Thank you, Bob, for your "rules" for using recorded bird calls. It's so easy to use the power of the recorded calls to the detriment of the birds, we all need to be thinking about setting up some kind of rules, so discussions like this are very important. Especially since you base most of your rules on bird behavior.
Since the Merlin Sound ID and Birdnet have been introduced, I rarely use any call back. I never use a call during nesting season, May through to September.
It always drove me crazy when I would see people lecture people on why not to play audio playback for specific migrating birds, but I would see the same people playing Eastern Screech Owl calls on repeat for like 20 minutes that would just completely freak out the whole "lot" of birds. I am happy one of your rules were to not play predator calls. Great video by the way!
What an eloquently done summary of the contradictions of birding and some excellent rules to follow. I agree with the concept that caring is much more important than eliminating any and all disturbance. Thank you for putting this together and encouraging important discussions in the community!
A guide in Arizona told me that his clients typically pay thousands for a serious birding trip and are expecting him to produce life birds for all. “What am I supposed to do?” He asked, “tell them my morals prevent from using playback?”. “I’d be out of business in no time”, he added. I wonder if using your suggestions would be a sustainable business model. Don’t get me wrong. I use it judiciously, as you say, but I’m not birding for a living. There will be as many opinions on this subject as there are birders. Good topic, Bob. Keep stirring the pot!
Yup. In fact, I'm planning a birding trip to Arizona next year looking for all those same life birds. I'm expecting to leave my MP3 player behind. I may miss a few lifers, but I guess I'll just have to go back again. LOL
I wonder which is more deleterious to birds, burning the fossil fuels for air travel on a birding trip or using playback? We can SEE the birds we influence with playback but don't see what the other activity leads to for birds we don't come near.
@@markstevenson6635 You can all rationalize your behavior however you want. LOL Sounds to me like you should not be taking that air travel if you think it's so dangerous. The reality is you don't care as much as saying you saw them.
Thank you for your informing videos! I’ve been watching them for a couple weeks now. I’m an avid birder from NC. I’ve been into birds ever since I was little. Your videos make me want to come up to Maine and go birding!
Really good topic! We try not to use the call. We do the psst for several of the birds and use Merlin for the rest. Our first Puffin tour with Stephen and Tricia got canceled due to rough seas. We went back a month later, had a great trip saw tons of puffin and seals. Had a great time. Going to make it a yearly trip
Birds disturbed by other birds invading their territory is an everyday event, but don't overdo playback. That applies to professional or amateur birders.
After finding this channel, I've been looking into local endangered and extinct species. It's a problem of which we're all aware (minus people who willfully deny humanity's impact on the planet) in the abstract, but it's easy to overlook just how close to home such ecological devastation can occur. I was pretty stunned to see that over the past several years, for every three avian species removed from the endangered species list in my area due to no longer being threatened, one was removed for going extinct. And arguably we should care *more* about the local impact than on what's happening elsewhere, because what happens near us is what we can actually prevent and fix by voting. So thanks for this honest and introspective analysis, and know that you are indeed helping people to care about local birds.
Great video Bob. I’ve always thought just don’t overdo it and be a jerk with it. It has its place at times and is a great tool. Like it or not we all have impacts on birds and wildlife. The amount of birds, snakes, frogs, etc hit by cars is untold. People letting their cats out probably does more damage than playing back Merlin.
Fantastic video Bob... FYI we've just had a couple of Magnolia Warbler turn up here in the UK caused quite a stir. Playback is generally frowned upon here in the UK but like you say, it does have a time and a place....
Great video. As a bird photographer, I haven't used playback an awful lot, mainly because I'm concerned about causing too much of a disturbance. There's a ton of useful insight that will help my own ethics evolve in this regard. For instance - if I take a really great photo of a bird using playback, does sharing it with an audience who hasn't seen it negate any negative effect on the bird? Especially if you provide some context about any challenges that particular species has to overcome? Assuming you're not leading a bird away from a nest, or not "letting the bird win" as well? Plenty for me to think about here. Oh, and chickadee cacophony would be a great band name!
