I've read some AMAZING fanfics with internal conflict that I could rant about for days on end. (By the name of the series "Chronicles of a Hounded Heart" and "i can be the one you call") I don't read that many traditional books now and movies are hit or miss for me... but don't knock the fanfics. These two series are legit in storytelling and angsty goodness AND just weaving a bunch of different characters into one cohesive plot.
Jinx from Arcane is fascinating. Witnessing both sides of her clash with each other internally, while also seeing it portrayed externally through the story's amazing writing is out of this world
Since learning about internal conflict I have started making it complicated to a fault and I kinda love it. People are complicated and sometimes those layers need to be peeled back until we find something deeper and when we do that is gold.
I’m in the process of re-writing my book, to include delicious internal conflict. My character’s misbelief is that, he disappointed his father breaking his heart. What a beautiful difference. So good!
Kate and Abbie I just want to say thank you. This is something I have been struggling with and I just couldn't understand on how to write internal conflict. This will help so much thank you.
Love this; the idea of sitting your character down at therapy and asking them all the hard questions gave me a cute chuckle LOL but that's actually so helpful! I'm currently in the character-building stages right now and while I've written in self-conflict in the form of misbelief and fear, I realized I was lacking a specific goal for the main character so far. It's time to backtrack and make sure I have that missing piece. Thank you!!
You're starting to repeat yourself - so I have to do the same. Again, there are *other forms of internal conflict than desire vs. fear.* Most notably, desire vs. duty. And that duty might *not* be based in a misbelief. You cannot "crush" a responsibility like you can crush a misbelief - you can only abandon your responsibility, and there will be a trade-off, a cost to it. Second, there are characters with a flat arc, who instead transform everyone around them: Paragons. This applies to a lot of superheroes and fantasy heroes, and therefore to many of the most successful stories out there. As long as your recipe cannot account for the success of those stories, your recipe is in need of expansion. Internal conflict is a vital component, if not the most important one, yes, I agree with you on that. The problem is just that your definition of internal conflict is too specific and reductive.
You know, I'm actually seeing what you're really trying to say here, and I think your point can help me at this very moment. Long reply here, so please bear with me. 😅 You see, there's a story I'm currently writing which has a main character that seems to have his internal conflict fall in line more with the "desire vs. duty" concept, and as this internal conflict pushes his character arc forward, it later develops in him a misbelief he thought he never had, which then creates a new sense of fear he now has to wrestle against (now falling in line with the standard "desire vs. fear" internal conflict method). And all of that culminated in the story's game-changing midpoint when his huge mistake (due to pursuing a flawed desire swayed by a flawed sense of thinking believing that was his duty) finally crystalizes this big fear in him and it grips him, controlling his every decision moving forward, when he firmly believes he has failed to do his duty the right way because his mistake harmed his friends and family (i.e. the misbelief). I know what I have here is mind-bogglingly complicated... and yet I have to develop this one because this story requires this character to have this much nuance in order to make his character arc function as intended. One may read this and realize it was all just "desire vs. fear" with this main character all along, but his misbelief and fear (that matters in the present story) has not become the internal driving force of his character arc until the midpoint of this story. And sure, this character does have a backstory that resulted in him growing up with a misbelief and fear, but that first led him to have this flawed desire in the story's hook, which later endangers his sense of right and wrong in the present story, leading him to untimately fail in his duty by the midpoint (after I temporarily gave him a false sense of success; the midpoint's plot-twist). And then off he goes towards the 3rd Act running away from his fear (his friends and family) because he falsely believes his failure has now defined his career and his whole life, burdened with shame and guilt (i.e. the present misbelief finally impacting him now, which it grew from his past misbelief that first led him to have the false desire). Your comment made me finally see what made this main character so difficult to analyze by comparison to the other main character that's in this same story I'm currently writing (which he has the standard "desire vs. fear" internal conflict method from the start, and this guy's "aha!" moment later on will come to help this other complicated main character have his own "aha!" moment too in order to save the day). I'm gonna use your "desire vs. duty" tip and see where this takes me as I will soon begin to write the story after the midpoint has taken place, while also applying the "desire vs. fear" method from Abbie and her sister here. 🙂
@@BuizelCream Glad I could help! 😀 I’d actually argue that the “desire vs. duty” conflict is much more *common* - perhaps, *that’s* actually the “standard” internal conflict. Especially in classical dramas, like Goethe’s “Iphigenia on Tauris”. But also, most “forbidden love” stories fall into this domain, including some of the “British Royalty” stories that Abbie herself seems to enjoy so much: Characters in arranged marriages have a romantic love interest, but also don’t want to abandon or “betray” their family by running away with that romantic love interest. Take Rose in Titanic, for example: Here desire is to be with Jack, her duty is to be with Cal. Being with Jack would mean a life in poverty - which isn’t just a personal fear of hers, but would also backfire on the rest of her family. Perhaps Abbie and Kate just grew up in a too liberal society to appreciate that 😁? A lot of societies are more restrictive, both historically and in the present. A children’s story with a “desire vs. duty” conflict is the first Lego: Bionicle movie “Mask of Light”. The plot is essentially The Lord of the Rings with robots. However, the theme is closer to Spider-Man, since it’s about the link between heroism and responsibility. Takua neglects his duty (which is one of the story’s “three virtues”, and therefore emphasised repeatedly), which is being the herald of the hero everyone is waiting for. He runs away from his responsibility, which is based in his misbelief: That he’s not important in the grand scheme