, and how other readings came to be much less used?
Actually I have to agree with Shabir ally. If those are the significant differences, they shouldn't seriously effect the believe nor the practice of muslims. However thank you for the video. I love them and I hope to see some more. :)
Since Arabic is a created language, what is the language of the eternal tablets?
It cannot be anything like Arabic since nothing created can be like Allahs attributes.
At best, the Quran which muslims possess is a translation.
But can aanyyhing created be like the uncreated seech of Aallah?
If yes, you just violated tawhid al asm'aa was sifaat.
If no, your qur'an is a corruption.
Are the"Arabic language in the heaven",in which Quran was written and the Arabic language in the earth, the same?
Ummer Farooq - God doesn’t have a prime language. Language is for creatures to communicate. Language is basically just a sound. If a Chinese person sat next to you and spoke Mandarin, if you don’t know Mandarin, all you will hear are just sounds. If you need to understand a sound, attach meaning to the sounds and then what you have is called language.
@Ummer Farooq arabic is a semitic language, it has developped from aramaic/syriac. it is not a prime language.
Is Arabic language of God ?
That's awesome shabir ali... Falling down..... Jaysmith's work finally pays divident
Shabir martials the same defence that I do when we defend the Bible at speakers corner... lol so er…. the divine text now needs the same defence as my 'corrupt bible'....
The best n truth full word ever
Shabir Aly's heart is warming up to the truth. May he let go and hold on Christ.
Al Boukhari has less variances
That is why Muslims follow more Boukhari than the Quran
😅
Bukhari we listen to follow the sunnah path of our messenger thats all . For believes definetly with no doubts quran
Amen very good explain brother Jay God bless you and your ministry
I respect Shabir Ally for this
Yes, he is a lot more honest than almost any other Muslim on this subject.
@@pfanderfilms Yes
I'm love to join you, Mr Jay..... History indeed telling the truth in order to understand the actual roof if founder Islam or Christianity.... And to compare it.
What ever you say, we really believe that Qur'an is the best book ever and no one can change.
Nope. Comic books bettee than quran
You have a soothing voice please make more of these where you just talk to us
The defense that it doesn't change doctrine or practice is a defense available to us but not available to them. We have never claimed the eternity of the Bible or its perfect preservation.
But we need to have a perfect bible. And thats only the King james 1611.
Its contains the majority of the maniscripts.
Thank the Lord for this man to stand up to Islam with all it error
Everyone is missing the fact that the Quran has been changed many times, and there are multiple copies.
In your dreams 😂
. Your dreams must make you uncomfortable seek Jesus for deliverance .
God bless you Jay
You got to Shabir, schooling him on his own religion! Sadly, his pride has not given you the credit for the guidance you offered in last debate. Glory to God!
A debate between Dr Jay and Professor Bart Ehrman would make interesting viewing.
1. When they can’t even re-write it correctly how before Osman caliph they memorize it😳😳
2. I don’t know about Arabs but many muslim just read the Quran without undrestanding it, Even if there is one Quran still is a horrible book
Hypota68
Hypota ....i give you 68 chances...get hold of a FREE copy of this book as you described and read it.
Its the only book thats MEMORIZED by millions of CHOSEN MUSLIMS WORLDWIDE.Its a living MIRACLE. NO other faiths has these miraculous powers.
@@mahamediqbalharoun8366 buraak space donkey research center miraculous power
@@riteshkumarsingh6473
Thats genuine rks ..no doubt...1.bILLION followers of that belief..unlike other beliefs taking cow as their worship.Even the dung they will eat it.
@Grilled BBQ
I dont understand what you explaining really...Get hold of a BIBLE..a TORAH or even a GHAGVAD GITA..and tell 10 persons each who can by heart..to tryand memorize these books from starting chapter and verse till end chapter and read it out by heart exactly as per chapters .......it will be impossible impossible my bru...i haven't seen this MIRACLE...but KORAN...it's a LIVING MIRACLE and reciters can read all together...it will be same recitation by memory...i challenge you if any of the above faiths can do this miraculous recitation...go and check with if you follow a particular belief..follow up with them and let me know.
so, which words did Mohammad hear from Allah since Muslims have to recite as their prophet heard the voice in his ears?