Thanks! It's a tough topic. Furthermore, I don't think it's well enough studied. Every bird reacts differently. Some are bothered, most aren't - at least not more than minor inconvenience. I think the most important thing to do is watch their behavior and stay cautious.
I have been using audio minimally over the years to get a visual confirmation of the bird that I'm seeing for a bird count. My eyesight has not been the best as I get older and I am not great with binoculars. I don't want to disturb the birds so I just make a quick check for my checklist and I don't go any further. worm-eating warbler always will respond with a dive by lol . I do think the chickadees, catbirds, and house inches enjoy the company. Oh and the ethereal and beautiful call of white-throated Sparrow almost always gets a response. I think it is okay to do if done responsibly and without greatly disturbing the bird populations.❤🙏. We are losing too many birds and they need to be documented, respectfully. Great video.
Its not talked about much but my main use of playback in the field is to confirm the call of a bird ive just heard but couldn't confidently ID. Usually the case with Pipits and Finches/Buntings as they tend to have similar calls and flight calls. Ill play it quietly up to my ear to confirm it.
I have 52 weeks out of the year. I just stay out of bird areas during the first 6 weeks of spring. After nesting season there will be many more birds to see or hear.
I just listened to MPR's today Maine Calling with Bob and Maine Audubon's naturalist (not an easy show to get through to live). Caller from St Andrews, NB brought up the burden of fossil fuel consumption to the panel as it relates to birding. The panel acknowledged the relationship but missed the opportunity to elaborate on ways to mitigate the problem if one is so motivated. I don't make my livelihood as a guide as they do, so it's easier for me to make birding location decisions that limit my travel to one or two local spots. I may twitch on a species once or twice a year, and if I go on an out of state birding adventure I try to arrange for fewer and longer stays to minimize travel. Just offering this for those like-minded, and to solicit for any other strategies that help this concern.
I agree with this thoughtful dive into the issues about playback. For some people it's anathema, and others have no guardrails at all. Another ethical dilemma for birders may be twitching and unlimited travel contributing to atmospheric CO2 accumulation. As stated early in Bob's video it rests with the individual to make their own decisions based on ethics. In recent years I have consciously limited my fossil fueled travel for birding to a portion of my prior trips, both local and remote. It boils down to what any individual feels comfortable with in terms of personal responsibility.
Thanks for this great conversation, Bob. A year or two ago, there were reports of an EASO near a popular rail trail. When I arrived, I was excited because I could hear the owl singing and also the mobbing reaction of the BCCH, TUTI, and others. As I turned a bend in the trail, there was a group of about a dozen folks with binocs, and one person playing the call quite loudly. I felt very put off - almost violated - because I'd driven over an hour with hopes of seeing this bird. No luck, although some of us did see a Winter Wren on our walk back. This experience reinforced that i don't want to use recordings when birding. I have a similar aversion to rare birds visiting home feeders -- great for them, but I will stay at the road's edge. I will pish in dense forest, and will attempt to mimic some calls (I've had some great cross-valley conversations with Barred Owls), but I prefer to listen; now at least i'm more keyed-in to the sounds of birds mobbing an owl, so I can zero in on the potential target. I find Merlin to be a great way of quickly sifting thru the songs and calls of a target bird, to see if I might have the species I want.
I never play calls in a populated area. I use them less and less. When I do, is not a song. Only a contact "chik" call for a few seconds to see if there is a response. Never more than a few seconds. I do find it funny that you cannot play calls in a National Park, yet I can disturb the entire forest with a Screech Owl whistle. Makes no sense.
I have a friend who is a US Fish & Wildlife warden. He always reminds everybody about the rule...and then smiles when he says "you can pish, though." I find pishing is more of a disturbance, but rules are rules.
One unfortunate consequence of the increased interest in birding as a hobby or pastime is the over objectivefication of birds. They become "tics & pics", low grade trophies. I advocate to rarely, if ever, use attractants. Respect the birds as living things that generally don't need or want us in their lives.
@@Bob_DuchesneAbsolutely! Be as quiet & unobtrusive as possible. You will be rewarded. Also, I'm not convinced that the increase in "birding" has brought a significant increase in conservation advocacy.
in this electronic age it is too easy to play bird songs Once I was playing a cd of bird songs in my motorhome with the windows slid open I attracted a male cardinal then when the wild turkey call came on a big gobbler came up the trail. this could have implications with immoral hunters, and what about drones with cameras ?
