Psalm 118:24 “This is the day which the Lord has made; Let us rejoice and be glad in it.”🙏 Let God’s Peace be with you always (To Reader). Praise God always. Amen🙏🙌
The point about absolution is a good point. Namely, the debate over categorization is just that. Whether we afford the title of "sacrament" has no bearing on the efficacious reality of a rite: absolution still remits sin whether we give it the "S" title or not. Likewise, our rejection of the full seven is more a matter of being precise in language and really isn't making a claim about whether these events are effective or empty signs. (For e.g. ordination may have no divinely instituted sign or a promise of _forgiveness_ attached.. but when the church in her freedom lays on hands and prays for the gift of the Holy Spirit, we believe that isn't without effect). It comes down to how narrow/particular we want to be (is grace only ever "favor", or can it be a more general "gift", etc.) If your definition is "An outward and visible sign of the inward and spiritual gift," then that may give more wiggle-room, but it poses the danger of being too broad.
One thing that Pentecostals try to do is to say that commands that Jesus gave to the disciples specifically, especially the command to wait for the sending of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, are applicable to all believers. Could you please comment some time on how we distinguish between the commands that were given to the entire Church, notably baptism and the Lord's supper, and those given specifically to the disciples which are not applicable to the entire Church?
The convention is the seven ways we see God working within the life of the first century apostolic church. Baptism and the eucharist should be self explanatory but the other 5 sacraments are attested to in scripture as well. Not just in these verses alone but here are examples: Laying on of hands to receive the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:14-17 Confession of sins to the apostles (and later to bishops and priests through apostolic succession) in John 20:21-23 Anointing of the sick with oil in James 5:14-15 Jesus addresses marriage as a covenant bound by God in Mark 10:4-12 Appointing of priests/spiritual elders in Titus 1:5
The Eastern Orthodox aren't hard and fast on the numbering or the specific named sacraments/mysteries; sometimes it's 2, 6, 7, 10, everything in Creation ... When Calvinism came into their churches they rejected it with Roman Catholic argumentation, that's primarily where the numbering of seven is seen.
@@harrygarris6921I think the difference is that not all sacraments impart grace. Marriage is surely biblical and good. But it alone doesn't impart grace, only Baptism and Communion explicitly impart grace, for the forgiveness of sins. This is a very good video and it's nice we can have it this short
@@harrygarris6921 Yes. I have heard somewhere that they view it as an external signs on earth, that have effects in heaven. By that definition, more sacraments than two may be reasonable.
@@Dilley_G45 The anointing of the sick is an external sign, commanded in the Bible, which conveys grace - but it is not commanded by Christ himself. It is still strange that it has fallen out of use in most Lutheran churches. In general, it has been replaced by giving communion to the sick and dying. Maybe it was considered a bit overkill to bring the oil as well?
Jesus chose to veil certain things in his humiliation. We see him know the minds of others and how events will unfold, yet we also read of him learning and studying.
@@LeoRegum- As it would appear from the video, the Lutheran position is that Absolution, as a sign of pardon instituted by the LJC, is a sacrament. Perhaps the dual-category of sacrament and sign is helpful. All Sacraments are signs, but not all signs are Sacraments. Therefore, we have the freedom to call a sign a "sacrament" without fear of denigrating the preimenent catholic and ecclesiastical Sacraments (namely, Eucharist, Baptism, and for many, Absolution).
Confession / Absolution is the third un-sung Sacrament (depending on definitions) as pardoning is truly received to the repentant believer. Some Lutherans don't recognize it as a Sacrament because they believe the visible element attached to it must be physical in nature like water in Baptism or bread / wine in Communion. As for preaching in a general sense, no, it's not really considered a Sacrament. Preaching has been instituted long before Jesus walked the earth. The Word is considered a separate category although Sacraments contain the Word if that makes sense.
@@restedassurance - I certainly think preaching would fail the test of "a visible sign of an invisible grace." Nevertheless, we should not be dissuaded from speaking about the sacramental nature of preaching. In the reception of preaching, we enter into fellowship with the LJC and his Church (1 John 1). It may not be a Sacrament par excellence, but it certainly is a sacrament (sign, sacrāmentum) or means of grace.
This is the exact video i needed right now!! Thank you
Psalm 118:24 “This is the day which the Lord has made; Let us rejoice and be glad in it.”🙏
Let God’s Peace be with you always (To Reader). Praise God always. Amen🙏🙌
Dr. Cooper you rock! Shout from Montana!
The point about absolution is a good point. Namely, the debate over categorization is just that. Whether we afford the title of "sacrament" has no bearing on the efficacious reality of a rite: absolution still remits sin whether we give it the "S" title or not.