of things. In one scene, his best friend Jaller asks Takua, who is the chronicler of the island, what’s his own story. Takua expresses his misbelief by claiming he didn’t have any story of his own. The disaster plot point happens when Takua is scared by the antagonist into abandoning his friend: After running away from his responsibility to Jaller, the antagonist’s minions follow him to the nearest village and destroy it. Thus, Takua sees that him running away from his duty led to the destruction of this village - which also means his actions do have real consequences (positive and negative). Thus, his misbelief is disproven. He joins the fight against the antagonist’s minions, allowing the villagers to escape. Then, he catches up to his friend Jaller, now having accepted his role as the herald… and from here, I don’t want to spoil the final twist. Again, much like in your case, this “duty” could be reinterpreted as a “fear”: That Takua runs away from his responsibility, merely because he were afraid. But he’s not afraid of doing dangerous things: The film introduces Takua while he jumps across a stream of lava to investigate a totem with ancient runes. So he is more than ready to risk his life in pursuit of a great story - he just doesn’t believe he could ever have a great story of his own. “Mask of Light” is thus a great example to show that the “desire vs. duty” conflict, just like the “desire vs. fear” conflict, *can* indeed be based in a misbelief - but neither of them *has to be.* Going back to Titanic, the negative consequences of Rose being with Jack, for both herself and her family, are very real. The duty will be a stronger obstacle to the protagonist the more rational arguments can be made in favour of fulfilling the duty - and/or the higher the stakes of abandoning the duty. In such cases, there are no correct “answers” - only choices. No matter which choice the character makes (Abbie’s “Impossible Choice”), there *will* be a trade-off. Such stories can also come off as less “preachy” to the audience. A character “crushing their misbelief and discovering a truth” presupposes that there is one correct way to act in this given situation. With desire vs. duty conflicts, there often isn’t: It can be a lose-lose situation (as Abbie would put it, “pain vs. pain”). What’s important is to make transparent to the reader why the character decides one way or another.
@@cosmicprison9819 This is really interesting. As if you're bringing up the option of whenever I have a misbelief figured out, I can choose either "fear" or "duty" to be the driving force of the character when they pursue a goal based on it. It's like a tool to diversify my writing craft. I will definitely use it for the story I'm writing. Thanks! 😁 This definitely brought out something to light as to why this character I'm writing is so mind-boggling to analyze within this one method (which worked no problem with my other main character; there are 2 main characters you see x3). I wish I can find ways to apply the internal conflict element without having to tie it to a misbelief, which links to the story's truth, hence the theme? Sounds like a tool to write a story with multiple themes in it, which makes it less "preachy"? I guess that will be for another writing project in a different time. 🙂
@@BuizelCream Yes, avoiding preachiness is definitely a top priority - especially nowadays. Some audiences have become sceptical about the very idea of a story having a message at all. Which is ironic, because they will usually say “stop preaching your message; just write a good story!” Not realising that most good stories do indeed have messages. 😂 What they probably mean is that we’ve been so conditioned by “preachy” stories that a lot of us only detect a story’s message if it’s forced upon us via telling, rather than showing. A lot of competently told stories, including 100 Days of Sunlight, could have very preachy messages if you spelled them out explicitly (as 100 Days of Sunlight “sadly” does, at least in a light dose, on the front cover). And alternative to that is to play with themes, rather than with one specific message. You could place your characters on different ends of a spectrum of opinion and have them clash within your story, without necessarily taking one side. What I find disappointing with this approach, though, is when authors raise a bunch of big questions, and then are either too lazy, too superficial, or too afraid to even try and answer any of them. That’s like a student who raises their hand in class, and then blabs on and on about something, without ever getting to the point, or without the audience even being able to try and infer what the student wanted to say. You can avoid preachiness by avoiding a clear answer - but instead, the story can come off as pretentious, trying to pass itself off as very important, without really contributing much to the debate. The video game NieR: Automata is a particularly egregious example of this: Raise a bunch of big fundamental questions, make allusions to a bunch of philosophers, hit the audience over the head with tragedy upon tragedy that the story doesn’t really bother to earn and make believable - then pull a non-sequitur happy ending, with one of the surviving characters literally saying: “Perhaps we now understand that not everything needs to have an answer.” Great - why did this story just waste my time for 40 to 60 hours then? The optimal trade-off between the two approaches is probably to play with themes in a debate manner “somewhat closer to the surface” (still, the themes shouldn’t be patently obvious); and then have the message be more subtle further beneath that. I have characters with different viewpoints clash again and again over the course of a trilogy, and not everyone with the “wrong” stance ends up being punished for it. Conversely, not everyone with the “right” stance has an easy time (because that would be a Mary Sue, which is often created out of a Paragon, i.e., a character who already has the “right ideals”). Then, over the course of the story, you can slowly start taking a stand on the issue yourself - usually through your protagonist’s transformation, and/or by showing how the villain is faring (or other side characters) for holding on to what you consider the worse stance in comparison. It is only at the very end of the trilogy that my protagonist will “hit the reader over the head with the message”, by becoming at last firm in her newly found convictions. Of course, preferrably not through a preachy monologue (looking at you, Terry Goodkind), because that would be telling. But rather, as always, through the decision she makes at the end, i.e., through her actions (showing). Still, that doesn’t mean this protagonist has convinced everyone around herself of her new worldview - it’s just her personal conclusion at the end of the story. Thus, ultimately it will still remain up to the readers to decide if they agree with the protagonist’s conclusion or not.