I'm not judging other folks, I can only express my own thoughts and actions. I will never use an audio recording to lure birds. I would never pay a business that would do it. That's just me and my conscious. I don't hate on others that may do it. I just wouldn't get any joy from it. "The tragedy of the commons is a metaphoric label for a concept that is widely discussed, and criticised, in economics, ecology and other sciences. According to the concept, should a number of people enjoy unfettered access to a finite, valuable resource such as a pasture, they will tend to over-use it, and may end up destroying its value altogether. Even if some users exercised voluntary restraint, the other users would merely supplant them, the predictable result being a tragedy for all."
Thank you so much for your input……the only playback I ever have done….is for the northern cardinal. I have a few in the area……and notice when I play certain calls…..the male….& …sometimes female will show up. I have never absolutely OVERDONE IT………but……it just came to mind…..is it BAD…..or….is it not. Your video has absolutely enlightened me. Glad I know…..LET THE BIRD WIN…….. awesome……also…..don’t draw in the female.! Thanks for your love for the species……#RESPECT. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Thank you, Bob, for your "rules" for using recorded bird calls. It's so easy to use the power of the recorded calls to the detriment of the birds, we all need to be thinking about setting up some kind of rules, so discussions like this are very important. Especially since you base most of your rules on bird behavior.
Since the Merlin Sound ID and Birdnet have been introduced, I rarely use any call back. I never use a call during nesting season, May through to September.
It always drove me crazy when I would see people lecture people on why not to play audio playback for specific migrating birds, but I would see the same people playing Eastern Screech Owl calls on repeat for like 20 minutes that would just completely freak out the whole "lot" of birds. I am happy one of your rules were to not play predator calls. Great video by the way!
What an eloquently done summary of the contradictions of birding and some excellent rules to follow. I agree with the concept that caring is much more important than eliminating any and all disturbance. Thank you for putting this together and encouraging important discussions in the community!
A guide in Arizona told me that his clients typically pay thousands for a serious birding trip and are expecting him to produce life birds for all. “What am I supposed to do?” He asked, “tell them my morals prevent from using playback?”. “I’d be out of business in no time”, he added. I wonder if using your suggestions would be a sustainable business model. Don’t get me wrong. I use it judiciously, as you say, but I’m not birding for a living. There will be as many opinions on this subject as there are birders. Good topic, Bob. Keep stirring the pot!
Yup. In fact, I'm planning a birding trip to Arizona next year looking for all those same life birds. I'm expecting to leave my MP3 player behind. I may miss a few lifers, but I guess I'll just have to go back again. LOL
I wonder which is more deleterious to birds, burning the fossil fuels for air travel on a birding trip or using playback? We can SEE the birds we influence with playback but don't see what the other activity leads to for birds we don't come near.
@@markstevenson6635 You can all rationalize your behavior however you want. LOL Sounds to me like you should not be taking that air travel if you think it's so dangerous. The reality is you don't care as much as saying you saw them.
Thank you! This has been a discussion amongst birders in my Manitoba community and I'm linking your video on our websites.
And, FYI...I LOVE birding Manitoba. Done it several times and can't get enough.
I agree not to use calls to locate or confuse.
Thank you for your informing videos! I’ve been watching them for a couple weeks now. I’m an avid birder from NC. I’ve been into birds ever since I was little. Your videos make me want to come up to Maine and go birding!
Hi Bob, thanks for another thought providing video. General we don't tape here in the UK and our birds don't tend to respond to pishing.
Really good topic! We try not to use the call. We do the psst for several of the birds and use Merlin for the rest.
Our first Puffin tour with Stephen and Tricia got canceled due to rough seas. We went back a month later, had a great trip saw tons of puffin and seals. Had a great time. Going to make it a yearly trip
Thank you Bob! Great nuanced discussion of a difficult and controversial topic. I think your rules cover all the bases very well.
I found this video very helpful. Thanks!
You presented a very nuanced discussion on an important topic. Great video!
Birds disturbed by other birds invading their territory is an everyday event, but don't overdo playback. That applies to professional or amateur birders.