Likewise, our rejection of the full seven is more a matter of being precise in language and really isn't making a claim about whether these events are effective or empty signs. (For e.g. ordination may have no divinely instituted sign or a promise of _forgiveness_ attached.. but when the church in her freedom lays on hands and prays for the gift of the Holy Spirit, we believe that isn't without effect).
It comes down to how narrow/particular we want to be (is grace only ever "favor", or can it be a more general "gift", etc.) If your definition is "An outward and visible sign of the inward and spiritual gift," then that may give more wiggle-room, but it poses the danger of being too broad.
Good work brother
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One thing that Pentecostals try to do is to say that commands that Jesus gave to the disciples specifically, especially the command to wait for the sending of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost, are applicable to all believers. Could you please comment some time on how we distinguish between the commands that were given to the entire Church, notably baptism and the Lord's supper, and those given specifically to the disciples which are not applicable to the entire Church?
Thank you. What definition do Rome and the East work with to get the number seven? Or is it just convention?
The convention is the seven ways we see God working within the life of the first century apostolic church. Baptism and the eucharist should be self explanatory but the other 5 sacraments are attested to in scripture as well. Not just in these verses alone but here are examples:
Laying on of hands to receive the Holy Spirit in Acts 8:14-17
Confession of sins to the apostles (and later to bishops and priests through apostolic succession) in John 20:21-23
Anointing of the sick with oil in James 5:14-15
Jesus addresses marriage as a covenant bound by God in Mark 10:4-12
Appointing of priests/spiritual elders in Titus 1:5
The Eastern Orthodox aren't hard and fast on the numbering or the specific named sacraments/mysteries; sometimes it's 2, 6, 7, 10, everything in Creation ...
When Calvinism came into their churches they rejected it with Roman Catholic argumentation, that's primarily where the numbering of seven is seen.
@@harrygarris6921I think the difference is that not all sacraments impart grace. Marriage is surely biblical and good. But it alone doesn't impart grace, only Baptism and Communion explicitly impart grace, for the forgiveness of sins. This is a very good video and it's nice we can have it this short
@@harrygarris6921 Yes. I have heard somewhere that they view it as an external signs on earth, that have effects in heaven. By that definition, more sacraments than two may be reasonable.
@@Dilley_G45
The anointing of the sick is an external sign, commanded in the Bible, which conveys grace - but it is not commanded by Christ himself. It is still strange that it has fallen out of use in most Lutheran churches. In general, it has been replaced by giving communion to the sick and dying. Maybe it was considered a bit overkill to bring the oil as well?
Was Christ's human nature omnipresent during the state of his humiliation?
Jesus chose to veil certain things in his humiliation. We see him know the minds of others and how events will unfold, yet we also read of him learning and studying.
It seems to me by these 3 requirements that foot washing would also count. Would it not?
Did Christ command foot washing? Or did he do so to demonstrate humbleness and service?
@@stephenkneller6435 the point you're getting at with your questions is a fair one. I'll keep looking into this but you make a good point. Thank you.
@@4jgarner You are welcome.
Why is preaching not a Sacrament?
As the Sacraments are visible words, preaching is a verbal "sacrament."
@@nicklaushart9063 And Confession/ Absolution?
@@LeoRegum- As it would appear from the video, the Lutheran position is that Absolution, as a sign of pardon instituted by the LJC, is a sacrament.
Perhaps the dual-category of sacrament and sign is helpful. All Sacraments are signs, but not all signs are Sacraments. Therefore, we have the freedom to call a sign a "sacrament" without fear of denigrating the preimenent catholic and ecclesiastical Sacraments (namely, Eucharist, Baptism, and for many, Absolution).
Confession / Absolution is the third un-sung Sacrament (depending on definitions) as pardoning is truly received to the repentant believer. Some Lutherans don't recognize it as a Sacrament because they believe the visible element attached to it must be physical in nature like water in Baptism or bread / wine in Communion.
As for preaching in a general sense, no, it's not really considered a Sacrament. Preaching has been instituted long before Jesus walked the earth. The Word is considered a separate category although Sacraments contain the Word if that makes sense.
@@restedassurance - I certainly think preaching would fail the test of "a visible sign of an invisible grace." Nevertheless, we should not be dissuaded from speaking about the sacramental nature of preaching. In the reception of preaching, we enter into fellowship with the LJC and his Church (1 John 1).
It may not be a Sacrament par excellence, but it certainly is a sacrament (sign, sacrāmentum) or means of grace.