@@cosmicprison9819 All this discussion is making me curious on where the story I'm writing stands in all of this so far. 🤔 I definitely try my best to not be tell-y that my story's theme doesn't come off as preachy, but I've had my beta readers in this project pointed out to me before that I started off with a huge clarity issue in my earlier drafts because I was doing all I can to refuse stating anything clearly (as if leaving things too implicit or too open for interpretation was clever writing, expecting readers to readily have the most intuitive of minds that can effectively piece all the clues together). Since then, with the help of online research and writing resources, as well as reputable peoples in the Authortube community, I decided to supplement my showing with good telling, so that important themes are being unpacked and explored on the page. I let my narrative reveal my character's goals, fears, emotions; such as how they mentally process before they reach to a decision (depending if I as the author decide to reveal that information to the reader in its respective time). I also allow my characters to state their wants and needs in their dialogue, opening up doors for vulnerable conversations to make genuine connections and chemistry as it moves the story forward, making the concepts evolve, change and complicate clearly on the page. I guess the problem with what's happening with many stories is that they state the theme's overarching message or lesson, such as in dialogue, that doesn't really merit the cause of why it was stated in the first place, other than the writer thinking it's time to state the lesson clearly to avoid confusion (or to remove potential for critical thinking and speculation fearing that audiences might miss the point after they consume the material). I still have to finish drafting the midpoint from here, soon heading into the 3rd Act, but I like the way you state how you'd communicate your themes to the readers. It doesn't need or have to be blatantly obvious. It could just be a layer of it or more being spread around, and it's up to the readers to piece those together, the final thing, and decide for themselves if it is their lesson they should learn. As I learned from my clarity issues, I still want my story to have its message being shown through the character's actions, but be supplemented by good telling. With where the story's ending is heading towards, I imagine them openly reflecting their journey to each other on the page to increase their understanding of one another, thus strengthening their friendship dynamic during the resolution. I believe this might remove the risk of monologuing the lesson or the message to the audience because it is not being told at them. I dunno how the readers will take this ending, but if they are emotionally invested or not, it is not their story, but it's the characters thag they are cheering for. With what the characters have learned, I want that to be the substantial thing being left behind for the readers to take away with them. 🤔
Yessss love internal conflict! Can I request a podcast topic? I’m starting my developmental edit on my first draft and I want to know the specific differences between developmental edits and line edits, and what I should look for (and what I should ignore) in each. Love ya guys :)
I didn't put my character on the couch, but I did make him sit down and talk to me. Lol It was honestly super helpful! I discovered what he really wants and from there I'm weaving around to discover WHY, but I think I just realized his misbelief while watching this video! Thanks for the great insight! Love your show. Love how you break things down so simply. 😊
Yes! And although I think most of us write our first book based on ourselves and what defined our lives, this is great practice for writing (truly, not in name only, lol) imaginary characters! Because even when writing ourselves, we would still need to ask ourselves exactly what we really wanted, and what we feared (before our passion and character arc obliterated that fear, if not yet the misbelief)!
What I have learned about myself as a writer is I get bored if while outlining I need to figure out a character's subplot or backstory and I'm just sitting at my laptop or with a notebook. It makes me feel like I'm doing nothing and being unproductive with time I could be doing morew with. But I also like to take walks in the evenings around my house, and I'm always happy to just think while I'm walking because I'm also doing other things, so while walking I've compleatly fleshed out backstories, subplots, chapters, entire basic novel ideas. I get to see things and be outside, but I also get to work on my novel while not just being at my desk staring at a screen.
It’s great that you have discovered what works for you and that you are leaning into it. I’m still trying to find my individual writing process by trying different things. Some things are clicking but I’m still looking to fill in some blanks.
I know this is an old comment but I recently started creating a story and I do exactly the same thing! Long walks around where I live with at most soft music in my ears where I consciously think about my story and what I want to do with it. It puts me in a sort of meditative but goal driven state that I really need to be creative
I honestly love Abbie's "internal conflict is why it matters" so much. It's the perfect distillation of the driving force of stories-if the external conflict (aka antagonistic force) did not make it difficult for the protagonist to get what they wanted, and the protagonist didn't sweat and struggle, the story would be terribly bland.
Side note on the Enneagram - each type is either part of the Fear, Shame, or Anger triad, which is just their kneejerk response to stress. Super useful! To know a type 4 (think Hamlet, think Jo from Little Women, expressive, strives for uniqueness, compares themselves to others) - the Type 4 is a shame type. Which means, when they're stressed, they get embarrassed. Very useful tool!
OK girls I have a question: how is it that you two young girls have so much wisdom and insight into the human mindset? I think it’s awesome and I give you high respect. I appreciate your show a lot thank you. This is from an old lady 83 years of age and starting to write Kara’s a lot of stuff that I’ve learned but it took me a lot more years past where you are to begin to understand.
Hey Kate and Abbie! Writing life has been awesome lately. Taking a break from the novel I was working on. Right now I’m owning my skills in a Fan Fiction that I’ve had brewing inside me for some time. Finally I’m writing it and it’s coming out awesome. I’m so much more competent as a writer now, things have clicked and I’m smooth sailing. If anyone here likes Sailor Moon, in particularly the Outer Senshi, than you are in for a treat cause it’s epic!
I haven't watched this yet, I just wanted to say, I HAVE seen several of your other videos, and am about to embark on the journey that is dismanteling the pages and pages of manuscript I have written and looking at it all with eyes that have learned much. I'm looking at my protagonists character sheet and am just looking at the Internal Conflict, and have written in and then deleted several lines. I just got the notification for this, and it's like you were watching and waiting for the moment when I would need this the most. Perfect timing! Thank you in advance!