Great video Bob! Love this discussion.
After finding this channel, I've been looking into local endangered and extinct species. It's a problem of which we're all aware (minus people who willfully deny humanity's impact on the planet) in the abstract, but it's easy to overlook just how close to home such ecological devastation can occur. I was pretty stunned to see that over the past several years, for every three avian species removed from the endangered species list in my area due to no longer being threatened, one was removed for going extinct.
And arguably we should care *more* about the local impact than on what's happening elsewhere, because what happens near us is what we can actually prevent and fix by voting.
So thanks for this honest and introspective analysis, and know that you are indeed helping people to care about local birds.
Great. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
Great video Bob.
I’ve always thought just don’t overdo it and be a jerk with it. It has its place at times and is a great tool.
Like it or not we all have impacts on birds and wildlife. The amount of birds, snakes, frogs, etc hit by cars is untold. People letting their cats out probably does more damage than playing back Merlin.
Good thoughts to follow 👍👍
Fantastic video Bob... FYI we've just had a couple of Magnolia Warbler turn up here in the UK caused quite a stir. Playback is generally frowned upon here in the UK but like you say, it does have a time and a place....
And I heard you had Canada warblers, too. This has been a crazy year.
Yeah crazy and I was just 15min away when it got reported, happy days. 1st for Britain.@@Bob_Duchesne
Only the 1 bird though.@@Bob_Duchesne
I rarely play a tape. But after listening to your really good comments, I plan to do it even less. Thanks Bob.
Yeah, I've been thinking about it for a long time. And I don't just watch birds. I watch birders, which can be equally fascinating.
Great video. As a bird photographer, I haven't used playback an awful lot, mainly because I'm concerned about causing too much of a disturbance. There's a ton of useful insight that will help my own ethics evolve in this regard. For instance - if I take a really great photo of a bird using playback, does sharing it with an audience who hasn't seen it negate any negative effect on the bird? Especially if you provide some context about any challenges that particular species has to overcome? Assuming you're not leading a bird away from a nest, or not "letting the bird win" as well? Plenty for me to think about here. Oh, and chickadee cacophony would be a great band name!
Thanks! It's a tough topic. Furthermore, I don't think it's well enough studied. Every bird reacts differently. Some are bothered, most aren't - at least not more than minor inconvenience. I think the most important thing to do is watch their behavior and stay cautious.
I have been using audio minimally over the years to get a visual confirmation of the bird that I'm seeing for a bird count. My eyesight has not been the best as I get older and I am not great with binoculars. I don't want to disturb the birds so I just make a quick check for my checklist and I don't go any further. worm-eating warbler always will respond with a dive by lol . I do think the chickadees, catbirds, and house inches enjoy the company. Oh and the ethereal and beautiful call of white-throated Sparrow almost always gets a response. I think it is okay to do if done responsibly and without greatly disturbing the bird populations.❤🙏. We are losing too many birds and they need to be documented, respectfully. Great video.
Great video....very interesting ...i use audio also...great tips...ill be using your tips for sure...thanks..
Its not talked about much but my main use of playback in the field is to confirm the call of a bird ive just heard but couldn't confidently ID. Usually the case with Pipits and Finches/Buntings as they tend to have similar calls and flight calls. Ill play it quietly up to my ear to confirm it.
Absolutely. It's a big reason I keep the Sibley app on my phone.
I have 52 weeks out of the year. I just stay out of bird areas during the first 6 weeks of spring. After nesting season there will be many more birds to see or hear.
I just listened to MPR's today Maine Calling with Bob and Maine Audubon's naturalist (not an easy show to get through to live).
Caller from St Andrews, NB brought up the burden of fossil fuel consumption to the panel as it relates to birding. The panel acknowledged the relationship but missed the opportunity to elaborate on ways to mitigate the problem if one is so motivated. I don't make my livelihood as a guide as they do, so it's easier for me to make birding location decisions that limit my travel to one or two local spots. I may twitch on a species once or twice a year, and if I go on an out of state birding adventure I try to arrange for fewer and longer stays to minimize travel. Just offering this for those like-minded, and to solicit for any other strategies that help this concern.