Thank you brother Jay , shabby Ali is big fat Deceiver hope he has bought himself fire suit for Hell 👿
My conclusion is that the Hafs transmission is the authentic one to adopt, being the one that makes sense and consistency of all its parts. 1354 differences between the Hafs and the Warsh. It's not like any of the differences vary about things such as the significance of Ramadan, the inheritance rights of women, the need for modest dress, or the conditions for continuing war or accepting treaty of peace, or the degree of respect for Christian (innocent) creatures.
I hopeim wrong but I believe regardless if they knew there religion was completely false they still wouldn't denounce it due to getting funded as well as pride, again I pray I'm wrong, come to the Savior brothers 🙏🙏
Wonderful ministries. Very compelling evidence.
As someone with Arabic as his first language, I can confidently tell you that in Arabic, more so than probably any other alphabetical language, the way you read the same written word can make all the difference in meaning. And it's not just the different grammatical states of the verb or whether it becomes a noun or adjective derivatives of the same verb, it can also make it a completely different word with a completely different verb root.
Hello, strength from the Lord be yours Jay Smith.
Quran miracle number 19 is COVID 19 miracle😆 and Shabir is right
Bro stay safe, and specially remember me in your prayers. Jesus bless you.
Quranavirus
The best way to preach Islam, is incomplete until yu embrace Islam Mr Smith.
Hu tu tu tu tu
It is only because they claim infallibility of the TEXT, not the infallibility of inspiration. (This isthe same mistake that Bart Ehrman makes about the Bible.)
Related to the reliability of the gospel do you think that it's trustworthy because there is a video on UA-cam about 10 changes made to the bible do you think it has something that may question the reliability of the gospel because i really want it to be reliable respect from a muslim and do watch that video so i can get an honest reply
Jesus is Lord
Research by Dr Turhan Fursun in 1952,Languange Arab is always change every 200 Years,for 71 tradition and 16 dialect change too,and for that Dr Turhan Dursun create 7decade from 1900 to era 570-633.
About Mohamad is form from Univercity Moscow research Chabal Jews write Mem,ham,mem,daled,=siwa,brahma,wisnu,ruhudra rape goddes woman Durga and all sign square 1970.
Mokmin in Islam/qur'an call Hajj,but in Tybia Solomon/Sulayman religion in call by name Voodoo Islamakandal practice simple have 8 book just dzikir mokmin 6X /day,most stranger among all is howcome from (Voodoo Islamakandal mean the live most danger and sorrow from dead)
Finally - Finally they have found one unfounded unrelated ( with The Holly Quran ) Imaginery discovery.
Amusing !
Difference on reading. For example english from america and english from england and english from nigeria, the words are same but different reading
15:00 this would contradict the passage in chapter 3 where it says that the Torah and the Gospels are true, that would make jews & Christians innocent and not burning in Hell
I only see one of those variations that was significant. The one that has the creatures and innocents change. The rest really seem to be more slight translational variations.
Dr. Jay torn sabir apart, what an exposition.....
Incidently 1924 Egypt was a british semicolony, with strong french influence (and italian fascism making inroads). Raises the Question of possible political manipulation (not just of the Hafs).
Jay ... Thankyou so much for your passion in exposing all the untruths of Islam.
Notice that Shabir says they don't affect beliefs and practises in any significant way . Or don't major impact on muslim practises. But that doesn't mean it doesn't affect practises! e.g. there could be minor impacts on muslim practises. Bernie Powers mentioned one in his discussion with you(about a singular and plural, and a difference between islammic schools of thought about practise regarding giving charity, and the difference is based on whether it's singular or plural). At 0:48 you understate what Shabir said.. Shabir didn't say it doesn't change any practise. If you look carefully at Shabir's wording, he subtly acknowledged that it might affect practise! Fantastic that you included that video from Shabir though. I recall seeing one somewhere, maybe from you or david wood(using some stuff from anthony rogers) or islamcritiqued, where shabir's religious daughter asked him about the qiraat.