Yes! Lo e the way you put that! Isn't that how it usually works? As soon as you ask the question, the answer begins to form and come your way, thank God! (Well, some answers take longer to come (or be acknowledged?) than others. I'm a writer living in Africa with a very busy husband, lol, and this morning, I'm binge-watching two of my favorite writing inspirations on UA-cam: Abbie and Kate! By the way, your user name is super cool!
@@brandic89 Thank you for the compliment. I've been using this name for many years on many platforms lol. A song called Breña by the band A Perfect Circle.
@MoonlitBrenya Cool! That is a beautiful song! My real name actually sounds closer to Brenya, but I always liked the name Brandi, lol. I've found that only God (Allah, Yahweh, Dieu, etc. depending on the language) can heal and protect, even when we have the most wonderful people somewhere in our lives, but I'm interested in exploring paranormal events that would come under the heading "fantasy," especially since I've experienced a few, just for curiosity's sake.
I think that this conversation finally helped me see why my villains and heroes fail to capture attention: not enough internal conflict. Why would a villain want to capture innocent people, and why would he want to kill somebody? In my story's case, it's him blaming others for his circumstances. He believes that he must perform procedures and experiments that are "unpleasant" for the greater good. He believes that he wouldn't have to, if the majority of people had chosen a different path in life. Thank you! If I'm on the correct track for internal conflict, then please let me know! 🙂
Hi Katie and Abbie thanks for explaining the dived and connection between, fear and misbelief. Up until now I had unconsciously allowed the two concepts to morph. Thankfully from now on I will be able to relate better with my characters. 🙏🙏
I've been meandering through a short story of my own in my spare time, and I'm familiar with the ideas of misbeliefs and goals as I've been paying attention to your work for a while. But I was listening to this in the background just now while doing other things and my MC's misbeliefs and goals magically sprung to my mind (I hadn't directly acknowledged them as such already) and now that I see them clearly, they perfectly match and deepen my story's thematic threads, meaning I can lean into them more consciously. Thanks!
Great tutorial, ladies! After years of writing I’m teaching a new writer about storytelling and realized that I’ve been missing Central Conflict in my stories 😮 Don’t know how I’ve gotten so much done without paying attention to it. Your analysis of Internal Conflict dovetails perfectly with it. I will be including it in my writing and teaching going forward. Thanks so much! Can’t wait to learn more from you guys 😀
Great timing- I'm about to start working on my next book and while I have a solid plot, I've been missing a compelling internal conflict for the main character. (this is book 4 of a series so we've already worked through some of the easier character arcs) Was inspired by your conversation and jotted down a couple of pages of ideas. Will also check out Abbie's workshop.
How do I like a video more than once? 😂🤣 But seriously, this helped me SO MUCH!! I’ve been recently brainstorming a new story, and this helped me get to know my new characters!! 😊
The main genre of my story is action. But my MC is a male antagonist, which makes my story more of a horror genre when it's based on my MC's perception. How can I make my MC's internal conflict stick to my story's main genre: action?
I love all of Abbie’s videos so much I listen to them like music on repeat. I have always done some of the suggestions both sisters mentioned in this podcast. One reason I prefer GOT to the new series House of the Dragon is character development. I simply don’t care about the spinoff’s characters and can stop watching the show at anytime. The charters drive the plot, I know there objectives but I can’t connect to them emotionally like the characters in GOT. There’s no Tyrion or Starks to pull me to the story😔
Sidenote, but I'm very glad you ditched the headsets -- I don't know what good they did -- and big on-screen mics. It improves the show quite a bit - it looks like a video, instead of a podcast you happened to shoot -- and I think the sound quality is still great. Plus, I bet you're both just a lot more comfortable -- I used to have to wear big headphones back in college radio days, and man, I hated them. (The content is great as always, thanks.)
I'm doing a television series and novel about a high school cheerleader who's leading a double life as a spy. She thinks she can defend herself if she had gun and she asks her math teacher who's also her bodyguard. She tells her "When I think you're ready" and then gives her a speech I call a "This is not" speech. Then she lists all the reasons why.
Watching this makes me realize I may be in over my head. I have a character who has a false believe in her world to make a commentary on where our world is headed. Another false belief in another character will become a truth when that character becomes an ally. 😬
it's 32 minutes for 2 points of a 5 point concept. duty, need and expectation are missing. just like my comment saying this which got deleted. did i say something untrue? or something too true? doesn't change the facts... literally takes 5 seconds to google btw.
ok guys, BEST INTERNAL CONFLICT YOU'VE EVER SEEN IN A STORY. GO.
I've read some AMAZING fanfics with internal conflict that I could rant about for days on end. (By the name of the series "Chronicles of a Hounded Heart" and "i can be the one you call") I don't read that many traditional books now and movies are hit or miss for me... but don't knock the fanfics. These two series are legit in storytelling and angsty goodness AND just weaving a bunch of different characters into one cohesive plot.
*screams* PRINCE ZUKO FROM AVATAR THE LAST AIRBENDER
Everyone in Six Of Crows!!
Jinx from Arcane is fascinating. Witnessing both sides of her clash with each other internally, while also seeing it portrayed externally through the story's amazing writing is out of this world
Legend by Marie Lu!! Oh man, such good conflict from both main characters and they’re conflicts create such a dynamic between the two of them
“On the edge of my sheet” is when you’re reading in bed and it’s so suspenseful you can’t fall asleep until you know what happens.
Since learning about internal conflict I have started making it complicated to a fault and I kinda love it. People are complicated and sometimes those layers need to be peeled back until we find something deeper and when we do that is gold.
I’m in the process of re-writing my book, to include delicious internal conflict. My character’s misbelief is that, he disappointed his father breaking his heart. What a beautiful difference. So good!