Great video😊
I agree with this thoughtful dive into the issues about playback. For some people it's anathema, and others have no guardrails at all.
Another ethical dilemma for birders may be twitching and unlimited travel contributing to atmospheric CO2 accumulation. As stated early in Bob's video it rests with the individual to make their own decisions based on ethics. In recent years I have consciously limited my fossil fueled travel for birding to a portion of my prior trips, both local and remote. It boils down to what any individual feels comfortable with in terms of personal responsibility.
Thanks for this great conversation, Bob.
A year or two ago, there were reports of an EASO near a popular rail trail. When I arrived, I was excited because I could hear the owl singing and also the mobbing reaction of the BCCH, TUTI, and others. As I turned a bend in the trail, there was a group of about a dozen folks with binocs, and one person playing the call quite loudly. I felt very put off - almost violated - because I'd driven over an hour with hopes of seeing this bird. No luck, although some of us did see a Winter Wren on our walk back. This experience reinforced that i don't want to use recordings when birding. I have a similar aversion to rare birds visiting home feeders -- great for them, but I will stay at the road's edge.
I will pish in dense forest, and will attempt to mimic some calls (I've had some great cross-valley conversations with Barred Owls), but I prefer to listen; now at least i'm more keyed-in to the sounds of birds mobbing an owl, so I can zero in on the potential target. I find Merlin to be a great way of quickly sifting thru the songs and calls of a target bird, to see if I might have the species I want.
It is a violation of the Endangered Species Act to use it on species listed as Endangered or Threatened under the Act. It's considered "take".
Good
This is an awesomely informative video that I will certainly share with many new birders I know.
Thanks. I've been thinking about it for a long time. I've been watching behavior closely for years. It's been informative, to say the least.
@@Bob_Duchesne Behaviour of birds or birders? Or both 😆
I never play calls in a populated area. I use them less and less. When I do, is not a song. Only a contact "chik" call for a few seconds to see if there is a response. Never more than a few seconds. I do find it funny that you cannot play calls in a National Park, yet I can disturb the entire forest with a Screech Owl whistle. Makes no sense.
I have a friend who is a US Fish & Wildlife warden. He always reminds everybody about the rule...and then smiles when he says "you can pish, though." I find pishing is more of a disturbance, but rules are rules.
One unfortunate consequence of the increased interest in birding as a hobby or pastime is the over objectivefication of birds. They become "tics & pics", low grade trophies. I advocate to rarely, if ever, use attractants. Respect the birds as living things that generally don't need or want us in their lives.
Furthermore, if not harassed, birds will show a lot of fascinating behaviors that are fun to watch.
@@Bob_DuchesneAbsolutely! Be as quiet & unobtrusive as possible. You will be rewarded.
Also, I'm not convinced that the increase in "birding" has brought a significant increase in conservation advocacy.
in this electronic age it is too easy to play bird songs Once I was playing a cd of bird songs in my motorhome with the windows slid open I attracted a male cardinal then when the wild turkey call came on a big gobbler came up the trail. this could have implications with immoral hunters, and what about drones with cameras ?
I'm not judging other folks, I can only express my own thoughts and actions. I will never use an audio recording to lure birds. I would never pay a business that would do it. That's just me and my conscious. I don't hate on others that may do it. I just wouldn't get any joy from it. "The tragedy of the commons is a metaphoric label for a concept that is widely discussed, and criticised, in economics, ecology and other sciences. According to the concept, should a number of people enjoy unfettered access to a finite, valuable resource such as a pasture, they will tend to over-use it, and may end up destroying its value altogether. Even if some users exercised voluntary restraint, the other users would merely supplant them, the predictable result being a tragedy for all."
Thank you so much for your input……the only playback I ever have done….is for the northern cardinal. I have a few in the area……and notice when I play certain calls…..the male….& …sometimes female will show up. I have never absolutely OVERDONE IT………but……it just came to mind…..is it BAD…..or….is it not. Your video has absolutely enlightened me. Glad I know…..LET THE BIRD WIN…….. awesome……also…..don’t draw in the female.! Thanks for your love for the species……#RESPECT. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
don't guide tours when birds are nesting where they are nesting