@A Proud Believer Putting aside that I am a non-believer that can simply see that islam is the worst and most irrational "religion".. I don't know if you noticed, but the subject is the quran. And if you don't like the bible then that's a problem for islam because you believe that moses and jesus etc received a book, but that book even going back to the oldest records, clearly doesn't match with islam so you have to believe in books you have never seen that you imagine match islam.
Jay is finally accomplishing mission bringing Muslims scholars kneeling down.
The BIG Question is, WHICH Quran is with their Allah's paradise?
i want to see more :)
I will like to hear from you sir. Shalom.
Dr.Jay,
From the way you speak and your overall body language speaks a lot about your lack of confidence in proving the Qur'an wrong.
You are really giving yourself a tough time which unfortunately will be a fruitless unyielding effort on your part until you find yourself in the grave.
May you be guided
The major mistakes with this video:
1.The idea that different arabic languages could somehow ''replace'' original arabic language wich prophet Muhammed came with.
2.The idea that ''closest translation'' should not exist because all languages are ''equally rich''
Answer:
1.Arabic language of by wich prophet Muhammed came with MUST COEXIST within arabic that is not the arabic langauge of prophet Muhammed, OTHERWISE THE QUR'AN WOULD BE LOST. AND as hard as it sounds i would agree on that video if that was the case.
2. Not every language is rich so trying to explain things is much more difficult to countries that lacks some of the words that desribe things that doesn't exist in their language.
It would be nice if you have thousands of examples of discrepancies to categorize them and make some stats about it...
The difference is only in the script.
What VARIATIONS are we talking about here,..variation of the ORIGINAL TEXT, variation of TRANSLATIONS or variation of VERSIONS ?
excellent video.
Even if there are errors with the dots and vowels, the Quran is still the same because it was protected by memorization unlike the Bible. Muslims don't depend on the physical written words in the Quran. Millions of Muslims have the original recitation as taught by the prophet in their minds. Can your Bible say the same?
Thank you Dr. Jay Smith for your ministries. Now Muslim no longer able to dismissed the evidence against their supposed claim of "perfect" quran preservation. Even Shabir ally has conceded defeat on that front. All glory to Lord Jesus Christ.
Why if you want to know the real meaning of text , why don`t you see [ when and why it revel ] see those people whom Quran address at that time .....
Jay left Mormon Church and embraced Islam.
Do they not argue that the words without the diacritical marks are unchanged?
It seems the writers of the qurans were not quita sura about a thinga or two...
Shabir is still dancing around, to minimize damage.
Book recommendations:-
1.Translation of the Holy Qur'an by Abdul haleem or Clear Qur'an by Musthafa Khattab
2.The Sealed Nectar - Biography of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH).
3.The Divine Reality by Hamza Tzortzis
4.God and Logic in Islam by John Walbridge
5.Islam and secularism by Sayyid Muhammad Naquib Al- Attas
6.The History of the Qur'anic Text: From Revelation to Compilation : a Comparative Study with the Old and New Testaments by Muhammad Mustafa Azmi
7.Discovering the Quran by Neil Robinson
8.Structure and Quranic interpretation by Raymond Farrin
9.On Schacht's Origins of Muhammadan Jurisprudence by Muhammad Mustafa Azmi 10.Misquoting Muhammad by Jonathan A. C Brown
11.Purification of the heart by Hamza Yusuf
12.Inner dimensions of the prayer by Ibn Qayyim al jawziyya
13.Reclaim your heart by Yasmin mogahed
14.Women and the transmission of religious knowledge in Islam by Professor Asma sayeed
15.Sexual ethics and Islam by Kecia Ali
16. The Bible, the Qur'an, and Science by Maurice Bucaille
17.The text of the new testament its transmission, corruption and restoration by Bruce metzger, Bart ehrman
The Koran was finally changed to make it draconian for humanity.
1. We must train ourselves Not to kill
2. We must train ourselves , Not to steal
3. We must train ourselves , Not to commit adultery any harmful sexual misconduct.
4. We must train ourselves , Do not lie avoid slander speech, nonsense talk, harmful, harsh speech.
5. We must train ourselves , not taking intoxicants of any kind that Cloud the mind