Edmunds misbelief: turkish delight will make me happy.
his desire: turkish delight
Fear: that he will not get any turkish delight.
Kate and Abbie I just want to say thank you. This is something I have been struggling with and I just couldn't understand on how to write internal conflict. This will help so much thank you.
Yay!! I am so glad this episode and topic are here for you at just the right time! 🙏We are cheering you on in your writing journey friend
Love this; the idea of sitting your character down at therapy and asking them all the hard questions gave me a cute chuckle LOL but that's actually so helpful! I'm currently in the character-building stages right now and while I've written in self-conflict in the form of misbelief and fear, I realized I was lacking a specific goal for the main character so far. It's time to backtrack and make sure I have that missing piece. Thank you!!
You're starting to repeat yourself - so I have to do the same. Again, there are *other forms of internal conflict than desire vs. fear.* Most notably, desire vs. duty. And that duty might *not* be based in a misbelief. You cannot "crush" a responsibility like you can crush a misbelief - you can only abandon your responsibility, and there will be a trade-off, a cost to it.
Second, there are characters with a flat arc, who instead transform everyone around them: Paragons. This applies to a lot of superheroes and fantasy heroes, and therefore to many of the most successful stories out there.
As long as your recipe cannot account for the success of those stories, your recipe is in need of expansion. Internal conflict is a vital component, if not the most important one, yes, I agree with you on that. The problem is just that your definition of internal conflict is too specific and reductive.
You know, I'm actually seeing what you're really trying to say here, and I think your point can help me at this very moment. Long reply here, so please bear with me. 😅
You see, there's a story I'm currently writing which has a main character that seems to have his internal conflict fall in line more with the "desire vs. duty" concept, and as this internal conflict pushes his character arc forward, it later develops in him a misbelief he thought he never had, which then creates a new sense of fear he now has to wrestle against (now falling in line with the standard "desire vs. fear" internal conflict method). And all of that culminated in the story's game-changing midpoint when his huge mistake (due to pursuing a flawed desire swayed by a flawed sense of thinking believing that was his duty) finally crystalizes this big fear in him and it grips him, controlling his every decision moving forward, when he firmly believes he has failed to do his duty the right way because his mistake harmed his friends and family (i.e. the misbelief).
I know what I have here is mind-bogglingly complicated... and yet I have to develop this one because this story requires this character to have this much nuance in order to make his character arc function as intended.
One may read this and realize it was all just "desire vs. fear" with this main character all along, but his misbelief and fear (that matters in the present story) has not become the internal driving force of his character arc until the midpoint of this story.
And sure, this character does have a backstory that resulted in him growing up with a misbelief and fear, but that first led him to have this flawed desire in the story's hook, which later endangers his sense of right and wrong in the present story, leading him to untimately fail in his duty by the midpoint (after I temporarily gave him a false sense of success; the midpoint's plot-twist). And then off he goes towards the 3rd Act running away from his fear (his friends and family) because he falsely believes his failure has now defined his career and his whole life, burdened with shame and guilt (i.e. the present misbelief finally impacting him now, which it grew from his past misbelief that first led him to have the false desire).
Your comment made me finally see what made this main character so difficult to analyze by comparison to the other main character that's in this same story I'm currently writing (which he has the standard "desire vs. fear" internal conflict method from the start, and this guy's "aha!" moment later on will come to help this other complicated main character have his own "aha!" moment too in order to save the day).
I'm gonna use your "desire vs. duty" tip and see where this takes me as I will soon begin to write the story after the midpoint has taken place, while also applying the "desire vs. fear" method from Abbie and her sister here. 🙂
@@BuizelCream Glad I could help! 😀 I’d actually argue that the “desire vs. duty” conflict is much more *common* - perhaps, *that’s* actually the “standard” internal conflict. Especially in classical dramas, like Goethe’s “Iphigenia on Tauris”. But also, most “forbidden love” stories fall into this domain, including some of the “British Royalty” stories that Abbie herself seems to enjoy so much:
Characters in arranged marriages have a romantic love interest, but also don’t want to abandon or “betray” their family by running away with that romantic love interest. Take Rose in Titanic, for example: Here desire is to be with Jack, her duty is to be with Cal. Being with Jack would mean a life in poverty - which isn’t just a personal fear of hers, but would also backfire on the rest of her family.
Perhaps Abbie and Kate just grew up in a too liberal society to appreciate that 😁? A lot of societies are more restrictive, both historically and in the present.
A children’s story with a “desire vs. duty” conflict is the first Lego: Bionicle movie “Mask of Light”. The plot is essentially The Lord of the Rings with robots. However, the theme is closer to Spider-Man, since it’s about the link between heroism and responsibility. Takua neglects his duty (which is one of the story’s “three virtues”, and therefore emphasised repeatedly), which is being the herald of the hero everyone is waiting for. He runs away from his responsibility, which is based in his misbelief: That he’s not important in the grand scheme of things. In one scene, his best friend Jaller asks Takua, who is the chronicler of the island, what’s his own story. Takua expresses his misbelief by claiming he didn’t have any story of his own.
The disaster plot point happens when Takua is scared by the antagonist into abandoning his friend: After running away from his responsibility to Jaller, the antagonist’s minions follow him to the nearest village and destroy it. Thus, Takua sees that him running away from his duty led to the destruction of this village - which also means his actions do have real consequences (positive and negative). Thus, his misbelief is disproven. He joins the fight against the antagonist’s minions, allowing the villagers to escape. Then, he catches up to his friend Jaller, now having accepted his role as the herald… and from here, I don’t want to spoil the final twist.
Again, much like in your case, this “duty” could be reinterpreted as a “fear”: That Takua runs away from his responsibility, merely because he were afraid. But he’s not afraid of doing dangerous things: The film introduces Takua while he jumps across a stream of lava to investigate a totem with ancient runes. So he is more than ready to risk his life in pursuit of a great story - he just doesn’t believe he could ever have a great story of his own.
“Mask of Light” is thus a great example to show that the “desire vs. duty” conflict, just like the “desire vs. fear” conflict, *can* indeed be based in a misbelief - but neither of them *has to be.* Going back to Titanic, the negative consequences of Rose being with Jack, for both herself and her family, are very real. The duty will be a stronger obstacle to the protagonist the more rational arguments can be made in favour of fulfilling the duty - and/or the higher the stakes of abandoning the duty. In such cases, there are no correct “answers” - only choices. No matter which choice the character makes (Abbie’s “Impossible Choice”), there *will* be a trade-off.
Such stories can also come off as less “preachy” to the audience. A character “crushing their misbelief and discovering a truth” presupposes that there is one correct way to act in this given situation. With desire vs. duty conflicts, there often isn’t: It can be a lose-lose situation (as Abbie would put it, “pain vs. pain”). What’s important is to make transparent to the reader why the character decides one way or another.
@@cosmicprison9819 This is really interesting. As if you're bringing up the option of whenever I have a misbelief figured out, I can choose either "fear" or "duty" to be the driving force of the character when they pursue a goal based on it. It's like a tool to diversify my writing craft. I will definitely use it for the story I'm writing. Thanks! 😁
This definitely brought out something to light as to why this character I'm writing is so mind-boggling to analyze within this one method (which worked no problem with my other main character; there are 2 main characters you see x3).
I wish I can find ways to apply the internal conflict element without having to tie it to a misbelief, which links to the story's truth, hence the theme? Sounds like a tool to write a story with multiple themes in it, which makes it less "preachy"? I guess that will be for another writing project in a different time. 🙂
@@BuizelCream Yes, avoiding preachiness is definitely a top priority - especially nowadays. Some audiences have become sceptical about the very idea of a story having a message at all. Which is ironic, because they will usually say “stop preaching your message; just write a good story!” Not realising that most good stories do indeed have messages. 😂
What they probably mean is that we’ve been so conditioned by “preachy” stories that a lot of us only detect a story’s message if it’s forced upon us via telling, rather than showing. A lot of competently told stories, including 100 Days of Sunlight, could have very preachy messages if you spelled them out explicitly (as 100 Days of Sunlight “sadly” does, at least in a light dose, on the front cover).
And alternative to that is to play with themes, rather than with one specific message. You could place your characters on different ends of a spectrum of opinion and have them clash within your story, without necessarily taking one side. What I find disappointing with this approach, though, is when authors raise a bunch of big questions, and then are either too lazy, too superficial, or too afraid to even try and answer any of them. That’s like a student who raises their hand in class, and then blabs on and on about something, without ever getting to the point, or without the audience even being able to try and infer what the student wanted to say. You can avoid preachiness by avoiding a clear answer - but instead, the story can come off as pretentious, trying to pass itself off as very important, without really contributing much to the debate.
The video game NieR: Automata is a particularly egregious example of this: Raise a bunch of big fundamental questions, make allusions to a bunch of philosophers, hit the audience over the head with tragedy upon tragedy that the story doesn’t really bother to earn and make believable - then pull a non-sequitur happy ending, with one of the surviving characters literally saying: “Perhaps we now understand that not everything needs to have an answer.” Great - why did this story just waste my time for 40 to 60 hours then?
The optimal trade-off between the two approaches is probably to play with themes in a debate manner “somewhat closer to the surface” (still, the themes shouldn’t be patently obvious); and then have the message be more subtle further beneath that. I have characters with different viewpoints clash again and again over the course of a trilogy, and not everyone with the “wrong” stance ends up being punished for it. Conversely, not everyone with the “right” stance has an easy time (because that would be a Mary Sue, which is often created out of a Paragon, i.e., a character who already has the “right ideals”).
Then, over the course of the story, you can slowly start taking a stand on the issue yourself - usually through your protagonist’s transformation, and/or by showing how the villain is faring (or other side characters) for holding on to what you consider the worse stance in comparison.
It is only at the very end of the trilogy that my protagonist will “hit the reader over the head with the message”, by becoming at last firm in her newly found convictions. Of course, preferrably not through a preachy monologue (looking at you, Terry Goodkind), because that would be telling. But rather, as always, through the decision she makes at the end, i.e., through her actions (showing).
Still, that doesn’t mean this protagonist has convinced everyone around herself of her new worldview - it’s just her personal conclusion at the end of the story. Thus, ultimately it will still remain up to the readers to decide if they agree with the protagonist’s conclusion or not.
@@cosmicprison9819 All this discussion is making me curious on where the story I'm writing stands in all of this so far. 🤔
I definitely try my best to not be tell-y that my story's theme doesn't come off as preachy, but I've had my beta readers in this project pointed out to me before that I started off with a huge clarity issue in my earlier drafts because I was doing all I can to refuse stating anything clearly (as if leaving things too implicit or too open for interpretation was clever writing, expecting readers to readily have the most intuitive of minds that can effectively piece all the clues together).
Since then, with the help of online research and writing resources, as well as reputable peoples in the Authortube community, I decided to supplement my showing with good telling, so that important themes are being unpacked and explored on the page.
I let my narrative reveal my character's goals, fears, emotions; such as how they mentally process before they reach to a decision (depending if I as the author decide to reveal that information to the reader in its respective time). I also allow my characters to state their wants and needs in their dialogue, opening up doors for vulnerable conversations to make genuine connections and chemistry as it moves the story forward, making the concepts evolve, change and complicate clearly on the page.
I guess the problem with what's happening with many stories is that they state the theme's overarching message or lesson, such as in dialogue, that doesn't really merit the cause of why it was stated in the first place, other than the writer thinking it's time to state the lesson clearly to avoid confusion (or to remove potential for critical thinking and speculation fearing that audiences might miss the point after they consume the material).
I still have to finish drafting the midpoint from here, soon heading into the 3rd Act, but I like the way you state how you'd communicate your themes to the readers. It doesn't need or have to be blatantly obvious. It could just be a layer of it or more being spread around, and it's up to the readers to piece those together, the final thing, and decide for themselves if it is their lesson they should learn.
As I learned from my clarity issues, I still want my story to have its message being shown through the character's actions, but be supplemented by good telling. With where the story's ending is heading towards, I imagine them openly reflecting their journey to each other on the page to increase their understanding of one another, thus strengthening their friendship dynamic during the resolution. I believe this might remove the risk of monologuing the lesson or the message to the audience because it is not being told at them.
I dunno how the readers will take this ending, but if they are emotionally invested or not, it is not their story, but it's the characters thag they are cheering for. With what the characters have learned, I want that to be the substantial thing being left behind for the readers to take away with them. 🤔
Yessss love internal conflict! Can I request a podcast topic? I’m starting my developmental edit on my first draft and I want to know the specific differences between developmental edits and line edits, and what I should look for (and what I should ignore) in each. Love ya guys :)
I didn't put my character on the couch, but I did make him sit down and talk to me. Lol It was honestly super helpful! I discovered what he really wants and from there I'm weaving around to discover WHY, but I think I just realized his misbelief while watching this video! Thanks for the great insight! Love your show. Love how you break things down so simply. 😊
Yes! And although I think most of us write our first book based on ourselves and what defined our lives, this is great practice for writing (truly, not in name only, lol) imaginary characters! Because even when writing ourselves, we would still need to ask ourselves exactly what we really wanted, and what we feared (before our passion and character arc obliterated that fear, if not yet the misbelief)!
What I have learned about myself as a writer is I get bored if while outlining I need to figure out a character's subplot or backstory and I'm just sitting at my laptop or with a notebook. It makes me feel like I'm doing nothing and being unproductive with time I could be doing morew with. But I also like to take walks in the evenings around my house, and I'm always happy to just think while I'm walking because I'm also doing other things, so while walking I've compleatly fleshed out backstories, subplots, chapters, entire basic novel ideas. I get to see things and be outside, but I also get to work on my novel while not just being at my desk staring at a screen.
It’s great that you have discovered what works for you and that you are leaning into it. I’m still trying to find my individual writing process by trying different things. Some things are clicking but I’m still looking to fill in some blanks.
I know this is an old comment but I recently started creating a story and I do exactly the same thing! Long walks around where I live with at most soft music in my ears where I consciously think about my story and what I want to do with it. It puts me in a sort of meditative but goal driven state that I really need to be creative
I honestly love Abbie's "internal conflict is why it matters" so much. It's the perfect distillation of the driving force of stories-if the external conflict (aka antagonistic force) did not make it difficult for the protagonist to get what they wanted, and the protagonist didn't sweat and struggle, the story would be terribly bland.
Side note on the Enneagram - each type is either part of the Fear, Shame, or Anger triad, which is just their kneejerk response to stress. Super useful! To know a type 4 (think Hamlet, think Jo from Little Women, expressive, strives for uniqueness, compares themselves to others) - the Type 4 is a shame type. Which means, when they're stressed, they get embarrassed.
Very useful tool!
OK girls I have a question: how is it that you two young girls have so much wisdom and insight into the human mindset? I think it’s awesome and I give you high respect. I appreciate your show a lot thank you. This is from an old lady 83 years of age and starting to write Kara’s a lot of stuff that I’ve learned but it took me a lot more years past where you are to begin to understand.
Hey Kate and Abbie! Writing life has been awesome lately. Taking a break from the novel I was working on. Right now I’m owning my skills in a Fan Fiction that I’ve had brewing inside me for some time. Finally I’m writing it and it’s coming out awesome. I’m so much more competent as a writer now, things have clicked and I’m smooth sailing. If anyone here likes Sailor Moon, in particularly the Outer Senshi, than you are in for a treat cause it’s epic!
We're so thrilled this episode could inspire you! Keep writing my friend! I am so glad your journey has been expanding 🙏 ✨
I haven't watched this yet, I just wanted to say, I HAVE seen several of your other videos, and am about to embark on the journey that is dismanteling the pages and pages of manuscript I have written and looking at it all with eyes that have learned much. I'm looking at my protagonists character sheet and am just looking at the Internal Conflict, and have written in and then deleted several lines. I just got the notification for this, and it's like you were watching and waiting for the moment when I would need this the most. Perfect timing! Thank you in advance!
Yes! Lo e the way you put that! Isn't that how it usually works? As soon as you ask the question, the answer begins to form and come your way, thank God! (Well, some answers take longer to come (or be acknowledged?) than others. I'm a writer living in Africa with a very busy husband, lol, and this morning, I'm binge-watching two of my favorite writing inspirations on UA-cam: Abbie and Kate! By the way, your user name is super cool!
@@brandic89 Thank you for the compliment. I've been using this name for many years on many platforms lol. A song called Breña by the band A Perfect Circle.
@MoonlitBrenya Cool! That is a beautiful song! My real name actually sounds closer to Brenya, but I always liked the name Brandi, lol. I've found that only God (Allah, Yahweh, Dieu, etc. depending on the language) can heal and protect, even when we have the most wonderful people somewhere in our lives, but I'm interested in exploring paranormal events that would come under the heading "fantasy," especially since I've experienced a few, just for curiosity's sake.
I think that this conversation finally helped me see why my villains and heroes fail to capture attention: not enough internal conflict. Why would a villain want to capture innocent people, and why would he want to kill somebody? In my story's case, it's him blaming others for his circumstances. He believes that he must perform procedures and experiments that are "unpleasant" for the greater good. He believes that he wouldn't have to, if the majority of people had chosen a different path in life.
Thank you!
If I'm on the correct track for internal conflict, then please let me know! 🙂
Hi Katie and Abbie thanks for explaining the dived and connection between, fear and misbelief. Up until now I had unconsciously allowed the two concepts to morph. Thankfully from now on I will be able to relate better with my characters. 🙏🙏
I've been meandering through a short story of my own in my spare time, and I'm familiar with the ideas of misbeliefs and goals as I've been paying attention to your work for a while. But I was listening to this in the background just now while doing other things and my MC's misbeliefs and goals magically sprung to my mind (I hadn't directly acknowledged them as such already) and now that I see them clearly, they perfectly match and deepen my story's thematic threads, meaning I can lean into them more consciously. Thanks!
Great tutorial, ladies! After years of writing I’m teaching a new writer about storytelling and realized that I’ve been missing Central Conflict in my stories 😮 Don’t know how I’ve gotten so much done without paying attention to it. Your analysis of Internal Conflict dovetails perfectly with it. I will be including it in my writing and teaching going forward. Thanks so much! Can’t wait to learn more from you guys 😀
Great timing- I'm about to start working on my next book and while I have a solid plot, I've been missing a compelling internal conflict for the main character. (this is book 4 of a series so we've already worked through some of the easier character arcs) Was inspired by your conversation and jotted down a couple of pages of ideas. Will also check out Abbie's workshop.
Another excellent note added to my Obsidian vault. Love and light.
Wow! what a huge piece or information!
How do I like a video more than once? 😂🤣 But seriously, this helped me SO MUCH!! I’ve been recently brainstorming a new story, and this helped me get to know my new characters!! 😊
We're so so thrilled that this episode spoke to you friend!! 🙏✨
The main genre of my story is action.
But my MC is a male antagonist, which makes my story more of a horror genre when it's based on my MC's perception.
How can I make my MC's internal conflict stick to my story's main genre: action?
I love all of Abbie’s videos so much I listen to them like music on repeat. I have always done some of the suggestions both sisters mentioned in this podcast. One reason I prefer GOT to the new series House of the Dragon is character development. I simply don’t care about the spinoff’s characters and can stop watching the show at anytime. The charters drive the plot, I know there objectives but I can’t connect to them emotionally like the characters in GOT. There’s no Tyrion or Starks to pull me to the story😔
The book I’m writing has 4 psychiatrists in it and therapy group sessions, I’m loving it.
Sidenote, but I'm very glad you ditched the headsets -- I don't know what good they did -- and big on-screen mics.
It improves the show quite a bit - it looks like a video, instead of a podcast you happened to shoot -- and I think the sound quality is still great.
Plus, I bet you're both just a lot more comfortable -- I used to have to wear big headphones back in college radio days, and man, I hated them.
(The content is great as always, thanks.)
We're so stoked that you like the new setup!! 🙏❤️
OMG you switched places! I am puzzled, now, how am I going to orient? my whole world is upside down!! :))))))) good to see u both
Good idea to take stories you don't like and case study them for why you don't like them.
Happy to see Abbie is now better. Nice video btw
Thank you! 😊
At 2:25 I think "on the edge of my sheets" was actually more accurate for us bedtime readers. Just saying.
I have a daughter and wish i could afford another daughter so they'd grow up being sister best buds like you two appear to be. God bless you both!
Thank you best story from you 💓
I'm doing a television series and novel about a high school cheerleader who's leading a double life as a spy. She thinks she can defend herself if she had gun and she asks her math teacher who's also her bodyguard. She tells her "When I think you're ready" and then gives her a speech I call a "This is not" speech. Then she lists all the reasons why.
Finding a character's misbelief; create a character profile to build their personality, beliefs, and history.
Watching this makes me realize I may be in over my head. I have a character who has a false believe in her world to make a commentary on where our world is headed. Another false belief in another character will become a truth when that character becomes an ally. 😬
Hi beautiful awesome work 💖❤💝💝💜💝💜💞💞💓💓😍😍👍👍👍👍
What if your wrinting a protagnist with flat character arc?
I love you both 💚💚
💜⚡️
Hello :)
Can your protagonist’s internal conflict change as the story goes on?
When the characters meet after long epistolary communication, they will not be immediately comfortable. I’ll make it comfortable as soon as possible.
Sleepless in Seattle 2?
Interstante?
32 minutes for 3 points? Can you write it in a 1000 word (or less) essay?
it's 32 minutes for 2 points of a 5 point concept. duty, need and expectation are missing. just like my comment saying this which got deleted. did i say something untrue? or something too true? doesn't change the facts... literally takes 5 seconds to google btw.
I seriously thought she was saying innie-gram, and was suddenly thankful for my belly button. (it's enneagram if you didn't know, like me).